Does Obama believe what Obama is saying?

Mark Hillman

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Listening to President Obama explain "his" health care plan, I can't help but wonder if he actually believes his own words. Maybe it's been so long since the adoring press corps has held him accountable for his innumerable exaggerations, omissions and misstatements that he believes he can create a new reality simply by speaking it into existence. However, for anyone who's been paying attention, the President's recent health care pep rally disguised as a press conference was littered with statements that just don't square with reality:

Tags: Congress , Government Spending , Health Care , Obama

Mark Hillman

Mark Hillman

Mark Hillman is a Colorado native, a farmer, "recovering journalist" and a former Majority Leader of the Colorado Senate.

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TangledUpInaBlueState Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 7:44 PM

I can't see any proper excuse for this recent practice of congress passing bills without reading them. I have no doubt that many of our elected officials have always been lazy and sufficiently indoctrinated by their parties to vote for any bill that is sponsored by one of their own, but i had hoped that at least the staffers would have read the legislatio in question and given a briefing to their congresscritter of some sort. Now we've had at least one 1,00+ page bill passed before anyone could possibly have reviewed it, because it was an "emergency", and the same is being tried with this health care fiasco.

I worked in the medical field for the better part of 30 years, as an Army medic, an LPN, and an RN. The medical system,...

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Rowly Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 9:06 AM

When I am elected to office ,I will propose some changes...until then,like you,all I can do is complain.

As a citizen,I can say I want the Democrat dictatorship of the congress to get out of the healthcare business altogether until they can prove they can make it better.

DO NOT insure illegals!! Scrap the present bill and do a bipartisan one,with Republican input.

Last,but not least....if this bill as it is passes,force congress and the administration to live under the same healthcare they force on us.

Now you asked for specifics. This won't shut you up,of course,but this is all you will get from me. Now you vamoose and have a nice life.

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Craig C Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 7:40 AM

he has not read the bill either

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genuine cactushead Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 1:28 AM

while we lived in sc, the hospital where my wife worked lost a couple of million treating illegals and those without insurance.

To make up for part of this loss, the cost was passed on to the employees in higher medical insurance rates.

and it has been reported that the cost of illegals both in and out of prison costs calif alone some $10.5 billion in the last years they have figures for.

But this all gets back to those of us paying taxes and for services we use. At what point can we no longer afford to provide services for people who cannot or will not pay for what they use.

It seems we are at the point yet the dims in congress seem to think the tax payers can fully fund their health care fiasco, the cap...

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Eric, from THE Republic of Texas Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 1:11 AM

Cactus, great point. There is no denying this contributes SIGNIFICANTLY to the problem of escalating costs.

This is much akin to what retailers call "loss," (ie retail theft). Someone is enjoying the product without having to pay for it and the seller is still stuck with the costs. At least in retail they can write a lot of this off, but still, ultimately those costs get spread back to you, the consumer, to help cover the loss.

We may not be able to bring this down as cheap as, say, shopping for cereal in the grocery store. But we can do a lot of small things that WILL add up to significant savings. Anything is better than turning our healthcare over to the same bunch that gleefully takes pride in the fact they can't...

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genuine cactushead Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 12:53 AM

but another problem that is affecting hospitals costs is the gov't mandated treatment of illegals which cost hospitals across the country billions in lost dollars.

There is currently a case working it's way through the courts where an illegal required hospital care. After two years of treatment and a couple million dollars in costs, the hospital finally returned him to a hospital in mexico.

His family of illegals is suing the hospital for their relative to be returned to this country and receive all the treatment he needs to fix whatever the problem is.

If the court rules in his favor, all hospitals will be facing similar situations where there will be no limit on the amount of care they must provide to people...

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Eric, from THE Republic of Texas Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 12:35 AM

Ah, you do bring up some good points, but I believe affordable care would be available to any American if we only got the disconnected, third-party "price distorters" (health insurance companies, Medicaid, Medicare, etc.) out of the mix.

One point I need to make is one that seems so obvious, yet no one ever questions it: why in the hell does your employer provide your health insurance? Does he provide your auto insurance? Home owners insurance? Boat insurance? Life insurance? Keep the employer-provided health insurance benefit and just pay me what I'm worth (ie "pay me the difference").

There is always a natural price equilibrium between what the seller and consumer. The most important part of the seller/consumer...

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balanced Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 12:17 AM

Do you feel health care costs could come down enough for the average joe to get good care? It still seems like it would be costly, with doctor's fees, their insurance, the cost of tests, equipment, etc.

I know in my case, keeping all the money I've earned could possibly make up the difference, particularly if I had catastophic insurance.

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genuine cactushead Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 12:12 AM

I calls em like I see them

You remain a sanctimonious hypocrite who thinks running bits of you your pathetic life will make you baseless arguments plausible

But if you are so worried about the tax advantages available to the wealthy they have been written into the tax laws while the dims were mainly the majority party in congress.

But we have also witnessed other dim heroes of your like alldull who while vp gave $50 to charity and now biden who on an income of $300,000 gave some $1100. to charity.

I doubt you have an open mind about anything that doesn't involve the dims and their socialism. But your point has been it's greedy conservs that are the problem and it's the conservs that need to open their hearts...

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balanced Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 12:09 AM

NOW WE'RE TALKIN'!!! THANK YOU! SOME ACTUAL IDEAS! Let me stew on them a bit, but thank you so much for offering some real thoughts on this, rather than just adolescent name-calling.

I have to say I've often had a gut feeling that we could scrap the IRS and rainbows would come out.

Thanks.

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Eric, from THE Republic of Texas Wrote: Jul 28, 2009 12:02 AM

Also Balanced, I forgot to add that I'd change all insurance to cover ONLY catastrophic issues, much in the way your auto and home owners insurance covers only catastrophic issues.

Sure, you can get your insurance to pay for more "stuff," but like anything else in life, those extras are going to cost you.

Having health insurance pick up routine costs is akin to having your auto insurance provider pick up the costs for your gas, oil changes, fuel filters, air filters, tune ups, spark plugs, tire rotations, tire balancing, brake maintence, waxing and detailing... etc. You get the point.

When you're only paying for what Chris Rock called "In-Case-Some-Sh*t-Happens" insurance, your health insurance costs will...

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balanced Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:56 PM

I know many, many wealthy conservatives. They all want me to play in their scrambles because I'm a talented golfer (no ego, just fact). Not necessarily because we have tons in common, but because I help them win money. Let me share something with you. We've discussed the, 40% tax, as you call it. Very few of them pay the percentage I do. The system seems to be set up so that they can pay much less than the average joe. In fact, they always joke about it. "Oh, it's December - better find some charity to give some money to - tax time, ya know!"

I'm not saying that ALL conservatives don't care. Nor am I saying that ALL conservatives refrain from charitable work. Many, many do great stuff. I AM saying that most...

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Donald466 Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:55 PM

balanced
Location: AZ
Reply # 20
Date: Jul 27, 2009 - 10:25 PM EST

"2. Dispatch calls made public. The cop said he had ID from the guy, and that he was being a "bit unruly."

3. Yelling at a cop while on your own property (remember, there was no physical contact or even physical aggression) is not 'disorderly conduct' under Massachussetts law.

4. The only law that was actually broken was the arrest of the professor."

I have talked to a police Lieutenant friend who resides in Boston 'Proper'. He informed me that physical contact does NOT have to occur. He says that Massachusetts law defines 'Disorderly Conduct' is: Conduct occurring in an open or public setting, deemed to be disorderly (e.g.: any...

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Judith268 Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:53 PM

Quote from John Conyers(D-MI)
I love these members they get up and say,'Read the bill!' What good is reading the bill if it is a thousand pages and you don't have two days and two lawyers to find out what it means after you read the bill?"

Steny Hoyer (D-MD) laughed at the idea that House Members actually read the health care bill before signing it. "If every member pledged to read it in it's entirety, I think we would have very few votes".

Henry waxman of Cal admitted he did not know all that was in the $787 Billion stimulus bill before voting for it even though he was one of the bill's sponsors.

Is anyone else bothered by this?
Is congress trustworthy? Credible? Honorable?

You decide if you are OK...

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genuine cactushead Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:52 PM

the congressional repubs have offered their own plan, as have the black caucus and the hispanic caucus.

But since the dims have veto proof majorities in both houses, they have totally discounted what the repubs have offered.

And since the msm is little more than a mouthpiece for the dims these ideas do not garner any air time.

But you continue to ignore the $2 trillion deficit run up by the dims and flap ears which pales compared to the spending deficits run up by bush during the 6 years the repubs controlled the budget.

But you again are the typical troll, you claim you would hold the dims accountable when you are another fool who can't get over h is bush deranged syndrome.

Meanwhile flap ears is...

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Eric, from THE Republic of Texas Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:49 PM

Dear Balanced... my ideas on health reform?

Scrap Social Security, Medicaid, Medicare and the IRS. Go to a national sales tax allowing Americans to keep the full amount of their entire pay check.

Next up, immediate tort reform, using "Loser pays" rules and cap any damages. This will bring down the provider malpractice insurance costs. Next, I'd make it illegal for any business to provide healthcare as part of their compensation package.

These steps would finally, for the first time in nearly three generations, open healthcare up to true and real market forces. (Healthcare is so expensive because it operates in a vacuum away from market forces.) Your healthcare will cost you pennies of what it costs...

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balanced Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:45 PM

That's good to hear you have an Asian doctor. Did you ask if she got into the program on affirmative action? If she did, it might have been a good thing. Please remember that affirmative action was not the result of our attempt to get unqualified minorities into school or jobs. It was an attempt to offset the bigotry they faced for too long.

I don't mind your view of me. I'm okay with it, but I'm still waiting for someone to direct me to the REPUBLICAN'S PLAN TO REFORM HEALTH CARE. A link, or something...I'll read it. I'm open.

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balanced Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:38 PM

I think BOTH parties are responsible for too much pork. Look at the federal highway bill in 2005. Monstrous. Filled with pork. The article I read about it (don't remember where) said it well - "Reagan would've vetoed it."

Anyway...just waiting for the republican's PLAN.

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balanced Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:36 PM

God. Again, what are you IDEAS on health reform? I'm not pretending to be some economist - I'm far from it. But you continue to badger the attempts by this president to do something and you're not coming up with anything better. What have the republicans come up with? Simple question.

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genuine cactushead Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:36 PM

you make the false premise that earners don't help the parasites you claim to champion. Since some 43& of the in come we earn is stolen is various taxes in addition to the dollars we contribute to the church and other charities we like most people we know are doing more than our fair share.

Yet fools like you still accuse us of not doing enough.

But it seems you are troubled by the amount of money people earn through various employer/employee hiring agreements.

But that is the beauty of capitalism, the market place determines who earns what.

But your messiah spent billions of tax dollars giving the auto workers who lost their jobs due to his demanding the auto companies change their ways.

The...

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balanced Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:29 PM

I don't completely disagree with you. It's crazy what we're spending, true. But would you at least agree that SOMETHING has to happen to reform the industry?

There have been attempts over the years and I keep hearing the same argument and NOTHING happens. Republicans have done NOTHING for health care. The same mantra echoes constantly - 'socialized medicine,' 'government is going to get between you and your doctor,' 'health care rationing,' blah blah blah.

It's apparent that government can't leave the private sector to their own because they take too much advantage.

So, rather than telling us what WON'T work, tell us what WILL work. Please. I'll listen.

And, on a side note, there is a lot of great...

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boilerdawg Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:28 PM

BALANCED, I thought it might take you at least a few minutes to go the name calling route, but as with most liberals, you are going to cling to sterotypes. That's fine, go ahead. Your lack of intellect and debating skills gets old after a while. It's so incredibly insulting to assume that I would only want to have a white doctor and so devoid of thought, that I think I have lost about 60 IQ points just trying to debate you. If you must know, my current doctor is an Asian woman. I never really bothered to find out from where because she's very good and has taken good care of me and I could care less her ethnicity or background. I guess I'm still a racist since the person isn't African-American, in your eyes, you absolute imbecile....

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Rowly Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:24 PM

balanced
Location: AZ
Reply # 71
Date: Jul 27, 2009 - 11:08 PM EST ROWLEY
It's working just fine. See, I understand that sometimes deficit spending is required. Bush's spokesperson said so himself when HIS crazy spending was in question.

But, your IDEAS are not ideas. They sound more like adolescent squealing.

I'm simply asking for IDEAS on what Republicans want to do to REFORM health care. It's easy to say what they DON'T want. But, what are they going to actually DO? What would they DO if they had the chance? I've seen a 13 page summary so far. I wrote papers longer than that overnight. Give me some ACTUAL IDEAS.

And, stop whining.
***********************************************
First,we...

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genuine cactushead Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:20 PM

and you morons always forget that the dims under piglosi and corrupt land deal reid controlled the budget the last 2 years of the bush presidency

They took control of the congress promising to drain the swamp of repub corruption and to offset any new spending bills with corresponding cuts in existing programs.

The net result was that pork spending grew which included huge increases in corporate welfare.

And despite promises to control spendiong piglosi and reid grew the deficit by $700 billion including last years largest deficit ever.

And now we are looking at a $2 trillion deficit and trolls like you continue to blame bush. But you fail to justify the $800 billion in pork passed in feb followed by the...

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balanced Wrote: Jul 27, 2009 11:19 PM

Here we go again.

"But it is also losers like you that demand the earners need to help the parasites that are both too lazy and too stupid to take care of themselves."

There's the difference between you and me. I am an earner AND I help people who need help. You forget that not every single person in this country has been given the same opportunities. Again, get out and see the country.

No spending at all is not an option. It's just not. If John gave you a business that was in the hole, you'd probably have to do some deficit spending to get it out of the hole. Or, close it down. It's that simple.

You all are ASSUMING what's going to happen over the next decade already. You just don't know. You remind...

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