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Friday, June 27, 2008
John Hawkins :: Townhall.com Columnist
Why Liberals Lie About What They Believe
by John Hawkins
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Do you feel the leaked information from a global warming alarmist organization is meaningful?



Once you've watched liberals long enough to understand how they think -- scratch that, how they feel -- they become extraordinarily predictable.

To begin with, the liberal agenda is, in many respects, the same as it was in the thirties. Whether you call it communism, fascism, socialism, liberalism, or progressivism, the only real difference is how much they believe they can get away with, the way they sell it to people, and the latest trendy name for what they believe.

So, once the liberals pick a policy from their stale program to push, the next step is to get it implemented. This is where liberals have problems because whether a policy makes sense, is practical, or actually improves people's lives is of secondary importance to them. What is important to liberals is whether supporting or opposing that policy makes them feel good about themselves.

This is why liberals continue to support dysfunctional policies that have been failing miserably for decades and why they often oppose common sense programs that have been proven to work time and time again -- because it isn't about whether it works or not, it's about how it makes them feel.

In other words, a liberal will almost always prefer a policy that's extremely expensive, is difficult to implement, helps almost no one, but seems "nice" -- to a policy that is cheap, simple to implement, extremely effective, and seems "mean."

However, since most Americans make decisions about policies based on whether or not they believe the policy makes people's lives better or worse, liberals have had to become habitually dishonest about what they believe and want to do to get their ideas put into action.

This is a point worth stressing because many people who aren't familiar with politics believe that conservatives and liberals are simply flip sides of the same coin and therefore, approach issues the same way. However, conservatives genuinely believe that this is a center-right country. That's why conservatives have no qualms about being publicly labeled as conservatives and it's part of the reason why we're much more honest than the Left -- because we believe that a majority of the American people generally agree with us and share our values.

So, those of us on the Right spend our time trying to explain to the American people what we really want to do, while the Left spends its time trying to hide what it really wants to do from the American people.

Because of this, when liberals don't feel that the political winds are blowing in their direction, not only will they generally avoid discussing the things they believe, they will typically deny that they believe them at all.

Additionally, liberals go to bizarre lengths to tilt the political playing field in their favor. They move into the mainstream media so that they can tip what are supposed to be "objective" news stories in their favor. They get into positions of power in our educational system so that they can teach kids liberal propaganda before they're old enough to know better. They uniformly support judges who care nothing about the Constitution as long as it moves liberal ideological goals forward. Even the Left's support of illegal immigration is rooted in the desire to bring in millions of poor people from socialist countries who are more likely to vote Democratic. If they can't convince the American voters they're right, then they'll just bring in some new voters.

More disturbing is the Left's ever-increasing reliance on what are commonly thought of as fascist tactics. Liberals at college campuses attempt to disrupt conservative speeches and the Democrats want to try to drive conservative talk radio hosts off the air with the Fairness Doctrine. Conservatives like Tom DeLay, Rush Limbaugh, and Ann Coulter have been targeted criminally for political reasons and there's even talk of trying to jail members of the Bush Administration over policy differences after they're out of office. Ideological soulmates of modern liberals -- like Stalin, Lenin, and Mao -- would certainly approve of those tactics.

Still, even though this is a center-right country, we do have political cycles and there are times when those cycles favor the Left. When that happens and the Lefties start to get a bit more confident, usually a few liberals at the edges will start talking about what they want to do. At that early point, most other liberals will still vehemently deny their ideological goals to the public out of fear that it will prevent them from getting into power.

However, when the Left gains enough strength to be capable of getting one of the policies they favor implemented, all the liberals who previously denied that they supported it will unapologetically shift on a dime and vote for it en masse -- while they rely on their ideological allies in the media and the fact that many Americans are ill informed about politics to cover their tracks.

So, if you want to know what liberals want to do, their words mean absolutely nothing because lying about their agenda has become as natural to them as chasing a cat is to a dog.

Instead, what you have to do is watch what other liberals have done when they have come into power. Look at Canada, where conservatives are being put on trial for hate crimes because they've dared to criticize Muslims. Look at European countries, where they have socialistic economies, sky high tax rates, rigid speech codes, and overweening nannystates. You can even look at liberal enclaves in the United States like Berkeley and San Francisco, where members of the military are treated like pariahs and they boo the national anthem.

If you believe the liberals in Berkeley, France, Canada or for that matter in the bowels of the Daily Kos or Huffington Post, are significantly different than, say Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton, you are kidding yourself. The only differences are in what they think they can get away with and how honest they are willing to be about their agenda.

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John Hawkins is a professional blogger who runs Right Wing News, Linkiest, and Viral Footage.
 
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Religious Fanatics!!!
Liberals commenting are continuing the lie and hide theme. Attacking the messenger because they have been outed. I'll out them a little more.
Liberals push their policies with religious fervor because it IS religion.
LeftMedia disparages the 'Religious Right,' but have you noticed they do not get into discussions about or even name the 'Religious Left'? That is because - to continue your 'Lie' theme - they want to hide their beliefs, which are totally sympathetic to the Left:
http://www.jcn.com/manifestos.html
Diversity, World Community, Redistribution, Choice, Tolerance, Consenting Adults, Cultural Pluralism....These are all worship words.
The Left is all about forcing citizens to conform to their faith. The Left points at conservative Christians and shouts 'Theocracy!' But the truth is our public policies are more and more reflecting and enforcing Humanist beliefs.
And you don't even hear the word Humanism or Manifesto.
Most liberals are mind-numbed followers, but some do know about the Manifestos and defend them. I had a Superintendent of Public Instruction proudly tell me he was a 'pure Humanist.'
Peruse the Manifestos, then watch the Left.
You will see the faith-based words and actions.

High School Level Writer
This is embarassingly amateurish on all levels. Faulty logic,poor organization,mundane writing style. His parents need to stop paying his bills and force him to seek gainful employment.

Word confusion...
Replace "liberal" with "white" and you got it %100 correct!

Rant, Rant, Rant
Surely this is a mock rant. Even a mediocre writer backs up his/her assertions with at least a modicum of evidence. If it is a mock, it's humorous, it it's not, it's embarrassing.

Historical lying or spinning by the Left
Obama's shifts, spin, flips, flops, are nothing new for socialist pacifists. After WWII, liberals were flopping all over the place in their sympathies for Communism. Even Truman felt their wrath. The Hollywood Left natually put Americanism into their own amoral world view via their pictures. Hiss was found out but the Left kept lying that he was really innocent as were the traitors, the Rosenbergs. College profs in the '60's lied to their kids and of course we Americans were always oppressing all minorities round the Globe. America was always to blame as Jeanne Kirkpatrick averred as the DemLiberal Playbook. Liberals never did like JFK or LBJ but Camelot was made up to make sure that a rising conservatism , finally back from the dead after its demise during the Depression, would not take hold. The '60's were one of the worst decades in American history since the Left made Americans the evil, the Great Satan, which naturally our real evil enemies, picked up and the Left smiled and nodded. Dems have never liked war even if America gets mugged. Reagan came along and actually defeated Russia which liberals loved. Now liberalism is alive and well again, dissing capitalism, dissing our military, loving even partial birth abortion, whacked enviros are loved, and Obama is the new Messiah. He like Clinton lies on a daily level and the MSM approves. And undecided voters wonder just who this faux savior is all about.

Weapons
That's what they said about Iraq. But they never materialised.

Lefty

"Iran is producing nuclear weapons"

Is there 100% proof that Iran is producing nuclear weapons, no, but there is prima facie evidence that Iran is in fact doing just that.

Akagi: a response
I noticed you didnt answer the question I asked you specifically, was this statement that is made by repubs cons:

"Iran is producing nuclear weapons"

a fact or an opinion. it cannot be both. so which is it?

another thing is you argue points I never said and youre putting words into my mouth I didnt say.

I absolutely never said Iran doesnt have nuclear progam nor did I say there isnt a possibility that they may have nuclear weapons.

The gist of my original post was that repubs/cons repeatedly state opinions as if they are indeed facts when they are not. the statement above is but one example of this.
please review the definitions of the words "fact" and "opinion" because there is a big difference in the two.

Georgia Gal
In a situation in which the government is paying for all the health care then the government will soon, as a cost saving measure, set up guidelines to decide who is eligible to receive care. Suddenly, your doctor will be factoring the cost of keeping you alive, your potential economic value to society and whether or not you belong to any favored or protected groups in the decision about what treatments to order.

Eventually, even those factors will pale in significance to the overriding fact that the government has no more money to pay him until the next fiscal year. Currently medical care is triaged by what the patient can afford. When the patient no longer has any reason to limit his doctor visits and treatments, the system will have to choose other ways to limit the costs. I don't think you will like the methods it chooses.

Bob
You're right Bob, it's pure psychobabble. No liberal says 'I disagree with that because it's mean'. They might say 'It's immoral', and that is exactly what the Republicans say too.

Wendy 10:36
'The emotions by which liberals are driven - and they are driven entirely by emotions, or whim - are not the "positive emotions."'

Where do you people come up with this nonsense? It's all pure psychobabble, and says a great deal more about the author than it does about the imaginary people he or she is trying to insult.

Does it do you good in some way to construct these fantasy representations of people you dislike, and then build soaring structures of invective about their foibles and failings? Hawkins does it in the lead article of this thread and Wendy duplicates his efforts here. It seems to be you'd be better off with a good porn site and some lube; the results would be pretty much the same.

Liberal Bias
This article should be published in all the major news rags by the Conservative element of the Republican Party, if the Party cannot be persuaded to run it, itself. Everyone who knows what it means to cast a vote should be given the opportunity to read it.

And, they even lie to themselves
I agree with this article, and I would add one thing in my usual 2000 words or less. The emotions by which liberals are driven - and they are driven entirely by emotions, or whim - are not the "positive emotions." While they do experience emotions such as euphoria at times, the root emotions behind all of their beliefs are always negative in nature: Guilt, envy, hatred.

They feel guilt because they do not believe that they have earned their money (which is more often true than not. They are often in careers or jobs which they sense are unproductive, such as certain types of government work, social work, acting, etc.). If you observe their lives, you can see some patently insane acts of contrition go down because of this type of guilt, and it always leaves a trail of bodies behind it. Let no victim stand in the way of their absolution.

They experience envy because they look around and see industrialists and others who have earned their wealth through producing something of value to other human beings. The industrialists have earned their way; the resenters have not. What they envy is the sense of self-efficacy, the basis of genuine self-esteem. The envy they experience reinforces their guilt.

Finally, this envy culminates in hatred and hostility toward the objects of their envy and resentment. This hatred is an irrational fury whose ugly roots are camouflaged in the language of compassion and caring for the supposed victims of the efficacious industrialists. They end up accepting an entire fraudulent belief system, idea by idea, that is designed to ideologically validate and avenge their primitive, savage, irrational emotions. That belief system is collectivism.

Myk
If you do not believe posting on Townhall influences anyone or does any good, then why are you posting on Townhall?

Icedog 7:25 PM EST
"I was selective because I was addressing a specific point. A poster stated the Iraqis "want us out of their country"....and I provided evidence that shows "80% want us to stay."

No, you were selective and dishonest. You quoted part of one question without quoting the rest:

Q22 How long do you think US and other Coalition forces should remain in Iraq? Should they leave now, remain until security is restored, remain until the Iraqi government is stronger, remain until Iraqi security forces can operate independently, remain longer but leave eventually, or never leave?
38% Leave now
35% Remain until security is restored
14% Remain until the Iraqi government is stronger
10% Remain until the Iraqi security forces can operate independently
3% Remain longer but leave eventually
1% Never leave

Note that the administration and RW press is claiming that #2, #3, and #4 have been accomplished now, by the success of the Surge.

When 38% say we should LEAVE NOW, there's no way you can conclude that 80% want us to stay. It's likely you got your 80% from the series of questions about what future US involvement should be in various activities, without making note of the fact that none of them require us to be continuously in the country. We can participate in security operations with air cover from carriers or distant bases, and we can send them money and weapons from anywhere.

38% of the Iraqis want us out right now, immediately; 72% think that we're making the security situation there worse or no better. Using those results to conclude that "80% want us to stay" is just flat-out dishonest.

Bob
You missed the point....I was selective because I was addressing a specific point. A poster stated the Iraqis "want us out of their country"....and I provided evidence that shows "80% want us to stay". The Iraqi opinions on "the surge" and specific neighborhoods are part of the poll, but they have little bearing on the statement I was debating.

Black and White Brian 6:41 PM EST
" putdown of Icedog .... ignores the fact that both ... the BBC and ABC are heavily invested in their shared un-and-anti Americanism and their support for America's every enemy"

That would mean that their poll was horribly biased when Icedog used it, too, but I didn't see any complaints from you about it then. Is perhaps the poll reliable only when it reflects your opinion? Why'd they bother asking all those Iraqis, when they could have just called you?

Oh and lefty
If you are still reading these posts, just answer me this. IF Iran is not developing nuclear weapons:

Why spend billions of dollars on nuclear energy when they are the 4th largest oil producer and has the 3rd largest oil reserves on earth? If they want to develop alternative energy to free up more oil for export, why not build solar and wind energy producers which would be cheaper to build and maintain. Why build 5000MW reactors--one of which is bigger than all of Taiwan's (6) combined when most reactors built to produce energy are between 800-1600MWs? Why build heavywater reactors instead of lightwater ones which most countries today build for energy production? Lightwater reactors are difficult to use in weapons programs, heavywater ones are critical to weapon programs. Why enrich uranium which has no commercial purpose UNLESS they need to enrich it to weapons grade quality for the fuel required for a nuclear weapon (see the US program that produced the Hiroshima bomb of an example of this process)? Why not allow IAEA to place real time cameras and open their nuclear facilities to complete, unannounced inspections?

The answers to these questions if you are logical is that are developing nuclear weapons, but you tell me your explaination for all of the above.

Bob Munck's putdown of Icedog ....
.... ignores the fact that both (especially the psychopathologically hesperophobic haters at) the BBC and ABC are heavily invested in their shared un-and-anti Americanism and their support for America's every enemy. The outcome of any and every "poll" led by their professional polemicists is guaranteed to represent whatever point of view its authors are that day promulgating. Bit like going to Gaza, Judeo and Samaria and asking the islamanazi squatters in those parts of Greater Israel whether they're happy for their Jewish neighbor.

Myopine
Like most here he doesn't understand what communism is and couldn't define the various schools of communism to save his worthless life, nor how they differ from each other nor how communism is different from socialism or how Social Democracy found in Europe differs from modern American liberalism. And Libertarians are about as far from a communist movement as you can get.

Wikipedia is not seen as valid because those that create the entries aren't confirmed to have expertise in what they post, but in general I have found it to be very accurate--both the English and Chinese versions. I have found a few errors--it wrongly implied the 54th Mass. Infantry (of Glory fame) was wiped out after the assualt on Battery Wagner, it had the source of the name for Union County, Georgia incorrect--it was not named for the Union Army, but the Union Party which predates the civil war by some 30 years (which I corrected), and in the English version had the date when Sun Yat-sen became president of the ROC incorrect--it was correct in the Chinese version. But mostly, I have found it to be extremely accurate and the claims that it is full of falsehoods generally incorrect on the whole. And much more accurate than World Net Daily that myopine loves to use and think is a valid source.


ladisney hits the Texasupchuck's ...
... asinine spewings about a couple of the totalitarians' most egregious scams: Socialist "security" and mediscare; "working," on the head -- but misses the other half of his well taken point -- that the evil bloody fascissocialists who pose as "teachers" have so corrupted the "minds" of generations of America's school, college and university students that millions of them, like Texasupchuck, actually believe that fascissocialist "security" and mediscare "work!"

God save our beloved fraternal republic.

And so says Black and White!

Icedog 3:24 PM EST
"According to a BBC and ABC News poll conducted in Mar 08"

You did some nice selective quoting, but here are more results from that poll:

Q23 Overall, do you think the presence of US forces in Iraq is making security in our country better, worse, or having no effect on the security situation?
27% Better
61% Worse
11% No Effect

Q21 As you may know, the United States has increased the number of its forces in Baghdad and surrounding provinces in the past six months. For each item I name, please tell me if you think this increase of U.S. forces has made it better, made it worse, or had no effect.

[The next two are essentially what the Iraqi think of the results of the Surge as it is currently being sold.]

Security in the areas where these forces have been sent
36% Better
53% Worse
10% Had No Effect

Security in other areas of Iraq
30% Better
49% Worse
21% Had No Effect

[These two are what the Iraqi think of the current state of the original goals of the Surge]

Conditions for political dialogue in Iraq
21% Better
43% Worse
36% Had No Effect

The ability of the Iraq government to carry out its work
25% Better
44% Worse
30% Had No Effect

[So when asked "Is the Surge working?" the Iraqi population overwhelmingly answers "NO!"]

Q33 If the American forces left the country entirely, do you think the security situation in Iraq overall would become better, become worse, or remain the same?
46% Better
29% Worse
23% About the same

Iraq for oil
"Some people say we went in "for oil!!" How can that be? are we getting oil from them now?"

Just because that was the plan, doesn't mean the plan worked! That makes them even more incompetent - the people who told us 'this war will pay for itself with cheaper oil prices' have turned out to be utterly wrong.

KOS
"Vets for Obama"....Ha, would be interesting to count the number of BCDs in that group. I'm sure "Mr. Four-Year PFC" Markos from the DailyKos is a member.
Kos was in the military????? Wow, his sole purpose for joining must have been to sow the seeds of discontent.

58ttom:"Besides, what business do we have of invading a country because we do not like it's government. Some will say that Sadam was killing and torturing his own people. Well, how many people have been tortured and killed because of this war?"
I must be senile because every time I hear the reasons for invading Iraq, I get very confused. Some people say we went in "for oil!!" How can that be? are we getting oil from them now? for a discount??
58ttom, your stated reason for going into Iraq is better than most. It would be a good reason to go in but that isn't why *I* thought we went in.
I thought we went in because after many, many years of Saddam thumbing his nose at the UN demands that he allow inspectors in and he give up all information about the MISSING WMD's. The UN consists of eunuchs, we HAD to do something because he'd already proven that he'd use WMD's. We didn't find what we wanted. Not our fault, it was Saddam's decision to deny the information to the UN.
Is it the military's fault that people have been tortured? It's the fault of radical terrorists.

58ttom
"The Iraqi people have made it clear that they do not want us there."

Not trying to pick on you, but you perfectly illustrate the "misinformed" or "uninformed" voter problem in this country. Despite what you may have heard...this statement is exactly 180 degrees from the reality of the situation.

According to a BBC and ABC News poll conducted in Mar 08, "...only 38% want an immediate withdrawal of American forces...and many as 80% want the US to remain engaged in Iraq for other purposes, such as fighting terrorists, especially al-Qaeda, military training, and keeping Iran and Turkey at bay."
http://hotair.com/archives/2008/03/17/iraq-poll-improvement s-across-the-board/

Please don't take the liberal sites and MSM at face value...you can do your own research and make much more informed decisions.

Hal
"Vets for Obama"....Ha, would be interesting to count the number of BCDs in that group. I'm sure "Mr. Four-Year PFC" Markos from the DailyKos is a member.

What choice do we have
I must agree with Paolo. When it comes to lying, liberals do not have a monoply on it. I am not supportive of many of the causes of liberalism such as welfare, abortion, gun control,...etc. I agree with the author that the programs promoted by liberals to deal with these issues only cause harm to the people they claim to help and many also restrict the liberties of the American citizen. This is very rarely brought to the public's attention.
However,the so called conservative is no better. A good example would be the continuing war in Iraq. The Iraqi people have made it clear that they do not want us there. Besides, what business do we have of invading a country because we do not like it's government. Some will say that Sadam was killing and torturing his own people. Well, how many people have been tortured and killed because of this war? Besides, if the Iraqi people didn't like their government it's their duty to rise up and overthrow it.
There is also the issue of these "free trade" agreements that conservatives such as McCain promote that are far from fair trade . These agreements very much infringe upon the sovereignty of the United States. And what about the outrageous federal spending under the Bush administration? We won't even get into the huge invasion of privacy created under the guise of Homeland Security.
So, what choice do liberty and freedom minded people who also care about the economic stability of their nation have when it comes to voting for president? The Liberterian and Constitution parties have candidates worthy of considering but unfortunately few Americans will even hear about these candidates. I must say that as it stands now I will probably be voting for one of them.

Obama on how to succeed in America

Obama's Top Ten Rules to Live by

10) Comprehensive means the absence of opposition to Democrats.

9) Compassion without coercion is useless.

8) Never ask when you can use the government to take.

7) If a government program fails, repeat.

6) A liberal without guilt is no liberal at all.

5) Global Warming yields more cash than pointing a gun.

4) Moral choice is a complex personal issue that is better defined by focus groups.

3) To each according to his ability to work the system.

2) Only fools say what they really believe.

And the number One rule to success:
1) Never, ever cross Michelle Obama.

Yes, but....
As a libertarian, I don't favor either conservatives or liberals, Republicans or Democrats.

Hawkins is right that Liberals usually try to hide their big government agenda. Ah, but the author cannot see to remove the mote from the liberal's eye, as he has a beam in his own.

Conservatives, you see, for all their quasi-libertarian rhetoric about shrinking the federal government, have no intention of doing so. When the "conservative" George W. Bush had a "conservative" Republican majority in both houses of Congress, he and his fellow "conservatives" did absolutely nothing to shrink the federal government. We are paying the price for their lies today in the form of inflation in food and fuel costs (and many other ways as well, too numerous to list).

Of course, most (not all) "conservatives" are also warmongers--war being the biggest, most destructive government program imaginable. Their lies take the form of whipping up hysteria over second and third-rate foreign "enemies" in order to launch pointless wars that enhance their prestige and self-perceived manliness.

Do "liberals" do the same thing? Of course--study Bosnia and Kosovo for more information.

Conservatives and Liberals, Republicans and Democrats, are both ardent supporters of huge, privacy-invading, high-taxing, inflation-creating central government.

If you haven't yet realized this, you need to reconsider your premises.

Armalite
"It is a waste of time debating, discussing or in any way rationalizing with the left. Stop doing it. From now on just smash them in their faces and stomp them into the ground."

In other words, you know they're right, so violence is the only way you can win. Are you Robert Mugabe posting incognito?

RE: Exercise in Ego
Myk -

Your points are well-taken. Its good to keep blogging in perspective.

I do enjoy it a lot and do it for recreation; it is addictive and yes, self-serving. At least I try to remember to get up and move around at regular intervals :-).

But above all my motivation is to have an influence on public opinion. While these postings may not be read by the authors themselves (I like to think thay is not 100% the case all the time), these postings are still read by many fellow citizens.

Make no mistake about it - we are in what amounts to a cold civil war of ideology. Lets keep it from going hot with continuing dialogue. Even with most staked out on one side or the other, there are those reading who perhaps haven't completely made up their mind already, and maybe even some whose "brainwashing" can be reversed.

I too have descended into personal animosity. Agreed, it is a challenge to keep the debate civil - a worthy challenge.

Above all, since the mainstream media fails to present information without a bias that I find despicable, I relish the opportunity to project an alternate perspective. Even if not mainstream, the blogosphere may have greater reach and impact that you think.

As far as this particular article goes, I find it to be an example of the "intellectual masturbation" you mentioned. There is nothing to it for me to really sink my teeth into.

But your post was quite intriguing. Thank you.

Late to the dialog
but Mr. Hawkins has it 100% correct.

Bottom line: Liberals are liars because they are not, and have never been, "of the Truth".

A exercise in ego
Seriously folks . . . do any of you really believe the writers of these online articles, regardless of their ideological persuasion, really give a rat's behind what any of the readers post on this forum? Do you really believe the columnists even bother to read these posts? These online reader forums are just an opportunity for zealots of the Left and Right to insult each other and feel good about how "witty and clever" they are, without actually contributing anything new, original and enlightening to objective knowledge. It is a kind of "intellectual" masturbation. If it makes you feel good to insult and ridicule others simply because they disagree, so be it. But please, don't be under any illusions that you are being "profound" by doing so. I've occasionally been guilty of insults and ridicule myself. I admit it. It's not something I'm proud of. In hindsight, when it happened, I know I was just trying to dominate the "conversation" by enhancing my own ego. However, it really is a pointless exercise for anyone to do. With only a few exceptions, I suspect that most of the serial posters in this forum are not really interested in a mutual exchange of objective information for purposes of mutual BENEFIT. They simply have a need to display how rhetorically clever they are, and to get a pat on the back from those who share their particular ideological partisanship. It seems some people have no life outside of the Internet. I would suggest one's time would be better spent writing directly to the columnists themselves. Have a good life.

Hal The Communist LIAR!
How many lies have I caught you in Hal?
Every one of them was a senseless lie about you personally for the purpose of your own self grandioseness.

When you lied and said you were once in law enforcement, what did that have to do with politics?
(You were unaware R&F Law Enforcement are very supportive of the NRA)
(Only a few politicians in Law Enforcement are anti-gun.)

When you lied and said you were once a member of the NRA and the NRA is a Right Wing extremist organization, what was the purpose of that lie?
You know NOTHING about NRA policies or you would never make a statement like that.

Your lie about speaking at NRA Banquets changes so often I can't keep up with it.

Hal, You are a perfect example to illustrate Mr. Hawkins's article.

Methusela...
Probably one winter to join with the existing Alaskan pipeline. I would say max of 2 to 3 years to be putting fuel in our tanks from that source. Americans are quite resourceful once the roadblocks are removed. If it is opened to drilling there should be something in the bill that requires that crude and natural gas to remain in the USA.

Trying for Compromise
It is a waste of time debating, discussing or in any way rationalizing with the left. Stop doing it. From now on just smash them in their faces and stomp them into the ground.

It's easy to do. Because they've been feminized they've lost their upper body strength and are defenseless.

God bless Judge Scalia. God bless guns, especially assault weapons. Anyone who doesn't have at least five is a traitor and should be stomped too.

No veterans are for Obama. Any who claim to be so are phoney.

Everything I've said is absolute truth. The evidence is incontrovertable. The debate is over. Period.

TrueRedHead
"...: "Folks on the far right"
Just who are these "folks"? Can you name a "far right" member of Congress, for example? "

Tancredo

folks
Adios and be well

MyOpine
Ready to join vets for Obama? I can help sign you up

Prima Volta
Wikki is a very unreliable source for anything.
If something is factual then it will be known by another source.

You can't learn about the Progressive Party from a dictionary anyway.

Try going directly to Progressive sites.

http://www.progressive.org/may04/zinn0504.html

or;

http://cpc.lee.house.gov/index.cfm?ContentID=166&ParentID=0 &SectionID=4&SectionTree=4&Ink=b&ItemID=164

Somehow I get an impression this is not YOU!

"Folks on the far right"
Just who are these "folks"? Can you name a "far right" member of Congress, for example?

Hal The enemy Collaborator.
So you are going to continue to work for America, not against it?
When did you even work FOR America?
You think you are working FOR America by promising our enemies we will soon surrender if they will just hold out a little longer and kill a few more Americans?

You are a COWARDLY ENEMY COLLABORATOR!
You are just like your role model John Kerry.
Have you met with the enemy too Hal?
Did they give you instructions on how to betray America?

Your idol Kerry met with the enemy.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41 106

Failure to answer this question labels you an Enemy Collaborator.
If you wanted to help defeat America and cause us to loose the Iraq war just like Vietnam;
What else would you do that you are not doing right now?
As the Progressive you are RIGHT NOW, not assuming other form or hypothetical pretense.
Can you think of anything you have not done already?

Robert
I hope you and yours are well? Been a rough day here. The troops really are wearing out. Spent part of the morning counseling a young USN guy who lost his first wing man. He is at Fallon... Then let's see we now have two local guard guys in Walter Reed... Just that kind of day

Liberals Lie To Themselves.
I doubt many liberals know what they believe themselves. They latch onto someone like The Obamaman and whatever he's for,they're for.

They have a mantra like the old cheer in school....Barack Obama,he's our man;
If he can't do it,no one can.

If you threw some one liners at them,they would look at you incredulously and say "I don't believe in that"! They either lie or don't know what they think.Just that Obama thinks for them.


onceamarine
telling lies to yourself is not an answer

"...Conservatives are not whitewater people although they are more successful than liberals when the chips are against us."

Really is this what we saw say during the civil war when the conservative, decadent South was doing its slave thing?

"Conservatives see the faster current and the eddies around rocks and urge caution....How come nobody stopped the damn boat fron going over the top.??. . "

You hit the nail on the head you timid and frightened conservatives were a perfect foil for the liberals - then you got power. Well after this fiasco I doubt you will again for at least a generation or two

"Sounds like the old mob violence, doesn't it.??."

no not at all - that is a conservative thing - trying to stop change

"I am not reponsible. They did it. I didn't want to hang the man. I was just there to see."

A PERFECT explaination of the Bush Regime it is their fault. "Their" is anyone but them. New Orleans gone - not our fault "they" did it. Spoiled is a great definition

"Do liberals lie and ...responsibility for life."

See above that is you - mr timid and frightened

"Liberals generally ...prefer that others make the real sacrifices."

Really then why does PA have so many veterans. You conservatives are cowards if you were not you would not keep sending the same soldiers into combat time after time especially to save people like the Bush girls from serving.

"I am going to continue to work for this country and not against it, but I will not be the last to abandon it for a better place if the death sentence is placed on the USA."

Rubbish if you support extreme conservatism you are trying to kill extreme America.


Numbers Dont Lie
The Democrat C H A N G E Americans voted for in 2006 :

--------------------2006------------------2008
Gas----------------$2.00------------------$4.5
Food--------------------------------------Up 30-40 %
Economy---------GREAT--------------HORRIBLE
Compromise-----------------------------NONE
IRAQ WAR-----Told us we LOST---Missing in Action
Work Done
-----The Peoples Business-------------NONE
Hate speeches, endless
hearings and finger
pointing with NO
solutions whatsoever--------------------EVERY SINGLE DAY

APPROVAL RATING *** 10% ***

The Nation is facing an Energy Disaster brought about-on by thirty years of WACKO Democrat Energy Attrition Policies and Democratic Stupidity. Soon people will not be able to drive and the trucks that carry Food and Essential needs to the people will shut down; and the Democrats solution is; Tough Luck ! Drive Less, Save Less, Live Less, Sue More, Tax More !
While Al Gore and the Hollywood elites Fly Around on their planes and live in their Mansions and burn up 100 times more ENERGY than the average person, all the while telling us to “SUCK IT UP”, the Democrat Supporters keep coming. W H Y ?

Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid gave us this Change in 2006, and now Mr.OBAMA wants to give us even more C H A N G E.

When their done C H A N G I N G US, will there be anything LEFT.

Congrats on your honesty, Prima Volta
apparently you are one of the few willing to admit it.

Are you also willing to share your view of Socialism? What is it, or at least, what do you believe it to be? Do you believe America should embrace and work toward the Socialist ideology?

Thanks for the link MyOpine
Excellent article by Williams and some great reference material as well.

johninoregon
You say progressives are "frustrated and angry at what 30 years of conservative policy has done to this country."

Wow, I must have missed that. For the last 30 years, seems like Democrats have been in charge some substantial percent of the time in one or more branch of gov.
But I digress. I'd be interested in a list of what said policy has done. Doesn't have to be detailed or comprehensive, just a few specific woes perpetrated by conservative thought. Sincere question.

You are undoubtedly right about overblown stereotypes, though. And the article is certainly a caricature. A little fun to relieve the frustration (about what 'progressives' propose to do no doubt).
I'm sure you'd never find that sort of thing about conservatives on the sites you visit. They're probably intellectually discussing the issues in a dignified way, which is what we should be doing. Many of the 'progressive' folks who visit HERE, however, do routinely quite a bit of stereotyping of that same nature, and manage to throw in quite a bit of namecalling and vitriol spewing on top of it. Just so you realize that. I'm sure we should just ignore them, and take it on faith that perhaps they do not represent liberal thought.

Redhead
Hi Redhead. I'm very liberal, and yes I agree with the goals of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. I had to go to Wikipedia to find out what that was, though.

The more I read, the less of it I want..
.
...Maybe there's nothing better, but history is an amalgam of development and change. What the USA has traditionally been and stood for seems to be unraveling. Have you noticed.??. Of course you have, and liberals love the ride over the waterfall as exhilarating, but haven't hit bottom or they wouldn't be so sure they want "change".

Conservatives are not whitewater people although they are more successful than liberals when the chips are against us. Conservatives see the faster current and the eddies around rocks and urge caution. Liberals simply think it's an amusement park and shriek for glee, until they hit bottom and go, splat. Next they ask,what happened.??. How come nobody stopped the damn boat fron going over the top.??. They are typically irresponsible on a personal level and wish a collective effort in case things don't work out.

Sounds like the old mob violence, doesn't it.??.
I am not reponsible. They did it. I didn't want to hang the man. I was just there to see.

Do liberals lie and justify their miserable existence.??. You bet. They hate indidualistic people, and will never understand those who do take an individual responsibility for life.

Liberals generally do not volunteer for war time combat or do anything that might bring them in harms way. They like to feel warm and mushy although they themselves prefer that others make the real sacrifices.

I am going to continue to work for this country and not against it, but I will not be the last to abandon it for a better place if the death sentence is placed on the USA. How in h3ll and why do you think all of us early birds who got here when it was all forests and Indians came in the first place.??.

Right. It was a challenge and there was no established cronyism to deal with. Death we can handle. Betrayal, never.
.
.

stand
Your (6:48pm) post:

Yeah, lost cause. I think there was an agenda there rather than an honest question. (surprise!)
The agenda being to try to make a case that there's some plot to addict minorities in inner cities to crack and thus oppress them.

The only real plot I know of to oppress minorities was welfare. It worked.

Retired Geek
Would you try to get Taft to reread the article and attempt to explain why we must judge Communists by their deeds, not their words?

Here is an example of Obama's deeds;
He wrote a bill that would give the United Nations the right to TAX American citizens for the purpose of equalizing World Poverty.

http://capwiz.com/sicminc/issues/alert/?alertid=11014611&ty pe=CO

DONOHUE DEMOCRAT
Subject: DEMOCRAT
Air Force Officer Donohue you are a Democrat.

Nothing wrong with being a Democrat but the associations concerns me. I find it difficult raising my hand with the likes of Sean Penn, Brian de Palma, Barbara Streisand, John Kerry (know true he is not a Roman Catholic - St Paul’s School, NH is High Anglican CoE), Al Gore (Woodhole Oceanographic refutes GW-CC). Born in Chicago (CUBBIES) we were not sure if Al Capone' was a Democrat but knew Tony “Big Tuna” Accardo was for sure (West Side Block).

Boston Time (Go Red Sox) I was at the Parker House Hotel (Dem Party days in Mass) the night Kerry was elected Lt Gov under Dukakis. His behavior there was very odd - may have been on something. MaryJo Kopeckne was just 28 when the other Senator killed her.

New York, the supercilious female Huffington Blog woman tools around NYC alone in the back seat of a stretch black limousine telling the rest of us Plebs ”If you can’t afford the gas – Get off the road!” HypoCrat

My Democratic Friends work and want nothing from nobody accept good jobs at good pay and a safe place to live. With the O’BoyToy the word “safe” concerns me here in Ground Zero

I will make this easy for you. Just complete the sentence.

***** Barack "Barry" Hussain bin O'BoomBox (nee: Obama) is ________________________.
Dissertation not necessary - one word will do!


TruRedHead
This gives some insight as to how right you are.
Many real Democrats are revolting.

http://www.newmediajournal.us/staff/williams/jb_williams.ht m