The House Oversight Committee has been conducting transcribed interviews with witnesses as part of the impeachment inquiry into President Joe Biden. Last week, the Committee posted that they, along with the House Judiciary Committee, had interviewed Mervyn Yan, a Biden family associate affiliated with the Bidens' dealings with the Chinese-linked energy firm CEFC.
On Wednesday, the Committee made the transcript of testimony from Yan publicly available. A major takeaway of Yan's testimony is the uncertainty about the level of expertise or value first son Hunter Biden has.
🚨 TRANSCRIPT RELEASE 🚨
— Oversight Committee (@GOPoversight) February 8, 2024
Today, we are releasing the transcript for Mervyn Yan, a Biden family associate connected to the Bidens’ dealings with the Chinese government linked energy firm, CEFC.
🧵 See the key excerpts 👇
Yan revealed that he met Hunter Biden and James Biden, the brother of now-President Biden, in May 2017 through Kevin (Gongwen) Dong. The meeting was "roughly 15 minutes," Yan shared, emphasizing how quick it was.
He went on to further describe how quick a meeting it was, and how little he knew:
A. So basically we shake hands and basically saying we can work together. And CEFC's name, he mentioned, but I have no idea in what capacity. That was before everything was structured. So basically Kevin introduced me as sort of like on-the-ground person who execute and pretty much sourcing the infrastructure deals. I will be working closely with Hunter, and that's to the extent of that meeting.
Q. What was your understanding during that meeting as to who would be the investor for the deals? Who would be paying for the deals?
A. I don't know.
While Yan shared that Hunter had been working for CEFC U.S. before they met in May 2017, he did not know how long Hunter had been with CEFC prior to that meeting.
After that May 2017 meeting with James and Hunter, Yan and Dong helped establish Hudson West LLC as "joint venture" projects "to source investment opportunities in the United States" in August 2017, which Yan confirmed were about "[i]nfrastructure and energy projects[.]"
When asked what had happened between May and August 2017, though, Yan could not say. "Nothing much happened, at least from my point of view," he offered, going on to say that from May to an August 2 email, "I wasn't involved in any of the conversations."
In discussing who it was that had that area of expertise in energy, Yan offered that "all the projects we did is actually we're using third-party experts. So we're basically managing the investments." He couldn't speak to any area of expertise that Hunter had:
Q. And do you have a background in energy and infrastructure?
A. No, I don't have background in energy and infrastructures. But from my point of view, this is just the same as building a condo building because I'm not a contractor. We're just using a third-party expert.
Q . So what was the value you were bringing to the group?
A. At that time, I think just Kevin and I was working. And then I don't think he has anybody else to work on this.
Q. Did Kevin have a background in energy --
A . He's a real estate development -- real estate investments.
Q. Did he have a background, though, in energy infrastructure?
A. No.
Q. Who did?
A. I think at that time was -- well, all the projects we did is actually we're using third-party experts. So we're basically managing the investments.
Q. Okay.
A. So if, for example, if we identify a project, we go out and find a construction firm.
Q. Hunter Biden didn't have any experience in --
A. I don't know.
Q. -- energy infrastructure, did he?
A. I don't know.
Later in the interview, House Judiciary Chairman Jim Jordan (R-OH) spoke to question Yan and to emphasize how he could not say what value Hunter Biden brought. "What did Hunter Biden bring to the table?" Jordan asked. Yan could not say.
Hudson West LLC was also involved with CEFC to allow the Chinese-linked company access to the U.S. energy market.
However, Yan claimed not to know about CEFC's business activities or its ties to the Chinese government. This is despite how he received a salary of $10,000 a month from CEFC. As Yan maintained:
Q. Could you remind us what you said about your knowledge of CEFC?
A. I -- let me say this, I never heard of CEFC until that particular senior executive, John from the insurance company, to CEFC securities. In fact, before that, I never heard of it.
Q. And was it your understanding that Mr. Dong was working for CEFC?
A. No. It’s my understanding that he mentioned this a couple times to me that CEFC is one of his investors.
Q. Okay.
A. He is managing some of their moneys presumably and that CEFC is paying a management fee for Kevin’s entities.
Q. Okay.
A. To be primarily investing in real estate transactions.
Q. And you’re partners with Mr. Dong.
A. No, I am not partners, no. I am not partners. We work as an independent --
Q. Well, you said you are a two-man group, so what did you mean by that if you are not partners?
A. We act as a team. So, when he has something to execute and. . . [he] ask[s] me to take a look, I will review the documents because I am always available at least in the States.
Q. So you are a team, but you are not partners?
A. Not in the equity interest sense, no.
Q. Okay. And so you never had any role at CEFC?
A. No.
That $10,000 a month compensation also came up regarding communication that Yan had with Hunter Biden over WhatsApp, in which he offered "to resign" from CEFC. Yan testified that he saw such a role with CEFC as being an "independent contractor."
Again, Yan did not know what Hunter or James Biden contributed. Even as Hudson LLC failed to land infrastructure deals for CEFC, they were still compensated handsomely:
Q. I would like to turn your attention to section 4.6, which is on page 10. And, based upon this provision and the agreement, Owasco manager Hunter Biden shall entitle a compensation of $100,000 a month, and James Biden shall entitle a compensation $65,000 a month. Compensation of other staffing persons shall be determined by the board of managers. Furthermore, R. Hunter Biden shall be paid one time retainer fee of $500,000. This is August 2nd of 2017.
...
Q. What was your understanding that Hunter Biden was going to get this $100,000 a month for? What was the basis for giving him $100,000 month? So it is $1.2 million year.
A. In my understanding, reading the statement, this is just a draw; it is just a draw from the initial operating budget. That's -- that's it. I don't determine the numbers.
Q. And James Biden would get a draw of $65,000 a month?
A. That is right.
Q. Why was Hunter Biden getting more than James Biden?
A. I don’t know.
...
Q. The way I read this, correct me if I am wrong, that there were essentially five energy-related endeavors that Hudson West III was trying to be involved with. Is that correct?
A. Who was trying to be involved with?
Q. Hudson West III --
A. Yes.
Q. -- in 2017 appears to have tried to land five different energy deals. Is that -- do I have that correct?
A. That's right. Five of them actually on paper.
Q. But none of them materialized, meaning none of the deals actually happened, correct?
A. That's correct.
Q. And despite the fact that none of the deals actually materialized and no money was ever produced from it, Hunter Biden and James Biden still were paid, correct?
A . That's correct.
Q. And these deals only happened in 2017, correct?
A. The initial starting point --
Q. The attempt at making the deals were in 2017?
A. Yeah, the attempt of making this deal happens in 2017.
Q. There's nothing referenced in your letter that's in 2018, correct?
A. No.
Q. But there was still money being paid out of Hudson West III to Hunter Biden and James Biden in 2018 and beyond, correct?
A. That's correct.
Further questions came up as to why James Biden was still receiving the same compensation after Yan and Dong signed a second amended and reinstated limited liability company agreement of Hudson West LLC, even though James was no longer involved.
Again, though, Yan couldn't answer questions on the matter. He himself also only "eyeballed" the expenses:
Q. If James Biden is no longer involved, according to the LLC agreement, I go back to where I started. Why was Lion Hall Group getting payments out of the Hudson West III bank account? Because at this point, you are a signatory on the account. It’s post March 31st of 2018.
A. Yes.
Q. The payments go to Lion Hall. They begin in April. I still don’t understand why Hudson West III was making payments to Lion Hall if you’re claiming that James Biden is not involved anymore at this point.
A. Well, I’m not claiming that. It’s just in the statement that the Owasco [was] receiving the same amount as the first... LLC agreement. So I wasn’t paying attention. But I think, to your point, yeah, James and Hunter are still there.
...
Q. What services were Lion Hall Group providing?
A. I think that’s primarily for all the -- all the number[s] that they submit. I -- presumably, that’s a business expense related to Hudson West III business.
Q. But it’s my understanding that at this point, Patrick Ho has been arrested, CEFC is not really responding very well, that you’re not getting -- there’s not the communication you want. So what -- what business expenses are being submitted? It seems like a -- $30,000 in business expenses. What -- what did that entail at that time?
A. I think there was a spreadsheet of some sort. I mean, they detailed probably the expenses occur before -- before this before -- the change of the LLC agreement signatory. And also, it's my expectation that while ... CEFC is nonresponsive to the Hudson West III business, but it’s never officially dissolved, so nobody is getting fired, unless I’m told ... to fire then you're off the payroll or something. So nobody is given clear instruction of what’s going on, so everybody is doing business as usual.
The conversation that I had, probably in 2018, I mean, there’s still some lingering conversation that I had with the Monkey Island transactions. In fact, that I was doing some work receiving [a] couple of packets of those Takano parties, like Magnolia and the Monkey Island presentation from the owner ... Greg Michaels. So we still have a regular business contact with ... potential transaction, but it's just CEFC never came back to us with any ... solid yes or no answer. So everything take a pause, but that doesn’t mean that we stop working.
Q. ... in your letter you say there's no contact with Lion Hall. So ... I just don't understand why Lion Hall is getting the money still. I appreciate there may be expense reports specifically for James Biden, is what it sounds like you're getting at ... But why Lion Hall? It's a separate entity. It's not ... James Biden in his capacity, is what I understand, because the agreements don't say Lion Hall, they say James Biden. So why is Lion Hall getting paid?
A. I don't know, but I guess that's the title of the expense report, and that's [what they] ... gave me.
...
Q. Do you want to explain your role there?
A. Yeah, so basically my role there is being like a foreperson in this time. So Hunter Biden and James Biden, they will -- sometimes they combine through their assistants to send me a whole bunch of expense reports related to travel. Basically I just eyeballed it...
So Hunter verbally agreed, but he never sen[t] me any detail of receipts, but he just summarized [a] certain amount. And then I eyeballed it. It doesn’t seem to me that's out of typical business travel expenses. So then that's why I just say pay for it. And then I just forward that email to -- probably Kevin got that email, too, so he authorized the payment for the reimbursement of business expenses.
Yan could also not explain why James' wife, Sara, received a Hudson West LLC credit card, in addition to James and Hunter Biden. Yan could not speak to what she was buying or how much she could spend.
It had been established early on in the interview that despite how Yan claimed he had had no "direct contact" with Sara Biden, despite how he communicated with her via her Lion Hall email account, which was James Biden's group.
More interviews are still to come, including from James Biden on Februay 21 and Hunter Biden on February 28.
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