Townhall.com, Where Your Opinion Counts
Talk Radio:   Bill Bennett   Mike Gallagher   Dennis Prager   Michael Medved   Hugh Hewitt   
BREAKING NEWS  LeftArrow - Townhall.com : Conservative, Political, Republican   RightArrow - Townhall.com : Conservative, Political, Republican  
Columns, funnies & more in your inbox!
  • Check the boxes and send us your email address to receveive your free newsletter
  • Your daily must-read of conservative columns, cartoons and news. Coulter, Sowell, Krauthammer and more.
  • Townhall.com’s weekly inside scoop on what’s happening behind the scenes in the world of politics. When news breaks, we report.
  • Signup to receive the latest daily Townhall cartoons
Tuesday, January 22, 2008
Dennis Prager :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Case for Rudy Giuliani
by Dennis Prager
Vote on It:
Average Vote:
[+] Text [-]
 
Poll
Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


To the extent that I understand how most Republicans think, it would seem that former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani comes closer to the Republican ideal than any of the other viable Republican candidates. They are all good and decent men who would be better for America than either of the Democratic front-runners. But it is difficult to see, from a conservative- and Republican-values perspective, what major shortcoming Giuliani brings as compared to the other candidates. And given the obsession of liberal news media with publishing negative reports about Giuliani and frequent praise of John McCain, it would appear that it is Giuliani whom Democrats most fear as the Republican presidential nominee.

On the "war on terror," no Republican contender but John McCain equals Giuliani in longtime efforts on behalf of that war or in understanding and articulating the threat radical Islam poses to America and to liberty on earth. And they both have great courage. If the only issue that mattered in the next election were the "war on terror," all those -- including Democrats and independents --who share this awareness of the Islamist threat could be happy with either candidate.

Anyone who does not understand the nature of the war that liberty is now waging against tyranny should not be president of the United States. And the Democratic candidates until now have shown no such understanding -- the term "Islamic terror," invoked by nearly every Republican candidate, was not mentioned once in any of the Democrats' debates. But while this understanding is necessary, it is not sufficient. America needs a strong leader domestically, as well as internationally.

And when it comes to being strong on both domestic and international issues, it seems that no presently viable Republican candidate matches Rudy Giuliani.

The current leading contender, Sen. John McCain, is a great American and a true American hero. However -- and this is written in sadness -- on too many significant issues, conservatives, and even many moderates, would not only disagree with John McCain but also would question his judgment.

John McCain is a leader in promoting legislation on behalf of "campaign finance reform." Aside from limiting freedom of speech, such legislation has done real damage to our democracy. For example, it has severely limited how much money one American can give to another American to run for public office. Consequently, increasingly only the very famous and/or the extremely wealthy -- e.g., California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, former senator -- now governor -- Jon Corzine of New Jersey, and New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg can run for office. The percentage of very wealthy members of the U.S. Senate is the greatest in American history. Thanks to John McCain and "campaign finance reform," Americans running for public office can spend hundreds of millions of dollars on themselves, but individuals can give only $4,000 to non-wealthy candidates. John McCain, in a recent Republican debate, asked, "Why shouldn't we be able to re-import drugs from Canada?" (With its socialized medicine, Canada buys drugs at cheaper rates.) This is not merely not conservative; it is radical and it is foolish. As George Will wrote this week, "That amounts to importing Canada's price controls, a large step toward a system in which new pain-relieving, life-extending pharmaceuticals would be unavailable. When Mitt Romney interjected, 'Don't turn the pharmaceutical companies into the big bad guys,' McCain replied, 'Well, they are.' There is a place in American politics for moralizers who think in such Manichaean simplicities," Will concludes. "That place is in the Democratic Party."

John McCain twice voted against President Bush's tax cuts.

John McCain has wholly bought the politically correct view of man-made carbon emissions leading to global catastrophe. It is true that all the Republican candidates pay lip service to a hysteria that is capable of truly harming the American and world economies, but John McCain is the major Republican activist on this issue. He is co-author, with Sen. Joe Lieberman, of a bill empowering Congress to legislate carbon emissions, and he has dismissed all scientific questions with Al Gore's, "The debate has ended."

John McCain's view of drilling for oil in a remote corner of Alaska: "As far as ANWR is concerned, I don't want to drill in the Grand Canyon, and I don't want to drill in the Everglades." Any comparison of a part of frozen Alaska that has been seen by almost no human being in history with the Grand Canyon and the Everglades, which tens of millions of people have visited and always will visit, is, shall we say, odd.

John McCain is a good man, a good American and a good leader, but he is not a conservative in some important ways. That is why John Kerry considered John McCain as a possible running mate. Would John McCain be a better president than a Democrat? Yes, primarily because of his stance on the "war on terror." But conservative supporters of McCain need to acknowledge that some fundamental conservative principles -- as noted above -- probably would be rejected in a McCain presidency.

Rudy Giuliani may have made a great mistake by not campaigning in New Hampshire, Nevada, Iowa and South Carolina. But between Rudy Giuliani (and, for that matter, Mitt Romney) on the one hand and John McCain on the other, there is little question as to who more embodies mainstream conservative and Republican principles.

But Giuliani is not merely more of a conservative than John McCain. In fact, if it is Ronald Reagan that Republicans want, Giuliani is extraordinarily close to that venerated man. Ronald Reagan stood for two great beliefs: that big government is a big problem for a free society and that America must be militarily strong and lead the war against global communism.

Substitute "global jihadism" for "global communism" and you have Rudy Giuliani's twin pillars. His one major weakness in appealing to all conservatives is that he is for abortion rights. Let me, then, briefly address all those who, like me, consider nearly all abortions immoral.

Ronald Reagan was pro-life, and it mattered little to the pro-life cause. Concerning abortion, what matters most in a president is the type of judges he appoints to the Supreme Court. As George Will wrote on behalf of Giuliani, "The way to change abortion law is to change courts by means of judicial nominations of the sort Giuliani promises to make." It is extremely unlikely that John McCain would appoint similarly conservative judges. After all, why would he appoint judges like Scalia and Alito who apparently differ with him on the constitutionality of McCain's own "campaign finance reform" laws?

Pro-life Republicans need to ask themselves: Will a Democrat or Giuliani as president render abortion less common in America? The best is the enemy of the better. And Giuliani is far better on abortion than any Democratic nominee.

Giuliani is for school vouchers, against bilingual education, for reducing taxes further, for reducing government spending. And he has well-thought-out positions on how to achieve these things. He also has the experience of cleaning up the most liberal major city in America.

I write this column aware that Giuliani may have lost his chance at getting the Republican nomination. But I could not live with my conscience if I did not articulate one week before the potentially decisive Florida primary why I believe Rudy Giuliani would make an excellent president of the United States.

Share:
Vote on It:
Average Vote:
 
About The Author
Dennis Prager is a radio show host, contributing columnist for Townhall.com, and author of 4 books including Happiness Is a Serious Problem: A Human Nature Repair Manual.
 
TOWNHALL DAILY: Be the first to read Dennis Prager's column. Sign up today and receive Townhall.com daily lineup delivered each morning to your inbox.
Totally Disagree
couldnt disagree more. Rudy liberal on almost every social issue. Take a stroll down you tube and you'll see a WEALTH of videos that would make any conservative blush. He will be extremely polarizing for african americans, his family life is a mess including him cheating on his wife while in office ala Clinton.

I mean what type of justification is the republican party establishment trying to use to enhance his standing among conservatives? I simply don't understand how any conservative could vote for Guiliani OVER the other candidates.

Sure if he's going against hillary he would be the better choice, but it ASTONISHES me how the establishment can demonize Huck and McCain, yet try and justify Rudy as conservative?

And tell me this. Why oh why should ANYONE believe that Rudy will appoint conservative judges when 1) His personal beliefs/philosophy is pro-choice 2)when things get extremely HEATED come judge appointment time....why would Rudy FIGHT so hard for someone that he doesn't even agree with philosophically? Bush fought for prolife judges when it got down and dirty because of a intrinsic belief in the cause...someone that doesn't believe in that cause simply will NOT fight for it I believe when the kitchen gets hot.

Discuss this at Prager Fans website!
Visit http://www.PragerFans.com to discuss this and other Prager-related topics with those who are fans of Dennis Prager. Click on the link for "Discussion Board".



I have got a great case for Giuliani
If he is the Republican nominee, then we
Democrats can win without even breathing hard.

Go Giuliani

Elephant in the Room
Giuliani is unacceptable for conservative Republicans. Mainly for the reason most people will not talk about. The elephant in the room: Adultery. I thought we had enough of that in the Clinton years. Republicans didn't give Bill a pass on that. Why should we give Rudy a pass?

Rudy will have to win
Rudy will have to beat McCain if he wants to be viable. If Romney wins FL it will hurt McCain and help Rudy by hurting McCain. I am assuming Rudy can raise enough money to win NY, CT and maybe NJ.

Unless something changes I expect Rudy to run 2nd or 3rd in FL.

The two newest polls are from a Sunday over a 3 day weekend so lets see if some regular week polls show a different pattern but Rudy and Huck have been losing votes and Romney and McCain have been gaining and share the lead over the 2 latest polls in FL. Fred dropping should help Romney the most. It may take a week or so for the votes to show up.

See, this is why I gave up on Prager
and all the other "reformed" liberals, like Medved (Deadhead, as I call him), Kristol, Horowitz, and all the rest of the self-proclaimed "reformed" liberals -- my contemporaries -- who were all out there protesting Vietnam, smoking dope, trashing campuses, being Democrat stalwarts (as Prager himself has admitted), and basically being good hippies/leftists.

At the very exact same time, I was an Army brat, protesting the protesters (in my case by volunteering for the Army and Vietnam in 1969), was anti-drug from the jump, never trashed a campus, don't feel the need to apologize or regret anything politically in my entire life.

As Prager says -- I guess trying to paraphrase Reagan -- he didn't leave the Dem party, it left him.

So what you end up with is a bunch of these ex-leftists feeling guilty for missing the Vietnam War -- which was my generation's war and they chose the wrong side -- now trying to apologize, but still not being able to make the real and definitive move to actual conservatism.

That's why these clowns support Giuliani, a true RINO, someone who shares their own ambivalence toward real conservatism, and is always making apologies for his liberalism in the past, and excuses for his liberalism of today. Just like Prager.

A Bald Hillary election would validate these clowns.

Which in and of itself is reason enough to reject Giuliani. He's simply running in the wrong party; he'd make a Dem candidate worthy of consideration. But not for the GOP if the GOP still wants to have any claim at all as the party representing traditional American conservative values.

I'm also forwarding directly to Prager a copy of this comment. FYI, if anyone cares.


As long as Ted Olsen stands by Rudy,
it's reassuring.
A judge outlast the president. Judges decisions outlast the judge.

What a president does about judges - including lower court who are next decade's crop of SCOTUS candidates - matters way after the prez is out of office. I don't trust Rudy. I trust Ted Olsen.

This being his holiday, MLK longed for the day when a man would be judged by his character. RG is a Clintonesque sleazeball with respect to his wives.

Comments on McCain were, sadly, spot on.

One has
to give Praeger credit for his loyalty to Rudy. But Rudy is no conservative. An anti-gun, anti-life, pro-sanctuary city, pro-adultery canddiate suits well in the other party, not ours. National security?? Give me a break..being a a deputy assistant US Attorney sounds good on television but is no match for real war heroes or a governor who has actually commanded the National Guard.

You have to be kidding?
If Mr. sanctuary city, abortion on demand, gay rights parade marcher Rudy Guiliani is Mr. Prager's idea of a solid conservative, then I think all hope is lost for Dennis. I know the Iraq war is the paramount issue above all issues for Dennis, but there really is more to being a conservative then being the biggest pro-war candidate in the field.

And as far as the abortion question, in the short term things like upholding the Mexico City policy have much more impact at preventing abortions then judicial appointments (which of course are important in the long run). There is no reason to believe that Rudy would stand strong at defending such policies.


Yeah, JamesB, what's up with
that One-Note Johnny crap with RINO Rudy the Bald Hillary?

"When I was mayor of New York on 9/11...." blah blah blah.

C'mon, dude, what have you done for me lately? Who cares? That's so yesterday's news, and so provincial!

News flash to RINO Rudy and the rest of the Bots: New York is NOT the center of the Universe. Shocking but true!

Even more amazing: most of the country doesn't really give a damn about New York City! Yeah, amazing, right? But it's really true!

Most of us actually live in the real world.


Why the failure to mention Romney?
Prager -- I generally like you and appreciate your analysis. However, you are completely off on this.
Because you're religious, perhaps you will appreciate the advice of Proverbs 16:32, "He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty [this eliminates MCain], and he that ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city [this eliminates Giuliani]."

If Giuliani cannot conduct himself honorably in the most sacred of vows, how can you trust him as president. Clinton was competent. He was just morally bankrupt.

Romney has conservative positions. He may be a convert to them, but he governed as a conservative.
Romney has lived a moral life of service and achievement.
Romney has demonstrated intelligence and competence -- graduating in the top 5% from Harvard, getting simultaneous degrees in law and business.
Romney exemplifies in both his personal life and his political speech what Americans esteem: family values, financial success, and personal integrity. He may make a misstatement now and then, but who doesn't?
He will reduce the waste in Washington, and give us conservative judges.

Rudy is hardly the epitome of conservatism.

BrianR
Yeah, what you said! :op

Don't ya love how the pundits all seem to be pushing for pone liberal or another?
They're either rooting for rudy, or shilling for mcamnesty.

Only a few with guts to actually talk about Romney or Thompson. Gotta give david limbaugh credit for bucking the tide and backing fred. Too little too late tough it appears.

Hey Brian, check out my blog, new toy I tink you'll like

What About Integrity?
What about our 2nd amendment rights?

What about illegal immigration?

What about Life? Traditional Marriage?

Even Rudy's tax plan favors the rich, reinforces three distinct income classes, and punishes upward movement and success. Does little or nothing to strengthen the dollar or to keep jobs in America. It really doesn't compare to the FairTax.

Personally I much prefer A FAIR DEAL FOR ALL AMERICANS:

http://www.mikehuckabee.com/?FuseAction=Blogs.View&Blog_id= 1178



It's about principle
Dennis, who often writes about the importance of principles and values, is asking voters who believe in the sanctity of life, have supported the 2nd amendment, believe that any city that encourages illegal immigration should do without federal funds, and believe that marriage is between a mand and a woman because the family is the core component of society to check their values at the door when voting for Rudy. Not going to happen.

It also occurs to me that the piece is more about how McCain is NOT the guy vs. Rudy is the guy. On that point I wholeheartedly agree.

I'll take Huckabee or Romney over McCain or Giuliani every day of the week.

Both Mitt & Rudy Changed Their Tune
From the very moderate sometimes liberal songs they used to sing to the conservative talk radio mantras they've been preaching since entering the race. I don't buy it. I can't trust them in so many ways.

http://www.mikehuckabee.com/?FuseAction=Blogs.View&Blog_id= 1217

I don't Understand RINOs
If you want to kill the Muslims you have two choices.
Rudy and McCain. No one else is even worth mentioning. Mitt has NOTHING that Rudy does not have better. Mitt is the the left of Rudy on most issues.
Rudy will take their oil for Israel McCain does not care about oil, he just likes killing Muslims.

Now if America's freedom, personal liberty and responsibility, and sound economic principles and limited government are what you about Ron Paul is the only one running on that platform.

I don't care what polls say
the truth is that the media WANT McCain.

I think McCain will be the best democrat president ever voted into office by the republicans. Wants to silence everyone.

Rudy is second best. Runs the best sanctuary city in the country.

Huck is a jerk. Lost a lot of weight and it's 'IF I CAN DO IT, ANYONE CAN' time... Any ex- smoker, drinker or fatty is on a crusade.


Well Dennis;
I hope you like ones. He may be OK for your kind of Republican but he sure ain't OK for a real conservative.

How about this; neither McShame nor RINO Rudy are worth a T-D*mn and I will vote for neither.

So far I have rang up 3 "Republicans" that I will NOT vote for. RINO Rudy, McShame, and the Hillbilly Huckster.

Vic
My 3 no-noes exactly. The others are smelly, but still possible. With economic disruption a stropng possibility, maybe its just best to have a D in the WH. The right wing is in such disarray from the rotten performance of the RINOs, only another Peanut Jimmy type shock will re-create responsible voters.

Savage99
I think we have "consensus". I guess that makes it a scientific fact.

Vic
Well, it would if we were Al Gore and Robert Redford. The things on our side in the AGW fiasco are time and money. The high cost of any "cure" and time will inevitably expose it for a farce. Meanwhile the Chicken Littles will have moved on to some other fad. Somehow, the latest is really real this time.

Savage99
Yeah, I'm still trying to get over the vote for McShame on Saturday. I just can not see how SC Republican voters voted for him over Fred.

I can see the religious zealots voting for Huck because they have blinded themselves to his liberalism but I can't see the rest being blinded by McShame's military career over his liberalism.

I guess the one thing is that McShame actually got less votes this time than last time when he lost. If Fred had not been in the Huck would have won and vice versa. If Huck had not been in the race Fred would have won.

Why Republicans Must Support Rudy
I am very conservative and I understand all the points that most of you posters have raised. Many are valid, but here is why we must support Rudy.

We must be realistic. The political landscape is not in our favor right now. People want change and the Democratic candidates are getting all the buzz. We must support a more moderate candidate just this one election if we want a chance to win. Giuliani and McCain are the only candidates that can win. If you don't agree than you are fooling yourself.

Romney will get lambasted by the Democrats for being a flip-flopper and only taking positions that are politically beneficial. For whatever reason, Romney comes across as insincere and has not connected with the average voter on a personal level. This was Kerry's downfall. And this is not the election to "test" whether the electorate is ready to support a Mormon candidate. He probably could win most elections, but not this one.

Huckabee reminds people too much of George Bush. A religious simpleton from a Southern state.

For whatever reason, Thompson has not connected with the American people and people worry he may not have the energy for the job.

That leaves Giuliani and McCain. I think Giuliani is the far better candidate. First he actually has experience governing -- and he did it spectacularly. He took one of the biggest cities in the world which had been run into the ground by 30 years of Democratic leadership and he turned it completely around in five years. It's really incredible. All while having to fight a Democratic legislature all the way. Think what he could do for America. We know he is great in a crisis. He is more conservative on virtually every issue than John McCain.

Continued Below....


Why Republicans Must Support Rudy - 2
His only real flaws are abortion and his personal life. What did Reagan, Bush41, and Bush43 do for abortion? Nothing. The only thing a president can do is nominate strict constructionist judges to the Supreme Court. Rudy says he will nominate judges in the mold of Roberts and Alito. He has Ted Olson advising his judge selections and he has always kept his word in the past. As far as his personal life, I would love to have a great family man, but that is impossible right now. Like Giuliani says himself, a politician's personal life might matter if that is all you know about him, but with Giuliani we can look at how he has governed and see the results for ourself. And Reagan was divorced and had poor relationships with some of his children as well. Like in the NFL, the best coaches almost always get divorced because they they are workaholics who put everything they have to make their team successful.

So this one election, we must think practically instead of idealistically. Votes for Romney, Huckabee and Thompson are votes for Hillary Clinton. If we nominate one of them, then she will be our next president. So when you go to the polls to vote, just think of Hillary appointing the next two Supreme Court Justices and vote for Giuliani or McCain who can actually beat her. And I believe Giuliani is the best choice between these two flawed candidates.

Rudy vs. Hillary
Can’t we do better than these two?

Giuliani: If I Have A Presidential Mistress, She Will Get Security Too!

Giuliani’s Answer Was ‘Flimsy,’ Says ‘Tough-Talking New Yorker’

Giuliani Defends, Employs Priest Accused of Molesting Teens

Hillary’s Hsu indicted

Weapons Industry Dumps Republicans, Backs Hillary

Hillary, Bush For Open Borders

WATCH VIDEO


http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/rudy-vs-hillary




Are you kidding me????
Thompson is conservative in just about every area and his record bears that out.

McCain is a liberal when it comes to taxes and free speech and illegal aliens. As his record shows.
I don't give a flying leap what these guys are saying now.

LOOK AT THEIR RECORDS!!!!

Guliani is all for gun control, gay marriage and sanctuary cities.

Huckabee wants to give in state tuition to the children of illegals just because their own parents put them in a bad situation and he thinks the govt. should fix it for them.
He's talked about national smoking bans.
He's talking about regulating the pay corporate execs can make. He's playing right out of the liberal handbook when it comes to class warfare.
And I'm pretty tired of him making cutting comments and personal cuts at people that have nothing to do with issues and everyone letting him away with it because he does it with a smile and seems like a nice guy.


Rudy Demonstrated Real Leadership
I think it is just silly to vote for a president on the basis of who committed adultery and who did not. Reminder: McCain cheated on his wife, who was seriously injured in an auto accident, when he came back from Vietnam, and married an heiress from Arizona. There are no paragons of virtue in this race. They are all human with many faults including Clinton, Obama, and Edwards.

Giuliani is a leader and a forceful leader. All Americans saw this confirmed at 9/11 but those of us living in the tri-state area knew before 9/11 that he was the kind of leader who could make a difference--a big difference. He turned around an ungovernable major city, a feat that still is not fully appreciated by most Americans.

Not only could we expect that Giuliani would vigorously defend the U.S. from Islamic terrorists, he would turn the bureaucracies in Washington upside down. The State Department and CIA bureaucrats would be walking on pins and needles. I for one would sleep more comfortably if Rudy was in the White House.


Rudy is an Open-Borders Traitor
He is an adulterous, cross-dressing, pro-gay-agenda pervert who manages to make Bill Clinton look like a good family man!

He believes that the cure for crime is to disarm the American people.

He is fervently pro-abortion.

And worst of all, he ran New York as a SANCTUARY CITY, a haven for ILLEGAL ALIEN crime and corruption! You can't claim to be tough on the war on terror if you support policies THAT KEEP OUR BORDERS WIDE OPEN. We have been invaded by Mexico, and it's time that we start to fight back! Every day at work, I am forced to listen to the MEXICAN NATIONAL ANTHEM, with the announcer declaring in Spanish "If you can hear this, you are on MEXICAN LAND!" I had to watch my dying father, a WW2 Vet, quietly weep in his wheel-chair as he watched MEXICAN CRIMINAL SCUM tear down the Stars and Stripes that his buddies had DIED for -- and hoist up the filthy flag of MEXICO.

Things like that don't bother Prager and Medved, etc. because their loyalty is to another flag, not America.

Orthodoxa et al
After reading "opinions" like Orthodoxa's above (and others) on this column, I'm saddened by the "DailyKos"-like vitriol being spewed by conservatives on a consertive opinion site. I think I'm done with the comments section on this site. What happened to conservatives using reason and logic to make a point?

Dean OUT

I'm not so sure
that staying home on election day and handing the presidency to the Democrats would be such a bad thing.

I always said that Jimmy Carter was the best thing to happen to the Republican party. His term as president gave us Ronald Reagan and a nation that finally "got it" regarding the worth of conservative principles.

I think it's very possible that four year of Hillary or Obama could do the same thing.

Good riddance, Dean
You might be sick of hearing from people like me, but I AM SICK AND TIRED OF BEING TREATED LIKE A FOREIGNER IN MY OWN COUNTRY.

If you like the MEXICAN INVADERS so damn much, why don't you move there?

Dean
At least on TH, conservatives are willing and dare to debate and have differing opinions.
You go over to Kos or Huff 'n Puff and try to post an opinion that differs at all from the crazy lib socialists and see what happens. You'll get banned and then have comments about how they wish you were dead.


Best IS the enemy of Better!
Except for Rudy and Romney, every other viable candidate is a one-legged Republican stool.
-McCain is HALF of a defense conservative.
-Huckster is a social demagouge.
-Thompson is the only true conservative, but he's unelectible!

Rudy was my first choice last year and I consider myself prolife. The man cleaned up Times square and put a hurtin' on crime. What more do you one-dimensional prolifers want?

That said, I now OPPOSE Rudy on the basis that it is undemocratic to sit out of the primary process like he has. He hasn't been properly vetted and I don't want a precedent to be set where future elections are run nationally rather than locally.

Romney is my man and if we can narrow the field to Romney and McCain, Romney will win HANDILY.
VOTE FOR ROMNEY!

Romney Not Included?
"John McCain is a leader in promoting legislation on behalf of "campaign finance reform." Leader? His "leadership" is best exemplified by leading the Republicans into deals with such stalwart Americans like Kennedy and Feingold, and "leading" rebellions against Jorge Bush's nominations for supreme justices. Yes, the leader of the Repubs among the Gang of 14 -- leading along with the Democrats. He is a numero uno maverick who is always looking for the reporter and TV camera, and will do anything for this type of hype to show that he is a "leader." The worst decision that the US has made is to become a slave to mideast oil and McShame does not want to drill in and around the US. That is not an option. When a global tiff occurs and the oil boats coming to America become targets, it is goodbye economy and we better pray for more global warming to allow the northern US people to stay where they are.

and another thing!
Everyone is piling on Rudy, but I don't see anyone's plan to beat McCain!! McCain has been sticking his finger in our eyes for 8 years. Let's stick our finger in his eye and send the old man back to Washington!

It's the Economy
It's the economy, stupid - not the war in Iraq and Afghanistan. Guiliani, McCain and Romney are not going to simply pull out of Iraq. At the same time, until we can remove most of those troops, we will not be involved in any other ground war - because we simply don't have the forces. And if, as I believe, a majority of them will be there for at least three more years - then the only option any President will have will be to fight terrorists in concert with our allies, and to use Air Power if it comes down to trying to take out the nuclear option for Iran. The fact that Guiliani and McCain trot out their war credentials is, as a result, secondary.

So, it's the economy. And that means huge, almost $800 Billion a year trade deficits, a weak dollar, a $250 billion current budget deficit that is going to grow because we are going to spend money to try to stimulate the economy, a $9.7 trillion dollar foreign debt that foreign governments use to extract trade and defense concessions from us, a loss of manufacturing, an influx of illegals and an influx of foreign workers brought in by corporations who are gaming the system, and the retirement of the boomers leading to systematically rising costs of entitlements.

Who are you electing to deal with this? Or will they all just kick the can down the road?

Nice Job, Prager
Finally, someone in the national media gives Rudy a word up. Rudy is perhaps the best candidate in a general election for the GOP, imo, because he is as knowledgable and forceful about the differences between the "conservative" platform and the Libs' Marxist ambitions as anyone. Unfortunately for him, the system is such that he's already been relegated an after-thought. His only hope now is Florida, and that looks nearly out of reach. I tried desperately to get a "opt-In Tax" idea to Rudy for weeks....to, apparently, no avail. Imagine Rudy proposing a new line item on all tax returns whereby anyone could give, in addition to their regular, mandated tax-load, any amount they wanted to with an "Opt-In" donation. This would give the likes of Warren Buffett et al the ability to pay through the nose if they wanted instead of claiming to not be taxed enough. As it is, Rudy is just the "9-11" guy and we've been put back to sleep on the issue of terror due to the effectiveness of the Bush administration in dealing with it.

prm79
"Let's stick our finger in his eye and send the old man back to Washington!"

That'll show'em, lol

(I know what you meant)

He's no Reagan he defended infaticide
Despite his supposed mid-campaign change of heart, Rudy, time and again, defended partial birth abortion (which Moynihan called infanticide.)He passionately argued that its a woman's right to choose.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giZx5i3Ntv0

And he highly recommended his corrupt buddy Kerik to be head of Homeland Security. Can America afford such lapses of judgment? I think not.

Major Personality Flaws
Guiliai was a great take no prisoner prosecuter. His time as Major was a mixed experience. Yes, he did recognize the importance of quality of life issues and deserves a lot of the credit for cleaning up times square. But he has some personality traits that are troubling regardless of your ideology. For one he like anyone else getting the credit so he forced out of office one of the most talented Police Commissioners in history largely because he was getting too much credit for the reduction in crime in the city. He also sees the universe as populated by friends and enemies and so when Repubican Senator D'Mato a longtime political enemy of the mayor's within the Republic Party put up George Petaki to run against the ultra liberate Mario Cuomo. Guliani crossed party lines to endorce Cuomo. Of course, Cuomo lost and Guliani was seen for the longest time as a traitor in New York's Republican establishment. He was also extremely tone deaf in his interactions with the black community. Not because he is a racist but because he just does not know how to win over people who initially don't like him or support him.

I bought his book on leadership in the height of his popularity and found it troubling. In it he defines great leadership as doing what I do. Not once in all those pages does he admit a weakiness or acknowledge a mistake that helped him to learn or grow into a better leader.

He just reminds me too much of our current occupant in the White House.

4 RINOs
RINOs Rudolph Giuliani and John McCain represent social-facsim.

RINOs Mitt Romney and Mike Huckabee represent western-socialism.

Fred Thompson is the only candidate that represents our Constitutional Republic.

If Republicans don't vote Thompson in as the President, our nation will fall to complete communism/nazism in less than 4 years.

for Jerseyvet
Jerseyvet writes: "I think it is just silly to vote for a president on the basis of who committed adultery and who did not."

I agree with you,
but the Christian evangelicals, who are now so powerful within the GOP, want a President to be a good "CHRISTIAN LEADER" (does that phrase sound familiar?).

That means they want a President who sets a good Christian moral example, as well as being a spokesperson for Christian values.

For them, George W. Bush, the born-again Christian, was the perfect President. As they've said.

And for them, Giuliani is the diametric opposite--someone whose lifestyle and expressed values are the antithesis of their ideal.

It's just one more example of how the Reagan coalition is breaking up. In the 1980s, the social conservatives never rejected any Republican candidate solely because of an affair and/or a divorce (Reagan included). But now, this year, they have really started throwing their weight around. They have become rigid ideological purists, who are threatening to expel anyone from the GOP who doesn't measure up to their standards.

Stayin' Home
M Sederoff writes: "I'm not so sure that staying home on election day and handing the presidency to the Democrats would be such a bad thing."

I've said the same thing. My dear spouse was quite shocked, but I pointed out that just 2 years of Bill Clinton got us our first conservative Congress in 40 years. (Well, okay, the corrupt liberal Congress at the time helped, but the Dems have that one covered again right now.)

Heck, if the choice is McCain or Rudy vs Hillary, I just may pull the level for the D. Why settle for a mostly-progressive when we can get the bone fide thing? If the country wants liberalism, the let it have liberalism -- undiluted. RINOs just confuse the populace as to what conservatism stands for.

Reimportation of Drugs
Up is down and down is up. How can you believe in free trade and not believe it should apply to citizens who want to shop around for a lower price. Canada does not fix the price of drugs it simply negotiates for all its citizens a reduced rate. By the way many large US corporations do the same thing. Drug companies screw US citizens. They force us to carry the load for the cost of reserach and development and then sell to the rest of the world at a bargain rate. This is only possible because of artifical barriers created by the federal government to protect the industry. It is justified on the basis of safety a phoney arguement.

So is prager saying he is against free trade. These laws amount to a kind of corporate welfare. If these law were eliminated the drug companies would adapt and prices would likely rise a little for Canadians, and the rest of the world and fall for consumers. The problem with conservatives like Prager is that they frequently will contort their central conservative principals to make arguements favorable to big corporate interests. Corportaions don't have an ideology only self interests and will flip for oneside to the other side of the political spectrum to get the best deal.

John McCain is a true conservative.

Rudy realities
Rudy has done the absolute impossible to NYC after democrats trashed it for years. He cleaned it up in record time, lowered taxes by 17%, lowered abortion rates while increasing record adoption rates. He led NYC out of a terrible and surreal crisis none of us could ever have imagined. This you all truly cannot deny. He shows himself as a leader, a do-er, who only has made insanely negative situations spin into positives for all. This is what we need.

As far as abortion, snap out of it. A president cannot wave a magic wand and abolish it. Even the most anti-abortion president cannot do this. Abortion will never go away. What a president can do is appoint judges on the supreme court with those ideals and uphold them and fight for them. Rudy can and would do this.

As far as gun control, the only control Rudy wanted was to have a person fill out a questionairre to see if they are dangerous mental cases. Do you have a problem with that? I sure don't and I support our 2nd ammendment rights. What is wrong with checking a persons criminal and mental history before being allowed to purchase a weapon?! This infringes on your rights? Tell that to the lunatic murderer who bought a gun and kills your family.

He cheated on his wife and upsets his children? Well, are you voting for a natural born leader or are you planning on dating the man?

Gay pride parades? Have you read Stossel's article with Ron Paul and read what RP was quoted in saying about gay marriage? RP could care less and doesn't mind gay marriage, he leaves that up to the state. Does that make him a RINO? A liberal? I find that Rudy hasn't even said that much.

I feel sadly Rudy won't win because of uninformed persons or people with extreme misguided negative bias towards him.

All we can hope for is that Romney wins, although I feel Rudy would be the only person to take down Hillary.


Reimportation of Drugs
Up is down and down is up. How can you believe in free trade and not believe it should apply to citizens who want to shop around for a lower price. Canada does not fix the price of drugs it simply negotiates for all its citizens a reduced rate. By the way many large US corporations do the same thing. Drug companies screw US citizens. They force us to carry the load for the cost of reserach and development and then sell to the rest of the world at a bargain rate. This is only possible because of artifical barriers created by the federal government to protect the industry. It is justified on the basis of safety a phoney arguement.

So is prager saying he is against free trade. These laws amount to a kind of corporate welfare. If these law were eliminated the drug companies would adapt and prices would likely rise a little for Canadians, and the rest of the world and fall for consumers. The problem with conservatives like Prager is that they frequently will contort their central conservative principals to make arguements favorable to big corporate interests. Corportaions don't have an ideology only self interests and will flip for oneside to the other side of the political spectrum to get the best deal.

John McCain is a true conservative.

yada yada yada
I am so tired of these supposed conservative pundits attempting to sway GOP opinion with drivel like this.

They must think we are all morons easily manipulated to believe whatever they say. I'm tired of the manipulation, it's a slap in the face, a real insult.

Guilliani is even losing in New York polls, he can't even get his own family members to vote for him. Truth is, Guilliani is nothing but power hungry.

Prager suggests Rudy will bring in strict constructionists judges. He didn't as New York Mayor - they were all liberal. Give me a break.

Instead Prager spends 80% of the article trashing McCain. I like the fact that he's a maverick, I like the fact that he'll stand up to the GOP establishment, he is lead by his heart, not polls, not GOP pressure, he is his own man - exactly the kind of leader and patriot we need in the White House.

I like Fred Thompson more, but I can live with McCain, especailly a McCain/Huckabee ticket.

So please Prager, quit insulting us, quit trying to feed us major spin, Guilliani is done. In fact, you can use the argument, his campaign policy of waiting until Florida was a major disaster, if that is any evidence of his judgement and decisions, that tells me he would make a lousy President. He shot himself in the foot - all by his lonesome. And all of your spin and punditry can't change that.

In fact, with idiotic articles like this, please go work for Hillary's campaign, it would do us all a favor.

Orthodoxan -"you bring me right back in"
Thanks for making my point. I offered no opinion either in favor of, or against any candidate and you attack. How very ironic of you. Thanks, I needed a laugh. I realize the noise at the lib blogs is much worse, but my point is lost on you. Alas, where did civilized debate go? Sadly, we bring ourselves down to the tin-hat wearing level of discouse. Sigh.

BTW - I haven't made up my mind yet, but I think all the Rep. candidates have their good points (and bad points), so I'm really taking my time to do the research on each. When I have made my choice, I'm not going to sit around and type bad things about those who don't agree. That would be kind of childish, don't you think?

Guiliani?
You must be kidding. His positions are indistinguishable from the democrats. Even my kids asked the question why Rudy calls himself a republican! There is nothing conservative about this guy.

Sorry guys you had your shot
I want a conservative! wha wha wha. All the candidates or RINO's. wha wha wha. Where are the conservative principles? wha wha wha.

Fred Thompson came out and spoke of conservative principles. He stood for everything you wanted in a candidate. He had the positions you wanted. You just didn't listen. There was a conservative in the race and you shunned him for the flashier RINO. Good job. You said he was unelectable. Well sure he's unelectable if you whiney faux conservatives keep voting for RINOs. The primary is not designed to get someone in there that can win. It is to get your ideas in the main event. It's easy to get someone elected with an (R) behind their name. Just tell Hillary to switch parties. She'd do it if she thought she'd win.
You failed. You looked at Hillary and said we have to beat her. You played defense. You compromised your positions and now the conservative is all but out.
Fred was there for you. He is proof you don't want someone that is conservative. You want someone that can play a conservative on TV. The irony is beautiful.
Now either Florida (me included) has to pull a rabbit out of the hat or you get the RINOs you wanted. Anyone that didn't vote or support Fred and whines about the lack of conservatives no longer has credibility in the RINO name game.

Imagine all you want, DBerriman
But Rudy is the same as Hillary, except that he likes wearing dresses.

Why do you think that Rudy would care a bit about your tax policy preferences? He has already ignored entire states in "flyover country" that he considers beneath his notice!

His idea of having a track record of "fighting terror" is kicking Yasser Arafat out of a New York dinner party! Oooooh, I'll bet that had Osama quaking in his boots!

And you can't claim to be fighting a war on terror while keeping the borders wide open with "sanctuary city" policies! Ask Rudy about the $4.3 million that Mexico City paid Rudy in "consulting fees". That corrupt SOB has been paid off by Chavez, too.

Just Say NO To McCain
I will sit out the election if John McCain is the Republican candidate. I may even opt out of the Republican party and go to Independent. No matter what some Republican leaders say, he's getting the support of the Republican machine because of McCain-Kennedy. They want the cheap labor for business. Period. His current stance on illegal immigration is McCain-Kennedy with a fence. He'll wreak havoc if he's elected. I don't trust him to appoint conservative judges and I don't trust him to keep us safe. The man can't even support "dunking the sheik" if American lives were in danger. I take exception to calling him a good leader. Can you please point to him being EFFECTIVE in the Senate as opposed to being a showboat? I don't want some Maverick with his hand on the nuke button. You don't reward bad behavior with a shot at the presidency. I may hold my nose and vote for Guiliani or Romney but McCain will NEVER get my support and what's making me ill is the possibility of Thompson throwing in with him.

The Case for Rudy Giuliani
I could not agree more. Rudy is the embodiment of conservatism on issues of importance.

Don't Understand
The problem with the campaign and with the Republican party is that there are 4 grand constituencies that are represented, and their first priority does not run in together.

In the party, we have the fiscal conservatives who want a balanced budget, elimination of unneeded services, tax cuts, etc. For this group, Bush & the last congress were a disaster. We overspent and balanced and elimnated nothing. Rudy & Romney are strong here while McCain and Huckabee are suspect.

Next, we have the libertarian wing. Their wish is for the government to but out of their business. Like the fiscal folks, they want spending cuts mainly to starve the feds and stop them from being able to be activist. These people too were disappointed in Bush. All of the candidates are supect by this base and their support is either staying home or going to Ron Paul.

The third group is the National Defense supporters who want our nation to be strong in the fight against the global jihad and independent of other nations (immigration & United Nations). Here both McCain and Rudy are strong against the Jihad, but both are very suspect on immigration. Romney and Huckabee are not as strong on defense, but are much stronger on immigration.

Finally, the fourth group is the one concerned with the secular progressive attacks on the character of the nation. Often called the religious right, they worry about gay marriage, abortion, etc. Romney and Huckabee win here with Rudy a distant 4th.

The key for a candidate is to somehow knit these groups together and still show as a moderate to the great middle of the road voter. Can this be done? In the words of Miracle Max, "It'd take a miracle".

DeanPot likes looking for kettles
Oh, this is hilarious.

You call me illogical, etc. and then threaten to leave in a childish huff while neglecting to address any of the arguments of my original post, such as:

A) Rudy is a cross-dressing pervert.

B) He is an adulterer.

C) He is pro "gay rights".

D) He is pro-abortion.

E) He is for gun control.

F) He is an Open-Borders Traitor.

I doubt you have the intellect to refute any of those arguments, so why don't you post another whiny cry-spiel and then go off and hide.

Anti-Socialist
I take issue with you saying that Mitt Romney promotes "western socialism". NO. Mitt Romney is the height of a CAPITALIST. His company that he founded was called BAIN CAPITAL. Bain was formed to take companies, retool them, and turn them around into profitable companies that employ people. Staples and Dominos were 2 such companies. The man was in business for over 25 years. He knows how our free market economy works. He's NOT a Socialist.

He also is the best, brightest choice for President. His negative, Ken doll image, the "flip-flopper" charges on abortion are unfair and wrong. He has a wife that he's been married to for 38 years, he has 5 sons that adore him, and has been called a business "genius" in the past. This is a candidate that may not have the speaking ability of Obama or Huckabee, but his credentials are top notch, and he will make a GREAT PRESIDENT.

Mom in Wisconsin

The Third Group
>The third group is the National Defense supporters who want our nation to be strong in the fight against the global jihad and independent of other nations (immigration & United Nations). Here both McCain and Rudy are strong against the Jihad, but both are very suspect on immigration. Romney and Huckabee are not as strong on defense, but are much stronger on immigration.<

First of all, national defense has been so distorted since WW2 that what it really means is massive military budgets complete with all the pork and earmarks as socialist entitlement programs.
Romney is currently second behind Hillary in campaign contributions from defense contractors, and first among Republicans. Likely, Romney will be friendly to defense contractors, not so much for actual defense purposes, but because the defense industry is one of the most viable manufacturing entities still based in the US. Romney, as a businessman, understands the importance of maintaining a manufacturing base in the US. Hopefully, he will have a more centered philosophy as to what defines defense than the current administration when he becomes president.

Here's some campaign photos for Dean
Take a good look at the pervert that Prager supports!

http://www.perrspectives.com/images/rudy_drag.jpg

Ironic, is it not.
For what it's worth, the last two polls in Florida show either Romney or McCain. Of the last 7, Guiliani led in one by 1% point. Other than that, he is consistently 3rd. Huckabee, appears to be sliding - not gaining. Guiliani can speak bravely as he's doing - but he needs Florida more than anyone - and it doesn't look good for him.

Granted, these polls have been infamous - or famous, but Guiliani better get a bounce out of Florida - or he could be toast. He's not, after all, leading much of anyplace - and a loss in Florida won't help. In addition, the Mayor's refusal to campaign in Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, and Michigan was more an admission that he couldn't win - than a winning strategy. Thompson also seems on his way out. He has to connect somewhere - and it's just not happening. The Huck, in turn, also needs a bounce somewhere.

Are we really getting down to McCain and Romney? I wonder.

If so, let the games begin. McCain seems to line up well with the Dems in the fall, but not the conservatives in his own party. Romney doesn't seem to line up well in the fall. But, it could change.

After all, if Hillary wins - I can't see the GOP or independents picking her over either, even if the conservatives aren't happy. After all - they can take McCain, whose solid on abortion, defense, and spending - or Hillary. Or, they can take Romney - or Hillary.

How ironic it will all be. And, if it's McCain, it will put some egg on my face. I simply never believed that McCain could be a possible nominee, given some of his positions and how many conservatives feel about him.

Still skeptical. But given his wide lead today in the February 5 California primary - there's not even a close second - who knows?

Ironic, is it not.
For what it's worth, the last two polls in Florida show either Romney or McCain. Of the last 7, Guiliani led in one by 1% point. Other than that, he is consistently 3rd. Huckabee, appears to be sliding - not gaining. Guiliani can speak bravely as he's doing - but he needs Florida more than anyone - and it doesn't look good for him.

Granted, these polls have been infamous - or famous, but Guiliani better get a bounce out of Florida - or he could be toast. He's not, after all, leading much of anyplace - and a loss in Florida won't help. In addition, the Mayor's refusal to campaign in Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, and Michigan was more an admission that he couldn't win - than a winning strategy. Thompson also seems on his way out. He has to connect somewhere - and it's just not happening. The Huck, in turn, also needs a bounce somewhere.

Are we really getting down to McCain and Romney? I wonder.

If so, let the games begin. McCain seems to line up well with the Dems in the fall, but not the conservatives in his own party. Romney doesn't seem to line up well in the fall. But, it could change.

After all, if Hillary wins - I can't see the GOP or independents picking her over either, even if the conservatives aren't happy. After all - they can take McCain, whose solid on abortion, defense, and spending - or Hillary. Or, they can take Romney - or Hillary.

How ironic it will all be. And, if it's McCain, it will put some egg on my face. I simply never believed that McCain could be a possible nominee, given some of his positions and how many conservatives feel about him.

Still skeptical. But given his wide lead today in the February 5 California primary - there's not even a close second - who knows?

I disagree with the entire Prager articl
He keeps saying McCain is a good leader, good American. What??? McCain is not a good leader or a good American. I question John McCains Patriotism. Just being a Navy Pilot and a POW doesn't give you an instant pass. Sorry, doesn't work that way in my book. No pass for you McCain. There are many ways to show you love America and are a good leader. McCain flunks them all.
You are on board with every bad idea the democrats have. Amnesty for people breaking U.S. law by the millions. Flunk. Higher Taxes. Flunk. All the liberal ideas you supported and the conservatives you left for dead...we won't forget.

Guliani is infinately better choice than McLiberal.

WTF OVER!
THE BALD HILLARY!?

Gimme a break Prager.

RINO Rudy is the biggest POS RINO next to McShamnesty and I wouldn't vote for him for dog catcher.

It's people like you that are shoving these RINOs in our faces and destroying the GOP.

Get the h*ll out of it.

BTW, do a little research on the candidates before you tout those RINO scum.

http://noliberalspin.townhall.com/g/e55a8758-e97d-4da1-9f52 -2d173e2dbd1a

RINO RUDY.....for street sweeper.

Here's a photo of Rudy...
...being a gun-control fascist:

http://www.gunowners.org/pres08/giuliani01.jpg

He believes that his MISTRESS should be provided with armed police protection while the peasants are left defenseless!

Some perspective
For those of you who keep throwing the "RINO" term around, I have to ask when were the following issues NOT Republican: cutting taxes, cutting spending, strong military, free trade, personal accounts for Social Security, parental choice for education (including vouchers), and health care reform that promotes less government and more individual choice and free market competition? If those issues are "Republican in name only", then one of us is living in Bizarro world. And yes, that is Rudy's platform.

For those throwing the "sanctuary city" thing around, I would ask you this: are you saying then that Rudy should have worried more as mayor of *New York City* about enforcing *federal* immigration law than he did about reducing crime in *New York City*? He allowed immigrants to report crimes & turn in criminals without fear of immigration-status retribution. Can you, with a straight face, claim that this wouldn't help fight crime and take criminals off the streets? So for the sake of potentially deporting more illegals NOT committing crimes, Rudy should have promoted a policy that would have allowed increased crime in his city? That seems to make little sense.

Rudy's hardly the perfect candidate, but let's have a little perspective here.

Romney should have gotten your nod..
Rudy is a good man and would be phenomenal in one of the cabinet posts but he is too vulnerable in a national election. Too many skeletons in the closet thus mitigating any attack on the Clinton's ethics.

Romney has his weaknesses but he is very bright, accomplished, well-spoken, understands business far better than anyone running (just listen to him), and will be very aggressive against jihadists and China Inc, both of which to do successfully will require a robust American economy.

re: NE Conservative
I'm no big fan of McCain, but for you to question his patriotism is ridiculous. What, because he disagrees with you on some issues, he's unpatriotic? And who exactly made you the arbiter of patriotism?

By the way, McCain is on the record for supporting making the Bush tax cuts permanent, even though he did (wrongly) oppose them originally. And he has proposed a fairly large pro-growth, supply-side tax cut authored by Jack Kemp.

Look at the entirety of his voting record, and you'll find that while misguided on plenty of things, his record is still far from that of leftists like Hillary or Obama.

He's not my choice for the Presidency, but let's be intellectually honest in our assessments. And for you to denigrate his service to our country in the military and question his patriotism is simply low.

re: GunnyG, Robert
re: GunnyG
Calling Rudy the "bald Hillary" does not pass the intellectual debate test. Look at his platform, and look what he accomplished as Mayor of New York. Last time I checked, cutting taxes, school choice, reducing spending, free trade, personal accounts for Social Security, and market-oriented health care are not part of Hillary's platform. They are part of Rudy's.


re: Robert
You severely undercut your assertion that Republican politics is based on "name calling, loud babbling etc." and then imply that they are neither "serious" nor "adult".

John Galt
Every single ILLEGAL ALIEN is a CRIMINAL.

What part of "ILLEGAL" do you Open-Borders Traitors fail to understand?

So if it is OK for Rudy to declare NYC a "sanctuary" for ILLEGAL ALIENS, is it OK for the mayors of other cities to shield people who are guilty of other federal crimes?!?

Corrupt traitors like you are turning this nation into a de-facto Mexico, where the laws are only applied when they benefit the elites.

McCain was right
>McCain is on the record for supporting making the Bush tax cuts permanent, even though he did (wrongly) oppose them originally<

He opposed them originally because they weren't accompanied with spending cuts. If anyone is a RINO, it's those who want less taxes and increased govt spending.

not again....
So I guess this means today's show is gonna be another three hours of Dennis gushing over Giuliani like a school girl, while continuing to shame those of us who don't like the guy for our "lack of clarity".


Rudy says, "I'm personally opposed to abortion, but will not stand in the way of a woman's right to choose". Dennis hears a statement like that and doesn't find anything wrong with it. He might even agree with it. But he isn't putting himself in our shoes. He wouldn't support a candidate who personally opposes terrorism but will not stand in the way of a terrorist's "right to terrorize", even in countries that are run by terrorists. Here's a much less extreme example: He wouldn't even support a candidate who is personally "pro-smoking" but won't do anything to overturn the smoking laws.

When Prager calls Giuliani a "true conservative", what he's really saying is that Rudy is every bit as conservative as he is. They're two peas in a pod. Prager's so-called, "liberal instincts" cloud his judgment more than he likes to admit. That's why he's going around accusing those of us who are much more conservative than he is of failing to think clearly and rationally. He doesn't think that true conservatives are clear and rational thinkers.

We hear a statement like "personally pro-life but ultimately pro-choice" and recognize it as dishonest. This was Bill Clinton's view!

The grand delusion.

As a life-time conservative, I just have to "marvel" at some of the comments.

In spite of the fact, that some posters have accurately pointed out that voting for our next president... is a vote for the next two or three Supremes... other posters hint at either staying home or voting third party.

Then as their non-vote or third-party vote elects Queen Hillary, I suppose that they will after her "reign" march on the White House and demand...

...that the 2 or 3 far-left new Supremes resign,

...that all her new "entitlements" be cancelled,

...and that any enacted portion of "socialized medicine" be rolled back.

Right... when pigs fly.


why Prager touts Rudy...
Simply put, Rudy is a neoCON trumpeteer. His advisors are STRICTLY neoCONS who believe in fighting any and all Islamics for another agenda. For Prager, Prelutsky, Barone, Cliff May, Dick Morris, Gaffney, Krauthammer here on TH, NOTHING else comes close to mattering. The neoCONS simply glommed on to conservatism because it was the prevailing wind in power starting with Reagan.

Their cohorts (Perle, Wolfowitz, Libby and Feith) then manipulating Bush by his own choice willfully got us into Iraq to construct those 18 permanent bases... we took out Osama's enemy Saddam, who had NOTHING to do with 9/11. Then when things went rank in Iraq, they slunk away leaving dupes Jorge and Rummy to take the rap... they had never cared about winning per se; the REAL agenda was those defensive bases for another tiny nation. They had called for this beginning in 1996, but Slick Willie would not buy into it, so they waited until 9/11 gave them their cause celebre and a willing stooge in Presidente Jorge, who SHOULD have been worried about AMERICA's border.

http://www.csmonitor.com/specials/neocon/spheresInfluence.h tml
http://www.antiwar.com/pat/?articleid=2371
http://tvnewslies.org/html/pnac_neo-con_artists.html


This is a HOOT
For year and years, Republicans blew smoke up America's butt with their insistence on personal morality, standing by conviction, principles, principles, principles, etc. They were all in favor of such things, but only as long as such rhetoric helped them gain power.

Now, watching them try to find a raitonalization for abandoning their princiopels is hysterical.


Let's be honest here please
Rudy could rape your mother, but as long as he's right on the "War on Terror" read; Holy War, you'll go along with ANYTHING. Even Rudy's dreams of a leftist police state. Count me out idiot.

Robert

"Illegals? Do you really think we are going to "throw them all out"? No we are not."

-- Uh, yes we are. In Arizona and Oklahoma, the new state laws cracking down on illegal aliens has spawned a mass exodus of the criminal scum. All it would take is for us to ENFORCE THE LAW. The new Arizona law is already working so well that MEXICAN GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS staged protests in Arizona last week, stating that the flood of criminals back into MEXICO would DEVASTATE THE MEXICAN ECONOMY as they began to demand "free" handouts like they do in America.

"The ecnomy (sic) then has major problems."

-- Your personal economy might suffer, if you are making money off of ILLEGAL ALIEN CRIME AND CORRUPTION, but the American economy will improve, as American jobs go to Americans, and the parasitic foreign scum are no longer crowding hospital emergency rooms, schools, etc. demanding everything for "free" and in Spanish.

" No one on this forum will go to BAstrop Texas and pick onions."

-- I sure will, if the pay is right. Your hatred of America shines through in the above comment. For most of this nation's history we have not needed ILLEGAL ALIEN CRIMINAL SCUM to be prosperous, and we don't need them now!

"Most people here are to (sic) fat, to (sic) old and to (sic) lazy to do it."

-- And some are either too lazy or too ignorant to spell correctly.

The way McCain has been
acting the last years, I am beginning to wonder if his five years in Vietnam have actually been a vacation, with him as a guest of the same VC for whom Kerry made a propaganda broadcast and went to Paris to be their agent.

Talk Radio versus Giuliani
The Republican party is made up of more than religious conservatives. It is made up of religous, social, and fiscal conservatives who should all be playing nice in order to win the election and stop a socialist landslide. There are many moderate Republicans, moderate Independents and even moderate or centrist Democrats who may be looking for a candidate with a more moderate philosophy. I believe Giuliani fits that picture. I feel that if we promote a moderate we may even swing a large amount of Democrats who may not be comfortable voting for a far left wing candidate. Hillary is not Bill. Bill was a Centrist, Hillary is a Socialist. Guiliani's problem is that the liberal radio and tv can't wait to ring his campaigns death knoll because they fear him as a winnable candidate. Conservative radio broadcasters like Laura Ingraham who always talks about neo-cons and elitists, is a strong Romney backer and bashes everyone else, and delights in Guiliani's loss of poll figures. Talk radio people have a goodly amount of impact on the political arena, if they don't think that they are elitists then they aren't being honest with themselves. Guiliani may have a past with his marriage issues, he has made mistakes. I worry about people who are too clean or have never made mistakes. I want someone who is flexible and not predestined to react in a certain way. I want someone who believes in a small federal footprint and will leave to the states and the courts the interpretation and implementation of the law. I really fear that McCain and Romney and Huckabee will only pull factions of the party. Look at who the DEMs want to lose, that is who they really fear. I am holding off buying a wreath for Rudy's campaign just yet.

personnel cuts
If the government repealed all taxes and replaced them with One tax And Done, they would remove them from the price of everything, reducing the price by everything. They would also eliminate the taxing bureaucracies, and the bureaucrats could get real jobs and start paying INTO the treasury, instead of taking of it.

BrianR-GunnyG
It looks like Hairless Hillary is TOAST!

Here's what's funny
So far, Ron Paul has garnered a bigger percentage of votes in each primary or caucus, and has more delegates (6 to 2) than Giuliani.

Prager - Rudy is toast. Even if he wins winner take all Florida, isn't it obvious that there isn't enough national support to get enough delegates to win the nomination? He's polling behind McCain in his home state.

Either McCain or Romney will be the nominee, with Huckabee a longshot possibility.

Facts.
1. Rudy sold his consulting company he bought out of the Enron bankruptcy to the Aussie/Spanish toll road company that is lusting to build the Trans Texas Toll Road. This Spanish/Aussie company just paid him $7,000,000.00 and then they go and buy up all the local newspapers in Texas and Okla. along the route so they can stop the truth.
2. Rudy just spent the last two years before this on the pay roll of the City of Mexico City, to slow crime, did not work but got paid lots of money any how.
3. Rudy's law firm is the reg. lobby agent for Hugo Chavezes of Venzoolala land's Citco Oil in Texas, and it was paid $76,000 for that work last year.
4. Rudy will ok any am-nasty McCain and Kennedy sends him if elected.
5. China is the one that will get its junk shiped in cheap and up the toll road from hell, so get ready for more of the China suck up.

enough is enough
Republicans had better get their heads out, or
the U.S.A. and "We the People" are in for big trouble.

Jane Roe endorses Ron Paul
Norma McCorvey, the famous "Roe" in the Roe vs. Wade case, is repentant of her position in the abortion case and is now a pro-life advocate. She is endorsing Ron Paul for president today.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/01/roe-v-wade- advo.html

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=ZDllNTMyNGY5MTg1MW YyYzVmN2EwY2MxZjc1YWI2ZmI=

Ron Paul's pro life stance is impeccable. He is the only candidate that is proposing to end the supreme court's Roe vs. Wade abortion ruling immediately. He has proposed just such a bill in congress (110th Congress, HR300). Ask your legislator why they haven't co-sponsored the bill and helped bring it to a vote if they say they are pro-life. Ron Paul has also proposed a bill to define human life as beginning at conception. As an OB/GYN, Dr. Paul knows that human life begins at conception. This bill will clarify this question in federal law. Additionally, Ron Paul will most certainly appoint judges that will uphold the constitution.

http://www.ronpaul2008.com/articles/?tag=Abortion

Arp
has a good point.
He said that all the conservatives wanted a conservative but keep touting and voting for RINO's.
Sure Thompson doesn't have the big, shiny personality that some of the others have. So what?
Are we electing a Personality of the United States or a President?
It's the issues stupid!!

Look at their real records. Never mind what they're saying now.

Did you McCain lovers know that he fought to squelch the free speech of a right to life group along with all liberal partners???

You want McCain and Huckabee to give favor to illegals?

You want someone who, when asked a serious question continually brings it back to how well he handled 9/11? That's one thing and he pretty much had no choice, did he?? He had good, smart, prepared people working for the city.

Look at their past records!!!

Romney vs Giuliani
Dennis,

How would you compare Mitt Romney versus Rudy Giuliani?

Damning with faint praise
As a huge fan of Dennis Prager, I found this column very disappointing. It is largely an exercise in McCain bashing (which is fine, I think McCain needs a lot of bashing and Dennis does it well), but has little to say about what makes Giuliani uniquely well-qualified for the Presidency.

Yes, Rudy is uniquely serious about Islamo-fascism, and that may just be all it takes. I find nothing else here that distinguishes him from, say, Romney, except having cleaned up New York City, which receives only passing mention. There is really no examination of Rudy's policies, positions, and/or character beyond his being the hero of 9-11 and not-McCain. Oh, and he's not a Democrat, either. So, that's three.

The final paragraph is really a howler: after offering this languid pro-forma, uninspired, and largely off-topic yawner, Dennis lets us in on the fact that he wrote it because his conscience demanded it, even if the cause is already lost. Yep, and it reads like an epitaph, too.

Electibility
Prager makes good points. For two years, I have blogged that the most electible ticket would be Rudy-Fred. Is it perfect? Of course not. Did anyone see the Hil-Obama socialist pacifist racial debate last night? Do any of the Pub purists here who vote on one issue and have never worked in politics as they simply rant about 'perversion' but forget the Carter years which the Dems would foist on the entire populace not just one wing of the Pub Party. Prager cites issues which we know Rudy would support. There are no Reagans now on our list. OK, one must decide if we turn the nation entirely over to the socialist pacifists for the next 16 years. No more SCOTUS picks. The economy tanks. Our national security is headed by an Empty Suit no matter who wins the Dem nomination. So, we can rant and call RINO and be smug as losers. Frankly, I don't want to lose the entire nation when at least we have a shot with Rudy or even Mitt. You can ramp up your self righteousness and lose the nation. Good. Wait for Jesus and the Millenium. I will be there too as a Christian but is could be a long, long time before then!

POWER CORRUPTS ALL
POWER CORRUPTS ALL

Here are some recent examples of Government sponsored terrorism:

British Special Forces Caught Carrying Out Staged Terror In Iraq?
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/september2005/200905st agedterror.htm

U.S. Government Uses Al-Qaeda To Attack Iran
Bush authorizes group formerly headed by alleged 9/11 mastermind to be bankrolled & armed by CIA for covert regime change
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2007/280507usesalqa eda.htm

Readings on government deceit, cover-ups, false-flag terrorism (state sponsored terrorism etc)

Who is funding Americas enemies?

"None Dare Call it a conspiracy" – Gary Allen (1972)
http://reactor-core.org/none-dare.html

This book explains the geo-strategy of the war planners and empire builders:

"The Grand Chessboard - American Primacy and its Geostrategic Objectives" (1997)
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/zbig.html


Rudy Giuliani would tramp down the GOP
Let us stand for family values and clear morals.

Let us be the party that rejects the devaluing of the American Family.

Rudy Giuliani is unethical in his personal life and we do not need that in the White House, most especially NOT WITH OUR BLESSING.

King Lib re your 11:42 post
I think you hit the nail dead on the head.

The GOP has been going through some contortions for the last 4 elections. Bush 1 first rode on Reagan's coattails to a huge victory which he threw away in his re-election by turning into a RINO. Then we had Dole, "Mr. Compromise", rightfully sent back to the dugout. Bush 2's been only marginally better than his opponents would have been, a huge disappointment. And now you have a conservative faction that's finally fed up with being told to "hold your nose" every single time and vote for these guys who don't hew to conservative principles.

So the natives are restless, the wardrums are beating, and there is a very real possibility of a confrontation, which you summarized well.

A nomination of the Bald Hillary or McCain will surely lead to a GOP meltdown, because both will lose to the Dem, and the GOP Establishment will then rightfully point to us conservatives as being the ones who allowed defeat.

Which will be true, I'm happy to say. We've certainly given enough warning about it.

That could end up being a healthy development for the long run, if in 2012 the nominess are Jindahl or Palin, or a combination, or someone like that.

We had to get through Carter to end up with Reagan; it may be time for something like that again.

The case AGAINST Rudy.
Here's why Rudy Giuliani should not be the Republican nominee: He will lose -- period.

I'm not impressed with Giuliani's claim to appoint conservative justices. When the chips are down, he's going to do what's politically expedient, and that means appointing justices who pledge to uphold Roe vs. Wade.

I'm not crazy about John McCain or Mike Huckabee, but I could vote for them against Hillary or Obama. I dislike Mitt Romney, but I could hold my nose and vote for him. I'm not sure I can hold my nose tight enough to vote for Giuliani.

Othadoxa = P.O.S.
Apparently, you are a recalcitrant child who needs his pablum fed to him a spoonful at a time. If you note in my orginal post (try: reading), I wasn't arguing ANY point about ANYTHING you wrote (which was all vitriolic garbage with no substance), so for me to address your "points" was moot, as I was merely commenting on the hateful content of your post and the lack of meaningful discourse included. Your tiny intellect can't even fathom my meaning, let alone grasp the concepts necessary to speak eloquently on the subject. Thanks for giving me even more reasons to abandon any thoughts of a rational discussion on this board.

Please become a liberal so that you can go discuss things with like-minded moonbats who have similar computing power.

Giuliani
Giuliani's main problem is his horrific gun-rights record. Prager failed to mention this crucial issue. Rudy did not succeed in assuring voters that he would protect the second amendment. This is the main reason why he might not get the nomination. Romney's support of an assault weapons ban also undermines his candidacy.

John McCain has the longest and most consistent record of upholding gun rights.

Actually, Robert, I agree with you
I also agree that times, do indeed, change. That could be good OR bad for the country. Frankly, I'm not sanguine.


If, as a nation, we've simply lost the will to make traditional principles determinant, well.... the nation will change, and in my opinion, not for the better.

There's certainly no God-given guarantee that we'll survive as anything the Founders envisioned. But it's something the people themselves will determine by the choices they make.

I gotta tell you, man, I look around me at California, where I live, and if THIS is the future of the country, we're in very deep trouble.


Robert
"The American people want Roe to stay. They do. That means it is going to stay."

That's what they said about Scott vs. Sanford and Plessy vs. Ferguson.

Polls show that most Americans want greater restrictions on abortion. Yet the pro-abortionists consistently fight even the most minor restrictions, such as parental consent laws. They say they want abortion to be "safe, legal, and rare." Abortion is legal. When do they plan to work on safe and rare?

Dean
You effete, effeminate, liberal.

Stop crying like the baby you are and try to man up for once in your life, you POS.

You are just horrified that people are posting the truth about Julie-Annie and perhaps fear that if the drag queen photos circulate too much, that associates of yours will see you standing in the background - ready to pin a flower on your new 'beau'.

Why don't you move to Mexico.

spot on brianr
after 30 years of neozioncon control.
we BETTER get back to traditional roots.

Yeah, sonofsam, but here's what
worries me.

There's a quote popularly attributed to Tytler, in his essay in which he observed that most democracies have a life span of approximately 200 years, that "when the people awaken to the fact that they can vote to themselves the largesse of the Treasury, democracies fail".

That very well may be where we are now in our history. Too many people are dependant on the "largesse of the Treasury" -- the government -- for monetary benefits of one kind or another.

Too many people look to the government to solve all their problems, large and small, so we have an intrusive government stepping in and trying to mandate every aspect of our lives -- for "our own good", of course -- so we see thousands of new laws about smoking and diets and trans fats and fast food and seatbelts and motorcycle helmets and government-controlled home thermostats and everything else under the Sun.

And of course, any law by its very definition curtails choice and, thereby, freedom to one extent or another.



Very, very troubling.

Ken
Abortions are down 25%, a movement on the rare issue. Continued efforts to enhance sex education to include effective birth control education are importnatn though opponents still think they can jusy say no to Human nature. As for safety, an abortion is much safer than actual child birth, so it's not really an issue.


Robert
"Roe is amazingly good law and really good work by the court."

Is that so? Consider a few facts:

- Norma McCorvey, alias Jane Roe, claimed she was raped. She now admits she never was.

- McCorvey's attorney's compounded her lie by saying that she was gang-raped.

- Bernard Nathanson testified that approximately 5,000 to 10,000 were dying each year from "back alley" abortions. He later admitted that these figures were false.

- In 1973, people generally accepted the argument that a fetus is just a blob of cells. Ultrasonic technology has proven otherwise.

In other words, the whole Roe decision was based on perjury, falsified evidence, and obsolete medical knowledge. This is "amazingly good law"? Give me a break.


Jack
"As for safety, an abortion is much safer than actual child birth, so it's not really an issue."

Baloney!

You folks are all missing the point
I believe most of the people posting are missing the point of Dennis'article. The point is that if given the choice between Rudy and McCain, which would you choose? I myself would grudgingly choose Rudy. I'm not a big fan of either one, but Rudy is preferable over McCain if those are the two remaning choices. McCain only has one positive in my eyes and that is the war against terror...Rudy is good on that too. I just think McCain would be all too willing to sell out Republicans if he's president and will be doing all kinds of deals with the Demos to increase the size/scope of Govt. He enjoys those backroom cocktail parties with Ted Kennedy, Chris Dodd and all those other brain-dead socialist folks way too much.

Robert, you took me too literally
But other than that, I again agree with most of what you wrote.

Obviously, there's no way we're going to wind back the clock to the 18th Century; no doubt.

However, just in my lifetime, we've lost so many of our basic freedoms that it amazes me. In 1967, when I turned 18, I wanted to legally purchase my first handgun (you could buy a rifle at 16 in those days). I went to my local hardware store, found one I could afford, paid my money, filled out one form, the clerk put my gun and ammo in a bag, and I was out the door. The whole transaction took maybe half an hour. Can you imagine that today?

And that's just one example I could cite.

I'm very concerned about the trend in this country. That's the point I was trying to make.

Lunch Meat
Baloney is not much of an argument.

You pull up your data and I will pull up mine.

Charles Morality check list
Yeah that's right and you are about as sharp as Keith Olberrrwoman

BrianR
Snopes has the goods on all those Tytler quotes. It is a hoax. Much of it is paraphrasing from Alexis de Tocqueville but most of it is just made up.

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/a/alexis_de_tocqu eville.html

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/tyler.asp

Roberto, advocate for crime

"maybe in your fantasy world we are going to toss the law abiding illegals out, but in the real world of American politics we are not."

-- There is no such thing as a "law-abiding" illegal alien, idiot. In addition to their crime of illegal entry, most have committed FELONY offenses, such as identity theft. By the way, did you know that some of the 9-11 hijackers got their bogus drivers licences from an illegal alien from El Salvador, who was selling fake IDs from a convenience store parking lot? Those "cheap" onions you seem to like so much cost this nation dearly, you traitorous b@st@rd.

"The American people as a whole are far more moral then folks like you."

-- If they are, then they would find your arguments in favor of crime and corruption even more repulsive than I do, scum.

"You wont pick onions for the 10 dollars an hour my classmate pays her workers"

-- Does your classmate know that the crime of harboring illegal aliens is a felony, with up to 5 years in prison and up to a $250,000.00 fine? She deserves it if she's hiring the invaders. If you live in Texas, have you seen where the business owner who harbored a pedophile ILLEGAL ALIEN who then shot and killed a Houston cop will be charged for this CRIME?

"...it is to hard for folks like the far right to od."

-- Either you are incredibly ignorant (likely), incredibly lazy (also likely), or an Illegal Alien scum yourself (BINGO!), because the above gibberish makes no sense in English.

" They are mostly lazy."

-- No, you America-hating scum, it is the Mexicans who are lazy. If being an illiterate drunken savage from a third-world country was the key to prosperity, then Mexico would be the richest nation on earth.

ModerateMark
I don't get your point at all. Are you saying we should opt for what is politically expedient over what is right?

Trends

In virtually every society since Socrates, people have complained about imminent doom as a result of decreasing respect for tradition. The good old days were always better. Young people have always failed to measure up to their forebears.

WHile there are trends that even I decry, they do not portend the immediate demise of the greatest political, economic and military power ever known.

Prager
Fred has announced he is withdrawing his candidacy. 1 more conservative down the tubes. Maybe the fishing will be good Nov.4.

LOl, Robert...Yup
I remember those days, and you're right, they ain't a-comin' back!

And you're also right that there are a lot of things that HAVE changed for the better, too.

Interesting times.

Robert
"I dont sense that "Life" has emerged in dime sized masses of tissue which have no lungs for life to be breathed into."

That's a not-so-artful dodge. If a person is temporarily on life support, are they less than human? Should a doctor or family member have the right to kill such a person, even if his/her chances of recovery are good?

I find it interesting how pro-abortionists cry foul every time someone displays a picture of an aborted "fetus." Such pictures put the lie to arguments like yours.

As for your argument about rape, less than one percent of abortions are done on rape victims.

Farewell Fred...

Lets just see if, like I said before, the Republican Media comes out in favor of Rudy....

Not a bad choice considering McCain. But, apparently Rudy is Bush's choice from the beginning.

I'll put my faith in George one last time... If George trusts Rudy, so will I.


Robert
"My opposition to Bush V Gore was that The Constitution already had a method for dealing with issues JUST such as that"

In Bush vs. Gore, the Court properly prevented the Florida Supreme Court from violating state election laws. I suspect your real opposition to that decision was that the Court ruled in favor of Bush.

Jack
Okay, let's see your data - and the source from which you received it.

Vic
That's why I qualified my attribution. It's not clear. I've heard it attributed to de Tocqueville, Franklin, others.

Here's an edu site that attributes Tytler: http://www.fiu.edu/~leyesj/Tytler1801Quote.htm

Who knows?

However, history and common sense dictate its accuracy.

BrianR
I noticed you had qualified it. Snopes did a real search through all of Tytler's writings and could find none of it.

It does sound neat though.

ModerateMark
"What hurts the country, too many voters (such as my mother-in-law) really only care about this issue, nothing else."

Some of us happen to think the sanctity of human life is an extremely important issue. After all, the right to life is the most basic of all human rights. I'm sorry if that's difficult for you to understand.

Robert
"The Constitution and its process are the most important thing."

Just where does the Constitution guarantee the "right" to an abortion? It seems to me that you only support the Constitution when you agree with it.

So, Roberto, did you host...

Rudy is DONE
Rudy 6th in most races and now behind in FL and NY, his home turff. He is toast. Thank God.

>Dennis Prager: The Case for Rudy Giuliani
>"To the extent that I understand how most
>Republicans think, it would seem that former
>New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani comes closer to
>the Republican ideal than any of the other
>viable Republican candidates."

WHY IS RUDY CLOSER TO REPUBS IDEAL?

-Adultery - Check (time 3)
-Pro Abortion - Check
-Gay agenda - Check
-Likes to cross Dress - Check
-Father - Hated by children
-Great speaker - Lisp like cartoon character
-Husband - 3 marriages, wife #2 told of diverce in public press conference, trophy wife.

9/11 - As mayor made all the wrong decision in preparing NY. Did not update communications and placed command center near WTC, despite advice not to. 911 committee investigation interviewed Rudy. Rudy admitted he didn't know who Al Quada was before 911; when he was asked specific security questions, he claimed ignorance and differed them to someone else. Now he's an EXPERT? Give me a break.

Lets not forget all the scandals. like 8 of his 9 appointees to NY position have been indited for fraud, theft and corruption.

Claimed he spent as much time on "the pile" as the workers and was fine, refuting cliams of health problems. Rudy made a few walkthroughs, that was it. He's an exaggerating liar.

His buddy Bernard is a crook with mob ties and recommended him to Bush for head of all security of America?

Bernard is picked to train Iraq police? He goes and is a failure, distributed weapons are missing. Bernard was Rudy's DRIVER. These are the people Rudy likes, cronies, just like Bush.

Rudy is a typical NY'er, arrogant, aggressive and short fused. He will be a authoritarian control freak. If that is being a Republican, no thanks.

Done with the Texas Good-Ol-Boys and no way in hell I want the NY mafia to run America.

NEJOM
For example, in 2004,Green and Eckert reported in the New England Journal of Medicine that between 1991 and 1999 approximately 1/3 or all preganancies ended in abortion, but only 4 % of all maternal deaths in childbearing were associated with that 1/3. Thus 96% of all child bearing deaths occurred in the 2/3 of pregnancies brought to term.

give it up, Denny...
You simply cannot pull a fast one on your readers anymore. It seems that most of the posters here have caught on to Julie-Annie's core stances: he's as liberal as any Dem on gun control, immigration, abortion, and is absolutely no conservative. He even told Charlie Rose that he's a "liberal" and a "Republican." (I'd dispute the latter claim.)

Of all the neocons who want to kill Muslims, hitch your cart to another horse, Denny. It's not too late to hop on the McCain bandwagon. Or maybe you just like the chicken hawks who talk tough, but have never served (Romney). Julie-Annie is a lost cause. He's getting rolled, and it looks like he won't even win Florida or even his home state of NY.

As for Julie-Annie, he'd be a disaster who's virtually identical to Hillary. If he's nominated, I and many other principled conservatives will stay home. I've had enough of faux-conservatives. Our current crop of spendthrift Repubs is *worse* than Clinton Dems.

Robert
"the right of privacy to a free people"

So if I kill a person in the privacy of my own home, it's none of the government's business?

It must be the water in the talk show
host circles. How else can a reasonable person explain Hugh and Prager's support of Mitthead and Rudy considering they are both pro-abortion and have fund raised for planned parenthood. Let me explain this to the "money first republicans". You may live to earn more money or hire a good estate planner to avoid paying high taxes - but once a life has been killed, that is final. Republicans need a strong pro-life and defense ticket. McCain (the patriot in chief) offers these two strong positions. He is also the most qualified to negotiate with a democratic congress when it comes to getting anything done in the next 4 years given his ability to work in a bi-partisan manner. Finally, we need a president who is not status quo i.e. a rich republican businessman running for president like his daddy. Denis and Hugh, why did you give Bush a pass on immigration in 2004 since you seem extremely unforgiving to McCain about immigration? Stop selling the republican party to the highest bidder or a pro-abortion ticket. We can have a strong pro-life, defense candidate capable of beating any democrat in November - and that is McCain.

Jack
How does that prove that abortion is safer than childbirth?

Robert
"you dont understand the rights of a free people."

I understand that the most basic right is the right to life.

"The Constitution does not "guarantee" rights to a free people."

What was the purpose of the Bill of Rights? God gives us rights, and it is the government's duty to acknowledge and protect them.


"The rights come from as the DOI says "our creator" and we all have them irregardless of who we are."

Yes, and "among these rights are LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." Liberty and the pursuit of happiness are fairly pointless without the right to life. Just ask the survivors of the Holocaust.

Clarity on social issues
Roe v. Wade and subsequent precedents can be overturned by a constitutional amendment, which at present is a pipe dream. In the alternative, Roe can be overturned by the Supreme Court, but only if Justices Stephens, Kennedy and Ginsberg are replaced by jurists applying a judicial philosophy that will also incite them to overturn campaign finance reform. There are no other options (that I know of).

McCain does not appear capable of appointing jurists who disagree with him on the first amendment, for he lacks the character to suffer dissent or opposition. This bodes ill for the Pro Life movement, who do the unborn a great disservice by not understanding things this basic.

Guiliani will appoint jurists to the Supreme Court who will overturn Roe and McCain/Feingold both. In the meantime, he will encourage the states to experiment with means and measures to virtually ban abortion. We who are against abortion together with constitutional penumbras and emanations can't ask for anything more or better than this. Hopefully for the unborn's sake, the Pro Life movement will figure this out soonest.

Ken,
The example I provided suggestes, not proves, that child bearing is approximately 8 times more likely to result in the deaht of the mother than abortion is. I blieve that particular article is specific to women ages 35-39. Data on first trimester abortions indicate that abortion may be 35 times safer than carrying to term.

If you have other data, please bring it forward.

Giuliani Doesn't Get Mad, He Gets Even
Anyone thinking of voting for Rudy Giuliani should look at the front page story in today's New York Times (1-22). It is all about G's love of vengeance. Those who have crossed G or even blown the whistle on a city operation when G was Mayor of New York have found themselves the recipients of payback. One man called a talk radio show to complain about a police traffic sting near the Bronx Zoo. Within hours he was arrested on a 13 year-old traffic warrant and led away in handcuffs, the case soon to be thrown out by a judge. Then a list of his alleged offenses was (illegally) provided by a police spokesman to newspapers. This included a false statement that he had been convicted of sodomy. In the end the man had a nervous breakdown and collected a $290K settlement from the city, which during G's tenure paid out $7 million in such cases. Apparently G's likes to fix his accusers good & proper. This is presidential posture?? Forget the many wives, forget the cross-dressing: this man sounds like a gangster.

Oh Boy Abortion again
Why does the small gov, states rights, individual freedom the Repubs claim they are WANT TO CONTROL OUR BODY & LIVES, like a bunch of self righteous authoritarians.

The abortion issue is down about 10th on my list right now:
-Economy,
-Iraq (related to econ),
-energy (related to Iraq as well)
-health care,
-massive deficit,
-trade deficit,
-social security,
-immigration,
-national HOME security
(No one on American soil yet lost to IED or attack from Irans Airforce, Navy or Army.)

You WANT TO FORCE PEOPLE TO HAVE CHILDREN? That’ll never ever happen. Why?

First, more women vote, and they’ll not let MEN tell them what to do with their bodies.

Second, abortion is a easy procedure technically, available world wide, easily. (Emotionally it can devastate a woman & there are health risk.)

Last, what do you do with all the unwanted children, born to woman forced to go full term? Every crack baby born (w/ massive problems) needs to be adapted by YOU; than I listen to you. YOU want to TELL people what to do with their body, than put or shut up.

Abortion is terrible, period, but the key is reduce unwanted pregnancies first. That means SEX ED, B-control and Church.

Church - You can't legislate morality and God, Make disciples of all people through faith. Spread your religion & anti-abortion message with LOVE. Stop with the politics & fascist authoritarian approach. Do you admire the Taliban?

The BIBLE does not prohibit abortion, religious dogma does. When is a zygote a person? That's debatable. I hate all abortion; anything after the first trimester (12 week) is very grotesque to me.

Abortion rates have gone DOWN, with OUT more laws.

We need more adoption, sex-ed and B-contl & most of all people of faith to teach others about Gods love, not more Gov. Repubs & conservatives don't even want to TALK about sex-ed or B-contl for the PEOPLE.

Robert writes:
on Tuesday, January, 22, 2008 at 11:12 AM:

"the "far right" on this forum consistently is the group of personal insult tossers in the form of someone's name. JUst to make fun of their name... That is something that is well childish."

This from the person who regularly refers to his Commander-in-Chief as "Arbusto".

"Robert" has no honor and certainly has no standing to criticize others for "childishness".

As I see it,
Before I cast a vote for one of the RINO's I will vote for lilly, and that will NEVER happen.
Unless I take up smoking gahngi...lol

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!



GOP
In regards to the comment about someone refusing to vote, I see your point. On the other hand, how many concessions are we suppose to make? I am Christian and conservative but not so super far right that I would vote for anyone who utters the magic words "Jesus".

I like Romney. I also could easily have voted for Hunter, Thompson, & Tancredo. I could hold my breath and even pull the lever for Guiliani...though it would darn near kill me to do it. But I have to draw the line SOMEWHERE. McCain, albeit a hero many decades ago, has slapped my conservative face over and over again leaving a permanent sting I will not forget. I feel strongly about that. Since he was so comfortable betraying his own base as SOTUS, what would he do as POTUS? Huck is just as unacceptable to me. That man will give Christianity a bad name everywhere when finished.

Off the subject....just heard Heath Ledger passed away.

Most of us will "probably" vote for Rudy
But the enthusiasm of Evangelicals will be lost. We helped bring the Republicans through the last Presidential election by working, talking up, and getting out the vote. I am not sure I could even bring myself to vote for him. So all you phony "Pro-lifers" go ahead and nominate this degenerate. I simply cannot stand his stance on: life, gun rights, and homosexuality. As to his "promise” to appoint strict constructionist, well, he also “promised” to love honor and cherish at least two women, and he publicly, and proudly, and openly, broke at least one of those promises. His promises do not mean a thing!

Kat
Thats the point, some of us have drawn the line. It stops at Rino's Like:
Rudary
mittary
huckary
and last and least MaQuack the biggest RINO (must be if wobbie likes him)

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!





sophie whateveritistoday writes:
If that is what you people give us, maybe it's best you stay out of politics!

why? we should want people who act and think like you? thanks but no thanks.

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!

re: orthodoxa
quote: " Every single ILLEGAL ALIEN is a CRIMINAL.

What part of "ILLEGAL" do you Open-Borders Traitors fail to understand?

So if it is OK for Rudy to declare NYC a "sanctuary" for ILLEGAL ALIENS, is it OK for the mayors of other cities to shield people who are guilty of other federal crimes?!?

Corrupt traitors like you are turning this nation into a de-facto Mexico, where the laws are only applied when they benefit the elites."

I wondered when that knee-jerk response would come. Yes, by definition, someone here "illegally" is doing something "illegal" and is therefore a criminal. However, most people recognize that not all "illegal" acts are the same; for instance, technically, driving 1 mph over the speed limit makes one a "criminal", because it is "illegal"; however, there is a difference between going 36 in a 35 versus driving recklessly in a school zone. Both are not of the same seriousness, and therefore both wouldn't deserve the same level of prosecution.

In terms of fighting crime on a city level, a mayor is faced with the choice of encouraging people who might be here illegally with reporting information that might lead to prosecution of crimes that are more damaging to the public than simply being here illegally, versus threatening to deport those people and therefore discouraging such reporting. It is at least a reasonable position to decide on the latter course.

If you disagree, I'm willing to hear some intelligent debate; however, calling me an "open border traitor" when I have neither advocated open borders (I'm not for them, for the record) nor have I advocated treason (I'm against that also, for the record) does not qualify as intelligent nor as debate. Sorry, not good enough: try again.

re: utahnotmormon
quote: "McCain was right. He opposed them originally because they weren't accompanied with spending cuts. If anyone is a RINO, it's those who want less taxes and increased govt spending."


McCain engages in a bit of revisionist history by declaring that lack of corresponding cuts in spending were the only (or even the primary) impetus in his opposition to the Bush tax cuts. Go back and read what he actually said during the 2000 primary campaigns about "tax cuts for the rich" and such, and then again during the debate on the tax cut package in the Senate. His rhetoric was that of class warfare and the status quo. McCain simply does not have a consistently good record on pro-growth, free market capitalist economic policy.

No Maggie Thatcher
I'm not looking for another Bush. I'm looking for a conservative that will close our southern border to the illegals aliens that kill 9000 Americans a year.

Rudy turned New York into a sanctuary city. Now that Fred is out, there isn't a conservative left running for the Republican nomination. There are just flavors of liberal.

The fundies aren't hurting the party as badly as the truthers are dragging the dems down.

RUDY!

As someone who survived 9-11, I find the anti-Rudy comments on this thread morally repugnant and very unpatriotic. If you don't vote for Rudy the "terrorists" win. And of course by terrorists I mean Dr. Paul's legion of free thinking, liberty-minded, fiscally conservative, Constitution loving patriots. Those maniacs had the gall to interrupt Rudy while he was pandering to a bunch of Buick Roadmaster driving Floridian pastrami munchers. Don't those "Paulites" understand there is no such thing as blowback! So please vote for Rudy, we need a cross-dressing, lisping fruitcake to defeat Hillary. He's the only one who can you know.

Gotcha Doc.
I can see both sides to the argument. But one side is not understanding the many, many concessions we have made for the sake of the party over the last decade. I feel as if I have made a billion and ten compromises for the GOP to keep the party in tact but they are unwilling to meet me 1/10th of the way. McCain is not exactly what a would call a concession on their part.

McCain has thoroughly abused the GOP base and now they are asking me to back him? Nope. Not this time. McCain/Huck ticket is some GOPers 'dream' ticket so I'm reading. Not mine though. They're more of a 'bad dream' ticket. I'm not asking for another Reagan...he clearly has no political twin. But the GOP think tank needs to be reasonable. You can't, after all McCain & Huck have done, present them to conservatives as our candidates. Look, I'm willing to stick my chin out there again, but not to the ones who hit it before with a backup punch from Kennedy, Feingold & Pelosi. That was too nasty a tag team.

Magaret Thatcher
I am an evangelical, you'd probably call me a fundie. The republicans have left the religious right and moved to the middle. The issues I care about are stopping the illegals immigration, keeping the US from becoming like France and the UK in regard to Islam, stopping the murder of the unborn, and preserving the 2nd amendment, in that order. Now that Thompson is out of the race, I don't have a candidate that I can support. None of Huckabee, Romney, Guliani, and least of all McCain are right on even 2 out of 4 of those issues.

The republicans are assuming the "religious right" won't go any where, so they can move to the middle with impunity. It is similar to the way the democrats are assuming the "black vote" won't go any where.

The fundies aren't a threat to anyone, unless they don't show up in November. At the moment, I'm not sure I could hold my nose and vote for any of those four losers, but Clinton and Obama are worse.

I guarantee there won't be any contributions from me this election cycle.

John Galt
Here's just an excerpt from a single news item that illustrates how obscene the practice of "sanctuary cities" is:

"As 15-year-old Dani Countryman struggled beneath Gilberto Arellano Gamboa, pinned to the floor with her pants down, he called on his cousin to help subdue the girl. Alejandro Rivera Gamboa responded by stepping on Countryman’s throat until she stopped moving.

That’s how investigators described Countryman’s death in a court document released Tuesday. Evidence outlined in the document included statements by the defendants and a bloody shoe that matched an imprint on Countryman’s chest.

Gilberto Javier “Gabe” Arellano Gamboa, 23, who is also known as Rivera Gamboa, and Alejandro Emeterio “Alex” Rivera Gamboa, 24, were arraigned Tuesday in Clackamas County Circuit Court on charges of aggravated murder. Through a Spanish-speaking interpreter, they acknowledged the charges against them and asked for warmer jail clothes."

Those 2 scumbags had already been arrested by police in Portland several times, but because it is a "sanctuary city", they were never deported.

Alejandro may have been the scum who physically crushed the life out of that poor little girl, but Rudy Giuliani and every other proponent of "sanctuary cities" was there in spirit, choking off her screams for help.

No doubt Roberto thinks that this is completely OK as long as he has plenty of cheap onions to shovel into his fat, America-hating, mouth.

Maggie
Logic apparently escapes your grasp.

If Illegal Aliens were not purposely shielded by "sanctuary cities" they would be removed from American society.

THEY HAVE NO RIGHT TO BE HERE!

THEY HAVE NO RIGHT TO TEAR DOWN THE AMERICAN FLAG AND HOIST UP THE TOILET-PAPER BANNER OF MEXICO!

AND THEY CERTAINLY HAVE NO RIGHT TO RAPE AND KILL OUR CHILDREN SO THAT FAT SCUM LIKE ROBERTO CAN HAVE "CHEAP" ONIONS!

So Maggie, since you are so darn worried about "anglo" criminals, answer me this:

If MEXICAN ILLEGAL ALIENS DON'T HAVE TO OBEY THE LAW, WHY SHOULD THE REST OF AMERICA DO SO?

Since the corrupt leadership refuses to enforce laws ALREADY ON THE BOOKS, why shouldn't Americans start to defend our nation and culture on our own and hunt down and kill the invaders wherever we find them?

You've already read posters on this thread advocating that immigration laws not be enforced because they benefit from the criminal activity.

THEY are the ones who are the true initiators of anarchy, as respect for the RULE OF LAW is flushed down the toilet.

You are worse than Hitler
Typical debate style and tactics of the hard core right. Call people names. How dare I criticize KING Rudy?

Well DevilsPaintbrush Rudy is not God or anything else. I give him credit for cleaning up times square. On the other hand he used draconian tactics to do it.

Also I find your handle, DevilsPaintbrush, repugnant. You use the anti-christ name casually?


>DevilsPaintbrush writes: 6:18 PM

>RUDY!
>As someone who survived 9-11, I find the anti-
>Rudy comments on this thread morally repugnant
>and very unpatriotic.

You survived? Where? I saw it on TV as well. In fact as an airline pilot, I just took off from LGA an hour earlier. I bet you where not within a 5 miles of the WTC or Pentagon.

Rudy is a man full of faults. He was a washed up politician in on Sept 10, 2001, NOT loved by NY'ers, NYPD, NYFD, ex-wives or children. He even wanted to STAY in the mayors office past his term, totally throwing away the LAW. Typical of the Neo-Con.

Rudy dropped out of Senate race with Hillary. Why? because he could not win. Rudy dropped out of the 911 commission to raise money.

If I get hit by a train that does not make me a transportation safety expert.

Rudy just happened to be mayor of NY. He did WHAT to make him so great?????????????????? NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING.

Again credit for attacking the MOB and porno shops in time square. Credit for being a 9/11 hero. GIVE ME BREAK!!!!!

Rudy came in 6th in most states and is losing Florida and NY. His plan or tactics failed. He will lose and he will never, never, never be president of anything but his BS security firm.

Its a moot point RUDY IS DONE, Finished, ca-put. He is as out of the race as Thompson and dead as Keith Leger. RUDY..... YOU ARE DONE SON, take your limp, bald, lisping, cross dressing BULL OUT-A here. Heck he had heart palpitations in the plane, doing an emergency return. McCain is more of a man than Rudy could EVER be.

Hey
You all know what? I do think abortion is murder, and I do believe in God, but I am no “fundie” as you all are fond of saying. Want an easy solution to the abortion problem? Be responsible, don’t get pregnant! Sheese, you don’t need to be Einstein to figure this one out. And as far as voting for these RINO’s I HAVE A PEN READY to write in Fred’s name. And I have heard he is doing so. That's OK I am still writing his name in. Nuff said!

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!

sophie whateveritistoday writes:
You show yourself to be too irrational and filled with hate to be taken seriously.

NOW that(irrational part)is funny coming from you. Hey if cobert had said that to you, he would have said something funny. LOL

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!

Anybody but McCain and Rudy!
Rudy is a law and order conservative and social liberal! His personal life is a joke.. McCain is a Pro-Amnesty, Anti-Free Speach In sidet the Beltway RINO who is a card carrying member of the AARP and best friends with Ted Kennedy! He is too tempermental, too old, and cannot be trusted among the base. No wonder the liberal media wants either of these candidates to be our nominee.

We need a real conservative with conservative values as our nominee -- and someone who is not from Washington, Chicago or New York City to be the next President. In the end,Americans prefer Governors -- not Senators or Mayors of liberal cities to be President. That is why the Republicans will win the election in November and Clinton or O'Bama will not ... so long as Rudy or McCain are not our nominees!










sophie whateveritistoday writes:
Orthodoxa appears to have anger management issues at the very least!

AHAHAHAHAHA how many times you been booted sophie? MORE funnies!

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!

Maggie
I have to work with these criminal third-world scum every day.

They are NOT decent, hardworking people. They hate America with every fiber of their being.

Their favorite radio station plays the MEXICAN NATIONAL ANTHEM several times a day, and the announcer always declares in Spanish, "If you can hear this, you are on MEXICAN LAND!" When they hear this, the criminals always erupt in cheers of "MEH-HEE-KOH! MEH-HEE-KOH! RAZA! RAZA!"

Do you know what they discuss on their talk shows, Maggie? I do, unlike the invaders, I am bi-lingual. They discuss how they will be able to re-conquer America without firing a shot! Google "Reconquista". The biggest debate they currently have is whether or not Americans should all be killed, or "deported back to Europe."

No doubt you think that this is all so very charming and amusing.

After all, they have a RIGHT to break the law, they are LA RAZA.

You do know what the motto of the "civil rights group", LA RAZA, is don't you?

"Por LA RAZA todo, fuera de LA RAZA nada."

"For THE RACE everything, outside of THE RACE nothing."

It's a motto that Hitler would be proud of, but there's nothing to worry about, right?

sophie whateveritistoday writes:
Orthodoxa appears to have anger management issues at the very least!

AHAHAHAHAHA how many times you been booted sophie? MORE funnies!

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!

ModerateMark
I am a non denominational Christian. Very pro life. Would LOVE to see Roe vs Wade overturned. But what most Christians miss is that the President, no matter how pro life or choice he/she may be, has no actual say in it whatsoever. It is a Supreme Court issue.

The best/most POTUS can do is appoint judges that do not hold special interest group agendas and are strict constitutionalist's as opposed to living document constitutionalist's. The real question to ask presidential canidates is not whether they are pro choice or right to lifers, but how they view and value the constitution. Do you view the consitution as a living document or a strictly and literally adhered to document? Life or choice questions are, frankly, irrelevant. Why have all of our pro life reps done nothing about Roe Vs. Wade? Because they CAN'T.

Evengelicals are making a mistake in asking what a canidate would do about any supreme court decision. The more accurate depiction of where a canidate stands and what he will do regarding supreme court decisions is to ask .... "What judges will you appoint?" Then google the judges named to see how they view the constitution.

ModerateMark writes:
I just assume he was a leftie but you know what, he is a conservative!

wobbie is no more conserative than you, you can tell because he likes that Lib McQuack!

http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/text/crimevictims.htm l
Free Ramos and Compean
If we can’t have HOME SECURITY first, the rest just won’t matter!
http://fred08.com/
http://vets4fred.net/
NO MORE HOLDING OUR NOSE AND PULLING THAT LEVER!!
VOTE FOR A REAL REPUBLICAN!! NO MORE RINO’s!!!

Orthadoxa = catcher
I tell you what there Orthadoxa, I'd bet you wouldn't speak that way to my face. You'd rather hide behind cowardly words that you can throw from afar. I think my being a gun totin' republican might just shut yo' mouth, but maybe not since you are incapable of reason. You are a moron and add nothing to the conversation. Good luck with your blind extremism, you'd make a good al queda recruit.

For the record, whoever gets the nomination, I'm voting republican, the rest of this BS is just for show. We don't need to sink to the libs level like my friend Orthadoxa, it doean't help our cause. That's the only point I was trying to make, but apparently it falls on deaf ears (blind eyes?) and is inconceivable by some.