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Sunday, February 01, 2009
Debra J. Saunders :: Townhall.com Columnist
Prison or Versailles?
by Debra J. Saunders
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Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


Of course California's prison inmates are entitled to reasonable 21st-century health care. Unfortunately for taxpayers, Clark Kelso, the federal receiver in charge of California's prison health care has, as state Attorney General Jerry Brown noted at a news conference last week, a "gold-plated wish list" for California's prison health care system.

His Receivership wants to spend $8 billion to build seven new hospitals, each the size of 10 Wal-Marts, which would create "a holistic environment," with "music therapy, art therapy and other recreation therapy functions," a music room, stress-reduction room, game room and "therapy kitchen," with lots of natural light and high ceilings. A gymnasium would feature a "full-size high school playing court with basketball hoops and built-in edge seating up to four rows deep. Various floor striping allows for other games, such as volleyball, etc. Other sport activities include handball courts, exercise, and (a) workout room."

"The overarching value" of Plan Kelso is to create "a health care facility that cares for prisoners as patients and not a prison that cares for health care needs as inmates." No surprise: The California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation estimates the annual cost of operating these facilities to be between $170,000 and $230,000 per inmate.

The amazing part: California politicians were going along with the plan until Wednesday, when Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger and Brown filed a motion asking U.S. District Court Judge Thelton E. Henderson to replace Kelso with a special master.

Like hell, His Receivership's plans were paved with good intentions. When Henderson stepped in, he wrote in 2005, California's prison medical care system was so broken that "an inmate in one of California's prisons needlessly (died) every six to seven days." Henderson found that in some facilities, hygiene was optional and staffers were substandard. A San Quentin dentist wouldn't even wash his hands or change gloves between patients. I'm tough on crime, but that's criminal and unacceptable.

Henderson's remedies, however, have had their problems, as well. The first receiver, Robert Sillen, once threatened to "back up the Brinks truck" to the state's treasury to bankroll better inmate care -- and he clearly meant it. Sillen was paid $775,790 in the 15 months, ending in June 2007. An audit found no fraud, but it found that Sillen authorized $218,790 in overpayments to staff members for such benefits as health insurance and retirement that they already had received.

Henderson fired Sillen and then hired Kelso, who set his own annual salary at $224,000 -- plus a possible bonus. The Schwarzenegger-Brown motion complains that Kelso's "large staff and $74 million in administrative expenses" are duplicative and amount to a full-scale takeover of the state prison health care system.

In the meantime, health care spending per inmate rose from $7,601 per inmate in 2005-06 to $13,778 per inmate in 2007-08 -- an 81 percent increase and far above the average of $4,600 spent on health care per Californian. Kelso boasts of "an influx of new physicians and nurses" -- including 172 board-certified physicians, 488 registered nurses and 533 licensed vocational nurses -- in part because of big salary increases. The number of inmate deaths has fallen dramatically, from 124 in the first quarter of 2006 to 87 in the second quarter of 2008. The number of "preventable" deaths fell to three in 2007. At the news conference, California's corrections secretary, Matt Cate, credited the receiver for such improvements.

With all those gains, I wondered, doesn't that mean His Receivership can drop the building plans? Kelso thinks not. He told me over the telephone Thursday that he believes the $13,778 number is inflated by the inclusion of correctional officer salaries. Also, he argued that costs for dental and mental health -- which he took on to help the Corrections Department -- drove up the costs. If he eliminated mental health, he could reduce the up-to-$230,000-per-inmate estimate substantially. And come to think of it, maybe he'll throw mental health back to the state.

While mortality and preventable deaths are down, "possibly preventable deaths" are up. "We're up about 15 to 20 percent through our Turnaround Plan," he said, which suggests his plans are too ambitious.

I think the "holistic" language was a mistake. He countered, "You're right about that." Kelso rightly closed in noting, "These people are not animals" -- and doctors should treat them as patients. But his operation is completely out of touch with fiscal realities. As state Finance Director Mike Genest noted, with Schwarzenegger trying to fill a $41.6 billion budget hole, "We're having to cut back everywhere." But Kelso is all plus signs.

And His Receivership doesn't quite understand the population he serves. The yoga/music therapy/handball/landscaping -- that's right, I forgot to mention the landscaping to give facilities that retreat feeling -- approach fails to recognize that 47 percent of California's inmates are repeat violent offenders.

They aren't animals, but they aren't entitled to facilities that far exceed those available to the average law-abiding taxpayer. As Brown noted, California is spending "almost three times what the federal government is spending, more than two times what the average Californian gets. When is enough enough?"

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Impeach the judge!
Impeach the judge who has ordered these travesties of justice!

Why It Is
All those who serve in government as judges, administrators, and other bureaucrats are inherently cowards, traitors and turncoats who take those positions to get back at better people who bested them in the private sector.

These despicable vermin find it easier to side with criminals and other domestic enemies rather than serve and protect law abiding citizens.

It is not our imagination that our government is at war with us just as violent criminals. Those officials I describe above feel that by allying themselves with the criminal element, they will be spared their lives.

This is mainly the reason they want us disarmed. Gun laws are actually meant to make us more vulnerable and unable to defend ourselves against them.

The only suitable remedy for these cockroaches is that given to Mussolini in WW II. He and his mistress were taken out, slaughtered, and hung upside down by Italian partisans.

This is the only righteous end for all such scum.

universal coverage
This reality, coupled with irresponsible people receiving medicaid is exactly why all Americans should be eligible for medicaid. I agree that it should not be a gold plated program -- and people should prefer private programs -- but prisoners and people who refuse to work should not be treated better than taxpayers.

Solution:
Do away with the prisons & return to vigilantism & lynch law. In Guatamala, the village leaders take the dope pushers out to the cemetery, have them dig a grave, then pull out their machettes. No need for an undertaker, much less for music therapy & stress reduction.

pb
The number of criminals killed during the commission of a felony by civilians now exceeds the number killed by police. Its been that way every year since 1987, according to my recollection of FBI statistics. Those who quibble can check me out. With the expansion of must issue carry permit laws, the number can be expected to rise. It is getting harder and harder for proscecutors to convict solid citizens of shootings committed in defense of self, and particularly of property. 60 years ago a homeowner who shot a burglar was in deep trouble. Here in Florida the law has actually been changed to further protect the defender of his home. In practically all areas, even where the law has not changed, jury attitudes have. Proscecutors avoid trying cases where jury nullification might spoil their conviction record. If prisions are turned into country clubs, cheap and effective vigilantism can be expected to increase. Just as when jihadis that surrender are turned loose, it can be expected that fewer will survive attempting to surrender.

pb, continued
District attorneys just hate vigilantes. Its not that vigilantes and lynch law often make mistakes. Just as a guess, i'd say vigilante action is more accurate at punishing criminals than a trial, since it almost always takes place at the time and scene of a crime. They hate vigilante action because it underscores the fact that law enforcement is failing to do a good job. Every street cop i know supports gun permits for law-abiding citizens. A beat cop is delighted when some store owner smokes a hold-up man. It reduces crime and makes their job easier. It makes for one less goblin they might have to deal with.

Pistol
"A beat cop is delighted when some store owner smokes a hold-up man."

Que paso wit dat, mis amigo? Someone ought to tell those beat cops about their unions, because their unions are insufferably left wing and very, very anti-conceal and carry.

Just curious, do you have anything other than anecdotal or urban legend type sources for this ? I used to believe the one about child predators. Funny thing: turns out prison is filled with them and they just don't go around killing "their own".

Absolute power
Obscene power.
Imperial power.

That's what judges in this country, this state, possess.

What law? What constitution? You think my decision is insane? APPEAL IT!!!
That's your remedy. Now shuddup and get out of my courtroom.


2spothipshot
I qualified my anecdotes as being my limited experience. There were 4 events involving cops and guns. A friends wife saw a prowler and loaded her husband's rifle. He was away on a trip and she called the sheriff to unload the rifle as she didn't know how. The deputy who unloaded the piece said if she had to shoot the guy (a notorious nuisance later caught by another armed homeowner) to call him first because he would help her put the best possible story together. He could have been lying, of course. Twice while stopped for traffic violations cops noticed my gun. One asked if it was loaded. I said yes, he said that's the only way they're any good, but be careful. The other said I have trouble noticing firearms but some officers see them, so keep it out of sight. Now i do, the terms of my CCW make this a good idea.

2spothipshot
What urban legend concerning child predators? I am uninformed and curious.

DA's. Police chiefs and unions are run by career politicians. They are all CMA types selling image. They are the furthest possible from beat cops. Cops are very closed mouth, loose lips sink careers. I know a cop who lost his job because he made himself a nuisance arresting homosexuals. When the DA for whatever reason never took them to trial, he expressed the belief there might be money involved to me--and apparently others. He lost his job when he bought an M1 Garand on a deal too cheap to pass up. However, it turned out the semi-auto sear had been filed so it fired full-auto. "Someone" filed a complaint, the rifle was examined, he was given a chance to resign. Probably for the best. He was too literal minded, too lacking in a sense of priorities, to operate effectively as a police officer.

Political correctness
Is the statistic of inmates dying at a faster rate than the civilians population a bad thing?

Economics
Supply and demand. Low on the supply side for successful prosecution of criminals, demand for quicker justice (vigilante).

Mr. Pistol,
Question: would you rather have a "clock-puncher" for a teacher or engineer?
Answer: Depends on whether you want to learn or fly.

By the way
Pistol and 2spot. I soon return to The States from teaching in Japan. Any recommendations about what I should carry?

They aren't animals
Of course they aren't animals. Don't insult animals by comparing them to violent repeat offenders.
Anyone who thinks music and art therapy will turn these guys around also must think we can sweet-talk Iran into giving up its search for a nuclear bomb, too.

Profblog
CCW is a fun subject. I keep a Ruger .357 Security Six in my car. A visible firearm can be interpreted as a threat, so i keep it in an opaque plastic bag. .357 and .45 ACP with proper ammo have pretty much been empirically shown to be the best compromise between power and controllability. I rarely carry on my person. When i do, a hammerless revolver in a jacket pocket works for me. Some people like a 5 shot .38, i prefer a 6 shot .32 Mag. I also have a Kel-Tec 9mm. At 13 ounces, with +P+ loads it is a handful. It uses S&W magazines. I have an 11 round mag with a very helpful grip extender. I'm using SWAT rounds loaded in Austria, 100 grain hot core bullet at 1450 fps. They were only available in the US for a month or so. However other good defense loads are still available. I would avoid calibers with more recoil than .45 ACP, and lighter guns in .357/.45. They are just too unpleasant to shoot to shoot well. Best bang for the buck is one of the imported 9x18 PPK clones manufactured east of the Danube. They go for around $150 and are so common now that good defense ammo is now easily available. The ballistics are half-way between .380 ACPO and 9x19 parabellum.

Profblog
BTW, i like a hammerless revolver in a jacket pocket because one can have it in his hand and shoot through the pocket. The aura of a man with a gun in his hand is palpably visible to goblins. I have several very polite conversations with strangers on the late night streets of Washington DC in less than affluent neighborhoods.

As to the choice of clock-punchers, i worked for a small quite successful engineering firm and we had no clock-punchers until we expanded. I only have noted one clock puncher teacher and she was gone in 4 months. The charter school at which i work has a committed educator as director, and she has virtually unlimited hire/fire power.

In NJ alternative education
There are now kids who are coached by their parent(s) on just how much to act out so that they get sent to an alternative setting. The settings of our local three schools are beautiful, dance class is counted as math because dance steps are counted, and the school day starts later in the morning. As one who works in an alternative setting within a large high school, I can attest that there are a significant amount of kids who like the prospect of going to an entirely different campus and still getting their diploma from their regular high school (records are confidential, alternative ed is considered special education).

One girl from our district pulled a knife on another girl last December and was suspended for a period of time (with home instruction). This girl said she didn't care, she was just going to be sent to one of the alternative schools and that would be it. After much sound, fury, and blustering by the district, the girl is happily attending an alternative school and enjoying horseback riding lessons, dance lessons, sculpting, and guitar lessons and continues to party and fight after school and on the weekends. She also takes great pride in texting her friends who are in the regular high school during exceptionally fun activities. The bill to the taxpayers for this is $96,000.00 per year.

wrong guy-right approach
I heard Stalin did it. Not exactly a hero of mine, but the right idea anyway. He first took the lawyers and put them before a firing squad. Then the dopers and homos were next. Problems solved.

Unbelievable
As a California citizen I continue to ask why we have more than our share of axxholes. When former Governor Moonbeam Brown objects to this coddling of prisoners you have to figure it must be outlandish.

I wonder if they will offer outpatient services so that ordinary folks can have their health care at the same location. Maybe Medicare patients which would help offset the inmate health care costs.

What's next? Organic food requirements in their kitchens? Starbuck coffee?

Maybe we are getting our prisons spiffed up for Daschele and Geithner or even Porky Bill Richardson.

No Sympathy
Californians elected their state legislators. They chose the system of government that lead to this waste. Stew in your own juice, Pinkos!

oldsocialworker, czar
When people are comfortable, and have opportunity to achieve even more comfort, they pay little attention to such obscure burdens of $96,000 school programs for delinquents and $100,000 jail cells for criminals. But when they are out of work, feeling deprivation and seeing it hit their children, they start to question coddling goblins. PC is very expensive and one very possible benefit of having Dumbo in there is it may raise the temperature in the pot high enough quick enough for the frog to notice it. Its encouraging that the gutless CINOs in congress have seen enough citizen opposition to the earmarked pork bill to vote against it. Never would have happened with McCain in there.

Arnold and CA legislature...
As a very disappointed Californian in Arnold, who has acted like a liberal Democrat too long, I am not at all surprised that a federal interloper would feel comfortable with excessive expenditures for health care, for inmates no less.

Both the Governator and the Democratic legislature should be RECALLED!!

Thanks
Mr. Pistol. I'll take your info to the local gun shop and go shopping. Went to gun club years ago in 5th grade, shot M-1's in Navy boot, and it's been a long, long time. All the best to you and safety on your travels.

The perfect model for corrections
is the one utilized by religious retreat centers. Simple healthy meals, limited stimulation (no gyms, movies, therapy groups, porn in the jail library, computer access, etc...) tidy and modest accommodations, exercise that doesn't require equipment, etc... One of the biggest issues for offenders is the constant need to be stimulated in some way. The stim of choice serves to divert attention from whatever corrupt internal belief system drives them. Our current system does everything contrary to promoting change, whether it is through over accommodation or filthy dentists/doctors and corrupt and abusive co's.

The problem is, corrections is now huge business and there is no turning back. That applies to all US gov't. We are stuck, I'm afraid, in country that is crashing and burning in its own former affluence and bureaucratic ignorance.

You are right, Pistol
You are. O is the overdue intervention, like a fleet enema to a festering impaction. I still hate knowing it was all so avoidable.

Pistol
In Colorado you can carry a loaded pistol in your car. Your vehicle is seen as an extension of your home. Thanks god I'm not in California where self defense is a joke. As a matter of fact, I think that San Fran takes the cake for being the city of liberal idiots.


WHERE'S THE BALL AND CHAIN?

.....Bring back the road gangs ...I want to see my tax dollars at work .....COLOSSUS

HEALTH BENEFIT
I am a registered nurse.Thank you for your writing,I've always wondered about that how come prison inmates get all the health care but not the American tax paying citizens who does not have health insurance.I've worked the hospitals that has contract to prison,and not only they get best available care but they have security guards that sometimes 5-6 guards per 1 inmate depending on the degree of the crime they've committed.
It is unbelievable that media is not after this.
Thank you again for your writing.

But They ARE Animals
Idiots in CA need to consult with Sheriff Joe Arpaio.

Plus, how many of these are illegal aliens?

Pistol
I need some advice. What's a good firearm for someone who's never fired a gun before? I want it small and easy to use.

Amazing? Enough?
Saunders writes:

"The amazing part: California politicians were going along with the plan until..."

There's nothing amazing about this. About 80% of California's politicians are either Democrats or liberal Republicans. As such their primary concern is getting re-elected and their primary method of getting re-elected is to use tax money to buy votes.

As liberals, much of their constituency is comprised of felons, friends of felons, families of felons, and/or attorneys of felons.

It would have been amazing if California's politicians had denounced the plan for what it is; a grossly inflated reward to criminals who, judging from the OJ trial, must truly be genuine menaces to society to have actually gotten convicted by a jury of racist California bleeding hearts.

Saunders also asks:

"When is enough enough?"

This answer is simple and to the point. There will NEVER be enough to satisfy liberals.

Do all of you 'moderates' out there get that? There will NEVER be enough.

Prescription Medicare Benefits is not enough.

SCHIP is not enough.

Campaign-Finance is not enough.

Amnesty is not enough.

$350 billion for TARP is not enough.

An additional $350 billion for TARP is not enough.

$157 billion in pork to bribe legislators to pass TARP is not enough.

$819 in pork, called "stimulus", will not be enough.

There will never be enough gov't funding for abortion.

There will never be enough gov't funding (or control) of education.

There will never be enough liberal dominance (or control) of the media.

There will NEVER be enough for the left.

English Speaking Inmates Needed In China
There are over a billion people in Asia that would love to get the chance to learn English. But due to the costs and unavailability of instructors it is impossible. English is a money language and those that speak it have a better chance of getting a good job. Now that there are millions of English speaking unemployed in the U.S. there is a new opportunity for filling the second language needs of Asia. The qualifications for an English instructor can be made simple. A basic knowledge of the language and a little patience is all that should be required. Also a desire to relocate to places like China or Indonesia. American English learning institutes have to be set up in cities and towns across Asia. They can be staffed by millions of Americas unemployed. Even our prison population can be decreased by giving them jobs in faraway places such as China. The plan is now on the drawing board and should soon be implemented. Having the whole world speak English will promote a better business climate and understanding of the American way of life.

WHy in heck would you send a criminal to
another country Melvin? That makes no sense at all! Now they have more of the world's population to exploit.

What is the goal
When you throw someone in prison, what are you trying to accomplish?

wiseone
As always well said and on the money!

I can say
as a resident of California, that the prison system wields all of the power, whether it is the unions or the victim mentality that suddenly takes the victim creators,aka criminals, and makes them victims themselves.

Victim hood is profitable, justice is not.

It is also much like the Welfare system of today...reward bad behavior and you get more of it.

NONE(sense) in Hi
Have you ever been robbed/assaulted or had any crime committed against you?
Apparantly not. People are put into jail/prison because they have broken the law/trust with humanity. They have wronged their fellow citizens. It is called punishment. NOT just a time out. But, punishment. At the very least it removes them from the venue of the public so that they cannot harm/steal from others for a period of time. Do you need any further explination. If so, you are hopeless anyway and should be in prison with the rest of the crud of humanity

I agree
with UncleB. Prisons are for punishment. Not rewarded for bad behavior.

Prison or Versailles
I'm glad somebody got back on topic. Michael I got the answer right, but a day late and a dollar short. Why in God's name did they go to Thelton Henderson? That idiot is the same one who killed the law prohibiting affirmative action in California after it was passed by an overwhelming majority of the people. If you read that abomination of a decision, Henderson essentially said the the Constitution is unconstitutional. It's just fine and dandy to dscriminate on the basis of race, creed, color, national origin or prior condition of servitude. If you can say that with a straight face, turning the prisons into luxury retreats is easy.

wiseone - agree with everything
and will only add that:

Enough will never be enough until those who SET THEIR OWN WAGES - say it is enough.

((That part caught my attention - the guy set his own salary!!))

HUMANS ARE HARD WIRED BY FIVE

.....Humans are genetically social animals who need both to be loved and to give love ...if they are denied this need in the early years, they become twisted psychologically and withdraw into defensive anti-social shells ...

.....This is a defensive mechanism against a perceived hostile world and leaves psysic scars that never really heal ...that is why the doo-gooders always fail ...they either don't understand human psychology or think that they have to power to change it by conditioning people, like Pavlov's dogs ...our ancestors knew it and expressed it in the homily ... "As the twig is bent, so grows the tree" ...

.....To empty out the prisons, all children would have to be taken by the State at birth and raised in very controlled loving environments with surrogate mothers and fathers ...this is a concept posed by Aldous Huxley in his futuristic novel "Brave New World" ...I don't think we are ready just yet ...maybe a nuclear holocaust or two might be necessary first .....COLOSSUS

6th paragraph
"Henderson fired Sillen and then hired Kelso, who set his own annual salary at $224,000 -- plus a possible bonus."

And his 'new and improved health care plan' should nail that bonus - shouldn't it?

Pistol
Pistol Location: FL
Reply # 10
Date: Feb 1, 2009 - 5:05 AM EST
2spothipshot
What urban legend concerning child predators? I am uninformed and curious.

I was referring to the legend that incarcerated predators must be kept in PC because they will die in the general population. A sort of "code of honor" being practiced by the "good" inmates is the basis for this legend (why must we always exalt the vermin among us?).

I find it appalling that so many people feel compelled to promulgate this fantasy as if thieves, burglars, rapists and drug dealers will not tolerate the ultimate form of depravity: forcing ones self on a child

Some do, in fact, have a line but most will just revel in their own tales of "success" at alluding capture for that particular horror.

Anyone who has ever found an eight year old stoned out of his mind on "free" drugs, or scraped an infant off the sidewalk after an errant hollow-point from a turf war from one of these pieces of human excrement can attest to the fact that they are, for the most part, the scum of the earth. They spread misery and human suffering beyond a sane and happy imaginations' ability to exist.

The day we stopped executing people who, intentionally and recklessly, harm children was the day we sold our national soul to the devil.

2spot
prior to leaving sc a couple of years ago, the gov proposed moving child molesters into the general prison population dues to the very high cost of keeping them isolated for other convicts.

The bleeding hearts as is typical rushed to their defense claiming these perverts would all receive jailhouse justice, ie the death penalty from other inmates

But these are the same leftie do gooders who also maintain that segregated prisons also discriminate.

Yet others maintain having prisons with single populations, such as those for hispanics, others for blacks and others for whites or whoever would slow down the high rates of violence occurring presently in prisons where they try to integrate the various populations.

I always considered prisons a place where low lives were sent because of their violent actions. This idea they will somehow be made better humans and assets to society just doesn't make sense.

Oh course my first solution to combat prison violence is for espn to get involved and sponsor the prison games where those who are already prone to violence get to compete in gladiatorial contests.

This would keep prison populations less wieldy, provide much needed funding to maintain the prisons as well as provide some real entertainment to the fans of wwf and off season nfl fans

2spot
Molesters are called "tree jumpers" and are usually kept out of population or put in a cell block where they won't be killed. Inmates have a "Lord of the Flies" thing going, and child molesters are reviled while cop killers are celebrated. A sick little world, really.

What We Need
Is there a way that hardened, vicious criminals can be steered toward rich neighborhoods and the progressive wealthy elite so that they are murdered and molested, rather than poor and working class people?

This would be very beneficial in changing the beliefs of our ruling aristocracy.

Besides, they have the wealth. Why risk imprisonment for meager gains when you can get lots of money from the rich, few of which are conservative anymore and believe in all sorts of foolish, progressive notions about crime and punishment.

And when they start wanting guns, there goes any further assaults on the 2nd Amendment.

We need some kind of campaign to educate all those mongoloid forms of human garbage criminals to go after the better targets.

Any ideas?

Oldsocialworker
Indeed. It always strikes we odd when fellow conservatives rant about molesters by saying how other prisoners have the right idea by murdering them. Yea, that makes sense -- talk up felons as our moral role models.
They say you can judge a society by how it treats its vunerable, its children, etc. I say we should judge it by how it treats its child molesters, its terrorists, etc.


Kaalifornia!!!
How much more of this tripe are you people out there in Kaalifornia going to take. You people are broke and your liberal leaders won't admit it. Why can't the prison system feed the prison population and clean their teeth with the IOU's that you are going to get instead of your tax refunds. Just have Arnold send the IOU's to the prison master and eleminate the middle man,(you). You people keep re-electing these people so now live with. However, what happens in your state dosn't stay there as it will get to the midwest in 2 to 3 years. Thanks for nothing.

rw
you might have a case if there was a way to rehabilitate those who molest children.
But rather than pay the additional costs of keeping them segregated from the general population it would be far more cost effective to try something different like fill a prison with nothing but child molesters.

Many in the shrink community have maintained they cannot be rehabilitated, so why not just find some old military base, put all the child molesters there or in as many prisons as necessary.

Protect the children. These perverts forfeited their rights as citizens when they started molesting the vulnerable.

RW
In NJ we have a place called Avenel Treatment Center for sex offenders. The problem is they eventually get out and most do not change. Some schools of psychology have taken to theorizing that pedophilia may be normal and that it may be the "taboo" society has placed upon it that causes the trouble. Pukey academicians at it again...

We do "treat" sex offenders, the problem is few are conflicted about their behaviors and actions. There can be no counseling without conflict-period. There was one guy I had hope for back in 1992... I generally avoided working with offenders because of their repulsive oily arrogance, but this one little guy intrigued me. He did not want a lawyer and did not want to be let out of jail. He felt that he could not be trusted around children ever. That I guy I had some respect for.

I am convinced that children must be protected from offenders at any and all costs. See one infant-yes, infant- with oral thrush (infants will suck anything); a three year old with a torn vagina and anus; a 15 year old survivor who kills himself (that was last month), and you will agree. I don't think its okay to put the responsibility on inmates to deal with these predators- there needs to be a death penalty for them through our courts of law.

Let every person
with a kind heart and compassion, every psychologist convinced he/she's cured the pedophiles and they want them released, be required to use their home for a halfway-house them.

Segregate the prison populations by race and make the wardens and trusties the same race.
Those would be case studies for psychologists instead of armchair theorizing.

Think of the peer reviewed articles Dr. Douglas could generate from those two actions.

LouLouise
The bhest pistol for a beginner is a .22 rimfire. The easiest pistols to learn on are medium sized. Everyone's consensus for a beginner's gun is the Ruger Mark II semi-auto pistol. Find a range. If indoors, most places will have instruction for a beginner. Most experienced NRA certified firearms instructors are quite good. Look out for cowboys and/or folks who lack respect for guns and women. A .22 is much cheaper to shoot than bigger calibers and so you can practice enough to become familiar and confident with your sidearm. .22 is far from an ideal self-defense cartidge, but it has its advantages. It is nothing to be sneezed at. If you build skill and confidence and have the money, you can go to something bigger. Handling heavy calibers is really not a matter of strength and many quite small women become very good shots with large guns. Best to start with the .22.

If you are thinking self-defense, the most important thing is mental attitude. Defense with a firearm is serious business. You must be familiar with the legal aspects. And you must face up to the consequences of deadly force and decide whether you can go through with it BEFORE you do it. Even displaying a gun is assault with a deady weapon in some circumstances. Using a gun as a threat is nearly always a serious mistake. You must be in deadly danger before it is legal to even threaten deadly force.
A good tactic is to talk to more than one person familiar with guns. There is a huge amount of mis-information floating around. You are lass likely to fall victim to some jerk if you talk to lots of people. Check out my advice with others, and their advice with others still. Take your time.

Enough will be enough when
those that pay taxes can no longer fill the coffers enough to cover the flagrantly abused methods of spending by the elected, be that local, state or federal.

Californians must have been blind to think that RHINO Arnold (just an extension of the Kennedy Clan) would be conservative as the republicans USED to be. We should all be glad that the Constitution prevents Arnold from running for OPUS, although I understand that he's already lobbying to try and change that.

I don't live in California, I live in a state close to the same mentality and can't wait to retire and move.

Why is anybody surprised...
It is California after all. Cali is how much in debt? But, they keep plugging along at a vicious rate to create and grow programs, and hoping that the rest of America will give them a bailout to enable and reinforce their bad fiscal habits. That's all bailouts do: decrease the likelihood that entities will explore efficiencies, innovation, and good business practices.

The Prisons in Texas
Each prison in Texas has a medical center. But it is for medication only. There is a dental office and several psycologists. There is also first aid. But any serious injuries are taken to the local hospital (with guards) and then if long-term care is needed to a state hospital.

This B.S. that they want in California is part of the reason they are out of money. Art, music, etc. is not "medicine". From the sound of it, this sucker expects the prisoners to spend several hours a day there even when they are not ill. A hospital is for sickness or injuries, not recreation.

Wasn't California bailed out once?
If I remember correctly didn't California get into debt once years ago? And they managed to talk the Federal Government into bailing them out. Now they are in trouble again due to this sort of spending and want my money to pay for their extravigances. Well, this time let them pay their own way out. And perhaps they won't be such big spenders in the future.

what happened
to treating a prisoner like a prisoner?

The Be Kind To Convicts Theory
Has Never NEVER WORKED.As a Retired Correction Officer, Fla.[16+yrs] I can tell you that the CONVICTS mistake Kindness for Weakness. The Recidivism Rate [Back to the Pen.] is as High Now, as when they were treated like the Sociopathic ANIMALS they really are. All this wonderful medical/recreational/educational Crap does not help the return to Prison rate in the least. The System worked just as well as when prison was the Un-Pleasant Experience that it Intended to be. At the least, they were not in such a Hurry to be Re-Incarcerated. As it is, they are "Doin' LIFE, on the Installment Plan."

GITMO
Hey Cactus (#49)

What a great idea!! GITMO will be available in the future. What do you think?

solution for buying the criminal vote
Enact a Federal Law that prevents Felon's from Voting.
As far as I am concerned, When you commit a crime against your fellow man, you give up your personal rights, and become less than human.

It's depressing how Liberals cater to the criminals, and Criminalize the law abiding citizens who struggle to make a living while the government strips away thier rights one self serving law after another.

Why Do We Put People In Prision
Let me suggest that the relevant question we should ask oursleves is "why do we throw people in prison"? Let me suggest that we put people behind bars for three reasons. One, to punish people who do not do what society thinks they should not do, two to convince them that they should not do it again and three to try to influence criminals and others that the price is to high, when you do commit a crime. So, the more benefits you give people in prison, and the easier you make their life spent in prison, you are defeating the purppose of throwing them into prison, you are not telling society not to break our laws, or tha tthe price is to high when you do break the law.

None--why do wew put people in prison?
It is actually simpler than that--we put them in prison either because we are unhappy with their behavior, or we are afraid of them.

The first group, IMO, shouldn't be in prison, at least most of them, most of the time. If they aren't dangerous, make them earn a living and make restitution for whatever they did. If they refuse to do either, then they may have to go in with the ones we are afraid of.

The ones that are dangerous? Make life hard for them. Up at 0500, hard labor until 6PM; half a day off on Sunday to go to chapel and write letters. Refuse to work? Fine--solitary and "sufficient food to prevent health problems" (that is what the Japanese do). Time spent in solitary does not count against the term. When do we let them out? Only after we are convinced they are no longer a threat.

Don't put people in prison if they aren't a threat to the safety of the populace and make prison a place you don't want to be. Prison population will be much smaller.

Isn't prison
suppose to be a DETERENT to crime? With perks like this, these guys will be killing, raping and pillaging to get in. Imagine some person who needed a specific health benefit. If he/she didn’t want to fund their own health insurance, just go out and rob a liquor store. The prison system will give you all the health care you could want.

Today, backing a truck up to California’s treasury would get you nothing but cobwebs. The state is broke and getting broker. Businesses and families are fleeing California at the same rate some Hispanics are fleeing Mexico.

And this is governments answer?!! I guess they intend to fill the population back up with criminals. That’s one way to do it.

CALIFORNIA'S BAILOUT

It is no surprise why the state of California is broke. They have bowed to all of those liberals programs. Now they want a federal bail out, our tax dollars at work.


Prisons
The prison system, today, is a JOKE! We send convicted felons to prisons which, in reality, are better living conditions than they had when they were out of prison. We need torevise the whole system. First, first-time offenders, especially those who stand a good chance of rehabilitation, should NOT be ensconsed with career (multiple offender) criminals who just teach the neophytes how to improve on their criminality. First time offenders should be given every advantage to improve themselves and become productive members of society, including schooling, libraries, exercise facilities, and educational TV. They should also be taken on tours of facilities reserved for multiple offenders, which brings me to my next point. Multiple offenders should be housed in facilities where, since they have proven to be non-rehabitable, they should have NO facilities such as mentioned for the first time offenders, butr should be required to live in cells with 8 prisoners per cell, bunks stacked with 18 inches clearance between to mattress top and the bottom of the bunk above, similar to how some of our navy heros are bunked. The tours taken by first time offenders would be to show them what they could look forward to if they continued their crimanal career.

Criminal Voting
Not all states allow criminals to vote. This was a Hillary issue which I suspect Obama will pick up. She wanted all of them to have the ability to vote. After all, some prisons have up to 5000 people in one spot, a perfect "captive" audiance.

However, during Dukaucas's term as governor of Mass. he ran for President on a Democratic ticket. One thing that helped kill him was when one of his top people visited a prison to speak with the criminals there (who does vote in that state). The man said something about Dukaucas being "their best friend in office". It killed him almost immediately.

When I took civics in high school I was told that if you were convicted you lost the right to vote whether you were in or out. I think we should go back to that for all states.

John:
I can think of a few other things than in your list, but I agree. We should have prisons strictly for first time offenders so they aren't with multiple offenders. We should also have at least one prison per state for first time offenders who are not violent. Many first time violent offenders are actually too far gone anyway. (I helped capture one some years ago. He had been arrested 32 times for burglary over a two year period but his lawyer had gotten the charges dropped every time because of his age. When they did finally get him, he got six months probation. He was already too far gone.)

I don't have a problem with school, etc. for those who may be able to do something with it but the multiple offenders don't need or deserve it. One guy on death row is now a lawyer although he hasn't passed the bar. He writes up appeals for the other prisoners - and he's been on death row about 25 years now (in PA).

The bad ones deserve hard work and no play. The really bad ones (only one per cell) simply needs a gas chamber. There is no way they can be "rehabilitated" and we shouldn't be spending the money to keep them around. Further, if they aren't kept around, some dumb governor or President can't turn them loose again. We had a governor turn one loose - who rape/torture/killed over 50 women during a 9 month period before they caught him again. (I still think the governor should have been tried as an assessory.)

Its Only Money
A fitting arrangement for a prison system that pays its guards 120K a year.Are you sure that the Receiver is named Clark Kelso? He seems more like Michael Kelso

universal health care
is like a DMV with injuries

California is a Socialist State
What do you expect from the Great Socialist State of California? And, as far as this taxpayer is concerned, let the loonies who choose to live in California and tolerate an insane government such as California has, live there and put up with this nonsense. But, do not come to the U.S. government and ask for tax dollars that come from the rest of the country to bail them out when their budgets have billion dollar shortfalls. Of course, California is bankrupt. Even with their excessive taxes on everything and everybody that works, they cannot extract enough blood money to pay for this huge and out of control Socialist Spending. If I were living in California, I would have long been gone from that loony place that gave us Hollywood and all the other perverted and weird concepts that have crept into mainstream American culture. I would like to see a fence built along the California border and a media blackout from anything coming from that state. And while we were at it, to do the same for Oregon and Washington state, as they seem to be infected with the same mental disorders as California politicians. Their mental illness is spreading all over the country, thanks to Hollywood, the media, and loons from that state such as Nancy Pelosi, Boxer, Miller and others who have now imposed California Style socialism on the rest of us out here.

Amen to Aimee in Wa
Good points Aimee, but I have to ask, "how can you stand living in the Great Socialist State of Washington?" From what I can tell, Washington is about as insane as California with it's socialist agenda. I watch a lot of the ID network shows on crime and it seems that the majority of serial killers originate in either California, Oregon or Washington. Is it something in the air or water out there that make people crazy enough to stay even when they see that their governments are completely socialistic, and impose regulations on everything from French fries to the kind of cars you are allowed to buy, and at the same time, tax you people to death, if you happen to have a job or own property? Has to be some form of insanity at play here, and it sound like that in California, they have put the inmates in charge of the asylums. Especially this nut they are paying a quarter of a million dollar salary to who suggests that their prisons be turned into Mayo clinics and health spas. Get out Aimee while there is still time. You may wake up one day and find that you too have gone insane living out there on the left coast.

What about GITMO
I agree partially with Debbie about GITMO becoming available. However we must remember the mass murders who killed by the thousands were tortured with servings of orange glaze chicken over rice pilaf just to mention but a few of the mouth watering delights specially prepared by the chef de cuisine so as not to offend the palates of those fine connoisseurs of superb tastes. So GITMO may not be a preferred choice least "We The People" be accused of engaging in or sanctioning torture.

Recidivision
Which one of these honchos of the California prison is more insane? Sillen or Kelso?

I think when the prison sentence is about to end for some of these prisoners they will create some sort of stunt to remain incarcerated to continue living in this health spa forever.

Where else in the bloody world would a person get clothing, medical, dental, gym privileges, room and board and psychiatric services FREE?

If I was homeless and lived in that area I would become a criminal for this kind of deal!

Perhaps criminal throughout the country would move there to become incarcerated. What a hoot!

I like the way the Sheriff in Arizona treats criminals-not like animals- he treats them like criminals. Guess what? They do NOT return when their time is up. No recidivision there!

vigilantes
We definitely should NOT go back to vigilante style judgement. We had a case in my small town where most of the community were ready to lynch a driffter/alcoholic for a crime because he was easy to manipulate. It turns out it was a jealous boyfriend that committed the crime. This poor man would have been drawn and quartered had it been left up to the population instead of a jury--who got to hear all the evidence. There is very good reason that our fore-fathers insisted on a jury of our peers.

As to my feelings about what and what not to give our inmates: After their basic needs are taken care of, 1)they should be forced to take classes, first the basic education so many of them are missing, then a trade of some kind; 2) they could only watch g-rated movies or educational films, and those in an auditorium--not a private tv set; 3) they should be forced to do exercse, but NOT body building with expensive equipment; 4) they should have to take behavior modification classes if they have "issues" whether or not they were ever getting out. And 5) absolutely NO Islamic clerics of teachers would be allowed to go in and convert them into terrorists.

I'm sure there are more ideas out there, but whatever they are, we MUST stop treating them so well that they want to keep coming back. My figures may be off, but I believe the majority of crimes are committed by 10% of the population. We are NOT doing a very good job at combatting crime!
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