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Sunday, June 14, 2009
George Will :: Townhall.com Columnist
More Judicial Activism, Please
by George Will
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WASHINGTON -- "We," said Queen Victoria, employing the royal plural, "are not amused." "We," said the Treasury Department on Tuesday, relishing the royal prerogatives it exercises nowadays, "are gratified that not a single court that reviewed this matter, including the U.S. Supreme, found any fault whatsoever with the handling of this matter by either Chrysler or the U.S. government." Is it lese-majeste to note that Treasury is being misleading?

At issue was the government's rush to push the remnants of Chrysler through bankruptcy and into marriage with Fiat, the Italian company that is now yet another business subsidized by U.S. taxpayers. But as the court said in its order permitting completion of Chrysler's bankruptcy, its refusal to review what lower courts have authorized "is not a decision on the underlying legal issues" and pertains to "this case alone."

*** Special Offer ***

That matters because the more complex and consequential General Motors bankruptcy is not completed, and as a consultant said in an e-mail to Chrysler's then-CEO, Chrysler was a "guinea pig" on which the government tested what it can get away with in GM's bankruptcy, which involves the same issues: Is it lawful to use Troubled Assets Relief Program (TARP) funds for this? Does the mistreatment of Chrysler's secured creditors constitute an unconstitutional taking of property?

Richard Mourdock, Indiana's state treasurer who has been criticized for contesting the terms of the Chrysler bailout, notes that "no critic has ever challenged us on the points of law." Indiana's pension funds for retired teachers and state police officers were among Chrysler's secured creditors. It has been settled law that secured creditors, as compensation for lending money at rates lower than the borrowing company's condition might justify, are first in line to be paid in the event of bankruptcy. Indiana's funds and other secured creditors received less per dollar than did an unsecured creditor, the United Auto Workers, which also got 55 percent ownership of Chrysler. So the government is simultaneously subsidizing Italians and injuring retired Hoosiers.

The Supreme Court has said nothing about "bailout law," a phrase that currently is an oxymoron. America as Bailout Nation is governed by unconstrained executive discretion.

Last September, Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson testified to the Senate that TARP money was necessary for ailing "financial institutions." Nowhere in the bill's 169 pages was there any reference to government funding of "automobile" or "manufacturing" companies. In November, Paulson told a House committee: "I've said to you very clearly that I believe that the auto companies fall outside of (TARP's) purpose." Then advocates of a Detroit bailout proposed legislation to authorize that. It failed. So President Bush's Treasury Department gave an "interpretation" of the law that ignored the unambiguous terms of the pertinent legislation, the history of its enactment and Treasury's own prior interpretations of it.

Controversy about the judiciary's proper role is again at a boil because of a Supreme Court vacancy, and conservatives are warning against "judicial activism." But the Chrysler and GM bailouts and bankruptcies are reasons for conservatives to rethink the usefulness of that phrase and to make some distinctions.

Of course courts should not make policy or invent rights not stipulated or implied by statutes or the Constitution's text. But courts have no nobler function than that of actively defending property, contracts and other bulwarks of freedom against depredations by government, including by popularly elected, and popular, officials. Regarding Chrysler and GM, the executive branch is exercising powers it does not have under any statute or constitutional provision. At moments such as this, deference to the political branches constitutes dereliction of judicial duty.

"At present," notes the Economist, "there's enough capacity globally to make 90 million vehicles a year, but demand is little more than 60 million (BEG ITAL)in good economic times(END ITAL)" (emphasis added). Unfortunately, says Reason magazine's Jacob Sullum, America's president "can imagine a world in which the internal combustion engine is obsolete but not one in which GM is." So, doubling down on his predecessor's misbegotten policy, the president is acting strenuously to perpetuate some of America's portion of the excess capacity.

A bemused Paulson, who was present at the creation of Bailout Nation with TARP funds, said while still in office: "Even if you don't have the authorities -- and frankly I didn't have the authorities for anything -- if you take charge, people will follow." This would not be happening were Congress awake, or were the courts properly active. Constitutionalists are not amused.

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About The Author
George F. Will is a 1976 Pulitzer Prize winner whose columns are syndicated in more than 400 magazines and newspapers worldwide.
 
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Its obvious
This nation is no longer a nation of law, but of men.

Here come the dark ages

Rule of Law??????
As talent scout says we are now a nation where the POTUS is a law unto himself and he gets to reward those who he pleases and dump on those he deems to be "evil rich", "unscrupulous lenders", in short anyone with whom his can feel no empathy or who will be of no account in the next election.

Why bother with legal niceties when you have to reward your brethren at the UAW?


His supreme court nominee neatly fits into his view that all true justice starts with empathy and carries with her the whiff of electioneering on a broad scale namely setting social policy through judicial fiat.

Obama and Sotomayor have the utter stench of racism as their entry into politics and the judiciary. Any white with their background would never be elected dog catcher but they are seen as transforming figures by the MSM and the left of this country!

We are not Amused Either...
There are many battles conservatives can enjoin with this Anti-Capitalist (N.B. I did not say "Socialist") President, but none more critical to the barely beating heart of America than this.

If Obama succeeds in upending our settled laws concerning how commerce is transacted and ejudicated, nothing will be safe from his will or that of his minions.

To borrow from Sen. Barry Goldwater -- 'Judicial activism in the defense of liberty is no vice, Executive activism in the destruction of law is no virtue.' (with apologies)

OUTRIGHT ILLEGAL
Says the Special Investigator, Inspector General Gerald Walpin.

quote:

Former Inspector General Gerald Walpin filed two reports exposing gross misappropriation of federal AmeriCorps funds by a prominent Barack Obama supporter and was shortly thereafter fired by the White House, circumstances he told WND are likely linked and others have called an outright illegal action by the administration.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=101031


I hear the sound of the pale horse.


Why not?
TheDailyLlama writes:
Reply I did not say "Socialist"
==========================

Whats the big deal about shying away from the word socialist?

Someone demand you not use it?

I honestly do no tget it because Obama is most assuredly a socialist, for petes sake

talent scout
"This nation is no longer a nation of law, but of men."

Did that start when Bush, Paulson and Bernanke asked for $700 billion, 'quick and clean', last September or else the end of western civilization was near.

Is this not another example of Republican wealth re-distribution from Main Street to Wall Street?

talent scout
"filed two reports exposing gross misappropriation."

Bud, how much money has been 'grossly misappropriated' in your Republican social-engineering project in Iraq?

Quick, who coined the phrase, 'When the Iraqis stand up, we can stand down?"

Why Does Obama Hate Gay People?
Get out the lavender hankies!

Justice spokeswoman Tracy Schmaler said that President Obama “has said he wants to see a legislative repeal of the Defense of Marriage Act because it prevents LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender) couples from being granted equal rights and benefits,” she said. “However, until Congress passes legislation repealing the law, the administration will continue to defend the statute when it is challenged in the justice system.”…

The Obama administration cited Catalano v. Catalano (marriage of uncle to niece, “though valid in Italy under its laws, was not valid in Connecticut because it contravened the public policy of th[at] state”); Wilkins v. Zelichowski (marriage of 16-year-old female held invalid in New Jersey, regardless of validity in Indiana where performed, in light of N.J. policy reflected in statute permitting adult female to secure annulment of her underage marriage), and re Mortenson’s Estate, (marriage of first cousins held invalid in Arizona, though lawfully performed in New Mexico, given Arizona policy reflected in statute declaring such marriages “prohibited and void”).

“Holy cow,” wrote [Americablog's John] Aravosis. “Obama invoked incest and people marrying children.”

We have Government inspired Anarchy
From the refusal to enforce all the immigration and hiring laws to all the crime of govermnment takeover of private business.

And on top of that, hand it over to foreign interests.

China has it eyes on Chrysler and all you "free" traders who said the deficit is of no concern should be able now to see it is a great concern.

They now have the cash to buy up all sorts of American Industry.

Only people who have never really understood the ideals this nation was Founded in could support the globalist world vision and the anarchy of our own government today

zapdoodat
Shut up stupid

Obama The Bulldozer Or Something

US cities may have to be bulldozed in order to survive...

Dozens of US cities may have entire neighbourhoods bulldozed as part of drastic "shrink to survive" proposals being considered by the Obama administration to tackle economic decline.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/financialc risis/5516536/US-cities-may-have-to-be-bulldozed-in-order-t o-survive.html


Poor Democratic and Union cities read it and weep OR come over to our side and call Obama a tyrant.

Let's call it what it is

Fascism.

And well on the way to socialism/communism.


Here is where America is going
The Complete Perversion of the Law

But, unfortunately, law by no means confines itself to its proper functions. And when it has exceeded its proper functions, it has not done so merely in some inconsequential and debatable matters. The law has gone further than this; it has acted in direct opposition to its own purpose. The law has been used to destroy its own objective: It has been applied to annihilating the justice that it was supposed to maintain; to limiting and destroying rights which its real purpose was to respect. The law has placed the collective force at the disposal of the unscrupulous who wish, without risk, to exploit the person, liberty, and property of others. It has converted plunder into a right, in order to protect plunder. And it has converted lawful defense into a crime, in order to punish lawful defense.

How has this perversion of the law been accomplished? And what have been the results?

The law has been perverted by the influence of two entirely different causes: stupid greed and false philanthropy. Let us speak of the first.

The Law
Frédéric Bastiat

http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html#SECTION_G1793

BrianR
Let's call it what it is fascism/socialism.

Amen bro! Wasn't the $750 billion Bush-Bolshevik bank bailout Socialism? The Republican party is very similar to the Bolshevik party in Russia circa 1917.

Russia was governed by a triumvirate of three men called Vladimir Lenin, Leon Trotsky and Joseph Stalin.

Today, Republican-Bolsheviks are George Bush, Hank Paulson and Ben Bernanke.

The Republicans redistribute wealth in many ways. The banks that received their $750 billion of taxpayer monies distributed it to their sacred stockholders in the form of dividend checks.

Another item on the banker's list on how to best use the taxpayer's money, is to partake in some lucrative Mergers and Acquisition activity. Oh, these Bush-Bolsheviks were clever in their wealth redistribution.

Fascism
My country thought they elected a socialist and all they got was a lousy fascist. Fascism needed a new face lift and Obama was there to provide it because he isn't white. They put up a black man and therefore fascism is more acceptable, and criticism of him is deemed racist. And it's NOT just Obama! It's much of Congress, and Bush was sending us on our way too, when he started the bailouts, that the Republican, McCain, supported too!

Corporatism is a system of economic, political, and social organization where corporate groups or interest groups, such as business, ethnic, farmer, labour, military, or patronage groups, are joined together under a common governing jurisdiction to try to achieve societal harmony and promote coordinated development.[1] Corporatism is based on the sociological concept of functionalism. - Wikipedia

"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." - Mussolini

Zap
There you go again. I guess Obama never does anything wrong. Now we have unsecured creditors being given preference over secured creditors. Just remember the vote on bailout 1 was that the majority of the Democrats voted for it and the majority of the Republicans voted against it. How are the Democrats not partially responsible for TARP 1. Then for TARP II no one read the bill and it was only passed with 3 Republican votes. How can that be the Republicans fault?

Property and Plunder
Man can live and satisfy his wants only by ceaseless labor; by the ceaseless application of his faculties to natural resources. This process is the origin of property.

But it is also true that a man may live and satisfy his wants by seizing and consuming the products of the labor of others. This process is the origin of plunder.

Now since man is naturally inclined to avoid pain — and since labor is pain in itself — it follows that men will resort to plunder whenever plunder is easier than work. History shows this quite clearly. And under these conditions, neither religion nor morality can stop it.

When, then, does plunder stop? It stops when it becomes more painful and more dangerous than labor.

It is evident, then, that the proper purpose of law is to use the power of its collective force to stop this fatal tendency to plunder instead of to work. All the measures of the law should protect property and punish plunder.

But, generally, the law is made by one man or one class of men. And since law cannot operate without the sanction and support of a dominating force, this force must be entrusted to those who make the laws.

This fact, combined with the fatal tendency that exists in the heart of man to satisfy his wants with the least possible effort, explains the almost universal perversion of the law. Thus it is easy to understand how law, instead of checking injustice, becomes the invincible weapon of injustice. It is easy to understand why the law is used by the legislator to destroy in varying degrees among the rest of the people, their personal independence by slavery, their liberty by oppression, and their property by plunder. This is done for the benefit of the person who makes the law, and in proportion to the power that he holds.

Bastiat

Victims of Lawful Plunder
Men naturally rebel against the injustice of which they are victims. Thus, when plunder is organized by law for the profit of those who make the law, all the plundered classes try somehow to enter — by peaceful or revolutionary means — into the making of laws. According to their degree of enlightenment, these plundered classes may propose one of two entirely different purposes when they attempt to attain political power: Either they may wish to stop lawful plunder, or they may wish to share in it.

Woe to the nation when this latter purpose prevails among the mass victims of lawful plunder when they, in turn, seize the power to make laws! Until that happens, the few practice lawful plunder upon the many, a common practice where the right to participate in the making of law is limited to a few persons. But then, participation in the making of law becomes universal. And then, men seek to balance their conflicting interests by universal plunder. Instead of rooting out the injustices found in society, they make these injustices general. As soon as the plundered classes gain political power, they establish a system of reprisals against other classes. They do not abolish legal plunder. (This objective would demand more enlightenment than they possess.) Instead, they emulate their evil predecessors by participating in this legal plunder, even though it is against their own interests.

It is as if it were necessary, before a reign of justice appears, for everyone to suffer a cruel retribution — some for their evilness, and some for their lack of understanding.

Bastiat

Lame brain
The Democrats are the ones that passed TARP I and II.

The Socialists Despise Mankind
According to these writers, it is indeed fortunate that Heaven has bestowed upon certain men — governors and legislators — the exact opposite inclinations, not only for their own sake but also for the sake of the rest of the world! While mankind tends toward evil, the legislators yearn for good; while mankind advances toward darkness, the legislators aspire for enlightenment; while mankind is drawn toward vice, the legislators are attracted toward virtue. Since they have decided that this is the true state of affairs, they then demand the use of force in order to substitute their own inclinations for those of the human race.

Open at random any book on philosophy, politics, or history, and you will probably see how deeply rooted in our country is this idea — the child of classical studies, the mother of socialism. In all of them, you will probably find this idea that mankind is merely inert matter, receiving life, organization, morality, and prosperity from the power of the state. And even worse, it will be stated that mankind tends toward degeneration, and is stopped from this downward course only by the mysterious hand of the legislator. Conventional classical thought everywhere says that behind passive society there is a concealed power called law or legislator (or called by some other terminology that designates some unnamed person or persons of undisputed influence and authority) which moves, controls, benefits, and improves mankind.


http://bastiat.org/en/the_law.html#SECTION_G1827

Lame brain
It was the Democrats that passed TARP I and II.

Socialists Ignore Reason and Facts
With the amazing credulity which is typical of the classicists, Fenelon ignores the authority of reason and facts when he attributes the general happiness of the Egyptians, not to their own wisdom but to the wisdom of their kings:

We could not turn our eyes to either shore without seeing rich towns and country estates most agreeably located; fields, never fallowed, covered with golden crops every year; meadows full of flocks; workers bending under the weight of the fruit which the earth lavished upon its cultivators; shepherds who made the echoes resound with the soft notes from their pipes and flutes. "Happy," said Mentor, "is the people governed by a wise king...."
Later, Mentor desired that I observe the contentment and abundance which covered all Egypt, where twenty-two thousand cities could be counted. He admired the good police regulations in the cities; the justice rendered in favor of the poor against the rich; the sound education of the children in obedience, labor, sobriety, and the love of the arts and letters; the exactness with which all religious ceremonies were performed; the unselfishness, the high regard for honor, the faithfulness to men, and the fear of the gods which every father taught his children. He never stopped admiring the prosperity of the country. "Happy," said he, "is the people ruled by a wise king in such a manner."

Bastiat

Bush totally screwed up his finish
His money guy - Paulsen - literally got down on his knees and begged Pelosi, Reed, Frank, etc.. for Tarp. Thy gave the dems the keys to the vault and even worse - the printing presses. And then there's the GM bailout.....

Socialists Want Forced Conformity
Rousseau invests the creators, organizers, directors, legislators, and controllers of society with a terrible responsibility. He is, therefore, most exacting with them:

He who would dare to undertake the political creation of a people ought to believe that he can, in a manner of speaking, transform human nature; transform each individual — who, by himself, is a solitary and perfect whole — into a mere part of a greater whole from which the individual will henceforth receive his life and being. Thus the person who would undertake the political creation of a people should believe in his ability to alter man's constitution; to strengthen it; to substitute for the physical and independent existence received from nature, an existence which is partial and moral. [7] In short, the would-be creator of political man must remove man's own forces and endow him with others that are naturally alien to him.

Bastiat

talent scout
Are you trying to kill zap with information overload?

In the land of Kennedy and barney's frank???

You are shooting fish in the barrel

SCOTUS has abdicated its purpose
Given that the Congress is controlled by the same socialist vermin that now hold the executive branch, the Supreme Court was our last, best hope of staving off the dismantling of our republic. Unfortunately, this Supreme Court is complicit in the dismantling by their own abdication of responsibility.

By refusing to address the "natural born" status of Barry Soetoro, aka Barack Hussein Obama, knowing that it is entirely possible that this man is not constitutionally eligible to the presidency, this Court signalled that they are afraid of the truth. They would rather see a bloodless coup d'etat continue than risk the pandemonium that will result when Obama is ultimately exposed as a fraud.

By refusing to stop many obviously unconstitutional acts by this illegal regime, such as the swindling of preferred stockholders and creditors of Chrysler, this Court signalled that they will stand aside and allow the continued rape of America.

This Supreme Court might as well be disbanded. They are a disgrace to the bench.

Mr Will writes:
The Supreme Court has said nothing about "bailout law," a phrase that currently is an oxymoron. America as Bailout Nation is governed by unconstrained executive discretion.
======================

Anyone who will read Bastiat can see there is nothing new in any of this, its the road to hell.

I cannot bring myself to believe anyone is Washington DC is ignorant of where they are taking this nation as it a very old failed policy.

So, I am left with believing the people in power are intentionally destroying this Nation.

Its like trading a person's life's savings for a bucket of slop

Politics is to blame
Both parties are miserable leaders, both parties are corrupt

Zap, What Little You Know!

Only half of TARP was distributed under the Bush Administration. The remainder was spread around by the Obama Administration.

Bush is retired.

Who helped craft the AIG bailout? Geithner

Who was Al Gore's partner in the carboncrap scam? The Naked Emperor Hank Paulson

Where did Paulson go later? Goldman-Sachs

Who was the ONLY non-governmental representative present in the TARP meetings? Paulson's successor at Goldman-Sachs.

What is Bernanke's nickname? Helicopter Ben

Who is to be named the next Chairman of the Federal Reserve? Helicopter Ben, much to the chagrin of Lawrence Summers

Do yourself a favor and read "Opium For Opportunists".

It will explain how opportunists know no party.


If you believe that most of us supported Bush's mortgage bailouts, Medicare Part B, TARP and auto bailouts, then you are delusional.

Heck! I did not even support Bush's decision to declare warfare in Iraq.

Keep the change
I do not bother arguing with zapaidiot.
He is a political hack.

Endless stupidity does not tempt me to argue with the moron.

I am really really sick of politics.

Forgive me for empying myself of outrage at this criminal WH and Congress and Supreme Court.

None of them show an ounce of respect for any law they cannot bend to their own greedy will

parties
Both are COMPLETELY corrupt! no hope left without massive overthrows

St. Denis
is always a voice of reason.

Keep The Change & Talent Scout

All of that which you write mimics my own personal political stance.

I am a fiscally-conservative CONSTITUTIONIST without party affiliation.


Keep up the great work!

carlos, CA

Thank you.

What remains to be seen...
...is how much more it will take, and how long it will take, for a critical mass of people to stand up and stop this destruction of our society. I have faith, dwindling though it may be, that there are enough patriots out here to stop the madness. But what will it take to coalesce us? Do we have enough with the mettle of our Founding Fathers, who penned the following words?

"But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security." (The Declaration of Independence, July 4, 1776)

If we want America back, it is going to take more than whining and more than words.

I don't get it?!
There is a world shortage of food but the US government pays farmers not to farm certain produce.

There is a world glut of motor vehicles but the US government is paying large sums of money to bankrupt car companies to keep making cars.

Keeping first things first is clearly not Obama's strong point.

Disaster
It is a disaster. Nothing will keep GM alive and yet we are going to spend billions in an attempt to do so.

This can only end badly!

mute point
Not very many people are considering buying an Obama car anyway. Buy a Ford instead.

I Support Obama
I am a big Obama supporter, but I think his domestic agenda has been a disaster.

I can't help but notice that it is just an extension of everything Bush had done. Obama has continued to policies of Bush.

Two men, opposite idealogies, who are doing the exact same thing.

It would appear that big money men somewhere are pulling the strings. Obviously they convinced Bush and Obama to follow their advice. And yet, the advice seems to benefit Wall Street at the expense of the rest of us.

Robert_CA: "... just an extension of
everything Bush had done. Obama has continued to policies of Bush.'

Actually NO!

You really need to go back and READ talent scout's and St. Denise's posts... for starters. And then read the rest...

Then, do some research...




The zapdoodat/Democratic response:
"Naw, naw, naw, naw! Bush did it! Bush did it!"

Really helps a lot, no?


To take Joel's post in 43
a little further.
After WW2, we had the best opportunity we ever had to advance American values, we owned the world because we saved the world.

We had the bomb and until the rosenbergs sold their own country out, we were the only ones that did.
We never should have gone into Korea, we should have given the North an ultimatum and if they refused, destroyed the place.
Mac Arthur was right, Patton was right, the pols were wrong.

Under Ike we had the best 8 years this country ever had, the only legitimate protest was civil rights for our black citizens and he stood tall as usual, did Republicans get any credit? Again the pols screwed the pooch..Should have done the right thing, educated them to what civil responsibilities were, we owed them that remember and then left them alone, they'd have done just fine.

Everything since has caused this nation to go downhill.

Gov't meddling in every aspect of our lives to pander to every group with a beef real or imagined has gotten us to this point.

And if you notice, it's always some lib who wants to push the envelope to gain acceptance for things like drugs, perversions, abortions for their irresponsible behavior.

The rest of us now have to pay for their bad choices with programs that were never neccessary when people adhered to the guiding principles that made the country great in the first place.

How is it that we, the responsible folks should get stuck with this, we didn't get you knocked up, we didn't give you aids, we didn't stick that needle in your arm...you did, deal with it.

Life is all about choices, examples abound with those who made good ones and those that didn't...those who made the good ones have no responsibility to "bail out" anyone else.

Past bad behavior by
Republicans (RINOS really) frequwently cited by ZapanIdiot does not justify bad behavior by Democrats (Facists/Socialists really). That's like saying bacause O.J. got away with murdering his wife and her friended it is O.K for you to murder your wife and her friend. Just plain stupid logic. But then when have Democrats ever been logical?

The cowardly black robed oligarchs of the (less than) Supreme Court have abdicated their responsibilities and dishonored their oaths. When the (hopefully peaceful) second American Revolution comes, that cesspool needs to cleaned out as much as the Congressional sewage pit.

If not us, who? If not now, when? Let's roll.

zapddodat
Has scathing contempt for Bush but, mysteriously, has no problem embracing Bush on steroids.

Curious.

talent scout-
"Shut up, slave" is more accurate.
;)

A complete perversion
What we are seeing is a complete perversion of what our nation is supposed to be. And in all honesty it did begin with the Bush administration when they 'interpreted' the TARP statute to mean that money meant specifically for troubled financial institutions was meant to go to car companies. The Obama administration simply has taken this into overdrive and expanded it to levels no one thought it would get to. And if the SCOTUS had stopped the sale it would not have been activist, it would have been what they were supposed to do...upholding black letter law.

UAW bandits team up with BO

UAW's campaign contributions to BO paid a huge return to them. In addition to its 55% stake, UAW gets a health-care trust fund of billions of dollars.

Next, BO implements national health care, and presto!.... UAW has billions of dollars of windfall! No neeed for UAW health care funding with Uncle Sam picking up the health care tab! I bet UAW will not get billed for a windfall profits tax either.

Meanwhile, BO is stealing from pension funds such as those in Indiana.

What a bunch of crooks!

Good article, Bad title
It is every bit as much "judicial activism" when the Court refuses to act when the government is in clear violation of the law as when it makes new policies to reach a desired result that is against the clear will of the people.

'Factitious Disorders' and Liberals...

We all know Liberals Lie, and Lie often. One of the telling signs of a Liberal Politician is their ability to create a 'Factitious Crisis' at the drop of a hat.

'Munchausen by Proxy' is a psychological disorder, and generally refers to a mother who feigns/creates an illness (Read: Crisis) in her child for the sole narcissistic purpose of garnering attention for herself.

Now, take the 'Attention-Getting' behavior of Munchausen Syndrome and apply it to the behaviors of Liberal Politicians such as Barack Obama and Al Gore.

What, is the difference between the seemingly daily 'Factitious Crises' coming out of the White House and those 'Factitious Crises' created by a Munchausen-Mother?

What, has the Factitious "Global Warming Crisis" done for America other than keep an 'Attention-Getting' Camera focused on Al Gore seven days a week?

Name one Liberal-Democrat "Crisis" that is not 'Factitious' or 'Created by them' in the first place?

Why The Wait?

Obama should just shred the Constitution, dissolve both Chambers of Congress, permanently retire the Supreme Court, nullify all state's Constitution, erase all state boundaries, nationalize everything, etc., and be done with it.

He governs by fiat and wants us to drive Fiats, except if we "choose" models made by Government Motors.

He is a tyrant and a Robert Mugabe, especially when it comes to debaunching the nation's currency.


Frankly, he needs to tread lightly because kings, dictators and tyrants usually meet an untimely end.

Misbegotten Policies
Yes, George W.'s bailout of the banks was misbegotten, but as a temporary loan to the banks to protect their liquidity while they garnered other loans, it was defensible, at least in the tradition of a country where we've decided that we need an organization like the Federal Reserve. There was also a good chance those loans would be repaid at some point, which they now have been. There's no chance whatsoever that the auto company loans will ever be repaid. American taxpayer, BOHICA.

Why The Wait???

Obama should just shred the Constitution, dissolve both Chambers of Congress, permanently retire the Supreme Court, nullify all state's Constitution, erase all state boundaries, nationalize everything, etc., and be done with it.

He governs by fiat and wants us to drive Fiats, except if we "choose" models made by Government Motors.

He is a tyrant and a Robert Mugabe, especially when it comes to debaunching the nation's currency.


Frankly, he needs to tread lightly because kings, dictators and tyrants usually meet untimely ends.

Not worth saving
Until the Chrysler non decision, I thought the Supreme Court was worth saving - no more. Let the Obama thugocracy appoint whatever garbage he chooses to the court, it no longer makes a difference.

Further

Obama has appointed a 31 year-old Yale Law School dropout, with no economic, business, manufacturing or automotive experience to head HIS Automotive Task Force. Brian Deese's only work in the real world (if you can call his stint that) is the period that he spend working for two "think tanks", one of which was funded by Soros.

Obama's Car Tsar, Steve Rattner, has ZERO experience in the automotive industry and cannot even be found. He did not even show up in the recent Congressional hearing.

Obama has named Edward E. Whitacre Jr., the former head of AT&T, to be the Chairman of the Board of Government Motors. Whitacre is a stooge and has acted as such in the past. He has even gone on the record as saying that he knows nothing about cars.


Mr. ZerO had a team of zeroes doing his dirty work.

Correction To 10:05 pm
Mr. ZerO HAS a team of zeroes doing his dirty work.

Another Blood Shoots Out Of Eyes Duo

#1) The IRS is considering taxing, as your personal income, 25% of your work-related cellphone usage, including, without limitation, incoming calls and text messages.

#2) Obama believes that he can generate $650bn to put towards HIS healthcare program by prohibiting the Federal government from paying US hospitals.


It is about time we familiarize ourselves with the lyrics of L'Internationale.

Little gray houses for you and me, but not for the Establishment.

If the TeaParty can't capitalize on this
And start our takeover of Congress then we obviously don't care or don't care enough to organize. There are numerous alternative media and some pmm (Propaganda Media Machine aka msm)that actually question the fiscal sanity of these approaches but for the most its couched in sour grape terms and of course everyone knows, "we won!"

We must realize that everyone under the age of 45 was in high school when Reagan's boom ended Carter's misery. And the elder crowd has a boocoo of tree huggers and old hippies that don't trust government unless its run by tree huggers and then there's the old folks that think like conservatives but only vote Democrat. THEY DON'T KNOW WE'RE HEADED FOR DEPRESSION AND INFLATION.

So its a mountain but if we bring IT down to district by district and issue by issue we might have a chance.

No. 1 - Make sure everyone knows a Democrat will go to DC and vote like a dim because Oblaba, Peloser and Harry Fraud are dims (Country be damned, politicize and demonize)

NO MATTER WHAT THEY TELL YOU TO YOUR FACE

No. 2 - That means taxes on everything (VAT), multiplied by fuel taxes (mileage), multiplied by carbon taxes (green), multiplied by energy taxes which all be multiplied into every food and product. POCKETBOOK!POCKETBOOK! POCKETBOOK!

No. 3 - Look at every government run program, even DOD and find one that doesn't waste more than it provides. 3,4,5 times to 1 with no performance other than the direct military.

UNIVERSAL HEALTHARE WILL BE NO DIFFERENT

No. 4 – Activist judges and illegals have overstayed their welcome. If we don't start getting them accounted for and under control we are headed for pure anarchy. PERIOD END OF STORY.

Who is greater threat
to our way of life, AlQueda or US government?

Indeed.
Mr. Will, thank you for at least attempting to call the public's attention to a true constitutional crisis in this country. Unfortunately, many of us--including myself--are starting to become convinced that it is going to take a second American Revolution to fix it. Barack Obama and his minions in Washington are becoming nothing more than dictators with a good face who believe they are immune to any form of legitimate constitutional restraint. Our beloved country is on the verge of becoming an abomination of everything our framers intended.

Joel- De Oppresso Liber
It seems to me that the very first phrase you quoted, under Section 2, is where SCOTUS is granted jurisdiction. I agree with you that Marbury v. Madison was wrongly decided and has been a thorn in our side ever since. However, to some extent, we must work as peaceably as possible within the framework currently accepted by most people. The SCOTUS could have decided to hear a challenge to Obama's eligibility but they chose not to do so, I submit because they feared the truth. If the Court HAD taken the case, and HAD determined Obama is ineligible, then they would have had to go where no Court has ever gone before and they were afraid to step up and do the right thing.

I agree with you, basically. The Court has overreached its authority many times in the past. However, given that the Court is wont to do so, and the executive and legislative branches are completely corrupt, there is no place left to turn, short of armed revolt.

INDEPENDENCE DAY TEA PARTY !

The 4TH OF JULY 2009 !

Had Enough Yet ?

Walk The Walk !

Dear Tim in PA
I do not mean to be unkind, but a Tea Party is nothing more than a circle-jerk with likeminded people. Everyone is shouting for someone else to DO SOMETHING! They all agree they are right, something needs to be done, then they go home and cook burgers and play Cornhole...

This is our government
Conservative, liberal or any other is this a representative government.

CZARS? How the he!! do Americans allow Czars, with this kind of control? You can say it started with the imperial Bush presidency. But let's stop there. Do we accept it. Congress avoids making decisions ie. abortion and have sent these decisions to the courts. Now presidents feel they no longer need Congress or the courts.

Look at the government's answer to the banks being to large to fail. We now have an investment firm with more investment assets than the federal reserve, Black Rock. Bank of America was forced to take over Merrill Lynch instead of divesting and paying smaller companies to take over portions dependent on the risk the take over company would want to invest in.

Chrylser was not taken over by Fiat it is majority owned by the UNION. The bond holders who invest with the intention of gaining safety in exchange LOWER return on the investment were screwed. What happens to all those workers booted out because of the closing of plants? Do they get a portion of stock in compensation?

We have a political activist group, not the AMA, Haliburton or the national rifle association but Acorn directly receiving our tax money.

TraitorBill - Who is Greater Threat?

A fair reading of history makes it crystal clear that the greatest threat to human beings in recorded history has been the local potentate, warlord, or whatever else has passed for government where those people live.

Our 230 year Experiment is devolving to the primitive state humans have tolerated across most of human history, a process that started during the Progressive Movement of the latter 19th century. We are noticing now because the acceleration of notoriously unlawful behavior by the State is too extreme to ignore as isolated aberrations.

The political class denigrates those of us who take notice of these phenomena, for fear we upset their apple carts.

Jefferson was painfully aware of the risks when he wrote, "The basis of our government being the opinion of the people, the very first object should be to keep that right:...Cherish therefore the spirit of our people, and keep alive their attention. Do not be too severe upon their errors, but reclaim them by enlightening them. If once they become inattentive to the public affairs, you and I, and Congress, and Assemblies, judges and governors shall all become wolves."

Tea, anyone?

usual excellent posts from Denise
...as usual, such as @ 10:05, 9:54, 1:59.

An urban myth: GM does not make cars people want to buy. Fact--> GM and Toyota sold the SAME number of cars last year.

Why does Toyota thrive while GM went under (despite many $ billions of taxpayer funds)?

Strangling and crippling UAW labor costs at GM and Chrysler--> UAW workers make $150k/year all-in... for a H.S. degree and little-to-no job skills... they make half as much at Toyota here in America, yet line up for those jobs. The UAW has killed the Golden Goose, and is NOW simply moving on to bleed taxpayers.

The unions OWN the ObaMessiah! It is STUNNING to dismiss secured creditors in favor of unsecured claimants--> like the UAW.

The Chosen One is effectively subverting B/R law. Unions have killed the big 3, and they (teachers, public service workers, hospital service) have bankrupted Mexifornia-- which the REST OF US will ALSO have to bail out.

When you torpedo the rightful claims of bond holders, then future investors will be dissuaded from buying corporate bonds of any remotely troubled company-- which might serve to ASSURE further trouble! One reason that Ford is not yet on the brink is that it took on new debt (such as bonds) awhile back.

Federal workers already make TWICE what private workers earn; state and local workers make 40% more-- both groups of guvment workers are unionized.

Unions are ruining our efficiency and bleeding us dry-- killing the Golden Geese.

http://www.bankaholic.com/finance/lou-dobbs-federal-employe es-earn-twice-as-much-as-private-workers/
http://www.usatoday.com/money/workplace/2009-04-09-compensa tion_N.htm

Hoaquatch - tea ..
Beg to differ. There is serious work to be done in building public opinion and making a concrete demonstration of wide-spread support for resistance to the ursupations of the Statists. By itself, this is not sufficient, but it is nevertheless necessary.

Some of our countrymen need the comfort of company before they are willing to voice their opinions and stand up in opposition to emerging autocrats. Let's give them that company - it doesn't cost much in the long run.

Hosquatch don't make fun. it's beneath u
Do you believe any protest is worthwhile? You don't think drawing attention to the people's outrage is important? Also where does the basis for strategy come from? I for one think the Tea Parties are effective not only in expressing outrage, but it in finding identity. The conservative movement (Tea Parties) haven't found themselves or an effective strategy, but the alternative is worse. Which is what conservatives have always done: give their power to Washingtonian Republicans who shameless squander it. This process isn't perfect, but it's exactly what the disenfranchise need. A grassroot movement, where they can feel empowered and encouraged. It's step one. Hopefully the first among many.

Bud and Jason
I sincerely hope, and pray, that you two are correct and I am wrong!

I have attended a Tea Party and the spirit was excellent, but the step to action is presently missing. I am just getting impatient as I see my country go down the tubes a little more every day.

I commend you for your patience. I just hope it does not take the sleeping masses too long to awaken!

Joel
I am not a lawyer, but under Supreme Court's ability to regulate interstate commerce it could force GM and Chrysler to alter their bankruptcy. I believe Indiana is representing it's citizens it what it sees as a clear violation of its (and the United States) property rights laws (The State not its citizens filed the lawsuit). If they go after it that way it wouldn't expanded an already too bloated Supreme Court. Of course, it is always about the ruling and not about the cases.

TARP I and II
TARP I and II were written solely by Democrats.

End of story.

They were passed through Congress by left-leaning Democrats and three leftist Republicans.

Bush signed the bill because he believed that he had to oppose Capitalism to save Capitalism.

The present circumstances are a direct result of poor policies of the Democrats.

Hosquatch !

How do think many movements start ?

To give some perspective,look up what percent of the Colonists actually engaged The Great British Military in The War Of Independence ?

Remember ,Americans vote their wallets .

Americans are Consumer/Worker/Investors ,who are agitated and distrustful of Big Government burning through their Force Confiscated Tax Money and throwing America into World Class Debt.

Lead,Follow or Get The Hell Out Of The Way,Talker !

INDEPENDENCE TEA PARTY REBELLION !

THE 4TH OF JULY 2009 !

Walk The Walk !

Oracle1

Thank you.

In appreciation
For your strong voice here, thanks Denise.
======================


St. Denis In Obama's Red America wrote:- 2:17 AM EST
Keep The Change & Talent Scout

All of that which you write mimics my own personal political stance.

I am a fiscally-conservative CONSTITUTIONIST without party affiliation.


Keep up the great work!
=======================

Politics of both parties is destroying the fundamentals of good government.

The people must take the government back out of the hands of those corrupt actors, image worshipers.

The very word Tsar offends the **** out of me, and under this crook in the WH there is more opportunity to get a job as a "Czar" than there is any other occupation.

This man obama is the anti everything American in the rule of law and Constitution.

He is more dangerous to America than all the islamic terrorists in the world

War On ObamaCare
Did you watch the morning shows this morning? If not, let me give you a little recap.

Senator Christopher Dodd (D-CT) stated he is against taxing healthcare benefits, the governmental option, and restricting the choices available by patients.

Plus, read how the business community is united and has declared war on ObamaCare here:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/elections/2009/06/14/govern ment-health-care-derail-cooperation-hopes/

And, see how BOTH Senators from Illinois may now be in trouble here:

http://hotair.com/archives/2009/06/13/durbin-cashed-out-on- inside-information-sun-times/


Thus, GM gets to foist its healthcare liabilities on taxpayers, the UAW reaps a windfall, and unions will grow since more hospital workers will become unionized.

Total disregard for individual rights
The Obama federal govt's forced preferential treatment of certain groups at the expense of individual property rights has taken the United States of America back to the European Middle Ages.



Chuck
"Has scathing contempt for Bush but, mysteriously....Curious."

You relish when Clinton and Carter fumble but remain mysteriously silent under Republican malfeasance.

I give Ronald Reagan a hearty job well done in having the 51 American hostages, held at the US embassy in Tehran, returned home safely.

However, he made a big mistake by having 241 U.S. Marines used as hostages in Beirut, Lebanon in October, 1983.

A bomb-laden truck, driven by a Shia Iran-sponsored terrorist drove into the U.S Marine base and killed 241 Americans. The Commander-in-Chief had given the order that the sentries protecting the base were forbidden, by formal "rules of engagement", to not have BULLETS in their rifles. A colossal blunder and we simply left Lebanon a few months later.


The problem with Marbury-Madison
We have allowed the progressives in the legal field to define the impact of that case is where the real problem is.

In NO uncertain terms did Jefferson of Congress believe that case had anything to do with empowering the Supreme Court over the other two branches of Government.

Judge Marshall never came close to saying a word that would justify the lies by the legal profession today.

The enemies of the US Constitution have chosen to use the legal system itself to overthrow the legal system American Government is Founded in.

Marbury-Madison was decided correctly as to the written law.

Judge Marshall did not invent anything new in that single case which was LIMITED to that ONE MAN.

That case went no further than deciding if Marbury was entitled to a job in the Government of Thomas Jefferson.

That is the only and entire issue of that case, one man, one case.

It does not GIVE NEW POWER to the Supreme Court the US CONSTITUTION does NOT GIVE.

That case has simply been twisted and hi-jacked by some enemies of American Law to say something Judge Marshall himself NEVER SAID OR THOUGHT.

I challenge anyone to find language in that case that gives the Supreme Court the Authority to be the only ones to decide what is Constitutional and what is not.

It is NOT in there.

Only on a case by case TRYING OF FACT under WRITTEN LAW is the only time the Court has the power to decide what is Constitutional.

Otherwise they are maggots to create law from the bench


Thomas Jefferson Pt. 1
(Plus 1 by Mark Twain that is SO relevant today)


DID THOMAS JEFFERSON HAVE A CRYSTAL BALL?

IT HAS BEEN said; the greatest volume of brainpower in one place occurred when Jefferson dined alone...
HOW DID JEFFERSON KNOW??????


(On NYC, Detroit, LA, Houston, etc., ad infinitum)
When we get piled upon one another in large cities, as in Europe, We shall become as corrupt as Europe.
Thomas Jefferson

(On government "entitlements)
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those Who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson



(Obama's TRILLION $ + deficits. Not to mention Bush, et al)
It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world.
Thomas Jefferson


Thomas Jefferson Pt 2


(Government-run health care)
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the Government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson


(Big government, expansion of govt.)
My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government.
Thomas Jefferson


(2nd Amendment rights)
No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.
Thomas Jefferson

(2nd Amendment rights)
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
Thomas Jefferson

(On the occasion of the Shays rebellion - a tax & debt revolt)
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
Thomas Jefferson

(Public funded abortion, for one, subsidies to AARP, etc.)
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson

(The Federal Reserve)
Thomas Jefferson said in 1802:
'I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered..'

And finally, a Mark Twain truism:
(Today's "mainstream media", Obama's cheering section)
'If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed, if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed.'
-Mark Twain

talent scout
"I challenge anyone to find language in that case that gives the Supreme Court the Authority to be the only ones to decide what is Constitutional and what is not."

Well, an amendment was passed 65 years later, the 14th that does give the Supreme Court authority.

It says, "No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

It is time for you to sit down and SHUT UP!




Mr.Zippidy

Another Zippy Cut & Paste.

Do your Homework !

The Israelis were watching that Mercedes Truck and failed to notify U.S. Intelligence.

I am so sick
Of seeing CORRUPT LITTLE MINDED men lifted up WAY ABOVE their stations.

And people look up to those fools as if they are gods and not the vain men they really are.

The American System of Government and Law is not based ON MEN!

Screw all men, all men are fallible.

ALL MEN!

No man is above the LAW!
No man can take the Law and use it as his own personal tool for his bias and bigoted personal EMPATHY!

America has HYPOCRITES sitting if positions of power and people worship those clowns as if they were perfection of beauty and innocence.

What a mindless day for FREE MEN EVERYWHERE.

Justice has been relegated to obsurity! in American Justice.
Placed in exile; banished to mockery.

tim
On May 17, 1987 the USS Stark was on patrol in the Persian Gulf. On that day Saddam Hussein ordered one of his fighters to fire an Exocet missile at our American ship. The missile hit our ship and 37 Americans died from the attack.

What was Ronald Reagan's response the reader may ask? Nothing, at first. Later his response was to proceed giving Iraq even more weapons.

Can someone please let me know if this is appeasement?

Lonny

I am not a Republican and I wanted to see both GM and Chrysler go through Chapter 11. Why should I pay for losing companies indefinitely? Shoot, I am paying for Amtrak now nearly 40 years after Nixon formed it and swore that it would operate profitably after 3 years. And, Fiat is NOT the majority stockholder in Chrysler ... we are, as taxpayers.

Tough ti-tty said the kitty. I will stick to my foreign made cars.

Besides, Obama has floated the idea of bulldozing dozens of US cities, including Flint, MI. The link to the article is found on one of my earlier posts. So who cares, if he doesn't?

As Churchill Would Say

"The inherent vice of capitalism is the uneven division of blessings, while the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal division of misery."

Winston Churchill

Joel- De Oppresso Liber
It would be unlikely for me to intentionally offend you, as I most often agree with and learn from your posts. One reason I come to TH is to share and learn from contributors such as you, St. Denis, Tea Party, Anne in PA, Gunny, Seawolf, etc.

Going back to the eligibility/birth certificate question, it would seem to me that ANY American voter should have the "standing" before the courts to bring suit for resolution of that question, since every action of the executive branch of the federal government affects the life and liberty of every American. Yet, some lower court ruled that only Congress had standing, on ONE PARTICULAR DAY after the election, to challenge Obama's eligibility...which is absurd on its face. That ruling should be appealable all of the way to the Supreme Court. And, in my mind, it is the DUTY of SCOTUS to put that issue to rest with a final decision. Unfortunately, the lower courts have devolved into sites of political activism, with party-loyal judges, and the Supreme Court is AWOL.

We have few options remaining, other than taking direct action ourselves.

man worshiper
Lonny

You puke

Land of liberty
I am just not sure that the reasons my family came to this country 45 years ago will still exist in a few more years. It may be time to look for another place to go. I know my father was very disillusioned prior to his death. I can only imagine what he would think given all that has taken place in the last couple of years of the Bush administration and since Obama took office. The thought that the administration can just change contracts and take property rights away on what seems to be a whim is atrocious, to me at least. But then I respect peoples property, I don't just feel that I should get it because they have a lot more than I do and they can afford it. I don't know where this mentality comes from, but I know damn well it wasn't what this country was built on.

Tim
(I am using my wife's computer and for some reason I can't log into my own account so please forgive the wrong handle)

Hosquatch
You mention the issue of Standing.

Think about what the Court has done with this Court invented Doctrine.

Denied American Citizens their rights to Petition Government as the 1st Amendment demands for each and everyone of us.

YET they are now giving STANDING to FOREIGN ENEMY COMBATANTS the RIGHTS THEY DENY AMERICAN CITIZENS

Fundamental Foundations
Stealing is done by evil men.

Anyone who steals is a thief.

Thievery is always wrong, never is stealing a right.
Not from nature or morality.

Thieves are crooks.
Thieves are to be punished by the Law.
Thieves are not to be rewarded, but are to be punished if any society on earth wants to live in peace and harmony with one another.

Thievery from Government is as evil if its done by a Bank Robber.

If we prosecute bank robbers, its a given we prosecute the thieves who abuse government power to steal.

Obama is a classic thief

The courts are no different
Every man-made institution acts to preserve itself. The court system has been so designed and ritualized as to make it an exclusive club for enlightened juris doctors and judges. It is NOT a place where justice is impartially rendered. Try going into a courtroom without an attorney to represent you. That is, in the legal community, a breach of their fraternal etiquette. You do not know the correct words to use, or the proper forms to fill out, to operate at their lofty level.

So, Talent Scout, you are correct. All Americans should have "standing" to make their case before a court. However, we are unwashed and unfit for the fraternity.

Sad but true
talent scout

Your comments are very sad, buy o so true. I fear that this country will be no better than many that are run by third rate dictators and tyrants pretty soon. I have watched this country go from probably the best country on earth, to just another place to live, in just the 45 years since we came here from England.

I don't think that either of the two main parties are really any better than each other. I prefer Republicans a little more over Democrats, but there isn't enough difference to really matter.

Tim

More about thievery
You can add GW Bush to the list of thieves in Government.

I am today and yesterday apolitical when it comes to stealing.

GW Bush took money that did not belong to him and gave it way.
He also gave it away to a rats hole in his African AIDS theft.

No law in America gives him or any other President the right to take from this country and hand it over to foreigners, let alone our own citizens.

This is not about Obama or GW Bush though.
Its about the policy of theft from the entire American Government of today

talent scout
"Thievery is always wrong,"

Were George Bush, Ben Bernanke and Hank Paulson, all Republicans by the way, acting as thieves when they requested $700 billion ("quick and clean") for the banking industry last fall?

Again, For Intellectually-Impaired Zap
Zap, What Little You Know!

Only half of TARP was distributed under the Bush Administration. The remainder was spread around by the Obama Administration.

Bush is retired.

Who helped craft the AIG bailout? Geithner

Who was Al Gore's partner in the carboncrap scam? The Naked Emperor Hank Paulson

Where did Paulson go later? Goldman-Sachs

Who was the ONLY non-governmental representative present in the TARP meetings? Paulson's successor at Goldman-Sachs.

What is Bernanke's nickname? Helicopter Ben

Who is to be named the next Chairman of the Federal Reserve? Helicopter Ben, much to the chagrin of Lawrence Summers

Do yourself a favor and read "Opium For Opportunists".

It will explain how opportunists know no party.


If you believe that most of us supported Bush's mortgage bailouts, Medicare Part B, TARP and auto bailouts, then you are delusional.

Heck! I did not even support Bush's decision to declare warfare in Iraq.

Zap, get over the BDS
You make us question your sanity with your incessant yammering about Bush and the Republicans! Get over it. Whatever wrong things Bush did do not make Obama's sins any lesser.

I voted for Bush, twice. I think he did a decent job for the first six years, before he started drinking the globalist koolaid. His last two years were a definite disappointment.
He will be judged as a mediocre president. His greatest sin, in my mind, was in laying the groundwork for Obama to trample the Constitution.

However...Obama LIED at the VERY MOMENT he assumed office. "I promise to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States..." were words he NEVER intended to honor. He has set about, at a furious pace, to undermine and destroy the Constitution, and the country it defines, from his very first moment as Resident of the United States! He hopes to complete that destruction before real Americans wake up and say "NO!"

And, One Other Thing

While Goldman-Sachs did not receive TARP money directly, it did receive $8bn from AIG.

Mr.Zippidy Doo Dah !

You're A Military History Buffoon !

Do Your homework !

http://eightiesclub.tripod.com/id344.htm

And one more thing, Zap
I am a Conservative, not a Republican. I got so disgusted with Bush and the Republicans in Congress that I changed my voter registration to INDEPENDENT.

There IS a small difference between the parties.
Democrats crave power because they want to do evil and destructive things and control other people's lives. Republicans crave power because they want to be part of an elite, collegial country club and enjoy the trappings.
That is why Republicans are fine with being in the minority, as long as Democrats throw them a bone occasionally.

So, see Zap. We Conservatives do not worship Bush, unlike the Liberals, who DO worship Obama.

I say, a pox on both parties. We really need to start over from scratch!

agree with Denise
I thought the Iraq war was a mistake because I saw who was pulling Dubya's strings (Wolfy, Feith, Perle, Libby, Bolton, Abrams); those militant neoCONS (Zionists) were simply effecting their PNAC stratagem.

And GM and Chrysler SHOULD have gone into normal B/R to wipe out the enervating/crippling union and assure fair and legal treatment of secured creditors, BUT the UAW owns Obama and the Left, so the law was subverted for the bloodsuckers.

Fully 50% of those now in unions are guvment employees (teachers, bureaucrats, postal service, hospital workers) and they are bankrupting places like Mexifornia. unions have declined steadily in industry because they suck blood until they kill the hosts.

The mortgage bailouts came about because the LEFT had demanded that lenders make sub-prime loans to those not credit-worthy... the simple truth is that some people cannot borrow ANY sum, much less a big one.

Is It Even Constitutional?

No. Further, Paulson explicitly stated that TARP did not cover car companies.

Fortunately, TARP expires at the end of the year. Be sure to let your representatives know that if they renew such cr@p, then they will commit political suicide.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/0 6/12/AR2009061203379.html?nav=rss_opinion/columns

How we got to fascism
We can blame Obama all we want, and justifiably so, but our credibility is nothing if we don't also blame Bush and the many Republicans for what has happened. It's not just Obama, Pelosi, and Reid. It's people like Lindsey Graham, George W. Bush (and Dick Cheney and others in that adminisration), and John McCain.

If we just listened to Ron Paul this wouldn't have happened. He said this was going to, this is why people like me supported him but all the neocons in the Republican PArty could focus on was defending te war in Iraq and interventionism. Do you neocons finally see where this logically leads us? We couldn't swallow our pride because admitting that our foreign policy was wrong may somehow imply the Democrats are right, when in reality foreign policy hardly changes from administration to administration, regardless of party. Is Obama doing anything different from Bush? The Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilateral Commission dominates foreign and to some degree domestic policy for both parties. Members range from Gergen to Tim Geithner to Henry Kissinger who gave Obama his first job out of college. These people work together with the globalist bankers who dominate the private Federal Reserve, and certain corporations. This is how we've hit fascism, and why socialism is here too. It's been going on for a long time. We have to stop playing in the false left-right, democrat-republican paradime and look at the true power structures.

Lonny
Republicans didn't want GM to fail, they wanted them to go thru bankruptcy. Thru bankruptcy, they could renegotiate their union contracts and get back to solvency.

Obama has allowed the union to continue its crippling ways. Now GM will fail, after fifty billion dollars of aid (basically to the unions, who will kick it back to Obama). GM will probably go into a real bankruptcy in five or ten years and finally the union will go down.

Descent Into Totalitarianism
The irony of our descent into totalitariansim is that a significant portion of this country welcomes it.

In this regard, the U.S. in 2009 is no different than Germany and Italy in the 1930s. Both then and now, THE PEOPLE chose their ruler, empowered him with complete mastery over themselves, and then wildly cheered him on, as he eliminated his opponents and became a law unto himself.

Then, as now, the sheeple renounced their freedom in the pathetic hope that their newly empowered man-god would wield his power for their benefit.

We will have our day of reckoning, just as they did, and it won't be pretty. I expect that as the dismantling of the rule of law and the rights of contact continue, economic activity will shrivel to the point where mass unemployment and widespread civil unrest results. Greater demands for action will result in greater overreach by the governemnt which will only accelerate the process.

Add to this the proliferation of rogue state challenges to the morally bankrupt and economically crippled West, such that the global political situation spirals into widespread warfare. As it stands, there is already an assumption that the U.S., Europe and their allies lack the will to physically intercede to counter an act of naked aggression. The more the West begs rogue regimes to "talk through our disagreements," the more disdainful these regimes become towards us, and the more emboldened they become to act against us.

No basis in Law
Or common sense and sound reason of sane minds to say:
"too big to fail"

What an abortion of words!

Makes no more sense than to say too small to succeed.

Its absolute MADNESS.

We have people in Government today who are CURSED by the Creator for their sins against all sound reason and law.

Hypocrites supreme and degenerates of blue ribbon fame.

They have names like Barney Frank, a man so wicked he stinks up the entire nation with his filthy corrupt speaking.

America cannot escape judgment, its the law of nature these fools cannot amend or abolish.

Problem is, all of us will suffer in one degree or another for allowing idiots to set policy of theives

Judicial Activism?
I disagree with Mr Will in that the court doing what it is paid to do is "activism". As he points out, there is nothing in the law to authorize the executive to take the actions it has been taking, and the Supreme Court should have acted in the interest of the law and taken the case. Doing nothing may have been more passive than active; however you slice it, the court failed, and there is no control on the Congress or the Executive.

Losing Our Will to Exist as a Nation
Citizen of the world and POTUS, B. Hussein Obama represents the self-loathing face of liberal America. With every new act of diplomatic groveling abroad that he engages in; with every act of disdain that he exhibits toward our constitution and laws, he provides further evidence of his willingness to drag this nation into the abyss.

Even sadder than knowing that such a man is now in control of this nation's destiny is the knowledge that he was put there by the tens of millions of our countrymen who agree with his final solution to the problem of American dominance.

OogyWoggy

Pay attention. Most of the posters on TH (that are anything other than Democratic) did not approve of TARP. And, for it to morph into something as ridiculous as bailing out non-financial companies is unconstitutional. Under the present rules, as creatively read, I could file the documentation tomorrow declaring myself a bank and would be eligible for a bailout if I declare myself insolvent on Tuesday.

SandMan... Self-Loathing Liberals

Yes, we do find Liberal-Democrats to be self-destructive in nature. They unite under a broad spectrum of Personality Disorders and Splintering egos.

Most Liberal Democrats -when they speak to truth- will admit to their: dysfunctional upbringings, feelings of being unloved, inner emptiness, and restless desire to escape reality.

I suppose this all comes from a personal sense of Worthlessness developed in childhood. And their adult drives and desires become a cover for those feelings of inadequacy. A permanent faux Public-Persona so to speak.

Maybe some day an more effective therapy will be developed to unwind this awful complex of (often hidden) despair.

Until then, we can only Love our Liberal Brothers and wish them the best on their journey out of their darkness.

Why are there any people in our
government that are not Constitutionalists? Why do they even live here?

Hey Zap
Do you support or oppose the following? Now, don't answer with Bush did this or Reagan did that just a yes or no and an explanation of why you do or do not support each of the following:

1) $700 billion TARP II.

2) The agreement to give the UAW 50% of GM.

3) The ballooning of the deficit to $2 to $2.5 trillion this year.

4) Replacement of CEOs by Obama.

5) Closing of Gitmo.

6) Giving abortion funding to abortion in Mexico and other foreign countries.

Now remember you can't say anything about any previous action. Just yes or no and why you support or don't support each of the above.

zapadoodat
Why is it only Republicans that are blamed for the war in Iraq when Democrats supported military action almost unanimously? Do you always try to cloud an issue that is inconvenient to you with lies and distortions of another issue? Quick who said "Saddam Hussein is a tyrannical dictator who has shown he will use chemical and biological weapons on his own people and he must be stopped to preserve stability in the region."? You wouldn't like the answer.

Hey Oogy Woggy (6/14, 2:02 pm)
Get a life. Ron Paul is a nutburger; so is anyone who thinks he had a chance in hell of becoming POTUS.

Tom
Who said, "If we do not invade Iraq now, he will have mushroom clouds over America?"

Perhaps phony Conservatives, like yourself, have uttered, "America is in the fight of our lives...America is at a cross roads and the stakes are high, maybe even our lives."

Or, "The Democrats don't seem to even acknowledge that we are at war with a brutal throat slashing, burn people alive enemy that wants to destroy us. They'd pull our troops away from fighting in foreign countries with the inevitable result of the fight moving to our own homeland."

But, truth be told, the only way you are willing to pay for this engagement with the enemy is to hold onto your precious tax cut and raising the debt ceiling on the national credit card.

The War in Iraq, a social-engineering project, costs $12 billion a month. The cost per American is $40 a month for the past 6 years. If your family had actually been paying this bill from the get-go, your attitude would have been to 'cut and run' four years ago.

It's time to stop the 'drama queening' and if you think we should be in Iraq, and 'Operation Enduring Freedom' has national security value, then PAY for it, NOW!



h20shier
As a big time supporter of the 100 year social-engineering project in Iraq, have you ever been willing to pay for the war?

How would you have paid for the $120 billion yearly tab for the past seven years?

Do NOT dodge!

Zapdoodat
You seem to know so much; you must be a socialist. Thank God (Oops, sorry to offend you) there are still some constitutionalists in this facsist state of Massachusetts, otherwise your kind would be taking over under the guise of tolerance.

MaCom
"you must be a socialist."

No, I'm not a Republican. Republicans are ruthless wealth-redistributors. Should I give you some examples?

The judiciary should do its job
The judiciary should be active, or engaged, and not passive. But it should do so for the purpose of protecting the inalienable rights of the individual. It should not simply rubber stamp that which is passed by Congress and signed by the President--regardless of whether the Republicans or Democrats are in power. The idea that the judiciary should simply defer to whatever Congress and the President serve up is just as abominable as the notion that the judiciary should make special allowances for the government when it attempts to violate the rights of the individual.

judges on the take
THE SUPREME COURT ATTEMPTED TO PREVENT THE APPEARANCE OF JUDGES BEING ON THE TAKE. WAIT UNTIL A CONSERVATIVE SUPREME COURT JUSTICE DECLARE A LEBERAL JUDGE DISQUALIFIED BECAUS OF HIS CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTOR HAVING A TRIAL IN HIS COURT. LIBERALS WILL HAVE A FIT, JUSTICE GINSBERGH SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO HAVE ANY JUDGEMENT INVOLVING THE ACLU, NOR ANY OF THE CIVIL RIGHTS ASSOCIATIONS. SHE WAS THEIR CHIEF COUNSEL FOR YEARS AND WROTE OPINIONS ABOUT LEGALIZING PEDOPHILIA, RAPE AND OTHER SEXUAL CRIMINAL ACTIONS.

Zap
You know most of the people on TH are conservatives and most found great fault with the GWB administration, most do not support re-distribution or large government. Yet you are here day in and day out with your one sided partisan arguments that make you look
silly really. You have some grasp of events and you are seemingly intelligent, but you constantly tell part of the truth and spin the rest, you never answer a fairly asked question. If you toned down the partisan clutter in your approach, it would be much more productive.


This is how rot spreads
Responding to this hack.

zapdoodat

Think of him as a bad apple and just toss his stupid posts aside

US Debt Equals $1mn Per Family
David Walker, the former US Comptroller General, says that the federal debt level is approaching $55 trillion and if you add in the what is owed on the state and local levels -- plus personal household debt -- it adds up to $75 trillion in obligations.

Walker, who now heads the Peter G. Peterson Foundation, named for the co-founder of the Blackstone Group, warned that without fiscal restraint, Uncle Sam may be guaranteeing that our future is not as prosperous as our past.

At the $75 trillion deficit level a family of four owes $1 million, he said.

Earlier this year Walker wrote on Politico.com: "Social Security and Medicare alone are already underfunded by about $44 trillion, or $146,000 per American, in today's dollars, and this number is growing on auto pilot every year by about $2 trillion, or $6,600 per American."


And, the majority of Americans (57%) wants TARP repealed now and 53% list out-of-control governmental spending as their foremost concern.

the only issue that matters to
zapadoodat

is the score:

Democrats vs. Republicans

Never mind what's best for the country. Any past mistakes and shortcomings by Republicans justify all that Obama's doing, right or wrong.

Not enough people died on 9-11
A friend said it well: not enough innocent Americans died on 9-11 for the Democrats to really take notice.

And of course, then it will be America's fault, just as it was on 9-11.

Dems won't feel that stopping terror-supporting states is all that important until at least 10,000, maybe 20,000 Americans die.

Who knows, with millions of dollars available, maybe state supported scientists in North Korea or Iran/Syria will develop an AIDS virus that can be transmitted by mosquitoes, or just a plain, everyday Ebola that spreads like wildfire.

It is interesting that democrats, who live in a world of theory, refuse to believe such is possible. But, by God, carbon is definitely causing global warming and ethanol is good for America.

Switch paragraphs, please
Sorry. Please swap paragraphs two and three.

I hate it when that happens

Watch your investments
Democrats don't give a rip about the rule of law. They'll eat their own- just like they did the Indiana Teachers Retirement and a host of others. It's all about cronyism, just like a Third World country.

When are Americans going to wake up to the travesty of the statists and especially the Obama Administration?

It's appalling.

David
Exactly right. And isn't it interesting that the Left almost NEVER will criticize their own.

Criticism of GWB was all over TH before the election, for good reason. You won't see that about BHO on the looney left sites.

Libs come to this site because there are actually thinking people here - even though they won't admit that deep down they know we're right

David
"most found great fault with the GWB administration,"

I would call it quiet indifference, other than some blog posts.

How many Tea Parties took place when George W. Bush was president?

How many Tea parties were there when the Republicans added, yet another entitlement spending program on top of all the other entitlement programs back in 2003?

St. Denis In Obama's Red America
"US Debt Equals $1mn Per Family"

As I noted on another blog, you have very poor math skills.

If you go out from now to ten thousand years from now, then the US debt per family is one trillion dollars. Now, you can be even more scared.

David
"Yet you are here day in and day out with your one sided partisan arguments that make you look
silly really."

I think I am complementing this site on behalf of the conservative cause. Republicans talk the talk, but do not walk the walk.

They are for Big government, not small.

They are for rigged markets, not free.

They are for huge central government when power in DC, and small central government when not. Big Whoop.

Their entire view of 'Responsibility' is to blame the most convenient Democrat.

They are phony.

zap

You are an idiot. It is not my math. I identified the gentleman who made the statement.

How much would you venture to guess how much of the debt is attributable to each American.

I Hate When That Happens...

Zap, how much would you venture to guess is the amount of debt attributable to each American?

zapdoodat
"You relish when Clinton and Carter fumble but remain mysteriously silent under Republican malfeasance."

Even if that WERE true, how does that justify YOUR inconsistency on Obama?

Chuck

Zap will not answer. Everything a Republican does is wrong, but when a Democrat does the same and more it is BRILLIANT!

St. Denis
I usually don't respond to the obvious cult members, but I'm bored tonight.

Thanks for the heads up.

Zap
I knew you wouldn't answer. You are a coward and will never criticize a Democrat.

St. Denis is right in her post #142. To answer your question. One of the few things the federal government is responsible for is for the common defense. The $120 billion you state could easily be found in all of the programs the federal government is not responsible for but still insist on doing: SS, Medicare, Medicade, Welfare, DOE, HHS to name a few. If the war required a special tax I would have supported that because at the time before the war most people thought Saddam had WMD. You know hindsight is always 20/20 and it is easier to see when mistakes have been made in the past.

The question now is not should have we gone to war but what do we do at this point in time? You can't change the past but what is the best part forward.

Zap
Now answer mine. I bet you will not.

I heard
another government giveaway program that could be cut. The government is paying people $3000 to trade in their old cars for new cars. To get the $3000 the new car must 4 mpg more than their current car. Where is this money coming from? Is this a legitimate job of the government to bribe people to buy a new car and to subsidize it in the process?

h20shier
"The $120 billion you state could easily be found in all of the programs the federal government is not responsible for but still insist on doing: SS, Medicare, Medicade, Welfare, DOE, HHS to name a few."

Yet another blowhard statement, from yet another blowhard. If Republicans are for small government, as they say, then how many times did they cut $120 billion from any department's budget when George Bush(R) was President, Denny Hastert(R) was Speaker of the House, and Trent Lott(R) and Bill Frist(R) were Senate Majority Leaders?

St. Denis...
The National Debt Clock, at least the version I saw a few days ago, showed about $37,000/citizen of national debt. Cripes, that's scary enough, but you have a figure approaching 1 million per. This comes from adding in unfunded obligations/mandates in the futre, into the calculation, correct? Such as social security, medicaid, gov't. pensions, etc. plus debt service on our debt? Please clarify.

All I can say is, if your figures are correct, let the government try to collect that money, or even a large portion of it now, and that'll be the spark to the tinder, what finally sets people off.

Zapdoodat (#10) wrote,

"St. Denis In Obama's Red America
"US Debt Equals $1mn Per Family"

Zap, you'd better go back to the drawing board. Whether our debt load is a 'mere' $37,000/person or the much higher figure of 1M, either way you should be concerned, very much so. Are you wealthy enough to just dip into your wallet and hand over 37K to the IRS or the feds? If so, bully for you, but most of us aren't. Me, even if I had it, I'd rather burn it than see Obama get his hands on it. So if I was you, I'd spend a lot less time worrying about who to blame (yes, the GOP was to blame, too), and more about pulling our fat out of the fire. How old are you? I ask because if you are young, you are going to get stuck with the tab for BHO's "socialist adventures.' Think about that the next tax day, why don't you?

Land of Liberty wrote, "I am just not sure that the reasons my family came to this country 45 years ago will still exist in a few more years. It may be time to look for another place to go."

I hear you, if you find someplace worth running to, let us know, OK? I hear the Aussies are good people who still understand freedom...

zapdohimer
Well, the Democrats own Congress and the White House right now. They took the Republicans' irresponsible spending and raised it to new levels unseen in the history of the world. We will have in one year a deficit equal to Bush's and the Republicans 6 years. How does you justify that? Oh wait, I know, Bush did it so it is ok to double what he did. No wait, quadruple what he did and it is alright with you.

You are the blowhard. Have the Republicans cut government when they were in charge? No, I thought that was one of the reasons they were kicked out - overspending. Did I support those spending increases? No. Do you support the massive increase over Bush's irresponsible spending? Judging by your silence and refusal to answer the questions posed to you then that must mean you do support all of it.

GB61
The national debt clock only shows the current U.S. debt. It does not take into account that the Social Security trust fund has a balance of $0. The trust fund was supposed to pay for future retirees. However, every penny of that money has been spent. Currently there is $11 trillion in unfunded liabilities. For Zip, that is an actualiary figure on how long current people will live, the amount of money promised, and the amount of money available to pay those current and future retirees. One figure I saw recently for Medicare and Medicade showed there was $57 trillion short in both of those programs. Adding the national debt, SS, Medicare, and Medicare we get $80 trillion divided by the 115 million families in the U.S. gives a value of roughly $695,000 per family.

Grab your pitchforks ....
.... and shake them at every TV camera that comes your way. Otherwise, you - the American people - are headed down Hugo Chavez lane, and it's a one-way street.

The Obama administration has seized crisis powers (as the WSJ aptly observed), and Congress and the courts are not going to make them give the crisis powers back once the crisis blows over. The checks and balances of the U.S. constitution (and the rule of law, for that matter) having thusly failed, the people have become the last line of defense of their own liberty.

If the people don't wake up and put the Obama administration back in its place, they'll eventually be lining up around the block to declare their undying loyalty to The One ... at the wrong end of the barrel of a gun.

It's all Obama's fault now.
Let's all end blaming the Bush Administration for the current economic problems. Our current plight is on the head of the Obama Adinistration and not George Bush. Obama has taken over the American auto industry. Rest assured Obama wants to take over as much of your life as he can. Democrats are socialists no matter what they tell you otherwise. Some don't even now it. Barney Frank wants to be known as the person who caused the biggest takeover of your real estate through the power of the mortgage purse. He denies it but actions speak louder than words. He did it, damn it. America now has more Czars than Russia ever had. Obama is now the Czar of Czars. I liken that to the Boss of Bosses. Capo de capo. Now you know

Bush did it the democrats did it
Let's not get lost in the finger pointing. We kicked the republicans out because they failed.

But, Now we have CZARS in America. We have czars! Congress has constantly failed to do it's job and left issues to the courts. Now they allow Obama to use Czars to do their job.

It is good to see that some of the libs are seeing the erosion of our representative government, though they claim it is an extension of Bush policy. Awful curious though that they would want any extension of Bush policy.

Please will some lib point out an example of Obama having reduced one line in the budget. The line by line review did not eliminate having Air Force One take him to Europe and another take the wife (they could have gone together had they planned better).

Taking charge
So what happened?
Paulson took charge and Bush followed.
And Goldman Sachs was saved.
What a deal!

Don't you get it George?
Obama doesn't give a flying f*** about stupid things like "laws" and "the Constitution". His only care in the whole world is rebuilding the Berlin Wall right here in the United States!

I thought
Will's column was about presidential abuse of power. The current and previous "executive" have used fear as a lever to increase executive power. Bush created fear of terrorism and Obama followed with fear of poverty. With the help of a zombie like cult following and an all too willing media both have stolen our liberty.
The Founders created three branches of government to protect the people from abuse. Isn't it time to hold our Congress responsible? Restore the balance, refuse to confirm activist judges and demand that the president work within the confines of the Constitution. We are at the brink and while we fight among ourselves those who would steal our liberty are planning even more surprises.

Merle
"Not very many people are considering buying an Obama car anyway. Buy a Ford instead."

In the 1870s, congress made the United States Postal Service a legal monopoly (they are the only ones who can deliver First Class mail). The reason they did this is because they realized that the USPS couldn't possibly compete with private mail carriers.

I predict that unless Government Motors starts selling cars again, that the America-hating fascists....er, I mean Democrats....will do exactly the same thing they did for the USPS and make GM a legal monopoly.

Now isn't THAT a pleasant thought. Cars built by the very same morons who can't tell the difference between Weare, New Hampshire and Were, Massachusetts.

Stop the Madness
IF people actually "got it", we would stop our world for ONE day and say, "enough!" Someone with "leadership ability" could actually get a few million people to surround WashingtonDC and stop the madness for a week. We have got to stand for something, like our Constitution, and get the zer0
WHO is totally a lawless child, OUT! Like Paulson said, "Even if you don't have the authority...and frankly I didn't...if you take charge, the people will follow". Let's gitter done!

Created the fear of terrorism??
How many reports out of the Clinton administration did they have which said terrorists are trying to develop or obtain WMD?

Were you not paying attention?

If someone blows up buildings in the middle of the largest city in the nation we haven't the right to be afraid it could happen again?

The Terrorists are real. England, Italy, Indonesia, the Sudan and here in America. This should not be an issue of political correctness.

Allen I think you missed my point.
American presidents have exploited our fears for generations. No political party has a monopoly on fear mongering. It is not in the best interest of the ruling party to actually remove the source of our fears because it diminishes their power. There is no doubt that danger lurks at every turn and that a certain amount of fear has ensured the survival of our species, but when our natural fears are magnified to the point that members of a free society willingly give up liberty to obtain safety we no longer deserve either. I am not suggesting that we ignore terrorist acts or turn a blind eye to the melt down in the financial system. What I am suggesting is that we keep the things that threaten us in perspective and control those responsible for our safety with the ballot box.
By the way, I think Bushes response to the airplane attack on the WTC and the Pentagon was inappropriate. I would have asked Congress to declare war on Saudi Arabia, given King Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz 24 hours notice and then sent one conventionally armed Cruise missile into down town Riyadh. The Obama Administration should let individuals who can’t stop charging beyond their ability to pay hang out to dry, and refused to bail out unprofitable businesses with tax payer money.

h20skier
"How does you justify that?"

The entire time the Republicans were spending you were saying, "Deficits don't matter."

Every time the Republicans created another spending plan, you cheered, "Yet another opportunity for a tax cut!"

You are the hypocrite.


To disprove this, then tell my how you would pay for the $120 billion War in Iraq for the past seven years!






h20shier
"The $120 billion you state could easily be found in all of the programs the federal government is not responsible for but still insist on doing: SS, Medicare, Medicade, Welfare, DOE, HHS to name a few."

In fact, the Republicans didn't cut anything the past eight years. They ramped up domestic spending faster than Bubba Clinton. They redistributed wealth to their constituents. They added another layer of entitlement spending. Mission Unaccomplished!

Zap
You are a coward. I asked you to answer whether or not you support several of Obama's and the Democrat's bills passed recently. Your only response is to call me a hypocrite and evade the questions.

I have not supported all of Bush's and the Republican's spending. It is good they got kicked out of office. Now, we need to do the same thing to the Democrats because they are making Bush's irresponsible spending pale by comparison. Obama's budget increases domestic spending by 12% this year. Do you support that? Oh, I know you will not answer it because it will reveal the true hyprocrite here.

Remember that the last two years the Democrats have controlled Congress and have created $2.4 trillion in debt put on the nation's credit card as you are fond of saying. This year's deficit will be $2 trillion to $2.5 trillion. Almost equal to Bush's first 6 years. Now coward, answer the questions.

i will help you, zap.
no matter what crimes the democrats commit, it is all the republicans fault. there. everything you have to say has been said. now will you please go away?

h20shier
"Now coward, answer the questions."

I think you've gotten addicted to lying and Republican KOOL-AID.

Let's flesh it out. Bush's budget was $3.1 and Hussein's was $3.5 trillion.

You and other Republican's talk about more spending and debt than the previous 200 years. It's all lies!!!


curmedgeon
"Let's flesh it out. Bush's budget was $3.1 and Hussein's was $3.5 trillion."

Let's add Bush's $700 billion TARP bailout.

Let's add Hussein's $500 billion spending from the Stimulus package.

Where's all this DEBT???

Choosing Sides
Results of the Gallup poll released today:

Those identifying themselves as Conservatives is 40%.

Moderates lose points and log in at 35%.

Way down at the end of the pile are the Liberals, who pull in a whopping 21%.

The poll also demonstrates that people are LIVID about higher taxes.

2010 predictor.

h20shier
"Remember that the last two years the Democrats have controlled Congress."

So? Are you telling me Congress controls spending?

Isn't 'Clinton Administration defense cuts' a lie. You lie about National Security when it suits you. As a matter of fact, it was the Republican-controlled Congress that did those deep defense cuts. Stand up and defend yourself!


Are we in the TWILIGHT ZONE, or what???
As Mr. Will wrote:

"Of course courts should not make policy or invent rights not stipulated or implied by statutes or the Constitution's text. But courts have no nobler function than that of actively defending property, contracts and other bulwarks of freedom against depredations by government, including by popularly elected, and popular, officials. Regarding Chrysler and GM, the ***executive branch is exercising powers it does not have*** under any statute or constitutional provision. At moments such as this, deference to the political branches constitutes dereliction of judicial duty." HEAR HEAR!!!

***Is that not USURPATION and TYRANNY???

And what's with SCOTUS? Have they too been poisoned, or infected with some virulent plague in D.C.---that masquerades in the form of the "charm" of an inept president---and renders them impotent or cowardly?

Gallup also reports
that 61% approve of Obama's job performance and 64% are dissatisfied with the State of the Union. When I looked at the list of percieved
republicans leaders previously listed it became clear what is wrong. If the Republicans ever want to lead again they either need to purge religion from the platform or find leaders who are not so morally bankrupt that they lack credibility. It would be the former that would bring me from "moderate" back to my preferred political party. 35% is a lot of voters, I wonder if other moderates feel as I do?

Who
is going to invest in either GM or Chrysler. Any investor who wishes to make $.10 on a dollar would be a fool the invest in either company. BO bought it and now we own it. He says he does not want to be in the auto business....but he left us with no choice.

one more time.
You must be a complete moron Zap. "Let's flesh it out. Bush's budget was $3.1 and Hussein's was $3.5 trillion." You said Bush was completely irresponsible with his spending. Right. If that is so then why does Obama propose a 12.9% increase in spending (400 billion / 3.1 trillion = 12.9% increase). How is this responsible?


"So? Are you telling me Congress controls spending?" You tell me who controls spending. Are you saying the president controls spending?

BTW, the bailout passed under Bush was $800 billion and under Obama $700 billion. That was off budget. Remember, the majority of the Democrats voted for the Bush bailout proposal and the majority of the Republicans voted against it. Under Obama's proposal only 3 Republicans voted for it. So, who is responsible for both of these bailouts?

I know you will never answer any questions put to you. Look at the projected deficits under Obama here: http://perotcharts.com/2009/03/cbo-estimate-of-the-obama-b udget-2009/

I NO year does any of his projected deficits get anywhere near what the irresponsible Bush had.

h20shier
Budget appeasers, like yourself, think fighting wars are free. That's why you're an apologist for Republican failures to be accountable and honest.

Can you tell me what part of President Hussein's 12.9% budget increase is due to the fact that he put most of the cost for the War in Iraq and War in Afghanistan back 'on' budget?

The Republicans had their own budget. The biggest difference between the two was that John Boehnor and Eric Cantor moved the costs of the war back 'off' budget.

Tell me, if something is moved 'off' budget, does that mean it's free?

What was the purpose of moving the wars costs 'off' budget under the Bush 'Reign of Error?'


h20shier
1) $700 billion TARP II.

TARP II is a tranche of about $350 billion designed to unlock the credit markets, help homeowners deal with mortgages and other debt, help and banks deal with toxic assets.

Are you sure about the $700 billion?

Try googling American Recovery
and investment act.

From the Huffington Post – A draft summary of the stimulus plan is circulating among House Democrats on the Hill. Below is the outline of the $825 billion proposal:



h20shier
the stimus bill is $787 billion of which $250 billion is tax cuts. I hope you are not going to say those tax cuts are spending?

h20shier
$288 billion is for tax relief, not $250 billion.

That number is etched in my brain now!

so
now you are saying tax cuts are free. First you said tax cuts must be paid for and now you say they are free. Make up your mind. You still have not answered any of my questions. So by implication you support the stimulus bill and spending of $787 put on the nation's credit card. All of this money goes directly to the huge federal deficit.

Also,
since Bush's spending was irresponsible shouldn't Obama have cut the budget instead of increasing it? He could have just removed all of the irresponsible spending and then we would have a budget surplus according to you. HAhahahahahahahah

h20shier
"So by implication you support the stimulus bill and spending of $787 b"

It's spending of $499 billion (787-288).

Learn how to write correct question and i will answer it!

Were the Reagan tax cuts spending??

h20shier
Your Perot chart was made before Hussein even became president. It's the result of 'cut taxes and spend even more' philosophy of the Republicans. Those surpluses under Clinton were the result of a sane 'tax and spend' philosophy.

http://www.jbs.org/inflation-taxes-economy-blog/1881-ross-p erots-charts-warn-of-looming-economic-disaster

h20shier
Republican malfeasance from 2001-2007 was so deep and malignant that we became a cancer patient.

Would you give a healthy person radiation or chemo therapy. No, when a person has cancer they need some tough medicine. The Republican party was brought the nation that I love to its economic knees after inheriting surpluses 'as far as the eye could see.'

Now, the most important item on the Republicans agenda is to get their mouth back on the teat. Never trust what they say, watch what they do!


zzapdoohimer
The Reagan tax cuts were irresponsible and the Bush tax cuts were irresponsible because we are at war. But Obama's tax cut is responsible even though we are still fighting a war. Didn't you earlier in this thread rail against the Bush Tax cuts?

Your reply 121:"But, truth be told, the only way you are willing to pay for this engagement with the enemy is to hold onto your precious tax cut and raising the debt ceiling on the national credit card." Reply 160: "Every time the Republicans created another spending plan, you cheered, "Yet another opportunity for a tax cut!"'
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