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Wednesday, April 09, 2008
Ben Shapiro :: Townhall.com Columnist
Obama Coddles Evil
by Ben Shapiro
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On Tuesday morning, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad declared that Iran was busily installing 6,000 new centrifuges for development of nuclear material. Further, Ahmadinejad stated, Iran would begin testing a new type of centrifuge that works five times faster than ordinary centrifuges.

On Tuesday afternoon, Democratic presidential front-runner Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., declared that the U.S. should engage in a "diplomatic surge" in Iraq. In particular, he said, America should embrace talks with Iran. "I do not believe we are going to be able to stabilize the situation without that," Obama told Gen. David Petraeus and U.S. Ambassador Ryan Crocker. "I continue to believe that the original decision to go into Iraq was a massive strategic blunder, that the two problems you pointed out -- al-Qaida in Iraq and increased Iranian influence in the region -- are a direct result of that original decision."

Never mind the unbelievable arrogance of a foreign policy boob like Barack Obama, lecturing the two most knowledgeable on-the-ground figures in Iraq on the best military strategy for Iraq.

Barack Obama's scariest characteristic isn't his ego, though its sheer size threatens to shift the globe out of orbit.

Obama's scariest characteristic is his puerile belief that everything can be solved by talking with dictators.

He seems to believe there's nothing to be lost by sitting across the table from murderers, thugs, Holocaust deniers and genocidal maniacs. "I will meet not just with our friends but with our enemies, not just with those we agree with but those we don't," he blustered in February.

Obama, more than any politician of the past fifty years, should understand the power of words and gestures -- his entire campaign is based on them. Yet, he doesn't seem to understand the simple truth that America's enemies see negotiation as a sign of weakness.

Evil leaders always see negotiations without preconditions as surrender. Neville Chamberlain's shilly-shallying at Munich emboldened Hitler. Yitzhak Rabin's agreement to the Oslo Accords encouraged Yasser Arafat. April Glaspie's statement to Saddam Hussein that "We have no opinion on the Arab-Arab conflicts, like your border disagreement with Kuwait" gave Hussein the green light to touch off the first Gulf War.

Obama likes to compare himself to Ronald Reagan. Reagan, Obama says, negotiated with the USSR. Naturally, Obama neglects to mention that Reagan only negotiated with the USSR after placing missiles in Europe, funding Star Wars, joking about bombing the Soviets and calling the USSR an "evil empire." Obama's meetings would be more like an Oprah interview than a Reagan negotiation.

It's not surprising Obama is willing to have coffee with those who hate America. After all, he allowed an America-hater to preside over his wedding. He sat in the pews while his spiritual mentor railed against Israel. He's used to Ahmadinejad-like rhetoric -- he went to a church full of it for two decades.

Obama has no problem chatting with the world's bloodiest butchers or sitting in racist churches because he "understands" everyone. Back in November, I wrote that Obama was running as "The Man Who Understands."

"I know, I have seen, the desperation and disorder of the powerless," he writes in "Dreams From My Father." That understanding leads him to excuse Islamic terrorism as a function of poverty; it leads him to compare black teens on the South Side of Chicago to jihadis in Indonesia. It leads him to excuse scumbag preachers and to kowtow to sadistic tyrants.

There's clearly one thing Barack Obama doesn't understand: the nature of evil. That's why he continues to coddle evil men in both his personal life and his politics.

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About The Author
Ben Shapiro is a regular guest on dozens of radio shows around the United States and Canada and author of Project President: Bad Hair and Botox on the Road to the White House.
 
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Obama is
Jimmy Carter Redux, GOD HELP US!

Perhaps there is an easy explanation?
It may well be that the prior association of Obama with the Muslim community suggests to him he can be comfortable around these types of people.

If so, then the reverse may be true as well, i.e. he is less comfortable around us solid Judeo-Christian Americans.

Shapiro writes well
As he states:
There's clearly one thing Barack Obama doesn't understand: the nature of evil. That's why he continues to coddle evil men in both his personal life and his politics.


"I know, I have seen, the desperation and disorder of the powerless," he writes in "Dreams From My Father." That understanding leads him to excuse Islamic terrorism as a function of poverty; it leads him to compare black teens on the South Side of Chicago to jihadis in Indonesia. It leads him to excuse scumbag preachers and to kowtow to sadistic tyrants.
----------

ts:
It really is not about he sees no evil.
What he is about is who he DOES see as evil.
And that is America, white men, and Jesus Christ Himself.
He sees Jesus as evil cause he accepts a God hating racist as a Pastor.

In his world, America is evil.
The Justice System is evil
Whites are evil
Christians are evil.

He sees good in compromising with any enemy of America, the white race and Jesus Christ.

His gospel is the opposite of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

He is a very wicked and deceitful man and a sinner against God and God's truth.

Disclose the Puppeteer
I recommend urgently that Obama read and re-read Luke 4:6-8 and dwell most particluarly on what Christ had to say in Verse 8 when the Puppeteer offered Him what apparently Obama believes is now on offer to him.

Or if he just cannot bring himself to open a Bible, how about he check out The Two Towers and figure out how power sharing with Sauron worked out for Saruman?

Appeasement redux
As George mentioned, Obama is Jummah Carter redux. The ability of Demlibs to misunderstand evil has been a 60 yr. dysfunctionality for the DNCers. They all though Uncle Joe understood democracy even as he captured the Baltics. And Mao, well, he was just an agrarian reformer. Lib Dems love Castro, Chavez, Muggabe, and all non-white dictators because their coalitions contain so many multicultural lobbying groups. Obama is now being questioned by the New Republic as is Wright. One may not rely on them anymore but if their information is correct, Obama will have more trouble ahead in credibility.

Poor Ben...
Ben said "Obama's scariest characteristic is his puerile belief that everything can be solved by talking with dictators."

I'm sorry, but where did Obama say that "everything" could be solved that way? In fact, Obama didn't say that anything could be solved by talks. But, he believes in starting with talks. Unlike our current President that believes in using America's imperialistic powers to garner more oil.

And, Ben, that's not "puerile" in any stretch of the imagination. Juveniles would rather fight it out than talk about it. So, before you throw out these rarely used words that you think make you seem older than you really are, try to think about their meaning.

Why are you supposed Christians so afraid to talk with the enemy? WWJD?

"Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing" (1 Peter 3:9).

Seeing no evil
Busn policy vis a vis Iran has resulted in an US installed Iraqi government that has stronger ties to Iran than al-Sadr. Obviously their marginalization policy isn't working.

Syler
because once you recognize evil, you don't cuddle it, cozy up to it, or try and make nice with it. When Nutjob says I want you dead, where do you start the negotiation? Don't kill me now kill me later, just kill a few hundred.
Jesus also saw the money-changers in the temple as evil and threw them out. No negotiation, no coddling, no kissy-face. This man has stated he wants and it is his aim to have a world without Israel and a world without America. That is unless we capitulate and see things the Shria way, are you ready for that?

Obama supports

unlimited access to abortion and the elimination of marriage. If you think these policies are good for a society, Obama is your man.

Obama supports growing government and raising taxes. If you think these policies are good for America, Obama is your man.

Obama wants to dwell in the past by repeatedly referring to entering Iraq and overthrowing Saddam Hussein (not Barack Hussein Obama) as a mistake. Mistake or not, it is over with and I am interested in what affect our being in Iraq will have on the future. If our future policy in Iraq does not concern you, Obama is your man.

Paranoia Strikes Deep

I am always amused by American conservative paranaoia. What must it feel like to live in a world so beset by evil and enemies that even talking to a so called enemy is enough to drive people into foam at the mouth rage?

Talking to Iran is no different than talking to the Soviet Union or China. Of course one negotiates with other parties, even if you think they are your enemy.

By hte way, the American defense budget is larger than all the other military budgets in teh world.....combined. Relax. Breathe deeply. You are safe.


The problem POLMSgt and Eddie
Is that Bush admin policy has basically handed Iraq over to the Iranians.

Mdoggie BOOB
You forgot one thing REAGAN did something noone else had the B#LLS to do. Free millions in EASTERN Germany without a shot being fired and it wasnt done by sitting down and singing KUMBAYA with the enemy. It was power and allot of it. You people whom seem to hate America will be the downfall of this country one day and MLDOGGIE, MDOGGIE, NY DOGGIE or what ever name you are using this week because of your IGNORANCE and people blocking you.

When have you fought for you country COWARDCRAP

I hope you are one of the first to go when this country is attacked again and I know that might not happen but we thought the same anbout the TOWERS also didnt we.

This country has become a bunch of pansies with the likes of you and your TRAITORCRAPS

Why dont you just tell OBAMA to let the Terrorist come here and give then a couple of our states and maybe they will not kill or bomb us anymore. Maybe IRAN can have a couple states also beginning with yours. Hell lets just swap places with the MIDDLE EAST becuase when LIBS get done with this country they(RAGHEADS) will have more rights here than we do.

MDOGGIE POOH
First thing that I want to see is OBAMA in IRAQ before he tells our Leaders there what he thinks they ought to do, By they I mean the people fighting the war not sitting in their ARMCHAIR GEN AIR CONDITION OFFICES. The man talks the talk so lets see him WALK THE WALK and go to IRAQ and see for himself before he draws judgement on people whom he couldnt carry their JOCKSTRAPS

When I see him in IRAQ then and only then will I care what he has to say. His world dont mean squat. Maybe he can go on a HATE AMERICA trip with his RACIST PASTOR to the ME

Obama is really a closet commie
Ace has blogged that Obama's boyhood mentor was Frank Marshall Davis, well known Communist Party member. More here: http://obamareport.blogspot.com/2008/04/barack-obamas-comm unist-mentor-frank.html

What if...
I'd like to hear a rhetorical question posed to Obama regarding what he would do if, during his presidency, America was attacked again 9/11 style. And I would like to hear a straight, no BS answer from him.

Obama is a muslim
Obama is a muslim who will turn this country over to the terrorist. His dad is a radical muslim, his mom is a burnt out hippie and is pastor is an ex muslim America hater. If this country elects him then we deserve to suffer the consequences.

MDoggg
One of the fundamental problems with your argument is that you have no proof that the general is a Bush lapdog other than that he happens to believe in the Iraq policy. In the left mindset, anyone who happens to agree with Bush is a Bush lackey with no mind of their own.

I know this is hard to swallow for the elistist left intellectuals who believe they know more than anyone...but perhaps, just perhaps, the general on the ground in Iraq has just a wee bit more insight than you do.

You twist the facts to meet your world view that America is always to blame. When you look at the Saddam et al, you invariably bring up things like that Rumsfeld sold him the gas he used to gas his own people without ever trying to understand what would lead the US to back Saddam decades ago, and then be staunchly against him years later after he showed himself to be a brutal dictator who gassed his own people.

I could go on and on, but see the bottom line is...does America look out for America first and foremost? Absolutely! Does that make us evil or wrong? NO.

Mirefox writes:
What if...
I'd like to hear a rhetorical question posed to Obama regarding what he would do if, during his presidency, America was attacked again 9/11 style. And I would like to hear a straight, no BS answer from him.

It was in the dem debates and his answer was more first responders. What he and his supportes failed to see is that the first responders would be dead along with thousands of civilians. He has no business any where near the WH.

Mirefox
I know what he'd answer. he would say: "I would sic Chuck on them, he seems to like a good battle."

I'm Not Too Sure Ben....
You said, "He seems to believe there's nothing to be lost by sitting across the table from murderers, thugs, Holocaust deniers and genocidal maniacs."

I think Obama will actually be more comfortable in that setting---it'll be practically like him going to Trinity Church.

RK58
Go on. Go on. Every crazed thing you write just goes to convince peiople, even here, that the far right wing is just as nutty as the far left.

Forget about Hussein
As we speak the admin is trumpeting its' support of a theoratically inclined gov't whose leaders harbor Quds Force officials, and engage in murder and ethnic cleansing.

Those are the facts.

bryce,

I think maybe you are jumping the gun, the future course of events in Iraq are just that, future events that no one knows.

The U.S. cannot be driven out of Iraq. The only way the U.S. will leave Iraq is on the U.S.'s own terms.

We can leave before there is a sustainable, free government or after. If the U.S. leaves before the Iraq government can sustain itself as a free entity, then the U.S. has chosen to surrender in the battle for Iraq. I believe that we should discuss fully the consequences to the War on Terror that surrendering Iraq will produce.

When will Obama address this? Please Obamaramamamas respond!!!!

9/11 indeed
Issue with libs is that they get all brave and patriotic on Sept 12 but then back to appeasement and blame on Sept. 13. They were the loudest when it came to the blame game - refusing to look at the previous POTUS.

Hey, why don't we send nuclear technology to North Korea - if they promise not to use it for weapons? Another great lib idea. Thank God Bush is trying to clean up that mess.

Eddie
Too simplistic. You write:

"The U.S. cannot be driven out of Iraq. The only way the U.S. will leave Iraq is on the U.S.'s own terms"

The US CAN be driven out of Iraq, in the same way the Soviet Union was driven from Afghanistan. It simply becomes too expensive to continue. It will LOOK like its our choice, but it isn't.






Constitutional Amendment neded
I think Obama should draft and promote a constitutional amendment stating that foreign relations should be handled by obscure members of the Ill legislature. Those with knowlege and expertise need not apply. It is a new version of affirmative action.

Dialogue...what dialogue?
Obama's suggestions and ideas on how the US should engage Iran, and the rest of the middle east is risky and dangerous. But, if we look back at the last seven plus years of the current administration's diplomatic failures and blunders..I am sure any new change and direction would be a plus.

What is wrong with you conservatives? Why can't you be honest with your fellow man? You are so wrapped up in the whole ideological idea of power, money, war, and more power and money that you neglect the country's basic needs to survive and thrive as a nation. Why don't you all start thinking along the lines of what is best for our country, and how not to destroy it anymore than it has been the last eight years by the Cheney and Bush puppet show.

MDoggg
That is not true at its face. Other generals who are not on the ground in Iraq have voiced dissention, but they are not on the ground in Iraq.

Straight answer
With respect to the comment, "And I would like to hear a straight, no BS answer from him." let me suggest that the day that any politician, especially one who is a pestilential, oops, presidential candidate gives a straight, no BS answwer to any question, will be the day that Hell freezes over.

ALL
How long ago could the Iraq transition (the war lasted but a few hours) have been concluded, had the self hating leftists (you must hate yourself before you can hate America) actually been on OUR side, instead of the enemy's?

Tom
Because most of us conservatives are old enough to remember Jimmuh "the moron" Carter and we understand no matter how bad Bush has been, Obamarama would make him look like a true Rhodes scholar(not the phony Klinton type).

Tom
While I agree with your conclusion, you do say one thing that needs to be challenged. There is absolutely NO risk to engaging with Iran and other Middle East nations.

Kuwull
You are deluded if you think any politics here at home influenced what happened in Iraq. WHat happened in Iraq is squarely at the feet of G.W. Bush.

ClaireSolt,
You said...
"I think Obama should draft and promote a constitutional amendment stating that foreign relations should be handled by obscure members of the Ill legislature. Those with knowlege and expertise need not apply. It is a new version of affirmative action."

... and what foreign policy experience did President Bush have? Heck, he couldn't even run a successful business, except when he used eminent domain to steal land for a new Texas Rangers stadium. Then he made some real money.

Reply to Ben Shapiro
And so does Ambassador Crocker!!!!

Exclusive: Ambassador Crocker Says Ready to Talk to Iran Again

"But he also added that "we don't want to have just what you describe as a proxy war with Iran inside Iraq, and that is why we are willing to sit down with Iran face to face for talks on Iraqi security at the invitation of the Iraqi government. We've had three rounds of those talks and we've told them we are ready to again."

http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/Vote2008/Story?id=4612088&p age=2




JMind
"elistist left intellectuals who believe they know more than anyone" Excuse me, ever hear the word: "Quagmire".

A little bit of education goes a long ways, because it allows one to read books without the belief that the preacher, or the president, or anyone who's "closer to god", like those politicians(!) "on the ground" in Iraq, have a special insight that we little sinners aren't vouschafted.

See, education allows one the confidence to think, gee, we shouldn't have gone into Vietnam, we see no reason for going into Iraq, therefore, Iraq might be like Vietnam.

And don't deny it isn't. Your "president" said it was.

I rest my case.

Liberal Cowards
Are Congregating Here!

Obama on Negotiation
Every time I hear Obama speak of negotiation I think of Chris Rock.

Chris said "When locked in a cell with a brutal sadistic rapist - your goal becomes - when and how long?"

Welcome George Twin!
The conversation was getting way too rationale and prodcutive. Glad you are here to put a stop to that.

Hey, Syler
What makes you assume that Shapiro is a Christian? Is it mainly because you have contempt for him and his opinions? "Ben Shapiro (born 1984 in Burbank, California) is an Orthodox Jew and conservative political columnist and author" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Shapiro).

Cuddly Foreign Policy
Both Clinton and Obama will engage in Teddy Bear Diplomacy.

Give the bad guys a teddy bear and a hug and they'll stop bombing innocent men, women and children.

Negotiation = Comprimese
Ahminajead and Obama meet.

Ahminajead says "I want to destroy Israel, Western Culture, capitalism and convert Americans to Islam."

Obama thinks awhile and responds "What if I give you all of the white people?"

I'm not sure how many times Ahmadinejad

and the radical Islamic need to announce their intentions....

"Death to America" and "Wipe America off the face of the earth" before the left understands that they most likely MEAN IT!

Exactly what part of those words does BHO not understand?

But, obviously BHO was absent the day they talked about pre WWII and Neville Chamberlain's attempt to TALK to the Nazis.

Would someone please show BHO a history text book?



Anne
They won't understand until we are hit again. BHO is an educated idiot

Anne
That Dogg is one sick puppy. He must be related to oberleutnant Klink

the oblahma the unifier.
The wright protegee thinks he can solve the supposed racial divide and now imagines he will bring about world peace. I guess just like he missed wright's 20 plus years of preaching hatred and victimhood he hasn't a clue about the messages of hatred coming from iran and saudia arabia and their fellow haters. But like the other dim stooge, jimmah, I am in the pocket of every tinpot dictator, carter he will overlook all the madness from the region and will sacrifice israel is he is promised the nobel peace prize.

Wildwest
BHO is still smoking those funny cigarettes

Schoolyard Politics from the Neocons
So what we get from this article is that the US should engage in war and sanctions only with countries we know we can beat. If Iran or any peace of crap 3rd world country says the word nuke we need to attack em. but when countries that have nukes engage in aggressive rehetoric -north korea-, attack their neighbors -Russia's invasion of afghanistan-, or destroy personal liberties -china-. only then should we talk. what's even better is our proping up of governments that give us cheap stuff at the abject destruction of actual democracy -saudi arabia-. our relationships with every country should be very simple.
"what do you have to sell and what would like to buy from us" - I Hate being a real Conservitive

Jack writes: "WHat happened in Iraq

is squarely at the feet of G.W. Bush."

Wow! Such pontification! Simplistic pontification, that is!

You forget about the Congress and all the other countries.



But, here's a friendly suggestion. As soon as they come out with a vaccine for BDS, sign up for the clinical trials...




Obama
Maybe Obama can call up Madeline Albright. She did such a good job with North Korea.

God help us if Obama wins. He was a Muslim and is not a Christian now.

Obama describes his new found "Christian" faith as: (1) Suspicious of dogma (2) Without any monopoly on the truth (3) Nontransferable to others (4) Infused with a big healthy dose of doubt, and (5) Indulgent of and compatible with all other religions.

On Feb 15/08, Usama K. Dakdok, President of The Straight Way of Grace Ministry called Obama's Church and reported the following conversation: " I then asked the person who answered what I needed to do to join. She told me that I needed to attend two Sunday School classes in a row and then I would walk the aisle. I replied, "That sounds easy. One last question please. If I am Muslim and I believe in the Prophet Mohammed, peace be unto him and I also believe in Jesus, peace be unto him, do I have to give up my Islamic faith to be a member in your church? She answered: "No, we have many Muslim members in our church."

He will capitulate. I don't believe he even likes America.



Pastafarian: What a stupid comment!!!!!

You know NOTHING... whether or not Shapiro tried to enlist or not.

But how about this? My son is a strapping 6' 3" athlete.. Played VARSITY football, wrestling, and lacrosse for from the beginning of his freshman year in high school.

The reason he's NOT in the military is that he has, as they told him, too much "hardware" from injuries he sustained as a high school athlete.

However, if you challenged him as to why he's not in the military, with that obvious "attitude," he'd probably flatten you where you stood!!!!

Watch it, bozo. You have no idea what you're talking about....


Obama globalist stooge
Brezinzski is endorsing Obama and says he has the best world view. That would be kill American sovereignty to create the "new world order"/one world gov.

Check out gunsmitkat's link. He is a marxist. If you read the writings of the globalists their vision is some version of communism. The masses will be kept poor enough they can't revolt.

"When Barack Obama decided to enter politics in 1995, he saw it as a means to advance his true calling – mobilizing "collective action" to build "collective institutions" – and disparaged the "right wing" ideal of fostering reform through personal initiative as the "old individualistic bootstrap myth."

"But individual actions, individual dreams, are not sufficient. We must unite in collective action, build collective institutions and organizations."

In the interview, Obama addressed the "unemployment catastrophe" among black youth, and declared any solution "must arise from us working creatively within a multicultural, interdependent and international economy."

Collective institutions? "International economy" That's Marxism and globalism.

Obama is not loyal to this country. If this country is stupid to elect a guy who would line up behind Farrahkan (Million man march) we are finished.

Too bad the globalists own McCain too.




Anne
Another useful idiot heard from.
I'd like to be there when your son did the flattening. I'd hold his coat

Obama's vision
Obama shares this vision of America

“Before such a merger can be consummated, and the US becomes just another province in a New World Order, there must at least be the semblance of parity among the senior partners in the deal. How does one make the nations of the world more nearly equal? The insiders determined that a two-prong approach was needed; use American money and know-how to build up your competitors (Wall street financed Russia, now China), while at the same time use every devious strategy you can devise to weaken and impoverish this country. (The plan IS to de-industrialize the US) The goal is not to bankrupt the US...Rather, it is to reduce our productive might, and therefore our standard of living, to the meager subsistence level of the socialized nations of the world.

Notice that the plan is not to bring the standard of living in less developed countries up to our level (too hard to control the people!), but to bring ours down to meet theirs coming up.

You may be assured, however, that the Rockefellers and their allies are not talking about reducing their OWN quality of life. It is your standard of living which must be sacrificed on the altar of the New world Order. Gary Allen


Anyone think Obama and his wife are going to turn over their salaries to the collective to share with all of us?

He is a smooth operator and very slick. But he is nothing more than a scumbag traitor. He doesn't like America and he will turn our Republic over to the bankers and multinational co in a heartbeat.

Anna
Can you imagine what a nightmare it will when Obama selects his cabinet?
God help us.

Richard Wright
I have read Richard Wright's "Black Boy". He toyed with communism and left it because it was just as insane here as in Russia.

Paranoia, reporting on people, etc.

Obama is an educated moron.

WilliB
I think we are toast.

Both Obama and McCain are committed globalists. I don't think McCain despises our country however.


Obama Coddles Evil...
and G.W. Bush has embraced it, enthusiastically, as dictator in chief.

Willi Beax: Yeah! :-)

The last poor soul who tried that got himself jacked up against a wall.

I'm sure it was a moment that poor guy will never forget. :-) And I'm also guessing that the poor idiot never challenged anyone else!






Heres another example of coddling evil
I see you failed to mention Bill Clinton bringing IRA terrorist to the White House. I know, that one skipped you memory. Or how about Bill Clinton and his administration looking the other way when they could have taken out Osama while he was still in Afghanistan. That didn't encourage the terrorist to think we were paper tigers. Don't start in the middle, go to the beginning, say like on 9/11. We can't be selective in our infomation when it comes to Obama. Thats right, McCain is running against Hillary too. Or did that also skip you memory. Why do Conservatives keep on forgetting that MCCain is running against Obama and Hillary, instead of just Obama. Do you have the answer to that. Hillary is not a Republican, or are Conservatives forgetting that too.

RickV404 writes:
Obama Coddles Evil...
and G.W. Bush has embraced it, enthusiastically, as dictator in chief.

Explain how GWB is a dictator.

Shapiro doesn't do nuance
Definition of "Reification." To regard or treat an abstraction as if it had concrete or material existence.

Reification is a consistent and persistent conservative linguistic error.

Evil exists only in our individual neurons in our brains. It doesn't have a material existence "out there."

If Shapiro's premise is incorrect, how could anything he says thereafter be worth regarding?

Lumberjack7392: RickV404 is just another

victim of BDS... Obviously he has an acute case!


Proud Liberal writes: "Evil exists only

in our individual neurons in our brains. It doesn't have a material existence 'out there.'"

Ummmmm? And I'm sure you have proof of that? Right?





Bryce
Netanyahu, has stated "if somebody say they are going to kill you, you had better take take them seriously".
Ahmadinejahd has stated so, several times, I ask you what is the starting point of your negotiations?

Obama is Right
He's right, we should be talking with Iran. They're too big a player in the area to ignore. Talking is not coddling. You can talk to someone and still be tough. Even Ronald Reagan talked with the Soviets at the height of the cold war.

Farrakhan - Wright - Obama
Farrakhan is quoted as having said, "The white man is our mortal enemy, and we cannot accept him."

Farrakhan believes "Six-thousand years ago, an evil wizard called Dr. Yacub created the white "race" in a genetic experiment." Whites and blacks do not have the same creator.

Farrakhan boarded a UFO "mother wheel" piloted by 13 youths now orbiting Earth, waiting to destroy the whites and rescue the blacks.

Farrakhan stated that North America will be encapsulated with a "shield" and then the atmosphere will be burned off after the "mother wheel" rescues blacks.

Wright wants America damned.

Farrakhan - Wright have both made anti-semtic dclarations and comments and Ahminajead has said Israel WILL be destroyed in his lifetime.

Obama wants to negotiate (compromise) with Ahminajead.

Am I the only one nervous about this?

The Real Obama
Obama’s mentor, Frank Marshall Davis (deceased), member of the Communist Party USA taught Obama the merits of communism. Obama refers to him as Frank in his book "Dreams From My Father."
http://obamareport.blogspot.com/2008/04/barack-obamas-commu nist-mentor-frank.html

Obama was tutored by socialists in college. Obama, wife Michelle and his children were ministered to by a preacher who spewed an anti-white America, anti-Israel for 20 years. Obama wants to tax the wealthiest to the poorest in order to finance his socialist ideas. Raising taxes and blatant socialism is Obama’s “change”. http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/ckincaid/2008/ck_02191.sh tml

Obama asks, "Are we willing to make the investments in genuine, equal opportunity in this country?" Obama says, "People [black] aren't looking for charity. We talk about welfare and we talk about poverty, but what people [black] really want is fairness. They want people [rich] paying their fair share of taxes. They want that money allocated fairly."

Obama wants to tip a glass of rum and smoke a good Cuban cigar with Raul, Fidel, Hugo and the other Latin American despots to discuss the merits of socialism and commerce.
Obama wants to have tea with Ahmadinejad and Assad and socialize with Osama, Hamas, Hezbollah, Fatah and all the Jihadists and swap some ideas on religions.

WARNING: there is some graphic footage in here, including video of people jumping from the Twin Towers on 9/11—footage that has been hidden away by the mainstream media. http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=29406&only&r ss

This is a Video of more than 100 al Qaeda meeting their 75 virgins.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQhjaCgAS80

Your idiocy continues to baffle me
If you think you know more than Obama, why are you not running but here pushing your poison pen? Oh, so a dialogue is no longer a good way for civilized people to settle their issues? So what do you suggest? Do you advocate the nuclear bombing of Iran and murder of hundreds of millions of innocent citizens in Middle East? If yes, then you are a monster and a disgrace to humanity. mscsrrr.com

Never mind
>Never mind the unbelievable arrogance of a foreign policy boob like Barack Obama<

We've had the biggest foreign policy boob in US history inhabiting the White House for 7+ years.
Obama can only be an improvement.

More BS
>Yet, he[Obama] doesn't seem to understand the simple truth that America's enemies see negotiation as a sign of weakness.<

Yet, had we not negotiated with the Anbar Sunnis, the only real success of the surge would have never taken place. Duh!

Proud Liberal
Obviously you do not understand abstraction.

Humans use abstraction to understand complex events or objects. Abstractions of complex objects based in reality and abstractions of things in the supernatural are not the same although both could be reified.

An abstraction of the collateral damage caused by liberal solutions e.g. "War on Poverty" has evidence that cannot be denied unless one does not use logic and reason.

Liberals have reified their solution and disregarded the results of the solution which, is common behavior of a liberal.

An examination of the main focus of the aforementioned liberal solution - the black family and black community - reveals the collateral damage.

Those who cannot accept the resultant facts are either lacking in reasonable scrutiny or delusional.


Candidate for what?
>Netanyahu, has stated "if somebody say they are going to kill you, you had better take take them seriously".
Ahmadinejahd has stated so, several times, I ask you what is the starting point of your negotiations?<

Is Obama running for President of Israel?

Israel
Israel isn't going anywhere. Read an article lately that they said they could take care of Iran.

Of course they will. I do not think they will sit there and wait to be nuked. I wonder if that will trigger the events of EZ 38/39

EZ 38/39 describes Russia leading an Arab coalition against Israel. It doen't succeed. Instead Russia is mortally wounded and God gives Israel a huge victory. ME will be in shambles.

The only ME country that does not take part in the attack is Babylon (Iraq).

Might that set the stage for the peace pact that the anti-chirst makes with Israel? Which is the beginning of the period of Tribulation? Israel and Babylon will come out on top.

No one comes to Israel's aid. We either don't care or are out of commission.

One thing we know for sure is that nothing short of being bombed themselves, Iran will not stop.

The next few years are going to be interesting. Esp since the agenda for one world gov is so advanced. Barry aka Barack Hussein Obama would never bomb Iran.

Jeff writes: "He's right, we should

be talking with Iran."

And say what, exactly?


"They're too big a player in the area to ignore.

Which is exactly why we cannot leave Iraq prematurely.


"Even Ronald Reagan talked with the Soviets at the height of the cold war."

It was a cold war and the Russians had NOT made it clear that their sole goal was to wipe us off the face of the earth.




Reagan Negotiated
Reagan is venerated for having defeated the Soviet Union without firing a shot; he demonstrated strength and negotiated. We've certainly demonstrated our strength to Iran, with 200,000 soldiers on their eastern and western borders and a huge deployment of navy ships on the southern. Why do conservatives now reject the idea of negotiating with them? It seems to be what Reagan would do.

Pakistan
Lets not forget that when it comes to an ally like Pakistan, Obama had his scenario of invading Pakistan to get terrorist groups. Talk to our enemies, but invade our allies.

We also have the double speak out of the Obama campaign about NAFTA which had to be "clarified" by the Canadians. This clearly shows Obama's amatuer status in diplomacy.

I don't see Obama going to bat for the Columbian free trade agreement to support a strong latin American ally. In fact, if we want to alienate our allies in the world, all we have to do is let Obama do the bidding of his protectionist union buddies and erect trade barriers.

Proud Liberal
A belief in something by faith which cannot be proved may "seem" irrational.

Disbelief in something that can be proved "defines" irrational.


For Sure?
>One thing we know for sure is that nothing short of being bombed themselves, Iran will not stop.<

Will not stop what? Making economic agreements with China, Russia, most of Europe, Pakistan and India?

We Will Bury You
Anne, weren't you listening to Khruschev at the UN? Remember him pounding with his shoe? What, too young? Ben is.

Pancho
are you that dense? The man had a World without Israel and a World without America conference last April, he has said he wants the Americans dead or converted.

I am focusing on the part about America.

Talk to Iran
If Iraq Prime Minister al-Maliki is our ally and HE has diplomatic relations with Iran...why don't we? Sometimes you have to talk with your enemies. Maybe Ben will understand that when he's a little older.


Anna
I would be inclined to go with your position.

Have you read Dead Heat?

Reality
>It was a cold war and the Russians had NOT made it clear that their sole goal was to wipe us off the face of the earth.<

If you were Iranian, you would believe that the opposite were true, and there would be more basis for the claim.

Pancho
Ahamadinejahd hosted A World Without Israel and A World Without America conference last April, he stated several times that America must die.

I was focused and mentioned that in the last post, how do you figure I only mention Israel?

Link please
>The man had a World without Israel and a World without America conference last April, he has said he wants the Americans dead or converted.

I am focusing on the part about America.<

Surely you can link to the quote, and not an interpretation by someone who wants Iranians dead or converted, like Ann Coulter.

Talking to the Enemy
I am a father and I believe I have the right to talk to a person who is armed and has stated he wants to kill me. My life can be risked by me in hope to negotiate a peaceful solution.

If a person is armed and has stated he wants to kill my wife or family, I have no right as a father or husband to risk the life of my kids or wife. I WILL rain destruction on that individual by any means available until one of us is dead.

The POTUS has the same responsibiliy to his citizens, as a father has to his family.

Bob Munck: Yes I remember... but he was

soon removed from power by his own party...




Pancho: That BDS has obviously left

you delirious, delusional and unable to read.

It appears that Netanyahu stands a good chance of being PM of Israel AGAIN.

And yes, he has stated "if somebody say they are going to kill you, you had better take take them seriously."

Now, if you incapable of doing a "google" search, and finding the information on your own, then clearly you're far to stupid to engage in any conversation.




Pancho
At the “World Without Zionism” conference held in Tehran in October 2005, as the crowd chanted “death to Israel, death to America, death to England,” the Iranian President again recalled Khomeini’s words: “Once, his eminency Imam [Ruhollah] Khomeini stated that the illegal regime of the Pahlavis must go, and it happened. Then he said the Soviet empire would disappear, and it happened. He also said that this evil man Saddam [Hussein] must be punished, and we see that he is under trial in his country. His eminency also said that the occupation regime of Qods [Jerusalem, or Israel] must be wiped off from the map of the world, and with the help of the Almighty, we shall soon experience a world without America and Zionism, notwithstanding those who doubt.”

Pancho read my 8:09 post
Perhaps Anne who has 10 times more patience than I can explain it to you.

Retired Greek
Thanks, good catch, it was the World without Zionism conference.

Pancho, Nutjob can be trusted, Ann Coulter cannot? Ann Coulter currently has a nuclear facility up and running with 3000 centrifuges and had just announced she is about to work on another facility for 6000 centrifuges.

Ben Shapiro's article
The only issue I have with Bens' article is.

Obama not only "coddles" evil, he nurtures evil.

Retired Geek: Are you kidding me???

I lost my patience with anyone who can't LOOK UP THE INFORMATION a LONG time ago....

In fact, people who either aren't well informed, or won't look up the information themselves, should be embarrassed!

But, I guess it's that typical liberal mentality... they not only want the government to take care of them, they also want us to provide information to them.





polmsgt
I haven't heard of it. Will look into it.

Iran is very busy besides trying to wipe us and Israel off the map. He is trying to form an oil coalition that would challenge OPEC which he thinks is too friendly with the US. HE is pouring money into central/south America. Spreading Hezbollah/Islam. Working with Chavez on this.

Both of those two-bit dictators would be put out of business if we just reduced our oil consumption by a small percent. They are spending tons of money to buy loyalty. It's not that hard to figure out. Instead our gov is mandating ethanol and causing food shortages and high prices. Does anyone think Jorge wouldn't be getting oil out of the ground if they wanted to?

Anne
I have read hundreds of your posts and believe me when I say "You have 10 times more patience than I do with ignorance" you are just more extroverted. I do not mean that as a compliment or to denigrate - its just a fact.

Keep on posting!!!!!

PolMsgt
I have read Epicenter by Joel Rosenberg. You might want to read it. It isn't fictional.

Whose stupid, Anne?
>then clearly you're far to stupid to engage in any conversation.<

Those of us in the real world use the proper "too" stupid, which seems define you.



?obama in '08?
!!NObama In '08!!

Anna writes: "Both of those two-bit

dictators would be put out of business if we just reduced our oil consumption by a small percent."

You're right, and it wouldn't take too much.

But, we also have to come to grips with the fact that the "leftist-greenies" had allowed the oil companies to build new refineries and drill where we know there is more oil, we wouldn't be in this mess either.




Oh geeze Pancho, thanks for bringing

that to my attention... I don't often make a typo, but when I do, I appreciate knowing about it.

Thanks.

But, if a typo is the BEST you can do.... well, you don't have anything.



Khrushchev ... soon removed from power
Well, four years later. And he was replaced by his protégé, Leonid Brezhnev, who held the office for another 18 years. Not much of a repudiation of "We will Bury You!" So you're basically wrong in claiming that the SU didn't want to wipe out the US.

Clarification
It's unfortunate that Ben Shapiro has tried to couch this in emotional terms as an issue of "good vs. evil," because the strategic issue is getting lost.

Obama didn't just say he wanted to talk with Iran.

Obama went much further. He said specifically he wanted to talk with Iran WITHOUT PRECONDITIONS.

Talking with our enemies without preconditions is not something Reagan did. In fact, it's not even something Jimmy Carter did. Or Bill Clinton. Or Lyndon Johnson.

It's appeasement. An example of a national leader who went to talk with his enemies without preconditions was Neville Chamberlain.

It is certainly true that Reagan negotiated with the USSR. But he did so AFTER launching a huge U.S. military buildup (which liberals opposed); AFTER building a 600 ship navy (which liberals opposed); AFTER stationing more nuclear missiles in Europe (which liberals and European leftists opposed); and AFTER announcing his Strategic Defense Initiative ("Star Wars") program (which liberals opposed). Only then, with the U.S. arming to the teeth, he went to the USSR and said "OK, let's talk."

That is nothing like what Obama has proposed. Right now, the U.S. is in a weak negotiating position vis-a-vis Iran. And yes, I blame Bush for having put us in that disastrous position. The war in Iraq has been the best thing to happen to Iran since the Ayatollah took over there. It has made Iran the dominant power in the region.

The first order of business of the next Administration should be to restore American power in the region. Not go running off like a supplicant to beg Iran or Syria to act nice.

POLMsgt
I remembered the conference, couldn't remember when. Chronology has been something that has puzzled me my entire life.

I have never worn a watch or carried a timepiece my entire life. Time doesn't seem to have relevancy to me. I can remember events with great clarity, I just cannot put them in sequence.

The brain processes data sequentially, so maybe someone out there can put a label on it.

I have what I consider to be an exceptional ability to see patterns. I wrote a spatial relationship computer program that was used widely by a company.

Have a good evening! I am tired and going to bed.

Ret Geek: Thank you for those kind words

However, I think what you're taking as "patience" is actually stark annoyance.

I just can't stand ignorance and stupidity...
And among the worst is when someone ASKS for a link because they're too lazy to look it up themselves.

And you keep on posting too!!!!! :-)




Reagan had no preconditions
"Talking with our enemies without preconditions is not something Reagan did."

Yes, he did. You're right that he did a number of things to intimidate the SU before talking, but we've done such things to Iran already. As I said above, 200,000 troops on their eastern and western borders and a huge Navy deployment in the gulf to their south. "Preconditions" means demanding something from your opponent before you'll talk, and Reagan didn't do that. Instead, he threatened them with complete, possibly nuclear, destruction, and we've certainly done that to Iran.

Retired Geek
You have two options. Well, one really, for the first option is a fallacy in it's own right.

You could quit conflating politics and religion and, so, not refer to any religious beliefs when talking politics. You could do this in the abstract only, since in the real world politics and religion are complexly interconnected. But you would have to be careful to acknowledge that this is only abstractions.

The other option is that since politics is a part of the secular world you are obliged to provide a secular explanation of the bridge between religion and politics; you would have to explain where evil is located in the secular world, i.e. its physical coordinates and its mass and velocity.

Any claim to "taking it on faith" merely invalidates any characterization you make, since you have set yourself up to make any characterization that you like.


Barack Hussein Obama's Negotiations
Obama just might do some negotiating with the leadership in Iraq and Iran.He probably speaks their language well.

He could take Louis Farrahkan,the Muslim with him if he needs an interpretor. Maybe tell them how his friend ,the terrorist Ayers bombed his own country.

He could play some tapes of the 'unreverend'Wright's hate America rantings.That should show them Obama is on their side and wants peace at any price.

I read today on the Drudge Report where a Muslim school in Minnesota ,at taxpayers expense,are being taught the Muslim religion by teachers.Foot washing,etc.

Now,in our schools,it is illegal to even mention anything concerning religion,unless it is some idiot professor railing against it.Just what are we becoming in this country?

Obama bears watching...closely.We need to know why he is friends with such people and what they expect from him if he is elected.After he is,it will be too late.Much too late.

Pastafarian: YOU ARE SUCH A SMACKED BUTT

You have NO IDEA what you're talking about.... as usual!!!!

What I do know is that he's had two separated shoulders, and one dislocated...

A few broken bones that required plates to fix. Not to mention a few concussions!

Now, you can BET, that if you just asked him, without a stupid arrogant attitude why he's not in the military, he'd probably just explain.

But with your attitude, he'd DROP YOU where you STOOD! And that kid he jacked up against the wall, I saw it happen. The fool didn't know what happened to him!

And I don't care where or when you served. You have no right to have that attitude.


Now, take your butt elsewhere because your service does not give you the right to behave like a smacked butt... black or otherwise!!!!

You're an idiot!!!!!!!!!



Obama's ignorance too costly for USA
It's one thing to be the guy who "understands" everyone because he paid off student loans, it's another to be the guy who understands jihadists because his mentor and close associates hate america and he at best sympathizes or empathizes with our enemies. This kind of ignorance is a clear and present danger for american life as we know it. let's not even discuss Obama's plan to tax americans and fund jihadists under the "poverty act" bill. Whaaaaa? I have faith americans won't elect him as commander in chief - he lacks the experience and wisdom to lead this country at a level that rises to "meeting with the Iranian president without pre-conditions". How about allowing americans in FL and MI to vote without preconditions for a start Mr. Understanding?

It's not just Obama,
it's liberals in general that coddle and embrace evil. Heck, if I'm the enemy, I'm praying Democrats win the election.

Real Conversation....
I am trying once again to see if there can be any common ground at all, probably discuss some way of moving forward.

Let's just say that I agree that Obama is what the right says he is, and most Democratic politicians are the same way as well. But, I want to discuss history, how it relates to current events, and it's effect on foreign policy.

I am quoting Jmidd here" You twist the facts to meet your world view that America is always to blame. When you look at the Saddam et al, you invariably bring up things like that Rumsfeld sold him the gas he used to gas his own people without ever trying to understand what would lead the US to back Saddam decades ago, and then be staunchly against him years later after he showed himself to be a brutal dictator who gassed his own people."

I agree every country looks out for itself first, and that's what America does too, there is nothing wrong with that. But, what if a policy or policies, that were enforced, directly results in thousands of deaths. What if somehow Iraqis or others did the same thing in the US, sold weapons to a corrupt dictator for economic/political interests, which results in hundreds of thousands of people. What would you do? How would you see that? In the case of Iran, though not a perfect democratic government by any stretch of the means, the Mosedegh government was brought for reasons well know by now. What would you do if this happened in the US?

Real conversation continued.....
Why can't you condemn all of this at the same time? Why can't you condemn specific policies of any country/nation/religion/race, and still be respectful of the majority of it's poplulation? I want to condemn Russia for it's undemocratic behaviour at home, and in the neighbourhood. I want do condemn right-wing/oppresive governments in most of the Muslim countries. I want to condemn the Palestinian leaders, and it's violent extremists for not allowing peace to be ushered in. I want to condemn the Israeli government for continuing it's oppressive policies against innocent Palestinians to maintain the domination in that area. I want to condemn the Zimbabwe's President Robert Mugabe for his oppression, and usurping power from the people of Zimbabwe. I want to condemn the foreign policy of the US, for it's flagrant violation of International laws, and an illegal war, and at the same time praise the US for so many of it's services to the world, from charity to science.

Why can't I condemn Rev.Wright, and Rev.Hagee at the same time? Why can't I believe that free market policies are the best for growth, and development, and at the same time understand that while human beings' individualistic attitude brings creativity/productivity etc, also brings greediness if unchecked, and therefore need regulations/laws that protect people. Why can't I believe that while immigrants are being unfairly targeted these days, and the same time believe that English should be the only official national language, and that painting anyone who wants secure borders as being racist is completely unacceptable?

We all need to refine ourselves constantly, and make prudent decisions that benefit all of us. Now you can attack me for the part of comments you didn’t like or understand the spirit behind this in it’s entirety.

Now let’s talk….

CT
Hillary nor Obama talk about the endorsements they have gotten from Hamas. During the last election cycle Hamas and Al Qaeda both expressed their desire to have the Dems win. Wonder why?


Obama is the boob - period!
Obama's strategic error is thinking he can remove troops out of Iraq in 6-18 months. Something even his foreign policy adviser, Powers, admits is logistically impossible. Obama's other strategic error is refusing to fund our troops when they were facing the most fierce part of the battle in Iraq. His lack of support of our troops and playing politics with war makes him a strategic mistake if he ever becomes commander in chief. Obama's other strategic error is having a religion that teaches him to put Africa and blacks first without preconditions. If he believes that then he should run to become president of Kenya not USA. He is a fraud without any experience except inciting blacks against whites in inner city Chicago. Americans will give him his walking papers back to inner city Chicago where his gutter religion and his gutter foreign policy belongs!

Obama does not believe anything except
tax payers need to pay for his wife's and his harvard law degree because they enrolled into colleges they could not afford i.e. out of their league. tax payers should pay for blacks who bought homes they could not afford and had babies they can not afford to raise. tax payers should pay for abortions that women can not afford because it's their body, their choice and other's need to pay for their choices. tax payers should pay for ALL other people who can not afford anything they think they are owed by this white dominated evil God D america society. Too bad some people actually think he is the messiah because....liberation will have to wait a little longer. McCain will be the next president. tick tock tick tock

They're Not Stupid
"During the last election cycle Hamas and Al Qaeda both expressed their desire to have the Dems win. Wonder why?"

Maybe they realized that their loud public endorsement of the Democrats would make it more likely that the Republicans would win, and that's what they really wanted. Isn't that more likely?

Sarah and the Ivy League
"tax payers need[ed] to pay for his wife's and his harvard law degree because they enrolled into colleges they could not afford i.e. out of their league."

Harvard (also Princeton and Columbia) are private universities; taxpayers don't pay anyone's tuition for them, and Harvard Law has almost nothing to do with the federal government (other than supplying people to fill a great many of its higher levels). Most of the people in Ivy League schools can't afford to be there. The Obamas managed it with family money, scholarships, grants, and massive loans, as did most of us.

As for "out of their league," Obama was President of the Harvard Law Review; that puts all but a handful of lawyers in this country out of his league.

what is disingenuous
about this article is that as i watched the hearing, there were many senators including three republicans who said the same thing as obama about a diplomatic surge.

is it true or false that iran has more power and influence in iraq since our invasion?

i mean, al-malki and the badr militia were in iran during the reign of saddam and have closer ties to iran than sadr does.

what about saudi arabia?

besides the fact that 17 of the highjackers came from saudi arabia, a recent pentagon report said that the vast majority of foreign suicide bombers were saudi.

this is a complex and ever changing situation and even petraeus has stated that military power cannot win this war.

why is that so hard for those like this author to understand?

i still say we need to split the country up.

look at an-bar.
since being armed and protected by us from shia militia and oppression they have been cooperative and peaceful.

there may be a better way than "staying the course".

what can it hurt to try?

Thank you religiouslib
What troubles me in the hearings and in the online debate is the lack of discussion about the nature of the gov't we are supporting.

For instance, much mention was made of the Iranian malignancy. On several occasions the arrest and detention of high ranking Quds Force officiers was offered as proof of this malignancy.

On Iraq complexities cont'd
Here's the problem. The arrests were made at the compound of al-Maliki's current coalition party al-Hakim, where the officials were his invited guests. Al-Hakim vigorously fought for their release.

Unfortunately, while the WH was focusing their efforts on what they perceived as a worldwide war on terror, the Iranians saw it for what it really was, a civil war.

To sum it all up, the Iranians have played this administration like a cheap violin since the moment the double agent Chalabi wormed his way into the Cheney circle.

Rleligiouslib on the Sunni AwakeningI
I have an idea that I'd like to get out in the ether.

The Iraqi gov't is experiencing a large budget surplus, we are experiencing large deficit. Yet, we are paying a monthly stipend to members of the Awaking Councils in Anbar. I suggest that we publicly insist that the Iraqi gov't use that surplus to fund the Councils. This would force the gov't to put up or shut up in terms of their committment to both reconciliation and fiscal independence.

bryce
i always enjoy your clear headed thought provoking posts.

a couple other questions came up that i thought were good ones.

if iraq has a 150 billion dollar surplus, why aren't they paying thier share.

mccain likes to use the analogy of japan and korea but both of them have carried the brunt of the financial load for our troops since the beginning.

next, bush wants to make this long term agreement with iraq for our troops to remain.

if i was cynical i would say he was setting up the next president so iraq won't be blamed on him in the history books but i won't go there.

but the kicker is the iraqi parliament will vote on this agreement but bush doesn't want to allow our congress to vote on it.

so now he believes more in democracy for iraq than in his own country.

it is utterly shameful.

one last comment

mccain says he would stay in iraq for a very long time as long as americans aren't getting shot at, injured or killed.

well, right now they are getting shot at, injured and killed.

how long does he propose we stay under those conditions?



Obama's talks
To Obama, evil can be explained as a condition that results when the evil-minded perceive injustice from others. He (Obama) therefore believes he understands the rationale of the terrorists and has respect for their positions no matter how extreme.
The people should never elect such a person to the most important position in our government.

religiouslib
I see we're of the same mind.

Bob Munck
I doubt it, no they aren't stupid, but they also know they have support in the Democrats/liberals. Who was it that rushed to their defense anytime a claim of abuse was leveled against the troops? Dems. Who was it that made statements against the troops? (the troops are like Nazis, Stalin, Pol Pot (Dick Durban ), The war is lost, they can't win (Reid), they are terrorizing women and children (Kerry). No Dem ever said one word against the beheadings, mutilations of our people, but in every way came to the defense of the terrorist. Murtha pronounced the Haditha Marines guilty before they had a trial (oops, to date all but one has been exonerated, no loud apology from the king of the earmarks).Obama and Hillary are in a contest to see who can lose this the quickest and the terrorist know it. Also, after the Dems gained the majority and failed to secure a withdrawal, terror leaders verbally chastized them for not getting the job done.

religiouslib
You are certainly a liberal, but isn't your religion left wing government? Isn't your god the one you see every morning when you look in the mirror?

It's comical and embarassing for you to say that bryce writes "clear headed thought provoking posts."

There is nothing clear-headed about dullness and nothing thought provoking about ignorance, both of which bryce is well-known for.

Bryce responded to you by saying that the two of you are "of the same mind."

I think what he meant to say is that the two of you are "out of your minds".

And on that point, those of us who truly are clear-headed and actually capable of thinking and reasoning provocatively must respond "amen".

Fabius Cunctator
There are many important facts that show Ahmadinejad is no Hitler. First of all, Hitler was a dictator and had supreme power. Also, Hitler invaded countries and had concentration camps, the thousands of Jews in Iran, the largest number in the ME, except Israel, are not bad off and have representatives in government. So, its very, very different.

POLMsgt
No one said our troops are like Nazis. If you watch Fox News your going to have a contorted view of the world.

King of chickenhawks
Ben Shapiro is at it again. While sitting comfy here in safety he endorse the most irresponsible of all politics: no talking, just bombs. You conservatives hae lost all sense in your understanding of the world outside US.

Let me tell you: people in countries outside US are not just targets for your bombing. I know that Ben Shapiro gets all warm and tngly inside when muslim children and women are being bombed to death... after all anythiung less thatn killing all muslims would be cuddling with evil. Unless one happens to support the dictatorship of Saudi Arabia, Pakistan...

When did USA start to believe that killing and torture are solutions for every imaginable foreingn policy dilemma. Just kill them all..

And how long has Ben Shapiro served in US military? Isn't he cuddling evil by standing on sidelines and demanding more Americans soldiers to be killed in worthelss and useless was in Iraq? How many more, Ben Shapiro? How amny more young men and women you repugnants want to be killed in this war? How many?

When do you even know that you have won you ididots? When all Iraqi civilians are dead? When did conservatives become bloodthirsty savages? You'rte no better than the muslim terrorists: your goal and tools are exactly the same.

No Clue
Obama does not have a clue when it comes to foreign policy, milltary matters and national security.

Taft
It was Democrat Dick Durbin who said "I thought this was the work of Nazis, Stalin or Pol Pot". The dip is on tape, no fabrication by FoxNews, fabrications are best left to CBS, all those who refuse to see and or recognize the successes in Iraq. I know the typical lib commandment:Thou shalt not speak well of Iraq.

Fabius Cunctator
Sorry about that and no, I wouldn't.

Can't win
Sarah says:

>tax payers need to pay for his wife's and his harvard law degree because they enrolled into colleges they could not afford<

Blacks are routinely accused of taking advantage of a welfare system that has destroyed their work ethic and family structure.

But when they lift themselves out of poverty with an Ivy League education, Sarah still feels the need to disparage them.

Blacks can't win in Sarah's world, a world where blacks should be seen, not heard, and kept down on the farm, vacant of any desire to better themselves.

Sarah: You make some good points...

But what I'm wondering is why the black community (most anyway) aren't vilifying him the same way they've vilified and attacked many other blacks who have actually done well... Justice Thomas, Colin Powell, Condi Rice, Bill Cosby, Larry Elder, Dr. Sowell, etc., etc., etc.

But, the bottom line is that BHO is a raging socialist and has absolutely NO experience that would qualify him to be pres.


Rufus: That was a sick and demented

post.... Obviously, you have no idea what you're talking about.







POLMsgt
He didn't mean our troops in the field and was refering to torturing prisoners.

Durbin
” “During the course of that presentation, I read an e-mail from the Federal Bureau of Investigation that was discovered to exist last August, and has now been produced as part of the Freedom of Information Act. After reading the horrible details in that memo, which characterized the treatment of prisoners at Guantanamo, I then, on my own, my own words, made some characterizations about that memo. I made reference to the Nazis, Soviets and other repressive regimes.” “Mr. President, I have come to understand that was a very poor choice of words. I tried to make this very clear last Friday that I understood to those analogies to the Nazis, Soviets and others were poorly chosen. I issued a release which I thought made my intentions and my inner-most feeling as clear as I possibly could.” “Let me read to you what I said. ‘I have learned from my statement that historical parallels can be misused and misunderstood.

MDoggg-poo: Here's a friendly suggestion

As soon as they come out with a vaccine for BDS, sign up for the clinical trials! :-)

There isn't much that can be done to help your low IQ problem, but maybe they can help you with your derangement.

One out of two isn't bad. Go for it!!!!




New life for the brain dead
This column has certainly brought out the cretins, racists and far right wing nuts!
The posts by bryce, religiouslib, and a couple of others shine amid the drivel and sometimes outright racism in most of the other posts.

There is not a single intelligent argument here for not talking to Iran. Talking and establishing a diplomatic mission is not the same thing as formal negotiations. As someone pointed out, even Crocker basically agrees with Obama and he is part of the Bush administration.

Second, the Maliki govt. is already friends with Iran and the shia sects in the two countries are closely related. If Maliki doesn't retain power, it is quite possible the next government of Iraq will be run by Sadr who would be certain to establish even closer relations with Iran.

Third Ahmadinejad is not the REAL power in Iran. He is basically a figurehead and true power is wielded by Iranian religious leaders. We have little access to these people presently. Establishing a talking relationship will get us closer to these shadowy figures. This is important because access to them will give a better understanding of how much of Ahmadinejad's foolishness is pure bluster for internal consumption and how much is true foreign policy.

Gee Slacker: Thanks for sharing!

Did you make that up all by yourself???



IQ problem
Slacker has more intelligence in one post than Anne has shown in her entire TH posting career.

Pancho wows us again with his wit!
.

Anne
Yes.

If you read what I say carefully, preferably when you are on your meds, it may help you come to your senses.

Slacker: I have NO CLUE as to how or

where you get your information, and how or why YOU think YOU know so much more than anyone else.

But you've kind of shot yourself in the foot.

IF "Ahmadinejad is not the REAL power in Iran. He is basically a figurehead and true power is wielded by Iranian religious leaders." exactly what good would it do to "talk to a figurehead?

"Establishing a talking relationship will get us closer to these shadowy figures. This is important because access to them will give a better understanding of how much of Ahmadinejad's foolishness is pure bluster for internal consumption and how much is true foreign policy."

Really? And you know this how?

IF Ahmadinejad is a figurehead, and the real power is the Iranian religious leaders, what makes you think they're just letting Ahmadinejad mouth off as he has if they don't agree with him?

And, IF the Iranian (Islamic) religious leaders are the real power, then it stands to MORE reason that the promises of "Death to America" and "Wipe America off the face of the earth" should be taken even MORE SERIOUSLY.

You see, they have a religious edict and long, long history of converting the infidels (that includes us) or killing them. And they've already told us that Israel is the little satan and we're the big satan.

Maybe you've forgotten that part.


Taft
The terrorist still know in terms of having the troops denigrated they have allies with Democrats/Liberals.


Anne
Your questions are reasonable and indicate that perhaps you are ready to learn.

1. Do not assume that because you believe that Obama and everyone in the CIA, State Department, DIA and every other agency of an Obama government is a complete and utter idiot, that they really ARE. When the US establishes a mission in a foreign country there are a lot of smart and missioned people that come along. These ambassadors do not talk to only one person, they insinuate themselves every where they can in the government. They develop sources, evaluate these sources, and build conduits between the US intelligence services and the other country that can be ballanced and tested against each other.

Thse communications channels have to be established on both sides before either side will agree to have any formal negotiations leading to a goal. This preparation is MUCH more valuable than any one on one conversations between a single US ambassador and Ahmadenijad.

Yes, there are factions in Iran that would love to see Israel wiped off the map and wish Death to America. But there are also more moderate factions that are in a continuous struggle against the authoritarian Islamic government. One of the benefits of talking to them is to establish a bridge to the moderate factions and help them change the official outlook and positions of the Iranian government. You can't do that by refusing to send any US mission to talk to anyone in Iran.

Slacker writes:"...perhaps you are ready

to learn."

What a condescending horses-patoot you are!!!

Steve Emerson, one of the most well known and respected experts on terrorism said today about Carter's planned meeting with the head of Hamas...

"... one of the worst possible blunders ever made by an ex-president in modern times."

No different from the US meeting with Ahmadinejad.







whats the end game??
lets follow the logic of "staying the course" here.

i am still confused with mccains logic.

if he sees us staying for 100 years "as long as americans are not getting shot at, injured or killed", what if we never reach that point.

should we continue to stay there as well.

are we now taking the position that we should build permanent bases?

are we deciding we must rebuild the entire nation?

have we estimated the number of troops it will take to maintain these permanent bases when and if the violence stops?

have we decided what exactly the mission of U.S. troops would be on these permanent bases?

do we believe that we should foot the bill for this war and reconstruction while we run a deficit and iraq runs a surplus?

do we have a plan of action in the event that someone like sadr is democratically elected (like hamas in palestine)and moves to impose sharia law and tell us to leave?


i could go on for a while but that about covers my basic questions.
these are sincere and honest questions.
i have not heard any of these things being discussed on either side.

we need to talk about these things for the sake of our country's future.

what we DO NOT need to do is point fingers at each other and claim one side or the other is evil simply for trying to find our way out of a very complicated and complex problem.

Obama is a pampered child
who has been raised and nurtured in safe, protected environments. Few things are more secure and sterile than academia and community activism; the people involved WANT you in their worlds. Barack/Barry (whatever) has grown quite accustomed to positive responses to his gifts for reflection and articulation, and he confuses this with global knowledege and competence, as do many of his adherents.

We have been doing the "reach out and understand" (and therefore enable) thing with those who have chosen a value system that involves the destruction of others for many years now. Our often impotent and expensive corrections, education, social welfare systems along with the state of our deteriorating society clearly reflect the folly of systemic codependence Obama thinks is new and audacious.

Evil? That's Wal-Mart. All other things can be smiled and pontificated away.

Rufus
"When did USA start to believe that killing and torture are solutions for every imaginable foreingn policy dilemma. Just kill them all.."


While I find much wanting in US gov't, I must say that if we wanted to "kill them all", we could do precisely that in astoundingly short order. I note we have not.

Slacker
"Yes, there are factions in Iran that would love to see Israel wiped off the map and wish Death to America. But there are also more moderate factions that are in a continuous struggle against the authoritarian Islamic government"

Yes. You are right. However, I do think that refusing to deal with the current leadership does not mean that those in resistance cannot be supported. A little duplicity goes a long way (my mother in law is living proof).

oldsocialworker
isnt that the same logic that got us into this mess in iraq.

we ignored saddam and talked to those who claimed to speak for the iraqi people.

they did not greet us as liberators and believe me the iranian people would take the side of their crazy leadership anyday over an invasion or attack by americans.

Warmongers like Shapiro hate Obama
Like Joe Lieberman, Ben Shapiro is a pro-Israel warmonger who wants America to launch a pre-emptive attack against Iran.

As he sits comfortably at behind the high walls of Harvard, Shapiro wants OTHER Americans to fight and die on the streets of Tehran.

Anyone, like Barak Obama, who suggests actually diplomacy and negotiation (anything that doesn't include Iraq II) is condemned by the squeaky-voiced Chickenhawk Shapiro as "coddling evil."

Like Dick Cheney, and George Bush (speaking of evil) before him, Shapiro is pulling the Hitler comparison to any Mideast leader he doesn't like. Umm, Ben ever hard of Godwin's law?

If Ben Shapiro is so, so brave, why won't he enlist in the U.S. military and lead us into Iran?
He is the typical warmonger who wants Americans to spill blood for Israel. Talk about arrogance.

Shapiro actually says:

"Obama has no problem chatting with the world's bloodiest butchers..."

Has Obama chatted with George W. Bush or Dick Cheney recently?


Applause for the article
Really appreciate this article! I knew I wasn't the only one that could see that Obama's out of touch, not only with J.Q. Public, but with global realities and terrorism. Obama simply does not get it. And the consequences could be dire for the U.S. if somehow he actually became our president. Why is it that Democrats in general, don't seem to see the dangers? Complacency is the only reason I can come up with. Washington politicians in general seem to think we can just talk our way out of everything. Good grief.

America weakens
Obama - not right for America on so many levels.
I do believe the leftists are honestly trying to turn us into a communist country. They don't even seem to know any better. Don't even understand the principles that got us to be the most powerful country in the world.
And as our country backslides and her power is diminishing, they encourage socialism, not even realizing what damage has already been done by too much government "care". It's weakening us.
Back to the principles of our founding fathers. What they did worked. What we're doing, and where we are heading, doesn't.

obama the dictator
Obama is bad for freedom, great for dictatorships. I will never bow in surrender. I will simply ignore to the best of my ability this man child and his next four years.
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