Political Morality

All you've done is restate your previous position, basically, and I still don't buy it.

He pled to that reduced charge based on being arrested for cruising public restrooms for sex.


No matter how much lipstick you use, that pig ain't getting any prettier.

What is the limit on what a Republican can be guilty of and retain his seat? How perfect does one need to be?

I had this same conversation at the Spade, and it went nowhere. It always comes back to the micro---the Larry Craig situation, and ignores the macro---the question you are asking. It is the same one I asked at the Spade, but people are caught up in talking about this one instance without realizing that we often times do ask our elected leaders to be what no human can be. I realize that publicly elected officials have to be held to a higher standard, but we have to realize that they come with the same faults and frailties as the rest of us, and their bieng public officials does not change that.

In the interest of keeping the Spade fresh---and because I can't lure you to my TSN blog---I am going to start postng more sports related material at the Spade. It will be, for now, my thoguhts on what has happened in sports during the week. It may mirror what i have up at TSN, but if you're a sports fan I urge you to drop on by; I should have my first post up a little later today!

as I did at your place.

Cruising public restrooms is a crime of moral turpitude. It's not speeding on the freeway, or failing to signal when making a turn. It's an act of depravity.

It doesn't matter that he pled it down to a reduced charge; that happens all the time. The act that brought the charges in the first place is what counts.

By your lights, we can extrapolate that OJ Simpson's a fine upstanding citizen because a jury of the brain-dead found him Not Guilty.

Sorry, no sale. He's still murdering scum as far as I'm concerned. And Larry Craig is a pervert who CRUISES PUBLIC RESTROOMS FOR SEX.

You want to defend him? Go for it. But examine your standards, and don't criticize the Dems in the future when they support the next Bill Clinton or Barney Frank or Ted Kennedy or whomever.

Husker,


What is the limit on what a Republican can be guilty of and have him removed from his seat?


I'll reply with the Honorable Sen. Moynihan's words,"I know it when I see it."

I get that cruising bathrooms is moral turpitude and worthy of rejection. But that is your impression of what occured. There are perfectly acceptable charges of public lewdness, soliciting, and exposure that were not made. The actual charge of disorderly conduct is not possible to defend against effectively. If I charge you with disorderly conduct for ANYTHING, the chances are about 50-50 you will be found guilty. Based on that, I would be tempted to plead guilty.

And the actual actions that are included:
1. Glancing through the crack into a stall. (I have done that to see if it was full)
2. Tapping of a foot.... Huh
3. Reaching below the cube wall.... errrr
4. After the person in the othe stall moved toward my foot, I touched his. Strange indeed, but moral tirputude?

He was on a 1.5 hour layover. No food on the planes either way. So, he probably planned to eat on that stop. So we are talking of 15-30 min max of waiting. And he went to the bathroom. For sex? Short time to succeed in trolling, don't you think?

The benefit of the doubt. I would be with you if he had pled to different charges or if he had said something out loud or entered the other stall. It is just that I can posit perfectly rational reasons for the actions actually committed.

It is as the Dems say when charging us "it is the appearance of impropriety that matters." At least for Republicans. For Dems appearance be damned, without a conviction of a major felony, there is no harm, no foul.

You and Flagwaver must be reading from the same playbook of excuse-making for Republicans.

Forget it! He pled DOWN TO and GUILTY OF the negotiated charge, based on the act of CRUISING PUBLIC RESTROOMS FOR SEX.

I'm not going to re-enter this whole debate now with you after banging my head against the wall for a week with Flag. You want to see the arguments? Go to his blog.

All you people supporting Craig are trying to split hairs, IMO, acting just like Dems every time they make lame excuses for their own perverts and reprobates, and I can't believe I keep having to have the same discussion over and over again.

As a matter of fact, go to MY blog, and look at my essay from last week. I dealt with it in detail. That was my blog topic.

Sheesh!

Remember one thing, bro. You want to give Craig a pass? Fine, that's your own call. But the price of admission is that you can't EVER criticize the Dems in the future for doing the same thing for THEIR losers.

I just worry who will be left in our party after we reject all the unclean ones.

Maybe fresh blood, people with morals and values, who understand conservatism, and don't walk around with their schwantz hanging out of their zippers.


:-)

There is a line, and it is fuzzy, and I think this fuzziness accounts for a lot of the difference of opinion on the specific matter of Craig. However, I think that there is a specific group of folks whose opinion of where that line is should be counted most heavily, and again I think Doc has the answer:

Larry's career is over, so say his former constituents (if I could, I would underline or italicize constituents).

I don't think the line's fuzzy at all. It's only fuzzy to people who won't make judgements based on some kind of value system.

Like Dems.

Ag Sec. Johanns is runnung for Hagel's seat in the Senate. He's the cheap labor express' guy. Bruning is the conservative. Do Nebraskans know the difference?

If you get a chance, stop by my place to see my little girl tie the knot.

But on this vein, my new essay "The Outdated Second Amendment", inspired by YOU, should help clarify.


How's THAT for a subtle plug?

I have a fresh post at the Spade---Bring gloves , cause it's hot!

I'm doing some housekeeping, and your blog hasn't been active for a long time, so at this point I'm taking it off my Blog Roll.

If you get active again, let me know and I'll put it back up.