Origin and Death of Liberty

Thanks for this topic.

There is no question that just in our lifetime our country has been turned up-side-down. One of the left's keywords, for some time now, has been equality. Equality sounds nice. But what do they really mean by it!

Some may disagree, but I think the word 'entitlement' has become a scourge to this country. I think this is especially true when one looks at the things those on the left think they are 'entitled' to. Was wondering about your thoughts on this.

I've been following along as you try to kick that 45 yard fieldgoal while blindfolded, using a deflated ball, and with 'those moving goalposts'. I applaud your attempts but the old saying is still true: for those who believe, no explanation is necessary; for those who don't believe, no explanation will suffice.

I hope our friend can post on the weekend. Take care, my friend.

Not to steal WorldlyWiseMan's thing here, but how does the bible promote capitalism? I never got that impresssion when I read the bible. Would you mind explaining that a little more?

What an encouragement to hear from you. Yes! I miss our dear friend. I trust he is well and will join us if he has opportunity.

Fallen men are by nature irresponsible; they are prone to dependency because with liberty comes the harsh reality of personal responsibility. When Israel was freed from Egypt and began to face difficulty some wanted to return to Egypt, willing to exchange their freedom for slavery. Apart from the influence of grace, men are no different today.

What Obama and company are doing is criminal; they have trampled under foot the Constitution and it seems that no one in power is even questioning them. Here is where the media is complicit and failed in their duty to keep the state accountable to the people.

I’m afraid that enough of us do not realize what Obama is doing, because there is no concept of liberty in a worldview shaped by social Darwinism. Many think that the Law is not immutable truth revealed by God, but that we are evolving as a nation, rather than sowing the seeds of destruction.

I think the only way of recovery is a spiritual revival; there will be no return to constitutionalism and integrity without first a return to truth and a love for the Law and the Gospel.

Your wisdom is appreciated my friend. (BTW the book is available whenever you want it; I could post a temporary e-mail address for you to send me an address.)

Thanks, we could all use some humor. WWM will yield to you.

Some of these comments were taken from this article…

http://valiantfortruth.blogtownhall.com/2009/02/23/origin_o f_capitalism.thtml

Thank you for clearing that up Valiant. I remember you talking about how the Puritain work ethic influenced capitalism. But I didn't quite understand the biblical justifications they used for the aspects of capitalism like competition, free enterprise, free markets, etc. Not stealing is obvious enough, but that alone doesn't endorse capitalism. It just condemns a crime against it.

There are also parts in the bible, particularly the New Testament, which speak poorly of the rich. Some examples include Luke 16:19-25, Matthew 19:23-24, Mark 10:23-25, Luke 6:24, and James 5:1.

In capitalism, the rich are an natural byproduct. How would people like the Puritains rectify this because it does create a conflict. Promoting something and condemning the natural byproduct is self-defeating. I'm interested to hear your response.

Free markets are basic to liberty; liberty to pursue excellence in our work and liberty to wisely use our resources. Christians are commanded to ‘work as unto the Lord’ and to be frugal…

‘ There is desirable treasure,
And oil in the dwelling of the wise,
But a foolish man squanders it’ [Proverbs 21:20].

The Natural Law argument is that a man’s property is sacred, including his conscience and his labor. The free market allows men to be rewarded in proportion to his labor. Men are motivated by self interest, which is why free enterprise works. Socialist will not work even among the most devout Christians, as was demonstrated by Bradford’s experiment in colonial New England.


Colossians 3 in another one of those chapters where the apostle gives us a summary of the Christian life. Because of the work of grace on our behalf, this is the kind of people we ought to be, which includes our attitude towards work…

If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above…For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ…Therefore put to death your sins…and as the elect of God show forth the fruits of the spirit…but above all these things put on love…bearing with one another, and forgiving one another…even as Christ forgave you.

And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him…And whatever you do, do it heartily, as to the Lord and not to men…for you serve the Lord Christ.

This is the attitude that gave birth to the Puritan work ethic.

I will deal with the references because you pose a good question. But for now would you consider that the answer to your question is found in Mark 10:23-25. This passage comes after the encounter with the rich young ruler. Do you know why the disciples were astonished at this doctrine?

I must confess to just-now getting knocked out of my chair. I just read the Scripture you referenced for Jack, (Mark 10:23-25). I've read this many times, Valiant, but this time was the first time I really noticed the last part of v.24 "children, how hard it is for those who trust in riches to enter the kingdom of God". Wow! It's like I always thought v23 and v25 went together because I've read them so much I can quote them. This is a big deal for me, my friend.

As to the book, the last thing I want to do is burden you with things. I was trying to come up with a coded message for you which would provide the needed information and I'm pretty close, but, whatever you think is best.

Yes! The Scripture is alive when the Spirit is at work. I have one for you that hit me today when I was working with Colossians 3…

‘…if you have been raised up with Christ, keep seeking the things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God…as the elect of God, holy and beloved, put on tender mercies, kindness, humility, meekness, longsuffering…’ [Colossians 3:1; 12]

The language “holy and beloved” is used to describe Christians in the context of being “raised up” with Christ. This struck me as being similar to the language used by John in his description of the first resurrection…

‘Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power…’ [Revelation 20:6]

I think the apostles have the same message. In Colossians 3 look how Paul describes our new life…it is hidden with Christ…when He is revealed, then we also will be revealed with Him in glory.


Ed, I have a temp e-mail address. Please let me know when you send your address. I want you to have the book in hopes it will be a blessing to you.

valiantfortruthsb@yahoo.com

Address has been sent.

I just read Colossians the other day. I've probably been spending a little too-much time (if thats possible) on Romans, and I want to read-and-read all of Paul's work. For silly personal reasons Galatians is one of my favorites (and when I hear charges of arrogance against "friends" I kind of smile remembering how Paul addressed the Galatians. Paul did it in love; my "friends" do it in love).

Ed, message received. I will let you know when it's in the mail. Thank you dear brother. The Lord has a way of sending encouragement at just the right time.

The package is in the mail. Please let me know when you receive it. Expect it within a week.

Thank you, my friend. I'll be looking for it.

that the precedent for capitalism cited came how many years after the New Testament Church began but is regarded as the regular principle. This is despite the fact that unfettered capitalism is a major cause in the death of liberty.

The package just arrived (15 minutes ago) in excellent condition. What can I say!

I am most grateful for the gift, and especially for the nice note on the inside. I can't wait to get started.

I will probably have some questions, but I'll try not to burden you too-much. I would say that I would wait for a lull at your site, but there aren't any....and thats a good thing.

With a heart full of love I thank you again, my good and dear friend.

There is nothing I had rather do than to discourse with you on doctrine and application from Romans. The purpose of the blog is primarily to encourage believers. We view our engagement in apologetics with unbelievers primarily for the same purpose. There is no more to be gained from engaging the obstinate. Our world view has been clearly given. We leave them in the hands of the Lord.

All that is to say as forcefully as I can, do not let the unwelcome prevent you from posting comments on your discoveries in Romans. You have something to offer of interest; we can learn from you and be edified.

About that good encouragement, you have done it again!

A quick note as I ready for work.

I have already encountered a wealth of information.....and i'm still in the introduction.

Not to start an argument - but to bring a smile - I think you have the encouragement thing a little backwards.

Thanks for being willing to answer questions or clarify things. Sorry, gotta go.