A New Mission: Third Party in '08

Countryman brought this to my attention over at my place on my post on the Presidential Candidates. Kudos to him.

I think we should pick one candidate and stick with him, and it must be done together to get the attention of the GOP. Getting enough conservatives to make the jump to a single player may be a problem, though. That's one problem with conservatives, we rarely engage in group action (coming soon to a Redhead blog post near you...).

I like going with Bob Barr, but I really don't think it matters. We need to pick a candidate, any candidate, and vote for them in mass in order to let the GOP know that we are serious about not supporting McCain and their current leftward tilt.

Of course, I've got the beginnings of my own party started over at The Swamp. In my Featured Posts you'll find the platform of the American Tradition Party.

You have a great idea...for 2012!!! That gives us time to organize, find the right candidate, and spread the word.
You will have one result from what you want to do at the minute...elect Obama!!
The damage he can do to the country in 4 years is not worth dissing McCain.
I was just about to post a link to an article by Csrly Fiorina on my blog which makes some sense. I know there is a lot of disgust with McCain. It is in my house, also. but we have a duty to the country to keep Obama and his socialism out. Saving the country from him is more important than giving McCain the shove.

On the national security leg I cant buy into isolationism. That may have worked when the quickest way to get somewhere was a steam engine but it dosen't work in the space age.

like most of the other positions enumerated by Ron Paul.

Glad you're here!

Although I have some qualms about Barr (but ONLY because of the ACLU), I actually agree with you that in a way it doesn't matter whom conservatives choose.

I'm not a herd-mentality guy by nature--quite the opposite--but I would be willing to vote for a third-party candidate I didn't really like if the momentum among conservatives was swinging his way.

Please keep sharing your thoughts here. We need all of the conservative input we can get.

Thanks.

Not surprised to learn that you're up to something similar! :-)

If you'd like to share that information about the American Tradition Party here at the Blogatorium, that would be great.

The most important thing this year, I think (following Redhead's post), is unanimity. I'm not interested in promoting this blog--just in getting conservatives together in one place so that we can settle on ONE candidate and back him (or her).

Even if we don't elect someone this year, we may well do so in 2012, and we'll make an unmistakable point in 2008.

Cheers, big Crawdaddy!

I smell what you're cooking, but I won't be sitting down to dinner with you.

The two party system only becomes responsive when it is threatened. That's what we're doing.

The Whigs didn't think a third-party was possible either, until one emerged to replace them.

The name of that party? The Republicans (you can look it up).

I respect your opinion, but this isn't the forum for that discussion. This forum is intended for those who have already given up on the GOP. If you can figure out a way to get the GOP to move to the right, may God bless your efforts. Truly.

I see no hope there.


All the best,

Norman

The neo-isolationism of some third-party candidates bothers me, too. Then again, I'm getting more and more leery of our current-day aggressive internationalism (and I say this as someone who never met a cruise missile he didn't like--except the one that Bubba used to destroy an aspirin factory in Sudan).

I'm so fed up with the GOP, though, that I'll swallow some isolationism if the other two legs of conservatism are well represented.

Thanks for your comments!

Grand Old Pork party gave up on us. I feel like an orphan.

I think that we ALL feel like orphans. Personally, I feel like an orphan who got handed over to an abusive family. ;-)

Seriously, though, how much more clear could the RI-NO-P make it that our job as conservatives is to show up every two years to vote for them. Then we get to go back to ironing their shirts and bringing them beer and pretzels.

Please read some of good stuff that Countryman has posted to the main blog page. We need your ideas, your opinions, and your input.

Thanks for coming.

You are NOT alone.

If you're interested in joining me and Countryman as regular contributors to this blog, just send me an email: normanloquendiATyahoo.com

Let your articulate, intelligent, conservative voice be heard.

Thanks to everyone for all the support!

I prefer to try to rehab the GOP. Why? Because it's there and the various third parties, including the Libertarians - principles and all - haven't made much impression on the national scene in the about 30 years of campaigning. Rather than look for a new bunch of leaders to follow, I think the GOP can be rebuilt into a party that has a few princples that it will follow one of which will be listening to their constituents and doing what they've promised. I know; I know; a dreamy fairy tale.

The essence of my idea is on my blog over at wordpress, but I won't add the url here since it seems to be considered gauche to do so. I wish you the best of fortune, but I don't think four years is enough for getting either the LP up to speed or building a new party from the ground up. Best wishes, Norman and friends! Make me want to vote for your candidate in four years; will you? *smile*

probably go with Barr, but like I said in the other post, I still have some reservations about his affiliations with ACLU.


I think maybe a little "isolation" might be needed for our country,....wasn't if Jefferson who warned us about foreign entanglements?


I don't like the idea of "nation building", ala NWO, CFR, unfair/unbalanced/unregulated "free trade",etc.


I've been reading about this guy,...Chuck Baldwin, who is running for the Constitution party nom.,...and like a lot of what he has to say....

However, he's not as well known as Barr is.


I really wish there was a way that we could get Duncan Hunter to run on a third party ticket,....what ya guys think,...would that be possible?....Maybe?....maybe?


I DO know this,..we have to do something,...the gop/gobs have deserted us and McShamnesty ain't gettin it for us!!!

I hear you, but the GOP is an old nag with a broken leg.

Time to call the glue truck.

If conservatives would stop accepting the "but the other guy is so much worse" argument, we could elect a President in November.

Even if I'm wrong, and the GOP IS salvagable, they will only come around if the country-club, blue bloods Poohbahs are kicked out en masse and replaced with actual republicans.

If you believe that's going to happen, yet think a third-party is unlikely, well . . .

You have my best wishes, and my appreciation for expression of the same, but if we stay on the GOP reservation, we will continue to be slaves.

If you're not part of the solution, you really ARE part of the problem.

See you in four years! (Or sooner, I'll bet.)

Once the GE campaign gets rolling, check back in. I'm betting that a few weeks of Obamadum vs. McCaindumber will change your mind.

Cheers and good luck to you as well.

I thought very much the same as you four years ago, when we were in the process of reelecting Bush who had accomplished some tax cuts, and a successful prosecution of the war at the time.

In addition, there was a good bit of excitement with Rick Santorum looking like a potential RNC leader, possibly running for President in 08; Arlen Specter facing a stiff challenge from the grassroots effort by Pat Toomey supporters.

My faith in the GOP failed though, when the RNC threw all its weight behind Specter and told Santorum to hit the road; I knew then it was the death knell for hopes of conservativism successfully challenging the GOP establishment.

Conservative Republicans have been trying to change the party from within since Barry Goldwater; with the exception of RNC leaders Reagan and Gingrich for a brief time, the Rockefeller Republicans have held the strings and the purse of the GOP for all those 48 years.

We have tried time and time again to reform the GOP - how many times do we have to repeat the same thing and expect different results? Isn't that the definition of insanity?

Thanks for the comments. I don't know much about Baldwin, but I'm openminded on him and any other conservative third-party folks.

I'd like to have Duncan Hunter go third party as well. If we can assemble ourselves into a reasonably sized, visible coalition, we might be able to persuade someone like him to throw his hat in the ring.

I'm absolutely with you on abandoning the GOP,though. Countryman's comments to the well-intentioned and admirably cordial Ike are directly on target. Four years ago, I wouldn't have even thought about abandoning the GOP in favor of a third party, but now reality has set in.

We've always been the red-headed step-children in the GOP coalition. I used to think about bolting just to get their attention.

Now I want to bolt so that the GOP will implode faster, and leave room for a genuinely conservative third-party (whichever one that might end up being).

Cheers!

After reading Countryman's post, I spent the last four days talking with local GOP folks, both in and out of the "real party". Oh, my! I haven't been that disillusioned since I discovered that the voices of "Amos & Andy" on radio were white men and that was when I was about nine. Dear me; and at my age, to be so ..... wishful thinking will do that to you.

I see where Barr's been nominated and I assume that's a good thing. What would you recommend I do from here? My part of Texas has a "consolidated" multi-county LP organization which claims to include my county so I suppose I should start there, yes? Downloading the LP platform and rules etc will take a bit of time as well. It would seem that voting for an LP candidate isn't sufficient for voting membership in the LP? Twenty-five dollars isn't much these days, I suppose.

Please be gentle with me. Song titles that spring to mind: "It Only Hurts For a Little While"; "I'm Sorry"; "It's Only a Paper Moon"; "Straighten Up and Fly Right". *chuckle at myself*.

After re-reading my post, I'm afraid I was a bit rougher on you last time than you deserved. I didn't mean for what I wrote to come across as anything more than gently chiding, but when I re-read it, it struck me as a bit too rough. I'm sorry about that; I should have edited it more carefully than I did. I promise that I meant no offense, so please accept my sincere apology.

I'm glad to know, at any rate, that Countryman's gentle eloquence struck home.

I am by nature a "glass half full" kind of guy. I'd probably stick with the GOP, even NOW, if I saw some reasonable chance of its veering right--back toward the conservatism that has given the GOP its only consistent electoral success.

I see absolutely NO hope of that; I gather that you don't either.

I'm leaning LP pretty hard right now, with their nomination of Bob Barr--whom I have always liked--despite his association with the ACLU.

I think it would be great for you to whatever you can with the LP in your neck of the woods.

I'd also love to have you let the rest of know what you find out. With that in mind, if you'd like your own "perch" here, I'd be glad to add you as a regular contributor. You can just email me at normanloquendiATyahoo.com (@ ommitted to defeat SPAM web crawlers) and I'll get you set up.

Thanks, and welcome!

This is the most promising development I've seen in this, the most depressing Presidential year I have ever seen.

I've been thinking about this process for some time now. Here are a few thoughts you might consider.

1. The election this year is beyond us. It will be either a Dem or a Rep. We may be able to make a strong enough showing in some states that we can achieve respectability.

2. The prospects for 2012 are decent, if we make a reasonable showing this year.

3. We must build up our grassroots presence. This means election to school board, local government, county government, state government. If we can elect a few state legislators, some county executives, a few mayors of 100,000 population cities, contest a governorship or two, we will move from the nut fringe to the political mainstream.

4. We must coalesce at least some of the "third" parties into one party. This will be like herding cats, but if we don't do it, we will fail. Each of the smaller parties has an organization and a leadership. These parties must be offered a place in the new party, but without a veto on any single issue. This is crucial: No one or group may be allowed to veto an issue or position. Majority rules.

5. We must put forth a statement of principles and a declaration of intent. What do we stand for and what will we do if we are successful?

I think we can succeed if we treat this as a long-term problem and not as something done out of pique because "they" aren't listening to "us" and we don't like John McCain, Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton. We have to do this because the two political parties have abandoned the principles upon which this country was founded and which have preserved us for 200+ years.

Barry

Well-said.

I'm not sure how much consolidation of the various third parties into one larger, more viable entity will be possible until ONE emerges as dominant. This may well be the year for that, and the only party I see as capable of such a feat is the Libertarian Party. I happen to learn libertarian anyway, and always have, but until this year I considered a vote for a third party to be a throw-away. If the LP performs well this year, lots of people will rally to it, which will have the same effect as a formal consolidation.

I'm actually more optimistic than you are about 2008. I don't want to raise expectations recklessly, but a win for the LP is entirely possible--albeit something of a long shot. I have been following politics actively since 1980, and I cannot recall a year when both major parties were in so much turmoil at the same time.

The republicans are destroying what's left of their "brand" by lurching left. The Dems are--far more cannily--running blue dogs to capture the southern and rural vote, but the internecine stife between Obama and Hillary is doing their party long-term damage. If Obama is denied the nomination, blacks will be looking for somewhere else to go. If Obama GETS the nomination, lots of Hillary supporters will be left to choose between a cranky old cancer patient with a trophy wife and a third party candidate.

So we've got at least an outside shot this year, and 2012 is looking GREAT for a third party.

That said, the Blogatorium has not yet endorsed any candidate, but the LP is looking good to me personally.

Since you have a lot to say on this, please let me know if you'd like to added as a regular contributor. No pressure, and no obligation, of course, just a chance for you to share your valuable insights on the main blog. If you're interested, please just email me at: normanloquendiATyahoo.com

Cheers!