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Comment on: Oasis

Gimme Backlash!

68 Comments
Saturday, November, 07, 2009 9:21 PM enemaofthestatistquo writes:

CONTEMPT...

Do I have an AMEN! AMEN!!!
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 1:01 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

"We must stop being so open minded."

You got a headstart on the rest of us in that area years ago.

Is it your position that no Muslim in this country is law-abiding, and therefore no Muslim deserves to practice his/her religion here?
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 5:11 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Benjamin!

Did you even READ this? Yes, I said that the very essence of islam PRECLUDES muslims from EVER being able to live by our Constitution, which celebrates LIFE, LIBERTY, and the PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS. Islam preaches death, enslavement, and torture, to any and all who refuse to be muslim. Our Constitution and islam are MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE, and whether they are temporarily law-abiding or not, their "religion" tells them to lie in order to make us infidels believe they mean us no harm, and when they are strong enough to take over by force. Major Jihad had been spouting that crap for ages, but PC prevented anyone from doing anything about it. Now we have Ft. Hood. For crying out loud, wake up.
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 5:19 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

So there's no hope for Muslims? Should we kick them all out?

For instance, the Muslim lady who works at my local 7-11 . . . do we need to expel her from the country?

How about the Muslim man at the newsstand outside my office building. No hope for him? So we need to expel him, too?

Obviously I need more education on this because they seem like pretty good people to me. Am I just naive in this area?
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 5:30 PM Jim writes:

Don't be stupid Jan

Obviously Ben doesn't want any Muslim to have their rights violated, their right to kill their wives and children, infidels, stone people, SHOOT U.S. military personel or become president and trash our constitution. Why who are we to violate their rights to follow the Koran and it's teachings. Oh, wait a minute... Benny, you're wrong again, that would be a double negative. Either they have to give up their belief in killing everyone, or give up their freedom here and go back to where they are allowed to kill each other. Can't have it both ways although I know you'd like that. I know you get excited when a Muslim kills allot of White Americans.
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 5:41 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

No Hope for Muslims. Or Ben.

They can lie to you to convince you they are harmless. Islam says so. Read Robert Spencer.
A nice, neighborly Iraqi here in Phoenix just ran his daughter down with his Jeep a few weeks ago. She was "too western." He is muslim. She is dead. Her boyfriend's mother remains hospitalized.
As Jim says, they can't have it both ways. They have to give up the psychopathology of islam or go away. Would I like to see them all out of here? You bet! I have seen NOTHING to indicate that any of them embrace the love of freedom, life and joy that America respresents. It isn't in them, or they wouldn't be muslim. You go ahead and cozy up to your little muslim buddies. Nursing the viper at our collective breast, as the U.S. is doing, is what will get us ALL killed eventually. That, and pure, unbridled stupidity.
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 10:45 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

You are not a real American.

What's sad is you think you are.

Sad.
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Tuesday, November, 10, 2009 11:17 PM Jim writes:

Benny's right Jan

Here's what he believes are real americans
http://www.buffalonews.com/494/story/578644.html
http://www.breitbart.tv/html/12704.html
http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/11/05/muslim-kills-daughter-i n-arizona-because-she-became-too-westernised/
You really are messed up in the head Benny....
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Wednesday, November, 11, 2009 12:10 AM Jan@Oasis writes:

Geez, Benjamin

I tell you that a crazy muslim runs over his daughter on purpose and your response is to tell me I'm not an American. I offer you my reasons for believing islam is incompatible with American values, and you tell me I'm not an American. As my six year old grandson says when he's being funny, "Whaaaaa??" That's actually a more intelligent response than yours. Jim--check out islamicthinker.com. Heard about it on Hugh Hewitt. Haven't been there yet but apparently it spells out just what these lunatics have in mind for the world.
I am becoming a weary American.
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Wednesday, November, 11, 2009 9:02 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

It's the part about wanting to get all the Muslims out of the country that makes you not a real American.

It's people like you that led to the Japanese and Italians being placed in camps in this country during WWII. It's considered among the worst things this country ever did.
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Wednesday, November, 11, 2009 1:00 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Benjamin

Actually, real Americans put Japanese, etc. in camps because the government was unsure as to what sort of loyalty it might expect out of people who were living here but had ties to or were from countries which were interested in killing us all or at least dominating us all. I have no problem with a government acting to protect its people first and asking questions later. And everyone does NOT agree that this was "one of the worst things we ever did." Only the lefties who are all hung up on the theory that EVERYONE is good EXCEPT white Americans of western European descent and that diversity is what we need. I lived in Japan for two years, and I have no apologies to make for the actions of the U.S. in a time of war when WE were attacked. If the government operated then the way it does now, with PC the order of the day, I have no doubt we'd all be speaking German or Japanese.
REAL Americans want more than anything else to preserve our freedom and sovereignty and defeat ALL enemies, foreign and domestic. It's a toss-up as to which is more of a threat these days.
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Wednesday, November, 11, 2009 2:01 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

I'm glad I don't think the way you do. Call me whatever you want, but I hope I never become like you.
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Wednesday, November, 11, 2009 10:18 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Don't worry Benjamin!

You'll never think like I do, nor be like I am. And once again, you did not address anything I said. It doesn't really require ANY thought to knee-jerk your way through life and refuse to examine perfectly reasonable, if troubling, points that various people put forth. You said you were nearly done with me (and you need to increase your vocabulary beyond "wingnut" if you plan to stick around); dare I hope we are there?
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Thursday, November, 12, 2009 8:56 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

You are so far to the right, I really don't know where to begin with you. When you actually say something like "we must stop being so open minded", why should I bother?

Your political views are so destructive that you are like Berlin at the end of WWII. Responding to your 'points' (really that's a stretch to call them that) on a blog like this one is like showing up to clean up the mess with a dustpan and broom, when you need an entire reconstruction.

To put it another away, one therapy session a week is not enough. You need to go to Vienna to be treated by a team.

I find it depressing that people think the way you do. How should I try to refute your points? By telling you that I know Muslims who are not out to destroy the country? You'll just tell me that their religion is inconsistent with our principles, so I'm just being naive.

I will stop coming here eventually, but right now I'm like a driver on the New Jersey Turnpike who can't help slowing down to look at a car accident. I know it's disgusting conduct to slow down and look, yet I can't seem to help myself.
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Thursday, November, 12, 2009 9:58 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

"Wingnut"

I might be able to cut down on my use of this word if townhallers could refrain from calling me things like communist, socialist, and Marxist, and telling me how I worship Obama, my 'Messiah'.
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Thursday, November, 12, 2009 4:39 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Oh boo hoo Benjamin

I don't call you a communist, I call BARACK and his buddies communists. Because they SAY they are and I think that's the only thing they've said that ISN'T a lie. Yes, you are naive. That's why discussing anything with you that requires you to face reality is pointless. You can only splutter and rant about "wingnuts" and fling insults all over the place (very messy). My political views are not destructive at all to the people I care about protecting,and in fact are the only hope we have to keep a semblance of the America our Founding Fathers envisioned. Those I want to protect are Americans who love our Constitution, our freedom, our way of life and our values. Don't care a bit about protecting muslims, communists, loony lefties of any stripe, criminals, illegal aliens--need I go on?
You don't know any muslims period. They are allowed, no, ENCOURAGED to lie to infidels (that's you) so that you will think they mean you no harm, and once they think they can take over they pull a Ft. Hood. Please, do yourself a favor and read Robert Spencer, Bruce Bawer (because we are just as sound asleep as Europe), Steve Emerson, Brigitte Gabriel, Nonie Darwish, ANY of those people who have researched, studied and lived under islam. It IS incompatible with American values and law.
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Thursday, November, 12, 2009 10:46 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

And you do yourself a favor and read some books.
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 12:04 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

And once again, Benjamin,

you cannot refute a single point.

Are we there yet?
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 2:15 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

What 'point' should I refute? I'm not sure you have made any points . . . just ranting and raving and writing things that most people would be humiliated to have associated with them.

Nice to know that you think I'm fun. I'll take that as an invitation to continue coming here.
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 2:53 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Fun Benjamin

Oh, I don't know, any point will do. I know it's easier to just say, "you don't have any points." Don't be so lazy! Tell me how islam is compatible in any way with our Constitution. Tell me how a "religion" that requires its follower to lie to everyone else until such time as they can take over their society by force fits in with our values and laws. Tell me how islam's subjugation of women fits in with our ideas about equality and freedom.
Anyway, when I told Crawfish you were fun, I was being sarcastic, dontcha know. Are we there NOW?
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 3:29 PM Jim writes:

Not true Benny

I don't call you a Marxist, socialist or a communist, I call you an idiot, but none of the other stuff. I call Obama all the other stuff and I only do that because he is. Oh and I do get on you about the Messiah worshiping. But hey, you deserve that.
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 5:45 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

We'll be there when I choose. I'm not lazy, I just find your closed-mindedness and obvious racism so offensive that I don't know where to begin.

Let's start here. I'm of Jewish descent. Muslims have killed many Jews in connection with the disputes between them. But as I recall, millions of Jews were murdered in cold blood and systematically by a certain group of people we like to call Germans. So while we're rounding up the Muslims to kick them out of the country, let's round up your German husband as well since I obviously can't trust anyone of German descent not to try to kill me. At least by your reasoning.
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 5:47 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jim

"Jim writes:
Not true Benny
I don't call you a Marxist, socialist or a communist, I call you an idiot, but none of the other stuff. I call Obama all the other stuff and I only do that because he is. Oh and I do get on you about the Messiah worshiping. But hey, you deserve that."

Nice to know that I've been downgraded to idiot. I guess I'll take it.

But let me remind you that I worship nothing. Not any fictional ghost. Not any 'messiah'. Although most other people do, right?
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 5:53 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

"We must stop being so open minded."

OK, Jan. I'm thinking about it more and perhaps we do need to stop being open-minded.

I've decided that since your husband is German, and Germans killed millions of Jews, he is a potential Jew killer. To get me to follow your way of thinking, I need you to get him out of the country and stop any members of his family from coming here. I am clearly not safe as long as those Jew-killing Germans are around.
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 7:04 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Wow, Benjamin

So clever! The Nazis, not the Germans per se, killed 6,000,000 Jews (60+ years ago). The Nazis were roundly, soundly defeated in a WAR. Therefore, they are no longer in a position to perpetrate another holocaust. My hubby was raised by Lutherans, who as far as I know do not advocate killing anyone. True, the Germans were certainly culpable in some ways--many were anti-semitic and probably thought killing Jews was a fine idea. Nevertheless, the only organized killing going on in Germany now is when muslims blow themselves and as many westerners as they can to smithereens. So your comparison is simply not valid.
The muslims are weaned on hatred of all things non-muslim, and they either buy it or they die. There is no middle ground. If they embrace American values and love of life, they have to renounce their death cult. And guess what THAT is punishable by?
You don't get under my skin, not at all. You give yourself too much credit, sorta like the Prez gives himself. You do, however, bore me. That's way worse, don'tcha think?
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Friday, November, 13, 2009 7:52 PM Maureen001 writes:

Jan

I ain't no Benjamin, but you really blew me right out of the water with this!

If you really have read the Constitution, you must recognize that your entire premise (religious freedom colliding with the Constitution) is flawed. The Constitution is the document that limits government from infringing on our God-given rights, and religion is one of those. If you've read any of the writings of the Founding Dads, you would know what great pains they went to in designing a government that Roger Williams of Rhode Island would find accepting of his religion (Puritanism, considered extreme at that time).

All Muslims are the same? Hardly, especially after they've been in this country a while. If anything is going to bring about a Reformation in that religion, it's going to be exposure to Western ideology, not rejection by it.

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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 5:59 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

No, Maureen...

...my premise is not flawed in the least. The Founding Fathers went out of their way to allow for free practice of one's religion and to not try to establish a state religion. However, they did not take into account a political ideology, calling itself a religion, whose sole purpose is to replace our laws and our Constitution with sharia law and completely dominate every aspect of the lives of our citizens as they dominate the lives of those calling themselves muslims. There is nothing in the Constitution (I have my little Heritage Foundation pocket edition right here) which allows a "religion" to murder fellow citizens as well as family members, to institute laws that are in complete opposition to our way of life and our values, or to force their belief system on every country they inhabit--and this is what they do. It's their goal, their reason for existing and their mandate from their Little Book of Horrors. I beg you, BEG YOU to read Robert Spencer's books on Islam, Bruce Bawer's book, While Europe Slept, Nonie Darwish, and Brigitte Gabriel. I urge you to look up Geert Wilders speech in New York at the Four Seasons. I believe it was in February. (to be continued)
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 6:10 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

No, Maureen (cont.)

Educate yourself! Listen to Wilders, who lives in a country that is being devoured by islam while it pretends not to notice the disappearance of its culture and freedoms. The Dutch are waking up, but it is really too late I think, because like most of Europe, they don't reproduce much anymore--but the muslims do.
Hear this: islam is INCOMPATIBLE with our Republic and its governing principles. If muslims stay muslim, there is no way they can accept our way of life. And they are instructed to lie to infidels and make them THINK they are your friends.And I see you fell for it. Then they are supposed to convert or kill you. It has nothing to do with how long they are here--Hasan was BORN here for crying out loud. They either give up the sick belief system (and I don't think they do unless they convert to Christianity) or go live in Somalia. Or any of the other countries they have completely destroyed. Does Lebanon ring a bell? Beirut, formerly a glittering jewel, now rubble and oppression. They bring nothing good, and your naivite is going to be the death of us. Just look at Europe. (to be cont.)
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 6:16 PM Maureen001 writes:

Jan

I'm aware of those commenters and I am fully aware of the threat of Islamafascists. But the very Constitution you are citing protects the rights of Muslims in this country who are not working against it. You have been incited by those who have profited by doing so. Don't lose site of the very elements that make this country so very worth protecting by tossing aside its applications to all.

Muslims of this world are going to have to take a stand at some point. Either they will assert control over their religion and marginalize those who distort it or they will suffer the consequences. In the meantime, we do not need to toss out our own doctrines. Try substituting "Jew" or "Christian" in your post for every time you've written "Muslim" to get a real view of how you sound. It's not flattering.

If you recall, we are confronting the very same problem confronted by our Founding Dads, only then they called the "Musselmen". Somehow, they managed not to kill every Muslim in sight. I want to defeat our enemies, not become them.
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 6:26 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

No, Maureen

It wouldn't be necessary, at any rate, to DO anything in the way of passing NEW laws, if we would drop the politically correct crapola and go after the treasonous imams preaching death to us and Israel, stop being scared rabbits (Diversity Bunnies like Casey) and crack down on ANYTHING that smacks of anti-American activity that threatens our citizens in any way. Act first, and worry about the boo-hooing and the whining later. You talk death to America, you go bye-bye. Let the CIA and the FBI DO THEIR JOBS. It'll never happen of course, with the loony left in charge, so until we get some leaders with spines we just have to keep trying to stir up the masses and hope they awaken from their European-style slumber before it is really, truly too late. And fire Casey. Talk about nursing the viper at our breast.
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 6:26 PM Maureen001 writes:

Jan (cont)

"If Jews/Christians/Mormons/fill in the blank stay Jews/Christians/Mormons, there's no way they can accept our way of life." Come ON, now!

There is investigation going on now that may prove this Hasan monster was acting on instruction of Taliban or al-Qa'eda, that he may have been sending money to support terrorist actions. But what does that have to do with the Muslims in this country who, say, escaped the mad mullahs in Iran or got away from Saddam Hussein, or even like Joseph Farah's (Newsmax)parents, fled Lebanon? If one thing brings about reformation to Islam, it will be contact with the west, not expulsion.
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 6:39 PM Maureen001 writes:

No argument

You're absolutely correct about the harm the Left is doing to this country. I couldn't agree more. And politically correct thought/speech merely prevents us from seeing clearly what is before us. You're right.

The whacko stentorians who speak for the Islamafascists speak to the worst among us. Who else would recruit from the bottom feeders in our prisons and jails but those who can ONLY tap into the discontent of the do-nothing sociopaths?
The real treason, IMHO, comes from the educators whose promotion of Marxist doctrine enables Islamafascists to go beyond the talking stage to the violent action stage unencumbered. They are the ones sweet-talking the verbal PC straitjacket on us, and we pay them big bucks to do it.

Instead of advocating against those who share our values, why not start tackling the institutions and leaders who have brought the violent riffraff to the front as spokespersons for Muslims? Fight them on their own battlefields. What if they ran a Marxist university and nobody came? You don't have to abandon the Constitution to do that. It's the American way, you know.
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 6:42 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

OMG

Maureen. There is no comparison between islam and the religions you cite. Christianity, Judasim, LDS, even eastern religions such as Buddhism--are not DEATH CULTS. Hasan made a speech to fellow drs. at Grand Rounds saying, "We love death more than you love life." You cannot build on that and make anything good. And as evidenced by the recent murder in Phoenix of a daughter by her Iraqi immigrant father, muslims are BRINGING IT HERE, not escaping from it. If you look up the number of (dis)honor killings here and in Canada over the past decade, it might give you pause. Muslims here, there or anywhere are following the same tenets that Hasan was, or they wouldn't be muslim. You must grasp this singular truth in order to face reality.
I do not care at all how I "sound." I have no interest in being pc, sensitive, fair, or any of the other touchy-feely, leg-tingly descriptions the left is so fond of. I want to SURVIVE. I want my grandchildren to survive. You must realize that islam itself, by its definition, works against this country. And don't you dare dismiss the brave souls like Gabriel, Hirsi-Ali, Darwish, and our own Spencer and Bawer, as "commentators" who profit from their works. Shouldn't they?? They are also in grave danger for their decision to tell the truth about islam. I have not been "incited," but I have sure as hell been educated. I can only wish you and your fellow babes-in-th-woods will be also at some point.
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Saturday, November, 14, 2009 7:02 PM Maureen001 writes:

Calm yourself, Jan

If you don't call this 'incitement', I hate to think what you do consider it!

Islam gains no foothold in the country except among the bottom feeders in prison and jail. By contrast to Christian and Jewish religions in our society, most of which have already undergone reformation from their fundamentalist extremist earlier stages, it is found lacking in so many ways. It's doctrine of living an ethical life, though, sure beats the heck out of the materialistic one that's evolved here and there is some appeal in that. But you have to have a little understanding of the religion to know how one-sided your accusations are.

The Qu'ran is layered in chapters, somewhat like the Old Testament and New Testament, written at different time periods. There are conflicts in some of what is written there, and over time its leaders have said that later statements take precedence over earlier ones. Fundamentalist/Islamafascist Muslims are following only the earlier chapters, ignoring the later ones. Most Muslims are following the whole thing, which probably accounts for their peaceful practice of their faith. It doesn't take a lot of effort to search out Islamic religious leaders who disagree loudly with what is being done in the name of their faith. They post on the internet too, only they don't get media attention like the outlaws do.

We don't need to toss our Constitution and toss out Muslims, but we DO need to take the power away from those in THIS country who insist our way is wrong or flawed or imperialist or whatever buzzword they use these days to portray us as bad guys. Those who we allow to tie our hands with silken words so we are prepped for slaughter MUST be the target. They pose the greater threat.
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Sunday, November, 15, 2009 9:51 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

You are engaging in rationalization.

Your husband is a German.

The Nazis were Germans.

The Germans allowed the Nazis to take power.

The Germans enthusiastically supported the Nazis.

The Nazis (and therefore the Germans) coldbloodedly and systematically murdered 6 million like me.

So, by your logic, I cannot feel safe around Germans or with Germans in this country.

If you are going to be consistent in your beliefs about cleansing this country of those people who pose a danger to us, then you should get your husband and your kids (who are of part German descent) and your grandkids (who are of part German descent) out of this country. And you should take steps to ensure that none of your husband's Jew-killing family come here.

Please let me know when you have taken these steps which are consistent with your beliefs and American values.
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 10:15 AM Jan@Oasis writes:

"Calm down"

is what people say when they want to dismiss a point of view but cannot. As in, "oh you're just hysterical."
According to what I've read, Mohammed became MORE radical and violent as time went on, and the later injunctions to wage jihad against the world, etc. took the place of the milder (not much) earlier instructions. But it doesn't really matter, does it? Early, late, late early--what matters is what behaviors we can observe NOW. What we see is a murderous cult with billions of members who have so far brought nothing but havoc, death and destruction to every society they've infiltrated, destroyed freedom wherever they've obtained a foothold, and who have SAID over and over that their fondest desire is the obliteration of Israel and the U.S. Or total domination. Take your pick. It truly doesn't matter where it comes from, does it? As Dennis Prager says, I don't judge a "religion" by what it says but by what its adherents do.
You really have to stop comparing islam with Judaism and Christianity. It doesn't wash. I don't plan to embark on a theological discussion, because once again it doesn't matter much what you think the doctrines of any religion say or imply, it matters what the people who follow those religions do. The left is fond of bringing up the occasional crazed Christian, but each time Christianity denounces the crazed Christian, while islam celebrates every suicide bomber and jihadist, including the Ft. Hood killer. Just no comparison.
But thanks for stopping by.
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 10:28 AM Jan@Oasis writes:

Too silly.

Benjamin, you have to be serious in order to discuss anything serious. By the way, are you aware that the root word of "rationalization" is "rational?"
The Germans did not universally support the Nazis. They were TAKEN OVER by the Nazi party, albeit with their consent. I am not sure they knew the whole plan; nevertheless, as I pointed out before, the Nazi party and its followers were DEFEATED in a war, and thus rendered powerless. Wouldn't it have been better to take them out BEFORE they did their unparalleled damage, once it became clear what they were trying to do? Instead, the Germans--and the Jews themselves--hid their heads in the sand or went along with the tide, thinking it couldn't possibly...no, really, it couldn't be.... Oh but it was.
That is where we find ourselves here. As open-hearted, generous Americans, it is hard for us to believe that people who come here to live mean us harm and do not wish to embrace our freedom and opportunity. But the evidence is there, is you choose to see it. If not, there is little anyone can do to convince anyone else. There are none so blind as those who will not see. If you want to see the future of any country which does not address the islam issue early on, read Geert Wilders speech at the Four Seasons in New York. And ask not for whom the bell tolls. It tolls for thee.
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 10:35 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

I'm not sure which I have more of a problem with: your bigotry or your hypocrisy.

Just as you object to the Nazis as being viewed as representative of the German people as a whole, can you open your mind enough to consider that the Muslim people may object to being judged by the behavior of their worst radicals?

And are you aware that the founder of your husband's church, Martin Luther, was a raging anti-Semite?
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 11:41 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

"By the way, are you aware that the

root word of 'rationalization' is 'rational?'"

Kudos to breaking down the word and discovering the word "rational" in "rationalize". Nonetheless, the MEANING of the word is "to ascribe (one's acts, opinions, etc.) to causes that superficially seem reasonable and valid but that actually are unrelated to the true, possibly unconscious and often less creditable or agreeable causes."
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 12:03 PM Jim writes:

Let me Just Clarify Jan

The Nazis came to power by blaming the former government for the war, the economy, unemployment and by promising change. They promise that taxes on the rich would be shared with the poor, they promised universal healthcare, they promised to take control of the big powerful companies and share that wealth, they promised more government jobs. They promised to make the evil rich in society (Jews in this case) pay for being successful. They indoctrinated the youth (they had the largest support from the young). They did it through class warfare.

Now I know what you're thinking Jan, nothing like that could happen in this modern day, "who would elect someone that would make those same promises". Well I'm sure that none of that could happen today, or could it?
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 7:11 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Frankly, Benjamin

Neither my husband nor I feel the Germans were or are contrite enough regarding the Holocaust. As for the muslims, I'd hate to be hanging since we all started waiting for them to object to the terrorist attacks and kidnappings, bombings, beheadings and other islamic passtimes.
Congrats on owning a dictionary by the way.
My hubby has left the Lutheran church, while I have recently joined it. You'll be happy to note that the Lutherans are not "raging anti-semites."
Poor Martin, he just can't catch a break. The Catholics hate him too. He's been dead a while though, so I can't quite see how we can relate him to the current doings or even the WWII doings. Seems "irrelevant." Look that up.
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 7:18 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Jim

Hmm, why does your comment have a ring of familiarity to it? "Class warfare?" Oh, I'm sure that isn't possible here. Ever since B.O. came to town, the whole country is just one big ball of love--the poor for the rich, the black for the white, the muslims for the Jews and Christians, the Dems for the Repubs--gosh it just makes a tingle go up your leg, doesn't it? Yech.
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Monday, November, 16, 2009 7:29 PM Jim writes:

Oh I feel the tingle now

How could I have missed all that love Jan!

I love Benny...
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Tuesday, November, 17, 2009 1:11 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

"Congrats on owning a dictionary by the

way"

I could say the same to you, Jan.
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Tuesday, November, 17, 2009 4:33 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

"Neither my husband nor I feel the Germans were or are contrite enough regarding the Holocaust."

Why do you think that is, Jan? Could it be because they don't feel remorse?

I give your husband credit for dropping Lutheranism though. What made you take it up? I mean, yeah, maybe Luther's been dead a long time, but you are talking about a religion that was founded with ideals of anti-Semitism. Maybe it's you I have to worry about.
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Tuesday, November, 17, 2009 4:34 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Congratulate me

Don't forget to congratulate me, Jan. I'm trying to "stop being so open minded", since you think that's the way to be to be a good American. How am I doing?
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Tuesday, November, 17, 2009 11:03 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Benjamin,

you have that mystifying characteristic of all lefties: you don't answer questions. I asked you if you didn't think it would have been better to stop the Nazis BEFORE they brought such devastation to the Jews and others. Well?
I am neither a hypocrite nor a bigot.Are you just randomly pulling words out of your little dictionary to beef up the name calling? I think islam is dangerous and destructive,and I proceed on that basis. My actions and my words match, in other words. I judge the world on the REALITIES that I can see with my own eyes and hear with my own ears. I have seen NOTHING to indicate any followers of islam are in any way unhappy with their murderous representatives.
Technically hubby did not really leave Lutheranism, but instead grew up in a family where church meant baptism and confirmation and not much else. I grew up going to church every Sunday, but never felt a connection to the Presbyterians, which is what my family was. I went actively looking for a church with my daughter, and found a real home in the church I belong to now. It happens to be Missouri Synod Lutheran, different from other synods in that it is less liberal than evangelical and less conservative than Wisconsin. You have to admit, I answered your question. Hubby believes in God though, just not a big fan of organized religion. Different strokes.
I do own several dictionaries but I'm also the daughter of an English teacher. I love English.
So, also you never did tell me how the tenets of islam are going to fit right in with our love of life and freedom. I'm listening.
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Wednesday, November, 18, 2009 9:26 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

"I asked you if you didn't think it would have been better to stop the Nazis BEFORE they brought such devastation to the Jews and others. Well?"

Yes, it would have. Does that lead you to the conclusion that we should expel all Muslims from this country?

It could also lead to the conclusion that your husband and family should be kicked out, since we know what atrocities Germans are capable of.

"So, also you never did tell me how the tenets of islam are going to fit right in with our love of life and freedom."

Oh, Jan, are you actually asking me to justify a religion? Do you remember to whom you are talking? I can't stand ANY of them. All of them are hypocritical, manipulable, and useful to justify a person's worst prejudices.

However, there are people who have good hearts and they use their religion to help them do good works. (I don't think you are one of those people.) Among those people are Christians, Jews, and, yes, Muslims. The radical elements of all of religions are dangerous, among Jews (example: Meir Kahane), Christians (example: atrocities of Maronites), and Muslims (I obviously don't need to remind you of any examples, since you are obviously obsessed with them).
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Wednesday, November, 18, 2009 9:28 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

"I am neither a hypocrite nor a bigot."

I'll reconsider calling you a hypocrite since you may be disturbingly consistent in your views.

But you are a bigot. You realities are fueled by your prejudices.

I would have hated to have been a Muslim who needed medical care and got you as my nurse.
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Wednesday, November, 18, 2009 8:22 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Oh, don't worry Benjamin.

If you were a muslim and if I were your nurse, I would do for you what I would do for any patient; however, I would flatly refuse to move your bed around to face Mecca, as I read in one of my excrutiatingly politically correct nursing magazines. If your family wants you to face Mecca, THEY can move the bed. Save my back.
I don't recall asking you to JUSTIFY islam. I asked you how it would fit in nicely with freedom and life affirmation. It's interesting you had to dredge up Meir Kahane. One crazy Jew, quite a while back if I remember right, and billions of crazy muslims. As I said, I am not bent on a theological discussion in these comments. I am judging BEHAVIOR, not theology. And once again, if muslims object to terrorism in their name, why don't they OBJECT to terrorism in their name?
Don't think I said we should expel them all. Think I said I'd LIKE to. Since that won't happen, I said we need to crack down on the imams preaching anti-American hate. I would have said the same about ol' Jerry Wright, BUT as far as I know no one's been murdered on his instructions. Of course I don't know for sure....I would certainly think we should crack down on vermin like Hasan, who was signing his e-mails to his SUPERIORS with Praise to Allah. All the big red flags that were ignored add up to 14 dead and 30 wounded and taxpayer money being spent to keep the vermin alive. Wow.
Benjamin, you're so typical of the left. If we call Obama a dope and criticize his policies, we're racists. If I point out the rather obvious and severe problems with islamic behavior, I'm a bigot. And of course, ALL religions are the same. Really Ben? Really? Add a little dash of moral equivalency, and voila, you gotcha a lefty.
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Wednesday, November, 18, 2009 8:38 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

And,

I am truly sorry for your undisguised bitterness. But it does no good to call me names, insult me, or try to attribute motives to me that you cannot possibly determine, since you don't know me. I am very comfortable with myself, as flawed as I am--and we are all flawed. But I am also pragmatic and realistic, and so I could never refuse to see-- or ignore-- the looming threat to our way of life from creeping islamism, political correctness run amok, and the idiotic administration, aided by Congress and the MSM, the latter of which is in bed and HAVING SEX WITH that administration. (Bit of hyperbole for the sake of emphasis, one of Mom's favorite ways to make a point). A lethal combination, what? I know, I know, I'm just overreacting, I'm paranoid, I'm a wingnut, blah, blah, blah. Spare me. Will you just read the damn books I keep telling you to read?? And THEN try to stay in denial.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 11:58 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

I'm not basing my conclusion that you are a bigot on your opposition to Obama. I'm basing it on plenty of other things you've said that I've already addressed.

I have plenty of books to read. I'm not going to put books on my reading list just because they were recommended by a wingnut. Oops! I did it again!
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 12:05 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

If Meir Kahane was an insufficient example of poor behavior by Jews because he's only one person, how about the Deir Yassin massacre?
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 12:28 PM Jim writes:

Give it a rest Jan

I mean, you're not going to read Benny's favorite books like Mein Kampf, The Communist Manifesto, Proletarian Chicks in Bondage, The Little red Book, or The Audacity of a Dope: Thoughts on Destroying the American Dream. So you can't expect him to read ours.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 1:50 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

I suppose not, Jim.

But it's too bad, because I recommend great books. My dad was stationed in Germany right after WWII, so my parents had some interesting books and insights on the Nazis and what happened to Germany.
I also recommend And I Will Bear Witness, two volumes of diaries kept by a Jewish professor married to an Aryan woman in Dresden before, during and after the war, Victor Klemperer. As you read each entry, the gradual disappearance of all freedoms, one by one, all security, day by day--it is just chilling. It makes one realize how precious our freedom is and how dangerous are the freedom-haters in our midst.
Thanks for stopping by as always.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 1:58 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Benjamin, try to stay in the present...

...which is where we happen to be living. The only GROUP going around all over the world blowing people up, kidnapping, torturing and murdering innocent reporters, contractors, writers, aid workers--as well as OUR military and others'--are muslims. Right now, terrorism resides right smack in the middle of islam, and nowhere else. There are no Christian or Jewish or Buddhist or Hindu or Shinto terrorist cells here or anywhere else. It's islam. Islam. Say it with me: islam. THAT is who owns terrorist tactics and intentions in our world. Period.

I don't care if you read any books I recommend or not. Stay ignorant. Who cares?

I do hope we get there by Christmas. I think you would definitely try to rain on my Christmas parade. You can't, of course, but you would try, I just know it.

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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 2:14 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jim

"I mean, you're not going to read Benny's favorite books like Mein Kampf, The Communist Manifesto, Proletarian Chicks in Bondage, The Little red Book, or The Audacity of a Dope: Thoughts on Destroying the American Dream. So you can't expect him to read ours."

I have read "Mein Kampf" and "The Communist Manifesto", both out of curiosity. Neither of them are among my favorites.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 2:16 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

"I do hope we get there by Christmas. I think you would definitely try to rain on my Christmas parade. You can't, of course, but you would try, I just know it."

I like Christmas music and many Christmas decorations. I don't see myself affecting your Christmas in any way.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 2:18 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

"There are no Christian or Jewish or Buddhist or Hindu or Shinto terrorist cells here or anywhere else. It's islam. Islam. Say it with me: islam. THAT is who owns terrorist tactics and intentions in our world. Period."

I'd have to look into the Buddhists, Hindus, and Shintos, but I can't say that Christians and Jews are completely innocent. The Islamic terrorists did not come out of a vacuum.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 8:05 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

Putting words in my mouth Benjamin...

...again. Don't think I said Jews and Christians are completely innocent. Think I said the only group committing organized terror strikes all over the world are muslims. I might mention, just in passing, that I belong to two groups which support Israel: International Fellowship of Christians and Jews, and Christians United for Israel. Conservative Christians are by far Israel's best--only?--true friends in the world.
No, you won't affect my Christmas--you're right about that. I was kidding, which you often seem to miss. I wish you a wonderful season and a future connection to God, if not to Christ. The music is SO much better when there is meaning behind it. I still get chills, as I have since my childhood. America has been so blessed. I have been so blessed. We must take care, lest we lose it.
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Thursday, November, 19, 2009 9:18 PM Jim writes:

Benny and Marx and Lenin

Allow me to quote our greatest president. "How do you tell a communist? Well, it's someone who reads Marx and Lenin. And how do you tell an anti-Communist? It's someone who understands Marx and Lenin."
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 9:11 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

"I wish you a wonderful season and a future connection to God, if not to Christ."

I intend to have the first, but there's no chance of the second, except in my enjoyment of fiction and literature.

"The music is SO much better when there is meaning behind it."

Since you've always been a believer, it's probably not conceivable to you that it's possible to enjoy it without believing. The classical music, especially, is wonderful. It does not, however, make me want to go out and worship a baby born 2,009 or so ago.

"I do hope we get there by Christmas. I think you would definitely try to rain on my Christmas parade. You can't, of course, but you would try, I just know it."

I shouldn't have mentioned that I'll stop coming here when I get bored because now you are harping on it ad nauseam. Ironically, that is getting boring.
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 9:12 AM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jim

I would expect that you would think Reagan was a great president, but surely you don't think he was our "greatest" president.

I assume you are not a fan of FDR, but you have no doubt heard of Lincoln and Theodore Roosevelt?
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 11:27 AM Jim writes:

Why Benny, You Are Right!

Doesn't it feel good to be right? You can says that word over and over to yourself (right).
Yes Teddy Roosevelt was indeed a great president, establish most of our Nation Parks in land area, of course a Republican is the one most intersted in REAL conservation, not the fake conservation like they practice on the left. An Lincoln was a great president, abolished slavery. And again of course a Republican was the one to go through with REAL reform, not the fake reform designed to make minorities dependent on the government like the left.

FDR? Are you kidding? Destroyed the economy for 10 years when he could have fixed it. Much like your lord and master the messaih Obamanation is currently doing tou our economy.
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 12:09 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jim

I purposely picked Republican presidents because I figured you'd never admit any Democrats were good presidents. But the parties as they used to be are not equivalent to the parties as they are now. (Polk and Cleveland were Democrats, but would they be now?)

TR was a Republican but he was a progressive Republican, and the conservatives couldn't stand him.

FDR was a Democrat, but might have been a Republican except that he thought there was no room for growth for another Roosevelt in that party considering all of TR's sons.
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 12:11 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jim

Can you at least give FDR credit for getting us through WWII?
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 5:32 PM Jan@Oasis writes:

That was my hope,

Benjamin, that you'd get bored and move on (no pun intended). Perhaps I shall continue to harp. Fun for one and all.
I'm glad you are going to have a wonderful Christmas season, and just as I don't care if you read the books I tell people to read, I don't care if you ever embrace religion or God or anything of that nature. If the music is sufficient, have at it. Enjoy.
Now we are arguing over which presidents were good, and which presidents were not? Talk about fiddling while Rome burns.
It might be more fun to argue over which presidents were evil.There may have been more, but I can only think of two. ;-)
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Friday, November, 20, 2009 6:56 PM Benjamin K. Charles writes:

Jan

I love history way more than I love politics. Usually I am more interested in politics when it becomes history, and I love hearing people's views on the presidents of the past. If you have an opinion on Grover Cleveland or Rutherford B. Hayes, I'd love to hear it.

I assume the presidents you are talking about as evil are both Democrats. And I bet you mean Clinton and Obama.

I think that many of our presidents have been flawed. "Evil" is a pretty extreme word. The closest we've come to a president that is actually "evil" would be Nixon. But when he had many problems; if he dealt with them through therapy, he might have been one of our greatest presidents, but his paranoia, bitterness, and anger were too powerful for him.

I personally think that George W. Bush did evil things under the guise of being a religious man -- which offends me most. I think about him less than I used to, which has been good for me. Bush was probably not really an evil man, but he was incompetent, smug, and, frankly, weird.
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