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Comment on: ANTI-LIBERAL ZONE

WHAT IF MCCAIN?

75 Comments
Monday, September, 08, 2008 7:58 AM beachmom writes:

Good post Gunny

I am a fan of Sarah Palin. A big part of it is because she shows the backbone and more bal#@ than most of the men in the GOP. I don't think she would shy away from telling McCain what she thinks about anything. Especially as she becomes more comfortable around him.
If Barry the Marxist gets elected we will have it worse than when Peanut Boy was POTUS. It would be more difficult to recover from it too. There are too many people who are ignorant of any history. Too many who don't read anything except what the media tells them too.
If people would go through Crawfish's excellent multi-part posts of Barry's blueprint for change and then look up and read Marx and Engels' Communist Manifesto, they would see glaring similarities.
But, so sad, not enough people will take the time from watching Youtube to do it.
With all of Barry's planned tax increases, I told my husband if he's elected we should sell all of our investments, buy gold and then when everything hits rock bottom and a conservative is on the POTUS ticket buy the stocks back.
I'd hide my guns too.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:03 AM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

beachmom

We have a number of investments that pay dividends and would have to bail before paying an additional 40% as would MOST investors I am sure. The economy would tank and while we can blame it on the Dummycrats, living through it would SUCK! I already lived through Carter, I would prefer NOT living through OBmabi/Plugs.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:13 AM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

NEW OVOMIT FLIP FLOPS

1. Obama's verbal slip "My Muslim faith"

2. Says he considered joining military after high school. Yeah, right!

3. NOW he says could delay rescinding tax cuts. Can we say PANDERING!

4. NOW he is reconsidering the abortion question.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:30 AM Nee writes:

and Guns

Don't forget that he lied about the selective service. It was only reinstated in 1980...he graduated in 79!!!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:36 AM clyde writes:

Gunny

Don't know if you have had the chance or not,but you NEED to check out philosophocon's blog posts from yesterday.Eye-opening at the least. We ALL have a very tough choice to make here.My preference is to stand up for my beliefs,as we all should. The more info the better.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:40 AM R E writes:

What if Mc

I stand with you Gunny on not trusting Mccain but also hope that Sarah will be the real brains in the white house.
I think your quote below hits a bulleye. I do not think the muslim slip was a slip, just the real American oslammer osama obama coming to front. He wasn't the one who made the correction but had to be corrected. How does someone else know what another persons religious leanings are except by their actions? osama's actions speak volumees of how much he and his wife hate America.

Obambi would jump into bed with America's enemies like a two dollar wh0re with her p*mp!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:57 AM beachmom writes:

Gunny

I was only 17 or so when Karter was POTUS. I remember my father talking about going to a loan shark instead of a bank because loan sharks were carrying a lower interest rate.
I also remember watching the hostage takings and threat of kidnappings every night. It was more dangerous than ever for an American to travel.
God help us all if Barry the black liberation church believer gets elected.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 10:00 AM The Godfather I writes:

You're thinking here is

perfectly logical. What I think most of us wanted was someone to stand next to McCain and when he's about to do something liberal they put their hand firmly on his shoulder and say. "Not a good idea." I think we found her.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 10:02 AM philosophocon writes:

Well, frankly Gunny, I don't think

there are really any what ifs as far as McCain is concerned, he's about as known a quantity as a politician can be. I like Palin, but in the end she would be VP, the world's most prestigious second banana. We are all aware of McCain's arrogance and the maverick label applies in part due to the fact that he doesn't like to listen, at least not to people in his own party.

Come by my place, I've done some pretty detailed looking into McCain's recent legislative activities, tell me you don't know exactly what you're getting or that you're going to like much of any of it. Look at who he's worked most often with on legislation. Notice how long he's worked with some of them. Then try and tell me how Palin, who he probably just met for the fist time this year, is going to be a bigger influence. Oh, and by the way, he's worked with Obama on more bills than just about any Republican Senator during the current Congress. And also Hitlary and Turban Durbin.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 11:23 AM BrianR writes:

Uh huh


Well, he's now pledged -- as of yesterday -- to appoint Dems to his cabinet, as I wrote in my latest essay. Promptly taking his earliest post-convention post-Palin opportunity to stick it to conservatives once again, clearly telling us to get stuffed.

"Here's your conservative sop! Palin! Now get the hell away from me!"


As to Palin, just like any other VP, after the election, while McLib's sitting in the Oval Office, she'll be in HER office across the street in the OEOB, counting rubber bands.

You guys really ARE living the "dream", aren't you?

As to his ACU rating, that 82% is lifetime, and has been falling steadily for a decade. His last rating was 65%. He's the third most liberal sitting GOP Senator, passed only by Snowe, Collins and Specter. The link: http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/01/mccains_acu_ratings .html

And then to have to resort to the "a vote for Barr is a vote for Obama" nonsense...

Gunny.... shame on you.

Why... you've just turned into a McCainiac!

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 11:59 AM BrianR writes:

Breaking news, pard


I just saw this on the TH home page:

"McCain takes on GOP and Bush along with Obama"

with this little gem:

"McCain has not offered specific solutions to problems, saying instead he will reach out to Democrats to find answers. He said he would have more than one Democrat in his Cabinet."

Link: http://townhall.com/news/politics-elections/2008/09/08/mcc ain_takes_on_gop_and_bush_along_with_obama?page=full&commen ts=true


Hmmmm..... That, of course, is the perennial problem with McCain. Always "reaching out" to Democrats for his solutions, NEVER conservatives.

And funny, but he didn't mention PALIN as part of his "solution" at all.


Maybe I'll coin my OWN little catchphrase slogan: "A vote for McCain is really a vote for Obama-Lite".

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:12 PM bob's my uncle writes:

Absolutely, Gunny

My sentiments exactly only with better research. McCain is ugly, but when Palin stands next to him, somehow he don't look as bad.
Palin/Jindal '12!!!!!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:19 PM BrianR writes:

Bob'sUncle


"Palin/Jindal 2012"?


Does that mean you're hoping for a McCain defeat this time?


Because you're dreaming if you think he won't run for re-election. You know that, right?

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:20 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

Nee

Good Point.

Well done.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:23 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

clyde

I'll check out philosophocon's blog ASAP.

It IS a tough choice to make. Allowing scum like Obongo and that pos Plugs Biden to disgrace the WH is a little over the top for me.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:24 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

R E

Thanks for the kudos. I'm hoping that McShamnesty heads into a well-deserved retirement as soon after the inauguration as is humanly possible.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:25 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

beachmom

"God help us all if Barry the black liberation church believer gets elected."

I could not agree more.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:26 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

The Godfather I

I'm HOPING that is what will happen but I do not see any other choice other than writing in as I figured I'd do and that would only allow a muslim/socialist/commie/racist (times 2) to win.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:28 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

philosophocon

B.R.O.

As I've stated in other essay's, I'm STILL not firmly in the McShamnesty camp and if I do get there, it'll be FOR Palin not McCranky.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:30 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

No, I've never be FOR McVanity, he sucks and always will.

I'm HOPING that palin will exert some modicum of contol over his liberal tendencies.

What course of action do you propose? Vote Barr? Write-in Thompson?

It boils down to two things amigo.

1. Can we SURVIVE an Obomination POTUS? He sucks worse than Carter!

2. Can I STOMACH that p.o.s, sitting in the Oval Office? I could barely stand CLINTON!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:35 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

McShamnesty will be too OLD! I really think that you are allowing your hatred for McShamnesty to cloud your judgement. The guy SUCKS. We got F-D by the GOP AGAIN!

But WHAT is the alternative? The most LIBERAL sh*tstain to ever get in office with a UBER LIB running the Kongress?

Sorry, but I cannot afford a 40% increase on my dividend taxation. I cannot afford paying for universal health care for scumbags too lazy or stupid to work. I cannot afford more hands reaching into my wallet every payday.

At the end of the day, will McScummy reach out to blue dog dems or far lefties? I don't know but I DO KNOW that this is a tough election.

What screws THE NATION as a whole worse?

What screws ME worse?

Answers are WELCOME!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 1:59 PM bob's my uncle writes:

BrianR

Palin/Jindal is only a "hoped for" outcome. Just as your position leads you to a "hoped for" outcome. Neither you nor I can predict the future with any absolute certainty. Gunny's right. You gotta look at what screws us the most. Yeah, I know what you think. We just differ on that point. We shall see.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 2:17 PM BrianR writes:

Gunny


I don't "hate" McCain... I don't even know him.

But what I DO hate is liberalism trying to pass itself off as something else.

Maybe you should change the name of your blog to "AntiLiberal (Except McCain) Zone".

McCain's age in 2012 is irrelevant. You think he won't run for re-election? I can't BELIEVE the depth of denial you guys have sunk to.

You're worried about Obama, and demonize the hell out of him, all the while backing a guy who is just as bad.

Two policies alone -- amnesty and Cap and Trade -- will bankrupt this country. They're BOTH McCain policies, and he'll have a whole lot better chance of getting his liberal crap passed through Congress than Obambi will. The only time congressional GOPers show any stones is fighting Dems... they sure as hell won't fight McCain, who's "one of them" in ADDITION to being the titular head of the party.

Evidently you didn't pay attention to my earlier quote, but here's the salient part: "he will reach out to Democrats to find answers".

In other words: screw you, conservatives. And note: he DIDN'T even bother to say he'd consult with Palin, this mirage you guys seem to see as actually meaningful.



I'll hand it to McCain. Like a skilled matador, he waved the red cape called "Palin" in your face, and you fell for it. And as you go galloping by, he'll jam that sword right in your neck.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 2:21 PM BrianR writes:

PS, Gunny


The "answer" is the same it's always been, and no different from when I first wrote about it TWO YEARS ago.

Sometimes you have to sacrifice a rook to save your queen or king. That's called strategy.

This election's lost for conservatives, regardless of who wins.

So make the GOP pay for totally abandoning any semblance of actually standing for conservative principles. THAT is the only message they ever receive, and not even then all the time. They totally zoned out on 2006. But it's the only thing that has a chance.

Because it's not going to get any better in the future until they DO get it. Just like Carter led to Reagan, and Clinton led to 1994.

And there's NEVER going to be a "good time" to do it, because the other side is ALWAYS going to be "evil" or whatever other emotional hysteria is in vogue.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 3:17 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

As I stated on Phil's Diner, I am not 100% in the McShamnesty camp. He is too untrustworthy.

I see your point and have ACKNOWLEDGED it. You say we can survive an Obomination POTUS. You sure? The guy is far dumber than Karter, more left-wing, and has friends more dangerous and corrupt that Bubba's ever were.

McCranky sucks, on that I totally agree. But in today's world, an OBonehead POTUS is simply a no-go.

From taxes to foreign policy, Obambi is deadly.

Remember this, when Carter led to Reagan, we weren't facing a nuclear power (Possibly) named Iran. The USSR at least had the brains for self-preservation. We weren't locked in a GWOT per se.

I, like many others, are f-ing scared of OBungler trashing the US beyond repair.

BTW, it's STILL the Anti Liberal Zone!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 3:22 PM beltway girl writes:

gunny, great post!

i say mccain is a wonderful improvement over the Most Liberal Senator. i enjoy him, His Liberalness, and his Dem Friends here in chicago every day, already as president.

the average person behaves like the left-wing press towards sarah palin if you don't fall in line (i'll never forget my college years).

but it's not just this guy's ideas, i mean, he doesn't even have the experience necessary to implement them. and on top of it all, he blunders by passing up on hillary, his only sure bet into the white house, and picks... biden? a 3 a.m. text message for... BIDEN?

saw philosophcon's (did i spell that right?) blog, and it's fascinating (please note that at least mac HAS some bills). also have been to brian r's and flagwaver's discussing this very issue. while i'd never try to sway another to mccain (bad flashbacks to pushy liberal students and fears they'd rubbed off), he's just such a vast improvement over obama. i already saw a nomination acceptance speech that was like This Is Spinal Tap. i don't want to see a cecil b. demille (or steven spielberg) inauguration.

at least mccain's will only be the crosstown classic...
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 3:23 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

I go by what I read.

http://www.ontheissues.org

McShamnesty is a Populist-Leaning Conservative

Obongo is a flaming leftist. He's pegged FAR FAR to the Left. Even Karter was not that far left amigo.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 4:07 PM BrianR writes:

Well, then


I guess Specter's a "populist-leaning conservative", too.

You really telling me that with a straight face?


Dude, I have no problem if people want to vote for McCain. Just don't point to Palin and claim she's going to magically turn him into a conservative, because that ain't gonna happen.

And don't try to claim HE'S any kind of conservative, either, because he's not.




THAT has always been my major issue: the GOP hacks and everyone else claiming that McCain (and Giuliani) have anything to do with conservatism, when what it really means is that the GOP is simply caving in on principle.


Hell, I don't even mind if they do THAT, as long as they're HONEST about it.

Because THEN, real conservatives can find ANOTHER party to rally to, or form their own new one.


It's the lying, rationalization, and associated other BS that I absolutely loathe and despise.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 5:23 PM bob's my uncle writes:

BrianR

You are the King of the Skeptics. No one can hold a candle to you, and certainly not I.
I appreciate you though, because I think your are keeping us all honest to one degree or another.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 6:03 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

You should know me better. I have NO illusions about McCranky but I AM optimistic about Palin.

But Brian, WHAT is the alternative? Letting that gutless sack of pus and his idiot cohort take the White House?

Berry/Biden = Beavis and Butthead.

"Because THEN, real conservatives can find ANOTHER party to rally to, or form their own new one."

I'd vote in a NY NANOSECOND for a real conservative from the American Conservative Party but there is NO such party. We only have two choices...

1. A REAL UBER Lib in the WH, with a Uber lib sidekick, one running the Congress, and one running the Senate. And all dancing to the tune Soros plays.

2. A Republican-lite POTUS with a Conservative VP, both who may buck the status quo in the Beltway. NO DOUBT he'll screw us to but four years is a LONG TIME for a guy in McShamnesty's shape. I foresee a Palin/Jindal ticket and THAT gives me hope.

Brian, I have NO DOUBTS about McVanity. He sucks. I was pulling for a Thompson/Hunter ticket and put my money where my mouth was. Unfortunately, we got stuck with a pig in a poke.

BUT! You HAVE to give McCranky credit for picking Palin, not Lieberman, Romney, or Pawlenty.

Palin's ALL about serving the people while Beavis and Butthead are all about serving themselves.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 7:14 PM BrianR writes:

Bob'sUncle, Gunny


Bob'sUncle..... Hahahahaha! Thanks, man!



Gunny, vote for McCain. As I wrote earlier, I have no problems with that prima facie. LOTS of people actually LIKE the guy!

But don't use Palin as the beard.


Name me one presidency -- ONE -- in the modern era in which the VP called the shots.

Hell, name one anytime in our history!



Which means one thing: Palin's a conservative, McLib's a liberal.

So... whose policies are going to be the ones acted upon?

WHO is the BOSS?

Whose name is next to the checkmark on the ballot?

Who's going to be sitting in the Oval Office, and who's going to be sitting in the OEOB?


As far as I'M concerned, either way it turns out a "sack of pus" is going to be in the White House.


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Monday, September, 08, 2008 7:35 PM nanna writes:

GunnyG

I have never in my life voted to keep someone OUT of office, I mean for that reason alone. But so help me, I think I would vote for Smokey The Bear, to keep Obama out of office. In fact Smokey has more sense than B Hussein, and would make a better president!!
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:05 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

I hear you my brother but you have not given me an alternative to Beavis and Butthead.

While I think that American WOULD survive a Beavis and Butthead POTUS, the damage that they will do may be irreparable. From Federal judge appointees who will be far leftists to policies enacted and E.O.'s signed by this idiot and the leftist idiots in Congress.

So, the question remains, why are we to do?
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:26 PM beltway girl writes:

buckley, i think, backed

the opponent AGAINST mcgovern with his magazine. i mean, he was PURELY drving an anti-mcgovern vote.

it's not unheard of, i agree, it's certainly not as inspirational as it is pragmatic.

it's a bad situation for those less than enthused w/mccain. but take heart, palin could well end up being the driving stake in the culture war. that's something worth seeing. being veep isn't the same as being president, but you get her in there for four years and she gets some media (ahem), she could well end up as the future of the party.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:28 PM bob's my uncle writes:

Hey BrianR

If you listened to the libs during Bush 43's first term, Bush was Dick Cheney's puppet.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:37 PM BrianR writes:

Gunny


If you want to vote for McCain because you find that a more acceptable alternative than Obama, that's a legitimate reason. A lot of people feel that way.

My whole point about this Palin thing is it's a load of rationalizational BS. People who point at her and says SHE'S the reason they've changed their position are either kidding themselves, or trying to rationalize their change of position naively or dishonestly.

The honest thing to do is just admit you've changed your mind from before. People do that.

But don't point at Palin as anything other than a meaningless political ploy by McCain. He hasn't suddenly turned conservative. She's the conservative "curtain" he's hiding behind. She's just as irrelevant as every other VP in the history of the country.

A VP is like a spare magazine: not worth a damned until you're out of ammo in your primary mag.

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:41 PM BrianR writes:

Bob'sUncle


Yeah, Bob, but we know that's nonsense.

I'm sure the main reason Cheney's been so invisible is that he's the Real Deal in conservatism, and he wasn't going to publicly endorse Bush's awful policies.

He's actually a GREAT example of how irrelevant a VP is, particularly a conservative one under a libbish President.

Cheney, a true conservative, wasn't able to reign in Bush's lunacy, like NCLB, scamnesty, Scrips for Seniors, that stupid tax "rebate", lightbulb mandates, and all the rest of his "compassionate" BS.


And the funny thing is, McCain makes Bush look like Reagan reincarnated by comparison.

The next four years are truly going to suck.

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 8:59 PM Peppermint2 writes:

Hi Gunny

I absolutely agree with you. My vote for McCain is to keep out the Marxist/socialist/commie BO. The damage he and his socialist buddies will do could be irreparable. Hell, we haven't even been able to repair the damage the libs have done over the last 40 years. Roe vs. Wade still exists, we've got people poking their noses into our private lives more than ever with anti-food, anti-smoking, political correctness. Yeah, we're not supposed to call this war a war on radical Islam.

One wonders if the dims even believe we're in a WOT. I don't trust Barry to be CIC to start. Besides that he's a complete doofus who changes his stands every day of the week. You don't ever know where he stands. Except from his past and it's laden with radical, nefarious characters. He shouldn't even be a senator, much less president.

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 9:02 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

BrianR

As I've stated, I'm not in McShamnesty's camp by a long sight. I trust him about as much as I'd trust Bubba Clinton babysitting my 16 y.o. daughter or Sandy Berger as TS control officer!

Say we hold back and Obambi slimes in and proceeds to cause serious damage. What then? Point out that we were wrong? It's the RNC's fault? How long will it take to unscrew the damage the empty suit and the drunk do IF elected?

http://www.youtube.com/v/NmRXH7RkCZQ&hl=en&fs=1

Two Boobs in the WH? BOTH dumber than anything put out by the libs before?

I agree, the next four years are gonna suck.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 9:04 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

Pepp2

I agree but it's a hard election to decide WTH to do.

I agree with Brian that the RNC needs to learn a lesson but cutting off our nose to spite our face with a commie as POTUS?

I don't know.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 9:43 PM beltway girl writes:

you guys, respectfully

nixon was elected after having been eisenhower's veep. elder george bush was ronald reagan's veep and became president himself. al gore was clinton's veep and very nearly became president himself after being defeated by the son of the elder bush. it's not exactly a dead-end job in our times.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 9:56 PM bob's my uncle writes:

beltway girl

I think some of us suffer from short term vision.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 10:04 PM Peppermint2 writes:

Gunny

I'm with you on this. This is a very difficult decision to make this year. Gos and I have talked and talked about this going round and round what to do.

For us when it comes down to it, we don't trust or like McCain, but we don't trust BO even more. We just can't see letting him waltz into the WH without some sort of fight. I don't believe in just handing it over to this Marxist. There's a big probability he'll win anyway. But, I don't just want to hand it over to him on a silver platter.

Beltway Girl is right. Being VP is not irrelevant. There have been other incidences where the Veep took over. I imagine Lyndon didn't feel irrelevant when he had to step into Kennedy's shoes.

No one can predict the future and what will happen. McCain is up there in years. We don't know how long he has to live. No one does.

With Palin standing in the wings, this has made this choice a lot easier for me and Ron.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 11:01 PM BrianR writes:

Gunny, bottom line


Three issues are big to me now that Heller's taken guns off the agenda: illegal aliens, getting our oil out of the ground, and "climate change" BS.

Interestingly enough, polls indicate these are also the big three issues to a majority of the electorate. Essentially, the economy.

BOTH candidates suck, big time, so there's not a dime's worth of difference between them.


But I'll take it a step further and make a prediction. In January, the new Prez takes office.

I predict that before June, amnesty will again be getting pushed in Congress by the winner.

I predict that if Obambi's Prez, it'll get jammed up in the House by the GOPers and Blue Dogs, just like the last two times.

I predict that if MCCAIN'S the Prez, it sails through and becomes the law of the land.

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Monday, September, 08, 2008 11:27 PM bob's my uncle writes:

Crystal balls, getcher

crystal balls here. Guaranteed predictions. Getcher crystal balls here.
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Monday, September, 08, 2008 11:38 PM TNconservative writes:

McCain and his liberal democrats,

are the wrost case senario.

Obama will make people sick of democrats and liberals, and they will show that they have no answers for high gas prices, jobs and whatever else someone is concerned with.

John McCain on the other hand will make both conservatives and everyone else sick, yet his failures will be blamed on conservatives.

If John McCain wins you get atleast 8 years of a liberal in the WH. And McCain in the WH will probably hurt any chances of winning congress back any time soon. So liberals will have complete power for many more years if McCain wins as opposed to if McCain loses.

If Obama wins, this may cause a mandate for congress to turn conservative.

Congress is even more powerful than a president if you manage to get a majority, or perhaps even a strong majority. They can override a president. They can impeach a president.

Please consider these things.

Just because Obama is bad doesn't make McCain good. Two wrongs don't make a right. Or should I say two lefts don't make a right.

Please don't think we are happy about this either. I don't like it at all. But I think the best option at this point is to vote congress and support good candidates. The house is up for grabs every two years.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 12:13 AM BrianR writes:

Exactly, TNCon


It's simple historical precedent. No "crystal balls", Bob'sUnc.


Carter gave us Reagan. Clinton gave us the 1994 Contract With America Sweep of Congress. After each of those victories, the GOP wandered Left, then had to be corrected. They don't do it by themselves. They're nothing but political hacks who only care about one thing: winning elections. And they always seem to forget that conservatism sells. They get greedy. They win as conservatives, then try to "broaden their appeal" by sacrificing conservative principles and tacking Left. Like a pendulum.

The pendulum has once again swung too far to the Left and needs to be reset.


It happens periodically.

"Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it" - Santayana

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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 1:36 AM beltway girl writes:

look, you guys, not going to say

reagan did amnesty b/c amnesty has become like a joke with quadrennial punchlines, and they're never funny. no fence, no fealty. reagan was different. repeats of the same tired episode, crisp under reagan, are an insult.

"McCain remains coy on what enforcement measures he’d support. Judging by his bill, a few more border guards, some border fencing and a 'virtual fence,' but little else. He told Vanity Fair, 'I’ll build the goddamned fence if they want it.' Reuters quoted him at a recent New Hampshire meeting that he means by border security 'walls in urban areas, through vehicle barriers, with cameras and sensors.'” (human events/jan2008) agreed, it doesn't sound too reassuring.

i don't accept the premise he's going to sail this through at all on the backs of the blue dogs, or anyone else, not on this topic especially. ("Enforcement First immigration policy is extremely popular in Blue Dog districts ..." the foundry, may, 2008)

on oil, he is going to drill the oil. you won't find a better bet than this guy for doing that. and palin supports drilling in ANWR.

as far as winning back congress, i wouldn't count on it with the recent scandals. and i don't care how much americans want balance.

the best point you guys have made, i think, is that his administration's failures will be blamed on conservatives.

let me tell you, if this ticket loses, nothing will fill the left with more delight than having beaten a pro-life ticket, with a pro-life, conservative woman at the bottom of it. wait'll we see the spin on that.

even if we get only four years from obama, you can look forward to four years of hillary, thanks to the defeat of sarah palin at the polls in 2008.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 1:38 AM beltway girl writes:

excuse me, perhaps eight years of

hillary, who will be equated in the mind of the average voter as the dems' answer to john mccain after all of the fallout.

two wrongs may not make a right, but let me tell you, they do make a WRIGHT.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 1:52 AM reaganite writes:

Allow some talkbacks

Let some information in. This isn't shaky ground. Hey, that's pretty fuddy putty, I mean Gunny.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:04 AM Purplegimp writes:

Gunny, All

It's not easy being a conservative these days, but I like the way Gunny's mind works. At least he's thinking and not locked into any one stance.


For more, stop in at The Gimp Wonders
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 6:39 AM INTHENOW writes:

Bottom Line


Gunny,

God post and even better debate on the boards…a welcome change. Did I say “change”?

The issue seems to boil down to whether or not one thinks we can survive Obama. It’s a no-brainer for me. Having been in Italy for the past nine years, I have lived the socialist dream. There is no turning back the beast once unleashed.

The wife literally just returned from one of the many tax collections agencies holding a receipt for 480 Euros ($681). That is our annual tax on two vehicles (1997 and 2001 models). We visit the base in Sigonella only once a month because the fuel and tolls for the 3 hour round trip is about $150. Approximately 70% of that expensive are taxes. In addition to income taxes, there is also IVA (value added taxes) on everything you purchase. Or more simply stated, you pay a regressive income tax in addition to “progressive” income tax.

To make it in Italy, or any other EU country you either have to be born with the silver spoon, or in politics, or both. The nanny state givith and takith away on its own terms. The average Joe (yours truly) is reduced to bend over and submit, cheat, or go elsewhere.

I am voting for our best chance to retain what’s left of the American dream. Hopefully when I return, it’ll be to something a little different than what I’ve been unable to become accustomed to.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 3:56 PM Dogged writes:

Gunny, Good post

I'm not a fan of McCain but he is the only candidate who has supported drilling for our own oil. I was leaning toward him because of that. Now I will vote for him because of that and his brilliant choice for VP. Sarah Palin is a breath of fresh air, an outsider who also wants to drill here.

To vote for anybody else would mean higher gas and oil prices and do more damage to our economy then has already been done.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:14 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

Pepp2

I agree McShamnesty is NOT TO BE TRUSTED and I don't make the mistake of trusting him. He is who he is.

The Veep job should NEVER be held lightly. It's like the XO's job, backup to the boss. IF McCranky gets elected, he'd be STUPID not to listen to Palin. She is REAL and a Conservative, he ain't. If the RNC wants to regain it's Reagan roots, the Palin/Jindal/Hunter/Tancredo way is the ONLY way.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:15 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

beltway girl

Thanks and I agree, no limo lib inauguration for me either. Invesco and The Chosen One descending from the clouds was enough to make ya puke.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:17 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

Pepp2

"He shouldn't even be a senator, much less president."

He should have stayed a community organizer! He's deep into the Peter Principle now.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:23 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

TNConservative

Rest assured amigo, it'll be straight R across the board on the state and local level.

As for McShamnesty. I'll be watching him closely the next 57 days, he DOES NOT have my vote.

What really sucks is that AGAIN we have to hold one nostril shut, and pull the lever FOR someone we don't like because we're AGAINST the anti-american clown the leftists put up.

Will McShamnesty screw us in the WH? I don't know. Will he be a fiscal conservative? I hope so.

I agree with Peppermint2 that Husseini Obongo will do MORE damage than we can unfk afterwards. We're STILL saddled with SS, Welfare, Medicare, the UN, the war on poverty, etc, ALL ushered in by liberals with a liberal majority Kongress.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:24 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

beltway girl

"even if we get only four years from obama, you can look forward to four years of hillary, thanks to the defeat of sarah palin at the polls in 2008."

Good point and SCARY AS H*LL!
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:28 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

Purplegimp

Thanks. On the way.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:33 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

INTHENOW

Thanks for stopping by and commenting. We were in Europe in March and the taxes are UNBELIEVABLE!

One truly has to see socialism up close to believe it.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 4:34 PM Gunny "knuckles" G© writes:

Dogged

Good point on ANWR (you too beltway girl). It will take McCranky to stick it to the libs and force them to drill.

While compromise is a part of politics, I DO NOT want him to compromise for Scamnesty!
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 8:21 PM TNconservative writes:

beltway girl, McCain will bring Hillary

If McCain wins the first thing you will hear is Hillary Clinton telling democrats that they should have went for her.

In four years she will run against McCain and she will win.

Then you get Hillary Clinton in the WH.

And as I have said, if McCain wins you get ATLEAST 8 long years of nothing better than McCain in the WH.

However if Obama wins, as sad as that is, Hillary Clinton will not be able to run again in 2012. It will be about Obama trying to get re-elected. By 2016, Hillary Clinton will be nearly as old as McCain. Democrats don't run a lot of really old presidental candidates.

So if McCain loses, she is gone for good probably. If McCain manages to win, she will be back and might end up being the next to be in the WH.
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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 9:41 PM beltway girl writes:

TNconservative, if obama is turned into

a lame duck who can push through none of his noxious plans and policies in the white house, hillary may just enter into a race against him in 2012, and she may just win, particularly after a PALIN LOSS in '08, which will be spun out of control by a delirious leftie press. remember the reagan-ford fight in '76?

however, i find it hard to believe that it would go to that stage; if republicans and, God forbid, blue dogs attempted to stonewall our first (really) black president, vicious accusations of racism would fly, and these characters would be skewered. that won't happen.

that means four years of an at least quasi-successful obama. perhaps fabulously successul, if congress should tip any further to their favor, which it well could. and a mac loss would be likely to enjoy a synchronal relationship with congressional dem gains/pickups in congress.

and i don't, in ANY way, accept the premise that hillary would come back in 2012 and BEAT an incumbent mccain. she will certainly run. and she will almost certainly lose if he hangs onto the support he is enjoying now. not only that, but palin, by that time, will have gouged even more successfully into hill clinton's base than she already has.

in any event, i won't cede four years to obama easily. if we can get mccain in, and a pro-life conservative woman veep, we should fight tooth and nail to do so.

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Tuesday, September, 09, 2008 11:35 PM beltway girl writes:

it's really great to see

that no matter how emotional any of our arguments have become, no one has called anyone a pig yet!

kudos to us!!
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Wednesday, September, 10, 2008 2:14 AM andrews writes:

Hey Gunny

Long time since I posted any comments on your blog.

Hope you don't mind, but I used your article on my blog. I took it as a sign that McCain has a better prospect for victory than most admit. If he is winning back what was the hard-core of opposition thanks to the worries over Obama, I figure it is a sign he has a very good chance. So I used your change of heart to make this point.

Well, you can check it out for yourself. If I read your post wrong, feel free to correct me. Always good to get some comments on an article.

http://andrews.blogtownhall.com/2008/09/10/a_positive_sign. thtml

Or you can just follow the link on my name and check out my recent posts, it should be near the top. (Anyway, you may find some of my other posts amusing. In some recent ones I compare Obama to Jayson Blair and the media caricature of Dan Quayle.. and also to Captain Kirk, because like the old Star Trek episodes, Obama thinks he can just talk our enemies to death.)

Well, drop by when you have time. I have to come by again when I have time to post more comments.
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Friday, September, 12, 2008 3:16 PM Lolo1 writes:

Oh boy...

I see a whole lot of arm chair quarterbacks on here that know nothing of the game of politics.

First off there is a lot of differences between McCain and Obama and if you don't know them you are just not listening.

If you want McCain to be more conservative then keep pressure on him to do so. That is what politicians respond to. McCain is proving that he is leaning more conservative by picking Palin. Palin is smart enough not to damage her brand and her future.

Last of all some of these HC scenarios are way out there!!! First off they run under the assumption that McCain will be an absolute failure as POTUS. Then they run under the under the assumption that Obama's failure will bring HC which is simply as far from reality as one can get.

The single best thing McCain can do to restore the GOP brand and put the Dems back in their place is bring back fiscal conservatism which everyone identifies with from both parties. He is in a unique position to make or break the GOP but it also requires keeping up with the maintenance of elected GOP members. NO MORE GANGS!!! Another thing McCain can do is grow the party because the single largest disenfranchised voting block this election is moderate Dems since the militants have taken over.
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Saturday, September, 13, 2008 8:08 AM Sgt Relic writes:

That's a little harsh Gunny...

Ascribing a lack of objectivity to some irrational hatred is a lib tactic and you know it. You've certainly written enough about it. Objective people can disagree and have equally valid reasons for their conclusions.

One of our famous TH bloggers said "Rest assured, McShamnesty's conservatism is nothing more than a thin veneer of gold plating over a turd. McVain picks and chooses WHAT issues that he'll be conservative on and if we don't like it, too bad. And he'll switch when the time comes. Like his fence building sneer, he'll do exactly what he wants, especially if the liberal's pander to his inflated ego, and the liberally-biased media plants their lips on his butt 24/7. McVain's stance on globull warming was the REAL test of this idiot's conservative values and he failed...MISERABLY!"

I agreed with that and still do. This election determines not only who will be president but whether RINO's will control and reshape the GOP.

I will be the first to admit when I am wrong. I was wrong for example, when I wrote that the McCain campaign had said conservatives will get in line because they have nowhere else to go and I disagreed. I was wrong.

Do I wish that the dem wasn't a scary Marxist? Sure.

Objectively, I will be fighting whoever becomes president but the commie twerp is a standard issue finger in the wind politician, McCain is not.

I don't believe that McCain has had a conservative come to Jesus moment. I do think he made a smart move with Palin and has probably won himself the presidency but he is going to have to do it without my vote, since I will not validate RINOism by voting for him.

I just prefer to keep my enemies outside the wire.
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 4:28 PM beltway girl writes:

you guys, the obamablunder brings

hillary scenario is, agreed, very far-fetched. BUT were obamadunderhead to be made into the lame-duck pres he'd need to be in order to ensure he didn't do any serious damage while in office, well, then it's not as far-fetched as it may seem. if he's nullified to the point that he'd need to be, it well could bring HRC back in a fight reminiscent of ford-reagan in '76. it's possible. we've already seen the carry-on between these two camps THIS year, when he won the nomination. if they can get away with it, they'll do it. what's more likely, though, is he'd get to put her in a power post where she could do the most damage (SCt, for example). i just still really hope he doesn't get in, but i plan on making the best of a bad situation if he does, and tuning in to rush limbaugh as much as possible. i worry a lot about the SCt appointments if he gets in...
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 6:17 PM TNconservative writes:

Republicans and Yes Conservatives Too,

have gone the wrong way.

This is it, we may be looking at the end here. As the deceived masses want to be fooled so they can vote for McCain no matter what, they WILLFULLY lie to themselves.

McCain will be McCain. Have you ever heard of a politican acting different during an election? Don't you think that maybe thats what is going on here?

Do you not think that maybe this whole Palin thing was done as a political stunt? Really? You don't? You got to be kidding me.

Bottom line is that McCain is McCain. If you vote for the ticket then you are voting for McCain. Palin will have no power to do anything. She is meant to be an appeasement to conservatives yet without giving them anything that really counts.

While McCain is president, she will be making speeches, all the while having no actual power to do anything. And give up this pipe dream that McCain will resign. Reagan was older than McCain and was just fine coming out of his second term. Bob Dole is still alive in his 80s. So is Carter. So is Bush 41.

Its amazing to see so many being played like a piano. But if McCain wins then congress goes democrat, and we have nothing better than McCain in the WH for ATLEAST 8 long years.

Probably,

2008-McCain
2012-McCain or Hillary
2016-????

That is the real look at what you can hope for if McCain wins.

2008-Obama
2012-Palin

That is what it could look like if Obama wins.

But anyways, McCain does have a lot more experience than Obama, that is he has a lot more experience in hurting Conservatives.

McCain winning is the worst case senario.

This McCain support beats anything I've ever seen as far as people being dependant on a political party.
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 6:58 PM beltway girl writes:

you guys, NOT to antagonize, okay?

TN, if palin can't win on the ticket this year, why would she come back with so much gusto in 2012?

the leftie press is going to spin such a loss as the ultimate victory in the culture war. she'll be completely diminished, if not irretrievably damaged/crippled.
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 7:15 PM beltway girl writes:

get ready for dancing on liberal streets

http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/ar ticles/2008/09/14/the_fate_of_roe_v_wade_and_choice/

in article: THE RIGHT to reproductive freedom has played an occasional role in many presidential campaigns, but its fate is likely to turn on the 2008 election...

...But it is one thing to object to Roe as written in 1973. It is another to suggest that it should be overruled in 2008. American constitutional law is stable only because of the principle of stare decisis, which means that in general, the Court should respect its own precedents...

...Roe v. Wade has been established law for 35 years; the right to choose is now a part of our culture. A decision to overrule it would not only disrupt and polarize the nation; it would also threaten countless doctors, and pregnant women and girls, with jail sentences and criminal fines...

...It is relevant here that many people, including McCain running mate Sarah Palin, believe that abortion is unacceptable even in cases of rape and incest, and there is little doubt that if Roe is overruled, some states will enact that belief into law...

...Actually there is an uncomfortably close overlap between the constitutional views of some recent Republican appointees to the federal judiciary and the political views of those on the extreme right-wing of the Republican Party. There is a good chance that a newly constituted Supreme Court would entrench some of those views into constitutional law...



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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 7:39 PM TNconservative writes:

Beltway,

Its easy.

Didn't John Edwards come back and run for president, after Kerry lost?

Didn't Lieberman try to run after Gore lost? Not sure but I think he did.

And these guys are rather mild in their support from democrats.

With all the excitement over Palin, it will be clear that if McCain loses it will be because of McCain.

No one I know of thinks that Jack Kemp lost it. They think that Dole lost it.

If Obama wins, there could be an effort very easily to get Palin the nomination in four years.

However, if not then there are other conservatives, even other conservative women. Not Condi. Others.

But I think this is another part of the McCain hype, that a McCain loss will reflect badly on Palin.

When will they take any responsibility for McCain himself being all out rejected?

I for one am an example of this. If Palin were the actual candidate, and had a decent running mate, then I would probably be supporting her and voting for her.

But I'm not going to vote for McCain because of her. I'm not going to fall for that.
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 7:57 PM beltway girl writes:

i see what you mean

not trying to convince you, honestly. people need to do their own thing, and liberals are enough to make you puke in the tactics they'll employ to "change your mind!!!" so not going there, believe me.

i just feel very worried about the way these (expletive deleted) in the press are going to spin this. they'll relish this. it'll be the White Flag in the culture war. no matter what the reality is, the fix is on for sarah palin in the press. you can see them licking their chops already...

at least this election seems to be waking people up to what the MSM is all about. that's always a good thing.
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 8:26 PM TNconservative writes:

Beltway, what you do is

hold all of the supposed conservative media accountable.

This is something that I have lost a lot of respect for recently. I don't really trust any of them anymore.

But you never stop talking and using logic and reason to prove them wrong.

Personally I have heard probably more from the MSM about McCain not having as much support from Evangelicals and social conservatives than I have from any of the "conservative" media.

And I haven't heard much even from them about it.

What many of us are thinking is suppressed from the media.

Another factor that cannot be ignored will be the amount of write-in votes, third party votes and even the amount of people not voting.

If McCain loses, and the difference is there in the third party, and write-in votes then it will be clear that McCain was too liberal for them. They were not united in their support of McCain like they were for President Bush.

Even the amount of people not voting will show this.

I'm probably going to write-in. Others will third party. And a lot of people are too discouraged to even do that.
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Sunday, September, 14, 2008 8:51 PM beltway girl writes:

TN, that's a really interesting point

i agree, the conservative media needs to take all of this into account. i'll tell you what, though, when it comes to the MSM, they are ALL left. it's like the supposed "objective" media is wall-to-wall liberals. it's overwhelmingly dem. and they're the ones with the most reach to the most people. the conservative media reaches conservatives. the MSM reaches just about everyone, and i know what you're saying about the conservative press, but the MSM needs to be taken down a few notches on this one, and i really hope they are.

objective my... rump.
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