Why I Could NOT Vote For Mitt Romney

Your comments are sure to elicit some strong comments from Mormons and other Christians. Is that your goal? Someone antagonistic to Mormons should not explain their doctrine. It's like having Louis Farrakhan explain Jewish doctrine.

It's obvious that your understanding of Mormon doctrine is flawed. Your conclusions are based on an unfortunate lack of understanding, and your interpretation of their doctrines are based on skewed or distorted facts.


2 Timothy 2: 23-24 (KJV)
23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men...

Much like all Christians require faith to explain things that are not logical (e.g. Miraculous conception), so, too, does the doctrine of eternal progression require knowledge, inspiration and faith.

If you want to know what Mormons believe, ask a Mormon. If anyone is truly interested in knowing about what someone believes, shouldn't you ask the person with the beliefs in question?

It's only fair that you ask a Mormon to define and explain their faith. Would you ask an Imam to explain Christian doctrines?

I am not a politician, I am a Theologian! I have studied World religion and teach Apologetics on a collegiate level, I am accurate in my assessment of Mormanism. Now will GOP Christians admit the truth? In good conscience NO Bible believing Christian could vote for a Mormon, I don't hate Mormons, but they ARE a false religion!

I would like to add here, that if anyone says that the gospel is anything other than what it is stated in 1 Cor. 15:1-4, they are blinded by the devil:

"and even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God," (2 Cor. 4:3-4).

"I am a Theologian! I have studied World religion and teach Apologetics on a collegiate level, I am accurate in my assessment of Mormanism.(sic)"

That's rich. I do teach Mormonism in a college setting, and if I had a student make the claim you did above, I'd point out that his perception of what "Mormonism teaches" is significantly flawed. You may be a theologian, but not a very good one wrt Mormonism.

Alma
http://byteline.blogspot.com

Mormon Beliefs documented

Please note that these teachings are documented from Mormon writers, not anti-Mormon writers.

Book of Mormon
The book of Mormon is more correct than the Bible, (History of the Church, 4:461.)
Devil, the
The Devil was born as a spirit after Jesus "in the morning of pre-existence," (Mormon Doctrine, page 192.)
Jesus and Satan are spirit brothers and we were all born as siblings in heaven to them both, (Mormon Doctrine, p. 163.)
God
God used to be a man on another planet, Mormon Doctrine, p. 321. Joseph Smith, Times and Seasons, Vol 5, pp. 613-614; Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses, Vol 2, p. 345, Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p. 333.)
"The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as mans..." (D&C 130:22).
God, becoming a god
After you become a good Mormon, you have the potential of becoming a god, (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pages 345-347, 354.)
"Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them," (DC 132:20).
God, many gods
There are many gods, (Mormon Doctrine, p. 163.)
"And they (the Gods) said: Let there be light: and there was light (Book of Abraham 4:3)
God, mother goddess
There is a mother god, (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 443.)
God is married to his goddess wife and has spirit children, (Mormon Doctrine p. 516.)
God, Trinity
The trinity is three separate Gods: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. "That these three are separate individuals, physically distinct from each other, is demonstrated by the accepted records of divine dealings with man." (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 35.)
Heaven
There are three levels of heaven: telestial, terrestrial, and celestial, Mormon Doctrine, p. 348.
Holy Ghost, the
The Holy Ghost is a male personage, A Marvelous Work and a Wonder, (Le Grand Richards, Salt Lake City, 1956, page 118; Journal of Discources, Vol. 5, page 179.)
Jesus
"Therefore we know that both the Father and the Son are in form and stature perfect men; each of them possesses a tangible body . . . of flesh and bones." (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 38).
"The birth of the Saviour was as natural as are the births of our children; it was the result of natural action. He partook of flesh and blood - was begotten of his Father, as we were of our fathers." (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 8: p. 115).
"Elohim is literally the Father of the spirit of Jesus Christ and also of the body in which Jesus Christ performed His mission in the flesh ..." (First Presidency and Council of the Twelve, 1916, God the Father, compiled by Gordon Allred, pg. 150).
Joseph Smith
If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation. There is no salvation [the context is the full gospel including exaltation to Godhood] outside the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, (Mormon Doctrine, p. 670.)
Pre-existence
We were first begotten as spirit children in heaven and then born naturally on earth, (Journal of Discourse, Vol. 4, p. 218.)
The first spirit to be born in heaven was Jesus, (Mormon Doctrine, page 129.)
The Devil was born as a spirit after Jesus "in the morning of pre-existence," (Mormon Doctrine, page 192.)
Salvation
"One of the most fallacious doctrines originated by Satan and propounded by man is that man is saved alone by the grace of God; that belief in Jesus Christ alone is all that is needed for salvation." (Miracle of Forgiveness, Spencer W. Kimball, p. 206.)
A plan of salvation was needed for the people of earth so Jesus offered a plan to the Father and Satan offered a plan to the father but Jesus' plan was accepted. In effect the Devil wanted to be the Savior of all Mankind and to "deny men their agency and to dethrone god." (Mormon Doctrine, page 193; Journal of Discourses, vol. 6, page 8.)
Jesus' sacrifice was not able to cleanse us from all our sins, (murder and repeated adultery are exceptions), (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p. 247, 1856.)
Good works are necessary for salvation, Articles of Faith, p. 92.)
There is no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith as a prophet of God, (Doctrines of Salvation, Vol. 1, p. 188.)
"The first effect [of the atonement] is to secure to all mankind alike, exemption from the penalty of the fall, thus providing a plan of General Salvation. The second effect is to open a way for Individual Salvation whereby mankind may secure remission of personal sins (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 78-79.)
"As these sins are the result of individual acts it is just that forgiveness for them should be conditioned on individual compliance with prescribed requirements -- 'obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.'" (Articles of Faith p. 79).
"This grace is an enabling power that allows men and women to lay hold on eternal life and exaltation after they have expended their own best efforts" (LDS Bible Dictionary, p. 697).
"We know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do," (2 Nephi 25:23).
Trinity, the
The trinity is three separate Gods: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. "That these three are separate individuals, physically distinct from each other, is demonstrated by the accepted records of divine dealings with man." (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 35.)

"I am a Theologian! I have studied World religion and teach Apologetics on a collegiate level..."

Did Christ call the 12 or did the 12 "feel" like they were chosen?

Why was Christ baptised by John and not by someone else?

Hebrews 5:1,4
1 For every high priest taken from among men is ordained for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins:
4 And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron.


Ex. 28: 1.
1 And take thou unto thee Aaron thy brother, and his sons with him, from among the children of Israel, that he may minister unto me in the priest’s office, even Aaron, dNadab and Abihu, Eleazar and eIthamar, Aaron’s fsons.

"Nevertheless, they are taught to "feel" theological truth, not think it through."


Doctrine and Covenants 9: 7-8
7 Behold, you have not understood; you have supposed that I would give it unto you, when you took no thought save it was to ask me.
8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must cask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.

"Truth does not contradict itself."


Man does however. Does the Bible contradict itself? Or did the translators screw up? How about Paul's vision? Did Pauls companions not see but heard a voice as in Acts 9;7, or did they see alight but didnt hear a thing as in Acts 22:9?

You claim Bush lied about pre war intelligence.

Can you provide any proof for this claim?


If so, please do. If not, please delette the slander in your bio.

If he didn't lie, he was ignorant and launched a war on faulty information, either way he is incompetant as a leader. I spent 23 years in the USAF I was a Senior NCO, if I made decisions based on false info I would lose my job or be demoted, I voted for Bush, but is a dissapointment, he SHOULD have listened to COlin Powell more than Rumsfeld and Cheney and maybe we wouldn't be in this MESS! Powell served in combat and he understands the seriousness of sending troops into harms way! ALSO we SHOULD have concentrated our efforts on CATCHING Bin Laden in Afghanistan!!!!

The problem with most Americans Conservatives AND Liberals is they don't THINK for themselves, they follow their party line when a Democrat is WRONG I say so and the same with a Republican! When Clinton acted like a moral degenrate I condemned him, and now we have an ignorant cowboy in office and he needs to GO TOO! Right now Mike Huckabee and Barack Obama have my attention!

An Independant Thinker

Of course it is slander.

Bush was absolutely right to liberate Iraq and take on the terrorist elements there.

We are absolutely right to exert our force and presence in the Middle East among those who have dedicated themselves to killing as many Americans as possible.

You are in no way an independent thinker.

You are ignorant of the history of the middle east and of this wary.



Bush is right. You are wrong and arrogant.

Stop the lies and address the TRUE issues.

You bring shame to Christ by your blatant lies.

Stop the lies.

Your abuse of your post is shameful.

It's called freedom of speech, BTW I served my country 23 years in the military DID you? I have a right to disagree with my president...It's America...NOT Communist China!

You have no moral compass, apparently.

You should feel shame.


You won't reach accurate conclusions if your positions are built on a foundation of lies.

Chaplain Steve writes:
"There cannot be an infinite regression of causes. It is logically impossible. Why? Because you can not cross an infinity."


If the series of events has no beginning, then every event has been preceded by an infinite number of events. But if one can never arrive at infinity by adding one member after another, one would have never arrived at the present day, because to do so one would have had to "cross" (or complete) an infinite number of days.

(Francis J. Beckwith and Stephen E. Parrish. the Mormon Concept of God: a Philosophical Analysis. (blake T. Ostler), FARMS Review of Books, vol. 8, no. 2 (1996), .)

If God knows all true propositions about the infinite future, then God has knowledge of a completed and actual infinite. However, Beckwith and Parrish assert that it is logically impossible either for an actual infinite to exist or to complete an actual infinite (ch. 3). It follows that their view of God's foreknowledge is inconsistent with their view that an actual infinite is logically impossible. This position is persuasively argued by William Flanhead, "The Symmetry of the Past and the Future in the Kalam Cosmological Argument," and Robert Prevost, "Classical Theism and the Kalam Principle," both in The Logic of Rational Theism: Explanatory Essays, ed. William Lane Craig and Mark S. McLeod (Lewiston: Mellen, 1990), 99-111, 113-25.




(Francis J. Beckwith and Stephen E. Parrish. the Mormon Concept of God: a Philosophical Analysis. (blake T. Ostler), FARMS Review of Books, vol. 8, no. 2 (1996

Number Six in particular.
http://ldstheology.blogspot.com/2007/11/francis-j-beckwith- and-stephen-e.html

Beckwith argues as follows:

Reason 1: "If the Mormon universe is true, then an infinite number of past events has been traversed."
Reason 2: "It is impossible to traverse an infinite number."
Conclusion: "Therefore the Mormon universe is not true." (p. 77)

It should be apparent to any calculus student that Reason 2 is a glaring and ludicrous fallacy. Any movement whatever involves traversing "an infinite number." The fact that the infinite number traversed involves infinitesimal points is quite irrelevant to the argument since Beckwith has failed to specify his units of measure. He is speaking philosophically and, like his Greek predecessors, fails completely to perceive the complexities of a real universe.

Aside from his units of measure, given an infinite length of time, which is entailed in Beckwith's Reason 1, it is entirely possible to traverse an infinite number, even an infinite number of infinite units, whether of distance or of time. To accomplish this, one merely needs an infinite past. Such a past is fully entailed in the Mormon concept of the universe.

Nevertheless, Beckwith gives an example in which he sets the units of measure at "miles" and reasons that it is impossible to count off an infinite number of miles, because "an 'infinite' is, by definition, limitless" (p. 78). Aside from the circularity of that reasoning, what Beckwith has failed to note is that a limitless period of time is entailed in Reason 1. It is most certainly possible to count off a limitless number of miles in a limitless period of time. Thus God, or any eternal being (such as man, in Mormon theology), can travel an infinite number of miles.

Changing the units of measure to days, Beckwith tries to prove that a beginningless universe is impossible. The problem with his proof, and with that of J. P. Moreland, whom he quotes (see pp. 78–79), is that it assumes its own validity in order to establish its own proof. Moreland argues that it would be impossible to remember all the events of past history if the past were, in fact, infinite. Unfortunately, he fails to give the person remembering the infinite past an infinite future in which to accomplish the task. Since Reason 1 entails an infinite future as well as an infinite past, Moreland's proof fails, and with it this philosophical objection to the Mormon concept of the universe.

Beckwith argues as follows:

Reason 1: "If the Mormon universe is true, then an infinite number of past events has been traversed."
Reason 2: "It is impossible to traverse an infinite number."
Conclusion: "Therefore the Mormon universe is not true." (p. 77)

It should be apparent to any calculus student that Reason 2 is a glaring and ludicrous fallacy. Any movement whatever involves traversing "an infinite number." The fact that the infinite number traversed involves infinitesimal points is quite irrelevant to the argument since Beckwith has failed to specify his units of measure. He is speaking philosophically and, like his Greek predecessors, fails completely to perceive the complexities of a real universe.

Aside from his units of measure, given an infinite length of time, which is entailed in Beckwith's Reason 1, it is entirely possible to traverse an infinite number, even an infinite number of infinite units, whether of distance or of time. To accomplish this, one merely needs an infinite past. Such a past is fully entailed in the Mormon concept of the universe.

Nevertheless, Beckwith gives an example in which he sets the units of measure at "miles" and reasons that it is impossible to count off an infinite number of miles, because "an 'infinite' is, by definition, limitless" (p. 78). Aside from the circularity of that reasoning, what Beckwith has failed to note is that a limitless period of time is entailed in Reason 1. It is most certainly possible to count off a limitless number of miles in a limitless period of time. Thus God, or any eternal being (such as man, in Mormon theology), can travel an infinite number of miles.

Changing the units of measure to days, Beckwith tries to prove that a beginningless universe is impossible. The problem with his proof, and with that of J. P. Moreland, whom he quotes (see pp. 78–79), is that it assumes its own validity in order to establish its own proof. Moreland argues that it would be impossible to remember all the events of past history if the past were, in fact, infinite. Unfortunately, he fails to give the person remembering the infinite past an infinite future in which to accomplish the task. Since Reason 1 entails an infinite future as well as an infinite past, Moreland's proof fails, and with it this philosophical objection to the Mormon concept of the universe.