maybe he is going to convince all these straight people to stop having gay babies?

You seem to be under a pretty strong misconception about what things are like there. Going out and getting a job is hardly an option, and for many people who do still have jobs, they have had their pay cut to unsubstainable levels. I am not saying that cuts are not needed, but the cuts that are being enforced are terrifying for those they effect. And they are especially hard to swallow when the people creating the rules are very wealthy and will remain so, even though they are more likely to be the people who caused the problem to start with

hmm, okay, if you are looking at it from that perspective, that does make a bit more sense. but i guess i would ask you to consider something, this maybe a "no go" within your faith, if so, no offence meant, but what is it about those values that has been important in creating the society you want? was it the values of understanding, love, compassion and inclusion, or was it the ability to restrict gay peoples right to use the word marriage to describe permanant loving relationships which are in turn recognised by the state? it seems to me (although as an outsider) that the values that matter do not conflict with this at all. The only conflict seems to come from cultural views held by those who were involved in the early church.

according to one narrow view. there have been several interpretations over the ages about what marriage is about and what it is for. there has never just been "one" kind of relationship that covers it. Now, there is only one definitition of marriage withing christianity, but why should everyone else be held to that view?

don't feel meets the requirements of their religion. I personally think that attitudes will change and gay marriage will become common in many faiths as people start to see the fears they had about the results turn into nothing, similar in the way that interracial marriage was seen to be a threat to society by religious groups in the past.

i know that people seem to think that this is about a "redifineition" of marriage, but i find it hard to see it that way. It seems to be that the consistancy so far has been more to do with cultural predudice from a wide variety of cultures and sources (so not just the bible by any stretch) rather than a specific belief that it was more than the binding of two people who wanted to be in a permanant and stable relationship (after the days when it was more of an exchange of property). While I don't see how two men or two women getting married is any different to anybody else, i certainly agree that no religious organisation who feel morally oppossed should have to perform it, any more than they should lose their right to not marry anyone they

i like your point, it shows that while Christianity may well be responisble for some truly awfull horrors in history (same old list, crusades, inquisitions, burnings, wars), it does not actually represent the religion itself as much as the culture of the people practicing it at the time. But, you need to apply the same yard stick to Islam, which has had many long periods of peace, tolerance and has been a centre of learning which surpassed anything else around, it is not really about the faith as much as it is how people CHOOSE to interprate it

so instead of "this is what you can say and do", you would rather go with "agree with me or die"? much more rational, count that as a win for you

civil rights has encompased many things such as gender, class, race (origin rather than skin colour), agism and many other kinds of discrimination. The civil rights movement is about creating a civil society where these things do matter in regards to your ability to succed or be treated in a "civil" way. not saying that this is a civil rights issue, just pointing out it is far more than just how much pigment is in your skin tone

and you seem to have little understanding about how unhelpful your comment is regardless of what outcome you are looking for...unless you want to come across like a mindless bigot.....which maybe was your goal after all?