In response to:

Jimmy Hoffa, on Michigan: "We're Going to Have a Civil War"

Marlette John Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 12:58 PM
Conservative View: You have the right to form groups and assemble- EXCEPT you do not have the right to form a union AND if you do form a union the union MUST represent non-members who pay no dues.... Why does this make sense to supposed conservatives? Do you belong to any groups or clubs? What if the government told you that you MUST provide benefits to non-members who pay no dues? Does that sound fair to you?
Joseph64 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 8:15 PM
Who said they must represent non-members? You said yourself it is Federal law that forces this and 99% of labor laws are forced down our throats by the unions so it was the unions who forced that into law. I have been telling you all along that unions should not be forced to provide services to people who elect not to be in the union. So which Republicans are saying unions should represent people who do not pay?
scrow Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:33 PM
The union can form a union. They're not going to disappear because of what happened.

If you have a problem with Federal law, you should check with your legislator. However, the union can choose not to exist rather than be forced to do something they don't wish to. On the other hand, there was nothing someone could do about being forced to pay union dues, whether they were a member or not. Which issue of "force" is preferable?
Barbara3722 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:16 PM
Dear Marlette John,

You really need to work on getting out more, you have a very skewed idea of reality. "You" are free to form a club or a 'union' you shouldn't, however, be able to force anyone else to join.

>What if the government told you that you MUST provide benefits to non-members who pay no dues?

Incidentally, may I point out that unions do not provide the benefits which originate from the employer.
Marlette John Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:32 PM
The employer wants to pay as little as possible. Collective bargaining forces wages upward. That is a benefit to workers.
Kuwull Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:09 PM
Hey marionette, if you could always quit the union, and keep your job, why are the unions upset by this law saying youi don't have to belong to the union?
nimh2 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:04 PM
Let's turn it around. Why should I be forced to "join" an organization that I don't agree with?? Most people are unaware that they have been selected for employment by an"agency" (union) shop until they have been hired.
Marlette John Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:10 PM
I agree with that. People should not be forced to join unions. Michigan has for YEARS allowed people to quit unions in "closed shops". The diference is that since federal law makes the union provide benefits to these people, they have been required to pay an administrative fee (Not full dues) to pay for the benefits. Now the unions still have to provide benefits-except for free- that is not fair and not American,
nimh2 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:15 PM
Most unions will not give an accurate accounting of what they spend on "collective bargaining" activities. I tried invoking "Beck" with my union--they told me that my "refund" would be fifty cents per month. In addition they make it difficult to invoke one's "Beck" rights by requiring applications yearly.
By the way, we have not had "closed shops" since the 1940s. the correct description is "agency shop"
Marlette John Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:19 PM
Fine. Then quit the union and give back your weekends, overtime pay, 40-hour work week, medical coverage, work safety rules (enfoced by the Feds but originally demanded by unions), etc.
Joseph64 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:30 PM
"By the way, we have not had "closed shops" since the 1940s. the correct description is "agency shop""

A turd is still a turd no matter what you call it.
waynesteapartyworld Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 2:06 PM
So change the Federal law.
waynesteapartyworld Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 2:10 PM
I can negotiate my own benefits with the employer and don't want the union doing it for me. Obviously there are benefits to being part of a union, but many of us don't like these commie union bosses and refuse to be part of their club. Why don't you give up your weekends, overtime pay and 40-hour work week and go back to working 12/7 for 50 yen a month. The U.S. military preserved our free society with liberal work rules, you didn't serve in the military, and therefore you are an economic parasite benefiting from the sacrifice of others.
getthelibsout Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:01 PM
troll drivle...wipe yo mouth, pig
IsraelFirsterSecond Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:01 PM
What conservative has said you dont have the right to form a union?
southern tom Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:06 PM
...liberal agitators just make up their own facts. If you need proof, just watch obama for a day... he hasn't spoken the truth since he said he wanted to fundamentally transform America.
IsraelFirsterSecond Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:08 PM
You are making stuff up. How would it cripple unions and where does the right to work law say that?
getthelibsout Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:09 PM
you are truly cluless....in a non RTW state, if you want the job, you join the union. you quit the union, you lose the job.
Marlette John Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:12 PM
That WAS true in Michigan, however the law was changed years ago. Even in UAW plants, workers have quit the union and retained their jobs.
getthelibsout Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:16 PM
if that's true, what are on here bi tch in about?
americathebeautiful Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:21 PM
They may have been able to quit the unions Mariette, but they could NOT stop unions dues from being taken out of their paychecks!!!!!
Joseph64 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:27 PM
Nobody is forcing the union to represent anyone for free. let them kick out anyone who refuses to pay and let them negotiate their own terms with their employer. it might even work out better that because then the employer will be free to pay the best workers more money than they pay the union workers.
Joseph64 Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:29 PM
If that were true, then why the riots? It's obviously NOT true.
Marlette John Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 1:30 PM
Not full dues. Just enough to pay for the cost of collective bargaining and enforcing the contract-which the non-members also benefit from.
waynesteapartyworld Wrote: Dec 12, 2012 2:05 PM
Who is forcing unions to represent people who don't pay dues? Do non-union members get union arbitration/protection?

Yes, this is the same elegant creature who screeched about "taking out" Tea Party "son-of-a-bitches" [sic] at a presidential event last year.  In case you'd forgotten, both the White House and the DNC conspicuously declined to repudiate his vituperation at the time.  Now Jimmy Hoffa, Jr. has taken his anger mismanagement show to CNN, seething about an incipient "civil war" in Michigan:
 

Jimmy Hoffa, president of the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, said Tuesday he expects Michigan unions and lawmakers to break out into "civil war" after the state...