But this is the part that all the Common Core articles on this site refuse to see: The federal government is not forcing anyone to use the Common Core. Let me say that again for the sake of clarity: The federal government is not forcing anyone to use the Common Core. You know, it's an important enough point to warrant a third: THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU HATE OBAMA, IS NOT FORCING ANYONE TO USE THE COMMON CORE. If you have an issue with the CC - and there's a lot to take issue with, yes - then your issue is with your state government for choosing to adopt these standards. States were given a choice; if you want your state to make a different one, complaining about Obama and making it seem like you think Obama's responsible is hardly going to accomplish that. The state government will be glad that you're so misdirected that you don't blame them while they continue to pocket federal cash.

Don't blame the feds. They're not forcing anyone to do anything. It's the states who are choosing to adopt the Core; if they were a little less willing to sell out their rights to design their own curriculum, maybe the feds would have offered a better Common Core.

I know. I ceded that point to you and made another.

"In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth" (FIRST VERSE from the Bible), Scripture says THROUGHOUT the Bible that God MADE and sustains all things." No one questions whether or not the Bible says the universe is designed. The question, and one which your quote does not address, is whether it is obvious in observing the universe (NOT IN EXAMINING SCRIPTURE OR YOUR OWN HEART) that God - that is, Yahweh, God of Israel - exists. I will be super-impressed if your reply is relevant to this point, though.

I don't believe in God? News to me. That the universe is obviously intelligently designed is not an idea from scripture. That we all naturally know in our heart that there is a god is a scriptural idea. Barber argues both; I only disagree with the former.

Of course he was sharing his opinion, Andy. That our current scientific understanding of the universe makes Yahweh's existence obvious to the point that you're a fool if you disagree = Barber's opinion That the universe is obviously designed by an intellect = Barber's opinion That quantum physics and string theory are a bunch of unscientific, irrational junk = Barber's surprisingly uninformed opinion If nothing else we've proved that atheists don't have a monopoly on foolishness.

Thank you for that explanation. I had no issue with the language of the Psalm, though I do appreciate the clarification on its original meaning. It's Barber I take issue with. I'm confident we can all agree he's using "fool" in the modern sense when he points out atheists' foolishness, silliness, and irrationality. That's what I'm confused - how he can make the leap from "We all agree that something to the universe is beyond our understanding" to "Yahweh exists and you're stupid if you don't think so."

Though it does seem at least slightly odd that he's going to make you burn forever and ever in unimaginable agony for your choice, regardless of how else you live your life, and that this will amount to some kind of cosmic justice.

I disagree with Barber on a lot of this, but the core is a wise assertion: theists and atheists both have to acknowledge that there is something about the universe and its creation that is forever beyond human understanding. I don't see how Barber makes the leap from that to "And thus you're stupid if you don't think the Christian God exists," but whatever.

"How does the two compare?" You asked why it's still illegal if there's nothing wrong with it. I said it's because we have bigots in the country. I cited resistance to interracial marriage as evidence indicating the widespread presence of bigots in the country. Does that clarify the comparison?