In response to:

Is America Ensnared in an Endless War?

Joe 145 Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 8:46 AM
Islam is at war with us. Actually, Islam has been at war since its inception in 610 AD. We are just the new kid on the block. If you look back at U.S. history, we have had problems with Islam since our inception. We have just been able to avoid dealing with it because we are in a different part of the planet. With modern communications, travel and economics, the world is a much smaller place. Now we are the big guy who needs to be put in his place. But this does not leave out the rest of the world. The U.S. is not forcing our Islamic enemies to engage our military. That match up favored us and drained their resources far more quickly than ours. Now they can re-deploy and just look at how well they are using their forces now!
Corbett_ Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 11:03 AM
Joe:

When we invade their their countries, kill their families, prop up dictators, impose sanctions, etc., we pretty much FORCE them to do something. They weren't attacking the US until we started throwing our weight around in the 1950's.
traitorbill Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 11:03 AM
How about we win the crusades once and for all?
the Black Baron Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 8:57 AM
Agreed. I've always thought Reese's line from "The Terminator" is appropriate to describe any Islamist: "He can't be bargained with, he can't be reasoned with, he doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear, and he absolutely will not stop, ever!"

Isolationists ignore the fact that we can certainly withdraw to our own borders all of our forces deployed around the world, but bad people are still going to come and try to kill us in very dirty and nasty ways. The best defense is a good forward offense--kill them, in their homes, before they come to kill us.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 9:10 AM
You don't even know what 'isolationism' is. Isolationism is what Japan practiced before Perry invaded with an iron fleet in Tokyo harbor. Isolationism means no trade, no relations, no immigration or visitation, etc. It means CUTTING OFF CONTACT with the rest of the world.

Trading peacefully with the world is NOT isolationism. Anyone who thinks not making endless war on the world is 'isolationism' is either a charlatan who works for the big-government elite, or a sheep who falls for what that charlatan says.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 8:53 AM
First, the struggle is not about religion it is about money and power, as always. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool who got at best the superficial mythology that passes for history these days.

Second, consider us, the "new kid on the block." We stepped into WWI, despite 95% public opposition, to bail out massive war loans that JP Morgan and others feared would go into default if American boys didn't bail out those risky loans. In so doing, we enable Britain and France to carve up the middle east--lands belonging to others.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 8:57 AM
Since then, some of the richest Americans decided to get into the game and carve up the middle east for themselves. We helped seize Israel from the people who actually lived there, being charitable with other-people's property like socialists.

The ruling elite toppled Mossadegh when he threatened to boot out the western oil companies, another bailout of private business with public money. Then they installed the Shah, who murdered and tortured half of Iran for a quarter century.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 9:00 AM
The ruling elite in the US also played all sides against each other, feeding weapons and money and intel to Israel, Egypt, Syra, Lebanon, Iran and Iraq, at least. And stationed troops all over their lands.

Now, let's compare that century of acts of war AND the timing of all that, to any so=called "Islamic" attacks on the US.

Are radical fundamentalists good people who believe in freedom of speech, religion, etc? No. Neither are hornets. But it doesn't mean you should fight a war on hornets when you got stung after sticking your hand in hornets' nests for a century.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 9:02 AM
What is amazing is HOW FEW attacks have come from the middle east in the last century.

The solution is to stop the bailouts, using American taxpayer money and the blood of noble soldiers, of private ventures of the very rich who are in bed with dictators overseas. Want to take a risky gamble on overseas business? Bail it out yourself if it goes wrong. Leave the brave American men and women, and the taxpayer, out of it.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 9:06 AM
As for concerns about "security?" For all the acts of war the US government committed over the last century, we've hardly seen any real attacks. Nothing that threatens our country. Flea bites, compared to the wrath the US government imposed which elicited the response.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 9:06 AM
Moreover, the whole wold is a tar baby. The way to win is to leave it alone. Trade peacefully, privately, vigorously. The Muslims you fear so much will do what they ALWAYS have done: return to fighting amongst themselves. Different sects, tribes, languages, families, nationalities, cultures...it's a FRACTAL of discord. The ONLY thing that will make the middle east a threat to the US is giving it a common enemy: us.
SMyles Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 6:05 PM
"When the president does it, that means that it is not illegal."

So said Richard Nixon in his interviews with David Frost. Nixon was talking about wiretaps and surreptitious entries to protect lives and safeguard national security in a violent and anarchic war decade.

The Nixon haters pronounced themselves morally sickened.

Fast forward to our new century. For, since 9/11, we have heard rather more extravagant claims by American presidents.

Under George W. Bush, it was presidential authority to waterboard, torture, rendition and hold enemy aliens in indefinite detention at Guantanamo.

Under Barack Obama, we don't have a Nixon "enemies list"...