In response to:

Have Some Evangelicals Simply Left Their Bibles Behind?

Earl Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 7:13 AM
There's a distinct difference between fundamentalist Christians and conservative Christians. But at the core, the issue is whether the Bible speaks definitively on this and other issues. The mainline Protestant denominations have folded on this issue and, in doing so, are collapsing into secularism. There really is no middle ground on this issue as Reverend Stokes indicates. Liberals Christians argue that while homosexuality "may have been a sin" in the past, it no longer is considered sinful by many so it's probably not sinful. They point to their various denominations now ordaining divorcees when once divorce was considered anathema except in extreme cases or when one spouse was an "unbeliever."
Earl Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 7:17 AM
Continuing, they also point erroneously to passages in Leviticus that indicate eating meat with blood in it is also forbidden. The problem is proscriptions against sodomy are listed with sins like child sacrifice, incest, and bestiality...the punishment for all being death. The proscriptions against eating meat with blood in it is listed with proscriptions against plowing with two kinds of animals and wearing clothes of mixed weave. By analogy, a thousand years from now murder and rape will still be against the law but traffic laws will have changed dramatically.
lemonfemale Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 7:31 AM
And the death penalty for apostasy? It says that even if this person is the wife of your bosom, your brother, or a friend as close as your own soul, you are not to spare him. That is not a traffic law. Deuteronomy 13. But these days I don't know of any Christian outside of Fred Phelps who might advocate it. Why not? And therefore, is it not reasonable to allow homosexuals the same rights as apostates? I hope this does not read as sarcastic here. If so I apologize. I'm posing a debate question.
Earl Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 8:04 AM
Christians live under God's law as well as secular law and we are commanded to be faithful to both ("Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and unto me what is mine." This presents problems. Christ wrote, "The wages of sin is death." Spiritual death is worse than physical death which we, as Christians through Christ's death and resurrection, have defeated in that we share in his resurrection and will live eternally with our Triune God. Your debate question is fallible. It would be illegal to kill someone for sodomy or for holding a different position on doctrine. As a former member of the PCUSA, who gave up that denomination in which my father served as an ordained minister, and as a former elder, I wish we had excommunicated apostates.
Earl Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 8:06 AM
Continuing, unfortunately we were always "discerning" and letting liberals change the question etc. Eventually, they won. Proscriptions against gay ordination went down in 2012 and I expect the Book of Order will be amended to remove marriage as between "one man and one woman." It won't matter to me. I'm now a member of the Anglican Church of Rwanda which is more conservative.
Curtis108 Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 1:08 PM
That's all well and good, but I suggest you go ahead and find some Jews to argue with....
Earl Wrote: Mar 30, 2013 4:33 PM
Arguing with secular Jews isn't fun because they don't believe much of anything. I never argue with Jews who take their faith seriously. I take their faith seriously as well and commend them for it. Christ said he came to fulfill the law not to overthrow it. Christ was not the first Christian...the dude on the cross who recognized him was. In fact, Christ never became a Christian because he was God in human form...Immanuel.

In January of 2009, there was a furor over President-Elect Barack Obama’s selection of California mega-church pastor Rick Warren to pray at his first inauguration. Four years later, another mega-church pastor, Louie Giglio from Atlanta, was awkwardly uninvited to pray at Mr. Obama’s second inaugural.

Four years turned out to be a long, long time.

On the surface, playing the Warren card back then appeared to be a masterstroke by Obama – one that further demonstrated impressive political skills, the kind that took him from a backbencher in the United States Senate, to the highest office in the...