In response to:

Worse Than Waterboarding

Donjindra Wrote: Feb 07, 2013 11:08 AM
"They are no different than drone strikes on alleged serial killers" But a "drone" strike on a serial killer (in the form of a sniper) is perfectly legal and moral if he's evading capture and/or acting in a threatening manner. It was perfectly okay when Obama okayed those snipers to take out the pirates a few years back. There is no difference.
Donjindra Wrote: Feb 10, 2013 2:48 PM
"We threaten the whole world all the time. "

That's leftist propaganda. I think you classify yourself as a libertarian. If so, you seem to be an American-hating leftist libertarian.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 3:42 PM
The hypocrisy here is amazing. We threaten the whole world all the time. By YOUR logic, they are right to kill us all.
Donjindra Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 10:55 AM
"NO, you can SEE and HEAR if he is actually attacking, and base your action on THAT."

You mean, you think it's okay to kill only those who are in the process of slitting someone's throat? When you actually see the blood? You won't get many to agree with you on that.
Donjindra Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 10:52 AM
"BTW, that logic ACTUALLY IS threatening to ordinary, innocent people. By YOUR logic they should just kill you. "

That makes no sense. Who am I threatening? Try to stay rational.
Donjindra Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 10:51 AM
"Who cares if we're right? Who cares if anything is made worse? Hey, at least we DID something."

It must be fun arguing with a strawman. Personally, I care a lot about being right. That is not the same thing as certainty. You're chasing windmills.


JustMC Wrote: Feb 08, 2013 5:47 AM
RE: "Baloney. You can only suspect what he'll do. You can't know. I wonder how you came down on the Trayvon Martin case?"

NO, you can SEE and HEAR if he is actually attacking, and base your action on THAT.
JustMC Wrote: Feb 07, 2013 9:15 PM
Yes, it should. "Ready, fire, aim" and "we HAVE to do SOMETHING" are the dumbest things that sheep believe, and the stuff that tyrants feed those sheep.

Who cares if we're right? Who cares if anything is made worse? Hey, at least we DID something.

Frighteningly stupid and immoral.

BTW, that logic ACTUALLY IS threatening to ordinary, innocent people. By YOUR logic they should just kill you.
Donjindra Wrote: Feb 07, 2013 11:47 AM
"You seem to be missing the concept of IDENTIFYING with CERTAINTY who someone is and what he has or has not done."

Unfortunately certainty is beyond human capability. Should this paralyze us with inaction? I don't think so.

"The example of killing someone who is in the process of assaulting someone is a strawman, because the killing is NOT for what he is suspected of having done, but rather for what he is VISIBLY doing in the present. "

Baloney. You can only suspect what he'll do. You can't know. I wonder how you came down on the Trayvon Martin case?
JustMC Wrote: Feb 07, 2013 11:26 AM
You seem to be missing the concept of IDENTIFYING with CERTAINTY who someone is and what he has or has not done.

The example of killing someone who is in the process of assaulting someone is a strawman, because the killing is NOT for what he is suspected of having done, but rather for what he is VISBLY doing in the present. The pirates were not killed for alleged past or prophesised future crimes (as is the basis for drone strikes) , they were killed for the VISBLE crime in which they were actively engaged.
On Tuesday, NBC released a confidential Department of Justice paper concluding that our government can authorize the use of drones to kill targeted terrorist leaders, including U.S. citizens abroad. This story bares the dividing line between honest liberals -- such as Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., the American Civil Liberties Union and the San Francisco Chronicle's editorial board, all of whom opposed some of the harsher anti-terrorism tactics employed under President George W. Bush's administration and under the current administration -- and rank opportunists, such as President Barack Obama, Vice President Joe Biden and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, who denounced what...