In response to:

Stirrings of Secession

dan17 Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 11:57 AM
The Declaration of Independence, as the founding document, established that ALL men are created equal; and therefore, with the same inalienable rights. It also says that governments are instituted to protect these rights. The Founders fought a war to institute such a government, and therefore, were on the side of justice. The southern states were violating the Constitution; a contract, that derived it's authority from the people's recognition that the truths codified in the Declaration were absolute and irrefutable. The Civil War, as horrific as it was, was nothing more than the last battle of the Revolution; a reckoning, so to speak.
dan17 Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 7:43 PM
Every Constitutionalist should know that the Declaration is our founding document and that the Constitution flows from it. You apparently have not researched the history of the issue of slavery enough to realize that it has always been a festering and contentious problem that almost kept the Constitution from being ratified by all the states. The 3/5 representation clause was the compromise that they worked out in order to get the south to sign on. The obvious contradiction of slaves being considered property, but counted as people as far as representation, was just one of the many contradictions resultant of "that peculiar institution".
Corbett_ Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 4:29 PM
Dan -- First of all, you are conflating the Declaration of Independence with the Constitution. Surely you know these are two different documents.

Secondly, the phrase you seem to think trumps everything else in American history clearly did not apply in the manner you wish to apply it today. Even if Jefferson wrote against slavery, his beliefs were not adopted by the Congress.

dan17 Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 2:54 PM
Like I said, the Declaration planted the seed for the Civil War.
dan17 Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 2:53 PM
""all men are created equal, and endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights..."
Of coarse there were other issues regarding states rights involved in the Civil War. However, it is undeniable that slavery was the driving force that precipitated the war. You seem to have a revisionist and conspiratorial view about the whole issue of Lincoln and the evils of slavery. And by the way, in answer to your other comment that the equality clause in the Declaration only applied to whites; let me remind you that Jefferson actually addressed the issue of slavery in the original draft, but it was edited out because of the divisiveness of the issue...they needed all support and attention on the revolution at the time. Like I...
Corbett_ Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 1:36 PM
Dan -- the Confederate states were NOT violating the Constitution in any way. Please point to a single clause of the Constitution the South violated -- either prior to secession or by seceding.
Allan60 Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 12:39 PM
And it was pretty well understood at the time that the States had joined the Union voluntarily, and they could also leave the Union voluntarily.
Allan60 Wrote: Nov 30, 2012 12:37 PM
But then the Declaration of Independence goes on to say:

"That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

Secession is a withdrawing of consent from the governed, and at that point the rules of the former government should no longer be in effect. Slavery was not the only issue of the Civil War.
"When in the course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another ..."

So begins the Declaration of Independence of the 13 colonies from the king and country to which they had given allegiance since the settlers first came to Jamestown and Plymouth Rock.

The declaration was signed by 56 angry old white guys who had had enough of what the Cousins were doing to them. In seceding from the mother country, these patriots put their lives, fortunes and honor on the line.

Four score...