In response to:

The Death of American Religion

Andy544 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 3:58 PM
RELIGION= Man's attempt to reach out to an un-seen, un-known GOD via good works and good intentions; frequently headed by an insider 'clique' who set the 'rules' and determine the 'qualifications' for belonging to their 'religious club' (which we have THOUSANDS) CHRISTIANITY= God's reaching out to man, via the blood sacrifice of His only begotten Son, JESUS CHRIST, to establish a personal relationship based on TRUST, FAITH, and FORGIVENESS (the 'work' was already done by His Son on the Cross, when He said, "It is FINISHED") Maybe the 'death of American religion' is not such a bad thing...if it puts Americans into the position to drop dead, man-centered 'religion' and receive CHRIST as their Savior!
David3036 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 4:07 PM
Man has always created gods to explain the unexplainable, but there are fewer and fewer things that we can't explain. We no longer need a sun god to tell us why the sun shines or to believe that it's an angry volcano god that caused an eruption. We know why those things happen.

So when will we abandon the idea that the universe is so complex it must explained by belief in a supreme being, a being that is even more unexplainable than the universe?
C.H. Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 4:22 PM
David: The idea that the universe is more complex than God is backwards.

Watch this video if you have the time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sicqKbFhcq8

Andy544 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 4:24 PM
"Because that which may be known of God is known to them; for God has showed it to them. For the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and God-head; so that they are WITHOUT EXCUSE: because that, when they knew God, they glorified Him not as God, neither were thankful; but became VAIN IN THEIR IMAGINATIONS, and their foolish heart was darkened. PROFESSING THEMSELVES TO BE WISE, THEY BECAME FOOLS." Romans 1:19-22. The Bible says you are a FOOL, David.
David3036 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 4:51 PM
And I can make a good case that you are a fool to believe that what some ancient writers wrote is divinely inspired -- or that the Emperor Constantine's bishops were infallible when they decided which scriptures were "true" and which were not.

I can recommend a good book. It's called "Forged," by Bart Ehrman. It was the need to establish authority that prompted Christians to forge parts of the New Testament books, as well as ENTIRE books, and falsely claiming that they were written, for example, by Peter, Paul or Mark.

None of the original documents exists, and the existing copies differ from one another. How can you live your entire life based on writings that are most likely forged by later Christians?
Andy544 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 5:08 PM
Bart Ehrman is the current 'crown prince' of APOSTATES who are attempting to question the veracity and authenticity of God's word. His end, like yours, will be according to his deeds.
Let's just ignore all the psuedo-academic 'babbly-gook', about Greek translations, and 'missing manuscripts' and all the other baloney the apostates use to attempt to justify themselves in their un-belief, and CUT TO THE CHASE: CHRIST DIED FOR YOUR SINS. WHAT IS GOING TO BE YOUR RESPONSE? You don't need a PhD in Greek hermaneutics to answer the question..
bmitchell671 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 7:29 PM
Once again the most virolent athiest physicists and scientists of all stripes can still not anwser the questions..how does something come from nothing? And does life start from no life?
So since both of us (me theist - you atheist) have no idea of how to answer the above, my way of beleiving in God and an afterlife and a moral code gives me peace and happiness and rules to live band honory. You on the other hand have the most to lose - 'cause when we die one of us is going to be wrong..and your downside is WAY worse than mine! D'OH.
Cleombrotus2011 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 7:40 PM
Too funny, David3036. You appeal to a modern day author and his modern day book to refute ancient authors and an ancient book.

Too funny.
David3036 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 8:29 PM
Just how does that work, anyway? Why didn't God just forgive sins without the need for a human/god sacrifice? How does Jesus's death excuse me of anything?

Actually, it all makes sense when you consider that his death replaced the need to make animal sacrifices (the "lamb of God"). But does it really make any sense that those animal sacrifices would have been required at any time? Today we would consider it animal cruelty.
David3036 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 8:33 PM
And how do you answer the question of how God originated? And why would God send someone to an eternity of punishment for a few sins over a lifetime that is merely the blink of an eye on the cosmic time scale.

And, believe it or not, atheists DO have a moral code. If you are doing good on this earth only to get a reward in the afterilife, that's not morality. Morality is doing good because we care about each other in this life.
David3036 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 8:34 PM
I would put my faith in a modern-day writer ANY day before I would trust writings from the Bronze Age and of questionable origin.
Andy544 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 10:29 PM
Then you will stand alone, on your own merits, when you stand before a Holy and Just God.
Marie150 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 10:32 PM
David put some effort into reading books that have an opposing view to Ehrman. Try Escape from Reason, Francis Schaeffer. Or another of his books "He is there and He is not silent."
Marie150 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 10:43 PM
Why have you placed your faith and trust in people that do not love God? You entered into that thinking from a biased heart instead of an open mind and heart.

THE WAGES OF SIN IS DEATH. Why? Because God is perfectly holy and sin cannot enter into His presence. The sacrifice of animals was not able to permanently cover the sin. Sin should not be taken lightly. Sin separates us from God. Sin is egregious. The second person in the Godhead came down and lived amongst us as a man and lived a God honoring perfect life so that He could save us from everlasting punishment and bring us to everlasting life as the perfect Lamb of God. There is a Way to be saved. And it is the only Way to be saved.
Marie150 Wrote: Nov 21, 2012 10:46 PM
Trusting what God said on the subject of a healthy and good sex life is not a phobia.
David3036 Wrote: Nov 22, 2012 5:15 AM
Actually, although religious people think nonbelievers just haven't read the right books, it's because we HAVE read those books that we're nonbelievers. Atheist Penn Jillette said, he was the only one in his Bible study group that actually read the WHOLE Bible -- in solitary, not in the class where all the contradictions and horrible stuff are explaine away -- and it made him an atheist. My experience was somewhat the same. You can't read the entire book and come away thinking every word is divinely inspired.

Thomas Paine said something like, "The Bible is a book that has been read more and examined less than any book that ever existed." Part of the nonbelievers' skepticism stems from reading the history of the book itself.
David3036 Wrote: Nov 22, 2012 3:42 PM
I would hardly call Ehrman's work "pseudo-academic." He has spent a lifetime studyig the New Testament, but only AFTER studying at a fundamentalist Bible college, Moody Bible Institute, completing his undergraduate education at Wheaton College, and learning the ancient Greek language so he could read the ancient transcripts in the original language.

After graduating from Wheaton, Ehrman went to Princeton Theological Seminary, where he studied under one of the world’s great experts on the Greek New Testament, the late Bruce Metzger.

Like all hyper-religious Christians, you try to discredit anyone who doesn't agree that every word of the modern Bible is divinely inspired and accurately translated. It is neither.

In the aftermath of the re-election of President Barack Obama, conservatives searched the heavens and the earth for answers. Some suggested that Mitt Romney lost because Republicans didn't reach out more to Latino voters; some suggested that Romney lost because his "get out the vote" system fell apart on Election Day. Romney himself said that he lost because President Obama separated voting groups with particularly calibrated "gifts" designed to curry their favor.

In truth, Mitt Romney lost for the same reason that traditional marriage lost on Election Day: America is becoming a less religious country. And that bodes ill...