Townhall.com, Where Your Opinion Counts
Talk Radio:   Bill Bennett   Mike Gallagher   Dennis Prager   Michael Medved   Hugh Hewitt   
BREAKING NEWS  LeftArrow - Townhall.com : Conservative, Political, Republican   RightArrow - Townhall.com : Conservative, Political, Republican  
Columns, funnies & more in your inbox!
  • Check the boxes and send us your email address to receveive your free newsletter
  • Your daily must-read of conservative columns, cartoons and news. Coulter, Sowell, Krauthammer and more.
  • Townhall.com’s weekly inside scoop on what’s happening behind the scenes in the world of politics. When news breaks, we report.
  • Signup to receive the latest daily Townhall cartoons
Monday, March 26, 2007
Dinesh D'Souza :: Townhall.com Columnist
Liberal Myths about Radical Islam
by Dinesh D'Souza
Vote on It:
Average Vote:
[+] Text [-]
 
Poll
Do you feel the leaked information from a global warming alarmist organization is meaningful?



As the Pelosi Democrats attempt to steer the debate on Iraq and the war on terror away from President Bush's approach, it is useful to examine the premises behind the liberal Democratic understanding of the war on terror. So far the Democrats have been successful in faulting the president's admittedly-flawed approach. But there is no advantage in trading one bad model for another. Here, then, is my critique of some of the major elements of the liberal explanation for "why they hate us."

They're very upset at us for the Crusades: James Carroll’s recent book Crusade, portrays the Crusades as a horrific act of Western aggression that still shapes the military thinking of America's leaders and inspires outrage in the Muslim world.

Is it reasonable to think that Muslims today are genuinely outraged about events that occurred a thousand years ago? Let us remember that before the rise of Islam, the region we call the Middle East was predominantly Christian. Inspired by Islam's call to jihad, Muhammad's armies conquered Jerusalem and the entire Middle East, then pushed south into Africa, East into Asia, and north into Europe.

Rallied by the Pope and the ruling dynasties of Europe, the Christians attempted in the eleventh century to recover the heartland of Christianity and to repel the irredentist forces of Islam. The Crusades were important to Europe because they represented a fight to recover Christianity's holiest sites and also because they were part of a battle for the survival of Europe.

By contrast, the Crusades have never been important to the Muslim world. Muslims were already in control of their own holy places in Mecca and Medina. Not once did the Crusaders threaten the heartland of Islam. From the point of view of Muslim historians, those battles were seen as minor disruptions on the periphery of the Islamic empire.

In summary, the Crusades were a belated, clumsy, and defensive reaction against a much longer, more relentless, and more successful Muslim assault against Christendom. The striking aspect of the liberal critique is that it stresses the horrors of the Crusades while virtually ignoring the Islamic jihad to which the Crusades were a response. Even if liberals detest the Crusades, however, there is no good reason for many of today's Muslims to care about them, and there is no evidence that they think about the subject at all.

They're angry about colonialism: Many on the cultural left, like the late Edward Said, attribute Muslim rage to the still-fresh wounds of Western conquest and subjugation.

But America—the focal point of the anger of radical Muslims—has virtually no history of colonialism in the Middle East. If the Filipinos or American Indians were launching suicide bombers in New York, their actions could perhaps be attributed to a reaction against colonial subjugation. But until the Bush administration ordered the invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq in the aftermath of 9/11, America had never occupied a Muslim country. This was not for lack of opportunity. After World War II, America could quite easy have colonized the entire Middle East, but never even considered doing so.

America's record is one of opposing British and French colonial initiatives, and of encouraging the European colonial powers to withdraw from the Middle East. So Muslim hostility to America has to be explained by factors other than colonial occupation in the Middle East, since prior to 9/11 America has no record of colonial occupation in the Middle East.

They're angry because American actions have killed so many Muslims: Actually America has actively fought on the side of Muslims in several recent conflicts. During the 1970s the United States supported the Afghan mujahedin and their Arab allies in driving out the Soviet Union from Afghanistan. In 1991 the United States assembled an international coalition of countries, including many Muslim countries, in order to drive Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait and restore the sovereignty of that small Muslim country. Later in the decade, President Clinton ordered American bombings and intervention to save Muslim lives in Bosnia and Kosovo.

True, many Muslims hold America accountable for Israel’s bulldozing of Palestinian homes and Israeli shooting of stone-throwing Palestinian youths. And Muslims frequently deplore the civilian lives lost in the American invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq. These deaths, however, are small in number compared with the devastation that other invading armies, including Muslim armies, have wrought through the centuries right down to the present day.

More recent Muslim wars, such as the Iran-Iraq war, have also produced unbelievable horrors and casualty lists. Over the eight-year period of the Iran-Iraq war, for instance, between 500,000 and 1 million Muslims were killed. Islamic radicals know all this, which is why one cannot find in their literature the kind of indignation over America's killing of Muslim civilians that one routinely finds in liberal magazines, radio shows and websites.

My conclusion is that the main reasons leading liberals give to explain the antagonism of the Islamic radicals toward the United States and the West are false. Consequently we should be skeptical of liberal solutions such blocking additional troops, or squeezing funding, or calling for a precipitous withdrawal from Iraq. These "solutions" reflect muddled thinking about radical Islam, and they are likely to produce results far worse than the situation as it is now.

Share:
Vote on It:
Average Vote:
 
About The Author
Dinesh D'Souza's new book Life After Death: The Evidence is published by Regnery.
 
TOWNHALL DAILY: Sign up today and receive Townhall.com daily lineup delivered each morning to your inbox.
ChairmanMao
Thanks for the information.

The only problem now is ....if we suspect any forum members to be a 'forum Jihadists' what can we do about it?

If we even come close to suggesting our suspicions of someone...we could end up with a law suit filed against us by the CAIR (Council on American-Islamic Relations).


Thanks Fuzz
I don't need luck when I have faith.

AL Qaeda order Jihadists
Go to the blogs and act like Democrats.

THE MIDDLE EAST MEDIA RESEARCH INSTITUTE
Special Dispatch Series - No. 1508
March 20, 2007 No.1508


Islamist Website Instructs Mujahideen in Using Popular U.S. Web Forums to Foster Anti-War Sentiment among Americans

In the past few months, Islamists engaged in "media jihad" have increased their efforts to expose as broad a Western audience as possible to their jihad films, which purport to document the growing success of the mujahideen in Iraq and Afghanistan. As part of this endeavor, they have posted jihad films on popular free video-sharing websites such as YouTube, LiveLeak, and Google Video, hoping that such films will tip public opinion in the West against the war in Iraq and Afghanistan - thus pressuring Western governments to withdraw their troops from these countries.

As part of the campaign to foster anti-war sentiment among Westerners, and more specifically among Americans, a member of the Al-Mohajroon Islamist website with the username Al-Wathiq Billah instructed mujahideen in how to infiltrate popular American forums and to use them to distribute jihad films and spread disinformation about the war.

The following are excerpts:

"Raiding American Forums is Among the Most Important Means of Obtaining Victory in the Fierce Media War... and of Influencing the Views of the Weak-Minded American"

"There is no doubt, my brothers, that raiding American forums is among the most important means of obtaining victory in the fierce media war... and of influencing the views of the weak-minded American who pays his taxes so they will go to the infidel American army. This American is an idiot and does not know where Iraq is... mandatory for every electronic mujahid ."

"It is better that you raid non-political forums such as music forums and trivia forums... which American people... favor... Define your target... and get to know it well... Post your contribution and do not get into... futile arguments..."

Indicate You Are an American

"Obviously, you have to register yourself using a purely American name... Choose an icon that indicates that you are an American, and place it next to your nickname ."

"In my experience, the areas most visited in American forums... 'Random Thoughts' and 'What's going on in your mind?'... takes priority in the American forums, and is highly popular. You should post your contribution there... This should include films of the mujahideen in Iraq, mujahideen publications in English, and images and films of the Americans' crimes, killing unarmed civilians in Iraq... etc."

"Invent Stories About American Soldiers You Have Personally Known"

"Obviously, you should post your contribution... as an American... You should correspond with visitors to this forum, the frustrating situation of their troops in Iraq... You should invent stories about American soldiers you have personally known (as classmates... or members in a club who played baseball and tennis with you) who were drafted to Iraq and then committed suicide while in service by hanging or shooting themselves..."

"Also, write using a sad tone, and tell them that you feel sorry for your neighbor or co-worker who became addicted to alcohol or drugs... because her poor fiancé, a former soldier in Iraq, was paralyzed or his legs were amputated... which will break their spirits, oh brave fighter for the sake of God..."

How to Make Americans Feel Frustrated With Their Government

"You should enter into debate or respond only if it is extremely necessary... Your concern should be introducing topics which... will cause frustration and anger towards their government..., which will... render them hostile to Bush... and his Republican Party and make them feel they must vote ton bring the troops back from Iraq as soon as possible."

"Do not... discuss issues pertaining to Arabs or Muslims at all, whether negatively or positively... because this could be a trap for you... In addition, do not ask people to circulate the material in other forums... as these types of requests will expose you..."

No
Years ago I did take a Middle-East Studies class, and the not so liberal professor claimed that to this day Muslims tell their misbehaving children: "Stop, or I'll send King Richard after you!"

Islamic historians of 1096-1200's wrote extensively regarding the piking Muslim of men, women and children. How the Crusaders massacred whole villages, etc. They also wrote regarding how filthy the Crusaders were. How they didn't bathe, trim their p%$ic hair, and generally were unkempt. Yes, these were translated texts, but are considered primary source documents.

No Tom
Good luck with that.


That point was rather Fuzzy
My greater point was to try to say something nice about Christianity.I appreciate you imagining what it must be like to be a somewhat secular deist, such as myself. Unfortunately for your theory, this gentleman does holds himself and his family to a higher standard. I teach the kids about god if they ask. "God made a worm for every bird, but he doesn't just throw it into the nest"(Swedish Proverb) Since you threw out an assumption about my moral beliefs I'll return the favor and assume you are a god fearing Christian. In your version of heaven, people like me aren't in it. I say it's because we don't want to ruin it for you. In my version of heaven, I get to rule hell and punish all of the people who used their religion to make the real world a worse place. So if I'm charitable, polite, highly skilled at a tangible craft that I can pass on to others and generally follow a good path through life, I believe my heaven will come true when I meet my maker in a couple hundred years. When it comes true, I'll hope not to see you in my Heaven, because if I do, you will be hung from the wedgie tree with the rest of the blasphemers. Muhuhahaha.

T. Tom Sawyer
You think Christians and Muslims are bad. You should see what the secularists are like!

They believe there is no god - No Heaven or Hell.

If they are wrong, so what. Because they led their life by example and their friends relatives, children, loved ones followed their example and went to Hell it was ok with them. No biggie. They weighed the pluses & minuses & decided it was worth it to be secular. I am sure they say "Shoot, it was worth it just to not have to listen those Christian idiots. Can't someone make them go away?"



It's Good to have a secular point
We don't give a crap whether Buhda is giving Vishnu a wedgie of the gods. So Mohammed is doing his jihad thing, again and Christ is crusading right back at him. When a secularist evaluates who is most righteous it is key to note the products of each particular faith. Neither Christianity or Islam is perfect. Of the myriad of issues each tries to have the moral high ground on, one issue, women's rights, comes to mind. Although both religions have repressed women in the past, the Christian religion seems to have an edge over the past century or so. As an observer of my local mosque and the way that it's men treat it's women, it must be noted that Muslim guys are 90% more likely to be a jerk in public to their female family members. One could counter that Christian men are just as bad, but just not in public.
Another odd thing of note, they have a little shack on the side that used to have a sign on the door marked "Women"(in Arabic too)I didn't see a men's shack, so either the mosque only has urinals or women are encouraged to wait outside in the shack while the men pray.
One question asked to me by one of it's members, a female Somali, was "Are there any people around here like me?, you know Muslim, like me?"
I responded "There's a Church right there" She hissed back "That's a Mosque!" To answer her question I told her I knew a few Buhdists she could befriend but the only muslims I knew went to the, er, church, I mean mosque right there. She scoffed! at Buhda! I'd never seen anyone from any religion react so harshly to good ole Buhda, but I guess it would be hasty to pass judgement upon an entire religion based upon on a few random events.
I've had some run ins with the right wing Christian nazi brigade and a few turned out to be real barnburners. Yet when compared to events and experiences with Muslims, the slightest of edges goes in favor of Christianity having the moral high ground, unless of coarse, day got a problem wit dat. It's also not to say all Muslims are bad or even most.
By the many arms of Vishnu, may you all have a good day.

shrew's visions
"They hate you because you invade their countries and kill them withbout mercy while stealing all they have, be it cash, jewellery or oil. Your soldiers, like all volunteer soldiers, are the scrapings of the society from whence they come,and shouldn't be allowed out unsupervised."
If we fought a war in this way,our fuel prices would be considerably lower, our causualtie count would be lower,as would our war cost because we could use plain old dumb bombs. How many soilders have paid the price of us fighting this war by sparing neighborhoods,mosques. If we were as barbaric as we are painted by the left the war would be over. How dare you call soilders the scrapings of society, typical BS from someone who has been sheltered their entire life,being given their opinions by some pschyo who hates themselves as much as their home.Look at the scumbaggery in Portland, hiding in shame behind a mask burning a soilder in effigy chanting hateful nonsense. TAKE OFF THE MASK AND TRY TO BURN ME YOU COWARDS!!!!!!!!

Catalina
Watch what you say. With every bone in my body I am resisting running off on a tangent and talking about Jimmy Carter. Let me just recommend the book, The Real Jimmy Carter by Steven Hayward. Also read A National Party No More by Zell Miller. He offers tremendous insight into the real Jimmy Carter. I'll say no more as I might otherwise write for hours.

Soviet Intervention in the Middle East

BWM writes: Wednesday, March, 28, 2007 1:48 AM
..."but American INTERVENTION has been huge."

Really? Soviet INTERVENTION was strong too. Both Superpowers did this.

Soviets were buying influence and favors in the Middle East just like the United States.



Soviets sold Egypt arms during the 1950's.

Who helped Egypt to finance the Aswan High Dam? Soviets were trying to win over hearts and minds.

Arafat recieved funding from the KGB.

Nothing happens in isolation.

Catalina
I think if you re-read my post carefully you will see I am about as far from a typical lib as you can get. The post was meant to be a shared sadness that we have allowed ourselves to stray so far from clear thinking and clear unequivocal actions when needed. I normally enjoy your posts. Sorry I didn't make myself clear.

bumper stickers won't fix it
Roy writes: Monday, March, 26, 2007 10:30 PM
Promoting Radical Islam

"The best way to promote radical Islam is for the American media to rant and rave against Islam generally. This gives the Muslim crazies public relations fodder, increasing the hatred for the US among moderate Muslims."

We could say nice things about Islamic people all day long but that's not going to work.

Your missing the whole point.

It's our image we project overseas and it offends them.

Radical Islam will point out how our society is filled with Debauchery. The Radicals have convince the Moderates that Westerners are no longer embrass the Christian religion. We are Sodom and Gomorrah.

Just look at our media and the glorification of excessive indulgences. We are crude, lewd and uncouth.

Our rap music treats all women as whores.

Our popular culture is made up with people like Brittany Spears and Anna Nicole Smith.

No wonder Jihadist want to kill us.









Ron and Beruit
Ronald Reagan had to cut and run from Beruit because Congress requested it.

Shawn
I also do not like the idea of a Constitutional amendment to forbid flag burning. All that should be required is a law. Unlike you I do not believe flag burning is protected by our first amendment. The first amendment was designed to protect our right to speak on the public square and in the papers to redress our government. It is to protect the oral and written word, not expressions. I have stated before that I for one am tired of this government using the first amendment to protect flag burning, pornography, profanity and blasphemous artwork while at the same time using the amendment to chase religion from the public square and silence my voice prior to an election. What utter nonsense.

You miss the two biggest reasons...
and as a libertarian, I can't help but see political aims to that fact. First off, you missed the most important reason for why the Middle East hates us; Israel. I feel sorry for how Israel is hated, but WE are dying by supporting THEM. The other reason you missed, you actually defined poorly. American colonialism has not been common, but American INTERVENTION has been huge. We supported a military coup in Syria, Egypt, Iraq, Lebanon,and Libya. We controlled Iran. We supported the Taliban to fight the Russians, then left them to terrorize the country, then RETURNED to bomb the daylights out of the country BECAUSE it was being terrorized by the militia WE armed and trained. We supported Iraq specifically to fight Iran, costing hundreds of thousands of lives on both sides, and then we invaded Iraq and killed more people because the dictator we put in place was, surpise, a dictator. We also caused the people of Iraq to revolt, then left them to be decimated by the returning army. We have sent troops in all over the region, constantly changing sounds, constantly destabilizing the region. We never actually TOOK OVER any part of the middle east, but we did cause civil wars over and over and over. THAT is the second reason they hate us.

Ron
Ron, you made me do it. I changed my handle because I didn't want to be confused with you. Ugghh!

Say What??
In a column in the Kuwaiti daily Al-Qabas, Lila Al-'Othman wrote about a ruling by a sheikh on a television show.

A viewer told the sheikh that a sheep he had brought home to sacrifice for Eid Al-Adha had eaten part of a foreign newspaper, and asked whether the sheep was still permitted for consumption.

The sheikh replied that if the paper contained nothing harming Allah or damaging Islam, the sheep could be eaten.

Source: Al-Arabiya, March 27, 2007


It’s true that Muslims historically had
no great focus on the Crusades…until recent times when Muslims and Arab nationalists rediscovered the Crusades (and the defeat of the Crusades) as a useful historical precedent for what they saw as their own struggles against the West. Similarly, few in Russia were ever probably aware of the details of the battle at Lake Ladoga or the Time of Troubles, but they were familiar with the heroic mythology of resistance against invasion that became useful for propaganda during the invasions of Germans. Thus the communist Eisenstein could make a Russian nationalist epic film about Alexander Nevsky, someone venerated as a saint in the Orthodox Church, because his defense of Novgorod against the Teutonic Knights, although largely incomparable to the Soviet situation, served as a potentially powerful symbol used to inspire people. The basic message was this, as with all good nationalist propaganda films: those people have invaded before, they lost back then and they will lose again. Memories of past successes become all the more important as a people has fewer and fewer successes in the present. Hence it is not only the case that many Muslims today cultivate a grievance about the Crusades, but it was to some extent inevitable (especially with certain obvious geographical parallels with the foundation of Israel) since past victories were bound to become more important as Muslims suffered setback after setback even in the post-independence period.

The fact that the Crusades have been taken up as a manufactured grievance to impart a sense of enduring resistance against European “aggression” to those who would very much like to model themselves on Saladin and Baybars does not make the real-world effects of that grievance any less potent or less real. There is no evidence that anyone thinks about this stuff? D’Souza should get out more. Some people in Syria to this day celebrate Sultan Baybars’ victory against the Mongols and his successes against the dwindling Crusader kingdoms of the Levant.

Of course, the Muslim rediscovery of the Crusades as a grievance is a political manipulation of history, not entirely unlike the sudden discovery of the virtue of the Crusades even among largely secular Westerners who would normally denounce the “intolerance” of pre-modern Christian Europe under any other circumstances. But that sense of grievance does exist today. That doesn’t mean that we have to make any concessions or blame the Crusaders for our problems today (problems we have, indeed, done much more to bring upon ourselves), but it does mean that D’Souza still doesn’t know what he’s talking about.


Ron
I an guessing that you have no knowledge of the military or otherwise, you would have understood that that my reference to Army was in terms of using helicopters,their specialty, ( In 1971-72, the Army provided basic helicopter training for the Air Force,
read this link
http://www.military.com/Opinions/0,,Hackworth_042605,00.html

The author is no Bush lover and remember if you want to hold Bush or Clinton guilty for everything negative that happened during their terms, the same must be true FOR Carter

catalina:
Dont quit your day job....

Bill B. recognized 9/11 was because of
our infedl troops in Saudi Arabia who were containing Sadam thus Iraq had everything to do with 9/11

We need to be the Alpha Dog
of this world, and a nuclear response to 9/11 would have established that position very effectivly. And it would have been the morally right thing to do.

Rhamton 7, sanctions on Saudi Arabia
would devestate our economy. That is why I favor seizing control of their oil feilds and nuking their cities. That way the oil would flow and the proceedes would go into our coffers instead of the cofferes of terrorist.

Patton's doctrin of warfare was
as follows:

"No bastered ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastered die for his country."

We should have never of sent troops to invade an occupy an unsubdued foe.

The response to 9/11 should have been massive nuclear retaliation and seizure of all the oil feilds of the Persian Gulf region.

none
You're an anti-semitic swine nor worthy of a civil reply.

Oops
Arafat WAS an Egyptian. Forgot he was dead.

(How could I forget such great news? Shame on me!)

Palestinians
The original (and only) Palestinians were descended from the Phoenicians (hence the name), spoke Punic and worshipped a pantheon of Syraic gods. When Yasser Arafat speaks Punic or founds the city of Carthage I will accept him as a Palestinian. Until then he is an Arab.

(Actually, Arafat is from Egypt, so he isn't even a "palestinian" in the useless modern sense of the word.)

The only other uses of Palestinian were:

1. To describe residents of a Roman administrative district which encompassed parts of previous client kingdoms in the middle east.
2. To desribe residents of a British colony carved out the Ottoman Empire.

Neither of these is a racial or cultural group. They are no more a culture than "people who live on the third floor" is a race or a cultural group. In modern times (until it was adopted by the arab nationalists) "Palestinian" was a conventient geographic fiction, nothing more.

Ancient History & Icedog
You are 100% right on. There are no "Palestinians". They are Arabs. Always have been, always will be.

Radical Islam wants to destroy Israel. They always have. The only time the Arabs truly tried to make peace with Israel was the Camp David Accord with Menachem Begin and Anwar Sadat. Not only did they sign a treaty, they also met together to break bread together. That is an ancient Middle Eastern form of fellowship and reconcilliation. When 2 parties broke bread together, they were saying that they were one in friendship. That was truly a peace accord, and it cost Sadat his life by assassination.

When Clinton tried to do the same thing to secure some kind of legacy, there was one huge difference. Itzak Rabin and Yaser Arafat did meet together and they did shake hands and sign a treaty. They then boarded separate planes and went their separate ways. No breaking of bread and also no peace. That "peace treaty" was a sham.

Anyone who thinks there will be peace between Israel and the Muslims is a fool. The hatred is thousands of years deep. Even today, the Muslims are digging under the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, destroying Jewish artifacts that prove that the Jews were in Jerusalem before Mohammed.


A dark future
Iran has kidnapped British soldiers and we are worrying about escalating the "cycle of violence" and seeking a way to ensure we don't anger the kidnappers and their ilk any more than they already are. After all, we are to blame for their anger with us and our allies. They are actively subverting our aims in Iraq and costing precious American lives daily. They are on the cusp of going nuclear. And many of our citizens and-unbelievably- some of our leaders, feel that a nuclear Iran would be acceptable, perhaps even desirable.

We are headed down a path to a dark place where we may start to lose parts of American cities or begin to experience even more mind bending atrocities (Homeland tells us there is nothing to worry about in radicals seeking to be school bus drivers, it's all under control, don't you know). At that point, probably most Americans will move beyond the need to understand them and to share the never ending pain and alienation we have inflicted upon them.

The only solution may be what now seems to be the unthinkable, what was hinted of in A FEW GOOD MEN when Jack Nicholson roared "You can't handle the truth!!"

Perhaps there is still time for dialogue, for mutual understanding, but we are getting close, very close.

What is amazing is that there is a substantial part of our populace, our fellow citizens, who would deem periodic subway bombings in our cities, losing an elementary school or two, or whatever, as a regrettable but acceptable price to pay for diversity and for the sin of being Americans. "So sad, but if McChimpy Bushitler hadn't done what he did, we would all be sipping tea together and working for shared peace." Sorry for my cynicism, Roy, I truly-no sarcasm at all-wish it could be the way you stated it in your prior post, but I fear we may be beyond that now.

I recall a couple of weeks after 9/11, Ann Coulter had a column in which she said something to the effect that " we are not going to lose airliners to prove we are politically correct". I doubt she would say that now, and I believe we would.

ron
As much as you would like to believe that anyone and everyone who has conservative thoughts is 'filled with hate filled people' like me, I assure you that you are incorrect.
Unlike you and the liberal loons on the hill, most conservatives understand the difference between hate and not allowing our country to be overrun, taken advantage of, or mismanaged by those who seek to use our greatness to tackle every problem in the world all while complaining that we are too imperialistic and demanding.
Guess what? I used to be a hard core liberal. I USED to think much like you did. Gee, wasn't Carter great. Gee, it isn't illegal immigration, we need to be nicer. Gee, all republicans are bad.
Guess what? Carter WASN'T great. He was terrible. Guess what? Illegal immigrations is an enormous problem. The people that come to this country illegally don't pay their fair share, don't try to integrate themselves into our culture, and many, MANY of them are violent criminals, sexual predators, or worse. Know what changed my mind? I spoke with a few LEGAL immigrants. Overwhelmingly, they oppose illegal immigration. That ought to tell you the whole story right there. Guess what? Not all conservatives are evil or hate filled at all. Very few are.

Let's chat about Carter- Yes, it is a fact that carter cut the equivalent of $20 billion of todays dollars from the defense budget. Yes, he authored the Carter doctrine. But as I mentioned, this was only because his people funded, trained, and otherwise aided Islamic fundamentalists (including Osama Bin Laden) specifically to draw the USSR into 'their own vietnam'. So, to review, he created the USSR's Vietnam war, then wrote a doctrine stating that:

'An attempt by any outside force to gain control of the Persian Gulf region will be regarded as an assault on the vital interests of the United States of America, and such an assault will be repelled by any means necessary, including military force.'
This, of course, was worded by the very man who came up with this scam - Zbigniew Brzezinski, President Carter's National Security Adviser. And you somehow connect this to a military buildup? Hogwash. He did what he could to reduce our military, then incited a horrific war between the USSR and Afghanistan, then increased troop levels and military funding. What an accomplishment. Big whoop.
My all time favorite thing you said?
"The "left" invents scandal? Moronic statement."

Then feel free to explain the current scandal du jour - the firing of 8 US attorneys. The code is clear - not only are USA's political appointees (which naturally leads the left to try to frame the issue as a political scandal - USA's shouldn't follow the President's policy? OF COURSE THEY SHOULD. How long would you be employed if you refused to do what your boss asked of you?), but they serve at the pleasure of the President - meaning he can terminate them at any point, and for any reason. So where is the damn scandal? I've been asking that for weeks and so far, all I can tell is that the left is mad because they forced someone to testify that they were termed because of performance, when it turned out to be partially performance and partially because they general feeling was that these 8 were not loyal. What a scandal! Let me see if I can break this down for you - USA's are picked by the President and appointed to the position, then conferred by the Congress. Usually, well actually almost always, these people are rubber stamped through by both sides. Congress doesn't like to think too hard about this sort of thing. Of course, part of the job is following the initiatives that come from the President and through the Attorney General. When any USA doesn't do as they are expected, they can be terminated, again for any reason and at any time. So again - WHERE IS THE SCANDAL?
Now, you believe my point on Israel, the 'palestinian' struggle, and Carters appeasement and ludicrous theories are too stupid to discuss. I disagree.
Here's why - Carter calls it an apartheid. This is a complete fabrication. Since inception, Israel has made it very clear that they want peace and integration. The Palestinians, from the PLO (a terrorist organization at it's very root) and now Hamas and Fatah (both terror organizations as well) want to destroy Israel and remove it from the face of the earth. Odd how no nation without fundamantalist muslim rule has no issue with Israel, don't you think? Have you even spent a moment trying to understand that conflict? No nation note under Islamic control has an issue with Israel's existence. Yet the fundamentalist muslisms want to destroy it. When Israel provided safe transport to the so-called palestinians who wanted to go back to their countries of origin, those palestinians were turned away, often at gun point. Not one islamic nation accepts palestinian refugees. Yet they all pretend to care. They don't want peace, they want to destroy Israel.

None
History would have to disagree with your false facts.

The Kingdom of Israel existed for some 300 years before being destroyed by the Assyrians.

No Fly Zones in Iraq
Bill B,

"The US did NOT occupy Saudis Arabi."

The Saudi government invited the United States Armed Forces to place bases inside the country to keep Saddam at bay.


We were flying missions from Saudi Arabia to patrol the NFZ in Iraq during the 1990's.

But OBL thinks differently but he's dead now.


Ancient History
karennkc,

"In fact, there already was a Palestine – look at the maps in your Bible – since the times of the Romans. Everyone keeps saying if the Palestinians accept Israel, they can have their own state."


Tell me when Islam was introduced into the Palestine area?


Your playing word semantics. The area in question has been occupied by other Ancient Empires for centuries. I can name seven of them in Ancient History. Even more recent history....the Zoroastrian Persians occupied the area for 14 years in 614 AD!

Even the Neanderthals once occupied the region!


Palestine is what the Ancient Romans called the area during their occupation. It has nothing to do with the Palestinians of today.



"The name Palestine refers to a region of the eastern Mediterranean coast from the sea to the Jordan valley and from the southern Negev desert to the Galilee lake region in the north. The word itself derives from "Plesheth", a name that appears frequently in the Bible and has come into English as "Philistine". Plesheth, (root palash) was a general term meaning rolling or migratory. This referred to the Philistine's invasion and conquest of the coast from the sea. The Philistines were not Arabs nor even Semites, they were most closely related to the Greeks originating from Asia Minor and Greek localities. They did not speak Arabic. They had no connection, ethnic, linguistic or historical with Arabia or Arabs."

http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_early_palestine_name_origin.php




Typos
Sorry for all the typos. I am a miserable typist.

Bill B
My point being, I doubt the muslims even saw the US presence as an occupation until bin Laden invented that rationale for hating the US. Instead, I think they had an innate envy and dislike of the US, Bin Laden played on this, created a rationale for expressing it, and they bought into it.

Proof? I don't recall a signle muslim in 1991 calling for the US to leave Saudi Arabi. At the time, the residents of SA were more than happy to have us protecting them. it is only with OBL's claims that this even became an issue.

Bill B
It doesn't matter that derranged Muslims saw the US presence as an occupation. If they saw the US soldiers as cows it wouldn't mean the US army could produce milk. Whatever deluded people think does not change the facts. The US did NOT occupy Saudis Arabi.

None
No problem with Islam prior to 1948?

How about the Barbary Pirates in the 18th Century?

And, for the rest of the west, besides the US, how about the invasion of Spain, Sicily, and the attempted occupation of France? The expansion of the Ottoman Empire right up to the walls of Vienna and almost to Venice?

No problem prior to 1948?

USA In Saudi Arabia
My point is that the USA military had a significant presence in the holiest of holies to Muslims.

I qualified it by saying "invited or otherwise," but the fact of the matter is that many Muslims saw it as a de-facto occupation of the holy land.

I don't agree with that assesment but I do point it out as a point upon which many Muslims would disagree with Mr. D'Souza. I'm not a Muslim but I do see their perception of this quite well.

After all, to know your enemy you must know how he thinks. That's my point. I'm not here trolling for flames.

Catlina
And you can tell Ron why Jimmy Carter won a Nobel peace prize too.

Packrat
I am not saying Carter's plan was a success our anything, but he needed to work with the forces he had, maybe not the ones he wanted-Didn't Rummie say this? Anyway, how would all the Army mechanized units have slipped into the Iranian desert anyway? Besides, didn't the navy jets see a lot of action in Iraq?

RE: none
"Islam was not a problem in the modern era for the West until 1948."

But you can just happily forget the Islamo-nuts' alliance with Hitler prior to that, huh?

Apparently another "myth" that is being exposed right here on this blog is that there actually exists an honest and intelligent liberal.

Occupied Saudi Arabia
I believe that the US had permission to be in Saudi Arabia and did not occupy the country any more than when you go to visit someone and stay at their house that you have "occupied" or taken over the house.

I guess the US has then occupied Britain since we had troops there as well.

Ron
Carter was a micromanage of the nth degree, He sent Navy aircraft into a desert situation, where the Army had better qualifications.

He also oversaw the reduction of funding for both military and federal employees when inflation was double digit. ( He said he wanted us to be the example. We were. Nobody els followed his example)

RE: karennkc
Your facts are a bit off, which isn't surprising. In the Biblical era, there was no Palestine. That region that kooks like you like to call Palestine was actually called Canaan. The Jewish claiming of that land predates anything having to do with the Islamo-nut religion by about 2700 years, or more.

And if you think what happened 4000 years ago is really why today's Islamo-nuts hate us, then you're dumber than you sound.

"Why weren’t they allowed a say in how the West carved up these ancient lands? Why weren’t they at least compensated for their land?"

There are millions of dead Jews and Christians throughout the years who'd like to ask those Islamo-nuts those very same questions.

Shrew

Your ability to absorb talking point and regurgitate them is impressive. No rational thought just insults

Your attitude toward the military is 30 years past its prime.

Since you profess to have the answers, explain the wonderful couple that got through the checkpoint in Baghdad using their kids as decoys, then near their target, RAN AWAY, and then detonated the car bomb, killing the kids.

Jeffislouie
Yoda notwithstanding, Carter did try to free the hostages, but mechinical and incopetence onthe ground doomed the effort.

You mention carter earlier in his administration, but neglect to point out that his Carter Doctrine, since accepted by Reagan, created the largest military buildup in history. Todays, Rapid Response and Centcom is a direct result.

Carter negotiated the release of the hostages, the Iranians didn't simply "give up."

If the right had such a large role in balancing the budget,as you say, why hasn't the effort been duplicated rather than racking up huge deficits?

Your personal insights on Jimmy Carter and the Palestinians/Arabs are not worthy of discussion.

The "left" invents scandal? Moronic statement.

I think the reasons the right/conservative movement is foundering and failing is because they are filled with hate filled people like yourself (Ann Couter, Praegar ect...) and the majority of the American people are waking up to that fact and voting accordingly, this is something you can't accept. Ask Dick Cheney how his stint in the service was when his country needed him most during the Viet nam war, "I had other priorities in the '60s other than military service," Cheney told a reporter in 1989.


Bill B.
Your confused...I was in Desert Shield/Desert Storm...we were there at the request of the Saudi government. If you remember, the threat was that Saddam would continue to roll into Saudi after securing Kuwait.

When you invade a country to own it and make it part of your country you are an "invader"...when you are in a country at the request of their government you are an ally or a guest...big difference.

It doesn't matter why they hate us
It really doesn't matter why they hate us. If we are a country that believes in freedom as our main principle, we must defend freedom whenever it is threatened. That is the main point of this "War on Terror", even though I don't like that term. The libertarian in me tells me that whenever someone's rights are infringed by force or fraud, the violator must be punished. I don't know the history of the Middle East, but I do know the present times. And the biggest aggressors against freedom right now are fascists trying to impose their will on the world under a banner of Islam. The United States has been the biggest defender of freedom in the history of the world. We are not perfect, but we try our best. The best reason to fight these people is to preserve our way of life, that is, if we truly value our way of life.

US Has Indeed Occupied Muslim Country
I respectfully disagree with Mr. D'Souza on a crucial point.

The USA has indeed occupied a Muslim country, the one which all of Islam holds most sacred. Invited or not, the USA has had a considerable number of military forces in Saudi Arabia, since at least 1990.

Many Muslims consider this to be highly offensive and an act of war.

Although the USA has subsequently removed troops from Saudi Arabia, the basic fact still stands that Saudi Arabia was a de-facto occupied country.

That's what Usama bin Laden got all worked up over, so much so that his Al Qaeda ultimately attacked the USA homeland.

Step in the right direction for D'Souza
After finding much with which I disagreed in his previous articles, I agree with most of this article, especially D'Souza's criticism of leftist solutions to "radical" Islam.

However, I think D'Souza fundamentally misunderstands the threat the west faces today when he continues to draw a distinction between "Islam", and "radical Islam".

The distinction exists only in terms of methods employed to accomplish the ends, but not the ends themselves.

The childish and simpleminded arguments by leftists that the west was the aggressor during the Crusades, and that "imperialism" is at the heart of muslim rage toward us, are nicely dissected by D'Souza, revealing their falsity.

I just wonder why it is necessary for some to continue the charade of describing the threat we face as "radical Islam", rather than "Islam".

Anti-jihad Crusader
You are correct...don't capitalize!!

Why they hate us
What I'd like to know is why everyone has been asking this asinine question. If it wasn't us it would be someone else for the moslems to hate, it seems to be coded in their DNA to hate, destroy, and kill.

That being said, islam isn't a religion at all, the closest it comes to a religion is a blood-cult. It has to be one of the most violent ideologies I've had the displeasure of coming in contact with in the world.

You may notice that I refuse to capitalize certain words that are usually capitalized, this is not an oversight but a statement against a cancer that is gnawing at the vitals of the world.

Some clarifications
In the OT, the Israelites went in and did as they were instructed (mostly). The pagan tribes living in the lands the Hebrews would occupy deserved to be killed. They were irredeemable. They engaged in temple prostitution, bestiality etc. You have to assume they were therefore ate up with all manner of STDs; both the people and the livestock. (Maybe God could have given the Jews a knowledge of antibiotics?) The commands were quite specific in the OT: Go in there and kill the Jebusites, Amalekites Termites etc. Wipe out that particular people group. Cf this with Islam where muslims are told to kill the UnBelievers. Those who dont believe the Quran are a huge and broad group of folks.

Secondly, who was in possession of the West Bank prior to 1967? From '48 to '67 the Jordanians should have donated that property and helped establish a Palestinian homeland. But nooooooooooo, they didnt did they?
Tiny Israel can absorb and welcome refugees from all over the world. The Arab nations have treated Palestinian "refugees" horrificly. Kept them confined on reservations/refugee camps etc etc.
Of course I guess it would be asking too much for the Saudis to welcome the Palestinians. The Pals are universally hated by the majority of their Arab brethren even though all the physicians, engineers in the MidEast are Pals. And to me it seems scandalous the number of Nobel Prize winners (chemistry, medicine etc) produced by tiny Israel compared to all those Arab nations who've produced how many science Nobels? (I lost count! Oh yeah, none).

Why they hate us?
In the early seventies I had occasion to be in a discussion with a then Ambassador who had just returned from Egypt. He had met with Nasser and at one point, while overlooking a historic tract of desert, Nasser commented "if you want to understand the Arab-Israely conflict, read the book of Joshua."

In actuality, you have to go back much farther than that. Read about Abraham favoring Isaac over Ishmael and the envy of Ishmael (the first born, but to the servant) against Isaac. Ishamel is the ancestor of the Arabs and Isaac of the Jews. it began as a sibling rivalry. It doesn't matter if this is accurate or not if it was believed.

The schism between Sunni and Shiite is over succession after Mohammed died. That's 1300 years ago. The rest of the religion is the same. How stupid is that? The matter of succession is the schism between Roman and Greek Orthodox Catholics. Are they killing each other...TODAY?

What all this points out is the abject stupidity of age-old hatreds. If they still have resentment about the Crusades, it wouldn't surprise me.

But a people, or a religion, that has to use a thousand year old excuse really have little to offer.

Do you see Jews waging "jihad" against Egypt for enslaving them? Or sending suicide bombers to Germany? They make a life!

So why do they hate us? They don't even know as far as I'm concerned. There hatred is manufactured just as their excuses are thousands of years old.


Sawgunner
You forgot that in Muslim countries, pedophilia and slaverr are accepted practices. The only places in the world where slavery is practiced with impugnity is in Islamic countries.

Islam is a pestilence in the world.


Don't approve of flag burning
However, I don't believe there should be a constitutional amendment banning it either. I believe that it falls under the 1st amendment/free speech clause. That said, if you truly wanted to get it banned, I think the best way to go about it is to inact legislation making it considered "hate speech". The libs are always going on about "hate-speech" and "hate crimes", why not use their own arguments and precedents to turn the tables on them?

Is this guy for real?
He doesn't know much about history or Islam. He apparently hasn't read a paper in 5 1/2 years either.

Why is this guy considered any kind of authority on Islam? I keep seeing his name a lot in the press but he has no clue what he's talking about.

Just his lead paragraph alone is laughable. Then there is this quote: "Is it reasonable to think that Muslims today are genuinely outraged about events that occurred a thousand years ago?"

Duh? Anyone who knows even a little bit about Islam and history should know that the real reason why Spain was targeted had very little to do with Iraq and everything to do with al-Andalus.

Five hundred years. Muslims have very long memories indeed.

Evil Incarnate
I read with interest the book by Dinesh D'Souza that attempts to explain the cultural differences between these killers as well as their concept of proportionality that believes we only had the right to kill 3,000 of theirs because they only killed 3,000 of ours. It isn't that D'Souza is defending the Islamic mind, he is merely trying to explain it. Yet, I am left with no sympathy. I am left with no desire to understand. What I see and interpret from my purely western background is that this evil is worse than any I could have possibly imagined. I personally favor the withdrawal of this country's recognition of Islam as a religion, the closure of all things Islamic in this country much as we did the Nazi's during and after World War II and the deportation of all non-citizens of Islamic background. Let them clean up their world before we let them back in ours. I don't much care whether they join the twenty-first century or not. I don't much care whether they like or respect us or not. I only care that they understand that if they attack us again they will risk annihilation much like the Japanese experienced in the fire-bombings that preceded the two atomic bombs.

As an aside, there are at least two persons posting by the name Ron. I'm not the one that is foolish enough to believe that Jimmy Carter rebuilt our military and Ronald Reagan benefitted. What drivel.

Polls
Hillary Clinton and the leftist media really pay attention to polls, even if they are BS. We always hear about the polls showing how unpopular President Bush is.

I wish someone would take a poll of Americans to see how many of them think that the USA is in a war. I'm thinking that most Americans do not realize that the USA is in a war against terrorism.

People apposed to the war make a big stink about there being no weapons of mass destruction (WMD). They do not seem to realize that is a situation that can quickly change in this day and age of WMD in a suitcase.

I for one am very glad that we have a president who does not make his decisions based on popularity polls from people who do not have access to the information required to make an informed opinion on the subject(s). I had to have radiation treatments on my neck and upper left shoulder. My hair fell out almost two weeks to the day after the radiation started - The radiologist said that it takes two weeks to work. My skin got blistered and red like from a bad sunburn and I got so anemic that after radiation was over, it took over six months for my iron levels to get back into the low normal levels.

Pulling the troops out of Iran the way the Democrats want to is like Roosevelt's Congress pulling the troops out of Germany during WWII after they got that far. All it does is allow a defeated foe to regroup and greatly increase their motivation and morale. People would have called it treason - aiding and abetting the enemy.

With the Left, it appears that there is no such thing as right or wrong, but the only evil is anyone who disagrees with them.

Roy

Feel free to understand and appreciate moderate Islam all you want.

Best plan to convert if you live long enough, because that is the only choice you will be given if they win this war.


Jimmy Carter
Jimmy Carter gave us 18% mortgages, long, long gas lines, didn't keep his promises with our allies, caused the Shah of Iran to be overthrown, many countries moved to the Left or were lost to dictatorships during his presidency, and as an omen of how evil he is, a rabbit attacked him. You can still read the article about the rabbit attack online.

Jimmy Carter years later has totally different version of his Iran Hostage rescue attempts, including that he was patient although people claimed he wasn't and that no one died because of him, although many people did die because of his convoluted leadership - and people think President Bush is bad.

Jimmy Carter was such a bad president that even the Left main stream media, who usually lie, white-wash and put out propaganda to protect their Leftist candidates, even gave up on him so that Reagan won by a landslide, taking every state in the union except Carter's VP - Walter Mondale's state of MN.

At least Jimmy Carter didn't take polls to decide what to do like Billary did. The president has access to information that even members of Congress do not. It is really unbelievably poor and very irresponsble that the person who has access to the most information and to the most expert advice would resort to taking polls to decide what to do - Polls of people who really do not have enough information to make really informed decisions that are not their responsibility to make.

It appears that we are becoming a nation of know-it-alls that we tolerate leadership by polls like Billary did.

Carter
Pres. Whimp Carter did more to damage our country then any president since our country was founded. The inability to make a decision made us look weak in the middle east.

Until
Until we become energy independent(which will be impossible w/o drilling off our coasts, in alaska,and building more nuculer power plants. We will have to be nice these oil rich Ba*tards.

Promoting Radical Islam
The best way to promote radical Islam is for the American media to rant and rave against Islam generally. This gives the Muslim crazies public relations fodder, increasing the hatred for the US among moderate Muslims.

I have a bumper sticker on my car which I recommend. It reads: "We refuse to be enemies." Beneath in smaller print: "Muslims, Jews and Christians working for justice and peace."

The best way to defeat radical Islam is to understand and appreciate moderate Islam, the religion of over 1 billion people. As a Christian, I disagree with some things about Islam, but I disagree with many Christians on how to interpret Christianity, too. Too many Christians have a Taliban-like way of thinking. Our way or the highway - the highway to hell. Nonsense. God is much bigger than that.

Oh, and I have a new button I plan to wear. It reads: "God bless the whole world. No exceptions!"

It is such an attitude that could turn this world around and beat back the haters and warhawks and intolerant bastards wherever they are - and every religion has its share. Why must we go on killing people - most of them innocent whom we don't even know? It was rabid neo-cons Jews plus ignorant Christian evangelicals who pushed hard for us to invade Iraq. They knew about as much about Iraq as I know about climate conditions in southeasterm Cameroon. It's sad how otherwise decent people are brainwashed, then stampeded into foolishness, like a bunch or stupid sheep - headed for the slaughter.

The most effective weapon against the warped Al Qaeda mentality is not an equally warped Christian or Jewish mentality. It is a 'we all are children of Abraham' emphasis, and we won't hate however much the O'Reilly and Hannity and Fox & Co try to make us hate. Bush II actually has been good on the Islam issue, but his Defense Dept. was overrun by warrior kooks urged on by that military-industrial complex eager to make money off the blood of others.

Keep smiling - and praying.

Shrew
I believe I just dropped napalm on you! Pardon me if I don't elucidate.

Nee:
I'm kind of new to this forum; don't know the
by-lines you mentioned, but enjoyed your verse!

I know I shouldn't even respond to the likes of
Shrew. Notice that he/she showed up on this
thread calling names. That's because his/her
last attempt at rational discussion was utterly
shredded by some folks on a previous thread.

Pathetic.

Myth: Saudi Arabia is our ally - part 2
New poll shows American public sharply opposed to U.S. Mideast policy
IsraeliInsider, March 26, 2007

By a margin of more than 5-to-1 (65% - 11%), Americans believe that SAUDI ARABIA IS NOT A RELIABLE & TRUSTWORTHY ALLY in the war against radical Islamic terrorism;

By a margin of nearly 2-to-1 (51% - 26%), Americans believe that the US should IMPOSE ECONOMIC SANCTIONS ON SAUDI ARABIA until it stops its support and funding for terrorists and radical Islamic education that teaches hatred of America and Israel.

http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Diplomacy/11023.htm

Myth: Saudi Arabia is our ally
Bank of the Intifada to Join the U.N.
by Anne Bayefsky
National Review, March 26, 2007

The United Nations’ NOURISHMENT OF TERRORISM (a concept it has yet to define) reached a new low last Friday. On March 23, 2007, the United Nations General Assembly’s Sixth Committee -- its lead legal body comprised of all 192 member states -- recommended that observer status be granted to the ISLAMIC DEVELOPMENT BANK GROUP (IDB), an entity that has been directly involved in paying the families of Palestinian suicide bombers...

The creation of a fund dedicated to making suicide-bombing financially appealing was the brainchild of then Crown Prince, now KING, ABDULLAH OF SAUDI ARABIA. Saudi Arabia, where the bank is headquartered, put forward the application of the IDB for observer status, announcing in accompanying documentation that the IDB works “to promote social progress in accordance with the ethos of Islam.” Nowhere in the six-page Saudi “explanatory memorandum” does it mention the bank’s administration of the Al-Aqsa and Al-Quds Intifadah Funds...

The recommendation that the IDB be granted observer status was adopted, by consensus, in the form of a draft resolution. THE UNITED STATES LOOKED THE OTHER WAY. Only Israel registered a concern that the bank had relations to Hamas and pointed out that its “organizational chart showed that it had operated Al Aqsa and Al Quds funds, which had known ties to terror groups.”

http://article.nationalreview.com/
?q=Nzc2YjJlMWFiMzllODE4NjY2YzVkNTc0YjcxMjc5MjM=

Bullgod...Shrew
Surely you know that Shrew is another Monkey girl in disguise...I say it's the queen monkey girl Kimberly in diguise....Let it go...unless you would like to hear my rhyme as it pertains to Monkeys...

Screaming Monkey Syndrome" (Kimberly, et al, now-as described by GunnyG)
That is, they arrive...
they scream loudly...
flail about spectacularly...
flings poop in every direction...

and then retires to the cave...

And my poem of understanding the "Screaming Monkey Syndrome"(by Nee, revised)

See the monkeys in the cave,
all night waiting to rant and rave
Will they screech, will they scream
We know they will, but we can dream

shrew:
Nice to hear from you again! Are you here to tell us again how Americans are murdering
thugs who brought 9/11 on ourselves?

Or to explain that the "Iraqi guerillas" who
murder thousands of their own people, with
special attention to WOMEN AND CHILDREN, are
really just like the Minutemen?

Slither back under your rock, you loathsome
reptile.

MYTHS ABOUT "ISRAEL"
The word "Israel" is the name of a person in the Bible-not a country
The Jewish nation existed for less than a hundred years in ancient times
The wailing wall is the remains of an old Roman fort-Fort Antonina-not an ancient Jewish temple
Most Jews who settled in Israel were not even religious-in fact all the leaders who established Israel were atheists!
As for Palestine-Palestine was the old Roman province of Phistina
As for tiny Israel-the only Arabs allowed to own land there are the few who did not flee in the wake of the 1948 War-in other words those that are grandfathered in
There is a Jewish member of the Palestinian Parliament
In any case-most Jews (with exception of Sephardic) are descended from Eurpean/Asian Aszenazi-Khazars from central Russia

Why respond to the Communist/Amorals?
You must realize, these fools are just baiting you with their usual lies, lies which they truly believe, as if they were in High School, were repeated often enough, become truisms. If we are overwhelmed by unlimited illegal immigration, muslim immigration, and leftist moral depravity, which I believe will eventually happen, the killing will really begin!
There is not much you can really do but to really get involved in politics, and stop the currently defective political processes going on now.
Keep to the topic addressed by the column author, and ignore the insane. Wise old saying; "Arguing with an insane person eventually makes you insane".

apoplectic

I don't normally laugh aloud during these threads, but your verbal trap on Shrew is priceless. Well done!

D SOUZA IS FULL OF MYTHS
This is not a liberal v. conservative issue. Most Moslems are not even Arabs. The biggest Moslem country is Indonesia. D'Souza is way off base when he makes this an ideological problem.
Invading Moslem countries to "fight terrorists" is just a stupid "conservative myth." D' Souza is blind to the fact that we create terrorists every time we use "myths" like WMD or atomic bombs in Iraq as an excuse to wage aggressive war. Islam was not a problem in the modern era for the West until 1948. Could it be that our foreign policy made "for the jews, by the Jews and of the Jews" might have something to do with this radical Moslem hate?

Dude
I know exactly what Shrew is. Honestly couldn't resist.

Shrew
Nunya damn business. Now go fix that tooth, you've got a train to catch!!!

Shrew
I was a nunya.

Shrew
Go crawl back in your hole.. or are you the other kind of shrew (the bitter women)? I'm betting on the second. I was one of those soldiers so save your idiotic dribble and challenges to "go sign up". Do us all a favor and go ride your subway. Be sure and bring a large backpack with wires sticking out of it.

The holy crusades
It is a constant source of frustration with me that when the Holy Crusades are mentioned, virtually everyone agrees that they were a shameful mistake. Had the peoples who eventually came to see themselves as Europeans not unite to stop and then repel the Muslim invaders, we may all be speaking Arabic and America would almost certainly not exist. The Holy Crusades were a reaction, not an unprovoked act of religious-based aggression. The only common virtue the various European peoples shared was Christianity which is why they united around the goal of reclaiming the Holy Lands. It also made economic sense since the Middle East was the center of economic activity. It is no accident either that the famous explorers like Magellan and Columbus displayed the Rosicrucian cross on their sails. They were looking for a new route to the markets in the Far East so as to circumvent the Near and Middle East bottlenecks as the last of the Holy Crusades. The Holy Crusades were a good thing.

I think taj is basically correct
According to their religion, they should be the "chosen". They should be prosperous. The fact that America is so prosperous and powerful is an affront to them. How could a non-muslim nation be so prosperous and powerful. Surely that is not the work of Allah, so it must be the work of the devil. I think it ranges from jealousy (same reason the left hates corporate America) to the belief that we are truly evil.

They don't hate us...
They're just blindly waving Enlish-language
protest signs their power-mad leaders give
them.

When those "leaders" join Saddam at the end
of a rope, they'll like us well enough.

Iraq War and the uncertainty
Beautifully written. The extreme Muslims kill themselves to harm us because they hate us. As free people, we don't hate them at all. To me, that is evil at its purest, and President George Bush understands that! This war is a war of good vs. evil.. we must create tension in the middle-east to exorcise the evil that has taken over Islam.

70 virgins
I bet the seventy virgin are sheared sheep.

islam
of all the major religions in the world it is the only one spread by the sword(violence)i dont know what holy book muslims read but there isnt going to be 70 virgins waiting in heaven for suicide bombers

Not Patton
That parody of General Patton doesn't even reflect Patton's view of how to conduct war. Like me, Patton would be convinced that conventional forces could win the war.

The technically accurate term for the "Patton Doctrine" is: genocide. I'm not opposed to genocide, but I'm not amused at such a caricature of the General.

In spite of the myth of the movie, Patton did not have a gravelly voice.
Of course, if we'd followed the doctrine that Patton truly did endorse, we'd have a global hegemony now and communism would be a 60-year-old memory.

Another holiday to add to my calendar:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Lepanto_(1571)

I have to
Disagree with Mr. D'Souza slightly here, on a point of history.

There was in fact an organized resistance to the U.S. annexation of the Philippines after the Spanish-American War. It lasted for almost a decade (1899-1908). It was centered on Mindanao, the southernmost major island in the country. Due to the fact that the insurgency was largely the work of a single ethnosocial group from the Moro region of the island, it became known as the "Moro Rebellion", and those who participated in it were known generally as "Moros".

The "Moros" were almost exclusively Muslims. The violence they perpetrated included (but was not limited to) murder, arson, attacking and burning schools and churches, and using drugs to induce a shock-resistant state and then engaging in what can only be described as suicide attacks in markets, public streets, and even churches during worship services. These attacks added two words to the American military vocabulary; "running amok" (the insurrectionists' own term for this sort of attack) and "juramentado" (the term applied by other Filipinos).

The reason for the violence was simple. The "Moros" resented the fact that most other Filipinos were not Muslims, and resented the fact that they had to share, not just Mindanao, but the entire island group nation with such "infidels". They had not "acted out" prior to 1899 due to a very real chance of being wiped out by the Spanish (who were never "P.C.", and had both long memories and a prediliction for scorched-earth strategies), but after that they felt that the U.S. forces, coming from a "young, weak" nation, would be a pushover.

It didn't quite work out that way.

Today, of course, U.S. special operations forces are engaged in combat and support roles alongside the Philippine Army in that beautiful country. Fighting a Muslim insurgency that has continued from the 1950s on, but literally exploded after 9/11/2001.

And the more things change, the more they stay the same.


cheers

eon

FOWG
You paint a picture of Muslims as being so pure that God has decided to utilize them as the holy tool to destroy the decadent West.

As for this alleged purity, anyone that has been to Iraq can tell you that the citizens of that country enjoy their porn, beastiality, homosexuality, gambling, drinking, and whatever else you seem to think God is willing to kill us for partaking in. The Muslims have their wild side; they have just driven it all underground. It is truly laughable to think that the same people we videotaped sexually assaulting a donkey would take up the sword to kill a Westerner for enjoying a pole dance.

In our raids, we confiscated heaps of DVD's in search of terrorist propaganda, and as a result we wound up with volumes of "home movies" of the local people engaging in every type of behavior that you claim they deplore. No, the Middle East is just like the West in that sense, so there is no genuine moral indignation that they are fighting for. Rather, their actions are the result of a religious element run amok. Muslim imams aspire to political power, and they use their supposed coziness with Allah as the means with which to obtain it. Twisting the word of God is an old act, but there is always an audience ready to applaud.

You apparently have an axe to grind with people that engage in activities that displease you. In your self-righteousness fit you are cheerleading the Muslim wave because you hope they will kill the people that do not worship the same as you. As evidenced by my time in Iraq, it is often the case whereby the people that conduct their religion with such viciousness are in fact the ones that are first in line behind the donkey. And hoping God kills the West by using the Muslims as the tool means somebody should hurry up with your stepstool.

Thanks Icedog...
For smacking down Karen's ignorance. Maybe Karen would like to explain why Jews cannot own land in Arab/Muslims countries but approx 20% of Isreal's citizens are Arabs. Which society is racist?

Flag Burning...
... is done with great respect after the Flag is wore out.

I will always hand over wore out flags to my local chapter of the VFW. They do it right.

What does it matter
why they hate us? The Patton solution, here it is via the Barking Moonbat Early Warning System.

http://www.barking-moonbat.com/index.php/trackback/9119/qpxfgIMd/

I have been advocating this for years.

Ron...
Yes, Carter 'tried', but that seems rather a silly way of excusing something.
Master Yoda says, "There is no try. There is only do or do not."
The fact is, Carter tried to solve the problem 'diplomatically' and it didn't work. The Iranians got what they wanted in exchange for some suffering of innocent Americans.
If Carter had 'tried' the way the country wanted, he would have sent in battle squadrons to make life real tricky for the Ayatollah. Instead, he plunged the nation into a state of malaise. For the first time in our nations history, not even our leaders made the case that America is a good place to live. Carter was a one term President for a reason - he didn't know how to stick up for what is right then, and he doesn't now either.
Carter wasn't the catalyst for the military buildup - he hated the military then even more than he hates it now.
Here's some fun facts about Carter-
-During his first month in office Carter cut the defense budget by $6 Billion. That was 1977 money. Adjusted for inflation, that is like cutting $20 billion in todays dollars.
-Carters administration was the very administration that funded and supported anti-communist islamists in Afghanistan (including one Mr. Osama Bin Laden) nearly 6 months before the USSR invaded. Carters national security advisor admitted that this secretly provoked war gave America "the opportunity of giving to the USSR its Vietnam war".
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BRZ110A.html
-Carter didn't really bring home the Americans at all. They simply gave up. One of their primary demands was the release of the Shah, who we had brought to the states for medical treatment. Carter froze Iranian money, which then became part of the Iranian demands. When the Shah died of cancer in a hospital, they only wanted the money back. The banks took over negotiations for the release of the hostages, not the U.S. State Department.
-Reagan won a landslide 91% of the electoral vote.
-Carter is widely viewed as an anti-semite who ignores fact and prefers to side with his buddies, the terrorists who fight Israel with the aim of destroying it. He claims in his most recent books that Israel refuses to accept arabs into their culture, a blatant lie. He claims that Israel persecutes the palestinian people - also a lie. he claims that the situation is like apartheid - another lie. Carter is a liar.

Clinton balanced the budget? Sure, by adopting the Newt Gingrich deal with America he did. He had a republican Congress when that happened. The republicans had a much larger part in that than the left is willing to acknowledge. So what has the left done to turn the country towards their vision of greatness? Nothing. They surrender. They invent scandal. They huff and puff. They put pork in defense spending bills. They lie to their own constituents.
I'm kind of glad you never served your country. I'm sure you'd be in Canada right now had you been drafted.
People like you have no respect for the sacrifice our troops make. Clinton closed the military base in my community, and forced the retirement of thousands of soldiers because he didn't understand the very real global threat that existed then and exists now. Like more liberals, he believed the UN would save the day. They do not. The UN doesn't care about anything unless it lines their pockets with gold.
Shame on you Ron.



Hard Thought
American involvement in Viet nam began with Eisenhower, who incidentally developed the plans for the Bay of Pigs.

You say Carter did not try? And then you say he used the minimal force-Disd he or didn't he.

Carter began the largest military buildup in US history (Reagan merely accelerated it).

Clinton was the last President to balance the budget.

I am kind of glad you retired.

Islam
Islam has always been a violent religion but has now become an evil religion allowing tremendous autrocities in the name of Allah. The West must defeat them or our way of life will end.

Maybe there is no reason
Does there HAVE to be a reason? Maybe they're just plain EVIL*.

*Definition: Evil person - n. A person for whom others exist solely as opportunities to do evil.

Ron
Kennedy invented the cut and run at the Bay of Pigs. Kennedy got us into Viet Nam. LBJ caused the committment to sky rocket and then left it for Nixon.

Carter did NOT try to get the hostages out, he used the minimal force he hoped wasa necessary to get them back. The response should have been to land in the Persian Gulf and start marching on Tehran until the hostages were returned.

The military was not gutted by Nixon. I was in the Army then and know what was going on. After the pullout "defunding" of the Viet Nam war, the military was told to downsize. And they did. Carter gutted it even more by retiring ships and decommisioning divisions.

Saw the same thing under Clinton and retired in disgust at the traitorous ways the democrats deal with the military. Clinton cut 3 divisions and over 100 ships. Then declared a peace dividend. He did not use it to pay down the National Debt, either.

Reagan invented the "Cut and Run"
Remember the Beirut bombing killing all the marines and then Reagan pulled them out? Carter tried to rescue the hostages if you tried to remember, but the military was so gutted by the previous administrations that the equipment failed. Carter's solution was to begin the biggest miltary build up the US had seen, which was a major factor in winning the cold war, Reagan notwithstanding.

Ron
I like liberal beliefs myself. Like Karter leaving 52 Americans hostage for 444 days or Bubba Klintoon's cutting and running from Somalia. You can ALWAYS count on liberals run when the going gets tough.

Karen
Your post is so full of factual and historical mistakes that I don't know where to begin.

Instead of posting a novel here, I will just highly recommend you do a little more research. However, I will leave you a couple facts:

*** The total for all the 22 Arab League countries is 6,145,389 square miles. By comparison, all 50 states of the United States have a total of 3,787,318 square miles. Israel has 8,463 square miles, about one-sixth of that of the State of Michigan.


*** "...in 1918, with the fall of the Ottoman Empire, Britain and France were handed 5,000,000 square miles to divvy up and 99% was given to the Arabs to create countries that did not exist previously. 1% was given as a Mandate for the re-establishment of a state for the Jews on both banks of the Jordan River. In 1921, to once again appease the Arabs, another three quarters of that 1% was given to a fictitious state called Trans-Jordan." (Jack Berger, May 31, 2004.)

*** There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention)

*** "The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa. While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan." (PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, March 31, 1977)

Conservative Myth...
"We will never negotiate with terrorist." What a lie that turned out to be:

"The senior American envoy in Iraq, Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad, held talks last year with men he believed represented major insurgent groups in a drive to bring militant Sunni Arabs into politics."

I like conservatives values-you can always believe them.

Mister Buck
Hmmm. Drug my post from another article. You hero worshipping me or do you have a crush on me?

Mister Buck
Hmmm. Drug my post from another article. You hero worshipping me or do you have a crush on me?

Mister Buck
Yeah, in my presence. I guess it's the fact that I've seen the US flag raised around the world and have OWNERSHIP in this nation wherein the sh*tbags who desecrate the flag are simply wastes of skin, using valuable resources. You can exercise your 1st Amendment rights just like we can exercise our right to deliver an azzkicking and then pay the fine afterwards!

Speaking of which, I wonder if the hippie I thumped in 83 for burning the flag over Grenada still has the lumps! Cost me a 200.00 fine, money that I consider WELL SPENT!

But that's just my opinion. Got any ownership or are you just one of those people who enjoys the security that OTHERS provide?

Why do they hate us?
Wonderful article by Mr. DSouza. Every point he makes is clear. Of course, the liberal will still ask, "But why do they hate us?" I don't think most Americans will be able to accept the basic reason: envy. Western civilization shows the lie to the Muslim's own claim to superiority. Besides, the only way for Islam to grow is through conquest. Islam is sword religion for sword people. Always has been, always will be (no matter how many starry eyed Westerners align themselves with it).

Why do they hate us?
Wonderful article by Mr. DSouza. Every point he makes is clear. Of course, the liberal will still ask, "But why do they hate us?" I don't think most Americans will be able to accept the basic reason: envy. Western civilization shows the lie to the Muslim's own claim to superiority. Besides, the only way for Islam to grow is through conquest. Islam is sword religion for sword people. Always has been, always will be (no matter how many starry eyed Westerners align themselves with it).

Recommended Reading
1) 'Hatred's Kingdom - How Saudi Arabia Supports the New Global Terrorism', by Dore Gold, Former Ambassador to the United Nations

2) http://WWW.MEMRI.ORG - Under Let them speak for themselves.

Current titles include these ditties - 'What should be the punishment for a woman driving a car', and my personal fave - Palestinian Children - 'Mama killed 5 Jews and is is paradise'. I have to admit that it does sound like a Palestinian c&w song but there it is.

And of course...
Muslims never show collective anger at the number of Muslims killed by other Muslims (even taking the period of 1066-1966, worldwide, this number exceeds the number of Muslims killed by members of ALL other religions--including the oft-occuring Hindu-Muslim communal riots in India; and that was before 1971's "Operation Searchlight" in which Pakistan's Punjabi Muslims and mohajirs murdered 2.3 MILLION Bengali, then known as "East Pakistani" Muslims!).

In other words, their idea of "oppression" is only when Muslims are under non-Muslim rule--despite of the following facts:
(1) at no time in history can Muslims claim to have been worse treated by non-Muslim rulers than the reverse (non-Muslims by Muslim rulers)
(2) in general, Muslims have fared better under non-Muslim rulers than Muslim ones!

How about these?
A recruiter says to a young muslim "You must help in destroying the great satan."

Why?

"They indulge and promote the consumption of alcahol."

"They allow women to travel unacompanied by a man. They even drive cars". Their women are whores, see how they dress (or undress), see how they are portrayed in advertising and entertainment. They cohabit without benefit of marriage and even have children (bastards)without marriage, often with several different fathers (the governments encourage this through monetary reward). They kill their children in the womb, even while being born, again taxes support these abortions."

The young among them are users of mind altering drugs and sex obsessed. See the so-called entertainment they send around the world as television shows Hollywood movies, those drip of immoral behavior."

"Those people glorify immorality of all sorts, imagine, homosexuals and lesbians are shown as role models, even in the schools. Get this they are allowed to marry. YES! two men are recognized as married and can even adopt children! I know you think I am making this up, but it is all true.

"There is more, but that is enough for you to absorb for now."

"Those satanic, immoral, godless demons must be destroyed before their filth permeates our lands! The movies and internet are too much, we must resist."

O.K., give me a gun.

I THINK THIS IS CLOSE TO THE TRUTH.

Is militant Islam God's instrument to clean our society?


Radical Islam
The call for jihad is to kill infidels. Infidels are non-muslims,ie. christians,jews,(homosexuals). The primary way islam was spread was "by the sword", if you were challenged to profess your belief and it was non-islam your head was cut off.
Radical islam was ruthless then and now.
Sign Up to Post Your CommentsSign Up to Post Your Comments
If you are already registered, click here to login. Otherwise, please take a few seconds to register with Townhall.com. Once you sign up, you’ll be able to post your comments immediately, use the action center, get podcasts, and more!
Note: Fields marked with a red asterisk (*) are required.
Salutation:
First Name:
*
Last Name:
*
Email:
*
Nickname:
*
Note: Nick name will be shown when you post comments.
Address 1:
*
Address 2:
City:
*
State:
*
Zip:
*
Phone:
      
Your daily must-read of conservative columns, cartoons and news. Coulter, Sowell, Krauthammer and more.
(Bi-Weekly) We highlight the best opportunities from our partners for surveys, action items and more.