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Tuesday, April 08, 2008
Thomas Sowell :: Townhall.com Columnist
Random Thoughts
by Thomas Sowell
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Was the Copenhagen Global Warming Summit Walk-Out a Win for the U.S.?


Random thoughts on the passing scene:

Most of the problems of this country are not nearly as bad as the "solutions" -- especially the solutions that politicians come up with during election years.

Some people actually think that televising Congress gives us information. What it really does is give politicians millions of dollars worth of free advertising, while they play charades on camera to fool the rest of us.

Alfred E. Neuman of Mad magazine said: "What, me worry?" During election years, Democrats running for office say: "What, me liberal?"

Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain.

What is more scary than any particular candidate or policy is the gullibility of the public and their willingness to be satisfied with talking points, rather than serious arguments.

One way to reduce illegal immigration might be to translate some of our far left publications into Spanish and give everyone in Mexico subscriptions. After they read how terrible this country is, many may want to stay away.

Whenever I see one of Barack Obama's smooth performances, it reminds me of a saying from my old neighborhood in Harlem: "An eel is like sandpaper compared to you."

Most people on the right have no problem understanding people on the left because many, if not most, were on the left themselves when they were younger. But many, if not most, people on the left find it inexplicable how any decent and intelligent person could be on the right.

It is amazing to me that there are people who still take seriously claims by some candidates that they are against "special interests." All politicians are against their opponents' special interests and in favor of his own special interests.

Nothing is more fraudulent than calls for a "dialogue on race." Those who issue such calls are usually quick to cry "racism" at any frank criticism. They are almost invariably seeking a monologue on race, to which others are supposed to listen.

The same people who have gone ballistic when some prominent figure is found to belong to some all-male social club are full of excuses for why Barack Obama remained a member of a racist and anti-American church for 20 years.

Among the many wise things said by the late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan was that you are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts. Yet an incredible number of people make up whatever "facts" are needed to support whatever they choose to believe.

Rachael Ray is showing up in so many places on various television programs, on magazine covers, on boxes of crackers that the question must be asked: Are we sure that she is not twins, or perhaps triplets?

The way to get people's votes is to say that all their problems are caused by other people, and that you will stop those other people from giving them trouble. But if you really want to help, then you can tell them the truth and risk losing their votes.

The idea behind giving professors lifetime tenure is that this will enable them to speak out freely. But it would be hard to name any other occupation with a more cowardly record than academics, who have been giving in to politically correct campus bullies ever since the 1960s.

There is no question that Barack Obama is a clever and glib fellow. There is also no question that some of the most foolish, dangerous and horrific things done around the world in the past hundred years have been done by clever and glib fellows.

When someone is brutally murdered, the media often defuse our shock by focusing on praise of the victim, instead of focusing on what can be done to keep the murderer from ever doing this again. In the midst of all this emotional venting, it is galling to realize that chances are the murderer will eventually be put back on the street again.

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About The Author
Thomas Sowell is a senior fellow at the Hoover Institute and author of The Housing Boom and Bust.
 
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Random Thoughts
I read the column carefully and completly.

Da#n! i couldn't find a thing to disagree with.

Thanks again Dr. Sowell.

My Favorite . . .
is the call for the dialogue on race. Nothing could be further from the truth. You are correct, it is a monologue on race as a frank discussion is politically incorrect.

PS. I also loved the eel/sandpaper comparison!

Eel/Sandpaper
I also loved "An eel is like sandpaper compared to you." It would sure beat the use of "You're slicker than whale sh*t" when in polite company!

Please keep providing us with great columns, Dr. Sowell!

Frank racial dialogue:
Governor Orval Faubus: "I will not integrate the schools of Arkansas." Dwight Eisenhower: "Yes you will".

Governor George Wallace: "I will not integrate the schools of Alabama." Jack Kennedy: "Yes you will."

Dr Sowell
Great column. A homerun,hole in one and buzzer beater all wraped up in one. Good job! Now i'll sit back and wait for the libs to come and tell you to stop making sense.

Pseudo-Random Thoughts
"Some people actually think that televising Congress gives us information. What it really does is give politicians millions of dollars worth of free advertising, while they play charades on camera to fool the rest of us."

That's Ok. I don't think anybody really watches anyway.



"The same people who have gone ballistic when some prominent figure is found to belong to some all-male social club are full of excuses for why Barack Obama remained a member of a racist and anti-American church for 20 years."

Wish I'd thought of that one!


"Rachael Ray is showing up in so many places on various television programs,"

Oh I feel like a complete hermit now. Who the heck is Rachael Ray?



"In the midst of all this emotional venting, it is galling to realize that chances are the murderer will eventually be put back on the street again."

You think *that's* galling, how about giving murderers and rapists early release in order to ease prison overcrowding and make room for drug offenders on mandatory minimums?

Unca Alby
She has a cooking show on the Food Network (30 min. meals) Plus shes not too bad on the eyes.

Great One
LOL, I sometimes wonder if the congressional Communist(D)’s collaborate with the liberal News media to create “problems” in order to optimize chances for passage of some favorite socialist program. Examples of the press jumping on non-problems abound by the thousands. They range from the economy to AGW. All of them are a natural setup for congressional action, which inevitably result in more government intrusion into the private sector, and almost always in a try for higher taxes.

Frank racial dialogues
are hard to come by, true. I've had a few, one on one. Roadmaster posted a one on one racial dialog he had on a loading dock and remarked that racial wounds and fears are probably best dealt with one on one. I remember one i had sitting on the bench with a team mate at a ball game. He was really hot because a white woman got really scared when he walked onto an elevator with her. He was a gentle amiable well educated fellow, but he was big enough to go bear hunting with a switch. His reaction was to play the role and scare the woman out of her wits before she could get off at an early stop. I remarked he was not making things better, and he said Savage, i've tried to do that before, and will again, but i was just sick of being the bad guy. Blacks rarely take a chance in groups because they fear the reaction of the blacks, not the whites. Who can blame them? Look at the treatment Clarence Thomas, Bill Cosby, et al, get from other blacks.

a random thought
Barak Obama is a dangerous man motivated by a toxic mixture of anti-American political socialism and Afrocentric pagan spirituality.
ms

Thought provoking
Good column.

I believe the dialogue on race should be between those older Americans that have experienced racism before the marches and the civil rights act and those who experience racism as it currently exists. The former might realize that reliving the past only fuels the current generation with hate and suspicion. The latter might learn that doors have been opened but they have to actually take the steps to get through them. The problem with trying to dialogue with racists themselves is there is no hope for a sudden epiphany. They already "know" all they need.

As far as murderers are concerned. I have long believed that it is cruel punishment to let them go so long knowing the day they are to be executed. Instead of them agonizing for days, weeks, years.... just suprise them one day! It is also amazing to me that people are against putting murderous thugs to death after a fairly well designed judicial system has found them guilty but these same people are willing to let a woman that can't seem to figure out how she got pregnant choose whether an innocent baby gets the same sentence.

Observations

I'm white and have lived with my friend who is a US citizen and was born and raised in Africa for several years after she called to let me know things had fallen apart in her country and needed to work here to support her children.

She doesn't have much education though she has been taking classes at a local community college.

What I have found over the 20 years we've been friends as we occasionally talk about her conflicts at work is that a small percentage of white old people she would normally care for have told the staff they don't want a black person caring for them hence they refuse help and die sooner.

There is more racism among blacks, asians, hispanics and other immigrant groups - some that might surprise you for instance did you know Cameronians and Nigerians have a bad rep among Africans? That their is racism between one tribe and another?

I'm pretty convinced that the more education one has, the more exposure to different groups and the more dialogue - one on one - the less there is of a knee jerk response to blame racism rather than a far more accurate reading of the cause of conflict.

One other thing I have noticed..everytime there is a recession people tend to retreat to racism because of the perceived economic threat.

I'm pretty convinced that if you take any race of people and put them in a room someone or some group will end up isolated.

In "Progressive Democrat controlled cities" a new form of hatred is forming based on class and secular preference. This is a new virulent form of discrimination.




Succinct, brilliant and ... reasonable.
That's it.

Another Great Column...
"What is more scary than any particular candidate or policy is the gullibility of the public and their willingness to be satisfied with talking points, rather than serious arguments."

This is the root of every single problem that exists in our government. Voters are worse than gullible...they're derelict in their duty. They've taken the great country that was given them and squandered away their rights and money. I don't blame Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Shumer, Harry Reid, Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, John Murtha (I could go on forever). I blame the idiots who keep sending them back to Washington.

Liberals make excuses for their trash. Conservatives throw theirs out. There just aren't enough conservatives anymore.


T.Sowell V/S Oboma/Liberals/Media
Here's a debate I personally would pay a $ 10.000.00 to see or Promote bigger than a Don King "Greatest whip Butt fight contest of this Century .
It would even be greater than Ronald Reagan knock out Silly Punches of George McGovern taking 49 states in that election .
Thomas Sowell V/S Oboma/ Liberals/Media in a winner take all debate .
Sowell's abailty to use History , common sense , reason , pure cold facts , wisdom and ethic's and (not if it feels good we pay for it for life)would be a massive Stomping """NO CONTEST """of the media Liberals and Black racist couldn't call him a racist .
Oboma say's many words with meaningless ending unless it means he really is a socialist and wanted to raise our taxes and hates Big CO.s that pay many Americans retirement funds , health care and saleries .
Sowell say's few words but its meaning , impack makes real Americans know America is no sewer for liberals the media and Oboma to show outright destain for or our traditional values .....Since there are 20 countries still fighting to be The Second best Nation on Earth .
The History books in 100 years will say without America there would be no Freedoms or Democracies on this EARTH allowing me to write this thought or Liberals ands OBOMA to throw Rocks at this country Dr Sowell , We Conservatives love Liberals the media and Oboma take fore granted sadly .

The Attraction of Delusion

The attraction of delusion is that you don't have to object, to confront, to expend energy for something other than yourself.

It is the perfect retreat for ignorance and sloth.

... and we were oh-so-smart
"Most people on the right have no problem understanding people on the left because many, if not most, were on the left themselves when they were younger. But many, if not most, people on the left find it inexplicable how any decent and intelligent person could be on the right."

That's when we were certain that we knew everything worth knowing.

Some people never grow out of that mode. They're called liberals.

tenure
"The idea behind giving professors lifetime tenure is that this will enable them to speak out freely. But it would be hard to name any other occupation with a more cowardly record than academics, who have been giving in to politically correct campus bullies ever since the 1960s."

Amen.

Political non-discourse
"What is more scary than any particular candidate or policy is the gullibility of the public and their willingness to be satisfied with talking points, rather than serious arguments."

I would give anything (figuratively speaking) this election season to see the pseudo-debate sound-bite "town meeting" debate formats scrapped and just let the candidates have at each other a la Lincoln-Douglas...



Amen re tenure lies
"The idea behind giving professors lifetime tenure is that this will enable them to speak out freely. But it would be hard to name any other occupation with a more cowardly record than academics, who have been giving in to politically correct campus bullies ever since the 1960s."

Take it from this Ph.D., Doc Sowell is right on target. These little funky pointy-headed nutcases - esp. in social sciences -- are pathetic examples of Marxism gone bad. What a joke on the American people. Do NOT let your kids study social sciences in college. Not worth your money to support spoiled "doctorates" who are so piled hip deep in nonsense that they start to believe their own B.S. What a petty group of people.


Lee
I have read your racist remarks with interest.

Lee

Why don't they have American as a choice on the census form?

Why can't you recognize that we all bleed red?

Why can't you appreciate where you came from and honor your ancestors with out denigrating others?

Why is your ego so focused on something you had no power to affect?

How does your color make any difference in whether you are a decent man?


Rachel Ray...
Hey Unca-hermit
You must eat fairly well if you don't have to watch Rachel Ray and her 30 minute meal show. On the bright side, while some may consider her easy on the eyes, I can assure you, she is extremely hard on the ears.


Lee

You may be my relative just as Dr Sowell is if you go back far enough. You make an a pretty big deal over diet and sun exposure. You adapted and survive. You should be happy.

Racism, or maybe not
Several years ago I was in a restaurant with a friend -- both of us are white -- and our waiter turned out to be very slow. Three blacks -- mother, daughter, granddaughter -- came in and were seated near us and had the same slow waiter. I could see them looking around at other people who had a different waiter and were getting served faster than they were. It was easy to see what conclusion they were drawing. So I went over and assured them that it was only that particular waiter and not that they were black that was delaying things.

Their reaction was odd and it took me a long time to analyze it. They actually seemed disappointed that it wasn't racism. Which makes sense when you think about it. After all, those of us who are white have plenty of annoying incidents among ourselves, but we know it's not racism because it's between whites.

But what happens if the same annoying thing happens between a white and a black? The black doesn't know whether it's just an ordinary annoying encounter or racism, but the race hustlers tell him or her that it must be racism.

But one day you find out that it is nothing but an annoying encounter. Naturally, you will be disappointed, as your worldview crumbles to dust.

Lee - A better edition
You may be my relative just as Dr Sowell is if you go back far enough but I have to disagree with you. You are making too big of deal over diet and sun exposure. Your line adapted and survived. You should be happy.

If you have one group of people
who hate another group of people, black, white, red, or whatever, it is not racism as long as the hate is not based on race. If the actions are based on which tribe or region the "hated" people are from it is sectionalism and not racism.

For example, people in the South people hated yankees right up until the 60s. Yankees, likewise, considered all Southerners to be illiterate and inbred. One did not call this racism, one called it sectionalism.

How racist is it
when the majority of white democrats vote for a black American? Are they anti feminist because they didnt vote for Hillary? The election should be about idea's not race. Obama's choice of a racist pastor may have brought this discussion to the fore front but it shouldnt be used to minimize the need to determine platform, policy, methodology.
I have observed over many years that both liberals and conservatives have some of the same goals but most of the disagreements come when they describe how to obtain them. We need to get to that discussion or it will just be a big popularity contest hollywood style.

They protest too much

Ever notice that those who are racists or bigots or however you'd like to refine unreasoned hatred often over compensate by leaving their common sense behind to prove they are not?

Lee Writes or is that You Rev Wright ?

So obvious ,..My Butt ! Lets see is obvious your a Black , Socialist Liberal or all three !


Lee IT IS ALSO OBVIOUS YOUR SAD like You and Others and are no more than a Rev Wright living in the past sad black man and women followers .
More Jews were murdered 60 years ago. 6 plus Million than when
600, 000 slaves were brought here given by your former Tribal leaders in Africa . No black here wants back there since it as bad there not as it was then .Duh !
You will also notice JEWS moved on and don't ware the YOKE or past like your kind does .....So 98 % OF ALL JEWS don't have babies out of wed lock , support their own kids , stay out of prison and get educations, job skills and are not on welfare .YET they live in this country just like your kind does .
Your Guilt tripping White Folks makes this Baptist White guy wish there were more Jews in America and your sad kind of thinking, then my D...m taxes would be far lower I see wasted in all our black cities while they and you still hate white folks !
Just for the record Lee .....More whites and Jews have been enslaved than have Blacks since Time began . Your ... if they are Black Conseratives are Uncle Toms crap is getting very old indeed .
I formly as a poor white boy drafted in the USMC during Nam with no more than high school AND ZERO HELP became very Rich all on my own !

JFP
Well said. Never attribute to malice anything adequately explained by stupidity. Never attribute to racism anything adequately explained by malice. This advice has saved me a lot of heartburn. The feeling that someone has chosen to unload on you when you can't shoot back, can be devastating to health and happiness. Best to consider the source, count blessings, and remember. Building one's own happiness is the best revenge.

Reckless thoughts more like it
If there aren't any hard facts, I guess random thoughts will have to do. If the attacks on Obama hasn't turn the people against Obama, I guess the next thing on the agenda would be to compare Obama to a killer with a gift of speaking. After all these are just random thoughts aren't they. Imagine someone like Obama smooth talking his way to the nomination knowing full well, all Obama sees are victims of a scheme he's trying to pull off. Obama doesn't really want the nomination and the Presidency because he beleives what he says. No, Obama is smarter then that. After being trained by Reverend Wright, there is no way Obama could be good for anything other then crime and harming people. It's a good thing the tapes surfaced revealing the hidden criminal intent of Obama on innocent people. After all these are just random thoughts right. What the tapes never revealed about Obama, thoughts will. Are we correct about that. It was Hillary's random thoughts and an over active imagination that has gotten Hillary in so much hot water. Are we now following in the footsteps of Hillary with an over active imagination. The stories Hillary have told have all proved to be lies. Could the stories about Obama, because of the tapes be lies also. After all, these are just random thoughts, right? No one is really saying, Obama is a killer and Obama getting the nomination would the same as letting a killer back on the streets. Are they?

Thank you Recon

Recon-usmc

Recon-usmc makes my point! This is the typical Thomas Sowell supporter. Thank you very much for proving my point!

Lee & Maverick
You are both obviously very brave people coming to TH and speaking truth to power. Your incisive, well thought out rebuttals to Dr. Sowell's ramblings are no doubt making him cringe even as he reads them. Do either of you folks have a blog, because I'm sure there are dozens of TH readers (as well as Dr. Sowell) that would love to be further enlightened by your thoughts?

maverick
Up until maybe a couple of months ago, I actually liked Obama. I disagreed with him on just about everything, and I never would have voted for him, but he seemed like an OK guy. I even thought hey, maybe he'll end up winning the election and being a pleasant surprise, after all Abe Lincoln was inexperienced too (believe it or not, I try to be open-minded).

I've done a 180 since then--now I not only disagree with him on policy, but I think he's a leftist jerk and that he would be a total disaster for the country. And my change in attitude has come from observing him and those close to him, and not from some unfair "attacks" from TH columnists.

Lee
You are a troubled individual. Dr. Sowell has spent his life making a success of himself, while you and other like you spend your lives making excuses. Do you have some sort of prejudice against successful black men and woman? Do you consider every black man or woman who have made a great life for themselves "Uncle Toms".

It looks to me that your are nothing more than a racist. An not just about whitey.

Lee
It isn't about color it's about left vs. right. Instead of tearing down THomas Sowell why not argue with what he has to say. I've been around long enough to have experienced ill-treatment from every race and excellent treatment from every race. We are all the same.

Great Column
Sowell's "Random Thoughts" columns are always my favorite. They contain little bite-sized snippets of wisdom that I only wish I could remember more easily once I'm done reading. A particularly poignant comment in this column was the one about people on the left vs. those on the right. It is indeed true that many conservatives were once more liberal, so they understand that side of the debate even if they do not now agree with it. Sowell's point largely explains to me why so many liberals I meet seem to be intolerant of any other viewpoints, while most conservatives I've known seem more accepting of different views, even if they do not agree.

Lee
Yes, Sowell, Thomas, Cosby, Elder and many other successful black people are all "Uncle Toms". Other than Rap Singers and professional athletes, are there any successful black people who aren't Uncle Toms in your world?

Black or not, Obama is a socialist/liberal and Dr. Sowell is a conservative. If Obama had the ideological positions of Ronald Reagan, conservatives, including Dr. Sowell, would be supporting him. Ironically, conservatives by in large couldn't care less about race.

Since you obviously are liberal and read conservative blogs, you've probably noticed that the only people that even mention Obama's race are the liberals.

So go ahead an whine about whitey is keeping you down. Nothing will ever change for you and men like Dr. Sowell will continue to elevate the discussion and his position.

Damn, Lee!
After 54 years of life I still bristle at the line of logic you used commenting here. You are so brainwashed into being a so called African American that when you see someone of your race demonstrate superior intellect and a high comfort level when communicating with other races you seek to destroy or at least show disdain toward them. It is so obvious to others that no wonder Liberals use it against you it's almost like a handle just hanging off your back, it begs to be grabbed and used to fling you around.

Uncle Tom was a great Christian

Why do people like Lee hate Uncle Tom? Is it because he was a deeply spiritual man - some would even say he was a Saint? Why don't you hate the circumstances Uncle Tom was born into?


Comparisons
The eel/sandpaper comparison was very good, but, "he was big enough to go bear hunting with a switch" is masterful!

Random Indeed
As always, great stuff.

But that Rachel Ray thing cracked me up, ot because of its content but because of where it was placed. Truly a random thought.

Lee

Lee, the irony ere is that you dehumanize Uncle Tom as much as his last slave owner. You know the one, the one that killed him.

To Lee
Wake up and smell the coffee, before it's too late. People like Sowell because he makes sense; it has nothing to do with his race. I'd be reading him whether he was white, black, yellow, purple, etc. It is YOU, Lee who is focused on race. As long as you're having fun, though, that's all that matters.

I get it now...Maverick
I now understand why you have trouble getting what Mr. Sowell has to say. You don't understand what random thoughts are, or you don't get the meaning of the word "thought" at all. Try it some time.

Lee I'm sorry...
I just realized you could be actually ignorant and incapable of understanding the concepts Dr. Sowell puts forth. So if you aren't brainwashed into thinking that to be African American there are only a very few ways to think or to act and all others are forbidden, then I apologize. After all understanding advanced social concepts requires a knowledge of the history of the world that certified African Americans are forbidden from studying.

Dr. Sowell
Please run for President.

Doc nails it with two sentences!!!!
"Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain."

Dr. Sowell reduces all of the conservative angst into its essence. Brilliant!

Once again he proves that conservative thought is at its best when it is brief and to the point.

BTW, read Dr. Sowell's book, "Black Rednecks and White Liberals" if you want to effectively neutralize all of this talk about race. Its all about culture.

Lee
From your previous post it would seem you see whites as the "enemy", perhaps that might explain why a lot of people don't succeed. If a black person showed an interest in academic accomplishment would that person be viewed as a sell out in your eyes? As an uncle tom? Maybe you should applaud men like Dr. Sowell for not walking lock-step with the majority and having the courage to express viewpoints that he must know will get him labeled as a traitor to his race

Lee writes
Lee writes:
Thank you Recon

Recon-usmc

Recon-usmc makes my point! This is the typical Thomas Sowell supporter. Thank you very much for proving my point!
________________________________________________

If I was in the conner of HATE Whites and AMERICA like Rev Wright and You are then I would be OK like you ?
No thanks BRA .Smart folks look ahead not behind since life is not about that ever"But''Life as well taught me is not that any color is my FIX or Problem or is all 31 other races in America :Feel better now .
Thank goodness all other races that come to America who speak little English move ahead of blacks since they are hard work seek skills , family based and see the value of this country not in sucking this country $$ dry and the 6 Th. generation of living on welfare .Enough of your hogwash .

Your lights are on dim but ain't nobody at home Lee.
First I am an American , Former Warrior shot twice in NAM spending 11 months in a naval hosp. in VA and real Tax payer who just happens to be white .
I don't like titles like white Ms America contest , a white mind is a terrible thing to lose ,
White Caucus ,White NAACP . You don't call me a White European CAUCASIAN and you can be totally racist and use the N word 24/7 but I am racist if we question black moronic behavior ?
Just for the record I help those that help them selves but only until they become the best they can be and not wallow in the past of self pity parties like you kind .


Lee
just proves Dr Sowell's point.
"Nothing is more fraudulent than calls for a "dialogue on race." Those who issue such calls are usually quick to cry "racism" at any frank criticism. They are almost invariably seeking a monologue on race, to which others are supposed to listen. "

Lee
you and your attitude is the problem and your whining is not a solution

Dr. Sowell keep shining your light
A few years ago, I stopped reading newspapers and watchimg MSM evening news because I was tired of the mindless liberal bias.

One day while waiting for my wife at her doctors office I picked up a newspaper and happened upon a Dr. Sowell column on "Random Thoughts" - I have been a fan of his ever since.
-------------------------------------------------
I made a successful career "fixing" others failed computer code so it would work.

Elegance = simplicity has been my theme.

Dr. Sowell is a master of Abstraction and Logic and I have learned much from his books on economy and his columns of elegance.

Liberal attacks on Dr. Sowell
Liberals are narcisstic elitists. The incessant gnawing inside them is their fear of inferiority.
They try to validate self by attacking the wisdom and knowledge of someone like Dr. Sowell.

Not worthy of shining his shoes liberals resort to despicable labels and name calling. Liberals expect us to recognize their “superiority” and give them the special treatment they so richly deserve – not because of skill or what they have accomplished – but because of whom they are.

Liberals believe their very presence solves problems and relieves pain. Liberals have great disdain for those who do not see their “special” abilities and uses those who believe in them – like tissue to be disposed of when no longer needed.

Dr. Sowell described this behaviour well "useful idiots" of the collectivists.

Re: Lee
I'm interested in hearing *specifically* where you disagree with Dr. Sowell. Not the same tired ad hominems like "Uncle Tom" and such, but some actual intellectually-based debate on specific points Dr. Sowell makes with which you disagree.

Also, is your definition of an "Uncle Tom" any African-American who disagrees with you politically? On the role of government? On race relations? Yes, I know the book, but I'd like to hear a *precise* definition of what makes for an "Uncle Tom" *today*.

Dr. Sowell
You have made many "Open Ended" accusations in this article.Unfortunately,preaching to the "Choir" allows this.Calling for a dialogue on race is different from conducting the discussion.However you fail to make this distinction.Also,people feel, that they have a legitimate reason to blame government,when they are "Lied" into WAR.My last point,in a series, that could number "Hundreds";Health-Care alone could have saved "US" a troubling Economy,if it had been dealt with properly.The so-called conservatives debated socialism,while ignoring the constant "Hand Outs" to wall street and virtually all big business.This type of "Fraud" has placed most Americans on the defensive and therefore someone must take the BLAME!!Dr.Sowell, this article seeks to "Suspend Reality".Nice TRY...

How long is long enough?
How many years must we listen to self-pitying claptrap from 'African-Americans'- or whatever militant Negroes wish to call themselves these days- before we can agree to renounce racism- in both directions? How many laws must be passed, how many court decisions must be rendered, how much social bending over backwards, how many academic and employment preferences must be offered, how many tippy-toe circumlocutions must be deferentially murmured, before blacks are satisfied that their humanity is all the benefit they need or deserve, just like the rest of us? How long will we have to listen to self-proclaimed 'liberals' like Lee and his ilk accusing blacks who stray off the 'liberal' plantation of being 'Uncle Toms'?
Tell you what: If a black man is courageous enough to stand up for self-respect, economic independence, decent behavior, and personal honor, if he's enough of a man to get an education, to remain faithful to and support his own family, to love and serve his country, and his God, I don't care what color his skin. He has my unqualified respect.
Those who get rich off inspiring hatred, envy, and self-pity, with tired old Marxist class-struggle rhetoric, who whip up racial division as a political ploy, deserve nothing but contempt.

Dr. Sowell and Will
Will - YOU are not worthy to shine Dr. Sowells shoes.

Will - YOU are not worthy to pick up Dr. Sowells trash.

Will you are WORTHLESS and VILE and qualify to join the zombie army of liberalism and be enmasse with the other bottom feeders whose sustenance is "droppings".


killer - FYI
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - di·a·logue /'da???l?g, -?l?g/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[dahy-uh-lawg, -log] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, verb -logued, -logu·ing.
–noun
1. conversation between two or more persons.
2. the conversation between characters in a novel, drama, etc.
3. an exchange of ideas or opinions on a particular issue, esp. a political or religious issue, with a view to reaching an amicable agreement or settlement.
4. a literary work in the form of a conversation: a dialogue of Plato.
–verb (used without object)
5. to carry on a dialogue; converse.
6. to discuss areas of disagreement frankly in order to resolve them.
–verb (used with object)
7. to put into the form of a dialogue.

Gee, it doesn't look like there is a thing wrong with Dr. Sowell's usage and comment. You are incorrect, big surprise.

TH Readers: Lee is a "Black Redneck"
To my fellow TH colleagues: Please read Dr. Sowell's book "Black Rednecks and White Liberals" and you will see behind Lee's fascade. And just in case you are wondering, Lee, I'm Black too.

I have a sweatshirt, Lee, that might interest you. It says "So life has a hill. Get over it."

He gets you going, doesn't he?
Will is laughing his head off, but to quote a '60's tune,

Will, "You're so vain."

"I bet you think this song is about you."

JamesJ
Correct. Criticism of Dr. Sowell's ideas, based on how he "should" handle racial topics, identifies the criticizer as a racist. A scientist who solves a problem deserves his due, separately from any erroneous ideas he may have in other areas. We don't reject Tycho's work because he was an astrologer investigating notions, as he advanced the science of astronomy.

Proverbs 32 from the Book of ...
Sowell!! Reading through this article made me think that I was reading some spiritually inspired text. I nominate this piece for inclusion into the Book of Proverbs as Chapter 32!!

amelia et al with reason and logic
Good Posts all!

Advocates of liberalism and their useful dupes only contributions to society are inaccurate or useless drivel to be discarded.

Their only status is tenure, unions and laws such as AA etc. Liberals cannot compete in a society where excellence is rewarded.

sorry, I meant
Lee

I get them mixed up.

No, they're mixed up.

Me too.



Re: Killer
Government run health care could have saved us a troubling economy? I think you are getting your talking points mixed up.

OrpheusMay
Sounds like you have put a few lumps and hills behind you, and more power to you for the next one. At 74, my shirt says "Over the hill?? What hill?? I didn't see any hill!".

To RFP
RFO I had a similar experience several years ago at a Denny's restaurant - at the height of the racism charges against the chain. My soon to be husband and I went into Denny's one night at about 1am. The service was horrible. It took us 30 minutes to receive our drinks. During that time a small group of black students came in. They saw that we received our drinks and they had yet to been seen by a waitress. What they didn't see was how long we had to wait for our drinks. They became increasingly agitated and then stood up and started screaming at everyone in the place accusing them of racism, they were going to sue, etc. I told them that we had been there about 45 minutes and didn't have our order taken yet and that this was just bad service and not racism. I got a f u for my experience. I learned that people see what they want to see whether it is the truth or not.

OrpheusMay
OrpheusMay writes:
I have a sweatshirt, Lee, that might interest you. It says "So life has a hill. Get over it."
-------------------------------------------------

I am going to print that comment, frame it and hang it on my office wall.

You are a magnificent lady! Thanks.

Sir
I am incorrect according to your "context".Your approach while "Feverish", is absent of substance.You have used no "Logic" in your thinking.A person can raise an issue and not fully participate in the dialogue.I know of no law or principle, which mandates 100% involvement.A person who seeks "Honest" discussion, would acknowledge the fact, that Mr.Obama is otherwise engaged.I don't suppose "Open-Ended" gave you any type of "Clue".That was my Context.I SORRY....

Campus cowardice
Professor Sowell:

Regarding those cowardly academics who bow down in dhimmitude to the subtle and not-so-subtle tactics of intimidation employed by the multi-culti, p.c. groupthinkers of academia, there is a "growing band of highly credible public intellectuals who could have chosen to keep their dissenting views to themselves but decided instead to put their reputations and careers on the line for the sake of truths that badly needed to be spoken," as a commenter at my friend B.U. Professor Richard Landes's blog, Augean Stables, writes in response to his latest post, "What do my colleagues think?"

His post is available here: http://www.theaugeanstables.com/2008/04/07/what-do-my-coll eagues-think/

My own comments on the subject:
http://sisu.typepad.com/sisu/2008/04/what-do-my-coll.html

Sigh
T Sowell is the quintessential senior. He whines, complains and moans about everything from presidential politics to Rachel Ray without offering any viable solutions to the problems he constantly bellyaches about. The man is also extremely arrogant and condescending; I pity his wife and children if he has either.

Sowell’s mindset is basically “Everyone’s stupid, I’m smart”. “Everyone’s gullible, I’m informed”. “Everyone lies, I tell the truth.” Sometimes I just get the sense that Sowell is just an angry bitter social pariah that needs a friend and a hug.

Finally, it was the mainstream media (both right and left) along with disgruntled partisan hacks like Sowell that brought this "dialogue on race” about when they decided to smear Rev Wright and his church by using a few sermons of his to invoke fear into naive white Americans. Sowell should be ashamed of himself for selling out a socially active black church and pastor that has been actively working to solve some of the problems that Sowell constantly bellyaches about in his stupid columns. Shame on you Sowell.

Savage99
To Savage99: Thanks for the thought, my friend. That shirt you have is one that I have to get. I like that as much as the one I have. Don't let people like Lee cause you to shy away from a discussion about race. For every jerk like him there's a Black who will openly, honestly, and CONSTRUCTIVELY talk with you. Too bad that some high profile Black "leaders" (I never voted for them) have played on White guilt and cried racism for so long that people will not talk at all for fear of being labeled a racist. Time to move on. Thanks again for your comments. Now......how can I get that shirt?

John Galt vs. Lee
Very well said John Galt. Lee refuses or is incapable of refuting anything Sowell said so he attacks instead. Sadly, this reveals a shocking lack of intelligence.

I would also add that Lee is our typical liberal. Any thoughts differing from the brainwashing they have received is forbidden. No one is allowed to think differently from a liberal. They think it is because they are so intelligent. We know it is because of a profound lack of intelligence. They can't articulate their thoughts so their heads nearly explode to the point they want everyonelse to shut up.

John Galt
I chalked the dollar sign on the pedestal.

Still waiting.

Great Article/ Good Posts
Dr. Sowell needs to write a book of his Random Thoughts. If only the left had his grasp of life. Imagine how great this country could really be without having the drag of liberal thinking to deal with.

Amelia, Amen to your post.
Lee, maybe you don't have the capability to make the kind of life you want here in this racist country. Maybe it is too tough for you. Maybe you need an excuse for failure. God knows you've been given enough of them by the race baiters. What do you think when you hear Dr. King's words about seeing people, not by the color of their skin, but by the color of their character? Have you ever listened to yourself talk or seriously read your own words? How are they different than those of white Klansmen? They sound the same to me.

Racism
I have had only one instance of racism in my 75 years.I as a white male was going to be in a hospital in 1970.While in my room I was asked if I would share my room with a black man.I was shocked that I was even asked that.As it turned out he liked pepsi as well as I did each day my wife would bring us each a pepsi.This was not in the south,it was in Iowa.

Lee is a reprobate
Lee is obviously from the brilliant and articulate "everything is Whitey's fault, so give me your money, Whitey, or you're a racist" school of philosophical thought.
To use the obscenity, "Uncle Tom", in reference to such as Doc Sowell is totally unacceptable.
The one thing the likes of Lee will NEVER admit is that, from a spiritually and intellectually honest point of view, it is manifestly possible to be vigorously opposed to ideas such as collectivism, socialism, fascism, autocracy, authoritarianism, totalitarianism, sophistry, etc, without simultaneously being a racist and thinking you're a higher form of life than people with skin colors different from your own.
That Lee and his ilk doggedly, even desperately, refuse to admit this simple, self-evident fact makes them manipulative sociopathic reprobates unworthy of being engaged in meaningful conversation by decent people of good will and intellectual honesty (regardless of skin color).
Truth is, Doc Sowell rules, Lee drools! So, an enthusiastic and sincere middle digit salute to you and your ilk, Lee. Grow up. Get a life. Read a few books. Sowell on Economics 101 and "The Liberal Mind: The Psychological Causes of Political Madness" by Lyle H. Rossiter, M.D. would make a good start.

orlandocajun you hit it...
"Liberals make excuses for their trash. Conservatives throw theirs out. There just aren't enough conservatives anymore."

They did it for Bill Clinton a man who was caught in multiple lies. I heard a woman who was standing up for him when she said words to the effect, "I know he lies but he lies about the right things." Scooter Libby got a royal tube job for one alleged lie.

If Barney Frank was caught in a sexual sting in a bathroom by the police would he be given a pass. He was when he had a homosexual whore house that took credit cards being run out of his house. A Republican lost all his bananas over hand signals in a rest room.

Ted Kennedy fled the scene of a fatal accident and did not have to answer for it. I suppose he bought his way out.

Retired Geek
I'm a fifty year old Black male, my friend. The name OrpheusMay is a bit of Pig Latin. Morpheus is one of the main characters of a movie called "The Matrix", a sci-fi action flick about how machines took over the Earth and constructed a computer generated world to fool the humans into thinking that their life was a piece of cake. This was the 'Matrix". So it is with Blacks in and the Democrat-media complex in 2008. Too many of my people have been fooled into thinking that White conservatives are the enemy. They need to be unplugged from the Matrix.

Anyway, WhatOnEarthCatalog.com is where you can find that shirt.

Anthony Thomas
Thomas you have proven time and again that your sick narcissistic sense of self-worth and self-esteem derive entirely from feedback of others.

Thomas you have no self-esteem or self-worth of your own.

Thomas you are a narcissistic predator in constant pursuit of Narcissistic Supply.

Pathological narcissism is an addictive behavior.

Great article Dr. Sowell!
Thank you for your humanity! This is just how I feel as well:

Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain.

We indeed are in a deep conumdrum! America has had many primary elections where it could be said our choices are to vote for the lesser of two evils. This maybe the first time it can be said we have the choice to vote for the lesser of three evils.

Aunty Thom
Where have you been? Sowell's been offering solutions since I first began reading his columns over a decade ago: stop looking for a handout, get an education, be productive, don't get pregnant out of wedlock, etc. (note that I don't mean to imply that those issues are limited to black Americans).

Why is self-sufficiency, independence, and pulling one's (and one's children's) weight (while teaching them by example to be independent) so difficult a concept?

When Katrina hit New Orleans, there were 5th generation welfare recipients who didn't have the sense to get the hell out of the way. THAT's what the perpetual dole does. It was somebody ELSE'S responsibiity to move them out.

Note also that NO has been controlled by liberal Dems for generations. Fat lot of good their solutions did minorities there.

Liberal policies are, by and large, socialist policies, and yet liberals continue to advance them despite the overwhelming evidence of their failure staring them in the face. And yet when a black conservative offers the time-tested solution of personal responsibility, you reject it. Why is that?

Forgive Lee
Don't bother in Lee's behavior Long taught by the Rev Wrights of the World backed up my white Socialist/ Liberals/Media needs for Victims or the Victimhood slavery mentality that must keep on going to stay in Power !
No Victims means their SURE QUITE DEATH OR WHEN BLACKS WANT OUT
OF LIBERAL'
/ SOCIALISM FOR VOTES SLAVERY .
Victim's means there is no needs for personal responsibility and much needed INDIVIDUALISM but those are unspoken racist words among Liberals , Elite's and Blacks sadly .
Here is the real Black and White real DIFFERENCE after 45 years of Johnson's equal off welfare act in 1965 .
EARLY in my Childhood I was "Taught by Both Parents " . I was in charge of my own Bills and behavior .I paid the price when I was Wrong and enjoyed after much hard work my own fruits of my own personal Labor and life WINNING Rights .
But it wasn't easy nor is Life meant to be !
My Mom words ..... Son you play you pay .
Life it's self is one of pains , trials and Tribulations but in life's end we reap what we sowed .
Lee if your still reading this . When I turned 60 years old I wrote Thomas Sowell a personal Letter and he amazing answered me back .
I told him even though I had a white Dad and Mom . If I could have had another Dad it would have been him . Yes I told him it meant I would have been Biracial
Since his Wisdom . common sense , ethics and mind has no color .
He wrote me back and Son your are my own Son by
Proxy .
I have made better choices in my life after reading many of Sowells books and his columns .

Rachel Ray...
Dr. Sowell how funny you mention her. Pet peeve... I just have one thing to say...can anyone tie that stupid b**** hands together while she talks? I have never seen ANYONE make so many gestures while talking in my entire life. Can you tell that bothers me or anything?

OrpheusMay
Wow! What a grand lady. Having had two major surgeries in 8 months including one for cancer, I needed something to jump start my life again. Many, many, thanks! This is already on my office wall.

BTW, Great article Dr. Sowell.

I have a sweatshirt, Lee, that might interest you. It says "So life has a hill. Get over it."

SUGAR HILL
Doctor Sowell will know, I live in Sugar Hill one of the loveliest quietest parts of Manhattan where no one is Clinton-rich but the all the school aged children are fed, well dressed and off to school in the morning.

I read Barack Obama's Philadelphia "Speech" with intent on finding essence and substantive depth in this man. The 5,000 words consisted of approximately 35 paragraphs.

What I surmised from his words was: "gone to some of the best schools in America" from which instead of gratitude and transcending narrow racial thinking and attitudes Barack Obama proceeded to discuss color, color, race, muddle, more excuses, thick Biblical analogy, closed black racism, racial prejudice, past-present personality lock, racial accusations towards non-blacks, more muddled economic theory, mushiness, static societal attitudes and opinions, added racism, rage and sympathy suck demagoguery.

This may have been the speech that made Chris Matthews pee in his pants, but I found nothing Churchillian, Lincolnesque, or inspiring as from Martin Luther King.

I concede, I did not cross the Bridge at Selma; ergo, my sins of omission are there but to construe and thus call me a "racist" in fact or form is gross injustice which I stand in complete opposition and rejection.

Mr. Obama, I do not measure you by the color of your skin but I do consider your words to be measurement of your thoughts.

OrpheusMay
My game is basketball and i played in various leagues in Baltimore, DC and New Jersey for many years. Often i was the only white guy on the floor. I took a few cheap shots, but never had to defend myself, as my black teammates, even when strangers, did it quicker and more emphatically than i could. My experience with black folks is pretty much the same as with white folks, and that is overwhelmingly positive. I enjoy unflinching dialog and find black people are very sophisticated when it comes to reading the heart and identifying good will. I know there is a lot of CYA on both sides, but i have received so much help from black folks that could have no other reward than the knowlege that they were extending a hand to a fellow man, that i choose to believe the positive alternative when there is another possibility. TH can give a false impression of those both on the right and left because the disproportionate number of political junkies tend to indulge in name calling and other abusive nonsense. Just plain folks are all too scarce, so its always pleasant when one shows up.
As for my shirt, i bought it some time ago mail order. I'm on the idiot list for about 3 dozen catalogs and i forget which one i bought it from. Possibly Brigade Quartermasters, which has (or had) a large t-shirt selection.

Random Thoughts
When I taught secondary school I quickly realized that most of my students got most of their life experience through video, tv and movies. The "good" teachers showed movies instead of teaching or expecting kids to read. The "great" teachers played games or let the kids do all the talking. The one movie almost every kid has seen in "history" class is JFK. Soon the same rabid liar will be producing "W". What a farce is life.

Recon-usmc-RGeek-Vic-SRelic
Dr. Sowell’s Random Thoughts are FAR SUPERIOR to Barack Hussein Obama’s FOCUSED Thoughts.

LEE:
Go live somewhere else and take your attitude with you. You will see how good you had it. You don't deserve to be an American citizen. WHAHHH! Boo-Hoo!! You big baby, just STOP it.

Parker
That's why I could never live in NVC. Rachel Ray may be OK to look at but that voice is like nails on a chalkboard.

Lee
Wow, Lee, you are a racist and I find your comments appalling. I think maybe you should get off your a** and get out there and indoctrinate (er, I mean educate) all of the minority citizens who don't think like you. I mean really, they shouldn't be thinking for themselves should they? After all, Dr. Sowell doesn't have any fancy degrees or life and work experience of his own to draw upon, does he? Yep, Lee, I suggest you get started right away so that no more intellectual independence can exist. Maybe you could even create an "Education Camp" where you could house all minorities that disagree with your view until they see the light?

LEE: GET SMART!
LEE:
Get smart!

Make money on your perfidty. George Soros pays $100/word "I" and "a" included for leftist ant-etablishment screeds directed at any and all conservatives, traditional religion, Republicans, and George Bush.

Don't be shy - get in on the feeding frenzy!

Chump-Change to this guy, Soros is worth ten ($10.000,000,000) billion dollars. Go for the max; Contact:
Soros Fund Management (aka "SFM")
888 7th Ave, New York, NY 3.76mi
(212) 333-9898

Are you related to the General?

Dean
Bravo. I tried to write something similar but it was not as detailed and eloquent.

OrpheusMay
My apologies Sir grin. I did mistake your TH name as female not your comments.

Thanks for the tip on the shirt, I am going to order one. I shared the comment with my neighbor while walking my dog and he wants one as well.

BTW, my neighbor is black.

Barack says part 1
Barack Hussein Obama says:

America is the greatest nation in the world. I need your help to change that.

We are in a recession. People need jobs/money/food/ energy.
His solution: Give an extra 845 BILLION DOLLARS to the UN to waste.

We are in a recession. Unemployment is higher than it’s been in years.
His solution: Amnesty for 20 million illegal alien lawbreakers (some robbers, rapists, and murderers), so they can hold jobs needed by Americans Citizens.
.
Gasoline costs $3.50 per gallon. It’s actually $3.89 per gallon: You get 9/10 gallon for $3.50.
His solutions: A new tax on the oil companies which will be passed on to us-the-people-who-pay-all-taxes, thereby increasing the price to $4.50 per gallon. At the same time he mandated higher-gas-mileage cars, he mandated gasoline diluted with alcohol which gets less gas mileage. Gasoline explodes to deliver energy; alcohol burns. You will get only 9/10 of a gallon of gasoline for $4.50, and the real price will be $5.00 per gallon. President Carter used this tax to cap domestic oil wells.

Oil companies have high profits.
The cost of gasoline:
Federal pump tax: 18.4 cents per gallon
PA state pump tax: 32 cents per gallon
All federal, state, county, municipal, and school TAXES of all other kinds = 1/3 of the price.
Speculators add-0ns: Most of the rest of the price
Foreign nations’ prices: Much of the rest of the price

Georgetwin et al
Your post is "right on".

This "ole white dude" views Dr. Sowell as an American Icon who deserves the respect due a hero.

Barack says part 2
Oil-tanker ship charges and oil-spill insurance
The cost of the alcohol used to dilute the gasoline
The oil companies’ cost to process oil into gasoline = less than 25 cents per gallon.
The oil companies’ profit: 10 CENTS PER GALLON (2.9%). The oil companies get the large majority of their profit from out of the country, not from the American People.

BARACK, who is accusing the oil companies of price-gouging, REPRESENTS ALL TAXATION, WHICH IS A FULL THREE-SEVENTHS (43%) OF THE TOTAL PRICE.

The price could be greatly reduced by hiring the oil companies to drill, pump, refine, and deliver OUR offshore oil to us. There would be no speculators’ add-ons, no foreign nations’ price, no oil-tanker charges and oil spills. No dilution-with-alcohol cost would give us a full gallon of gasoline.
Repealing all the hundreds or thousands of taxes, and replacing them with ONE TAX AND DONE for each level of government, would alone reduce the price by three-sevenths (3/7).

He stands in front of a factory closed for decades and says the company moved out of the country. He doesn’t mention that it was taxed out of business by a Democrat-controlled Congress.

Barack wants to disarm all loyal, law-abiding Americans to put them at the tender mercies of the 20 million illegal alien lawbreakers (some robbers, rapists, and murderers), and his Muslim buddies who like to behead innocent victims.

If we are attacked again, he will go make nice with the Islamo-fascist-terrorist murderers and tell them that we surrender.

Uncle Tom
"Uncle Tom, the titular character, was initially seen as a noble long-suffering Christian slave. In more recent years his name has become an epithet directed towards African-Americans who are accused of selling out to whites. However, Stowe intended Tom to be a "noble hero"[21] and praiseworthy person. Throughout the book, far from allowing himself to be exploited, Tom stands up for his beliefs and is grudgingly admired even by his enemies."

That is for those of you who have never read "Uncle Tom's Cabin" or anything else, for that matter, so you know whereof your knee jerks.


with I Agree OrpheusMay
For everybody on these boards: Please, please read Mr. Sowell's "Black Rednecks and White Liberals", it really is culture. I live here in the deep South and the cultural life styles of both White and Black Rednecks is much the same. This book is full of truthful, historical statistics that document the sad journey of both American southern blacks and early low class anglo-saxon whites. We do NOT have a racial problem, we have a serious cultural problem that could be solved if it were not for the White Liberals that keep focusing on race as a foundation for their political power. Liberals and Socialists, the modern slave masters.

AUDIR10
Isn't it also interesting that the appelation of Uncle Tom to blacks who "suck up" to whites was done by another original race baitor James Baldwin. One wonders if Baldwin even read the original book.

Lies
If you think about it, the worst thing a person can do is be a liar. People may accept a murderer but not a liar. The bottom respected professions are: lawyer, politician, and media reporter, not necessarily in that order. All three make their living by telling lies.

That is why I dislike Hillary (and Bill) so much. Both are pathological liars and will tell a lie when the truth would serve them better. But both expect you to believe their lies and vote for them.

Speaking of Bill - the next Secretary General of the United Nations will come from this section of the world. Many small third world countries will vote for Bill for that position. And the next President will almost certainly be the person to recommend someone for that position. Has anyone thought of that? And just think what could be done with Bill as Secretary General and Hillary as President at the same time.

Thanks Dr. Sowell
Another great 'random thoughts' column.

For any who are interested...new parody on my blog. Cheers!

Disagree on one.
Well, I can enjoy Dr. Tom, but I still get to disagree with one of his random thoughts.

He says
"Some people actually think that televising Congress gives us information. What it really does is give politicians millions of dollars worth of free advertising, while they play charades on camera to fool the rest of us."

Without CSPAN I would not have been so sure, so soon, that Gore and Kerry were idiots.

By what you read in the papers as compared to what you would have seen on CSPAN, you would never have known that the next president should be NEWT, NEWT, NEWT. Well, maybe it will be the one after next.

=====

During the few months I attended Indiana Univ before I was bored out of my mind, one Prof of something, spent each day screaming about the terrible USA. They one day he came in with a smile and said, “I got a job in Sweden.” Never saw him again.

A few years later Sweetie and I visited the Stockholm University campus, and talked to students. One graduate student, getting his PhD in Economics, said, several times, “Do you realize how lucky you are to be living in the USA?”

======

"Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain."
-----
And who convinced you to vote for Bush except for Gore and Kerry. Come on Repubs, find a good man for president, not just a “better than that one.”

=====

Stupie Jesse Jackson says that if he sees some Black men coming towards him on the street at night, he crosses the street.

But think about it, if you saw three large Black men coming towards you at night, would you cross the street, or would you say, “Good evening Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson, and Bill Crosby.”

It’s not color, it’s what they look like, and what they are doing. I would cross the street if I saw a group of the white garbage generation.


Liberal Vs. Conservatism
"Most people on the right have no problem understanding people on the left because many, if not most, were on the left themselves when they were younger. But many, if not most, people on the left find it inexplicable how any decent and intelligent person could be on the right."

One definition of conservatism is "someone who makes decisions based on life's learned lessons rather than on abstract theory." This is true. You can learn the lessons yourself from your own mistakes or you can learn from other's mistakes. But young people (teens and college) have no life experiences except what seen and heard at home. So the young want to imporve things. The college professors (most of whom also have no lessons they have learned themselves and who associate with excited youth daily) emphasize that. As a result, most youths are liberal. Most conservatives are liberals who had learned what life is all about.

Profound statements, Mr. Sowell.

"shut up you jerk", they explained
Why is it that the criticisms of Dr Sowell seem to focus on his race and personality? Does anyone here care to try to rebut any of his points using facts and reason? Oh, and please note that being black does not obligate him to be liberal and ignore facts and reason.

If it did then I WOULD be a racist.

Anthony Thomas
I couldn't have said it better my friend. My problem with Sowell and others like him is that he has convinced whites that the only acceptable blacks are those that think like him. There have been a lot of posts here making assumptions about me for instance that prove my point. Statements about blacks being lazy criminals, uneducated, unsuccessful, babies out of wedlock, immoral, comparing me to Rev Wright and the antichrist etc. What you are saying is that if someone disagrees with you they must fit into these stereotypes. I don't have to acknowledge those kinds of ramblings because they don't apply to me. You love Sowell because he is shockingly anti black as many of you are. That's the appeal that he has.

Loved the Message board

A few years ago, during the war in Yugo, a beautiful lady from Zagreb was my partner.

=============

One time a very well endowed lady, who
I had played tennis with many times,
arrived for our tennis match wearing a shirt,
with a printed message.
_______________________________
She said, “Do you like my message?”
_______________________________
I said, “No, but I love the message board!”

Democrats and Illegals
About 1965 the Democrats discovered minority groups. At that time the Democrats were considered the "Party of the Blue Collar Workers". The Republicans were considered the "Party of the Rich". But politicians of both groups like the idea of block bosses. They pay off one person and get a whole lot of votes.

The Democrats immediately started promising everything to get the minority votes. They figured that, with the BCW votes, they could easily rule. And for a time they did.

But by giving the minorities whatever they want for votes, they tax the Blue Collar Workers to get the money. So the BCW's got annoyed. Most have now switched to the Republican Party for lack of something better. The Democrats suddenly discovered that minority means 'not a majority'. And the black people are beginning to realize that there are better things in life than trusting a liberal Democrat to make their lives better.

So the Democrats are frantic to find another minority that may even become a majority. The illegal people fill that position IF the Democrats can make them legal and IF they can convince them to vote Democrat. So you see a lot of Democrat effort going to help the illegals. Some of you may think that illegals can't and don't vote. Don't believe it. They can get driver license easily enough and that is all it takes to vote. Many do.

So don't be surprised at what is going on to attract illegal voters and to keep the border open. The Democrats consider it necessary if they hope to keep control of the country.

Conservatives and Liberals
Ah yes, a conservative is a liberal who has been mugged.

Lee wrote:
"My problem with Sowell and others like him is that he has convinced whites that the only acceptable blacks are those that think like him."

If there were any more irony in that statement, it'd rust.

The reason (not reason why, which is redundant) liberals hate conservative blacks (take a look at some of Ted Rall's racist cartoons about Condi Rice, for example) is PRECISELY because they think for themselves rather than accept the "group think" liberals demand of blacks.

killer
What you are is a waste of time. Another troll to be ignored. I will try to remember not to waste my time on you again.

Lee, You're Wrong
Lee:

Why don't you allow for the possibility that maybe, just maybe, you're wrong. Sowell has not "convinced whites" of anything. Nothing in his work every even insinuates that you have to be like him to be acceptable, no more than anyone with an opinion does anyway. Doesn't Reverand Wright communicate the idea that you have to be like him to be acceptable? Isn't his message just exactly what you are claiming about Sowell? Anybody who has a different world view than people like Wright, and you Lee, is unacceptable to you. Sowell has written books which are based on hard-core economic theory supported with time-honored principles. He does not just run off at the mouth like the Reverand Wrights of the world do. Wright offers nothing to support his claims, other than visceral reactions to everything he sees around him (which is limited). Sowell is an intellectual; Wright is a circus act. It has nothing to do with race; it has to do with behavior.

You're wrong Lee, and it is to your own detriment if you do not open your eyes. People with your outlook seldom succeed in life.

Sowell's Random thoughts always profound
Sowell writes: "Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain."

I still won't vote for McCain, but I must vote against Obamillary. Straight ticket Republican - again.

Sowell writes: "Rachael Ray is showing up in so many places on various television programs, on magazine covers, on boxes of crackers that the question must be asked: Are we sure that she is not twins, or perhaps triplets?"

If Rachael Ray actually ate all the food she promotes she would be as big as three people!


Bravo, Toons
I have to say, toons is just as quick as Thomas Sowell' at least today (2008 5:21 AM post).

". . . amazing to me that people are against putting murderous thugs to death after a fairly well designed judicial system has found them guilty but these same people are willing to let a woman that can't seem to figure out how she got pregnant choose whether an innocent baby gets the same sentence." Key word: INNOCENT /





A Challenge for Lee
"So obvious" is it?

Quote for us something from Thomas Sowell that supports your position.

Anthony Thomas -- You're Improving
Your ad hominems are a little more sophisticated. Good job.

Give Lee some advice, would you? He's still stuck in "self-hating uncle-tom house-negro sell-out" mode.

Now all you need to do is learn to argue against the message, based solely on its merits or lack thereof, instead of attacking the messenger.

I know it's a tall order for most liberals, but I think -- I hope -- you're up to the challenge.

dear 45caliber:
Yeah, agree with ya, Democrats are pandering all the time.

Very much the way they cultivated hispanics and Mexican-Americans back on May 1, 2006.

In the crowds assembled to protest under the pretext of "Si Se Puede" were many leftist hispanics, (in the thousands) as well as many illegals. Right there were our pandering DEMS.

However-- as distressing as that was; on our Right were countless, clueless Fringe-Right Fence-huggers all going Ape-Shoot over the beggarly, evil, frightening Mexican Peril who is "going to take away our country." The hate-speech over many months against Mexicans (code word, illegal immigrants) was deafening.

Too bad for our GOP.

"THEY" all heard it-- our savage rhetoric. They flew over to the panderers; we lost our congressional majority as a result. I was not alone remarking on this; On O'Reilly the same opinion was expressed by Dick Morris & Geraldo-- Hate speech has a price. We mustn't make that mistake anymore. I wish I could tell it to Rush, Sean, Laura & Cool Ann.

AT at it again
Anthony Thomas is the quintessential town malingerer.

Definition

The central theme to all definitions of malingering is that the term applies to persons who deliberately pretend to have an illness or disability in order to receive financial or other gain, or to avoid punishment or responsibility.


Black Conservatives
Christheprofessor writes:

“The reason (not reason why, which is redundant) liberals hate conservative blacks (take a look at some of Ted Rall's racist cartoons about Condi Rice, for example) is PRECISELY because they think for themselves rather than accept the "group think" liberals demand of blacks.”

You’re wrong, black conservatives do not think for themselves, they are merely pawns in the GOP game to destroy the liberal agenda. Black conservatives are not unique in thoughts or ideas, they simply recite GOP talking points and in many cases, are apologist for anti black racism in America; this particularly causes blacks to hate them. Black Conservatives like T Sowell baselessly attack liberal blacks, while ignoring the bigotry, hatred and ignorance that exist not only in America, but also within the political party in which they worship ( They need only read some TH post to see this bigotry)

Like most conservatives, black conservatives also fail to examine race from a comprehensive perspective. Black Conservatives cherry pick the bad in the African American community and inflate it as a complete representation of everything in the African American community; the Rev Wright story presents no better example of this. Self haters like L Elder give their books titles like “Stupid black men” and say things like “blacks are more racist than whites”, while ignoring that there are at least as many stupid racist white men in America as there are stupid racist black men. Why does he not title his book “Stupid white men or Stupid American men”?

Pseudo intellects like T Sowell and W Williams cater to the bigotry of conservative whites by presenting arguments with manipulated economic and statistical data that support their obvious disdain for blacks and distorted worldviews. These are a few reasons why white black conservatives are disliked by many blacks.

dreadnaught
Few TH'ers that I have talked with have a problem with Mexicans or other groups immigrating. The problem is with illegal entry into the US. If you cant follow our law stay the hell out. Break one you will break many. So get over YOUR self!

reply to Serpentdove
Love your examples of dialogues on race. Love to see there's another liberal here on TH. I say this because almost no real conservatives would find anything to smile about in your examples.

It's no use...
Anthony, Lee, and unfortunately countless other hatefilled posters here basically in a nutshell represent a perfect example of the 90% black voting bloc that chronically votes dems.

Even though the last 40 years has produced the destruction of the black family, excessive uneducation rates, astronimcal violent crime rates in much of the black communities, STD/AIDs rates at epidemic proportions, and a current genocide with the mass slaughter of over THIRTY THOUSAND young BLACK men by other BLACK men... He and many others cannot/will not see that it is a result of their own hatred. They fool themselves into blaming 10% of the community and all evil whitey's for their own self caused destruction. God help them! As it is written the real evil one is here to lie, steal, kill and destroy. Even a blind man should be able to see this.

i hear ya, hagar
Is YOUR post in any way a form of hatred against Mexico ?

Not at all. I agree with your every word here. I'm a conservative & a Republican.

I do NOT agree with those who claimed the illegal immigrant was a plague of cockroaches, or that they would "ruin this American culture," or that all they come here for is the freebies, and much more.

That's all within free-speech rights. You can be within your rights when you demonize an ethnic group. But you're not a good neighbor. A fence won't help you as a cultural device, either. But try & tell that to rabid conservatives of our Right Fringe. You know-- those who claim "JUAN McCain" doesn't deserve their votes. Or, a vote for him is a vote for amnesty (a complete falsehood).

AT
It's called "Stupid Black Men" to draw contrast to a book called "Stupid White Men" written by Michael Moore. In it, Moore blames the vast majority of the problems in America on white people. Larry Elder explains that it is in part the behavior of the black community that explains the problems facing black America, and cites individuals that he feels are perpetuating the problem. Elder's doing the same thing that Moore did. But when Moore did it, I'm sure you weren't saying Moore was a racist and a race-traitor. Yet when Elder does, you call him an Uncle Tom and a sellout.

Get a clue.

Anthony and Lee are both racists
To think that the only way a black person can be conservative is to be "brainwashed" or an Uncle Tom is patently racist. You latently signal your own feeling of superiority to those who don't agree with you. The irony is that you are both mental midgets compared to Dr. Sowell, one of America's most prominent economists. Your giant super egos and intolerance have no place in conservatism, go back to daily kos and spew your hate speech there, I'm sure it will be welcome.

catscratchfever
“Even though the last 40 years has produced the destruction of the black family, excessive uneducation rates, astronimcal violent crime rates in much of the black communities, STD/AIDs rates at epidemic proportions, and a current genocide with the mass slaughter of over THIRTY THOUSAND young BLACK men by other BLACK men”

You cannot attribute all the problems of the black community (many problems that also exist in other communities) to one side of the political aisle. Have liberals made mistakes? Yes. Are liberals the root cause to all the ills that you mention? Absolutely not.

It is my belief that the distribution of crack in America’s inner cities was cause of a foreign policy error made by one of America’s most popular conservative presidents, Ronald Reagan. How do you think the drugs got to the inner cities? Blacks do not have the resources or political connections to import cocaine from South America or any other place in the world.

The drugs that were allowed to be distributed in our inner cities during the 1980’s under Reagan were just as responsible for the “astronimcal violent crime rates, STD/AIDs rates at epidemic proportions, and a current genocide with the mass slaughter of over THIRTY THOUSAND young BLACK men by other BLACK men” that you mention than anything else .

However, somehow you absolve the administration of that era of any accountability in these matters, yet you condemn blacks as a whole for the failure of SOME blacks to succeed in spite of these blunders made by our elected officials. In my opinion, liberals weren’t responsible for the distribution of illegal drugs in American inner cities, why don’t you place some of the accountability for those who were responsible?

AT
"You’re wrong, black conservatives do not think for themselves, they are merely pawns in the GOP game to destroy the liberal agenda. "

Logically, if you reverse the terms liberal and conservative in your sentence above (and delete GOP), can you see how that could also be true?

Dean
“To think that the only way a black person can be conservative is to be "brainwashed" or an Uncle Tom is patently racist”

Who said that? I certainly didn’t. I gave specific examples for why many blacks dislike conservative blacks. You must be confusing me with someone else or just can’t read or comprehend too well.

AT
"It is my belief that the distribution of crack in America’s inner cities was cause of a foreign policy error made by one of America’s most popular conservative presidents, Ronald Reagan. How do you think the drugs got to the inner cities? "

This is simply ridiculous. How do any illegal drugs get into inner cities? They are brought there by drug dealers of all colors who want to make money.

"and a current genocide with the mass slaughter of over THIRTY THOUSAND young BLACK men by other BLACK men".

If you want to blame someone for that, start with Planned Parenthood.

Anthony
"You’re wrong, black conservatives do not think for themselves, they are merely pawns in the GOP game to destroy the liberal agenda. "

Has it ever occurred to you that maybe, after careful consideration, they don't AGREE with the liberal agenda?

Ken
Let's take Anthony's premise to its logical conclusion:

"You’re wrong, black conservatives do not think for themselves, they are merely pawns in the GOP game to destroy the liberal agenda. "

Okay, we know there are white liberals and white conservatives, right? So AT is saying for blacks to "think for themselves", they MUST be liberal.

In other words, to "think for themselves" they must unquestioningly follow liberal dogma. does that sound oxymoronic, or at least moronic, to anyone but me?


Right is it's own defense
“ Larry Elder explains that it is in part the behavior of the black community that explains the problems facing black America, and cites individuals that he feels are perpetuating the problem”

That’s my problem it’s always the black community and what the black community does wrong. He doesn’t examine the problems of blacks from a comprehensive prospective. Racism is no longer a barrier for blacks based on his writings and commentary. An unfair criminal justice system does not exist for blacks in his mind. The globalization that has decimated millions of inner city jobs has no affect on blacks according to the works of Elder.

If Elder is going to attack the evils(or leaders) that have destroyed the black community, he must attack all the evils (and leaders) that destroy the black community, not juts the evils (and leaders) that are politically convenient for him to attack, while maintaining his career as a black necon pundit.

The one and the only.

Dr. Thomas Sowell, simply our National Treasure.

In one word... priceless.

Taking the complex and the nuanced, extracting the essence... and then watching true leftists go bonkers while somehow trying to respond to his simple but brilliant observations.

To paraphrase another philosopher, Dennis Miller; sort of like watching a rabid chiwauva under a strobe light.

Love those leftists.

But their destructive thought and ideology, must be exposed for what it is.

It has NEVER been... just about a difference of opinion of how to get things done.








AT
Didn't you see "American Gangster"?

AZPhil
"In other words, to "think for themselves" they [African-Americans] must unquestioningly follow liberal dogma. does that sound oxymoronic, or at least moronic, to anyone but me?"

It sounds pretty moronic to me, too. Unfortunately, I've found that liberals don't exactly thrive on common sense.

AT
"Larry Elder explains that it is in part the behavior of the black community that explains the problems facing black America"

Notice he says IN PART?

Let me ask you - if one young black man pulls out a gun and shoots another black man, who, in your mind, is responsible?

Ken
Yeah, "think for yourselves" and "Stay on the liberal plantation" are sort of polar opposites. I guess if they "thought for themselves", that wouldn't help out Je$$e "I'm Always Unemployed" Jack$on and Al "Race Riot" Sharpton, now would it?

azphil
“This is simply ridiculous. How do any illegal drugs get into inner cities? They are brought there by drug dealers of all colors who want to make money”

Have you not heard of the Iran/Contra affair? I think you need to educate yourself before you call anything ridiculous.

AT
You just will never get it. Type away as you may. Your youth and children are being destroyed by your hatred. I am sorry for you. I wail for them, as there is nothing I can personally do. Maybe by the time 50,000 black youths have been slaughtered in the next few years by their fellow brothers, enough will finally be enough. As it seems you're only looking towards hatred and blaming and not changing. Maybe looking for a leader, some black leader somewhere will find a solution, because God forbid you listen to a black conservative or evil whitey. In the interim God help you all

Ken
This would be a good analogy for the SAT writers:

Vampires: Garlic

Liberals: ______

a) Emotion
b) Nonsense
c) Logic
d) Conservatives


AT
"I think you need to educate yourself before you call anything ridiculous."

You are right - one of us needs some schooling. You should rent American Gangster.

AZPhil
"Yassuh, boss, we ain' bout t'go agin Massuh Jesse's wishes! No suh!" According to Anthony Thomas, this is "blacks thinking for themselves."

AT
and again I ask "if one young black man pulls out a gun and shoots another black man, who, in your mind, is responsible?"

First Spouses
The thought of Michelle Obama or Bill Clinton representing the U.S.A. at home and abroad as first lady/man is the only thing that will cause me to vote for McCain.

Jinxy

azphil
“and again I ask "if one young black man pulls out a gun and shoots another black man, who, in your mind, is responsible?"

The parents of the young man, in conjunction with the more than likely poor economic surrounding he likely lives in, and of course the poor judgment of that particular young black male.

Living Soundbite-to-soundbite
"What is more scary than any particular candidate or policy is the gullibility of the public and their willingness to be satisfied with talking points, rather than serious arguments."

I guess I could eventually think of thousands of examples, but the one that comes to mind now was the 1992 election that revolved around slogans of "change" (unspecified), "health care", "worst economy in the last 50 yrs" (yeah, if you were in a coma in the '70's), & 1988's betrayed "read my lips."

Then there were the things nobody remembered about the 2000 election. E.g. one candidate had already made a name for himself on a particular issue, yet when running for POTUS he avoided even mentioning it. Instead that election, then the next one for POTUS (2004), were wasted on inane "What I Did During the Vietnam War" irrelevant essays, & fights over their veracity. Those are what I've come to call "content-free election campaigns."

"Rachael Ray is showing up in so many places on various television programs, on magazine covers, on boxes of crackers that the question must be asked: Are we sure that she is not twins, or perhaps triplets?"

Could be worse. About 10-15 yrs ago there was apparently some law that you couldn't publish a magazine without having Rosie O'Donnell's picture on it at least every 4th issue. Rachael Ray at least is attractive, & hasn't gone off like a rabid Rottweiler, that I've ever heard of, screaming utterly stupid political opinions.

AT
So whenLarry Elder says "that it is IN PART the behavior of the black community that explains the problems facing black America", from what you wrote above, "of course the poor judgment of that particular young black male", it sounds like you and ol' Larry agree.

AZPhil
Don't waste your time.

OTOH, he's improving. He's up to 1 of 3 right.

Sir Michael
Did you enjoy the knighting ceremony? :)

I am trying to be reasonable, if you look above, and not getting too far.

AT
Here's a question: If households routinely had guns out in the open in the 1930s, and there was a Depression, why wasn't crime RAMPANT then? And yes, I know about Al Capone and Joe Kennedy bootlegging, but I mean run-of-the-mill crime, or disorganized crime if you prefer?

The cure is worse than the disease
"Most of the problems of this country are not nearly as bad as the "solutions" -- especially the solutions that politicians come up with during election years."

In fact, many of the problems are invented, or defined as problems, specifically in order that government can grow & encroach into our lives more as a solution.

Take for example the inevitable fact of life that some incomes are higher than others. Given what money & income are actually for, in a just society one would expect that to be the case, rather than not.

You will not that virtually every issue that the elites & the pop media & people seen/heard/quoted therein, is presented in such a way that more and bigger government, more confiscation, more restrictions & intrusions in our lives, is needed in response.

Seldom do you ever see an issue for which the pop media calls for less government, except certain personal & sexual ones. Even in those cases, government is then called upon to shift the costs of bad decisions from the deciders who had their fun, onto everyone else.

Nightshift as arrived
The nightshift has arrived :)

Questions for Anthony
Here are some questions to which I would like to hear your honest answers:

You mention the Liberal agenda, just what is that agenda?

Do you believe that the Liberal war on poverty has helped or hurt the black community?

Do you really believe that the local beer distributor is responsible for the choices of the alcholic?

Can you explain why the out-of-wedlock birth rate among the black community in the late 50's was less than 20% and is now in excess of 75%?

Can you explain why the vast majority of black families in the late 50's included a father, but today less than 30% of black familes have a father present?

Can you explain why the black male unemployement rate in my region is in excess of 12% while we have a troubling influx of illegal hispanics all employed immediately upon arrival? And, by the way, these hispanics are NOT just making minimum wage; they have worked their way up into skilled trades with significant incomes.

There is something very wrong in the black urban culture and the statistics do not lie. The black family was in much better shape in ther 50's before the war on poverty and the great civil rights movement - what has happened? Yes, we do need a serious debate on race and inner city urban culture, both black and white. But, we cannot have that debate when any white person, or black intellectual like Mr. Sowell, who asks indepth questions about blcak urban culture is called a racisit!

Old Programmer
I have more questions about the race problem (warning - run-on sentence likely).

If blacks won't listen to me (because I'm white), and they won't listen to Thomas Sowell or Condi Rice because they're "sellouts", and they WILL listen to Je$$e Jackson who is only interested in helping himself, how can things ever improve?

AZPhil
My Knighting ceremony was just fine. Both of them. I also enjoy the knighting of others.

AZPhil & Old Prgmr: It is, and has been

absolutely beyond me (as it is apparently beyond the likes of Dr. Sowell, and Larry Elder, and Judge Thomas, etc., etc.,) how or why anyone would choose to NOT take advantage of what this country DOES HAVE TO OFFER!!!!

As Larry Elder has said time and time and time again, "If you can't make in this country, then you can't make it."

And the fact that AT and other blacks have the hubris to call Dr. Sowell and Judge Thomas, and Condi Rice, and Larry Elder, etc., "sell outs" is a just outrageous.

I fail to understand exactly how they're sell outs, and no one has every explained it....



Anne
Another question: Let's say BHO becomes president, the most powerful man in the world. With the last possible barrier for blacks eliminated, does that once and for all end racism in America? I'm curious. If blacks don't have the "same opportunities", yet one becomes president, wouldn't that sort of nullify the whole "race is holding us back" argument?

Japanese Americans
There was an article in our Sunday paper about the University of Oregon giving honorary degrees to 20 Japanese students, and American citizens, who were removed from the university in 1942 and put in internment camps.

There is a picture of a smiling 85 year old woman happily accepting the degree that was denied her so many years ago. Her granddaughter said,"She is such a happy person I wouldn't expect that had happened to her."

Another man accepted a degree on behalf of his brother who, after being removed from the university and put in an internment camp, joined a Nisei group of the U.S. Army and was killed in the Phillipines in 1945. Now 83, the brother says he holds no resentment for the treatment his family received years ago. "People make mistakes" he said.

Japanese Americans
There was an article in our Sunday paper about the University of Oregon giving honorary degrees to 20 Japanese students, and American citizens, who were removed from the university in 1942 and put in internment camps.

There is a picture of a smiling 85 year old woman happily accepting the degree that was denied her so many years ago. Her granddaughter said,"She is such a happy person I wouldn't expect that had happened to her."

Another man accepted a degree on behalf of his brother who, after being removed from the university and put in an internment camp, joined a Nisei group of the U.S. Army and was killed in the Phillipines in 1945. Now 83, the brother says he holds no resentment for the treatment his family received years ago. "People make mistakes" he said.

AZ:Good question! But somehow I doubt it

The reason is this.

That argument has already gotten way beyond the point of diminishing return.

There isn't one single area... politics, law, business, entertainment, sport, education, and medicine, military, etc., that blacks have not made it to the top...

BUT, what it has taken is the same thing it's taken for anyone from any race or ethnicity... desire and education and hard work and dedication.

However, for whatever reason, the blacks who have chosen to be stuck simply look at these people as "sell outs" or worse.

The real irony is, however, if BHO does not get the dem nomination, or if he does and does not get elected, there is no question that it will be BLAMED on racism.







Anne
"There isn't one single area... politics, law, business, entertainment, sport, education, and medicine, military, etc., that blacks have not made it to the top..."

No, there IS still politics. Yes, the last two Secretaries of State have been black, but no VP or President yet.

"The real irony is, however, if BHO does not get the dem nomination, or if he does and does not get elected, there is no question that it will be BLAMED on racism."

Now as for this, you are 100% right.

My Letter to the Editor, a few years ago


The local newspaper published stories about people who lived through the 1930s Depression. They must have censored those stories, and withheld information about the people in those stories. These were all poor people who lived in the 1930's when the economy was really in bad shape, and yet they expected us to believe those poor people were law abiding and “goody, goody.”

Many people said they didn't have money for clothes to wear, but never mentioned how many people they had smashed in the head with a brick!

They said they had no money to buy food, but didn't tell how many people they had killed or injured in drive-by shootings!

Some even had the nerve to say they had married during those years, but forgot to mention how many illegitimate children they had!

Wasn't there anywhere they could have learned those skills? I'll grant you that unlike today's kids they didn't have the advantage of all the non-education courses taking up their school time, and they didn't have all the “how to” TV shows and movies, teaching murder, drugs, sexual abuse etc.

Some of them must have been delinquents, after all they were poor!

Unscrupulous liberals will tell you that if you are poor, you are a criminal. Or maybe it's the other way around - if you are a criminal, you must be poor.

The 1930's, with all its adversity and turbulence, sure did produce a prestigious contingent of citizens, (well maybe some of us are only respectable)!



So true . . . so sad!
“Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain.”

That’s not funny. I have used the same rationale to come to vote for every Republican except Reagan and Goldwater.

AZPhil writes: "No, there IS still

politics. Yes, the last two Secretaries of State have been black, but no VP or President yet."

You have a point, but again I believe that it's academic, and of no consequence....

Example. My son has always felt as though he was in his older sister's shadow academically. She has an IQ of 180. My son, on the other hand has an IQ of 150 (+/-.)

What I had to make him understand was that the difference between an IQ of 150 and 180 DIDN'T matter. Both are very, very bright, and the difference was inconsequential.

Kind of like when it's hot outside... it doesn't matter if it's 99* or 105*. It's HOT!

Same thing, I believe, with your point.







RANDOM THOUGHTS

.....Are there really different races of people? ...when we say we belong to the human race, is there more than one? ...aren't we really just breeds or strains, differentiated by the dominance of certains genes but still all of the same species? ...

.....Aren't homo sapiens a species the same as canis familiaris is a species...and isn't the difference between a Beagle and a Terrier the same as the differences between a Caucasian and a Negroid .....just a matter of genetics and breeding? ...just wondering! .....COLOSSUS

What's up Doc?
You really should do a whole book on these types of truisms. I'm not totally with you on the "fear of Barack" but, then again, I don't have the doctorate either. What do I know?

When the candidate comes along

When an African American and/or woman comes along that has the executive skills to curb a bloated government, stream-line the regulatory environmet, cut back on the massive amount of government employees and hand functions back to the States, deal with Congress and the Senate, has the political capital and the public persona - then an African American and/or a woman will be elected.

Hopefully not before that time which is not apparently now. Cpmpetence not color or sex should be the formula thoug I know there is a strong desire to pick someone the lemmings will follow soley on race or sex.

Did you hear, the Federal government is HIRING 45,000 more employees. I thought they were going to REDUCE through attrition the amount of employees?


Anthony Thomas
Collateral damage = "injury inflicted on something other than an intended target."
Websters dictionary
-------------------------------------------------

Question? Could the destruction of the black community be a result of collateral damage from Liberalisim and liberal solutions?

old progrmr 5:11 PM post
Good Questions!!

I wonder if the debate on race should be held on the effects on blacks by Liberal programs.


Life is a hill, Get over it.
============================

Ungrateful Whiners,etc.
There are hundreds of people every day risking their lives to come to this country, illegally. Most for a job.Some for not so good reasons.

Many come to this country each day,legally.To see their faces when they acquire citizenship is very uplifting. In many cases,it has been a lifelong dream,realized.

Why then,do so many of our own citizens have such negative feelings for their country? Could they do better someplace else? I don't think so. What more do they want,that they don't have?

They should count their blessings that they are so fortunate. This country is not perfect,sure,but is there one better? Where?


Ungrateful Whiners
Each day hundreds risk their life to came to this country.Illegally.Some for honest work.Some for dishonest behavior.But they still come.

Hundreds come here daily ,legally.It is so uplifting to see the happiness on their faces when they finally acquire citizenship.For some, it is the answer to prayers and has been a lifelong dream.

Why do so many of our own citizens seem to dislike or even hate this country? Could they do better elsewhere? Have they tried it? If so,where? I would be interested to know.

They should count their blessings every day that they are so fortunate. Instead they complain. It takes a lot of patience to refrain from telling them,if they find a better deal than they have; take it. There are many who would love to trade places with you.

Ungrateful Whiners
Sorry for the double post.Posting was slow and I rewrote it.Dummy.

Employers in America
Top Five Employers in United States of America
-------------------------------------------------
1) US government 1,800,000 excludes Military.
2) Walmart 1,800,000
3) United States Postal Sevice 678,782
4) McDonalds 447,000
5) United Parcel Service 407,000
-------------------------------------------------


Life si a hill, get over it.

Ignorant Americans
That what is wrong with Americans. President Jefferson once said if the people had the facts then they will make the right decision. Ignorance is a plague.

Obama is a fraud, liar,
and racist himself. As a president, he would be a cheat, spendthrift, and demagogue.

Maybe the media will eventually catch up to his emporer's new clothes act or maybe they are so corrupted by PC'ness that they can never do their 4th estate work on Obama.

They've certainly been able to turn on Hillary, when given the chance of promoting someone else.

Sowell should be published on the front page of the NYSlimes--then every tv show would open their "news" with his "random thoughts" on a daily basis.

Lisa

"When an African American and/or woman comes along that has the executive skills to curb a bloated government, stream-line the regulatory environmet, cut back on the massive amount of government employees and hand functions back to the States, deal with Congress and the Senate, has the political capital and the public persona"

Lisa take a look at the mess in Iraq, and the economy and tell me that George Bush has those skills that you speak of. Did he curb the size of government? Is he building roads and schools in Iraq and providing a jobs program for Iraqis?? I was surprized to hear David Petrais say today that the American tax payer is paying the salaries of the Iraqis army. Do you support that as a conservative? What has he proposed to improve the education system for American children? Face it George W has been a disaster for this country but I guess he had the "public persona" that you were looking for.

OBAMA SPEEC H CRITIQUE
Doctor Sowell will know, I live in Sugar Hill one of the loveliest quietest parts of Manhattan where no one is Clinton-rich but the all the school aged children are fed, well dressed and off to school in the morning.

I read Barack Obama's Philadelphia "Speech" with intent on finding essence and substantive depth in this man. The 5,000 words consisted of approximately 35 paragraphs.

What I surmised from his words was: "gone to some of the best schools in America" from which instead of gratitude and transcending narrow racial thinking and attitudes Barack Obama proceeded to discuss color, color, race, muddle, more excuses, thick Biblical analogy, closed black racism, racial prejudice, past-present personality lock, racial accusations towards non-blacks, more muddled economic theory, mushiness, static societal attitudes and opinions, added racism, rage and sympathy suck demagoguery.

This may have been the speech that made Chris Matthews pee in his pants, but I found nothing Churchillian, Lincolnesque, or inspiring as from Martin Luther King.

I concede, I did not cross the Bridge at Selma; ergo, my sins of omission are there but to construe and thus call me a "racist" in fact or form is gross injustice which I stand in complete opposition and rejection.

Mr. Obama, I do not measure you by the color of your skin but I do consider your words to be measurement of your thoughts.

Lee Doesn't Like the Topic Anymore
"take a look at the mess in Iraq, and the economy and tell me that George Bush has those skills that you speak of."

Typical liberal tactic. Start losing the argument, change the subject.

NEWSFLASH:
Bush, the guy you love to hate, AIN'T GOING TO BE AROUND next January.

And, just so's you know, most conservatives aren't too happy about him either. If you'd been around for a while, you'd have seen reams of postings kvetching about the guy. It's just that we figure he was better than the Democrat alternatives.

It's time to pick a new guy.

In my view, none of the three top contenders are "good enough". So again we'll have to hold our nose and vote against someone we dislike more than we like the other guy.

But if you want to talk about "disaster", thy name surely must be "Barily". Or is it "Hilarack?" I keep getting those two confused. What's the difference between them again?

Let's see ... one is so liberal as to be almost pure Marxist, and the other ... the other is almost pure Marxist from being so liberal ... ?

Anthony Thomas -- Problem with Elder
"That’s my problem it’s always the black community and what the black community does wrong. He doesn’t examine the problems of blacks from a comprehensive prospective."

What you mean is, he doesn't Blame Whitey.

You want him to Blame Whitey. Everybody who doesn't Blame Whitey is either a racist or a sell-out.

Every time the topic gets anywhere near race, you come on and kvetch about how nobody is Blaming Whitey, even in the instances where you admit that all the data in the column is substantively correct.

And, for others reading this, YES, Anthony Thomas has been known to admit that the columnist was substantively correct. But his big complaint remained (and don't make me look it up to prove it) was that Whitey wasn't Blamed enough.

You don't mind the occasional diatribe against 70% out-of-wedlock births and higher crime rates. You don't mind it when people complain about kids without fathers and high drop-out rates.

You will agree with anyone who "acknowledges" that there are "problems" that "only blacks can solve."

You just want it all couched inside the rhetoric of Blaming Whitey.




"Racism is no longer a barrier for blacks based on his writings and commentary."

That's based on actual fact. As has been oft-repeated, racism in 21st century America is hardly a speed-bump, let alone a "barrier."

I even asked you once what "barriers" racism placed in front of you, personally. The worst you could come up with was being "watched" by a suspicious clerk in a store.

Good article...but
When will sombody write an UPPER!
One that will cheer you up!?
Maybe it's the pills Iam taking..somebody tell me "elvis, it's the pills you are taking its just your pills..your gonna wake up and it will be real cheery!"
Give me some good news..!!!
elvis

Elvis -- Good News
-- as of this writing, the Lakers are behind by 11 points, which is good news for the Trailblazers --

Howzat?

Obama Is A Smoother Jerry Wright
"An eel is like sandpaper compared to you" yes indeed Dr. Sowell he is one of the smoothest Presidential candidate's we've had in a while, he's so smooth that his wife Michelle is, finally, after all these years, proud to be an American, so you can imagine if she becomes first lady-I shudder to think what she'll say next.
Let's jump ahead shall we to January 2009 the Barack Obama swearing-in ceremony Pastor Jerry Wright to perform the invocation Gaddafi and Farakhan sitting together in the audience, and as the national anthem fades out, I here static and wake up startled and realised I fell asleep in front of the TV again.

Chicken soup...
--
...for the libertarian soul.


Gotta collect these "Random Thoughts," Dr. Sowell.

--

now this is a true brother!

makes note of rachel ray, only a brother or a latino would take notice of that fine big ole booty! the brother turned dem eyes to those hips and nates! aight!

unca alby...thanks!
Maybe you know Iam from goofyfornia...and I dont like the lakers anymore...sooo it's good news for me, thanks!I quit liking them after Kareem,
but my fever days were when jerry west,elgin baylor,etc.! I dont even like the dodgers anymore
and I follwed them in brooklyn..OKAY NOW YOU KNOW IAM PRE-HISTORIC!
I can't stand the colorado rapist(koby)!
Iam a PISTON because my son likes them...and he's 6'5" and weighs 250 lbs. at least..gulp.. so
I like 'em to..heh heh heh.
elvis

Lee

Focus Lee, I was not talking about Bush. And yes as a conservative I am looking in a candidate with competence, follow through, political capital and a guy or gal that most can work with.

The last consideration is race or gender which was what I was addressing. I'm not giving anyone a pass just because they are white, black, a man or a woman.

Religion--foundational for good or evil
Dr. Sowell is always right on and should be our Republican candidate for POTUS this year if we had any brains.

A random thought of my own............

If the Christian church had not apostatised, we would not have Obama, Clinton or McCain. At least we would not have them in their present form. What a thought.

Obama is a product of a false, pseudo Christian religion promoted by his apostate pastor of 20 years. How could he be other than he is coming from that abysmal background?

Clinton is a product of the influence of liberal Methodism during part of her formative years. At one time, she was conservative. Now, oy...not so much.

McCain is a long time Episcopalian, and most of us know what a thoroughly confused lot of gown wearing goofies they are (one of my favorite relatives is an Episcopalian priest). Knowing his religious background, it does not surprise me that McCain thinks like a man with advanced dimentia.

Tell me a man's religious views and I can tell you quite a lot about his character and thought processes on that basis alone.

Finally, had the "church" not sold out to Satan long ago, lock, stock and barrel, this world would be an entirely different kind of place in so many vitally important ways.

The Fight between Good and Evil

ColinCody, Your conclusion fell short though everything up to that point I'd agree with. We overlook their beliefs at our own peril.

I don't believe the church has "sold out" to Satan. I do however think that the battle between good and evil rages on today in small and large ways and on a personal and institutional level.

re: Lee
quote: "My problem with Sowell and others like him is that he has convinced whites that the only acceptable blacks are those that think like him."

I've never heard Dr. Sowell say any such thing, but in your ad hominem attacks on him, such as insulting him as an "Uncle Tom" without providing intellectual reasons rebutting his various ideas, you seem to suggest that the only "acceptable blacks" are ones that think like *you*. That's why I asked you to elucidate your position more clearly rather than just throwing invective.

quote: "You love Sowell because he is shockingly anti black as many of you are."

I'm not anti-black at all, but I'm "anti" *anyone* - white, black, Hispanic, etc. - who tries to infringe upon my liberty. Race-baiters are only one group that attempts to do so, and only one group of anti-liberty activists towards which I direct my scorn.

re: Anthony Thomas
You seem to suggest that because "black conservatives" have come to believe certain of the same tenets of conservative orthodoxy as "white conservatives" (or presumably, conservatives of any ethnic distinction), that somehow they aren't thinking for themselves. You also seem to intermingle the use of "GOP" and "conservative", which any look at the utter lack of spending restraint and entitlement reform of the current administration would show to be untrue (unfortunately).

Someone like Lee Elder titles his book "Stupid Black Men" because he, as a black man himself, is trying to reach people within his own group and prevent them from making certain mistakes. Do white men have children out of wedlock? Certainly, and the facts show that doing so increases his chances of ending up in poverty as well; unfortunately, a young black man is statistically more likely to do so, for whatever reason, and Elder is speaking to him specifically (although the message is no less true for a white , Hispanic, Asian, etc.).

If you're going to claim that Drs. Sowell, Williams, et. al. "manipulate[] conomic and statistical data", then I suggest you find *specific* examples. Sorry, the ad hominem attacks do not qualify as intellectual debate.