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Thursday, June 12, 2008
Terry Jeffrey :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Threat to the Car
by Terry Jeffrey
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Recent evidence that automobile use is declining in America and that some Americans are making significant -- and in some cases not readily reversible -- changes in their lives because of escalating gas prices should be worrisome signs for those who love liberty.

No device is more in keeping with the American spirit than the automobile. Privately owned cars and trucks allow us to go where we want, when want. They are freedom machines.

Still, some liberals would like to use government to force Americans out of their cars.

They believe in socialized transportation, not free-market transportation.

In a free-market transportation system, a person purchases his own vehicle with his own money, buys his own gas with his own money and can drive his vehicle anywhere there is a road -- and, if he has the right kind of vehicle, some places where there are no roads.

Admittedly, the roads generally are constructed by government, albeit with funds extracted from the earnings and gasoline purchases of drivers.

In a socialist transportation system, the government takes the taxpayers' money and purchases vehicles -- often buses or trains -- for itself or a government-funded agency. Where and when these vehicles go is determined by the government.

In a free-market transportation system, a person travels solely in the company of people with whom he has freely chosen to travel. In a socialist transportation system, a person may be compelled to travel in the company of people he does not know and who could even be a danger to him.

I have no doubt that most Americans who love the freedom of movement they derive from owning and operating a car or truck have recognized efforts by various levels of government to induce them to stop, or limit, their driving and cajole or compel them to leave the free-market transportation system and submit to the socialist transportation system.

Methods governments can use to do this include placing constraints on parking availability, forbidding taxpayers from using certain lanes of the highway (or even certain highways) unless they agree to carpool or ride a bus, and imposing excessive gas taxes or road tolls and using the excess revenue to subsidize money-losing public transit.

Artificially suppressing the oil supply is the most significant method government is using today to move people from a free market transportation system into a socialized transportation system.

In May, the Department of Interior estimated that U.S. territory contains about 139 billion barrels of undiscovered oil resources, much of it (85.9 billion barrels) off our coasts on the Outer Continental Shelf. Development of most of this oil is either forbidden or effectively prevented by federal laws and regulations.

Also in May, when the Federal Highway Administration released its monthly report on "Traffic Volume Trends," it revealed that Americans had driven 4.3 percent fewer miles in March 2008 than they had in March 2007. This was the fifth month in a row that Americans had driven fewer miles than they had in the same month the previous year.

"The March 2008 data," Federal Highway Administration spokesman Doug Hecox told me, "represent the sharpest single-month drop in vehicle miles of travel in the 66-year history that such data have been collected."

Are we at the beginning of a fundamental shift in the way Americans use cars? The lead article in Tuesday's Washington Post suggested this might be so. It was headlined, "Fuel Prices Challenge Cars' Reign," and relied partly on a survey of 43,000 American drivers released on June 9 by The NPD Group, which does market research for private industries.

The NPD survey showed that some Americans have indeed made changes in their lives because of historically high inflation-adjusted gasoline prices. According to a statement released by the company, 12 percent said they have cancelled a vacation because of the gas prices; 12 percent have carpooled; 8 percent have taken public transportation; 8 percent have vacationed closer to home; 6 percent have purchased a more fuel efficient vehicle, 6 percent have worked from home; 6 percent have worked closer to home; 4 percent have worked less; 3 percent have sold a less-fuel-efficient vehicle; 2 percent have moved closer to where they work; and 1 percent have purchased an electric or hybrid vehicle.

Hopefully, the 8 percent who have taken to socialized transportation represents a trend that can be reversed.

We should drill our own oil -- now. And, when the supply naturally diminishes to where prices drive the market elsewhere, American entrepreneurs must create another fuel whose production the government cannot readily curtail, and that keeps Americans driving where they want to, when they want to, in privately owned cars.

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About The Author

Terence P. Jeffrey is the editor-in-chief of CNSNews

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I'm not giving up my car!
The Leftie power grabbers in Los Angeles are getting really excited.

For the last few decades, the Lefties have been trying to force Los Angelenos out of our beloved cars and onto public transportation.

The Marxist mayor, Antonio Villaraigosa (formerly of the ACLU, who graduated from The People's Law School- I kid you not) has been trying to force a subway down the Wilshire corridor, so his gang member and illegal alien friends can ride to the beach for free.

But apart from the EARTHQUAKES here, there is a huge problem with METHANE GAS under the streets of L.A., which is likely to explode, or at the very least, fill the subway tunnels.

Even worse are the thugs and weirdos that frequent public transportation. Any creep with an automatic weapon or a bomb can hop on a bus, a train or a subway car, and assault the passangers.

Yes, I love my car.

If you want to hop on public transportation with a horde of the great unwashed, be my guest, but I am alergic to kooties!

You can have my car
when you pry my cold, dead butt out of it.


I know - rim shot

chris
LOL!!

Good one.

Please Go Green!
Please conserve energy and oil.
Please sell your car and take the bus or train or subway whenever you can.
We are counting on you to make the sacrifice.
Please do this to save the earth or whatever altruistic reason you have.
Do it so we, who understand freedom and self reliance will have more.
Hey, maybe in this case socialism can work!
You give it up so I can have it.

BAMAdoxx
Good point. These elistist jerks want us to live just like the Amish. Don't know if any of these folks live in your area, but there are many close to where I do. From a personal, moral, ethical atandpoint, there are none better, however, they do not own automobiles, use electricity, or even in most cases have indoor plumbing. The Greenies want us to live that lifestyle so they can enjoy private jets, stretch limos and long hot showers. To them I say "Lead by example", but am not holding my breath waiting for more than 1 or 2 to actually do so.

to tahssard, in response to 2:03
No one is trying to take away your "liberty of wanting to live this way". I just think if you want to enjoy public transportation, you should pay the real cost of it, instead of having the government confiscate my money to subsidise your quaint little humming and whizzing city life.

This incerdibly 100% backwards person prefers to live in the exurbs and telecommute when I don't have to be at a customer site. But when I do have to go on site, I need a car. You liberals are trying to make it so I can't live that way, even though I'm not harming you or using government subsidies to do so.

For what it's worth, when I lived in midtown Atlanta, I had no problem riding MARTA to downtown or the airport - being around the public didn't bother me a bit. The main problem is it didn't go most of the places I wanted to be, and it can't possibly be cost effective for it to do so.


BTW, when has anyone ever argued for restricting science education?

Sheeple, appratchiks, and gas caps
Another article attacking the watermelons love affair with mass transit. The watermelons love European style mass transit and hate cars. They love ALL things socialist and communist and this is one of those things. European mass transit appears to work for several reasons:

1. Due to the effects of socialism/communism most people are mired in poverty and can not afford a car, especially with the outrageous taxes on gas.
2. Most European countries are smaller than the average U.S. State, so traveling within your own country is much easier due to the shorter distance traveled.
3. Europeans do not have a history of freedom and independence so they are more willing to be herded like cattle.

As to what the future holds for the U.S. it depends on when or if the sheeple wake up. If they continue to vote in Commiecrats and RINOs we will have European style socialism and mass transit.

We will also have the European style apparatchiks driving their gas hogs by the slow buses in the dedicated “apparatchik lane” while laughing at the “sweaty peons” locked in a crowded and smelly bus with the teenage punk playing loud noises in a punk box and picking his nose with a ring in it.

So the sheeple will not have to worry about a car and insurance or high gas prices. They will be mired in poverty and will not be able to afford a 15 year old Vega with worn tires and a missing gas cap.

For those of us who cannot drive
All this blabber about how free you are with a car has another side to it.

There are many good natural road courses and indeed, many cities where only people who drive can go. And do NOT tell me that I can hitch a ride with somebody who drives. Read your own posts bragging about not having to associate with the likes of me, and find your answer there. I have had people make ugly and insulting comments about me when I mention that I cannot attend an event or a race because of my inability to drive -- usually *Why dont you learn?* kind of remarks, until I tell them I am blind in one eye and thus CANNOT drive, not DO NOT WISH TO DRIVE. People with cars automatically assume that everybody God loves can drive and the rest of us can go to Hades.

As I am a great racing fan and work in motorsports, I am all for saving the car and everybodys right to drive. Nevertheless,for those of us whom God has not blessed with the ability to drive, spare a though that is not SOCIALIST SHEEPLE and be assured that all we want in life is a way to get where we want to go. Not everybody who rides a bus, subway, streetcar or train is a socialist criminal with designs on your freedom. Some of us just cannot drive.

Here in Ohio
Our resident socialist leader and Che Guevara admirer, Columbus mayor Michael Coleman, is determined to ram through a plan for a new streetcar system down the center of Broad Street in the capital. When asked why the existing (brand-new and expensive) buses aren't good enough for the job, he launches into a convoluted "explanation" of how the streetcar system will be the prototype for a "light rail" system linking Cleveland, Columbus, and Cincinnati. This has long been a wet-dream of pols in the capital, with which they could squire deep-pocket contributors back and forth to Reds and Browns games- at taxpayers' expense.

The "streetcars" turn out to be electric-powered versions of the city buses- which Coleman & Co. still believe can be "enhanced" into a "light rail" intercity system.

Obviously, scientific or engineering knowledge is not required to be a "mass-transit" advocate in this country today.

Oh, and of course, all mass-transit systems must have "security" cameras- I suspect mainly to make sure that when you're riding same, you're reading something "improving". Like "Mother Jones" or the New York Times.

If they catch you reading "The Weekly Standard" or the New York Post, there WILL be somebody with a government ID waiting for you at your stop- to explain to you why your apostasy is unacceptable.

cheers

eon

Excellent article.
Jeffrey's article ought to be required reading for big-government liberals, for those whose answer to every problem is more government intervention in the lives of Americans.

Now, who embodies this big-government-knows-best mindset?

Why Fox News very own "No Spin" pontificator Bill O'Reilly himself.

Right now
I'm listening to WTVN Radio (610 AM) out of Columbus, and they are talking to Harvey Wasserman from Greenpeace. His talking points are;

1. No drilling in ANWR, or anywhere else, and no new refineries either. Fossil fuels are "last century's technology", and we need to eliminate them NOW. (He also used the "The oil in ANWR isn't worth going after" argument.)

2. No nuclear power, under any circumstances- too dangerous, and won't produce enough energy to make a difference, anyway. (AFAIK, he does not have a degree in Nuclear Engineering.)

3. Wind and Sun are the only alternatives which can save us- and Holy Mother Gaia. Nothing else can ever work, or should be allowed. (So forget about hydroelectric, too.)

By the way, he claims he "commutes" by bicycle. This is reassuring to me- I'd hate to think that anyone as ignorant, fanatical, and mind-bogglingly stupid as he apparently is was in control of anything which might hurt something else when he rams it while his head is in the clouds.

Or firmly up his fundament.

cheers

eon

Abuse and use;
Mass transit systems are important modes of transportation. There are many people that need such systems.

If God had wanted you to live in the city and drive, you would have been born with a parking space. I' heard that somewhere before.

Seriously; the current wave of price increases related to oil price increases should give us cause. Cause to change our life styles. We have the wherewithal to make the changes. Smaller more fuel efficient vehicles. Why wait another 60 years for the oil to run low. Lets do it now. Bring back the grocery store in the small communities. Stop having to drive 50 miles round trip to shop. I live in the midwest. The small towns have nearly dried up, by the way.

We do not need our "government" to control or make these changes. The free market can do that. Will it cost? You bet it will, it's costing us now. It's still the best way. Who will a "windfall tax" help? Politicians thats who. Oil companies are in the business of providing fuel. With less oil to develope they will develope and discover other means of fuel/energy.

All our politicians can provide is more hot air. Yet the hot air they provide will not lift a balloon.
Have a great day.

tahssard,
You may be in Georgia now, but I can see by the extraneous "u" you put in "favor" that you grew up a country with socialist leanings, whereas here we are not in favor of people of the government, by the government, and for the government, but rather vice versa.

tahssard
Say what?
Let me get this straight. Its all right for new urbanists to propose that its a good thing for me to ride to work and the grocery store and the barber shop and the ball game cheek by jowl whith folks that I feel uncomfortable around, but its not all right for me to point out that I feel uncomfortable sitting across the aisle in a New York subway car from a bearded homeless person who is talking to the air (sans blue tooth) complaing that the NY Yankees lost the to Red Sox, and from whom every other person in the car is recoiling in distaste. (This includes BTW the hispanic couple and the african american two seats down).


Harvey Wasserman - typical watermellon
If I am not mistaken the communist Harvey Wasserman lives in Ohio and he actually claims to commute via bicycle? Hahahahaha, I suppose that if he gets his way the snow plows in OH will be replaced by pedi-cab plows.

From his bio I see that he has opposed all forms of energy other than wind and solar. He is a total fruitcake of the type that pulls up paving stones and throws them at everything. If we were to follow his recommendations to the letter within a year we would be back in chaos and anarchy. Within another year (provided the edicts could still be enforced) we would be headed for the Stone Age.

The U.S. would become the prime example of those ridiculous “post apocalypse” movies like Mad Max and the Thunder Thighs. That is if we didn’t get invaded and conquered by the Communist Chinese or the Radical Islamacists who have no intent on adhering to this liberal PC cr*p.

Hey all of you watermelons; why are you not out in the street marching and protesting the Chinese drilling of OUR coast?

tahssard
"I find it horrifying that people feel no shame in saying their problem with public transport is having to be in contact with other people."

No one said that. They said they didn't want to be in contact with certain sorts of people.

By the way, I spent years taking mass transit in Minneapolis. I just got sick and tired of waiting in -20 degree weather for buses that were running late. Never again.

Also, for mass transit to work well, there needs to be a certain degree of population density. But for that to happen, those of us who favor the car will be stuck living near people we don't want to live near. For me, it's the people who insist on playing their music as loud as possible that I hate.

Before pushing mass transit, maybe you should be pushing a return to manners first.

Stop saving!!
Geese, the lefty commie b$$%strds are not traveling as much. The rotten commies. Just think. If we redueced our consumption of gas by about 15% then we could rely on US refineries to supply it from home.

Tha's a stupid idea. Drive more, invade more and wipe out the liberals.

Fight back
If you think our current national energy policy is as insane as I do, forward the link to others and sign Newt's petition at:

http://www.americansolutions.com/actioncenter/petitions/Def ault.aspx?Guid=54ec6e43-75a8-445b-aa7b-346a1e096659


tahssard
You are so compassionate! So sensitive. So intelligent! I just wish that I could be like you. By the way, your writing is formulaic, utterly predictable,uninspired.

As AudiR10 has oft stated
Toronto touts much its TTC, the prime example of such socialist thinking. To no surprise (especially to Western Canadians), TTC is known for breakdowns, delays, ...--and is oft facetiously named "Take The Car"!

And it is noticeable that in Canada, the high price of fuel does NOT deter private car ownership--due to the very issue referenced by Jeffrey, mobility/freedom.

Union County, SD recently gave approval for a refinery--which will process Tarsands Oil, a benefit to both countries (Canada gains by selling oil to US; US gains with secure, friendly energy source on border--unlike hostile Mexico on the other border--plus somewhat less so with Canadian imports of US-produced goods). Hats off to Union County--may others follow suit!

Bottom line
Individual travel by car is expensive. That TV ad remarks that a train moves 1 ton of payload 400 and some odd miles on a gallon of diesel. With a 200 pound driver, that is the equivalent of 4000 mpg. Mass transportation is one of the few efficiencies that makes Euro-socialism possible at their quality of life. It also reduces freedom, much like putting a tiger in a cage with regular meals increases his leisure and life span while reducing his freedom. What we are overdue for is transport that provides the best of mass transport and individual choice. The techology is availble to do this, and it won't be long before it is seen.

LOL
Stupidest article ever.
No-one is trying to take our cars away.
How absurd it is to argue against government funding of public transportation, when the government funds highways for out POVs.

The Price of Liberty
Escalating as prices should be worrisome to those who LOVE LIBERTY??? The petroleum fueled liberty we've traditionally enjoyed has exacted a terrible price. We're now facing a "balloon note" we thought we'd never have to pay. We've squandered America's reserves of petroleum with a cavalier "drive now pay later" attitude. The entire world is coping with a petroleum drought and ruinous prices that have skewed every facet of the economy. Sure we could drill more...but the "low hanging fruit" [500 BPD from 600 foot wells] is gone forever. Wells in the Outer Continental Shelf may be five miles deep and cost tens of millions for a single exploratory well. The public good demands expanded rail [passenger-freight] transportation and conservation [which includes restrictions on the private passenger automobile].

Jim-Too

The Illusion of Freedom
The only truly freemarket transportation system our country has ever known was our streetcar systems. Road construction, maintenance, and policing require money from general funds. Gas taxes don't even come close to covering their costs. Jeffrey left out a lot of things on his freemarket auto/road system. In a free market system, oil companies would join to send their own aircraft carriers and Humvees to the Persian Gulf when trouble arises (currently at the cost of $12 billion/mo.) By the same token, those driving the most would be the first to send their sons and daughters to fight the wars. There would also be no such thing as free parking, anywhere.

Those "socialist" Europeans don't look to our transportation system with envy but usually think we're crazy, as do many Americans who visit Europe.

Commander45ACP:
If you really don't think those nut cases want to take your car away, just ask them. Isk algore and his ilk if you should own (and drive) a car or if you should depend on government transportation.

Commander is right
This is a stupid article and the posters are stupid people. I bike to work because I work in a sedentary job. I am 60 and have biked all my life. I like to drive my BMW, but I like to ride my bike. If you don't have a bike, you should get one. IMHO. Stupid article.

Red Barchetta
My uncle has a country place, that no one knows about
He says it used to be a farm, before the motor law
And on sundays I elude the eyes and hop the turbine freight
To far outside the wire, where my white-haired uncle waits.

Jump to the ground
As the turbo slows to cross the borderline
Run like the wind,
As excitement shivers up and down my spine
Down in his barn
My uncle preserved for me, an old machine ---
For fifty-odd years
To keep it as new has been his dearest dream

I strip away the old debris, that hides a shining car
A brilliant red barchetta, from a better, vanished time
I fire up the willing engine, responding with a roar
Tires spitting gravel, I commit my weekly crime...

Wind in my hair ---
Shifting and drifting ---
Mechanical music ---
Adrenalin surge ---

Well-weathered leather
Hot metal and oil
The scented country air
Sunlight on chrome
The blur of the landscape
Every nerve aware

Suddenly, ahead of me, across the mountainside
A gleaming alloy air-car shoots towards me, two lanes wide
I spin around with shrieking tires, to run the deadly race
Go screaming through the valley as another joins the chase

Drive like the wind
Straining the limits of machine and man
Laughing out loud
With fear and hope, Ive got a desperate plan

At the one-lane bridge
I leave the giants stranded
At the riverside
Race back to the farm
To dream with my uncle
At the fireside...
----------------
By Neil Peart

more binary brains
Yes Stan, a liberal will tell you that public transporation is better for pleasant communities, public health, the environment, and national security. That's a far cry from someone taking your car away.

Whose the "nut case"?

The gubbermint
wants us to all use buses, trains, subways...so we'll make better concentrated targets

No change for me
I looked into taking the train/buses when we lived in Los Angeles. It was significantly more expensive in both time and money and took away my freedom to make my own schedule. And as many have mentioned, some of the unwashed masses that rode on the busses made it unpleasant and a safety issue. I'll stick with my car.

amusing article


This is a fine article for musing on. Anything that challenges us to think deeply has value; we don't get enough of them.

I'm fortunate to have visited several big cities as well as their outskirts, in Europe. Also two fine cities in Australia; though not outside in what's called the "bush".

Rome's traffic is unbelievable. Ever see a throng of Vespas & motorcycles? Five hundred of scooters, pouring it on? Scares the SH^T out of you, for sure. Their buses are great, and the Metro too. Very CHEAP transport, I loved it! But how would one live in a "bedroom community" several miles out?

London is terrific; good underground, as in Paris too. England is awesome for railways, suburbs only minutes away; you can buy 24 hour passes, hop on & off all day; "Mind the gap!" Haha!

Spain is traffic-jammed in the cities; but has good highways. There the gasoline was 4.90 a gallon (peseta equivalent then) as far back as 1997; with tollroads of excellent quality. Only tourists could afford cars at those rates. How much are they TODAY ! In the hinterlands you still have donkey-carts.

Returning to the US it's not hard to see our car travel's VERY wasteful. Why not admit it? We can't keep it up forever; no matter HOW much we Drill Now, Drill Here, Pay less-- We'll have to pay more! If not now; later.

Only in Muslim countries is there hope; says Amadinejad. There the magic carpet industry is growing in leaps and bounds. Praise Allah!



what is really scary

I see as REALLY alarming over time about this

--Is airline ticket prices. What's next year's seat on a jet airliner going to cost? It's numbing to consider what those prices are going to do to the airlines, and overall tourism.

The days of cheap air travel are coming to an end; and they may affect airplane construction itself. Forget your nice car, how many JOBS is this going to cost in a few years?

What a Loon
So due to purely market forces we see a whole 4% decline in people driving.

And this logically leads Jeffrey to conclude the government is going to take away his car?

What a loon.

Post 20
For your TTC amusement, today we had a ticket collector (woman of foreign extraction) busted for selling counterfeit tickets over the past 2 years. Yesterday two streetcars ran into each other and the little information that has leaked out so far indicates that one of them paid no attention to the need to see if the switch is in the right place before charging on.

Last week we had a drunken bus driver (foreign) who blew 3x the legal limit on the breathalyzer.

Yep, take public transit for an adventure evry day!

Who is "tahssard"???
I came late to this discussion. I see a lot of replies to "tahssard."

But I don't see any posts from any such person. To whom are you replying? Was his post deleted for being offensive or something?

for Cam
Cam writes: "Those 'socialist' Europeans don't look to our transportation system with envy but usually think we're crazy, as do many Americans who visit Europe."

Europe is NOT a "country" or "nation" like the United States. Europe is a continent.

If you travel 2,000 miles in any direction in any European country, you've left the country.

In the United States, you can travel 2,000 miles by car and still be inside the United States.

A nation's transportation system has to unify the entire nation. Europe's nations aren't even as big as Texas.

Their solution (rail) wouldn't work in America. It would take over two days for a passenger train to travel from New York to Los Angeles. That would kill American business.

Frightened Suburbanites
I spent my teen years in New York City, where everyone with any sense (including Mayor Bloomberg) rides the subway. I rode the subway at all hours--any New Yorker knows how to stare down a panhandler or other undesireable. I still use trains and subways when I go in to New York. I love my Cadillac, but it is just not fun to drive in the hellish traffic. My Cessna is also fun, but not ideal in New York airspace. There is no one right transit mode for all trips. Rather than subsidizing mass transit more, let's subsidize roads less--including having them pay real estate tax like railroad companies. Then just pay for use via gas tax, rail fares, etc.

Oh, I get it
So that's why everybody in America has their own private plane too right? That's how millions of people are able to fly around the country every year.
No wait, hang on, I don't have my own plane, nor does anybody I know.

Ah, so it must be that the government controls the planes right, it is socialized plane travel.

mmm, no, wait a minute, that's not right either.

Maybe the article is talking nonsense and it's not a choice between private car ownership or government run public transport.
What about private companies running a bus service?

Article is dumb and short sighted.

steve L; remember--
The 2,000 trip you mention is just as slow by car or motor transport as any train.

Air freight is going to cost vastly more; as well as passenger flights. America will HAVE to rely more on buses and trains for cross-country. People will be forced to go that way; prices are never coming down to the previous levels we've seen all our lives. Right now, a cross-country ride in your car is prohibitively priced. Picture the next five years.

Also; drilling now and in our own country isn't about to give us cheaper gas. It might drop the price some; but only if actual demand drops. Which it can't; it always RISES.

.

Jersey48
I find it hilarious that you refer to this as “subsidizing” roads vs mass transit. Perhaps you should do some research to the origins of roads and road taxes.

The building of “postal” roads is one of the few federal government functions actually authorized by the Constitution. Be that as it may, the feds financed original roads via many different things like lotteries and excise taxes, but primarily through tolls. Most roads however were local roads financed in the same manner. In some cases the roads were actually built by private companies who charged a toll. Most real transportation was done by train though, which was private.

This stayed pretty much the same up until the advent of the automobile. The automobile needed even better roads than the buggy. These roads were primarily local roads financed locally in the same manner as the old roads except that a new source of funding was needed due to the higher costs. This funding was provided by a tax on gasoline and the auto itself via the “tag”. The general taxpayer did not “subsidize” the roads. They were paid for by the people using them.

The latest change was the mass transit fiasco promulgated by the Commiecrats during the Clinton years. A law was passed that stated 20% of ALL gas taxes had to be diverted to mass transit. Thus you had drivers in Pumpkin Corner, AK financing the bus system in Newark, NJ. That my friend is really what is meant by subsidizing.

once again TH goes to an extreme
Only on Townhall is riding public transportation considered a bad thing. I don't understand this thinking. I also don't understand the thinking that we must choose between cars and public transportation with no option of using both. Perhaps there are environmentalists that want to eliminate cars completely and based on this column there are conservatives that want only cars, but most rational people leave the option open for both depending on cost, convenience, environmental impact, time, etc. As for me, I either ride my bike (8 miles each way...great exercise!) or take the train to work (I wish it was a little faster, more extensive, and that people didn't use their cellphones but I'm ok riding a train with other people). I also have a car that I use a few times a week at most for errands, visiting family, etc. My car is relatively fuel efficient and I fill the tank up usually once a month. If this causes people to think I'm an evil freedom-hating socialist, so be it.

SteveL
"Europe is NOT a "country" or "nation" like the United States. Europe is a continent."

Did I say Europe was a country?

"A nation's transportation system has to unify the entire nation. Europe's nations aren't even as big as Texas."

The context of this thread is cars vs. public transportation. You seem to be invoking a public transportation vs. air travel argument. Europe's numerous high speed rail systems far out-compete auto travel in speed and convenience. More extensive use of electrified rail would make fuel less expensive for the longer trips that can only reasonably be taken by plane.

Greater US oil output affect prices?
Coastal oil platforms have a reputation for not leaking and for promoting marine life, and some very nice coastal areas in California, such as along the Santa Barbara coast, already have them and they a not considered a liability by the locals, and look rather scenic at night.

But any extra oil drilled in the US would still go onto the global market, right? So this new oil will only make a small dent in global oil prices. Extra US produced oil would have to be reserved mainly for US consumption to affect the US market,
and would need to be produced by COMPETING US energy companies to achieve this desired result, i.e,
to saturate the US market.

One problem here is that it seems
the same people who rant about how we should increase US domestic oil output seem to be the same ones who also favor a free global market.





Want $10 gallon Gas?
Keep electing Democrats!

ANWR Exploration
House Republicans:91%Supported
House Democrats: 86% Opposed

Coal-to-Liquid
House Republicans: 97% Supported
House Democrats: 78% Opposed

Oil Shale Exploration
House Republicans: 90% Supported
House Democrats: 86% Opposed

Outer Continental Shelf (OCS) Exploration
House Republicans: 81% Supported
House Democrats: 83% Opposed

Refinery Increased Capacity
House Republicans: 97% Supported
House Democrats: 96% Opposed

what happened to tahssard's 2:03 post?
SteveL asked who tahssard is.

What happened to the post? It was not offensive, just stupid. Is there some reason it should never be seen again?

SteveL, as I recall tahssard was basically asking why we wanted to take her(?) light rail away from her - she prefers the soft whizzing and humming of rail to the sound of cars or something like that. She also said "shame on you all" for not wanting to ride the subway because of the other riff-raff that's sometimes on there. It went on for a while.

I think it's idiotic that the post is gone. How are we going to spot the idiots if the evidence is lost?

The mucky-mucks...
..are cheering and hoping that high fuel prices will keep the riff-raff off airliners. You know, the ones who rode Greyhound before airfares became cheap.

to chip, in response to 5:11 post
"... the same people who rant about how we should increase US domestic oil output seem to be the same ones who also favor a free global market."

"fungible":

Oil produced anywhere in the world effectively goes into the big pot labelled "supply", and oil consumed anywhere in the world is the demand.

if the U.S. attempted to separate its oil market from the world market - even if we were already producing 100% of our oil, it would not be beneficial to us.

Gasoline is a near necessity, so price has to rise drastically before many people choose to use less - it is inelastic. So when demand even slightly outpaces supply, prices shoot up.

The price floor is the cost of oil production at the most expensive location needed to meet demand - between $20 and $40 per barrel. Anything over that results from bidders competing for the same supply, like at an auction.

But that steep curve also works in reverse: if supply is increased even slightly relative to demand, prices drop quickly as well. It doesn't matter where the supply is from, or where it is used.



Retired Geek - want $10/gallon gas? keep electing democrats and RINOs such as McCain who vote with the democrats on such issues.

Did someone really flag my comment?
I wonder why? just curious...
its hardly close to the most incendiary thing I have said here

Chris
You seem to disagree with me, but I don't see your point.

Whatever the global market is,
assuming enough additional US coastal sites were made open to drilling to exceed US demand , exactly why don't you think the price of gas would not
always stay close to the drilling costs if the US seperated it's oil from the global market?

Wouldn't duties/taxes on US oil sold abroad whenever domestic oil is too high, say, a lot more than a typical defense contractor's profit margin, above extraction costs.



my point
Chip, I see your point in your 5:11 post from yesterday.


My first - and certainly debatable - point is that I do think that a little extra production domestically would greatly help the price of oil to come down due to being on the steep part of the price curve on the supply/demand chart and all that.


I think the reason I react strongly to posts like that, though, is that they proceed from a premise that the government can and should control prices.

I'm thinking of statements like the following:

-"Extra US produced oil would have to be reserved mainly for US consumption"

-"if the US seperated it's oil from the global market"


Every time government attempts to control price, it just messes things up. This is true whether it tries to prop up prices (like with food) or hold them down (like with fuel in the late 1970s).

So even if the U.S. threw off the tyranny of wacko environmentalists and developed enough oil production to meet all our demand (which is entirely possible), I think we would create more problems than we fix by isolating ourselves from the global market.
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