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Friday, August 08, 2008
Rich Tucker :: Townhall.com Columnist
Conservatism: The Premature Burial
by Rich Tucker
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Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


“Don’t knock it until you’ve tried it,” my grandmother used to say when serving a food that seemed, let us say, unappetizing. The same advice ought to be applied to public policy.

In the Outlook section of The Washington Post recently, Greg Anrig, vice president of programs at the Century Foundation, gloated that conservatism is in decline, slowly being replaced by what he labels “progressive” ideas. These days, he writes, “conservatives are the ones who are tongue-tied, as demonstrated by Sen. John McCain’s limping, message-free presidential campaign.”

Well, hold the phone for just a moment, there.

First, John McCain is anything but a full-throated voice for the conservative agenda. He’s better than, say, Barack Obama. But McCain earned his vaunted reputation as a “maverick” by often opposing conservatives on issues such as judicial nominations and tax cuts. That’s why, during the Republican primary process, conservative publications such as National Review went all out for Mitt Romney.

Next, let’s look at what Anrig lists as conservatism’s failures, since it could instead be read as a list of partial successes. “They [conservatives] advocated creating health savings accounts, handing out school vouchers, privatizing Social Security, shifting government functions to private contractors, and curtailing regulations on public health, safety, the environment and more.”

Let’s take just a few of these examples. Health savings accounts are the single good feature that was included in the bill that created Medicare Part D. That legislation added a massive new entitlement (putting the federal government on the hook to buy prescription drugs for seniors) to an already-too-expensive entitlement program.

HSAs are the opposite of a government subsidy. They allow individuals to control their own health care. And they allow healthy people to save up money in accounts they control. By putting the customer in charge, HSAs encourage patients to shop for value and be concerned about price -- thus bringing free-market principles to bear on health care.

It’s too soon to claim HSAs have worked, but they certainly haven’t failed. In fact, they deserve to be expanded.

How about the next item: school vouchers?

Here’s another conservative idea that is working, but remains, as they say in Hollywood, in “limited release.” In the nation’s capital, for example, the D.C. Opportunity Scholarship program allows some 1,900 children to attend the school of their choice, instead of the “government school” they’d be assigned to.

Studies by the Department of Education and Georgetown University show parents are happier with the voucher program. Meanwhile, separate studies show test scores are higher for students with vouchers than those without.

So why aren’t vouchers more widespread? In many places, so-called “progressives” have managed to block their use by applying a 19th century legalism: Blaine Amendments. These were originally written into the constitutions of dozens of states when anti-Catholic fervor was running high. It puts the left in the unusual position of supporting xenophobic laws -- not much “progressive” about that.

Finally, Anrig cites “privatizing Social Security” as a failure. It’s true that conservatives failed to get personal retirement accounts added to Social Security. But that doesn’t mean PRAs wouldn’t work; it just means they’ve never been tried. If nothing else, conservatives have successfully called attention to the funding problems behind the impending entitlement crisis.

Meanwhile, the left insists Social Security is on solid ground (it isn’t) and that, anyway, we could save it by raising taxes (we can’t). Talk about failed ideas.

On foreign policy, too, Anrig fails to convince. The Bush administration “has weakened our security -- most notably through the unnecessary calamity in Iraq -- by diluting our military capabilities and diverting their focus from genuine threats from al Qaeda.”

But that’s exactly wrong.

July’s American death toll in Iraq was the lowest since the war started in March of 2003. Al Qaeda has been devastated, and may never recover. Our homeland hasn’t been attacked since 2001. Who would have predicted that six years ago?

It looks as though American troops may be withdrawn from Iraq on a timetable favored by Sen. Obama -- but only because the “surge” he opposed and insisted wouldn’t work has, indeed worked. Around the globe, conservative foreign policy ideas are being vindicated every day.

Conservatism -- free markets, privatization and assertiveness abroad -- has worked --when it’s been tried. The question this election year isn’t “is conservatism dead,” it’s “do we have the will to expand policies that are already working well.” Time will tell.

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About The Author

Rich Tucker is an editor in Washington D.C. and a columnist for Townhall.com.

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Mark Twain
"Reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated."

The thing for which so many 'progressives' are holding wakes this year is not Conservativism. It is the Republican party. There was a point where they were indistinguishable - but the (R) party is a branch from the Conservative tree which was long ago spliced together with a trunk that is more of the liberal ilk.

I'm just sayin'.

I was enjoying this article until
the end, when Tucker defined his version of conservatism as "free markets, privatization, and assertiveness abroad."

That is NOT conservatism, that is neo-conservatism, otherwise known as european liberalism.

The first two terms are about economic liberalism, which has radically changed our culture since the time of Adam Smith.

Assertiveness abroad is a bad euphemism for imperialism.

PS I meant to add
that conservatism basically means "to conserve," as in conserving what this nation and the West were built on, Judaeo-Christian values, not the so-called enlightenment values Tucker espouses.

that being said, of course free market economies are better than say communism.

Well
if it were up to so called "conservatives"
populating the Senate, such as one half of the gang of 10 whose compromise is intent on sandbagging any domestic drilling etc, while
spending millions to promote alternative/renewable energy with the blessing
of ACLU and PETA. Just the ticket Reid, Pelosi and Obama want, and Saxby Chambliss calls it a "good bill," I suppose if you are a submissive dog Republican that can only roll over and piddle on yourself when meeting a DEMONRAT, it is. Meanwhile the true Conservatives making a stand in the House demanding an energy vote have had their legs cut out from under them..which is nothing new,
the king and queenlets on the Republican side
have a nast habit of sandbagging House Republicans.
I hope these fools will be routed, and we can'
get back to true conservatism envisioned by
the Founders. Instead we have a gang of money grubbing nincompoops representing the Republicans.

Teaparty
Please lable those repubs you talk about as RINOs. Republican in name only! I am a republican and I don't agree with much that McCain says but NOTHING that Nobama or osamabama says! As I said the other night, Osamabama is a boil on the nether regions of the U.S.A.

Now if someone would tell McCain
He is just the white alternative to Obama. Same platform and most likely to deliver on amnesty, Cap and Trade (stupendously big, centralized and intrusive government) and tax hikes. McCain is the end of the GOP but not conservatism. We are just shifting to a mix in the coalition, more Blue Dogs, fewer Republicans.

Conservatives are NOT Republicans
or vise-versa. It is REPUBLICANS who are in trouble, not conservatives. It is important to keep the two separate. Conservatives won in November 2006 and we will win again this November. It is just that the leaders of both wings of the United Establishment Party are not going to like it.

Conservatism = Sanity
No judge of history would agree that conservatism should be lost to the future.

It is the way we better ourselves by uplifting each on their individual merits and put government squarely in its place - not as an enabler but in a diminished role.

It is the guiding principle of freedom.

Tucker writes:
"Conservatism -- assertiveness abroad -- has worked --when it’s been tried."

assertiveness abroad???!? Not by my definition is this conservatism.

3 trillion dollar plus war to be fought about every 10 years, + 100 trillion in unfunded entitlements, and an economy that depends on the federal reserve to drop paper fiat notes from a helicopter.

How will Tucker's "free markets" pay for it?

The empire is crumbling.

conservative vs liberal
Liberals, as reflected by the democrat party, is much closer to being the American Socialist party than John McCain is to being a Newt Gingrich conservative.

The left and the democrats want to do away with the notion of a secret ballot for unions. They are for having people vote, in the general elections, without showing an identification yet complain that George Bush steals elections?

Democrats protect the notion of hate speech and further support restricting free speech with the fairness doctrine. Yet where are they when Whoopie Goldberg goes on an N word tirade and the panel is told only certain people should be allowed to use the word? The democrats are for free speech when it is porn or liberal but objects to Rush Limbaugh or Dennis Preger.

Democrats railed against Bush's lack of preperation during the 9/11 commission but want to keep privacy rights ahead of security.

Mr. Obama and Pelosi say the right tries to make Americans afraid?


HSAs
Sorry, but as a business owner who's tried Health Savings Accounts, I found them to be a useless scam. First, you have to buy a VERY expensive health insurance plan (that only kicks in after you've reached mortgage-the-house health spending levels anyway). Then, if you have a few pennies left over every month, you're allowed to sock it away into the actual HSA.

GANG OF WHAT?
Half of the gang of 10 each need to grow a pair! The people they represent should demand their retraction of the proposed bill or their resignation. This was a win-win situation for the GOP and these jackasses have just forfeited to Pelosi, Reid, and Osamabama. It's as if they crafted the bill from Osamabama's speeches. They just guaranteed the price of oil to remain twice as much as it should be.

HSAs II
My experience with HSA's is exactly the opposite as that of RW. As a small business owner, I cut my (and my employees) monthly cost of health insurance significantly via the high deductible plan. Then I and my employees were able to use pretax dollars to pay up to the deductible level. Even for those who use their entire HSA to pay up to the deductible level, both the gross cost and after tax costs are less than in the previous $40 copay/$500 deductible plan. Also, we are now much more cost conscious, which is good.

Taps
Mr. Tucker is right when he says that "Conservatism -- free markets, privatization and assertiveness abroad -- has worked -- when it’s been tried." And he is correct when he says that it is far from dead. However, he does not seem to be aware of two things: What is going on in the intellectual world, and what free markets consist of.

1. Conservative intellectual circles have been driving this train, and they have been dominated for years by neoconservatives, who are big government advocates in the realm of social values and national defense and who are indifferent to the size of government when it comes to the marketplace. Their agenda is simply to get in power and enforce society-wide mobilizations for various causes, whatever crisis is at hand or can be manufactured. The particular issue is not important to them; their focus is to stay one step ahead of the liberals in do-gooding to stay in power.

Compassionate conservatives are a lesser force in intellectual circles. They are essentially evangelicals who are otherwise leftists. They are also particularly pernicious because they are crazy. Unlike neocons, they are actually committed to their political items. With the backlash against them and the Republican collapse, expect many of them to flee to other parties.

It is widely acknowledged by the "conservative" intellectuals that there is a dearth of new ideas and activity, and no one to replace the aging crop in there now. This should come as no surprise, given who is in charge. Who wants to join them in their intellectual bankruptcy? They are through. There is no one who can save them, because there is no way to save them, because their ideas are bad.

To be continued...

Taps II
2. The other major error in this column is the labeling of things such as private health savings accounts, private SS accounts, and school vouchers as "private," as manifestations of a free market. Sadly, our culture has gotten to the point where many just do not recognize these things as implements of collectivism.

If you want privatization, why have these things at all? Why not just get rid of the concept and let people choose whatever they want?

"Private" accounts and vouchers are always designed to have government intervention. The government, after all, must make sure that you do not suffer in your freedom, that you do not have the freedom to choose an unwise course of action. With these so-called private accounts, government determines which companies you can invest in, which companies you can insure yourself with, which schools you can use your vouchers for, what those schools can teach, etc. Then they tell you to have at it. You have the illusion of being free to choose.

Since Democrats take a mile when Republicans give an inch, and since some government intervention begets more intervention, eventually, there will be no illusions about what has happened.

Wendy - Is your last name ''McElroy''?
--
Physicians are by training (and perhaps by temperament) inclined to treat every act of reasoning as something of an exercise in differential diagnosis and treatment.

The modern American conservative movement is so obviously different in so many critical ways from the "conservatism" of Europe that I wonder just what the hell seems to have put us in bed with the U.S. version of these same groping perverts.

As is evident from the observation of the religiously-motivated "social" pseudoconservatives (among both columnists and commenters here on Townhall.com) these people are both loud and stupid.

Unfortunately, they're absolutely immune to anything remotely resembling the learning process. Intellectual barnacles, each has found his respective rock down in the slime, and he's sticking to it, received "scriptural" wisdom in hand, deaf to anything but his peculiarly ordained cadre of witch-doctors, soothsayers, and mullahs.

But what reason - beyond political expediency; they *are* potentially useful idiots - gives us cause to tolerate these fellahin?

American conservatism's essential difference from the Old World neophobia and mysticism so exquisitely articulated in Russell Kirk's six canons (see http://tinyurl.com/6z7ewp ) lies in the fact that this nation has put in centralmost place a philosophy of individual liberty.

That's what American conservatives are really acting to conserve, "against all enemies, foreign and domestic."

But those enemies inescapably include the "social" pseudoconservatives, who (in the words of Tibor Machan:

"...all find it impossible to accept that they live in a culture that has distinguished itself to the world by virtue of its libertarian components - not by virtue of its emphasis on order, riches, traditionalism, Judeo-Christianity, and other tangential matters."

Clearly, they cannot be cured.

But can they any longer be endured?

--

SJ Doc
Perhaps they should look a little closer. A friend of mine went to the ER the other night. He was told that he had partially "blown" a tendon in his thumb and gave him the number of a surgeon to see. When he woke up the next day, the swelling had gone down a lot so he made an appointment with his internal med DR and found out he had a very badly bruised thumb and to keep the thera cast on for a few more days. Cost 50.00 cost to see surgeon to tell him the same thing 150.00 Not seeing surgeon...Priceless!

Not If But When
The exploding levels of immigration (legal and illegal) will bring the death of Conservatism in this country as a ruling philosophy. The vast majority of these immigrants are poor and uneducated with racially distinct characteristics that make them a natural constituency for the Democrats to exploit and bring into their fold.

The death of conservatism is not a question of if, but of when. My guess is the quickly accelerating tsunami of immigrants will start to make a significant enough of a difference at the ballot box within the decade given that the already evenly divided country doesn't need much of a shift to put conservatives outside the window of electability.

There may be a few victories for conservatives from time to time as the point approaches and passes, but within 20 or 30 years it would take an extreme situation for a conservative to ever gain victory in an odd election or two. Game over, Teddy Kennedy and his notions of liberalism and immigration win the game!

''Ask any doctor..."
--
"...and he'll think about malpractice / And tell you - at the very least - it's certain to be three...."

(From the science fiction fan parody filksong "Cheap Lawyer," relating to how various people might respond to the question "How much is two plus two?")


Of course, "Ask an attorney / He'll lock the doors and draw the curtains / And whisper to you: / 'How much do you *WANT* it to be?'"


Emergency Department physicians are COMPELLED to refer all patients to their own doctors or to one of the listed specialists "on call."

Those of us who work the ED do so with the acknowledgement that we're the bought dogs of the hospital administrators. They either employ us individually or (more commonly) contract with the practice groups to which we belong.

And them what pays the piper calls the shots.

--

If We Let Others Solve our problems,
We will Never Learn How.

Conservatism is about individual responsibility and accountability.

Liberalism is about government solving our problems, but government really cannot do that.

It is becoming more and more obvious why Liberals are blocking conservative efforts. It will make the liberals look bad because the conservative plans go against the Liberals agenda.

That is another reason why liberals change the subject when they cannot discredit the column.
These activists have more of a vested interest in my opinion. the are smart enough to know, Liberals are in error, but the have a special interest in blurring the facts with aimless off subject discourse.

Excellent article, excellent observations.

conservatism is NOT assertiveness abroad
I think you can argue this from the standpoint of observing an underlying philosophy of government as it pertains to domestic affairs, and applying such philosophy to foreign affairs.

Certainly few would argue that "assertiveness by government" in the domestic realm is evidenced by "judicial activism"...anathema to traditional conservatism.

Nanny-state regulations, exemplified by idiotic laws on trans-fats, smoking restrictions or prohibitions, even compulsory use of seatbelts and motorcycle helmets, is nothing more than government endorsed assertivesness on domestic affairs.

Such assertiveness in foreign affairs is exemplified by the stupendous arrogance of this administration in thinking it knows best how Muslim society and governance ought to be constituted.

In both instances it is all about how(this)government knows best...foisting its idea of what constitutes proper governance abroad(democracy)..as well as foisting its idea of what constitutes proper behavior among its citizens here at home.

The underlying philosophy of intrusive, assertive government, whether in domestic or foreign affairs, is diametrically opposed to traditional conservative principles.

Tucker has been swigging too much neocon swill here.

Kinda lame,
but still good points.

I definitely agree with assertiveness abroad, otherwise we'll simply be the butt boy for thugs like Chubby Chavez and Saddam Hussein who love nothing better than to poke us in the eye, kick us in the nads and generally mess with our interests. When you're the BIG DOG on the street, you better act like it, or pretty soon all the little rat terriers will be pi$$ing on your leg. I wonder if Mumar Khadafy is still hiding under his bed?

We didn't topple the evil regime in Baghdad because we wanted to re-order Muslim society: Saddam's defiance was feeding into the moronic collective mindset of Mohammedans that they were "tuff stuff" and God was on their side. They also believe that when they're defeated in battle, it is God's will. Why would any right thinking American not wish for the defeat of extreme Islamofacists?

The devastating losses inflicted on Al Queda have made them infinitely less attractive to ignorant fanatic Muslims everywhere, who don't see them as such a fun club to join anymore. What a stupid strategy - suicide bombers! Terrifying? Yes, but how can you win if you don't live to fight another day.

Whether dhimmicrats want to admit it or not, Bush policy has totally crushed the daffy dream of a world ruling Caliphate based in Baghdad that has been the goal of the despicable Muslim Brotherhood (which spawned today's fanatics) since the 20's.

Don't believe me? Here it is from a Iraqi scholar:
http://talismangate.blogspot.com/
and scroll down to The Jihadist Caliphate Fails. Much good reading on that site, if want a true prospective not found on Obama TV.

run as a conservative
Vote like a liberal.It seems to be the trend.

Most of you have it.
Most of you have it in a nutshell. Traditional conservative values have not changed. What has changed is Bush and the GOP's attempts to redefine the word conservative to conform to policies which are not conservative. Conservative foreign policy has always been to proceed cautiously and stay out of nation building. Basically, it goes back to TR's observation of walk softly but carry a big stick. Conservative economic policy is based on recognizing that any expansion of government by definition reduces individual freedom and interferes with individual choice. Further, the free market is a far better and more efficient regulator of economic activity than government can ever be.

The GOP is in trouble with conservatives, which is reflected across the political spectrum these days. It is attempting to re-establish its hold on conservatives, but it has precious little to say that represents conservative values.

Unfortunately, the damage the GOP did when it so easily abandoned conservative values is unlikely to be repaired. After all, if there is one thing that is obvious about this election - it is that far too many people are calling themselves conervative who are actually clueless about what the word means.

We routinely read that a majority of the public is really "center-right" in their views. However, that depends upon ones "definition" of what center right means. If the actual definition began with well established conservative principals, then the more fundamental reality is that that majority would be arrayed to the left - meaning that the majority is really center-left in their thinking - at least to a real conservative.

Conservatism
Is based on judging by results. Conservative values include honesty, which has been shown to be the best, most workable policy. Reward of merit, punishment of criminal activity, responsibility for actions and decisions, these are the bedrock of conservatism. Insofar as they are applied, prosperity occurs. When ignored, chaos and misery. Good intentions have NEVER been enough. Collectivist philosophies based on grandiose theories are as old as history. They have always proved unworkable. We could well be the next example.

A Second Look
I was all set to give this column a 4 but first there were some things I needed to investigate. I had never heard of the Century Foundation so I had to research that. Looking at their web site it was readily apparent that they were a clone of the Daily Kos. Their founder was a noted wealthy socialist (does that sound familiar?). Their communist musings should have no more weight assigned to it than the fecal matter deposited here by the leftist trolls. I find it unremarkable that they would publish some kind of drivel regarding the death of conservatism and we only elevate their importance by quoting them.

Then there is the matter of school vouchers. I do not find the case for school vouchers to be compelling. It is like taking an aspirin to cure cancer. True conservatives would do well to remember the route that the federal government took to get their long proboscis into the school system. That route was federal dollars. In every case when federal dollars come calling the long reach of the regulators is not far behind. This is the same with State dollars, except that the State government has a little bit more to justify their intrusion into what should be a purely local matter.

In addition, Mr. Tucker makes a big deal out the so-called Blain Amendments that forbid using public money to support parochial school like these were some kind of “hate speech” codified into State Constitutions and law. I find that to be a strange position for a conservative to take.

I was set to take issue with a lot of other parts of this column but after reading the comments I found that Wendy beat me to it. Wendy, you did a fine job of blasting this column.

I gave it a 2.

Pistol
Good morning

pasadena phil...explain

What this CAP and TRADE means?
Lots of people throw expressions around.......
assuming that everyone knows what they are talking about...?

Robt.-----you are for drilling..good!
But your statement that the establishments need to be replaced is scary...with what
MOSQUES!? Sheeez......
elvis

It is what it is.
If governmental assertiveness in domestic affairs betrays conservative principles(which no argues to the contrary), then governmental assertiveness in foreign affairs must also betray conservative principles.

For it is the robust and unbridled exercise of the SAME government in each case...government involving itself in affairs within our Beloved republic, or involving itself in affairs outside our Republic.

"Meddlesome", "Interventionist", "Assertiveness"...such descriptions of government are more consistent with a nanny-state government than with traditional conservatism.

It matters little whether it is applied to domestic or foreign affairs. The point is it is the same mentality embodied by government.

It is what it is.

The logic is inescapable.

And it is on this crucial issue that G.W. Bush and his neocon advisors have so betrayed conservative principles...this grotesque, arrogant, supercilious mindset that deems it knows best the proper form of governance, and the manner in which societies are to be constituted, within the Muslim world.

A number of posters have recognized this flagrant perversion of conservative principles, among them Joseph and Redlac.

Again I say for Tucker to claim governmental assertiveness is consistent with traditional conservatism illustrates his ignorance of what conservatism is all about.

GOP=Whig
The Republican Party under GWB seems intent on political suicide. Pandering to citizens of other countries illegally in our country while telling us we must be vigilantes if we object to illegal aliens ignoring our borders and laws. Mel Martinez was RNC Chairman to ensure an open borders candidate in '08. The cheap labor express will be kept running, regardless of the consequences, to party or country.

GOP-RIP

Wait until he nominates Lieberman for VP
And there will be fun, fun, fun when her daddy takes the T Bird away. McCain might make Bush appear conservative. And that will take some work.

Liked the article
but hated the title. There are so many negative things being written about Conservatism and our party even a hint of it is really beginning to annoy me. It is the best way to govern that is if you like freedom and a government that works when we ask it to.

Not Asking mty opinio.
You're just a sayin' it the way it is. If someone wanted my advice - and the GOP isn't asking, my first observation would be that if I wanted to rebuild the brand I'd finish the congressional leadership purge that started with Frist, Hastert and Delay, and get rid of anyone else in leadership that is a holdover from the last 8 years that resulted in most rapid expansion of the social welfare state since the 70's. However, since I don't see that happening voluntarily, then my next step would be to ensure that the GOP lost 5 - 7 senate seats and 12 - 20 house seats, and that McCain, the "maverick" who calls himself a Republican, was also not elected. A visit to the wilderness could well lead to the internal revolt and soul searching necessary to give us new leadership that would unhesitatingly and forcefully reject the last 8 years. Then, the party, under new leadership, having clearly broken with the past and having no responsibility whatsoever for any action taken by the Democrats, could then become an effective and articulate opposition group while setting up the next election in 2 years. Anything else (and as the "energy" policy trotted out by those 5 GOP and 5 Democratic Senators so clearly demonstrated)and the GOP will continue to appear to be a pale imitation of the Democrats. Further, since history demonstrates that the election cycle virtually guarantees that if McCain wins as a republican in this cycle, then he'll lose in the next, then it would be a much better trade to get 8 years starting in 4, rather than 4 now followd by 8. And who, but Hillary, would be the likely candidate carrying the Democrat flag to victory.


First expel the bluebloods!!!
WAY too many country club Rockefeller wing blue blood types in the GOP today. Worse than before the Reagan Revolution. Other than the flaming libs it was THEY who hated Ronnie most. He got their umbilical cords in a permanent knot!

Imagine these twits with teacups on their knees and scones in hand watching the dow flash along their Trinitron console TV set back them. Their intestines must've exploded when Ronnie started taking an ax to so many cherished programs and laid the groundwork for so many NEW millionaires to ascend to where THEY were.

-Ray
NRA Life Member

robt. ranger...??
There is no excuse for an educated man such as your self...supporting illegal immigration....
as you have implied over and over it is no big deal! If you belive that you are nuts...!
Here in calif...recently...a Father and son
were gunned down and killed for no reason at all
they were hispanic(legals).....and guess who killed them!? Illegals...gang members!
A black kid walking home and very close to home
..a football star...had a scholarship to college
was gunned down by more illegals...!So as far as Iam concerned people like you who are mushy
CAN SHOVE IT..AND YOU KNOW WHERE!
You will see it is no knuckle dragger in Nov.
if the corrupt politicians would get out of the way...we can solve our BORDER BS...REAL QUICK!
ELVIS

Sammy: Don't Count On It
I'm waiting for Bobby Jindall in 2012. He's going to be really unbeatable by then. He's young and a minority, and a great conservative. He's been doing major work since he was 22 years old, and he's doing a phenominal job of rebuilding Louisiana. Conservatism isn't dead, not by a LONG shot. Steve Pearce in NM is another great conservative who is running for Pete Domenici's (retiring) seat. Don't count on conservatism being dead; as long as people hold the Constitution and the Bill of Rights dear, there will ALWAYS be conservatives.

Another factor to consider is Rush Limbaugh. Do you realize that millions and millions of people listen to him? Rush has the largest radio audience, EVER. Undeniably a major leader of Conservatism.

There have been Conservatives since our founding, and my bet would be there will always be Conservatives around as long as there IS an America.

Premature, but getting close
Yes, but the current crop of Repubs have been working pretty darn hard over the past several years to discredit conservatism. If the Repubs don’t seriously mend their ways, they will kill the party.


Political Definitions
There are many Republicans running for the nomination, but very few conservatives among the lot. Party lines have been blurred and traditional conservative principles have been abandoned for the most part. For many reasons, the federal government has grown very large and has taken on tasks it has no business or ability to do. In the grand scheme of things, the government has become an instrument to redistribute wealth and would start to tax small businesses into oblivion under an Obama presidency. What happened to free markets, privatization, low taxes, small government, individual responsibility and personal initiative? Some cows burp methane and we want to call in the FBI, the CIA, Homeland Security, the Global Warming Pundits, the EPA and the Secretary of Agriculture to figure out why cows burp methane. Maybe we can spend $145,000 per cow to relocate them, in a FEMA trailer, to another planet, and milk them from earth. For years we had splendid programs of drinking from the government cow, not workfare and education, but passing out money to people, many of whom did not work. All these wonderful liberal/socialist programs do not work. We have a Department of Education that should be abolished and let states do the job themselves. I bet you a nickel to a hole in a donut they could do a better job overall. We could have a flat tax and start taxing all the underground cash payments, where everyone pays the same rate. In a socialistic society, these ideas become difficult to impossible to implement. Conservative principles are not dying or dead, but they sure are dormant and there are few to adhere to these ideas that work well in a republic.

Conservatism
I consider myself a conservative. I am for less government including less government intrusion into my private life. I am not a Christian I do not believe abortion is OK. I don't think it is anyones business if I look at porn, am homo, gamble or smoke pot. I don't think social security is the answer and I believe people ought to be responsible for their decisions and actions. I strongly disagree with raising taxes in all forms. I strongly disagree with any redistribution of wealth. the so call "big oil" companies are entitled to any profit they can get as are the big auto entitled to loose as much as they want. If I want to change "big oil" I buy stock in "big oil" and exercise my vote.

I don't want laws making prayer illegal. BUT I understand that ALL religions are equal wether we like them or not.

Am I a member of the Republican base? I think that the religious fanatics (of all religions) are what makes up the so called ring-wing base..

I say so called, because it's not true. REAL conservatives don't want to force more social or fiscal government on people..

CLYDE...NOT CHRISTIAN..??
Remember us LATTER DAY SAINTS are not CHRISTIAN either according to the far right evangelicals:
but in my opinion...you made some real good ....
points!
From one non-christian to another....I wish ya a good day!
Hey wait a minute...since Iam non Christian
how come I believe in Jesus Christ...and pray in his name...hmmmm?!
elvis

I Often Recall
something I heard Dick Morris say on, I believe, Hannity & Colmes, some months back when in discussion regarding liberalism and conservatism. I personally thought it to be quite profound and have wondered since why it has not been referred to in discussion today. Perhaps Alan talked over it, as he is wont to do when truth is being said? In any case, I think it bears elaboration. What he said? To the effect that EVEN LIBERAL GOALS NEED TO BE ADDRESSED AND SOLVED BY CONSERVATIVE METHODS. If we can come to this conclusion there's no telling what good could be accomplished.

Try to Make It So Thru Repetition?
Coservatism is not dead. It is not obsolete. It wasn't a phenomenon of the Cold War or the near-depression of the Carter years. It asserts timeless universal values of the worth of the individual.

Witness the # of people who want it. The political/pop media establishment, who are threatened by it, is forced to acknowledge & deal with the concept & desire for conservatism.

Why else would almost everyone try to claim to in some sense be conservative? If true small-government conservatives were really as fringe & insignificant as their foes try to say, they'd just ignore them & push 'progressivism.' Because such a vast number of people, perhaps a majority, believe in some measure with limited government, free enterprise, private property, &t rule of minimal law, at least for themselves.

The elite class push bigger government as the solution to everything, including imaginary problems like "climate change," because it empowers THEM, at the expense of the rest of us.

All sorts of special interests can divide up our freedom & wealth among themselves under 'liberalism,' but conservatism is the party pooper that condemns their game instead of playing it. That's why it must be destroyed, not given a seat at the table.

They are calling real conservatives names & repeatedly declaring conservatism 'dead,' in hopes of fooling us into believing it.

The GOP elite are the Undertakers
What we really see now is the Empire Striking Back. The elite have plotted to prevent another Reagan. The Republican Party was never REALLY conservative at heart the way the Democratic Party has been big-government & lefist since FDR.

Ever since 1994, we've seen the GOP becoming ever more not an opposition to the Dems, but a me-too, what-they-said-but-a-little-less echo of the metro-leftist 'mainstream' elite agenda the Dems champion. They live on the same reservation & drink the same Kool-Aid.

Asking whether government wouldg be smaller or taxes lower under GOP vs. Dem is like asking which team must win the Super Bowl in order to lower ticket prices. The NFL to whom both teams belong decide these things, & hi ticket prices are in the NFL's interest. Big government is in the interests of the top elite of the GOP as well as the Dems.

They are trying to force us permanently into the "lesser of 2 evils" trap thru stunts like engineering MCain's nomination then scaring us about Obama.

Only if we're courageous enough to hold the GOP & its candidates to a standard or else abandon it, & refuse to be suckered, will they stop taking us for granted. Fall for "better than the Dem" & "we have nowhere else to go," & we'll never get anything other than lies and flip-offs, while the US crumbles & goes totalitarian.

A nothing candidate for a nothing party
Barack Obama. When he talks, he says nothing. And he's the best they have! The modern Democrat Party is on the verge of collapse. I just hope Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid hold out against drilling until late October. This issue will wipe that flimsy party out.

Don't Tread On Me...

" Don't Tread On Me
Location: SC

Reply # 45
Date: Aug 10, 2008 - 1:32 PM EST Subject: The GOP elite are the Undertakers
What we really see now is the Empire Striking Back. The elite have plotted to prevent another Reagan. The Republican Party was never REALLY conservative at heart the way the Democratic Party has been big-government & lefist since FDR.

Ever since 1994, we've seen the GOP becoming ever more not an opposition to the Dems, but a me-too, what-they-said-but-a-little-less echo of the metro-leftist 'mainstream' elite agenda the Dems champion. They live on the same reservation & drink the same Kool-Aid.

Asking whether government wouldg be smaller or taxes lower under GOP vs. Dem is like asking which team must win the Super Bowl in order to lower ticket prices. The NFL to whom both teams belong decide these things, & hi ticket prices are in the NFL's interest. Big government is in the interests of the top elite of the GOP as well as the Dems.

They are trying to force us permanently into the "lesser of 2 evils" trap thru stunts like engineering MCain's nomination then scaring us about Obama.

Only if we're courageous enough to hold the GOP & its candidates to a standard or else abandon it, & refuse to be suckered, will they stop taking us for granted. Fall for "better than the Dem" & "we have nowhere else to go," & we'll never get anything other than lies and flip-offs, while the US crumbles & goes totalitarian. "

~~~

I VOTE THIS AS THE BEST POST ON THE COLUMN !!!

AMEN !!

Macroscope...
What he's really saying here is the Great American Experiment is dead. If that were true, which its not, that would be a tragic for all not just a political group. Conservatism didnt begin or end with Regan, it goes much deeper and farther into history than that. It's true, Regan may have been the last great example of it, but last time I checked we're not dead yet. Loosing in some arenas, maybe, but not dead. Win some, lose some is the name of the game.

Also, conservatism is a proud label worn by many as liberalism is still a mainly four letter word with a vast majority of Americans. The main political struggle, like right now, is for democrats to appear center my moving right and republicans appearing more conservative by moving right...so, whatchu talkin bout Gregory?

Failed?
A team that isn't allowed to take the field hasn't failed, they've been denied their chance to even play.

So many Conservative ideas are supposedly dead when in fact the socialists at all levels of government work very hard to make sure Conservative ideas don't even get an opportunity to succeed.

As the author states, how can Social Security privatization be a failure when it never happened? Surely the current Ponzi scheme is no success.
HSA's are another great example, I have one and I love it. Why are the Liberals/socialists so afraid of Conservative ideas? Because if they succeed then no one will need the Liberal nanny state.
Vouchers, another idea barely allowed to be tried and even then under heavy bureaucratic constraints.

No, Conservatism isn't dead, just shackled by career socialists and other government sponsored parasites who would collapse without the nourishment of the federal teat.

Conservatism
....is a state of mind. You can't lose it,if you really are a conservative.You only wish the rest of the country believed the same.

Most of us came from families who believed in God and Country. Our fathers served the country and our brothers could not wait until they were of age to serve in some branch of the military. At least that is the way we were.

DerKreiger and Ratas Y Ratones: Both of your posts are equally the best.For different reasons. Ratas tell the problems and Derkreiger gives the solutions. Bravo.



CONSERVATISM ISN'T DEAD, IT'S IN LIMBO
To steal from Mark Twain, conservatism's death is greatly exaggerated.

Ronald Reagan resuscitated Barry Goldwater's philosophy and the nation responded. It only remains for Republican politicians to realize that America is and always will basically conservative and that the shining city on the hill is waiting for them to acknowledge that.

Hey Ratas y Ratones!

I second your motion. WBABT/RBABT props!

That was indeed an excellent post.

As usual, you are a highly astute and discerning rat. . . .


Cheerios with Rocket Fuel!

Norman the Supportive

Weary
I get tired of all this self indulgent naval gazing while the tax and spenders run up the deficit. It has been going on since 2006, and that is too long.
Imho, the Repubs and Bush have met and faced some huge challenges which grew out of Clinton filures and wimpiness. They have been effetive even though you seldom gave them the tiniest of majority margins. You want more? Give them real majorities to work with.

Conservatism Has Not Failed
The abandonment of conservatism by mavericks like McCain and compassionate preppies like the Bushes, fools people into thinking conservatism has failed. What they do not realize, is that a large part of the GOP has abandoned/betrayed conservatism.

Poseurs like Bush and McCain give conservatism a bad name. Just because they are more conservative than Obama does not mean that they are conservatives.

Neither is the corruption that is running rampant in certain sectors of the GOP a sign that conservatism has failed.

Whenever conservatism is embraced by ethical persons it achieves remarkable results.

President Reagan was our last true conservative and the GOP betrayals of his legacy do not change the fact that conservatism works.

ClaireSolt
Your post makes no sense. After all, the federal budget grew from $1.85 trillion to $3.25 trillion over the last 8 years, and in six of those years, the GOP was in the majority. And this has been the largest expansion of spending and the welfare state in the post WWII era. After all, that's an 80% increase in 8 years. Bush vetoed nothing in the first six years - a record for a sitting President. Further, in the last two years, 1/2 or so of the GOP in Congress joined the Democrats to ensure veto over-rides on the agricultural bill and the attempt to save a few pennies on Medicare, and Bush then chose not to veto the supplemental military spending bill once certain language he didn't like was removed - even though it carried large chunks of irrelevant pork. And this was because sufficient members of the GOP supported it to ensure another over-ride. Now, in the last two years, we've had repeated mumblings from the GOP that they might take a "no pork" pledge. But each time, they lost their nerve and didn't do it.

What most recognize - and you appear to be missing, is that having a majority of Republicans of this particular style is no different than having a majority of Democrats. The GOP demonstrated that it could spend more money faster to buy votes in those first six years in power than the Democrats, and after losing their majorities, continued to support all the principal spending bills now authored by the Democrats - but previously authored by them.

Fiscal sanity and small government is a conservative virtue - but it is not currently a GOP virtue. This is what you seem to be missing. And frankly, this is what all conservatives are missing. The GOP will do little different than the Democrats - as we've seen, unless the GOP purges some 50% of the exisiting senators and congresspeople, and replaces them with conservatives.

Conservative/Republican/????
Conservative and Republican are archaic devices used to try to discriminate between virtually identical mistakes in logic.
Politicians, and others, can hide behind, between and under these two terms and people are left trying to figure out what they really stand for; if anything.
Constitutionist is a term I tend to be enamored of. A Constitutionist believes that Conservatives, Republicans, Democrats, Progressives, Mad Dogs & Moonbats all must be weighed from the context of where do they stand when their convictions are compared to the provisions of the Declaration of Independence, U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
The documents called out above don't need some hubris ridden Lawyer/Judge, some disfunctional Politician or self-altruistic messiah to decipher or understand. It was written so that the minimally educated could comprehend the Freedoms and Liberty it was written to guaranteed.
If you are not a Constitutionist, you are an agent of chaos and en enemy of Freedom and Liberty. If you think that must,and that you can, interpret & then re-define the meaning of the simple, clear & concise phrases of the Founding Documents of our Country; you most likely are not qualified to cross the street without adult supervision. if you agree that there are Politicians and/or Judges that have such qualifications you are a complete idiot.
"Constitutionist" is a simple description for all those folks trying to figure out why "Conservative" nor "Republican" will fit what they believe.
All of us Constitutionists need to work towards getting this Country back to operating as it was designed to operate. And we need to hurry.

Dwain Cleveland

Typos ect
Sorry about the spelling & typos. Lunch is nearly over; back to the saltmines.

D. Cleveland

Not from where I sit
I think that the progressives are not winning.
I think that the Conservatives are burying
their own ideals and philosophy.

I am convinced of that every time I come onto
TH and until someone says that this war has to
be paid for by something other than buying
yet another 47 inch tv, I will continue to be
convinced of it.

Reaganomics stink and its time someone admits
it.
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