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Monday, May 26, 2008
Phyllis Schlafly :: Townhall.com Columnist
A New Argument About Immigration
by Phyllis Schlafly
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Many arguments, pro and con, about how to deal with illegal aliens have been passionately debated over the past couple of years, but there are still other arguments that need public exposure. Mark Krikorian presents a new argument in his forthcoming book called "The New Case Against Immigration, Both Legal and Illegal."

The pro-more-immigration crowd argues that today's immigrants are just like immigrants of a century ago: poor people looking for a better life who are expected to advance in our land of opportunity. Krikorian's new argument is that while today's immigrants may be like earlier ones, the America they come to is so very different that our previous experience with immigrants is practically irrelevant.

The essential difference between the two waves of immigrants was best summed up by the Nobel Prize-winning advocate of a free market, Milton Friedman. He said, "It's just obvious that you can't have free immigration and a welfare state."

The term "welfare state" does not just mean handouts to the nonworking. Our welfare state encompasses dozens of social programs that provide benefits to the "working poor," i.e., people working for wages low enough that they pay little or no income taxes.

Immigrants of the previous generation were expected to earn their own living, pay taxes like everybody else, learn our language, love America and assimilate into our culture. Today's immigrants likewise come here for jobs not welfare.

During those prior major waves of immigration, the United States didn't have a welfare state. Native-born Americans survived the Great Depression of the 1930s without a welfare state.

The Social Security retirement system was established only in 1935. Most other agencies that redistribute cash and costly benefits from taxpayers to non-taxpayers started with Lyndon Johnson's Great Society in the late 1960s.

Today's low-wage immigrants and lower-wage illegals can't earn what it costs to live in modern America, so they supplement with means-tested taxpayer benefits. And many immigrants don't learn our language or assimilate into American culture because of the multicultural diversity taught in our schools and encouraged in our society.

Today's immigrants fit the profile of the people who benefit from our welfare state: the working poor with large families. Krikorian sets forth some dismal figures.

About 30 percent of all immigrants in the U.S. work force in 2005 lacked a high school education, which is four times the rate for native-born Americans. Among the largest group of working-age immigrants, the Mexicans, 62 percent have less than a high-school education, which means they work low-wage jobs. Nearly half of immigrant households, 45 percent, are in or near poverty compared with 29 percent of native-headed households. Among Mexicans living in the United States, nearly two-thirds live in or near the government's definition of poverty.

Costly social benefits provided to the working poor include Temporary Assistance to Needy Families (now called TANF, formerly AFDC), food stamps, school lunches, Medicaid, WIC (nutrition for Women, Infants and Children), public housing and Supplemental Security Income.

The Earned Income Tax Credit is one of the most expensive parts of income redistribution. Twice as many immigrant households (30 percent) qualify for this cash handout as native-headed households (15 percent).

Health care is another huge cost. Nearly half of immigrants are either uninsured or on Medicaid, which is nearly double the rate for native-born families. Federal law requires hospitals to treat all comers to emergency rooms, even if uninsured and unable to pay.

Hospitals try to shift the costs onto their paying patients, and when the hospitals exhaust their ability to do this, they close their doors. In Los Angeles, 60 hospitals have closed their emergency rooms over the past decade, which imposes another kind of cost.

Immigration accounts for nearly all the growth in elementary and secondary school enrollment over the past generation. The children of immigrants now comprise 19 percent of the school-age population and 21 percent of the preschool population.

The Heritage Foundation estimated that in order to reduce government payments to the average low-skill household to a level equal to the taxes it pays, "it would be necessary to eliminate Social Security and Medicare, all means-tested welfare, and to cut expenditures on public education roughly in half." Obviously, that is not going to happen.

Attempts to limit welfare eligibility for illegal aliens by provisions added to the 1996 welfare reform law, SSI, food stamps, Medicaid and TANF all failed. Krikorian concludes that "Walling immigrants off from government benefits once we've let them in is a fantasy."

As Americans are pinched between falling real estate values and the inflation of necessities such as gasoline, they are entitled to know how their tax dollars are being spent. The big bite that social benefits to immigrants (one-third of whom are illegal) takes out of taxpayers' paychecks should be factored into any debate about immigration or amnesty policy.

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About The Author

Phyllis Schlafly is a national leader of the pro-family movement, a nationally syndicated columnist and author of Feminist Fantasies.
 
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immigratation
ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION IS THE SECOND WORST THING TO HAPPEN TO THIS COUNTRY SINCE 9-11.

FIRST, WE ARE ONE INCH AWAY FROM BANKRUPTCY AND ANOTHER BIG DEPRESSION, AND CONGRESS IS BEING BOUGHT BY LOBBYISTS, NOT TO ROCK THE "ILLEGAL" BOAT, BECAUSE OF THE $1.2 TRILLION DOLLARS MADE BY BIG-BUSINESS OFF THE BACKS OF ILLEGALS , WHILE AMERICANS WHO WORKED THOSE JOBS, ARE REPLACED BY WORKERS FOR HALF THE PAY.

AMERICAN CONGRESS IS ONE OF THE WORST EVER FOR LAWS PROTECTING US AS CITIZENS.

FIRST, THEY ALLOWED AN OLD LAW OVER 140 YEARS OLD TO REMAIN ON THE BOOKS AND THAT IS THE JUS-SOLI "ANCHOR-BABY' LAW WHICH ANYONE CAN TELL WAS MEANT FOR THE BABIES OF SLAVES ONLY. CONGRESS FAILED TO RESCIND IT.
NOW WE HAVE A SERIOUS DILEMA ON OUR HANDS, WE CANNOT SAY CONGRESS IS SLOW OR DUMB, VERY SIMPLY 'CORRUPT', AND THEY DONT GIVE DAMN IF YOU KNOW IT....YOU FOOLS WILL STILL RE-ELECT THEM.

SECOND, OUR BORDERS ARE SO WIDE OPEN, YOU CAN STICK ALL LAWS WE HAVE THERE ON A MATCH BOOK COVER....WE HAVE NOTHING WORTH MENTIONING.

CHECK OUT MEXICOS 'ILLEGAL' ENTRY. 2 YEARS IN PRISON, WE ONLY SLAP YOUR WRIST, THEN WE OFFER
THE "HORN OF PLENTY".
YOU CAN HAVE FREE MEDICAL,FREE HUD HOUSING, WELFARE CHECKS, FOOD STAMPS, NOW WE OFFER THEM (OUR) SOC. SECURITY...AND WE ALSO GIVE THESE NON-CITIZENS "LEGAL RIGHTS", THE SAME AS ANY CITIZEN , AND IN MOST CASES, BETTER THAN AMERICAN CITIZENS.

CORRUPTION AT IT FINEST, RIGHT UNDER OUR NOSES, AND NO ONE CARES....CAUSE THEY DONT FEEL THE STING YET, THEN IT WILL BE TO LATE...TYPICAL OF SLEEPING AMERICANS.

ARRRRRGH, AS THE PIRATES SAY......TRANSLATED IT MEANS: OH CRAP,I LOST A THOUSAND DOLLARS
SOMEWHERE ....

Reply to Fivo
Fivo-

"spout?"
"racist tripe?"
"racist trophy liberals?"

You honestly don't have a thought in your head that wasn't planted there by the jew-controlled media, do you?

-Jim


Fin Location: ID
Reply # 121
Date: May 26, 2008 - 2:53 PM EST
Subject: A New Argument About Immigration
Phyllis Schlafly-

Thank you for your recent column, A New Argument About Immigration. I am, however, very disappointed that you did not immediately establish -- and focus on -- the most fundamental differences between contemporary immigrants and earlier immigrants: race (DNA) and the geo-biological incompatibility of the resultant various human organisms and cultures.

We risk losing Western Civilization because Caucasians and other races are genetically incompatible in the same society and geographical space, not simply because Central and South American Amerindians and Mestizos, and others, are “low-wage workers.”

Please continue your good work by including the most important reality -- the reality of race -- in your discussions.

-Jim
--------------------
Jim, Fin, whatever.

Please return to moveon.org and spout your racist tripe there. We're conservatives on TH, not racist trophy liberals.

Reply to Fivo
Fivo-

"spout?"
"racist tripe?"
"racist trophy liberals?"

You honestly don't have a thought in your head that wasn't planted there by the jew-controlled media, do you?

-Jim


Fin Location: ID
Reply # 121
Date: May 26, 2008 - 2:53 PM EST
Subject: A New Argument About Immigration
Phyllis Schlafly-

Thank you for your recent column, A New Argument About Immigration. I am, however, very disappointed that you did not immediately establish -- and focus on -- the most fundamental differences between contemporary immigrants and earlier immigrants: race (DNA) and the geo-biological incompatibility of the resultant various human organisms and cultures.

We risk losing Western Civilization because Caucasians and other races are genetically incompatible in the same society and geographical space, not simply because Central and South American Amerindians and Mestizos, and others, are “low-wage workers.”

Please continue your good work by including the most important reality -- the reality of race -- in your discussions.

-Jim
--------------------
Jim, Fin, whatever.

Please return to moveon.org and spout your racist tripe there. We're conservatives on TH, not racist trophy liberals.

It's time to act
The people who refuse to face the fact that Our President is part of the World movement to consolidate and have a one world government are going to be rudely awakened. The Amero has already been coined. I have held one in my American Sovereignty hand.
If it is pushed on us by a rabid government, then it is once again time to talk of Secession from this unholy union.
IF we can't get the Wall built against Mexico, then maybe we can seceed and get one built around the sane Americans who wish to have no part in THE SPP and the President who went behind the backs of Congress and the People of this country.( and to think I voted for him twice) He has really shown his true colors in this last term.
We need real leadership in this country and the Republicans and Democrats can't come up with it. So why not try the Constitution Party! It may be an uphill battle but at least we will have Constituional Leadership.

......
----With no jobs, no free benefits, and the threat of summary execution for committing crimes, the problem of illegal aliens destroying this country will vanish REALLY fast, one way or the other……….Beowulf----

Agreed. All illegal alien gang members [that’s virtually everyone in MS-13 and 18th Street] and any illegals convicted of murder/rape should be executed. No trial; if you’re are found to be a member or affiliated with these gangs -and other gangs- you will be summarily executed.

I don’t blame Mexicans for wanting to leave their sh*thole and come here to work, I blame our politicians for doing absolutely nothing to control the process. And on top of it they give these foreign nationals all the benefits reserved for legal citizens. It’s our open border sellout politicians who should be lined up against a wall in front of a firing squad. The Founding Fathers would have hanged these blatant traitors.


---These Americans are dead, a multitude of othes as well, all at the hand of illegal aliens. It isn't supposition, it is fact. And the fact is that these statistical unfortunates ought all to be alive……..enoughofthis----

I hold every open border dreg in congress responsible.

Why big business wants amnesty
It isn't for the low wages. They can have that with work visas. Big business wants forty million new Americans, keeping their money in the US and buying everything from toasters to used cars.

It is part of the myth that our economy can continue to grow forever. That some day we can have a population of one trillion and the dow is at 1 million.

There is a contrarian point of view. Limited resources will dictate a limit to growth. The question is this: will we realize this in time to stop Amnesty, or will we add these people only to see demand for food, water and gasoline drive us into bankruptcy and the waiting arms of our saviors - the Arabs. They will own our highways and our car factories long after we have stopped using oil.

The dems don't care about the long term, they just want the votes and the power. Voting for McCain won't stop it either. A vote for any democrat is a vote to damn all your decendants to poverty, crime and mediocrity.

Fin
Fin Location: ID
Reply # 121
Date: May 26, 2008 - 2:53 PM EST
Subject: A New Argument About Immigration
Phyllis Schlafly-

Thank you for your recent column, A New Argument About Immigration. I am, however, very disappointed that you did not immediately establish -- and focus on -- the most fundamental differences between contemporary immigrants and earlier immigrants: race (DNA) and the geo-biological incompatibility of the resultant various human organisms and cultures.

We risk losing Western Civilization because Caucasians and other races are genetically incompatible in the same society and geographical space, not simply because Central and South American Amerindians and Mestizos, and others, are “low-wage workers.”

Please continue your good work by including the most important reality -- the reality of race -- in your discussions.

-Jim
--------------------
Jim, Fin, whatever.

Please return to moveon.org and spout your racist tripe there. We're conservatives on TH, not racist trophy liberals.

Lower food prices is a myth
We may get lower food prices, but we more than make up for the savings in welfare, crime, prison populations, blighted areas, etc. AND many of them send the money they make to Mexico!


Simple solution to illegal invaders
As a thinking ultra-Conservative, let me tell you how (unfortunately, only in my dreams) we could take care of two Bush blunders together. Bring the troops home from Iraq immediately. Sorry, but I think the war is a horrible mistake Bush is either a lunatic, a moron or probably both. But the war is second on my list at this point. We should take half the troops and put them on the Mexican with orders to shoot anything that moves toward the border. The other half should fan out across this once great country with tattoo kits. They should tattoo the forehead of every illegal invader with a date sixty days from the date of finding them.
Make them understand that they will be shot on sight if they are caught on American soil on or after the date on their forehead. So damn simple, easy and costs effective!

It's just a hot dang joke anymore..
You can arrest, deport, imprison or wall them out all you like. Until someone cracks a can of whoopass, nothing is going to change.
What's the use?
An average citizen is not allowed to make a difference. The only legal option the average citizen has left is not to hire them in the first place. Sure you could call the INS but that's pretty much a joke too.
Someone relaxed the restrictions on immigration in response to a lack of laborers in this country. The low skilled workers that were citizens went on welfare as opposed to do the type of grueling work that the illegals now do. At first, they got the same wages as the few Citizen laborers did. The mostly legal immigrants went and told all their friends living in poverty back in their home countries.
In a span of ten years the American laborer became an endangered species due to relaxed regulations on immgration.
They were out numbered, out cultured, and out competed. How could the citizen-laborer be asked to compete with folks that don't play by the rules?
Those folks include the bosses that hire them. They are the importers of this labor pool that brings the third world to Candyland.
How's a self respecting American Laborer going to compete with the juggernaut that's enabled by unrestricted capitalism?
Wages plummented.
Some folks like to call all regulations bad. They like to De-regulate everything, even the borders.
The only thing a citizen can be expected to do is compete legally.
Citizen laborers are at a severe disadvantage in this type of situation.

Ethiopia
I just came back from Ethiopia and I ran into more English speakers than some neighborhoods in L.A.

Illegal Immigration: A Rich American...

Illegal Immigration: A Rich American’s Game

This is one of the best articles I have ever read about explaining the core issue behind illegal immigration. Congress has formed an unholy alliance with the lobbyist money changers in Washington to sell out small business and the middle class. Please read this article and tell me what you think.

By Froma Harrop

RCP-There’s a popular game in America that goes, I’ll cut your wages, but you don’t cut mine. And the outsourcing of your factory job to China is a good thing, because it makes my paycheck go further at Wal-Mart. We hear this theme a lot in the debate over illegal immigration.

Consider the recent raids on Swift meat-processing plants. Federal agents arrested 1,187 illegal immigrants at facilities in six states. Mere hours later, economists warned that depriving the industry of illegal labor could raise hamburger prices.

Illegal immigration is usually presented as a win-win situation: Undocumented foreigners earn far more than they could back home. Consumers get a bargain.

read more

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/illegal-immigratio n-a-rich-americans-game

No understand, amigo
Out here in California, it is wonderful. I have only been here for two months. So far, I am a foreigner in my own country. Hispanic radio and TV stations outnumber English. When I go to a restaurant, I would be the only customer who speaks English. The waitress tells me I talk funny, and I have to repeat myself over and over to get my food, and it still comes back wrong. More often than not, when I ask someone a question, I get a blank stare. They have no idea what I have just said. Little children playing together never speak or attempt to speak a single word of English. I wonder how these children will make a living when they grow up? They are destined to be life-long orange and avocado pickers. It reminds of China Town, where generations of Chinese stay in one isolated place, never having to learn English or speak very broken English. Spanish Town is a much greater problem than China Town, simply because of sheer numbers. It’s pretty sad, really, because one cannot become successful in another country without mastering their language. When a group as large as the Hispanic community makes no attempt to learn English, they are destined for poverty and a huge drain on the welfare system. And that means my hard-earned money will go to supporting these people. We need to stop the flow of illegals NOW. All three candidates are for open borders. McCain is the worst. It will be a cold day in hell before I vote for him.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda
Where were you people when Duncan Hunter was running for Prez?

With you guys we woulda been unbeatable.

Let's at least put Hunter in as Governor of California.

Let's take back the USA from the idiot-sellouts at least one state at a time.

Not to be taken seriously
No American should be taken seriously until personal accountability and personal responsibility are exampled by NOT partaking of the "government" intravenous system of redistribution of ANY kind.

To stand upon the soapbox of sanctimony espousing the financial woes of our nation as part of this issue while taking tax credits, et.al. and justifying your particular role in it, is pathetic and hypocritical.

The FairTax would alleviate the great majority of this garbage and absconding of American's hard earned dollars, but you can't get any politicians who "represent" the people to actually represent an idea whose time has come.

Everyone wants to rationalize their own personal situation by which they are stealing money from this nation.

What's your story?

What's your rationalization for stealing from you fellow Americans?

What's your excuse that you want an entitlement for?

Let the justifications begin.

Dear Bleeding Hearts
On February 19th of this year four school children were killed in Cottonwood, MN, twelve injured. Two of the four dead were brothers. This transpired when a twenty-four year old illegal alien from Central America ran a stop sign and slammed into the children's school bus. The illegl alien had been previously cited in 2006 for driving without a valid license and is an identity thief to boot.

In April, thirty-nine year old Tina Davilos, mother of five, was stabbed to death in front of a Houston area convenience store. Tina was fighting to prevent Mexican illegal alien Timoteo Rios from carjacking her vehicle, which contained her four month old baby daughter.

These Americans are dead, a multitude of othes as well, all at the hand of illegal aliens. It isn't supposition, it is fact. And the fact is that these statistical unfortunates ought all to be alive.

So bleeding hearts I ask you, what if one of these deaths directly involved one of your family members? Would you be able to dismiss it out of hand? Would your loved one simply be a sacrifice on the altar of affordable labor?

I haven't even scratched the surface regarding the dearth that illegal immigration costs this nation and its citizenry. Again, it isn't supposition, it is fact. This cancer needs stanched before it completely metastasizes; far too many Americans are paying far too high a price across the spectrum of existence and it is high time our elected officials either put up or shut up regarding their oaths.

We are and ought to be a generous nation, but we are wittingly or unwittingly becoming the author of our own demise.

Then to whom will the world appeal?

Hey leilanie !!!!! None Dare Call it ...
I took your suggestion and read the book you mentioned "None Dare Call it Conspiracy" by Gary Allen. It is actually now posted on the web so I didn't have to buy it.
Thirty some years ago I think I came across this book when it was first published and thought it was maybe a tad too extreme. After thirty years working on Wall Street, I don't think it is extreme anymore. Thanks for the heads up. I enjoyed it and I am afraid it just might be correct.

lightening_fast_draw
Nice excuse for illegals not wanting to recross the border- fear of being caught.

How about this, the grass is greener north of the border where you can break the law and get handouts. To boot, American leftists will give you money taken from productive citizens to keep you here. Nothing like expanding the victim class that props up a certain political party. While I do think that many illegals are here to work and take the money back home, those who are staying aren't here for fear of crossing a border going south.

beowulfe - even tougher on crime?
Executing illegal immigrants for any crime committed in the US seems a little bit bloodthirsty. After all, every illegal immigrant has committed a crime because they are here illegally. So in essence, you are advocating mass murder.
The easy way to handle this problem is to understand first, what the problem is. The vast majority of illegals from Mexico come here to work, not to live. They would much prefer going back home when their work is finished but many are now afraid to re-cross the border for fear of being caught. So instead, they settle here in the US.
Issuing work permits would be a source of revenue for the US government as would withholding taxes from their paychecks. Additionally, with the aging of the baby boomers we are going to be experiencing a shortage of workers which Mexicans can fill. As usual, we are spending huge amounts of money on a problem which should be a source of revenue.

Easy way to get rid of the criminals:
Here's an easy method of getting rid of every single one of the illegal criminal aliens in the US:

1) Pass a federal law that would impose a $1 million fine per offense for hiring the services of someone whom you know is not legally in this country. There are already easy-to-use means of checking someone's immigration status. This fine shall not only be imposed against corporations that do this, but also private individuals. If you can't pay it, you shall immediately lose your citizenship, then be deported to the same nation where the one you hire came from.

2) Withhold 100% of all federal funds for all purposes from any state that knowingly grants any benefits whatsoever to anyone not in the US legally.

3) Any crime committed by anyone not in this country legally shall be a federal level crime, and shall have a mandatory death penalty. Any crime at all. An illegal alien is caught jaywalking, it's the gas chamber for him.

4) Any illegal alien already in prison shall immediately be deported to whatever country they came from, and shall forever be banned from entering the United States. If they are found inside the United States, they shall be hanged from the neck until dead as invaders to this country.

With no jobs, no free benefits, and the threat of summary execution for committing crimes, the problem of illegal aliens destroying this country will vanish REALLY fast, one way or the other.

My parents were immigrants
They came here from India. However, my parents came here legally, and my dad had a Master's degree in Electrical Engineering from MIT, my mom had a Bachelor of Arts in the Fine Arts. My dad found a job with AT&T, my mom was a home-maker. Both my brother and I went to colleges and graduate school. We both are thoroughly assimilated. We fly an American flag on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July and we love this country.

I am all for legal immigration, but we have to follow Teddy Roosevelt's call for immigrants to become Americans. I also think we need to secure our borders and I see nothing wrong with carefully screening prospective immigrants not only for criminal records but also for job skills. I also don't think we should give welfare benefits or Social Security or Medicare to legal immigrants who have been here less than 5 years and illegals should not get any benefits.

I am sorry Mexico has poor people, but that is not our fault - that is the fault of the Mexican government that is a socialist government. Mexico could be a much wealthier country if they were more free market. Then the Mexicans would immigrate to the US at the same levels Canadians do, and we wouldn't have the problems we are currently having.

New Argument About Immigration (Taxes)
Here is another reason The Fair Tax is a good plan to change the tax system.
The Fair Tax is a nonpartisan proposal that re-
places all federal income and payroll taxes with
a progressive tax on consumption (National retail sales tax.
Visit: http://www.FairTax.org

What does assimilation mean today,
50 - 100 years ago people understood what it means to assimilate into the American.

America had a godly culture. Today as soon as you mention God you get into a fight.

45caliber
first lets talk facts.

you quote none.

if we need to see our money is spent wisely, please start with the iraq war and the billions that have been "lost".


do not get your facts from v-dare and cis and other such places as their facts are simply guesstimates based on trying to get thier market to continue clicking on their websites.
the more people that use thier website the more money they make.


two quick points
ad far as press 1 for english.

this is what you get in a capitalist economy.

there is a 20 billion dollar market out there and they speak spanish.

business has decided money is more important than speaking english, it is not political, just based on business.

the idea that illegals are bankrupting the social service system is just factually wrong.

welfare has gone down every year for 10 years and is at its lowest rate in 25 years.

The reductions in families and recipients on welfare over the last 6-plus years are over 21% and over 29%, respectively, which the country's overall population has increased by about 6-7%. The percentage of the population receiving welfare benefits has dropped from 1.95% at the end of 2000 to 1.32% in March 2007 -- a per-capita drop of almost one-third.

http://blog.cleveland.com/wideopen/2007/10/welfare_rolls_st ill_plunging_a.html

Quoting Facts:
The trouble with quoting facts such as the costs of illegal immigration is that the liberals don't want to hear them. As a result, they hurl insults instead to cover up the fact that they have no facts. We should simply keep quiet and hand them our money.

Facts show that illegal immigration is costing us billions every year. In this time of high costs, we need to see that our money is spent as wisely as possible. Giving it to people who knowingly break our laws isn't a wise way to spend it.

Thanks for that Fabulous Video! ...
That's enough ammunition against illegal immigration I've seen yet. We live in Texas and we are absolutely inundated. Wal Mart and Target stores are like Mexico and it seems more Mexicans than ever elect to speak Spanish. I asked one man for some information about the new Wal Mart Store (he was an employee) and he just stood there, smiling sheepishly, because he couldn't understand nor communicate with me at all. Just one little side effect.

Something I definitely learned today is that the Democrats want illegals here for the vote. What I didn't know is that Republicans want them here so that global business can grow through slave-labor wages.

Just for me - a problem. Is anyone out there having trouble with the new configuration for the Town Hall page? This started last Friday and all the articles are just squiggly lines. It's the same today. I have a question in to town Hall about it but have not yet had a reply. I have no problem pulling up comments. But, even going through http://www.Town Hall.com, I still find squigglies through the articles. Anyone else experiencing this problem?

Argument about Immigration
Her Numbers are a little off. No one ever talks about all the Cash the immigrants are getting paid with. That is never claimed for taxes.
If they are low wage workers why can they afford $130,000.00 homes and $30,000.00 Cars and Trucks. There Whole Economy is based around cash jobs. Live where they live and you will see.

No smart people allowded!
Isn't it interesting that the preferred immigration policy for Democrats is the lower the IQ of the immigrant, the faster we'll allow them to immigrate to the US? PhDs from Europe and Asia are on a 20-year waiting list to enter the US legally, but half witted morons from backwards, third world nations are welcome any time.

And yet Democrats STILL balk when I point out that Democrats are the party of stupid people. They're the ones keeping all the smart people out of the country, only allowing idiots in to vote.

OBAMA wants MORE welfare State

Obama a POTUS says he will expand the dysfunctional and rip of scam called the Peace Corps, He says USE your IVY league education to be a community activist:

WHO WILL make the appliances and furniture for his mega million dollar mansion:

OBAMA needs a refund on his IVY league education the only thing in his resume is being a community activist:

He is truly illiterate:
The only candidate in History who proposes to move everyone from WORK to welfare and to spread out into the WORLD and be activists around the world

Legal vs Illegal
I think the strongest argument for legal immigration vs illegal immigration is one I have made several times on TH and to which I have never received a response of any kind.

This is a nation of self-rule, of, by and for the people. If those people do not understand how our system of government works they can not sustain it. Legal Immigration provides an opportunity to insure that these new citizens hear and and can demonstrate some understanding on how this system works and their responsibilities in caring out their part in it.

Illegal Immigration does not. How can a government of self-rule by its citizens succeed if those citizens do not understand it?

I must always qualify that point by acknowledging that there are far too many natural born citizens who do not understand it either but that is a problem with a different cause albeit identical results.


ALL
Check out the Anti Liberal Zone (click on my name AND BOOKMARK IT) ASAP. One up on McShamnesty and his love for the human locust!

http://noliberalspin.blogtownhall.com/

Solution
Us Hard Working Tax Payers Will Just Quit! Im ready to just sell it all buy a small place and live on whatever i have accumulated, then when that runs out just find odd jobs to keep my basic needs met. Life would be simple and if we all took this attitude, the welfare state would not exist for long. Anyone else ready to throw in the towel and just break this country, so then maybe the Idiots in DC would get the Picture!

America fed itself with Imperialism
As a legal immigrant of 52 years and joining the Republican party also within the existing laws and even enforced by the than Commander in Chief at that time; yes, my observation all along has been, that especially after the WWII America has fed itself with nothing but the spirit of Imperialism.

The above in spite of the warming by none other than Dwight D. Eisenhower. Yes he spoke within the spirit of the Founding Fathers, whereas today America has converted itself into a fullfledged Empire, even more farreaching than the Brithish ever were. Yes, my Republican party actually leading the way as I can determine.

Yes, Ron Paul in reality the last hope for America to get back on track, an yet despised by my party that should know better. McCain the worst of them all, the one that reminds one of how another gun and shooting loving guy, who now "rests" somewhere with all his guns on top of him.

Yes, this nation was ripped out from a brutal empire to for once, start the world on a new road and yet nothing learned from the British? Yes, it seems like Ronald Reagan soon realized that there is nothing more powerful than to confronting the Soviet System by facing them with words to their face, hence it evaporated.

Sadly, George W. and his cronies have completely destroyed the bridge of freedom Ronald Raeagan built right smack into the heart of Russia. And from what one hears from McCain he will finish to destroy what George W. left for him to do, while the National Debt grows by leaps and bounds?

Thomas Jefferson said this: "The principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale". So America is full speed ahead doing exactly that; swindling the next generation of Americans, right?








A time to say no
There's a lady in my Church who is a Foster parent and an amazing one at that! She currently has 12 children in her home and they take up two very well-bahaved pews in our chapel. I've seen her transform children who have been severly abused and have huge behavior problems into sweet loving little kids.

My point is that even she has to say no sometimes. While she would like to take every child that comes into Foster Care, she simply doesn't have the room or resources to do so.

So yes, all the world are God's children, but that doesn't magically make the US capable of sustaining them all.

And lodestar, don't forget how McCain lied about Romney the day before the election, giving Mitt no time to respond to the lie. He claimed Mitt wanted to withdraw from Iraq. That was huge with Florida voters. But it was a lie. He's a slimy politician who would stop at nothing to attain the presidency. Look at the 8 ear long tantrum he threw after losing the nomination in 2000. He truly is shameless.

Why anyone thinks he's going to do anything conservative if elected is beyond me. He doesn't have any more chance than Bush of getting an up/down vote on constitutionist judges. Who will lead HIS gang of 14? And he's still PROUD of that.

why are we stuck with McAmnesty?
Several have expressed angst about how we could have gotten stuck with amnesty John when over 70% of the public wants ILLEGALS stopped and gradually repatriated if possible (it IS possible!). The RINO nomination was decided by Florida really. A crowded field allowed Romney, the preacher Huckster, and Fred to split the anti-ILLEGAL vote-- even Amnesty John PRETENDED to have changed his tune-- he brayed disingenuously, "We got America's message."
Sen. Mel Martinez told Hispanics in Spanish in Fla. that Amnesty John was their man-- that pretty much decided the nominee.

McAmnesty NEVER got a majority of even Republican vote, AND he lied about a change of heart on ILLEGALS, but the MSm kept helping him with polls purporting to show electability. At a crucial time, special interests favoring ILLEGALS rallied behind him, so we ended up with open border, CFR globalists on both sides. Amnesty John now wants to treat ILLEGALS as "God's children"... OK, let's kindly send them back to Mexico where ILLEGAL Mexicans belong!

Legal immigration too high
I think the point of Ms. Shlafly's article is that legal immigration is too high even if you take illegals out of the equation. Currently, the USA grants about a million green cards per year. Thats more than the whole rest of the world combined from what I've read. Sure, the line and thus the wait is long. But that's because there are sooooo many people trying to get to America.

Due to the welfare state and the bad blood caused by illegal immigration, America is not assimilating these newcomers as well as it used to.

Do we really want assimilation troubles like Italy, Belgium, Luxembourg, Germany, France and Spain are experiencing from too much LEGAL immigration? The melting pot is melting very well anymore...

Reply to Taft at 3:38p
You stated, "Seriously, are you going to want the government to deny pregnant women who come to the hospital, and yet be anti-abortion at the same time?"

You make it sound so heartless to ask that a pregnant woman in the last trimester (not emergency care) have her baby at her own expense or go back to her own country to have it. Should the mother of my children take a trip to Canada when she's pregnant to have the baby for free and then fly back home? Would Canadians be called xenophobes for objecting?

Imagrant
PS My great-grand-father a native of Scotland fought for four years to free the slaves in the Civil War. It now looks as if his sacrafice was in vane.
Are we enslaving our grandchildren with the wreckless spending by government today?
It doesn't matter who, democrate or republican, they all have spenditus when their party is in charge.

lodestar post may 26 at 9:45
Great list! However, you left one out. You mentioned that the federal prison population is 30% illegal, but you left out the State and county jails. Sheriff Arpaio in Arizona reported close to a 30% rate as well.

Illegal immigration
What upsets me the most is how employers treat each legal and illegal workers in CA. If you are a fireman, a policeman, a field worker, etc., you are expected to work for wages far to low to live where the work is. You either commute for hours a day to provide your family a home, or you rent a spot on a floor in eight hour shifts. You have little respect from your employer be they from the market place or government. If you are an illegal you make what you can and send most of your money home, provided your employer doesn't suddenly decide you ar illegal and turn you in to INS without pay. It doesn't matter if you were born in the state, exploitation is the norm. At retirement I couldn't leave quick enough to find a home I could afford on a boarderline poverty retirement and still be in the country I love.

Our reps. both Dem. amd Reps.
have refused to listen to the public even though the *conprehensive* immig. reform bill last summer was soundly defeated by citizen protest.

Now, there's a bill in Congress that would override all local and state laws on immigration like Hazelton, PA, and virtually make the entire US a sanctuary city.

You should contact your Congressmen and tell them that they should continue building the fence they already voted for and funded and that you do not want laws restricting police from asking illegals their immig. status or forcing more Am. citizen social services be granted criminals who should not be in the country.

Moreover, we should work for a law to change the nitwit Sup. Ct. ruling that any baby born here to illegals is automatically a US citizen and revise Teddy Kennedy's law that grants *rights of family reunion* that then brings all the 2nd cousins of the babies born to illegals into the country LEGALLY!!!!!

lodestar
I do get a newsletter from numbersusa....I don't read it as often as I should, obviously!

I agree with you about the immigration problem.

The thing that frustrates me the most is that 70% (at least) of Americans (obviously this crosses the aisle to both political parties and others) want a secure border and our laws be enforced.

If this is true, how do we accept the candidates that we have for POTUS? How did they ever get there if WE THE PEOPLE have a voice???

I often said that it wouldn't matter which party the candidate was from, if they were CREDIBLE about this issue they'd win in a landslide.

Instead we get the pitiful traitors we have as our 'choice'

It's nuts. Stop by my blog and be sure to let me know when you get yours up and running.


Wish we could do it this way, but
Taylor - 7:43 PM EST
Break the back of the Welfare State

Let's encourage illegal immigration so we can break the back of the welfare state.
-----
We cannot
The government has a printing press giving themselves and endless supply of money.
The more the pay out the higher the prices of all goods and service.

This is the MAJOR cause of gasoline and food prices rising.
Inflation from printing "money".


Most countries,
including small Island nations, have a set requirement to become a citizen. I believe it was Costa Rica where you must have at minimum $60k to deposit in their bank, a job, offer of employment, or become an employer who hires CR natives, or can show that you have at least $2k coming in every month via pension, ($2K is a little better than average cost of living)proof that you'll be there at least 6 months out of the year, and a few other minor things TO BECOME A CITIZEN.

The point being that most nations make you prove that you have the ability to provide for yourself and your family and are able to contribute to the nation in at least the same manner native citizens can. But most nations want you to be a genuine asset so expect you to immigrate with slightly more resources than the average citizen.

That is, every nation EXCEPT the U.S. Because of left wing socialist traitors, we allow endless flows of all kinds of immigrants who drain our resources and economy. We welcome vagrants, security risks, seperatists, just anybody. Liberals bash 75% of the populace for wanting to control the flow with a cut off number yet fail to acknowledge that we have the laxist of all immigration standards compared to any nation on the planet.

.......
Until our political jackals children are murdered by illegals we wont see any change; they couldn't care less if your child is murdered by an illegal. It is anarchy at our southern border and our politicians will stop at nothing to ensure that the invasion and destruction of our nation continues. Other than hanging our political misfits I don’t see what can be done to remedy this epic disaster; congress is a cesspool of sellouts and whores with few who stand for the American people. Burn it down.

"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions,
it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty......

And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost
in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."

-Thomas Jefferson

thanks for the appreciation
re:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Mrs. Paddy Location: CA
Reply # 60
Date: May 26, 2008 - 12:45 PM EST

lodestar--

Why don't you open a blog here on TH to post the information you gave here today. It would be appreciated!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

My thanks to several of you who expressed appreciation for my various posts here today. I am indeed overdue to set up a blog. I fundamentally believe that the ILLEGAL alien invasion, pervasion decimation and of America is the most insidious threat to our socio-economic well-being.

If you just tuned in, here is some important reference info:

Just below are the official contact sites for Congress... a few clicks, and you can EASILY send e-mails. Even easier--> NumbersUSA gives you FREE, prepared e-mails to send, and even targets your people in Congress for you. BOOKMARK THESE, and get engaged today! america is too special to lose!

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm
http://www.numbersusa.com/actionbuffet




Break the back of the Welfare State
Legal immigration is good, illegal immigration is better. I have never heard a bunch of faux-conservatives argue in favor of another government beauracracy. Small government is better isn't it. Let's encourage illegal immigration so we can break the back of the welfare state.

Catholic Church Supports Invaders
Taft wrote:

"Benedict has calibrated his immigration stance with care, stating the need to protect family unity and immigrants’ human rights, but pointedly avoiding any specifics of the American immigration debate, like the issue of whether to grant legal status to illegal immigrants. Yet last week his visit quickly stirred the crosscurrents of the debate."

Catholic bishops in the US are enabling the invasion, giving direct aid and comfort to the invader, instructing them in how to fraudulently obtain benefits, and assisting them in evading apprehension and deportation. Parishioners are being pressured from the pulpit to condone the massive influx of illegals, a large number of whom are Catholic.

It is every true American's duty to make the invader's life so miserable here their home country looks better in comparison. One way to help that effort will be to remove the Catholic Church's tax exempt status, and seizing the property that the Catholics are using to facilitate the invasion.

lodestar
Exactly - like there couldn't possibly be any other reason to not want millions and millions of people to come here.

When the Statue of Liberty was erected with the caption, 'Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free...' we didn't have food stamps, welfare and socialized health care paid by those who pay taxes. We didn't even have taxes. People were welcomed and expected to carry their own load.

Now that the taxpayer is expected to foot the bill for most of these people, it is a different story. And especially when these people come here illegally which starts them off breaking our laws, and takes away from those coming in through the legal route.

But as that video shows so starkly, we simply cannot assimilate that many people! Reason, facts and logic say it's time to STOP. And it has nothing to do with bigotry!

Steve - another loophole
you're on the mark....put pregnant illegal women on the bus back to where she was born and let her have her child in her own country...

we must stop the anchor baby program...that's the real draw...cuz once they're born here, it's the beginning of the beginning of the welfare life for them.

ad hominems about racism
It is interesting how quickly the left and the bitter anti-America ilk (e.g., hackneyed hak, Akagi, et al) will hurl the tried and true calumny "racism and xenophobia" toward groups like numbersusa. Such ad hominems are surely the masks of iconoclastic scoundrels.

They bray that the data of such groups are unfounded, though they do not cite refuting data. They also fail to note that many groups such as the Heritage Foundation and even PEW Hispanic produce myriad data damning to ILLEGAL aliens.

We are all entitled to our own opinions, but we are not entitled to our own facts and truths.
About 3/4 of Americans are opposed to the plethora of plagues visited upon us by ILLEGALS-- perhaps we should not believe our lying eyes.

HAK - Wrong again
I visited one the site with all the 'hate' group links. It listed the typical KKK groups, which I agree are hate groups, but also listed several 'anti-gay' groups and had some antisemitic crap on their site. Basically, ALL groups that are against unfettered immigration are considered 'hate' groups by that site.

And I searched for LaRaza, but couldn't find it listed anywhere as a hate site. I didn't feel it necessary to look into any of your other links.

Taft - I didn't mean our country would turn into a third world nation because of the 'nature' of Mexicans or any other immigrant group. You read something into my thoughts that isn't there. I think it would because this country doesn't have the resources to take care of that many people and too many of the immigrants are as Phyllis mentioned, very poor and in need of too many services. We simply can't addimilate that many people.

Maybe stop assuming bigotry where there is none.

Why the Republican malaise?


I was an unpaid volunteer in Atlanta in the Reagan campaigns for POTUS, and even also worked for Daddy Bush, though with an instinctive reluctance that he was a
faux/RINO Eastern Republican. I have voted for the more conservative candidate for POTUS for 40 years.

The less intelligent son Presidente Jorge Bush has screwed up royally on 2 key issues that Amnesty John is in sync with-- making a neoCON war on the wrong bad Arabs, and embracing ILLEGAL aliens. These are symptomatic of why conservative Republicans are dispirited. Each blunder will cost American taxpayers a FORTUNE with long-term detrimental effects, even as Jorge also grew govt. influence and largess (NCLB and Rx Care for Seniors) and spent $ like a drunken sailor 'Crat. The left-leaning RINO party needs a wakeup call.

Amnesty John McQuisling has appointed Smilin' Juan Hernandez to be his "Hispanic Outreach" adviser (to coordinate the Reconquista). The myopia of many RINO's on the open border, "'cheap' labor is good" agenda is stunning and flummoxing. It is fool's gold to fathom that these ignorant, indigent with supposed
"conservative social values" would EVER vote as conservatives simply because a minority of established, middle class Hispanics have done so. What, pray tell, is "conservative" about penchants toward serious crimes, drugs, gangs, dropouts, barrio blight, illegitimacies, and social service decimation?!?!

Obama is a socialist in Pied Piper clothing, but the thought of supporting Amnesty John is like bleeding a patient to cure him-- if the body politic survives, it will be a miracle. What a Hobson's Choice! I will sit this dance
out until the dreadful music dies... perhaps a protest vote for Bob Barr.

See a pattern here yet?
Free Immigration into a welfare state is something we can't have. But it's just one item on a farly long list.
This ethanol from corn madness is another item. Others are selective law enforcement, affirmative action, excess PC guilt and victimhood, free trade with coolie societies, cartels controlling oil supply.

Culturally we are declining. Lousy music on the radio (anyone still hear radio stations playing the current weekly Top 20 pop and rock songs from Billboard's list? Every station I listened to, quit a long time ago (obvious reason: American's can't put out enough decent music worth listening to anymore).

Trash on the TV (try to watch TV with your family and you'll just see a bunch of erectile dysfunction remedy commercials, frequently interspersed
about once a day with a subtle anti-typical American commercial), plus the content and inuendo on many of the sit-coms, including ones directed towards younger audiences, would never be accpeted even just 20 years ago)

Searching the Internet cannot be done
without exposure to "adult" material. (The default settings on
the most-used search engines, Google and Yahoo, DON'T filter out "adult" content, and their settings are not easily adjusted by novice users. In fact, the filtering settings are accessible only on the advanced search pages, and even there they are
deliberately out of sight down on the second page, so you have to opt for an advanced search, then scroll down to locate and adjust the filtering
every time you run a search, which is too impractical soo no one does). The search engines do this to us because doing so makes them more money, and no one stops them with a complaint or a class action lawsuit or something.

People have either run out of time to become involved or just don't care. Denatured, lacking in moral fiber.
Falling asleep.

The sad reality
We live in a welfare state, which makes this objection not only valid, but overarching. When large-scale violations of the rights of Americans are resulting from it for whatever reason, you don't ask Americans to continue to take it so that foreigners and their employers can exercise their free market rights without bother. You start fixing the problems first, so that Americans can survive, and you open up immigration as these problems get fixed.

The statists got us into this mess, but if anyone wants open immigration, they are going to have to repeal the welfare state, in all its manifestations, because there is no such thing as a right to live off of others; they are going to have to tighten voter identification because there is no such thing as a right to cast a fraudulent vote; they are going to have to secure the border because there is no such thing as a right to sneak across a border; and they are going to have to get a process in place to ensure that anyone who needs a work visa gets one before they arrive in country, because it is a legitimate function of the state to document the entry of non-citizens.

Joyyy knows without learning
I appreciate your personal reply. It indicates that you did not read even one line out of my writings about immigration, and you did not see my videos. Therefore, I feel that it is justified to say that you are one of those who know without learning. BTW, this is the kind of crowd that the Master of Deception addresses.

Henryk A. Kowalczyk
http://www.henrykkowalczyk.com


Immigrants?
Those who come here lawfully and obey our laws, learn our language and help us to build a better America will always be welcome.

Those who come here to steal from us and to victimize Americans should be severely punnished.
Returning them to the border is not punishment.
Keeping them in our jails and prisons is a luxury to them.
We should outsource all non citizen prisoners to foreign prisons by lowest bidder.
Repeat offenders should be SOLD on the Sudan Slave market!
America should not have to tolerate Americans being kidnapped, murdered, raped and robbed along our Southern Border.
It will continue to worsen until we do something about it!

This is only a partial solution;
http://hotair.com/archives/2008/01/19/mexican-state-whines- about-influx-of-mexican-workers/

rigdone
My heart goes out to you and I am sorry that your Father was treated so poorly. May God bless him today and always. You have every right to be angry about the situation you described.

We are either a country of laws or we are not. I keep waiting for the good people of this country to take a stand but what can you do when the members of both political parties are cowards with regard to this issue.

Take care and may God Bless your family.

off topic but revalent
This is off topic of illegal immigration but since Mclame supports that this is revelent because he also supports the AGW fraud and Kyoto. A study (by liberals) has found that the U.N. program for AGW in which the “rich” countries who are supposed to be paying for “poor” countries like China to cut carbon is being fraudulently administered. LOL, a program based on fraud to steal money from the West wasn’t good enough. They have to also have fraud in the program itself.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/may/26/climatech ange.greenpolitics/print


Enforce Immigration Laws On The books
We already have laws on the books that make it Illegal to enter this country without following legal procedures. Enforce them. Patrol the Border, turn them back at the border. As for those who hire them, arrest them since they are already breaking the law. If you Dry UP the places of Employment, and cut off all Aid to them, they will go home. ARREST ALL ILLEGALS WHO ARE PRESENTLY IN THE COUNTRY. ARREST EVERYBODY THAT HIRES THEM OR HAS EVER HIRED THEM. MAKE THEM PAY AND PAY, JUST LIKE YOU AND ME HAVE TO PAY WHEN WE BREAK A LAW. START IN TOWNS AND COUNTIES. POLICE DO NOT MIND ARRESTING LEGAL CITIZENS FOR BREAKING LAWS. SHERIFF'S DEPTS. DO NOT MIND ARRESTING FOLKS IF THEY ARE CITIZENS. WHY ARE ILLEGALS AND THOSE WHO HIRE THEM ABOVE THE LAW??????????

Emma Lazarus revisited
In 1883 the poet Emma Lazarus wrote “The New Colossus”, a poem familiar to most and engraved on a bronze plaque at the base of the Statue of Liberty.

Here’s my revised interpretation of her poem updated to our needs in the 21st century. Century.

{Give me your well educated, your highly skilled,
Your honest, energetic, law–abiding citizens
Yearning to assimilate and contribute to a Free nation.
The most gifted and talented of your teaming shores,
The best and brightest; send these to me.
For them, I lift my lamp beside the golden door.
Others need not apply.}


Joyyyy
Mexico is a third world country because of the system they live in and historical past, not because of some inherent quality the individual person possesses. The dynamics that might make America into a 3rd world country may well be in the works, but because of immigrants.

I found a fascinating study on this here..

"Hernando de Soto got some researchers to conduct a famous experiment: to attempt to get all the legal approvals needed to set up a small textile concern in Lima, Peru. It took 289 days of dealing with the bureaucracy, just to get the legal approvals. The same exercise in Miami, Florida (also a largely Hispanic city nowadays) took less than a day. It is perfectly obvious where there will be more economic activity, and where people will be more prosperous."

http://www.ipa.org.au/files/news_520.html

Bigjer
Your idea is also a good one. Actually, a very good one. It would help keep the cost of food down and since we are stuck paying for their healthcare and upkeep anyway, it wouldn't add to those costs like illegals do.

The falacy of low food prices using illegal invaders is that yes, the food costs are lower, but the costs are more than made up for in the areas of healthcare, closed hospitals, food stamps, blighted areas, higher crime, etc.

We need to get State propositions started.

PS to HAK and others - The video that is right on the money I referenced was the one I linked, not anything of haks.

Can't hurt to list it again:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4094926727128068265 &q=numbersusa&hl=en


HAK - A victim of liberal brainwashing
The video is right on the money. Your links are quite biased. They paint anyone who is against illegal invaders and too high levels of legal immigration as 'haters' and 'racists' which is hyberbole. I see who is behind your links. I would view THEM as the racists and haters.

I'm not a racist, I simply understand that unchecked immigration is going to turn my country into a third-world nation just like the ones the immigrants are trying to get out of.

oldsocialworker - 'comparing people to gumballs' LOL Yet more proof that liberalism is a psychiatric disorder. Liberals are highly allergic to facts. *sigh*






Illegal Immigration
I also agree that we dont have much to pick from for Pres. but the only reason I will vote for McCain is that he promised that he would have all border states certify that fences were built.

I am in favor of a change of our law from illegal entry only being a misdeamnor, to a Felony with a Mandatory Prison term of 3 years, and then deportation....2nd offense, 5 years,

Look up Mexico's own ILLEGAL Entry laws.....

IN truth, We dont need any farm workers...NONE...!!!

All we have to do is take away the "weights" from prisons, and offer the jobs to convicts who would love to work outside of the walls, for 8 hours in the free air, and pay them .25 cents an hour, and keep half of their pay until they are released for walking around money.

In their language, they must also be told that,if they try to escape, THEY WILL BE SHOT AND KILLED, UNDERSTOOD..???

NOW, THE "cHEAP " LABOR THAT THE FARMERS ARE LOOKING FOR IS EVEN BETTER THAN WHAT 'ILLEGALS' WILL WORK FOR.

ILLEGALS " WOULD SELF-DEPORT BECAUSE OF THE NEW LAW AND PRISON, AND WE COULD GET BACK TO "our" AMERICA, OUR WAY OF LIVING, WITH OUT BANKRUPTING HOSPITALS AND CLINICS, AND PUSHING # 1 FOR ENGLISH....

surreptitious machinations by Jorge,etc.

The U.S.-Mexico Totalization Agreement... ever heard of it?

Most people have no knowledge whatsoever of the subterfuge played here to effect this... many in Congress were surprised by things that Presidente Jorge Bush committed to with his amigo Vicente Fox. Now the new president of Mexico is openly calling HERE for ILLEGAL aliens to protest in the streets for their
"rights." Did you wonder why the govt., in consort with a drug smuggler, went after border
guards Campean and Ramos simply for doing their jobs? Because Presidente Jorge Bush wanted to influence the close Mexican election by assuring them that their wretched and ignorant would really be welcome here. While in Mexico in early 2007, Traitor Jorge promised them in Espanol to work to assure passage of Kennedy-McTraitor scamnesty for THEM, Mexican citizens! Did you vote for Presidente Jorge Bush to represent Mexicans?!

http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/back904.html
http://www.numbersusa.com/hottopic/totalization.htm
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2006/7/2/21483 4.shtml?s=lh
http://www.house.gov/paul/tst/tst2007/tst010807.htm
http://www.ssa.gov/pressoffice/factsheets/USandMexico.htm

Immigration problems
When a worker who has paid for 40 years of social security taxes becomes terminally ill he is denied Social Security disability; while an immigrant over the age of 62 is given social security disability benefits without ever paying into the system. The immigrant is eligible immediately upon entering the country on a visa obtained by relatives who pledged to be financially responsible for them for five years.
Now I must find a way to forgive a system that offered my father $66. a month social security at age 62 in 1970 after losing his government retirement when he was forced to resign 2 years short of the 20 years required for government pension. Dad worked another 7 years and social security still wasn't enough to live on when he was 69 so he put a bullet in his heart because he didn't want to be a burden on the family.
My husband and I were serving our country in the Air Force in Okinawa, SSgt and Airman 1st class. I had sent Dad money for a airline ticket to come live with us but he chose suicide. I don't want to be bitter but Jesus needs to help me on this one.

Evidence of the clandestine agenda

If you want to read a bit about the North American Union and the related ecurity and Prosperity Partnership, check out the Bush White House's own publication on some of it below.

In 2004, while visiting in Mexico, RINO globalist, open border Presidente Jorge Bush surreptitiously committed America to send S.S. funds south to Mexico even for those who had worked here only as ILLEGAL aliens... this later stunned many in Congress when they learned about it. In early 2007, Jorge told them in Spanish down in Mexico that he would be working hard for THEM, Mexican citizens, to assure passage of Kennedy-McAmnesty here. Many consider that nothing short of treason!

Anyone who brays about "conspiracy theorists" really needs only read a little bit to learn that there is no "theory" involved. Presidente Jorge has been hell-bent on effecting a North American Union. If you have liked NAFTA, perhaps you will love what they have planned for you.

Personally, I would rather have been asked to vote first on such agendas... so even would many in Congress.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/03/20050323-1. html
http://www.spp.gov/index.asp
http://www.libertygunrights.com/NAUFactSheet.pdf

opposition efforts:
http://www.numbersusa.com/index
http://www.grassfire.org/
http://www.grasstopsusa.com/
http://stopspp.com/stopspp/?page_id=11
http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/
http://www.citizensunited.org

Steve
Seriously, are you going to want the government to deny pregnant women who come to the hospital, and yet be anti-abortion at the same time?

protest vote time
re:
McCain apparently cannot wait to initiate a new amnesty program after a sham showing of enforcing the border. I cannot even hold my nose and vote for him, I hope the ballot has the option for "None of the Above."
************************************************
I presume that Georgia's own Bob Barr will be on the ballot here... for the first time in 40 years of voting, I will make a protest vote for him. Amnesty John McQuisling is patently unacceptable... the supercilious old goat is arrantly lying about hearing America's message. Like Presidente Jorge, he made a Faustian deal for Hispanic and miscreant employer support, and the majority can just go to heil as far as he cares!

The remote rich LIKE their ILLEGAL alien domestic help... THEIR children do not go to schools decimated by them... and THEIR neighborhoods will not be burdened with barrio blight.

Krikorian's main point being missed
Reading these posts I'm not seeing Krikorian's and the author's main point: the current level of LEGAL immigration is far too high, let alone illegal immigration. Mr. Krikorian published a big study a few months ago on this very topic but it got little press other than on C-SPAN.

I saw Lou Dobbs say on his show last night that he favors INCREASED legal immigration. Perhaps Dobbs hasn't read Mr. Krikorian's study yet.

marxist may day marchers
the marchers must be the most uninformed or educated people. abundant ignorance.

they hold signs that are anti george bush.
he wants to make them citizens. lower class but citizens.

they hold signs that praise cesar chavez.
he had his union workers call the INS (ICE) when illegal aliens showed up in the growers fields.
he stated that he was totally on the anti illegal alien side. they undermined the jobs and wages of u.s. workers.

now i understand the pro che, fidel, hugo signs and t-shirts. ignorant ammerica hatint peasants led by the marxists coalition.

they want to walk the gringos up the pyramid and cut out their hearts. i heard that at work.

adios,
Jarvey
Lancaster, Mexifornia
dial 1 for english

Another loophole
Tax payers are paying for the delivery of illegal's children in Arizona and I don't mean in the emergency room! I found out that DES (The Dep of Economic Security) is paying for anybody with financial need who applies for funding for childbirth in the last trimester without regards to citizenship. The hospital and OB/GYN get paid and the taxpayer gets screwed.

What's also surprising is we here in Arizona thought we passed some tough anti illegal immigration bills effective Jan 1,08 but not one business has been prosecuted yet for hiring illegals.

hypocrisy once again


Much as I respect Ms Schlafly, this article has its faults.

She says this is a "new" argument against immigration, both legal & illegal. But there's no new argument.

She cites the same remedies that have made no difference over the entire Reagan-Clinton-Bush terms. Throw out those "invaders" from Mexico.

Yet we all know the illegal alien is routinely deported. If he's deported, how has he "stolen" our country? How has he exploited our public services? His main offense is that he returns. He re-enters illegally because Americans hire his services. There is no question he'd still come, even if all public assistance were unavailable to him.

We only need to give repeat offenders the punishment any lawbreaking citizen receives. Three strikes you're out. Go to prison for a mandated minimum sentence. At the same time, make employers serve time should they knowingly hire an illegal alien.

On the plus side; we should employ every willing farm laborer at a fair wage depending on his/her Green Card, without which he can't be hired. There really are no other alternatives. Unless the United States is willing to install land mines along the fence now standing at our southern border.

Which is draconian and uncivilized.

.

you cannot go home again
... so wrote Thomas Wolfe about the resulting disillusionment. Our first home 30 years ago was in Roswell, Ga. It had been decidedly upper middle class suburbia. We drove thru there the other day and were stunned to see Hispanic business signs pervading.

Our former neighborhood had deteriorated, partly because ILLEGALS had invaded and overpopulated houses like a plague of roaches. Where there had once been upwardly mobile neighborhood pride there is now barrio blight developing. Interestingly, there is no ignorant manual labor employment such as food processing nearby. Someone living in Silver Spring,- Md. noted this same thing recently-- homes and yards going to hell because of ILLEGAL Hispanics.

Those who deny these inimical/pernicious realities and omens are like those in Germany in the 30's who denied that Hitler would do some of those things he had written about...

Juan mccain
mccain is going to speak to the xenophobic racist organisation: LA RAZA. he thinks he can get a few thousand votes from them.
ironically, he will lose hundreds of thousands of votes from conservatives.

viva la raza,

A. B. Normal
Lancaster, Greater Aztlan
dial 1 for english
p.s. who are the real racists?

Wave goodbye to America!
Phyllis Schlafly, as always, has hit the nail on the head and has again sounded the alarm of one of the major threats to our country. This is especially important because the MSM and most politicians rarely refer to it, even in this election year.

I agree with earlier posters who see the outrageous malfeasence on the part of elected representatives.
One does not have to be a rocket scientist to see the harm being done to our country by this invasion of immigrants, both legal and illegal. This out of control threat could well sound the death knell to the America
we all know.
Despite the overwhelming evidence of this threat, all the presidential candidates vow to grant amnesty to the millions and millions of illegals in our country. McCain apparently cannot wait to initiate a new amnesty program after a sham showing of enforcing the border. I cannot even hold my nose and vote for him, I hope the ballot has the option for "None of the Above." Bush is another traitor with his stealth conspiracy to surrender our nation's sovereignty.
Bush obviously thinks that because of his "superior intellect" he does not need to consult the great unwashed and stupid American people.


the Conspiracy Of Evil


re:
"Judging by results the support for immigration control is a mile wide, but an inch deep. The primaries proved it. Every voter wanted it, but wanted something else more."

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The biggest problem here is that the money and organization (hence power) is on the pro-ILLEGAL side. These forces include an unlikely, strange bedfellow alliance between groups which want to use them in different ways--> the Conspiracy Of Evil.

Miscreant employers simply want to exploit their labor-- screw the myriad egregious socio-economic problems they will foist upon America. The PC left wants to get them voting and seize permanent control for big entitlement government. The scandal-plagued Catholic Church needs replacement bodies for the pews; and they can put more in the collection plates in America than in Mexico. Ethnocentric Hispanic groups really do want an effective Reconquista, so they hide behind claims of racism and pleas for PC multiculturalism. Finally, the remote elites including the liberal MSM do not see what all the fuss is about; besides, they LIKE their cheap ILLEGAL maids and yard-workers, and THEIR kids will not go to schools with "those people."

Over 70% of America is righteously indignant about ILLEGAL aliens:

"Compared to other problems facing the country, how big a problem is ILLEGAL immigration?"

One of the most important-- 27%
Important-- 54%
--
total 81%

http://www.pollingreport.com/immigration.htm
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=research_res earchd74c
http://www.worldandi.com/newhome/public/2003/december/cipub 2.asp

A New Argument About Immigration
Phyllis Schlafly-

Thank you for your recent column, A New Argument About Immigration. I am, however, very disappointed that you did not immediately establish -- and focus on -- the most fundamental differences between contemporary immigrants and earlier immigrants: race (DNA) and the geo-biological incompatibility of the resultant various human organisms and cultures.

We risk losing Western Civilization because Caucasians and other races are genetically incompatible in the same society and geographical space, not simply because Central and South American Amerindians and Mestizos, and others, are “low-wage workers.”

Please continue your good work by including the most important reality -- the reality of race -- in your discussions.

-Jim

Don't just curse the darkness...


... get involved to save America! Middle Americans JUST LIKE YOU have stopped scamnesty so far, but it is an ongoing challenge against monied, powerful, organized special interests! As Mexifornia residents can attest, we risk losing America soon due to ILLEGAL alien voter fraud, the Reconquista agenda, and morphing ineluctably into a third world welfare state as they vote it in. The left is not waiting for them to become citizens-- why be bothered by that mere technicality?! They load them up in vans and hand them instructions in Espanol on how to vote. It is "40 acres and a mule/we're your friends" all over again.

Many RINOS/CINO'S are utter FOOLS to speak of capturing some of their votes because of purported "conservative social values." [What, pray tell, is "conservative" about wanton penchants toward crime, drugs, gangs, illegitimacies, ignorance/dropouts, barrio blight and balkanization, tax dodging, and identity fraud?!?!]

Legal, middle class Hispanics sometimes vote as conservatives, but ILLEGALS will vote 95:5 for entitlement government, thus soon inexorably morphing America irretrievably into a welfare state third world country, partly because they will insist that their myriad indigent, ignorant relatives all come here as well. Even a liberal demographer has admitted that ILLEGAL immigration will become the "the mother of all unfunded mandates for government largess."

If we do not stop ILLEGALS soon, it will be TOO LATE. Join the fight by rattling cages in Congress; you can reach them directly here at their official sites, or send targeted free e-mails via NumbersUSA... bookmark the sites, and get involved ASAP! America would be a terrible thing to lose... just look at Mexifornia as a harbinger of the national barrio to come.

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm
http://www.numbersusa.com/index

immigration
Let us not forget that one of the fuels of immigration is the population explosion going on in poor countries. The global gag rule ,invented by Reagan, to appease the anti-abortion folks cut off family planning $ to poor countries. The result family planning clinics closed and poor women living on $1-2.00 a day could no longer afford contraceptives. The result, thousands of unplanned, unwanted babies born in countries who can't grow their economies fast to provide jobs for them. Do you stay put and die or immigrate and hope for the best.

If we do happen to develop a way to shut down the flow immigration out of Mexico best we do it carefully. Immigration is a safety valve for that country governed by corrupt leaders. Without that release it will easily fall into chaos. Think we have an immigration problem now. Just what will happen if it falls into civil war. Look at the mass of immigration d out of Iraq into neighboring Jordan and Syria. the problem could get MUCH worse.

Do You Want To Keep Your Country?


We the People of the United States of America have the right to have our borders and our laws respected and enforced.

Citizens of other countries illegally in our country have no right to demand anything from our government. They most certainly have the right to petition the governments of their home countries for change if they are unhappy with their home country. If they want to be Americans, we have a path to citizenship, more generous than any other nation, and it starts in their home country.

We need to insist on the equal protection, application and enforcement of the law or devolve into anarchy. Our Republic only functions if everyone follows the same rules. We should not change the laws to accomodate those breaking them.

If America annouces to the world "We can't stop you, so come on in" with another amnesty, the deluge will be overwhelming. If 3,000 a day didn't get your attention, then wait until it's 10,000 a day. We cannot sustain this influx and survive as a nation. We must speak up and speak to each other about this and not let false claims of racism or bigotry be used to intimidate us into silent assent. America is not Congress' to give away. America belongs to We the People. Speak to your neighbors, speak to your coworkers, but please speak up to your Congressmen and Senators. It's O.K. for us to enforce our laws, no really, it is.

Someone please tell Sen. McCain.

ha.....I remember when
Your view of immigration is what most of America believes we still have. What a joke!

Earned citizenship and pride in their new country or stolen citizenship and loyalty to their true homeland first, foremost, and forever. Which of the two will benefit America?

Yeah, you're right. My people got here a little earlier, but my memories of immigration are those who came after the war. Our small community drew them from a number of places, but they all had that one thing in common; the desire to be Americans. I miss that, don't you?

Joyyy, a victim of Master of Deception
Please read my recent comment addressed to Mrs. Paddy.

Mrs. Paddy and Master of Deception
Numbersusa is one of agendas of a known white supremacist, John Tanton, http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?sid =72

They do not search for the truth, they produce what asked and paid for; they manipulate information in order to make it appear supporting their xenophobic agenda.

Nevertheless, one have to recognize that demagogy of Roy Beck reaches high level of excellence. For this reason, he is awarded a title of the Master of Deception,
http://www.henrykkowalczyk.com/$100_challenge.htm .

Henryk A. Kowalczyk
http://www.henrykkowalczyk.com

If Milton Friedman was right...
If we agree with Milton Friedman that we "can't have free immigration and a welfare state", the question is, what is the real problem, free immigration or the welfare state? What should we curb first?

In a private email to me, Milton Friedman stated clearly that free immigration is the way to go. You draw the conclusions.

Henryk A. Kowalczyk
An author of the Freedom of Migration Act proposal.

Read about it at
http://www.henrykkowalczyk.com/immigration.htm

See it at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6i8xbHNCxoU

Joyyyy
You posted a terrific link. I watched it and sent it on to my contacts. One of my contacts is a former student (now 20), who has an older sister in Columbia Graduate school for social work. The idiot SW student sent me a scathing email (scathing for an idiot, anyway)saying that I should lose my license for advocating "the comparison of human beings to gum balls". That's what the liberal twit got from the video. Unbelievable.

hanson
Good points. I don't think the Pope is saying we should allow illegal immigration to happen or not to rectify it, but to do it humanly and to consider the families. Many of whom come because NAFTA wipped out their farms. Thousands of the small Mexican farmer that could get by growing corn, had to compete with heavily subsidized American Farms/Corporations. They were desperate I suppose to find work.

interesting
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4094926727128068265 &q=numbersusa&hl=en

The “numbers” video is interesting, but the numbers alone, in my view, are not the only problem.

The core of the problem is… that civility and prosperity are fragile. I think it is naïve to assume that our system can continue to function with the current self-loathing plus continual dilution of the American philosophy and ethic.

Today we are struggling to teach our own children about being Americans. With all of the PC noise and self-loathing and relativism the diversity crowd is pushing, the US becomes less and less cohesive. It seems that the official policy of the educational system is to preach moral / civic / cultural / economic relativism.

Keep in mind that many of the immigrants we receive come from societies where corruption and nepotism and other ills are the norm. Throughout human history corruption and nepotism has been the norm.

The systems that the US / Canada / Western Europe are unusual. I think our systems are becoming more and more fragile because of the diversity movement and ease in which our western cultures prefers to see our own flaws.

I bet if you go to an average grade-school civics or history class and talk to the students… their talk will be more sure and confident on the topic about the flaws and mistakes of the US. The ideas of how the US has navigated her troubles and comparing them with other countries and human history are subtle and complex topics.

My mind is a little scattered on this part of the argument… but in my gut I know there is serious danger ahead.

These are the real heroes
“A real star is the soldier of the 4th Infantry Division who poked his head into a hole on a farm near Tikrit, Iraq. He could have been met by a bomb or a hail of AK-47 bullets. Instead, he faced an abject Saddam Hussein and the gratitude of all of the decent people of the world. A real star is the U.S. soldier who was sent to disarm a bomb next to a road north of Baghdad. He approached it, and the bomb went off and killed him. A real star, the kind who haunts my memory night and day, is the U.S. soldier in Baghdad who saw a little girl playing with a piece of unexploded ordnance on a street near where he was guarding a station. He pushed her aside and threw himself on it just as it exploded. He left a family desolate in California and a little girl alive in Baghdad. The stars who deserve media attention are not the ones who have lavish weddings on TV but the ones who patrol the streets of Mosul even after two of their buddies were murdered and their bodies battered and stripped for the sin of trying to protect Iraqis from terrorists. We put couples with incomes of $100 million a year on the covers of our magazines. The noncoms and officers who barely scrape by on military pay but stand on guard in Afghanistan and Iraq and on ships and in submarines and near the Arctic Circle are anonymous as they live and die.” —Ben Stein

TAFT in GA = HAVE MERCY ON ME
I think the Pope said it best when he spoke of protecting immigrant families, not dividing them.

"Benedict has calibrated his immigration stance with care, stating the need to protect family unity and immigrants’ human rights, but pointedly avoiding any specifics of the American immigration debate, like the issue of whether to grant legal status to illegal immigrants. Yet last week his visit quickly stirred the crosscurrents of the debate."

1) methinks the illegal breaks up his family first when he/she decides to come here unlawfully and leaves his/her family behind.

2) methinks Italy has quota #'s on who can enter legally...

3) they too are tired of those who enter illegally...

so it's a joke about what the Pope thinks or says...why isn't he talking about responsibility for one own's actions?

oneceamarine
My posts are confusing, and I'm sorry. I know illegal immigration is a very serious problem and we should fix what we can and stop any further problems. How many would I care for, honestly, I wouldn't hire them, but if they were staving I'd feed them. The ones with children born here, I'd also give special consideration for. I know no one here believes it, but if you were aware of how vast the California agricultural needs are for workers, one would realize they are not the drain on society as they think they are. I, just this last summer, btw, hired the local town guys to roof my house, when a lot of people were hiring cheap Mexican labor, ( I don't know if they're illegals). I'm very glad I did too, the work is guaranteed and they did a great job.

Memorial
Day tribute to the veterans. My blog.

Taft

It's time for you to put your money where your mouth goes.

How many illegals are you willing to sponsor and care for.??. Unless you already have some under your wing of course.

I don't believe you are a bleeding heart liberal who is blindsided by all this. You must have some personal or economic stake in allowing and keeping half of humanity in the U.S.A.




After looking
at the figures posted by lodestar for the costs of illegal immigration, I hope I never see another post on these threads about the high cost of the war in Iraq.

Taft
I didn't see anywhere in the video any mention of demonizing immigrants. The fault is in our government.

Compassion for the needy is not just taking them all in....We CANNOT do it.

I will say this...it certainly will level the playing field when we are all living in a 3rd world country, and the only winners are the 'ruling class'

If you can't get the statistics as shown, then I guess there is no hope.

The upshot of the video was blame the system not the immigrants.

it matters not....
who is elected POTUS. All three are willing to sell this country to the lowest bidder. During the next 4 years all Americans should be aware and let elected representatives know how what we expect them to do about illegals here and the ones still coming in!

2
and educated immagrants also realize how fragile prosperity can be... just a little too much corruption... a few of the wrong laws and economic policies... and the system slows and opportunity shrinks.

India is a country with many human and natural resources... yet for 50+ years after independence corruption and misguided policies has held the country back. Things are getting better in India... but someone who grew up in that environment knows that prosperity is not a given... prosperity is not automatic.

LEGACY OF TED KENNEDY
The immigration problem since 1965 has been compounded by another act of infamy perpetrated by none other than the lib hero Ted(the Blowviator)Kennedy, his immigration reform act was another of those JPF party ploys used to keep the Jackass Party from imploding by it's own stupidity and greed to retain undeserved power in office. It was not in any way acted upon to help any immigrant, legal or illegal, it was strictly self serving and indirectly resulted in an indentured class of impressed servitude by those lured to this country by unscrupulous business practice and condoned by crooked politicians.

Here in a nutshell is the life, the times and the sum legacy of one Ted kennedy and the lowlife ilk that allowed him to exist. Hero of the left.

Jayant

Jayant
Welcome to America!

You are the kind of immagrants the US should be courting. From day 1 - highly trained people who are net contributors working to move this country forward.

It is a shame that more native born Americans do not take advantage of the educational system to gain valuable skills. But since we don't, lets enlist skilled people from around the world and give them a shot.

It is ironic that highly training people from India are frequently more committed citizens of the US than native born citizens. They realize that the US is a great and fair country.

Mrs. Paddy
Thank you for providing that video but I saw it once a long time ago, and had bad things to say about then. First off, I don't trust statistics, especially by a journalist who has an agenda. second, it goes coundter to what the Pope's sentiments where, and mine, towards immigration.

This from NumbersUSA

“While Beck and NumbersUSA are careful not to appeal directly to racist or nativist sentiments, they do support harsh treatment of illegal immigrants, including speedy deportations and sharply reducing access to political asylum and judicial hearings. In Beck's May 15, 2000 statement to the Immigration and Claims Subcommittee of the U.S. House Judiciary Committee, Beck said NumbersUSA supports the apprehension and finger-printing of every possible illegal alien, even if there aren't enough resources to deport most of them. This will not only be disruptive to their communities—especially if people are randomly pulled from the pool to go through the swift deportation system—but it will kick in the 10-year exclusion rule on them, preventing them from benefiting from any legal access in the United States.”

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az =view_all&address=364x2870116#2870449

The Video
I suggest sending the link to it to everyone you know. And thanks to those who took the time to watch it. It is quite an eye opener.

Our country is committing suicide. It's a nice notion to be compassionate to the plight of others, but at some point we have to say stop. People can show their compassion by giving to those charities that help people help themselves in their own countries. That is the answer.

Jayant and Vic - Yes, I stand corrected. I will call them illegal invaders from now on.

The headquarters
for the "take back the southwest" for mexico is in Del Rio Texas.

And you can't tell me the government doesn't know this!!

I have seen the proposed map!
And i also have a vhs showing a drawing of similar "lines".

lodestar
Why don't you open a blog here on TH to post the information you gave here today. It would be appreciated!

If the GOP doesn't spur this
debate by July we need to have a major push for an independent party complete with representatives and senators in every district and state. Along with judges, drilling and ethanol this issue will cull the dim and rino libs from both parties. Let's then see if McCain gets it.

Anchor babies are not "going away".....

No candidate for president in 2008 will ever sign an executive order banning the recognition of anchor babies.

Just look at who they are. Obama.??. Shrillary Clintrock.??. and McShameful, Kennedy's twin brother.??.

Let's get real. We are screwed and it will take an act of heaven or an extreme malcontent to unscrew us.


Taft
Anyone interested in the real situation should watch the video posted by Joyyyy.

Here it is again. Watch it and then get back to us.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4094926727128068265 &q=numbersusa&hl=en

Absolutely every word in this is true
and understated. More issues include exponentially increased gang/drug activity, MS13, DDPs, Latin Kings, etc... which takes a huge toll in corrections, along with increased identity theft. All of the illegals I encounter (which isn't ALL, but its all I encounter) send money back home and avail themselves to various services here. There are booklets we hand out to illegals on their rights and entitlements. They would never, ever think about having fewer children- never. They're for the rest of us to worry about supporting. Things are really bad, and will affect the yet unaffected in time, but by then it will be too late. Its too late now, really.

As for cheap produce, which is the stupid arguement used to favor illegal immigration, things aren't so cheap these days because the size and scope of government has outgrown our ability to support it. The trickle down affect has quite arrived, and the amount of gov't dependents is only going to increase. Don't think they'll think twice about taking your home and 'redistributing" it to someone who needs it more. Sound alarmist? There has been small talk among some social workers that small families who have big houses should give them to large families who have small houses. It has no traction, but there were alot of nodding heads. We are so liberally screwed.

Jayant's post above illustrates the
difference between legal and illegal. The illegals are NOT immigrants, they are migrants who are here for the money. They care nothing for the country or it's customes.

Legal immigration seeks out educated people who are willing to assimilate. Illegal migration seeks out welfare, money, and jobs.

All illegals that are found should be immediatley deported unless they are found via a crime. In tyhat case they should be deported AFTER getting out of jail.

All CEOs of companies found to knowingly hire illegals should also go to jail. No pleabargains, no fines, and no sob stories accepted; ONLY jail time.

The anchor baby interpretation by the immigration people should be removed via Executive order.

Following that the problem will simply go away on it's own.

Stop bunching legal & ilegal immigrants
Dear Ms. Schlafly,
I am an immigrant from India and would agree with everything you say - as long as you use the word 'illegal immigration' instead of just immigration. Of course theoretically, you can bunch the two together and still justify your numbers because there are 10 illegals in this country for every legal immigrant like me and my wife. But tell me, is that the honest thing to do? Almost everyone coming into this country legally comes in either as a family member(which takes 10-20 years) or as a speciality skilled worker(in which case we pay more taxes than we ever consume in services).

For example, I and my wife will pay taxes on a gross income of over $250,000 next year. I am an engineer while she is a Psychiatrist practicing in an underserved area. We love this country, fly the star and stripes on our car and are raising our 1-year old son to be a patriotic American.

Please stop bunching us with illegals and kindly focus your ire where it should - on people like Maryland senator Barbara Mikulski who told our delegation (we wanted her support on a bill to release available visa numbers) last week that "we legal immigrants are spoiled brats. All we have to do is wait for our turn and we are coming to her for favors. Its the illegals in her view who need help" Of course they do, they represent 11 million potential locked up votes for the Democratic party.

The battle against illegal immigration is worth fighting and winning and I believe conservatives should want legal immigrants on their side in fighting it.

lodestar's (Rondak, Joyyy etc) posts
This may be wishful thinking....hopefully those "in power" check out Townhall.com. Lodestar's (etc) posts are simply stated, easy to understand and speak the truth. "They" would learn how concerned and AWARE legal American citizens are about the problems we face with the Invasion of Illegals. Face it we ARE BEING INVADED and those in Washington are turning a blind eye to the future of the United States of America. NumbersUSA's Roy Beck gives you a scary visual of our future or lack there of here. We must protect our sovereignty.

-
-


For those who do not know me...........

I am very fluent in Spanish since 50 years ago and have lived, worked or traveled in ALL of Latin America with considerable time spent in Mexico.

I know whereof I speak. He dicho..

Where does it all STOP
In Mexico there seems to be a generalized opinion that the illegals in the USA are supposed to be there and we are meanies if we object. That is not the case for other countries north or south of Mexico.

If you let a distant relative or for that matter a stranger into your house for several years, you can bet that sooner than later they would feel entitled to stay there indefinitely and would complain bitterly if you suggested they leave.

In Mexico the government understands the general public there feels that we owe them and constantly points out the contributions made to the "Unitedstatesers" (Estadounidenses), there word or name for us, we are never called AMERICANS nor is our country called "America", alternately and frequently they refer to us as North Americans (Norte Americanos)and our country as the United States of North America, when in truth the contribution is to the Mexican economy and not to ours. The dollars converted back to pesos coming from immigrants, mostly from illegals, is an enormous contribution to their economy only superseded by oil revenues, and is several times the contribution of tourism which is a very large and lucrative industry in Mexico.

Most illegals do not come to the U.S. expecting to stay and in truth many go home although back and forth is extremely common. What is typical is that those who truly return to Mexico are the better and more entrepreneurial ones, and the sliders without a future are the ones who typically stay in the U.S.

We can use and need some of them for agriculture and a few other items, but they should be controlled as "braceros" with limited opportunities to eventually stay.

We do require some legal immigration especially from the well educated who are available. personally, I believe, I, if one of the educated foreigners, would think twice about immigrating to the U.S.

doctorfixit
I think the Pope said it best when he spoke of protecting immigrant families, not dividing them.

"Benedict has calibrated his immigration stance with care, stating the need to protect family unity and immigrants’ human rights, but pointedly avoiding any specifics of the American immigration debate, like the issue of whether to grant legal status to illegal immigrants. Yet last week his visit quickly stirred the crosscurrents of the debate."

There really is no use to demonize them. Yes, assuredly we need to fix the problem and stop the flow, but with good old American values and mercy.

Citizen's Amnesty
All of us who are law-abiding should begin inquiring the following of our elected officials and judicial officers:
Which laws may we break so that we can receive legal parity with the illegal aliens and the employers of illegal aliens? When can we begin receiving payments to bring us financial parity with the approximately $22k/yr cost of each illegal alien?
Oh, and the politicians and civil servants who do not uphold the Constitutional protection of our borders - be honorable and leave office soon and quietly, or hold to the oath you took to protect us.

to Lodestar GA
No ILLEGAL alien need be naturalized unless WE choose to do so. It is unfair to so many deserving people who wish to emigrate here legally and properly to allow these lawbreaking interlopers any special breaks. Border jumping is just the first of many laws they break, most of which are felonies prima facie.

Here's another law illegals are breaking...upon reaching 18, they must register for Selective Service...if they don't, they cannot be granted citizenship....look it up.

Stop European-American Genocide
Phyllis Schlafly is one of the most courageous Americans ever.

Nothing is more racist than invading another country and imposing your language,customs, crime, and pollution on an unwilling host.

Liberal fascists want nothing less than the extermination of european americans, which they hope to accomplish with a three-pronged attack - from the south, from the Muslim countries, and from within using our government.

If european anericans are to survive, we must immediately boycott any company that puts out spanish writing, advertising, or signs, and immediately boycott any company that hires illegal invaders.

We must revoke the tax-exempt status of the Catholic Church and any other organization that supports the invaders.

La Raza, BAMN, and other internal terrorist groups are not being prosecuted under RICO or anti-terror laws. Why not, you should be asking "your" representatives?

The invaders are wreaking environmental devastation across the border areas of the Southwest. Yet their collaborators in the Sierra Club utter not one peep.

Our government is a coalition of special interests who view ordinary Americans the same way the Mexican oligarchy views their peasants. As stupid peons who are here to serve their interests - cheap labor, cheap votes, social chaos that results in more dependency on their puppet government. They see Mexicans as more pliable than the european americans.

The big story - the real reason Bush/Clinton/McCain/Obama do nothing - illegal invaders are being allowed in to "rescue" Social Security and Medicare for a decade or two until the liberal fascists figure out the Final Solution.

lodestar
Wouldn't it be easier to have another sort of guest-worker program. Both the illegals and the US public would benefit. From what I've read, the fence has only forced thousands to stay, when they'd rather go home when the off season comes. It also sure seams that we could get Mexico to help out in the massive invasion of their people. Your idea sounds good on paper, and who knows maybe it would work a bit.

Can we deport 20 million?

re:
"... most of the 20 million aren't going anyplace so at some point, yes, you are
going to have to normalize them."

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


This is the great false problem/mythical challenge. We CAN achieve attritive repatriation following some reasonable attempt at enforcement, which probably will require Real I.D., notwithstanding libertarian objections. Other countries (including Mexico!) think it is ludicrous how lax we have been about enforcement. Israel, e.g., would not begin to tolerate our government's willful folly. ILLEGAL aliens essentially swarm to the most accommodating places... we need to reverse that message. Arizona passed (with almost 50% of the LEGAL hispanic vote) several tough new anti-ILLEGAL laws which are resulting in their leaving the state.

No ILLEGAL alien need be naturalized unless WE choose to do so. It is unfair to so many deserving people who wish to emigrate here legally and properly to allow these lawbreaking interlopers any special breaks. Border jumping is just the first of many laws they break, most of which are felonies prima facie.

See posts to follow to see what YOU can do to save YOUR country from the ILLEGAL alien incursion. Get engaged while we still have a little time!

Apology
I apologize for the spelling in my comments of "OK" you asked for it. I forgot to proof read before I submitted.

OK! you asked for it.
I am a Constitutionalist! I will not apologize! I will not back down and I will not quit.
Lest you think I am a "Racist" I would just like to remind you of some history. These are facts Not Racist!
Cheap labor was forced on the 13 Colonies by King George of England. The Colonies voted against having slaves but they got outruled. So then, after the South purchased the slaves, sold to them by the North (they came in through New York and Boston) then someone called abolitionists, decided this was wrong and decided to attack their fellow Americans and free the slaves(headed by America's first Caesar Abraham Lincoln)
After 650,000 Americans lost their lives (both North and South)the thirty Seven States made an amendment (the 13th)to the Constitution to declare them free.
Then they decided to let the Negro vote. The South was against that. (not because they wanted to refuse him the privilege, but because the majority of the Slaves had been in the Cotton Fields and were not educated enough yet to vote.
But did that matter to the Republicans in Congress of 1866? No they just wanted them to vote for the Republican Party.
To sum it all up once again the Constitution was by passed, the 10 Southens states were refused a seat in Congress (violation of Aricle V) and once again at gun point The Southern Americans' governments were abolished and puppet governments were set up of Scalawags, Carpet baggers and uneducated slaves with the promise of political office if they would vote for the 14th Amendment.
Why did I say all of this? Because we now have people in our government who see the value of Slavery (I don't) and as they can no longer go back to the Slaves of yesteryear, the nearest that they can get to it is illegals that they can pay a cheaper wage. Not to mention the rest of us Americans who are asked to contribute to the illegal slaves with education, health benifits and welfare.

Joyyyy's video recommendation
Joyyy that was a great video on youtube.com. Anyone who has time should go to the link on Joyyyy's comment.

European AmericA
European Americans have a right to decide how they will live, and that an eventual geographic separation is necessary for the preservation of ALL unique cultures and values. Our fundamental interest should be what most benefits European Americans as a people, and the preservation of our genes and our lands is undoubtedly in our best interest.

Listen: http://www.wvwnews.net/story.php?id=4196



Is this my Imagination...?????
Or is it the pain pills Iam taking? Somebody tell me the 3 existing candidates are against Illegal Immigration!!
Laraza..and Juan McCain..!!!!
Somebody tell me Iam having Nightmare!!It's not
real,right!
Lets see...Mitt wouldn't allow Illegals to have drivers license, Duncan is against Illegals,
Tancredo was against it..so one of these guys is the candidate...right!??
elvis

johnnyp
Your posts are cogent and logical, and take the big picture view, something often missing in discussion of hot-button issues. You said it all, much better than I could.

as for Spanish being spoken in NM
for a long time.
I don't know anyone who disputes that Hispanics were present in NM since the greater Southwest was added in the 1800s, but these people learned English and assimilated and provged patriotic and in the case of those who became US citizens as a result of the USA acquiring the Greater Southwest, became very greatful to be US citizens as opposed to being citizens of Mexico, and all I know personally OPPOSE the INVASION across our southern border.
As for Texas, Juan Abamillo, Juan A. Badillo, Carlos Espalier, Gregorio Esparza, Antonio Fuentes, José María Guerrero, Damacio Jimenes (Ximenes), Toribio Losoya, and Andrés Nava all died at the Alamo fighting against Mexico for Texas Independence (there were many Tejanos who fought for Texas Independence), but again I'll state flatly that the descendants of these Tejanos and the vast majority of those from older Tejanos families of whom I am acquainted OPPOSE the INVASION of this nation being conducted across our southern border.

ILLEGALS and social service enervation

It is against the law for ILLEGAL aliens to receive welfare per se. Still, they overwhelm hospitals and schools, and overburden criminal justice, and the federal government REQUIRES that local service providers assist them at local expense. Then there is the issue of "anchor babies"... once an ILLEGAL madre can push one out on American soil, they get in the welfare line, and the ride on the welfare gravy train is on!

More to the point, ANY resident who is uneducated and poor inexorably becomes a welfare burden on average, partly because today's advanced service economy America cannot provide them upward mobility when all they have to offer is manual labor. The highly respected Heritage Foundation calculates that EACH household headed by the typical ignorant, indigent ILLEGAL alien will drain $1.4 MILLION more in govt. services than it ever pays in any form of taxes over a lifetime. This is aggravated further by clinging to a foreign language and disparate culture.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/bg1936.cfm
http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/SR14es.cfm
http://www.usillegalaliens.com/impacts_of_illegal_immigrati on_american_infrastructure.html
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4094926727128068265 &q=immigration

As even a liberal sociologist admitted recently, future drains by current ILLEGALS will prove to be, "the mother of all unfunded government mandates." The libs do not care about this; they know that current ILLEGALS mean future voters and the permanent hegemony of the left as America morphs ineluctably into a third world welfare state. Visa violators account for about 20% of ILLEGAL aliens; we MUST crack down on them also.

See below what YOU can do to stanch this barrio blight and culture decimation from destroying America.


Good article
From the article: "it would be necessary to eliminate Social Security and Medicare, all means-tested welfare, and to cut expenditures on public education roughly in half. Obviously, that is not going to happen."

Too bad.

Reminds me of the brilliant policy in San Francisco several years ago, where they started handing out cash to the homeless. Before they knew it, they were overrun with homeless.

How to get rid of illegals
Liberals in Congress say that we’re in a recession and that we’re losing jobs. Their solution for this is to give amnesty to 20 million illegal aliens so they can hold jobs needed by American citizens. We can get rid of all of them.

Develop a website called “Illegal Aliens” in which we document them in every way. Anyone on this website would be prohibited from receiving any benefits such as visas for citizenship.

Have ICE announce in English and Spanish that, in fifteen days, they will begin paying a bounty to any American citizen for each and every illegal alien they turn in.

Bring home our soldiers and equipment from FDR’s War. Have the infantry round up and deport the millions of illegal aliens. Have our tanks and helicopters patrol our borders. Have the Army Engineers build the wall along our border. Fund this with the billions of dollars presently paid out to protect Germany.

Enforce existing law, and deport all illegal aliens arrested by police in all levels of government. Deprive illegal aliens of jobs and homes. Fine and imprison persons who hire illegal aliens. Fine and imprison persons who rent homes to illegal aliens.

Make Spanish-language radio and TV broadcasts and ads in newspapers saying, “Mexican illegal aliens, Go Home. Return to your homeland and make it your own. Use the money received from oil sales and other sources to build schools to educate your children and provide jobs. American entrepreneurs will help you set up businesses and provide jobs for your people. There are millions of you. Go home and make Mexico the place where you want to live and work.”

today's immigration is liberalism...
Today, much of immigration is pure liberalism (small "l"). Democrats want a new dependent class of constituente. Doesn't matter if they don't speak English or if they ever will.

The elites in DC and around the world want to dissolve nations and make everyone a "citizen of the world". I disagree with that strongly but it seems to be happening.

We have two tried and true solutions
[1] Build the fence we were promised. Crime dropped 80% in San Diego as soon as their segment went up. [2] Dry up the jobs. Mexicans self-deport when they can't get work. All this crap about having to deport millions of illegals is a dodge. Where the jobs have disappeared, the Mexicans not only go home,but tell their friends not to go to America. Neither one of these solutions cost any more more money than has already been appropriated. We have allowed a corps of enablers (i.e. liberals) to give away our way of life.

Angie
I agree with you on one item; the US public does need to begin again to do their own yard work! It would help the kids and adults with the fitness issue (not to mention help the kids with work ethics), get people outside and associating with their neighbors more, help domestic companies who produce the tools and machinery required (I hope their are still US manufacturers in this area), and end this "draw" to the INVADERS of our nation.
I can say one thing about the pro-INVASION forces; their mantra of labor intensive agri-business requiring the INVASION in order to hold prices down is pure B.S. One needs only go into a grocer and see the prices and look closely at the ID labeling telling one that the produce came from Chili or Mexico or some other foreign land!
oh, and just for the record, the Liberals are not stupid; the anarchists and social/marxists who run the Liberal forces in this country (and now the Democrat Party some rubes are voting for thinking in places like Miss they are electing conservative "dixiecrats" who will make a difference) have had a plan to bring down this nation since after WW2. Once small in numbers, these people have spread their cause like a cancer into every defining area of American life, inclusive of the educational system and the propaganda mediums and the ranks both major politcal parties.

YOU can get involved: SAVE America!

Join the sacred fight now to save America! Time is short! Any ILLEGAL alien (including visa violators) who works here is automatically committing multiple felonies, not to mention the pandemic social pathologies which permeate with them like the Black Death. It is NOT the obligation of American society and taxpayers to bail out corrupt and failed plutocratic Latin American governments by providing employment and social welfare for their myriad, ignorant indigent, culturally disparate.

America CANNOT AFFORD this so-called "cheap" labor, which actually benefits only the relative few miscreant employers. A hotel room or head of lettuce is NO CHEAPER to the consumer as a result of ILLEGAL alien labor. When the feds make their "show raids" on miscreant employers such as meat processing plants, Americans (often the LEGAL workers previously displaced) usually refill the jobs IMMEDIATELY. ILLEGALS are NOT the Pedro to rob to pay American Paul his rightly-earned S.S. which the govt. has already squandered-- they represent instead "the mother of all unfunded government mandates" if we naturalize them.

What exactly are ILLEGAL aliens "entitled to" from American society? One side likes to proffer inane apologia and prattle such as, "border crossing is a minor transgression akin to jaywalking," or, "they are just trying to feed their families," or "they are just doing those jobs Americans won't do," or "America needs their cheap labor." ALL of these are willful, vacuous, disingenuous red herring dodges!

Just below are the official contact sites for Congress... a few clicks, and you can EASILY send e-mails. Even easier--> NumbersUSA gives you FREE, prepared e-mails to send, and even targets your people in Congress for you. BOOKMARK THESE, and get engaged today!

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm
http://www.numbersusa.com/actionbuffet

Millions won't vote for Obama...
"Millions wont' vote for Obama because they think he's a Muslim..."

I don't know about millions of people thinking he's a Muslim. That sounds a bit exaggerated. I don't know about any fake e-mails being read by millions of registered voters either.

I do know I will not vote for him, but not for the reasons you state. Rather because he's an anti-american, inexperienced, liberal, race pandering, idiot.

How much do they cost us? Part. 2

8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for welfare & social services by American taxpayers.
http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html

9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused by illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

10. Illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children, are going to create a huge additional crime problem in the US .
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html

11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens that crossed our southern border; also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from terrorist countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroin and marijuana, crossed into the U. S. from the Southern border.
Homeland Security Report: http://tinyurl.com/t9sht

12. The National Policy Institute estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period.
http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf

13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back to their countries of origin. http://www.rense.co m/general75/niht.htm

14. “The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants In The United States.”
http://www.drdsk.com/articles.html

In a video put out by ...
Roy Beck with NumbersUSA, I learned that the rate for LEGAL immigration today is 1Million per year. If you only consider the legal immigrants coming to America and the rates at which they reproduce and compare that with the rate that America reproduces, you will discover that this country will look totally different within one or two generations.

When you add in the illegal immigrants and their offspring and couple that with the strain on social services, education and welfare, it becomes very apparent that if we keep going in this direction America cannot sustain the economic standards that today's youth take for granted and demand.

At some point the cupboard will be bare and the lifestyle we have will not be available for future generations of Americans.

But hey, they will still have the pristine beauty of ANWR so maybe they won't hate us too much for destroying their futures, huh?

to LOCO in MI
"I would prefere as consumers, we pay home grown workers a real wage and quit paying the indirect cost, financially, culturally, and legally, through public assistance programs. With proper wages for the home grown worker, we could control our borders, respect our laws, and have workers who pledge their allegiance to this country first."

IF, illegal immigrants came here to make a better life for themselves, and came here honestly to get jobs, then why aren't they working?

Why are politicians, pro-amnesty groups etc saying we need to allow more in?

ARE ALL 12 to 20 illegal immigrants working???already employed?????

I WOULD PREFER that we OFFER ALL THOSE JOBS TO THOSE ILLEGALS WHO ARE ALREADY HERE and take them OFF THE DOLE!!


Okay Okay
"Sit down and shut up"! That is what the Repub & Dem candidates are telling us. Okay, I'm not shutting up, but I will not waste my time going to the voting booth anymore. We the people have not had a say in who our Prez will be for decades now. Why on earth do you think GWB ignored our outcries about securing the border? It's all about the NAU and the global economy and the big money fellows. It's not about what is best for the citizens of the USA. If you can get a hold of a copy of "None Dare Call It Conspiracy" by Gary Allen, it will document with photos and diaries that we, the people/citizens, have not had our say in our government since the 1920s. It was published in 1978, but because it sold over a million copies, you might find a copy somewhere. Otherwise continue to bleat like a sheep and go vote. None of them care what you think or want.

How much do they cost us? Part. 1

1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens each year by state governments. http://tinyurl.com/zob77

2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens. http://www.cis..org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens.
http://www.cis..org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html

5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

immigration
What I cannot figure out,is why if we only need 12 to 14 million workers for the various jobs americans won't do,why in the hell do we need another 12 to 14 million the next year and the year after that.According to the experts (so called)we have no jobs that need to be filled.Am I to believe that the agriculture groups apple growers peach growers etc.are growing so fast that they need all that help.Hell no people these illegals are taking jobs that our own people could do,but they won't do it as cheap.

Phyllis (Ugh!) and her ilk
I can't believe Phyllis is still kicking! Ugh. I recall in Tulsa OK when she was invited to the community college I attended. I'd just moved back from New Mexico and in comparison to the excellent speakers UNM presented, Phyllis was a real let down. By the way, New Mexico has always had Spanish speakers, remember? As for you others, get your lazy kids off the computer and let them cut the grass so they can learn how to pick fruits and veggies in the fields since you won't do it. And you don't want illegals doing it? BTW, wages do have to be kept at a certain level for some companies to remain competitive and in business.

-
-

what Middle America thinks
re:
"I simply don't understand how most Americans just don't understand what the illegal immigrant situation in this country is doing to THEIR country."

The general public overwhelmingly favors REAL immigration reform (BUT not Scamnesty posing as "C.I.R."). Poll after poll shows that Americans want well-enforced, sensible, and sustainable LEGAL immigration of the educated and skilled who can be positive contributors on balance, NOT the tsunami of ILLEGAL aliens.

* 89% of Americans think ILLEGAL immigration into the U.S. is a problem (30% "extremely serious," 33% "very serious," and 26% "somewhat serious." (Time Magazine, 2006)

* 82% think that not enough is being done along the borders to keep illegal aliens from crossing into the country. (New York Times/CBS 2007)

* 68% feel that the number who cross the border, whether legal or illegal is “too high”. (Polling Company, 2006)

* 62% oppose making it easier for ILLEGAL immigrants to become citizens of America. (Quinnipiac Univ., Feb. 2006)

*71% believe that ILLEGAL immigrants should not qualify for in-state tuition rates at college and universities.

*77% oppose making drivers' licenses available to ILLEGAL aliens.

*71% favor requiring foreign visitors to carry universal I.D. card.

*77% say that employers can require English-only on the job, and 89% favor making it the official/only language of government

The PC ilk, the MSM, ethnocentric Hispanic groups, and the open borders, globalist, miscreant employer types barrage us with disingenuous info, but Middle America IS righteously indignant about ILLEGALS. If not stopped and reversed soon, we will LOSE America. See how YOU can get engaged TODAY just below!

Bobby
Elaborate?

ha
AND GUESS WHAT??? We did more than survive, WE MADE IT!! BECAUSE WE HAD TO. True we lived with just the essentials and we had no luxurious items that we couldn't afford to pay for ourselves...BUT WE WERE HAPPY...there was food on the table and we had clothes on our back.....PAID FOR BY OURSELVES!!!

WHAT's WRONG WITH BEING SELF-SUFFICIENT???
******************

Congratulations!

My brother and I debate policy issues frequently. One of things we are very thankful for is that our ancestors did not come to the US in the time of the welfare state. The probability of both of us having master’s degrees and owning homes would be much lower if our family would have been exposed to the heroin-like social welfare system.

Oddly, a helping hand can be a very dangerous thing. We do it to our poor through government transfers and services. We do it through coddling middle and upper-middle class children. Sometimes the best thing to do is let someone fail and learn on their own. The risk of failure and failure itself is a great teacher, conscience, and cleanser of ideas and approaches.

As Thomas Sowell points out... it is an awfully curious situation when the rate of economic improvement for blacks went flat after the Great Society and Civil Rights act.