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Wednesday, December 10, 2008
Paul Greenberg :: Townhall.com Columnist
Time to Walk Off the Lot
by Paul Greenberg
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Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


Would you buy a used auto company from any of the Big Three's execs who've been poormouthing before Congress? Their goal: to have Uncle Sucker -- that's you, Mr. and Ms. American Taxpayer -- save them from the results of their own poor management. They've got a clunker to sell and would love for the rest of us to take it off their hands. Would you give these highbinders your good hard-earned cash?

Of course not. But Congress is about to. It's not as if it's spending its own money.

Having had their first request for $25 billion rejected and told to come back with a plan to make their companies profitable, the Big Three's execs returned last week -- not on their private jets this time but with even more torque-powered chutzpah. They upped the ante to $35 billion (it's the add-ons that always cost the most when you're buying a new model) and promised to build the kind of cars that Congress (not necessarily the American consumer) wants.

At last report, the shrinking Big Three were willing to accept $15 billion -- for now -- and the services of a federal Car Czar to oversee their restructuring. Much like a used car salesman's dropping the price and offering all kinds of concessions as the customer is about to leave the lot. It's the kind of deal only a congressman might consider a bargain.

There's a solution for businesses that have real, salvageable assets but hopeless balance sheets. It's called bankruptcy, which relieves poorly run companies of their dead wood, frees them from their overwhelming debt, and gives everybody a chance to start all over again while saving what's worth saving.

If the Chicago Tribune can still come out every morning after entering bankruptcy, there's nothing to prevent Detroit from continuing to make cars while it's been reorganized.

Instead, the Big Three and their partner in incompetence, Big Labor, have turned to government -- i.e., We the People -- to keep themselves in business. At least for a little while -- maybe even through the next quarter, when they'll surely need another transfusion of public funds to stay afloat.

But there will always be pols like Chris Dodd, the senator from Countrywide, and Barney Frank, that comical class warrior of a congressman who now proposes to run the Big Three the way he did Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Namely, into the ground.

How? By substituting Congress' idea of socially desirable goals for prudent business practices, which is just what the Big Three have failed to practice. For them bankruptcy would be a step up.

Congressman Frank, like so many facile "thinkers," wants to know why, if government needed to step in and save the country's banks, it can't do the same to save the jobs (and perks) of the auto manufacturers. But the administration's quick, day-to-day decisions to bail out this bank or let that investment house go under wasn't done to save bankers' jobs but the banks themselves, and an economy that depends on stable banks. It was done to avoid a repeat of the monetary crisis that did in the American economy back in the 1930s, when some 9,000 banks failed, depositors' money disappeared, and the country's money supply was essentially frozen.

By the time Franklin D. Roosevelt was sworn in as president on March 4, 1933, the banks in all of the then 48 states had been shuttered or withdrawals from them strictly limited. The economy was at a standstill, and the first thing the new president did was to close the nation's banks for three days (a "bank holiday," it was called) until they could be saved, merged, or put out of their misery in the least painful way for all concerned.

It was to avoid that kind of disaster, which was looming as the Panic of 2008 spread this fall, that the Federal Reserve and the U.S. Treasury began taking over, bailing out, and generally backing up the country's supply of money and credit, which are much the same thing. The purpose, like FDR's, was not to destroy American capitalism but to save it.

But for government to begin taking over the direction of huge private companies, issuing directives about what kind of products and services they are to supply, which contracts they're to honor and which ones renegotiate, which executives they're to hire and fire and on what terms ... would fundamentally alter a once free economy.

Do we really want mainstays of the American economy like the auto industry run with the efficiency and profitabilty of, say, the U.S. post office? And essentially become means of distributing government largesse instead of saleable products?

There comes a time to just say No. That time has come for the auto industry. It can be postponed, and just might be if Congress and the administration agree to give the Big Three a bridge loan to nowhere. But come spring, the same execs doubtless would be back, and the same question would face the country: Should we throw good billions after bad?

Enough. Government certainly has a role to play when major industries go under. It can provide unemployment benefits, funds to retrain workers for other jobs when assembly lines shut down, and generally act as a responsible receiver in bankruptcy, saving what it can of those firms that for years have failed to show the vision, flexibility and principle that successful enterprises should.

What government shouldn't do is go on acting as an enabler for fast failing enterprises that have driven themselves to the wall, and now propose to do much the same service for the U.S. Treasury.

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Redlac
Tell me who builds the M1 or the Bradley? The F22? The F18? The B1? The F117? Who built the USS Ronald Reagan and the USS Jimmy Carter? Hint: It is not Chrysler.

This is not 1917 and this is not 1941.

Tom:

Most here opposed the bailout of ther $700 billion. Haven't you been paying attention? And we oppose the auto bailout even more BECAUSE of the $700 billion. Instead of using the $700 billion to "unfreeze" credit and start loaning money to taxpayers, it has instead paid bonuses, held large partys, bought other banks (including I am told a Chinese one) and Chinese airplanes. The sit in strike in Chicago was caused because BOA cut off the company's crediot line and it was unable to paid the 60-day severance package as the contract with the employees called for.

Since we have seen what bailouts with zero regulations bring, we oppose this one even with more vigor. Without restructuring (which bankruptcy would bring)the companies are doomed anyway. You can make cars and earn a profit inside the US--BMW, Honda, Toyota, Nissan all do, but you can't when your cost per car is $2000 more than your rivals. Without changes in how they make the cars and the management, we will be back where we are now in a few years time. Bankruptcy will solve this, bailouts will not.


Do facts mean anything here?
Most of the blurts here seem more vindictive than logical.

Did the folks who so opppose the Big Three getting $15 billion do a similar rant when Bush and Paulkson tossed $700 billion at Wall Street when they said GIMME?

At least the Big Three produced 17,000,000 vehicles last year. What in the hell did the Wall Street white shirts produce last year except missing money?

moses #36
Why not? The 9% Congress was rewarded Nov 4, with a two fer; when corruption is rampant thats what you get. They are a mirror of our times, what we see is the majority of voters that see nothing wrong with corrupt pols doling out our dimes to everyone and their uncle buying votes for themselves.

I know that if we ever are in the market for another car, it's not going to be one of the Big Three. We have been mugged enough by the unions so why go for more.

redlac
If I have to BUY elections by Paying people to do WORTHLESS stuff, then to HELL with it.

You RINOs are making the SAME argument for the Greasy Wet Back Reconquistas, if the GOP wants to Win we have to turn the country into El Meh-he-ko Del Norte--to Hell with THAT too.

I'll be GLAD to buy pleanty of ammunition to SHOOT them, and the commieqr Big Labor Mob Commies too.

The Big Mick

TO Cliff NY
I couldn't agree more. How do we change the mind set? I have to disagree about American made cars. They have certainly come some way from the 70's. I have had four Pontiac's and I will say from experience they are worth it. Al depends what you are looking for. A Grand Prix getting better than 30 a gallon on the interstate I would say is pretty good. The ride is great. I also have a PT. I wouldn't traded it for anything. I am 6'3" and can slide right in. The ride is great. Storage will blow your mind. I waited ten months off production to get it. I first rented one for a day just on a whim. Although expensive at the time compared to what I could get one for today I was willing to take that chance. Although the mileage is not quiet there the pulling power up the mountains in VA passes everything.

redlac
We can build tanks and carriers and hummvs just fine. We don't need to build Covairs.

this is all about Big Labor. Screw em.

Let em DIE!

Or come work in the Poultry Plants so we can send all the Greasy Wet Back Reconquista Non-English Speakers back to the Cess Pool they've made out of their OWN country.

Turn Detroit into a kind of Labor Toxic Waste Cleanup Squad.

The Big Mick

Akagi
A country that cannot build its own weapons systems cannot claim to be able to effectively prosecute wars should they be necessary. The hard reality is that we now can prosecute wars only by committee, not decision. Your position, apparently, is that we have advanced beyond war. Or at least, wars of consequence. To make such an assertion, is to conclude, apparently, that only the history of the last 30 years is relevant. We could not, even today, sustain our weapons systems in Iraq or Afghanistan without importing components from many other countries. Countries now have a veto over our economy - should they choose to use it, and they have a veto over our ability to sustain weapons in war if they choose to use it. Integration into the world economy may be your vision, but I remain skeptical of its consequences.

Redlac
Voijanovich is also about as much of a Republican as Obama is. He opposed John Bolton (even crying over it) which cost him from being named pernamently and Bush had to name him in a recess appointment. He is 100% RINO. So what he supports or doesn't support is no concern of mine.

"...aresenal of Democracy..."

That phrase is about as Germane to 2008 as "Remember the Maine" or "Remember the Alamo" or "The War to End All Wars" or "Fifty Four Forty or Fight."

But What Will We Be?
We don't differ all that much on any of these things. But the reason Voijanovich of Ohio is one of the leading sponsors of the auto bailout, is because the rustbelt has been hemoraging manufacturing for the last decade. And let's not kid ourselves. The idea that if we lose GM and Chrysler, that we'll keep most of the jobs here, is not supported by facts. No one has the existing US plant capacity to absorb that much market share. Further, most of the GM/Chrysler component and parts manufacturers will be out of business. Many of their dealers will be gone as well, since competitive brands already have there systems in place. Those dealers with a strong combination of US/Other brands will survive - or at least some will.

From where I sit, however, I can only wonder about a country whose manufacturing base has been decimated in terms of what kind of country it will eventually be. Textiles, Steel, Auto Manufacturing, Appliances, Tools, Sports Vehicles, etc. All will be pretty much gone.

So much for the aresenal of Democracy.

Redlac
I oppose the bailout of the banks as I said nor do I care about the GOP prospects in Ohio (which it lost anyway)or anywhere else. I oppose welfare and just because the welfare is directed at GM instead of the "welfare queen" of Ronald Reagan fame is no reason to now support it. Welfare is welfare. If GM wants help, tell them to declare bankruptcy and reorganize, that is where the help should come from, not welfare from the US Treasury.

Akagi
Like I said, in the real world, if the US auto industry goes down, the GOP can write off Ohio and Indiana, along with Michigan, Illinois,Wisconsin, Minnesota, and perhaps even Kentucky.

At the same time, perhaps you can explain spending $1 trillion to "save" the banks, insurance industry, etc., but not the largest single employer in the nation.

After all, have no illusions. It was the financial meltdown, not the cost of cars, that created the conditions that caused car sales to plummet.

Here's Moody's take:

The $15 billion for GM and Chrysler falls far short of the $28 billion the two companies say they need. Mark Zandi of Moody's Economy.com told Congress that if the Detroit 3, including Ford, maintain their combined market share of about 50 percent, then the car companies will require about $75 billion in government aid. If their market share shrinks to 40 percent and they sell fewer cars, it could cost $125 billion.

It's also a safe bet that the Detroit automakers won't hold on to their 50 percent market share--so plan on Zandi's worst-case scenario. Fitch Ratings, in its forecast for 2009, points out that while domestic dealerships are losing sales because of tighter credit standards, foreign-based companies like Toyota and Nissan are still able to offer zero-percent financing and other enticements, which almost certainly means they'll take more share from the domestics in 2009. Any discount is good news for consumers, but it means the Detroit 3 will sell even fewer cars--and therefore require more money and more time to get healthy.

Just a year ago, the automakers were preparing for Americans to buy about 16 million cars this year and next. Actual sales in 2008 will be fewer than 14 million, and sales could bottom out at 12 million in 2009. Nothing will boost that except for an end to the recession and a consumer-confidence revival.

see if nancy polisi gets a free buick!
barney frank,nancy polisi and harry reid all get free cars!gm says thanks!

Reagenite

You seem to assume I was all for bailing out the failed banks. Wrong assumption. But there is a difference in the situations. The Fed helped create the banking fiasco and were obligated by the community reinvestment act to stand behind the bad loans. Not so with the big three.

I think resorting to fascist governing and economic tactics is a recipe for disaster for what is left of the republic.


right on paul greenberg!
the cars are not selling like hot cakes!at close to 25,ooo a car,no one wants them!so they will make more to draw dust just sitting in the car lots!they need to have big sale first!no bail out!

Socialism OK - as long as it's the banks
Is that the point of your column? We have unlimited, unrestricted trillions to shore up the big investment-banks-who-are-now-just-plain-banks which, along with Congress and the Fed, created the subprime mess and its securitization that brought us to this economic abyss. It's all for the general good, you betcha. (Too bad they haven't a clue about how to fix the problems).

But let the largest manufacturing industry in the nation ask for some bridge loans to get them through this credit crunch, caused by the unwillingness of those same big banks to lend some of the trillions the Treasury and Fed are supplying them, and people like you start being capitalists again.

Salty Dog, those 3 million potentially unemployed people won't need unemployment benefits or an $8000 check if the American auto industry can survive this deep recession. They can keep on doing what they're doing now: paying federal and state income taxes, local property taxes, paying their mortgages on time, and making purchases from retailers and other industries.







rdk
you wrote:
Subject: Government will not run the companies!.........(not sure I believe that, at least not with the current clowns in the house and senate..my words)

The Big Three can and do make good vehicles. The entire rustbelt provides parts for the vehicles. I think that we owe our fellow citizens a chance to succeed; if they now succeed, we will all succeed.
--------------------------------------

The free market is simple. Build a better product and the world will beat a path to your door.
Cars COST the Marginal 3 money.....therefore they do like any manufacturer and cost reduce, cost reduce, cost reduce. (and de-emphasize selling them) Take the $2500 that supposedly shows up in every automobile built due to retiree costs and put half of that back into the car in the form of quality and material improvements.....and the Marginal 3 might have a chance.
Right now the world is against them.....due to too many years of building what was good for the balance sheet as opposed to building products that the people wanted. Enter Honda, Toyota, Nissan, and all the other players to take over the car market.
There was room for The Marginal 3 as long as gas was cheap, they cast their ballot with Trucks and SUV's and remained viable. Now, its a new world and their problems are a testament to being a slave to Stock analysts, and being a slave to the UAW.......Sadly, the Marginal 3 are most likely failing becuase they have become big, beaureacratic, and slow to adapt to change......just like the 3rd rate citizens they are groveling in front of now.

There are no less than 22 auto makers worldwide that sell autos in the US. There are probably that same number who manufacture and sell outside of the US. There is no shortage of Automakers who could come into the US and set up operations.

from "about us"

With Scribd's iPaper document reader, anyone can easily upload and immediately share their original works on Scribd.com or any other website.

Akaqi
Too little info about your package to hazard a guess as to why it was misdirected The last time that I shipped a package overseas as an e?Bay seller a few years ago, USPS package tracking was as yet still unavailable outside of the US. I doubt that there is anything I could say that would change your mind about the USPS anyway. I am no longer employed by them, but I do know that it would be a huge mistake to break it up into pieces run by for profit companies, competing against each other for the more lucrative areas of the country with larger and more dense population. Japan has recently privatized it's postal service, but it is more like the size of a few states, and is not the size of the US with 50 individual states.

pardon me

for being skeptical of this source. I see nothing to separate military expenditure from welfare and other populist vote buying. Nothing to back up these stats.

DDL
That "stat" from Scribd.com (who ever in the hell they are) is from 1981-2005, it doesn't tell us what the stats are in 2007 nor how weighted they are. Is Michigan #5 because in the 1980s it gave a bucket loads of money and now they are basically a basketcase? Or have they been consistently #5 EVERY year from 1981 to 2005?

That stat doesn't really tell me very much about what is going on today.

DDL
Doesn't matter why the error happened--the error was caused either by faulty machines or faulty people and both are assets of the USPS.

Does any of this lead to Beijing? "Kaohsiung, Taiwan, ROC."


Redlac
"And if BK accelerates the spiral downward, then what may emerge would be little more than ceding much of what is left of the auto industry to competitors."

So? Is the role of the Federal government now to be picking which automakers prosper? Where is that in the Constitution exactly? I would also argue the government has no role in saving jobs--that is the private sector's job.

So the GOP is worried about voters going to the Democrats because it opposes central planning socialism? If it supports that, why is there a need for the GOP--the GOP and DP should be merged to form the DSP (Democratic Socialist Party). Then they can simply have intra-party debates over gays, guns and abortion.

Kia (bankrupt) in 1997 and Mitsubishi (nearly as bad off) sold cars too if I recall and still do, correct?

Chrysler needs to be liquidated. It is toast. Spending money on it is like painting a house that is on fire. It will I suppose be bought by someone at some point.

DDL
Virginia hosts, among other things, the Pentagon, Norfolk Naval Base, Quantico, the CIA, the Defense Communications Agency, and countless other military and federal installations. The income tax in Virginia is lower than that of Maryland or DC, so we get more than our fair share of DC's federal employees on our side of the Potomac. Many of the nation's defense contractors and consultants have set up their headquarters here. That's where the federal money is going - federal employment, not welfare.

As a consequence, our roads are choked and crumbling, housing prices are obscene, and our quality of life has been severely compromised over the last 30 years. That said, we are number 8 in terms of standard of living in the USA.

Akaqi
The USPS uses automated optical character reading technology to sort mail and packages, postal workers no longer read the addresses and hand sort them. If your package was sent to the wrong location, it was not due to human error.

Putting the wrong zip or zip plus 5 code on a letter or package will guarantee them being sent to the wrong location, regardless of whether or not the correct address, city, and state is included,as the OCRs scan for the zip code first. This will delay delivery until a postal carrier corrects the error and changes the zip code and marks out AS WELL as the barcode scan that was incorrectly generated.

Chapter 11 Doesn't Equal Extinction
The only solution for the big three is to shed labor costs. Given the intransigence of the UAW Chapter 11 is the alternative that will allow manufacturers to escape the suicide pacts that pass for labor contracts.

If you want your nations auto industry to survive please take five minutes and email your elected representatives stating opposition to a UAW bailout.

DDL

Source for the stats you just posted please.

DDL
" then our federal tax dollars should no longer be deducted to fund the economies of other recipient states."

I agree. I also don't like the Federal government being able to tell states what gas we can burn and a host of other things that forces on the states. But sorry, you are stuck. You could try to leave the Union, but your pal Lincoln and a good number of "blue bellies" from places like Michigan basically foreclosed that idea.

I don't care if the Big Three fold or file for bankruptcy or merge or end up owned by Honda and Toyota or continue on into the future as independent multinationals building cars in Michigan as long as they do it on their own without welfare from the US Treasury.


Jozzi IA Dec 10 9:46AM est
Subject: congressional interference
When are we going to tell our ?representatives?that if they screw things up they wwill have to pay for the rectification out of their own pocket?
___________________________________________

It seems to me we tell them repeatedly to go ahead with what they are doing because we keep voting these pine cones into office. Tom Harkin comes to mind as well as Grassley (I was born an Iowan.)

Be Careful What you ask for.
In the real world, having put over $1 trillion in play to the banking, insurance and investment banking industry, we might wonder why anyone is even worried about another $15 billion. Unless, of course, you buy into the idea that our $1 trillion was also an investment with the kinds of controls which would guarantee a "return".

And in the real world, if GM and Chrysler go bankrupt, (which is something neither a GOP administration nor a Democratic Congress wants to see) then if the GOP obstructs or kills the vote in the Senate, then you can rest assured that the sucking sound you see will be votes leaving the GOP for the Democrats all throughout the rustbelt.

Chrysler, after all, isn't going to emerge from BK. It will simply be liquidated. GM may, but with costs hat no one can foresee in terms of job losses. These people aren't selling airline tickets, they're selling cars. And if BK accelerates the spiral downward, then what may emerge would be little more than ceding much of what is left of the auto industry to competitors.

Tru Lib
"Detroit can't talk us into buying their cars so they will talk congress into taking the money from us by force. Ain't freedom great?"

I noticed that your state of Virginia has been a federal tax recipient state for decades, ranked 50th for contributions and 2nd for receipts 81-05.

Michigan, during the same period, is ranked 5th for contributions and 47th for receipts, I attribute our ranking is due at least in part to our automotive industry. Since most of the rest of the country wants the domestic automakers to file for bankruptcy, merge, or fold, then our federal tax dollars should no longer be deducted to fund the economies of other recipient states.

Akagi
The only problem with relying solely on elections for congressional turnover is that every district loves it's own pork passing member; consequently, we all get stuck with each others' idiots indefinitely. Eventually, those idiots wind up chairing committees (I give you Frank, Dodd, Conyers, and Rangle as exhibit One).

If the GOP ever hopes to regain control of congress, I recommend that they add bringing the constitutional amendment defining congressional term limits to the floor as one of the points of the new contract. Also, on my list of items in that contract are passing the FairTax, Drill Here (and Here and Here) - Drill Now, and vigorous pursuit and deportation of illegals.

In the meantime, I'm voting Libertarian at every opportunity.

rdk

I agree that US auto makers can make as good a vehicle as anyone in the world, but they have priced themselves out of the market with unsustainable benefits via the UAW.

Only congress has a better benefit package. Why should the rest of us be forced to pay for their failed utopia?

The "all knowing" giverment hasn't helped the situation any. OSHA has just about stifled any kind of production with some of their lunacy, just to name one giverment bureaucracy. The lawyer/thieves we call politicians know nothing of the business they regulate. They only know how to legally steal from them.

Say there will be up to 3,000,000 jobs lost if we don't pony up? Why not send each of the unemployed a check for $8,330? Maybe some of them can use it to start a profitable business and help us support the leviathan in DC, instead of milking it.

Ross
"I think number one we need term limits." I think I need a number of things, getting them is another matter. The SCOTUS has already ruled that state term limits for Federal offices are unconstitutional (US Term Limits, INC., et al v. Thornton, 1995). So to get this done you'll have to pass an amendment to the US Constitution. Since such an amendment would ultimately result in all of them losing their jobs, how many do you think In Congress would vote for such? You'll need 67 senators and 290 or so house members. Then 75% of the state houses agreeing. Would you support something that would lead directly to your unemployment?

They would support term limits for the President because many in the Senate see themselves as presidents-in waiting and term limits of that office benefits them in their eyes and same goes with the members of the house.

When Clinton got the line item veto, they sued because this reduced their power. They will never sign on to term limits. And there are term limits you know. They are called elections.

lanczos
Doesn't CAFE standards apply to Toyota too? Were they on Capitol Hill asking for a bailout?

The blame can be placed on the UAW and the management of the "Big Three." If the Big Three want government money, they shouldn't take half measures. Ask to be nationalized. Combined the three into one giant SOE--the brands will remaind--Ford, Chevy, GMC, Dodge, etc, but they'll all be owned by one single state owned enterprise. I suggest calling the new company ABM--American Bloated Motors.

Can't tell what make of car it is

Look out your window, and watch the cars going by. Did you see a Chevy, a Chrysler, a Ford? There is no way to tell. The Auto companies not only have built the most ugly cars ever seen, they are ashamed to put their name on them.

To solve this problem will take time to retool, and retrain both workers and buyers, but the solution is easy to find.

Just go look in the files that each company must have kept, and pull out the blueprints of the 1951 Plymouth, the 1955 Chevy, and the 1978 Cadillac I drove for 22 years.

It will take time to re-do the factory, but the result will be excellent, a vast improvement over the odd looking junk you see on every street and every parking lot.

By the way, make sure they use paint with some color in it.

Just look in a parking lot and tell me that isn’t the most ugly pile of metal you have ever seen.

By the way, here’s a job for you. As you drive here and there, and as you park at the grocery store, see if you can find two cars that are exactly, and I mean exactly alike. Or find one just like the one you are driving.


DDL
USPS as in the United States Postal Service? I know a good deal about them myself. I know they don't know the difference between the ROC and PRC and sent a package addressed "Taiwan, ROC" to Beijing. While I loathe UPS as a collection of multinational, treasonous snakes, they wouldn't ship a package to Beijing meant for southern Taiwan. An express package that was meant to arrive in two-days took 6 weeks. And what if these documents had been time sensitive? Guess I'd have been out of luck, huh?


incompetence should not be rewarded
the incompetence of GM and Crysler should not be rewarded.

their bloated management and poor management ahs driven the company into the ground. Of course, the unions were there to help kill it.

Congress is trying to keep the big 3 alive so that they don't have to restructure in Chapter 11. If they do, the sweet deals of the union become null and void.

Who knows, after the restructure they may shutdowen detroit and open up plants in the south where all of the successful car makers are.

American Cars-No Way Jose!
It has been over 20 years since I bought one of obsolete designed automobiles from Detroit and it will be another 20 years before I would even consider buying one.

Barney Fagie and the rest of the socialist Democrat and Republican parties may wish they could force us to purchase lightweight, no-safety cars but that is not the case.

It is now time to begin the consideration of burning at the stake the Washington slime that has turned traitor and stolen America right out from under us.

I see no other alternative.

Has anyone noticed
that,, despite the preponderance of evidence that most Americans do not want the Government to give the auto companies our money, Pelosi and Reid and Frank and Dodd have all the t's crossed and i's dotted and the bill to do so ready for Pres. Bush's signature?

Have we become so lethargic, or perhaps so weak and dependent ourselves that we simply haven't the time nor the energy to contact our representatives to Just Say No!!

Government will not run the companies!
Until the loaned money is repaid, government will oversee the conditions of the loan; that is, restrictions on pay and benefits of all. Creditors and bond holders will also pitch into the endeavor.

The Big Three can and do make good vehicles. The entire rustbelt provides parts for the vehicles. I think that we owe our fellow citizens a chance to succeed; if they now succeed, we will all succeed.

What kind of ...
person votes for a Frank or Dood or Teddy or Hillary? Once you answer that question you then have to realize the august wisdom of the American Constitution.
There have always been hucksters, charlatans and minstrels in our midst, the wise man might be amused at their flagrant attempt to achieve credibility; the fool elects them to public office.

Amen to Jozzi
Exactly what my wife says. Not only for the federal level but local as well. Locally we have a School Board building schools and then decide to close others because of budget. Uncle Sucker at the expense of our Representatives. I think number one we need term limits. Government service was not to be a career field according to our forefathers. I am currently reading John Adams written by David McCullough. I wish every Congress person would take the time to read this book and apply Adams
example of how to conduct themselves. This is a great book and it just turns my stomach to think our forefathers laid everything on the line for our form of government. If they only knew.

Just say NO
We need to be telling our congressmen this, not just commenting on this website.

congressional interference
When are we going to tell our ?representatives?that if they screw things up they wwill have to pay for the rectification out of their own pocket?

Can't compete w/ Japan on home ground?
The Japanese built a better mousetrap, while domestic automakers bought bigger, well-fed cats, who wait for the UAW to fetch mice for them.

The most frightening thing about government control over domestic automakers is that our elected officials will no doubt perform as badly in this capacity as they do in their "day jobs": abysmally.

Sadly, the dems have the advantage. Their supporters don't have to be informed, educated, or have any other qualities that might result in sound judgment.

It is truly ironic that the republicans (spineless slugs) choose to imitate dems, but don't offer to throw "free money" at voters, the dems' best weapon...against America.

But the automakers are making a huge commercial with the theme "you HAVE to buy our cars, but even if you don't, we don't care because we get a lot of money, anyway; screw you." Having no shame is a big plus, too.

I wonder how many Americans have already decided to never buy an American auto ever again? (We only have to pay for Japanese cars once, with no bailouts, while we must pay for American cars/trucks at the dealership and on April 15.)

Obama has fallen victim to one of Oscar Wilde's two tragedies: to get the object of one's truest desires...or NOT to get the object of one's truest desires.

He asked for it; he got it: Toyota!





To Look Good
Congress will "save" the auto industry, temporarily. Congress can't resist doing things to look like they're trying to help, even though their help almost always hurts more than it helps. The stupidity of Congress and Federal Government, in general, should never be underestimated.

Nationalized Auto Firms
Now we see that the RATgress wants to control the U.S. Auto companies directly. Forget the fact that many of the woes of the automakers are a direct result of congressional nannying the industry - CAFE standards and the like. This is the same RATgress that could not operate a kid's lemonade stand if you gave them the lemons and sugar.

And the proposed "car czar" - let's just call it what it is: the Glorious Peoples Heroic Revolutionary Commissar of Transportation.

ddl
I never worked for Ford but I helped build the Avon Lake Assembly Plant and got to know some of their "workers" first hand. If they had worked for my company, or any of the other contractors on-site they would have lasted about thirty minutes. The Unions were good in their time (1930's) but are now run by people who have no desire to do anything except skim off the dues. Chapter 11 is the only way the problem will get solved, a bailout is simply a bandaid on the inevitable.

DDL
How much experience is required? Is buying overpriced lemons and not getting your mail enough? People want to buy Toyotas and use FedEx and UPS because they have experience as customers. That is ALL the experience one needs when deciding who should get your money.

Detroit can't talk us into buying their cars so they will talk congress into taking the money from us by force. Ain't freedom great?

Time to Walk Off the Lot
Greenberg knows little about the inner workings of the automotive industry, nor the USPS, the former that I have worked for indirectly, and the latter directly, yet he feels that he is qualified to criticize them?

Stick to bashing businesses that you know about from personal experience, rather than polluting the ether with your diatribes.






The Other Side.
"...socially desirable goals...." Huh, anybody ever notice that socially desirable goals have ruined every great empire?

I think of one of the most recent (I think in geologic time, almost), Great Britain. Yes, Great Britain built and sustained a great empire, for quite a while, forswearing any kind of bankruptcy protection. That's what Debtor's Prisons were for. Then guys like Dickens came along, and it was all downhill, after that.

Forgive me, I am always sorry to mention actual human experience.

Let em go
It is time to let GM and the others sleep in their soiled sheets.

Any competent manager knows that a company can not have a growing pool of non-productive workers drawing on the company without eventually hitting the wall. They signed the contracts, did not fund the pensions with real dollars and let those dollars grow.

After living high on the stolen largess, the bills come due, they find themselves bankrupt, and it is a surprise? A high school econ student knows better..

They did it to themselves.

Big 3
should become the Big 0, as in, zero tax dollars. There should be no bailout unless the Congressman/woman want to put up their own money. Just think of all the money they would make from their investment.
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