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Saturday, January 03, 2009
Paul Driessen :: Townhall.com Columnist
Saving Lives with Coal
by Paul Driessen
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There is no such thing as “clean coal,” environmentalists insist. Burning coal to generate electricity emits soot particles that cause respiratory problems, lung cancer and heart disease, killing 24,000 Americans annually.

It’s the kind of claim that eco-activist Bruce Hamilton says “builds the Sierra Club,” by generating cash and lobbying clout for his and similar groups.

It’s also disingenuous, unethical and harmful.

Since 1970, unhealthy power plant pollutants have been reduced by almost 95% per unit of energy produced. Particulate emissions (soot) decreased 90% below 1970 levels, even as coal use tripled, and new technologies and regulations will nearly eliminate most coal-related pollution by 2020, notes air quality expert Joel Schwartz.

Moreover, the vast bulk of modern power plant particulates are ammonium sulfate and ammonium nitrate. “Neither substance is harmful, even at levels tens of times greater than are ever found in the air Americans breathe,” Schwartz says.

The alleged death toll is based on speculative links between pollution and disease, and unwarranted extrapolations from responsible estimates to levels that grab headlines and prompt contributions.

Coal helps keep American homes, businesses, factories, airports, schools and hospitals humming, and provides myriad benefits that never get mentioned by anti-coal factions. Even if we accept these groups’ assertions as fact, the benefits of coal should be considered in any policy debate – just as we acknowledge (and strive to reduce) motor vehicle deaths, but recognize the value of transporting people, products and produce.

Coal generates half of all US electricity, and 60-98% in twenty-two states, according to the Energy Information Administration. Modern, state-of-the-art, low-pollution coal-fired generators have replaced both antiquated power plants and monstrous industrial furnaces that were the backbone of our nation’s steel-making and industrial might just two generations ago. They improve and save millions of lives.

Imposing excessive new regulations, or closing coal-fired power plants, would produce few health or environmental benefits. But it would exact huge costs on society – and bring factories, offices and economies to a screeching halt in states that are 80-98% dependent on coal: Indiana, Kentucky, Missouri, North Dakota, Ohio, Utah, West Virginia and Wyoming.

Coal’s reliable, affordable electricity creates millions of high-paying jobs, and thus provides health insurance, rent and mortgage money, nutrition, clothing and retirement benefits for countless families. It keeps people warm (and alive) on freezing nights, and comfortable during summer heat waves like the 2003 scorcher that killed 15,000 elderly French citizens who didn’t have air-conditioning.

Thanks to coal-based electricity, CT scans, x-rays, colonoscopies and other examinations detect cancer, heart disease and other health threats, saving numerous lives every year. Life-saving and enhancing surgeries are performed because doctors have lights, lasers, computers, and sterile operating rooms and equipment. Premie wards and life-support systems carry people through critical illnesses.

Children and adults get vaccinations that remain viable because of dependable refrigeration. Millions avoid deadly intestinal bacteria, due to refrigerators and freezers, and water that is sterilized and piped in large measure because of electricity.

American families live in houses that are built from stronger materials and to higher standards, because of electricity. Tens of millions have been warned of natural disasters, and given time to flee, thanks to radios and televisions.

Environmentalists talk glibly about replacing America’s 600-plus coal-fired power plants, and the 2 billion megawatt-hours of electricity they generate annually. But with what?

Most greens detest nuclear power as much as they hate coal. They want to dismantle dams, not build new ones. They oppose drilling for natural gas that could partially substitute for coal, and fuel essential backup generators for wind farms. They support geothermal energy in theory, but rarely in practice.

They oppose construction of new state-of-the-art coal-fired plants that America needs to supply more baseload power, to serve a growing population and electricity-hungry products and equipment of every description. Most do support wind energy – and it must also play a role.

But right now, wind turbines provide a mere 1% of all US electricity. Wind power leader Texas gets just 2% of its electricity from breezes – versus 36% from coal. On blistering summer afternoons, when the Lone Star State most needs reliable air-conditioners, Texans can count on wind turbines to generate at only 9% of their installed capacity, because that’s when the wind blows least.

How exactly will Texas replace 36% of its electricity with renewable energy? How exactly will Indiana and North Dakota replace the 94% that they get from coal?

What happens to all those benefits when coal power is legislated, regulated, litigated, priced or cap-and-traded to the sidelines? To lives that are improved and saved with that electricity?

A little specificity, moral clarity and social responsibility would help here. We generally can’t expect it from environmental activists – who excel at denigrating and opposing energy, but do little to generate anything but hot air and political power.

However, we should expect, and demand, clear answers from judges, elected representatives and unelected government regulators. That’s the essence of ethics and social responsibility.

If we are going to end this recession, retain American jobs and living standards, and rejuvenate our economy, we will need vast quantities of electricity – from coal and every other source – now and for decades to come.

The rest of the world also needs coal, to lift people out of poverty and save lives.

In impoverished countries, two billion people rarely or never have electricity. Four million infants, children and parents die every year from lung infections – caused by smoke, soot and other pollutants from open fires that heat their homes and cook their meager food, because they don’t have electricity. Two million more perish from intestinal diseases, caused by unsafe water and spoiled food, because they lack refrigeration, sanitation and water treatment.

Radical environmentalists bemoan the exaggerated death count from producing electricity here in the United States. But they callously battle every proposal to build coal, gas or hydroelectric projects in these destitute countries.

24,000 speculative deaths versus six million very real deaths is hardly a fair tradeoff.

As we usher in 2009, may America and all nations resolve to implement policies that honestly reflect the costs, benefits and power-generating capabilities of traditional and alternative energy options that exist in the real world.

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About The Author
Paul Driessen is senior policy adviser for the Committee For A Constructive Tomorrow (CFACT), which is sponsoring the All Pain No Gain petition against global-warming hype. He also is a senior policy adviser to the Congress of Racial Equality and author of Eco-Imperialism: Green Power - Black Death.

Be the first to read Paul Driessen's column. Sign up today and receive Townhall.com delivered each morning to your inbox.

Coal
I don't usually read conservative blogs (I consider myself to be more left-leaning)but I have to say that I do agree with Mr. Driessen's points. While I'm not fond of the term "clean coal" (it probably ought to be "cleaner" coal), I do believe strongly that coal is important to our energy future. The fact is that it is going to be used -- most experts agree on that. Clean coal technology is what has made coal so much cleaner to use, and advanced clean coal technology has to be developed to make sure we can get to the carbon. This is not a partisan issue -- Pres.-Elect Obama and Sen. John McCain both agree that coal will be an important part of our energy mix and they both agreed that funding for clean coal technology is a must do. Clean Coal Technology is not a dream -- it is a real solution to a real problem -- how do we meet our growing energy demand with affordable and clean energy? I went to the site that one of the earlier commenters suggested (www.americaspower.org). Some good information there, although I'd like to see more details and more substance on solutions, including what legislation the group will support. That is key.

Global Warming
Those of you that contine to insist global warming is a figment of someone's imagination, explain world wide glacier melt and species retreat to higher latitudes and elevations.

Great article
This is a great article, thanks Paul! I did a little research about clean coal and found a group that is leading the coal electricity fight. They had a lot of great information on Clean Coal technology on their website:

http://www.americaspower.org/

You can even sign up for updates. They send information about specific issues and ways to get involved in the movement. I am pretty excited.

Quick Math Check
Our coal reserves is equivalent to about 1 trillion barrels of oil energy, while natural gas is at about 230 billion barrels. Our oil reserves stand at about 31 billion barrels that include ANWR and off-shore locales. Unfortunately, coal has traditionally been considered dirty and environmentally unfriendly from images stereotypical images we get from "London Fog", "Black Lung Disease", "16 Tons" and etc. We have the technology to arrest CO2 emissions; why not go for it? We import oil not just because of environmental issues but oil companies know we don't have enough of it on our shores.

An idea
Since Sierra Club, PETA, ... like to oppose dams, coal-power, nuclear power, etc.

How about the following: members of these orgs should volunteer to be the first off the grids in order to make shutdown of power-plants smoother.

(of course, that goes about as well as suggesting they jump off a cliff to provide birds with sustenance).

;)

Classic Love/Hate Relationship
For years, the Algorholics of the world have told us how horrible energy is while flying on private planes between visiting their various estates. Unfortunately, they still think that they have more control over demand than does the market.

People decreased driving and cut down on overall energy consumption when the prices SKYROCKETED. Neverthess, the Govt. wants to increase revenues by raising taxes while championing environmentalism and encouraging consumption? Huh? We are supposed to hate energy, but the government wants us to love it enough to consume more so that they can generate more revenues.

Despite the crossed fingers and pretty pleases of Big Government, when prices increase, consumption decreases. Reality is such a biatch that way. I suppose that the geniuses will think that Americans will be happier paying for their eco-terrorism than we were in funding terror-loving petrocrats. The enemy that you know doesn't make him more popular and will likely fail to restore evaporating tax revenues.

Politicans have screamed, "Big Oil", at every opportunity, even though the Government takes a 16.66667% royalty off of all gross hydrocarbon production. Then, they tax all of us. Talk about Big Government Oil.

Crippling Agendas
The only reason to agitate for us to stop burning coal or to stop building nuclear power plants is to criple the US. It is understandable that our enemies want to cripple the US.
Also, I do not believe particulate emissions from coal has much if any soot in it. Solid fuels, as covered in my Ph.D. Thesis, tend to emit carbon as charcoal, not as soot. If I am right, the particle size of any carbon emitted from coal combustion is likely too large to be hazardous.

Paul Driessen:Saving Lives

The problem with his call for more honest discussion of real facts is that it won't happen. The "global warming" crowd and their media pets have captured the high ground with their assertion that the world is quickly growing much warmer, that this is the result of human activity, and that cutting carbon emissions must be pursued to save the planet.

None of these assertions are true. The state of things 10 years out, as predicted at the time of the Kyoto conference, have NOT come to pass. The earth has not warmed further and has actually gotten a bit cooler, despite huge increases in cumulative carbon emissions during the past 10 years. An honest look at all the data now available shows the last 25 years of the 20th century as the anomaly among several hundred years of cooling.

The environmentalist movement knows this, which is why their claims are now morphing into "climate change" and "energy independence".
The first is an inherent part of nature and the second is an important strategic political matter, but neither has anything to do with "global warming"

The biggest challenge since communism
Europe is reeling from "Cap and Trade" just as we ready ourselves to be led by our new President into this economic thresher. Why? To what end?
Research Maruice Strong and George Soros for a clue. Realize their intentions and how they have positioned themselves and you will see that we are in big trouble.

We need more Driessens
Excellent,wonderful, thoughtful, helpful article by Paul Driessen. All Americans who are seriously interested in protecting this country should carefully read and UNDERSTAND what he is saying.

"Change"
Well folks, several "Americans" appeared to have "drank the kool-aid" of empty promises without even reading the ingredients. We are already beginning to see how this still undefined "change" will be accomplished: new taxes (lots of them), more government using the same old politicians (look at his cabinet), less freedom, and shutting down the few American industries left. Save the auto industry - where the labor unions have won out over common sense (did Chrysler collapse when they went bankrupt or did a very wise man name Iacoca lead the recovery?).

We clearly cannot trust the media. The "election" demonstrated all too well how distorted the reporting is these days. As we learned in Statistics class, you can take real numbers and make them show any result - it's how you select the data. Withhold the meaningful data - just like several "statistics" quoted in this blog.

And yet some "Americans" continue to believe the lies that spout from the likes of Al Bore and a few misguided "scientists" regarding our environment. If we would just use our brain and look at the actual history of weather on this planet we would see that "global warming" and the new and improved "global climate change" are just "normal". I do agree we need to take better care of our environment though. I wonder how many of these "greenies" actually recycle? Just look at the homes of Al Bore to get an idea of his true energy usage.

And now, PE Obama (the rock star) begins his quest to save us from ourselves and strip us of everything that made this country great. I have to wonder what it will take for those misguided folks that voted for him to wake up.

Let's use the RICO statutes . . .
against the environ Mentalists. They are perpetrating wholesale FRAUD by their total lack of knowledge about BASIC PHYSICAL SCIENCE concepts. Most of these Birkenstock wearing (urban dwelling) holdovers from the 1960's have NO understanding of the value of energy in its various forms. They have elevated environMentalism into a religion with its concept of earth worship. (separation of church and state needed here?)
RICO statutes could be used against them (as well as international "law") for their genocidal policies with respect to the ban of DDT and its wholesale slaughter of HUMAN BEINGS on the African continent. Oops, I forget, according to environMentalism, HUMAN BEINGS are NOT part of the equation.

fuel efficient?
The nickel used in the batteries is mined in Canada. It is then shipped to china for processing. It is then shipped to the U.S. to bemade into batteries. And after about three years we will ask ourselves, "What are we supposed to do with these old, wornout batteries?" Now that is smart.

Learned a lot
I have learned a lot from these blogs (even go over to the far left sites to see where they are getting their info). I certainly don't get this info from my local newspaper and heaven forbid the Chicago Tribune give a conservative view, and these 3 minute in depth studies the local stations may do on these subjects just leave me frustrated.
I appreciate the views on this forum and the sites they have referred to so that I can give a more informed opinion when I write in to the editor's letters or talk among co-workers. Many times I find that they only listen to one point of view and that is what they have heard from the biased media. Until I got this laptop and was able to search what is going outside the Ilinois boundaries that I have been able to question and maybe even change my views.
The Sierra Club is pro-choice..they would rather hug a tree than a precious baby...I say "You go Beavers, Dam the EPA"

Steve needs to think it through
Re Reply #1: Steverino, most of us don't live in Boston, NY, and LA. You city slickers need to remember that. There is a whole world outside the city limits that you ought to learn about. What's true for you isn't true for the majority of Americans.

Re Reply #2: Each of us pays road use taxes individually. You pay for your usage (however minimal it may be because of the train) in gasoline taxes. So do I. So do the other commentators. On the other hand, I don't know where the train/subway subsidies come from, but I'm pretty sure they aren't just in the ticket or long-term pass that you buy. They're collected via a tax or taxes somewhere, or portioned off of funds fed by taxes. That means everyone in the locality pays regardless of use, and that, sir, is socialism at its finest. On the road, you're coming very close to paying your own way. On the rails, you're not. (Before anyone goes off on this, let me say that the scenario gets better and better as ridership increases. In NYC there's a lot of ridership, so the proportion of ticket prices to taxes is very favorable to the taxpayer; in smaller markets, it will not be. What works well in NYC or Boston will not necessarily work in Orlando, for example.)

east bumphu#&
"I can take the bus across town and take two hours to reach my destination, or get in my car and be there in half the time."

I don't know what kind of ghost town you live in, but in the three cities where I have spent my adult life (NYC, Boston and LA) I could never have commuted to work by car in even twice the time I spent on the subway. Currently, my 17 minute subway trip (each way) replaces an hour (minimum) car trip. And sleeping or reading the paper sure beats gripping the wheel until my knuckles turn white. But I understand if you would be uncomfortable sitting next to people with varied backgrounds.

roads are socialist
"If you want to get there by train, that's fine with me. But if you insist on taking my money to pay for your service, I'm going to insist that you spend 5-to-10 in the penitentiary for stealing."

unlike all of the federal state, and local taxes used to pay for roads, that I don't use while riding the train. when do you send me my refund?

Subject: Polly
It's also a nightmare trying to clear a road when the trailer breaks down carrying one of those things. Took 2 days to clear a major intersection in western Iowa last year.

To be fair, though, I will say there are better designs, but I don't know if they are any better at producing energy.

Where are the Libs?
Anyone else notice the striking absence of our regular TH loonies on this article?

Defend your messiah damn it!!

To Bryce1 at 3:12 p.m.
Re: Exxon-Mobil.

While XOM has a small coal operation in Illinois, they're going to largely see coal as a competitor to their main oil business.

If Dreissen's a shill, he's selling their _competitors'_ product!

The point of the article was that shutting down the coal industry will deprive society of many good things. Your desire to hurt your fellow man marks you as either thoughtless or a sociopath.


Public Transit
Tends to be beastly inconvenient (often doesn't go where you need to go, or doesn't go when you want to go). I can take the bus across town and take two hours to reach my destination, or get in my car and be there in half the time.

But my biggest complaint against it is that it seems to always need a subsidy. Steve; If you want to get there by train, that's fine with me. But if you insist on taking my money to pay for your service, I'm going to insist that you spend 5-to-10 in the penitentiary for stealing. 'Cause that's what it is.

fear of public transit???
someone said:
" instead of draft animals we ride electric trains"

what is it about trains that upsets certain people; the fact that you can't drive them yourself? I'm always surprised when people equate trains with some communist plot.

Drill Now, Drill Here, Pay Less
Lord Obama and his followers seem to want to overlook that an estimated 80% of Americans supported the Drill Now, Drill Here, Pay Less philosophy a few months back. Obviously the price of gas has gone down since then, but this past week on C-SPAN, Greg Simon, a member of Lord Obama's transition team told a group of American University students that the new energy plan calls for a $2.50 tax increase on gas to bring the price of fuel to $4.00 per gallon. The idea is to tax gas to create a fund to provide incentives for "green approved" energy, flawed and unproductive as it may be.

When the dust settles Lord Obama and his enviro-wackos don't have the goods to deliver on the energy front. Wind, solar and geothermal are over a decade away from being viable as even supplemental energy sources. In order to bring the economy back to a more productive model, the country needs its' own resources to include coal, off shore oil, shale and natural gas. You can not generate true growth from the bottom up as planned by Lord Obama. FDR needed World War II to make people forget his failure to end the Great Depression with socialist ideas.

Finally, why not clean coal technology? Why does Lord Obama fear this idea? Could it be that it does not fit his template for governmental control of energy? It is too promising as a solution, which means the population might not have to look to Lord Obama for their BAILOUT. Make them dependent on government so you can control their lives.

IN GOD WE TRUST

mini reactors
Dr Tom:

Those small portable reactors have been in the science mags. Don't recall which ones. Maybe NEW SCIENTIST or SCIENTIFIC AMERICAN or the like. Didn't see anything about holes in the ground but they are self operating. They are expected to be a great help to 3rd world countries.

They still have the nuclear waste problem. As has already been pointed out, it is a political problem, not a tech problem. The anti-nuke forces are unnecessarily hysterical about anything nuclear and about nuclear waste.

Enviro wackos
Two types: the true believers and the Marxist opportunists. the first group wants to kill our economy because it is based upon the pursuit of happiness enabled by industrialism. They want to turn back the clock to a time when we all walked to the store and our work. The second group uses environmentalism to leverage political clout to achieve the Marxist Utopian state where all are equally miserable. Know your enemies.

They Hate Unlimited Energy
The real agenda of the green-commies & their patrons & masters the totalitarian aristocratic political class, is to restrict energy availability & choke off our ability to freely buy & use it.

If some tech that promises truly to provide basically unlimited energy e.g. space-based solar power beamed back to Earth at microwaves, or nuclear fusion, they'd consider it a disaster & try to stop it. Unlimited energy would be anathema to them.

Energyphobia & Green Serfdom
The anthrogenic "climate change" dogma & all the other anti-energy initiatives are actually aimed at making virtually all energy both scarce, & rationed by government. Energy, the key to our freedom & productivity, will go from a commodity we can produce & buy w/ our productivity, to another pile of political "spoils" to be parceled out or witheld by the aristopolitical class to reward themselves & their buds & punish their adversaries. That's what it's about & all it ever really was about! Totalitarianism thru control of energy.

I garantee you, even if folks started rolling up their sleeves & trying to actually site wind farms & solar plants, y'know what? The greenies & their Dem pals would squelch them, on the theory that they'll threaten endangered species & migratory birds, not to mention spoil the Kennedys' view of Nantucket Sound from Cape Cod. I saw a windfarm in a pass east of LA where I-10 cut thru the mts & descended (San Gorgonio? near Redlands? IIRC) to the coast. I think two out of all of them were even turning at all. Someone told me they killed protected birds when they ran wide open. Watch for solar plants to get nixed for shading ES habitats, issues to be dreamed up w/ wave power, & so forth.

I honestly think the fringe greenie totalitarians' ideal for most "commoners" is that we would live at a medieval level, except instead of fires we have little heaters & LED's that can be shut off remotely by the regulators at curfew, instead of draft animals we ride electric trains when & where they say we can, & we'll have Orwellian "telescreens" for feeding us propaganda 24-7 & cell phones tracking & spying on us.

Furthermore...
Now that you all hate me for being a presumtuous a**. LOL. Did anyone besides me see and read the article on mini-nuclear power plants that appeared several a few weeks ago on Drudge?

I have not found a link or any discussion on this subject, but it looked quite promissing. Basically a small self contained nuclear generator, similar to what is currently used on subs and aircraft carriers now, small enough to be transported on a flatbed truck, that is simply chucked in a big hole in the ground and would supply energy enough for several thousand homes for 20 to 25 years before having to be replaced. The price was just a few mil.

Seems to me that that sort of technology negates the above arguments about nuke plants being so expensive.

Dr. Tom

Where are all the enviro-wacko's?
By and large, most of the responses I've read are from resposible conservative envio-realists. Where are all the tree-hugging, whale-humping, tie-dyed wackos? ...chirp, chirp, chirp...when it comes to looking for a learned response from one of these enviro-idiots who think with their feelings rather than with their heads.

But I have to say, to Russ in MI, and all, yes, it IS happening. Here and now. And who do I fault? Those of you sitting in your undies in your basements bitching about this stuff instead of getting out in your communities and spreading the gosple as it were.

There is nothing to be gained here. You won't convince any of the dumba**es who do manage to poke their noses into this forum, but you might just be able to help your neighbor see the light over a backyard bar-be-que (with a real Weber and real Kingsford charcoal), or your buds at the local watering hole, or the guys and gals at work with a level-headed argument backed up with facts as presented in this article and not a bunch of 'feelings' and subjective whining like the libs are famous for.

So, you want to save this country, your job, your family's future? STOP BLOGGING, START TALKING!!

Dr. Tom

Zero Emission Coal
Here is a link to what the researchers are up to on zero emission coal.

http://www.princeton.edu/~chm333/2002/fall/co_two/minerals/ zec.htm

Roger E. Sowell
Marina del Rey, CA

S.A.M.
Wow! Just think of the "green" jobs it'll take to put that sucker back together again!! Obama's right!

And the more often this happens, the better. Even MORE green jobs.

C'mon, don't get started on "allocation of scarce resources."

Reasons Not to Glow Nuclear

1. Waste reprocessing, or sequestering toxic radioactives for thousands of years.

2. Shortage of qualified engineers to design and supervise construction.

3. Shortage of skilled workers to construct the plants.

4. Skyrocketing costs of materials: steel, concrete, copper, and others. These plants will cost far more than the last group.

5. Environmental groups and their lawyers are far more numerous, and have far more laws to use in their lawsuits to delay the plants.

6. High-cost nuclear power in the 1970's and 80's provided strong incentives for refineries and large chemical plants to build their own, highly-efficient power plants and go off the grid. Many combined-cycle cogeneration (CCC) plants were built then. The same cycle of build-a-nuke, raise the rates, and watch the customer base shrink will happen again.

7. Distributed Generation: the geeks and engineers have been busy in the past 30 years. This time around, not just refineries and big chemical plants can go off the grid by building a CCC. Smaller versions of these allow small businesses and homeowners to use natural gas to provide power, heating in winter and air conditioning in summer.

Utility planners should take note before embarking on new nuclear power plants.

-- Roger E. Sowell
Marina del Rey, CA

Remember California's turmoil
A couple of years ago with energy? Now we'll have the same on a 57 or 58 state wide basis. I'm just quoting our Prez elect for that number.
A few states already are figuring ways to raise the gasoline tax, because their favorite cars don't use as much gas, and we have to fund the highways.
Obscura says he'll bankrupt the coal burning plants - with no replacement in sight for new technology to replace it for decades - if then.
The big O says he'll create 2 million jobs. A couple of days ago I heard the manufacturing sector has lost, I believe 4 million jobs alone in the last several years, and still going downward.
I wonder if the libs and elites and their supporters have figured where they'll live in the future. Because the America that we grew up in - when America was a can do country - has no way of surviving these imbeciles.
Not as long as the libs control the MSM and we continue to graduate students totally oblivious of American history and our government. With good self esteem however!

I used to think windmills were good
Until I saw what happened when the brakes failed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvuP5IApfu4

What's going to happen in wind storms?

These things have to shut down when the wind goes above a certain speed.


Besides, coal ash makes good fertilizer.

Paul
A good article but it fails the "pussyfoot" test.

Lets call a spade a spade. The "war" on coal fired electrical energy is not about some environmentalist's totally unsubstantiated claim of 24000 deaths per year attributable to burning coal for energy.

It is about how to extract $Billions of US treasure under the guise of CO2 as a pollutant. Even the idiots on the left have begun to realize that their Global Warming aka Climate Change ALGORIAN mantra is coming unraveled. That is what is driving the "hurry up and pass this" frenzy in WDC to get a nationwide Cap and Trade CO2 tax in place.

Secondarily, such a "tax" is the ready made tool to impose:
1. Travel Restrictions-thru direct carbon taxation
and gasoline rationing to eliminate CO2 emissions.
2. Home Energy usage-Special meters that can control home usage at governmental whim.
3."Taxing" the energy source-Electric Utilities. And severely taxing those that are propagandized as "polluters. ie coal.
3. Massive government market interference-huge subsidies to let the latest "environmental darling", wind, geothermal, solar, ethanol(food for gas) be competitive.

I have personally toured the Four Corners coal fired plant in Arizona. I would happily have the exhaust gas that gets to the top of the chimney piped into my house if that would convince a few liberals that "Coal" is not a "demon", quite the contrary, it is our salvation from oil dependence.

PC is Thought Control
LEE

bryce1
Driessen is a "shill" for the energy industry? Therefore, don't believe him when he says coal is an important and necessary product if we want affordable energy?

Okay, all of your logical arguments have convinced me.

Too bad, if he'd had a grant from Government, we'd KNOW he was truthful. AND brighter than the average citizen, too. Drat.

jim
You say that "[f]or clean energy we must necessarily captur (sic) dirty products." You appear to have accepted that carbon dioxide is a "dirty product." It's not.

Problem solved.

Great article
Liberals always have trouble seeing past the end of their noses. They endorse ideas and regulations without considering the very predictable but unintended consequences. Green space increases housing costs, hiking the minimum wage reduces entry level positions, etc.

Recall also that the automobile reduced pollution - from horses.

Coal technology continues to improve. Here in Colorado Springs, a promising new system is being evaluated that shows potential for reducing pollution even further.

Coal vs. Natural Gas
One of the things that the Enviros push for is building Natural Gas fired generating plants instead of coal. Let's look at these two options.

With a coal-fired generator, you can install scrubbers and other pollution-control devices that remove almost all of the objectionable pollution.

If we build natural gas-fired generators instead, the increased demand drives up the cost of natural gas. When the cost of heating peoples' home goes up, the people look for other, less expensive, options. One of the options I see quite a bit is backyard wood-fired boilers.

So what pollutes more, one coal-fired generator with extensive pollution controls supplying electricity to 100,000 homes heated by natural gas, or a natural gas-fired generator supplying electricity to 100,000 homes heated by wood-fired backyard boilers?

The answer seems pretty obvious to anyone with a working brain.

Speaking the Truth Hurts - Liberals
If you speak the truth to Liberals that is considered offense and stupid. Lives are saved from all of our energy efforts. We must have coal and it is cleaner then ever in history. It does safe lives and gives the American people an easier life because of it.

As someone who suffers from a lung disease caused by an pesticide exposure while at work, I am not out there saying all pesticides should be banded. Yes, people suffer from all sorts of diseases from their own enviroment and outside enviroments, but we can't stop living because of it and we can't ask an entire nation to suffer because of it either.

Green is good, but obession with it or anything else is dangerous!
Liz, Apison, TN

Driessen the shill
Read Driessen's bio. His work is funded in part by Exxon Mobile. Of course he resists 'green' efforts, the man is a shill for the energy industry.

clean coal & & nuclear power
Wiseone:

I'm not sure I follow. The objective is clean energy. For clean energy we must necessarily captur dirty products. At the state of to days tech clean coal is not possible.

To destroyed mountains: if you are talking specifically about the Apps., you are correct--but open cast mining is still prevalent world wild.

Oregon is half desert. I recreate in the desert. We have a nerve gas depot in the desert. I have no problem with a nuclear waste dump in Or.

Dealing With Nuclear Waste
Don't the French reprocess their waste into much smaller amounts somehow? Seems to me there is a reprocessing facility in Virginia that does that for the French. Why don't we reprocess the waste we generate? Any engineers that can address this subject?

Phony
I wonder every time I see it, who is doing the counting of these people who are dying of whatever the reason? It always seems to be a very large number. Who takes the time to seek out this information? I thought medical records were private. It would take some doing to call each doctor of people, in the thousands, and ask what they died of. Have we reached a state where people just accept this number as fact? Sorry, I don`t. Every time I read one of these I just file it as junk news. Not worth the time.

Jim @ 11:59
US patent 6,846,967 offers a methodology to handle all levels of nuclear waste.

The problem with nuclear waste is holding it somewhere safe until it is no longer radioactive, which is 10 half-life cycles. Dr. Jerry Pournelle suggested storing it in the Mojave Desert years ago, but that was before airliners were used as cruise missiles.

Contaminated material (low level solid radioactives and other dangers) could be injected into the Kilauea volcano lava flow going into the Pacific where the lava destroys most of the material and disperses the radioactivity in the slightly radioactive lava.

There are ways to handle the problem. The political will needs to be there to do it.

For jim
"Coal loses 40% of its energy to make steam. Another 15% goes to capture So2/NoX/ash. An estimated 40% will go to capture Co2. That's 95% before we build infructure to sequester Co2 and we're not sure it will stay sequestered."

Your post is written as if the object of burning coal is to "sequester" CO2. This is the exact tail-wags-the-dog thinking that results in windmills and ethanol, which have to be subsidized by the feds AND backed up by the 'dreaded' conventional fossil fuels.

Let's do a little math. If we eliminate the bogus requirements of "captur[ing]" and "sequester[ing]" CO2, then suddenly we're using 73% of the energy to make steam. which is the object of burning the coal in the first place.

All your stats prove is that you think the objective is to capture CO2 when the objective is to make steam (and, subsequently, electricity).

"And then it doesn't matter if angel aroma and pixie farts come out the stack. They still level mountains and clog streams to get the coal."

This is bull. No mountains have been levelled to mine coal. Coal mines are famous for being tunnelled into mountains. Some open pit mining does occur, but not on anything close to the scale of "level[ing]" mountains. And it has been decades since coal mining companies clogged or ruined streams.

Your post is a perfect example of the kind of BS propaganda spewed by the enviro lobby.

BTW - I too am for nuclear energy. But I notice that you, in OR, are far too willing to store your nuclear waste in the deserts of other states. How about we make a law that all nuke waste made in OR has to be stored in OR? Still in favor of it?

Oh, Wiseone
Our universities are educating 10 lawyers for every engineer they turn out. Personaly, I think we're doomed.

Clean coal
"Greens" should dismantle their own property and move to another country and leave us alone. The 60s are over. They don't have any problem killing babies but some smoke in the air drives them nuts!

The "death toll"

When I was in Washington State in 2003 I saw anti-smoking billboards that claimed 50,000+ people die every day from second hand smoke.

I found out where this idiotic statistic comes from. Anti-smoking nazis believe that everyone is exposed to second-hand smoke. They also believe that everyone who exposed to second-hand smoke suffers heart, liver, and kidney damage. So anytime anyone dies of heart, liver, or kidney failure the anti-smoking nazis say it was the second-hand smoke that caused it because the victim would have lived a little longer if he had breathed second-hand smoke.

This is, without a doubt, the same kind of 'logic' being used by environmentalist whackos who claim coal cause 24,000 deaths every year.

The free market
USMC Lt. writes:

"As far as I know [a]bout the ONLY THING that could even come close to producing the electricity we need at a cost equal to or lower than coal, with the same low levels of REAL pollution, or even less, is Nuclear Power."

USMC Lt. is right. It is not by coincidence that more than half of our electricity comes from coal. Nor was it some mad scientist's whimsical lust that caused major utilities to build nuclear power plants.

The free market has a marvelous way of finding the most cost-effective solutions to everyday problems, provided the federal gov't lets it.

We have a wonderful system in the US. Our universities train engineers and scientists to figure out ways to use narural resources to solve the problems of life. Our business schools teach managers how to implement the discoveries and designs of the scientists and engineers. And they teach our accountants how to calculate the cost vs. benefit (aka "profit").

Then a gang of ignorant liberals who couldn't build an outhouse if you spotted them three walls and a toilet paper holder come along and tell all the scientists, engineers, accountants, and business managers how they have to do their jobs. In the process we get less light, less heat, less energy, and less freedom.

Environmentalism in 2009 is not about the environment. It's about liberals trying to control your life.

clean coal
Clean coal is a myth. Coal loses 40% of its energy to make steam. Another 15% goes to capture So2/NoX/ash. An estimated 40% will go to capture Co2. That's 95% before we build infructure to sequester Co2 and we're not sure it will stay sequestered.

And then it doesn't matter if angel aroma and pixie farts come out the stack. They still level mountains and clog streams to get the coal.

Nuclear power is cheap and clean. The rub on nuclear is waste disposal. The 240,000 year waste danger is another myth. After 600 years nuclear waste loses 99% of its toxicity.

But still waste must be stored someplace. This country has well in excess of a quarter million square miles of desert. Surely it can handle a few thousand yards of waste.

I helped
design the Kilngas Coal Gasification Project.

Saving jobs with coal too
Obama said that he intends to shut down the coal industry. He presented it as just stopping new coal-fired power plants from being built. There is a lot more to coal than that. This move will shut down the coal, iron, and steel industries and every industry that uses coal, iron, and steel.
Coal is used to power steam engines, heat some homes, and to make iron ore into iron the metal.
Coal is used to heat pig iron to form it.
Coal is roasted to make it into coke.
Coke is used to convert iron the metal into steel the metal.
Coal is used to form steel ingots into shapes like I-beams.
Steel is made into parts like nuts and bolts, angles, rebars, pipes, etc.
Reinforcing bars are needed for reinforced concrete.
Steel parts are made into machines such as lathes, harvesters, reactors, pumps, etc.
Steel is needed for drilling and transporting oil, natural gas, coal, and nuclear fuel.

When all these industries go out of business, they will no longer pay the many taxes they now pay, nor pay the employees’ income taxes, nor pay the new taxes that put them out of business.

Russ in MI @ 10:41 AM
That is interesting, and yet, all we keep reading is about how Obama is appointing such moderates. Oh, what a pragmatic Messiah he is. Oh brother.

So, Why Did They Vote For The Big "O?"
My grandfather, dad, and uncles all worked in the coal mines many years ago and my dad is 84 years old today and doing pretty good but the EPA would probably say it's because he's a tough old Italian guy. So, why did the American people vote for a man who wants to devastate our economy by bankrupting coal mines? Thank you main stream media for making your wishes all come true. Our only hope is that those same voters rise up and write letters and protest any such devastating move to our great country which is only one amongst many that are devastating our country to bring it to its knees and enslave these great nation if the socialist agenda is allowed to move forward as planned.

Politicians & terrorists, eco- & other
Begin with the knowledge that politicians are no more intelligent than the rest of us and in fact, for the most part, they're merely people who could not earn a living in any other occupation. They're good at winning elections, that's all.

Still, I don't believe that anywhere near ALL of them believe this "global warming/climate change" baloney. But it's certain they can control our lives with their implementing policies. And along the way they can enrich themselves.

The Democrats forced CRA on lenders, in the sure knowledge that the U.S. was rich enough to give home-ownership to the poor. Okay, that didn’t work out so well, but that's okay, the U.S. is rich enough to bail out the lenders who were forced to make economically-unsound loans, right?

And the U.S. is rich enough to waste $$ on stopping global warming/climate change, too. If utility bills become too high, the taxpayers will subsidize the utilities of the poor. The rest of us can give up silly things like travel and Wii and save for our utility bills.

If we become too poor to afford our health care? Well, the government has an answer for that, too.

I see similarities between the environmental wackos and the Islamic terrorists. They may not really believe in what they’re fighting for, but they can sure have fun fighting. And their true goal is to disrupt the lives of the people, world-wide but especially in the U.S., and of any and all businesses that make the evil “profits.” In this both groups succeed.


baseballdoc
Excellent point. The Left demands that we accept evolution as the guiding force and then refuses to allow it to have it's way. Personally I see evolution as the way God achieves his ends and see the process as inevitable. What happens when you attempt to thwart the inevitable?

I Help Build Clean Coal Facilities
We've just completed one, and we're working on the second one. This technology works, friends.
http://concretebob.vox.com/library/video/6a00cd9737fbba4cd5 00fad692fe8d0005.html. Thats water vapor from a coal stack. H2O, not CO2.
I think we've all seen the commercial where the guy is walking around a desolate wasteland, screaming into a microphone about clean coal technology. The Alliance for Climate Change, algore's attempt to sway public opinion, is responsible for that commercial.
http://unitedconservatives.blogspot.com/2008/12/reality.htm l
As I said in my post, if the tree-hugging whackjobs are so concerned about CO2, they need to stop breathing for 5 minutes.

Outlet
I heard audio of our Lord and Savior played on Conservative Radio in which our fearless leader admitted that his plans will bankrupt the coal industry and his policies will cause the price of electricity to skyrocket.

Will I still be able to afford to recharge my electric car's battery when he meets his objectives?

I like jeff's idea
Let all the environuts move to Washington state and Oregon and then cut off all electricity that is generated by fossil fuels and dams and lets see how they do. We'll give em a few years and then if it works the rest of the world can adopt it. Come on greenies, time to pony up. If you want to talk the talk, walk the walk!

Clean Coal
Just because something is not 100% is no reason to abandon it. Technology always improves. I have had experiments burning under pressure that did not have a smoke stack. Nuclear power too only needs to be improved. The French have a good system where all nuke plants are the same and they focus on improving them. There was a local power plant that burns garbage that created a lot of dissent. They improved their burning so much they are hardly even noticed any more. All we gotta do is roll up our sleeves and get to work.

Coal Smoke and CO2
Ironically the smoke from fossil fuels cools the earth balancing the green-house effect of carbon dioxide. The ham handed government lurches from one clumsy program with unintended conquests to another pork barrel filled wrong minded plan.

Carol Browner
The following is from Steve Milloy's Junk Science website. VERY SCARY.

"Seeing any RED? Obama energy/environment 'czar' is an offical with Socialist International - That's right comrades... Carol Browner is a member of Socialist International's Commission for a Sustainable World Society. Check out SI's principles -- including, "it is imperative to establish a genuinely new international economic order."

http://www.junkscience.com/

SI's principles found here.

http://tinyurl.com/9rak3b

Scroll down to find Carol Browner's resume.

Can this really be happening in the USA????

Howard in GA
Paleocon beat me to it! Yes, in 1996, President Bill Clinton, under the Antiquities Act, designated the Grand Staircase Escalante as a National Monument. Utah was notified about 24 hours before the dedication ceremony, which was held in Arizona, away from angry Utah residents, where large amounts of local unspoiled landscape were cleared to make for a better photo-op.

At the time, Utah was negotiating with Andalex coal mine for mining operations that would have delivered up to 4.5 billion tons of low-sulphur high-btu coal and created many jobs in Utah. Also put out of reach by Clinton's enviro-pandering was potential oil and gas and coal-bed methane, along with strategic minerals like titanium and zirconium.

It is merely coincidence that Clinton's supporters, the Lippo group, now possess the only known coal of this quality. In Indonesia, not in the U.S.

But wasn't it worth it? We in the U.S. now have another couple million unspoiled acres to DRIVE to--so long as garoline prices stay low, and until cars are outlawed due to their contribution to global warming/climate change.

The lost years
Where was everybody after the successful outcome of Bush v. Gore in 2000? Talk about resting on laurels! If platforms for education and common sense couldn't emerge in eight years, well, I suppose that will be blamed on Bush as well.Republicans and quasi-conservatives just sat back. Now everybody thinks tough times will bring about a reversal in the culture. Sorry, not going to happen. Somebody's going to have to get clever and ambitious enough to change the culture regardless of the economic climate. Communists now call themselves 'progressive'. Global warming is now 'climate change'. And the Newspeak, history-revised, pop-culture-driven, politically correct education conglomerate has been full steam for more than thirty-five years.
Good luck with all that. How did the New Math work out for y'all?

NO COAL!
We should NOT be using coal to generate our electricity.

We should be using NUCLEAR power to generate our electricity -- and most of our electricity would be generated by nuclear power if the eco-freaks and other assorted leftist manure-heads hadn't halted construction of nukes 30+ years ago.

We should be using our coal to make gasoline and other liquid fuels for transportation purposes -- a process that is simple and inexpensive, and has been around since 1920. Of course, the eco-freaks oppose that, too...

We Must Protest
Obama, Pelosi, and Reid are in control of our destiny, along with assorted nutcases like Gore and other enviro-nazis. That can't be a good thing for FREEDOM.

So, what are we going to do about it? Are you ready and willing to take to the streets with your pitchforks? Are you willing to march on Washington to let the bastards know that you're mad as hell and aren't going to take it any more? That's what we're going to have to do, and it may be necessary before 2009 is over. Get ready.

Clean coal
I think that environmental extremists refer to clean coal as a fuel with emissions devoid of carbon dioxide and, of course, that technology does not exist. Maybe they do not mean that and are simply bent on their motive to destroy modern economies. Addition and vigorous use of coal as fuel can help save our economy but I fear that the battle is coming close to being lost. Politicians of all persuations are jumping on the Al Gore bandwagon of science as he interprets it. Meanwhile, Al Gore continues to profit.

Test the theory first
Supposedly, scientist test theories before they suggest implementing any changes in how we do things. Therefor test the theory of no oil, coal, gas or nuclear power where the biggest whiners are, the LEFT COAST. Give them 10 years to "go natural" with wind and solar and cut off all supplies going into Ca., Or, or Wa.
Put up or shut up time. Sit back and watch the fun.

SIERRA CLUB A DANGER TO US SURVIVAL
STOP THE SOYLENT GREEN GOONIE BIRDS

.....Has anyone noticed that the Enviro-whackos are against Evolution and Capitalism? ...

.....In Nature when a species can no longer compete in its environment ...it becomes extinct ...hold on! ...here come the green crusaders to the rescue ...all creatures large and small, from polar bears to snail darters must be preserved even if the Green Goons have to drive mankind back into caves to accomplish their sacred mission ...

.....In Capitalism when industries can no longer compete with their competitors they go out of business or file for bancruptcy ...no longer my friends ...today the tax payers must ante up to protect these losers even if we have to bankrupt the Country to do it ...

.....Environmentalists should be hunted down and shot like rabid dogs .....COLOSSUS

Just remember folks ...
y'all voted for "change we can believe in." Now, you'd better believe it. Too bad, you forgot to read the fine print.

Enviros can't think!
Therefore they believe everything they are told by the professional beggars wanting donations to save this or that, (their cushy jobs mostly). I live in Wyoming where the wind always blows, we have lots of coal, oil, CBM, and uranium. I cannot tell you how often enviros insist they don't oppose drilling or mining, they jsut want it done somewhere else. I explain until my fingers wear out that those resources are where they are, they cannot be extracted from places where they do not exist. That makes no difference to an enviro, there is a utopia and perfect world and they demand that someone provide it for them.

When I was 13
we lived in a two-story home that was heated only by a woodstove. Our water had to be trucked in weekly so our cistern could be filled. Upon finding a dead frog in it once, the waterman simply asked for a bottle of bleach. He removed the frog, put in the bleach, and nobody got sick. Our only bathroom was brand-new when we moved in-there were two outhouses otherwise. We also had an 8-party line telephone.

I remember too as a little girl my Grandparents' farm up in northern Michigan having no indoor plumbing of any kind-I recall all too clearly the midnight trips to a certain door in the long shed whenever we went up north to stay with them and the pump that stood in front of the house.

Can't say I miss either lifestyle, frankly.

Since DH and I have been married we have always had a woodstove because the heat it generates is lovely-it penetrates like no other heat can. That said we can only hope Obama gets a clue as to the necessity of coal- and nuclear fired power. I really don't want to go back the 'good' old days!

Re: The real danger!!!
Here is the real danger in this global warming haha-to get ride of all the fossil fuel stuff and start investing in this green tech. which by the way only fuels about 1/3rd of 1% of out total energy needs and to top this off this global warming haha is only a propaganda tech. to dupe the American people into thinking that we are the reason for this terrable thing to take place!!! The entire idea is only a way to ruin the oil and coal industry and get ride of the last vestage of free enterprise in this country!!! And if anyone who reads my assessment of this I have been right on anything I have posted in this column 98% of the time! So, lets just listen to what the scientist are saying about the issue and go with COMMON SENSE!!!!

Nickel
Good luck tapping that spirit. The welfare state and the education system have done a good job replacing the spirit that created our nation with the need to depend on someone else for a livelyhood. A test is coming and most Americans have not been studying for it.

A good title, but beside the point
Nobody on the Left gives a rat's patoot about saving lives with coal or DDT or cruise missiles or any other proven expedient.

Cynics and criminals such as Gore and Pelosi are trying to squash fossil fuels (ours anyway) because they've invested heavily in the global-warming industry or because they stand to benefit by some other means from failing to exploit domestic resources. Remember when Bill Clinton created the Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument in 1996? Without Congressional approval, he locked up 1.7 million acres of Utah sitting atop the largest deposit of low-pollution coal on earth. As it fell out, the second-largest deposit sits in Borneo, ripe for exploitation by his Indonesian billionaire friends and campaign contributors, the Riady family.

The true ideologues on that side of the aisle are easier to describe, but harder to figure. Liberals in general love humanity, but hate people, especially those who disagree with them. Environmentalists love life in the abstract, but hate humanity. TruLib, USMC Lt., et al., are exactly right: these people want everyone except themselves to dwell in caves or simply die.

Respond in kind..
First recognize the enemy. How many of those elected politicans in Congress have been saying we need "Cap and Trade" legislation?

When you see one standing up and saying we ought to allow governments to tax our companies to offset the "polution"grab your wallets mark him or her as our enemy.

No company pays taxes, they just raise the price of their product and pass it on to us. The whole reason for the Cap and Trade travesty is to give our "political betters" a new crisis to allow them to tax us even more and on a world wide basis.

Al Gore isn't just a fool, he is the the front man for the Anti-Christ.

George Washington, once said when the outlook for the beaten down American army was most bleak and the English soldiers were closing in, that: "If we have to we should take our soldiers up into the Blue Ridge mountains of our great country and their the people would fight till their last breath for the next twenty years if need be."

We need to tap into that spirit today.The decendents of those Appalacian Patriots are spread all across this nation today and we need to rekindle that defiance of being treated like fools by our political "leaders"(sic)and take back control of our great country.

24,000 alleged deaths?
That's certainly an attention grabber with absolutely little proof. Sounds like early America when so many died of "consumption", the cause given to many a death by natural causes.
How many will die without the benefits of coal?

Will BHO kill or bankrupt all coal industry as he often promised? Or will he make good on the speech he made that we must have clean coal technology to survive?
And you thought Kerry was a flip-flopper.

Watermelons and Green Republicans
While the aims of the Environmentalist Watermelons (Green on the outside and RED on the inside) to destroy this nation are clear. I wonder what the "Green Republicans" are thinking. Are they just stupid or has the quest for power just eclipsed common sense. Yes, John McCain, I'm talking about you.

How can we educate our so-called conservative lawmakers so that they can represent us armed with facts?

It is going to be a LONG four years.

i wonder
how many trees did the Seirra Club chop down to pay for the paper for all those amicus briefs to the courts

Good Posts by All
The upshot is the Greens don't want energy production and "saving the environment" is the tool they use to achieve this end. The politicians don't care if the claims are true as it gives them an excuse to take control of the most important sector of our economy.

Instead of arguing the facts those that want our economy to grow should attack the subject head on and say the Greens want a lower standard of living for all because they hate the industrialized world, the free enterprise system and Western Civilization in general.

Wasn't it Sean Connery that said "don't take a knife to a gun fight"? We haven't even been using knives so far. The Greens and the politicians are loaded for grizzly and we need to respond in kind.

One Fact remains constant

Liberals are wrong.

Coal usage

The environmentalists run the show in congress. They have the nation convinced that global warming is a very real threat, and that coal will do its part to add to the threat. PE Obama is prepared to bankrupt the coal industry.

Where are these "fools" coming from? The entire global warming threat is based on computer models. The models don't begin to factor into the equation the myriad effects of the oceans, the winds and the sun's energy. Only God knows the full extent of creation and its total effect on the earth.

A discouraging thing about the environmentalists is their lack of concern for the third world nations and their environments. These nations need basic stuff like clean air and water. What better place to direct their efforts than these unfortunates. Instead, the enviros concentrate on blocking progress here in the USA.

Ron in NJ

I remeber
way back in the day when my grandfather's home was heated with COA:. You'd put a sign on the street and the coal man would dump a load of coal down your coal chute. This was the 1960's.
They have since converted to oil. Now what? switch to electricity?

BTW, the cleanest "base" power is nuclear.

Uh-HUH....now,this make sense
Nazi Pelosi is heavily invested in the "wind farms/plants" if memory serves correct.Uh-HUH

I also remember an article that said making those hybrid batteries for cars have made a four square mile area of woodland into not much more than a moonscape because of the caustic chemicals used. (poor little furry creatures who lost their homes)UH-HUH

Ever seen a windmill "farm" it's so ugly that it ruins any "view" that makes the land worth buying. Remember the ruckus people put up over cell phone towers well this will be 100 fold that.UH-HUH

Solar is great provided you cut down all the trees that block your solar pannels...that's great for the poor little fuzzy creatures...UH-HUH

Dams are just wonderful, water power like the leavies and damns that burst and rushed water into homes and oops that was government controlled too...UH-HUH

Well, out of ideas...coal good... government control bad...UH-HUH

Clean burning coal
Help me to remember. Wasn't there a situation with clean burning coal fields in some western areas that Prez Clinton shuffled off to the Chinese?

Living In The mountains of western NC
If we want to stay warm our options are basically Heating oil or Electricity. People have wood burning stoves and propane but they're in the minority.
Heating oil is still almost $3.00 a gallon to keep a decent sized house at 62 degrees it requires 20 gallons of heating fuel a week more if it's below 40 degrees outside.That is about $240.00 a month plus electricity to power the fans to blow the warm air into the house.
As Nickel put when it hit $4.00 plus it was unaffordable for most. Space heaters were in vogue and my electric bill was about $190.00 but it wasn't as warm in the house overall and we keep the house cool by most standards.

We need the electric plants and if the liberals and green meanies care more about a trout or earthworm than people they really have a screw loose.

Reality
Reality is that the leadership of the Eco-Socialists have long viewed humanity and western Judeo-Christian civilization as THE enemy of Mother Earth.
The goal has been and is the destruction of modern civilization and since stating that at the outset would assure defeat at the ballot box then incremental means and deception are key to their success.
So in their amoral- anti human quest what is a few million more dead humans - Re- the lies about DDT and the 20 plus million dead from malaria ?? To them it is a good start !
Outlaw coal with lies (AGW and soot) ? Hell that is child's play for these folks. Mind you they will sit in comfort and security while we little people are forced to live with the consequences.
Specifically as to soot causing 24 K deaths per year. Where are the corner's reports to support those assertions ?

Energy from Coal
I'd like to hear and read what that major piece of excrement that has been elected to "lead" this country proposes to replace coal as an energy source. He, his minions and all the tree-huggers of the world have not enough wind power including the flatulence from both ends of their collective bodies to supply the energy needs of this counry much less the world.
They disdain nuclear energy and hate coal and oil or gas-fired energy.
What is left.
Should the whole world be covered with inefficient solar cells and are we to be drawn back to a stone-age existance all because idiots such as BHO and Al Gore, the fool, the Jesse Jackson of environmentalistswish to control pollution?
If all the clean-air freaks, Kalifornians, Osama(aka Obama), SUV lovers and all the rest of us took a little bit of time to study how we might conserve energy, things might be a little bit cleaner.
ALL of the major idots in this world and those leading envrronmental movements just don't realize how much energy is needed to provide even the simplest needs of the world.
Castigating the use of coal is simply stupid and I'm forever amazed at the stupidity of these idiots who would remove the use of coal.
They need to see a documentary of how products are made and the energy required to do so.
There may be other sources of energy but until they are discovered, there is nothing else on the horizon and there's not enough hot air from politicians and eviromentalist to power even a small house.
What an absolute crock of horse hockey such as Osama "The One" they are.

Sierra Club
The Sierra Club's website trumpets the news that they have halted over 100 new power plants with their global warming arguments.

Judges treat the Sierra Clubs amicus briefs as if they are the unvarnished truth. We all know they are a pack of lies, but the courts seem to treat them as a kind of environmental bible.

Who knows what they will want to stop next.

As far as I know
About the ONLY THING that could even come close to producing the electricity we need at a cost equal to or lower than coal, with the same low levels of REAL pollution, or even less, is Nuclear Power.

BUT, as the writer said, the Dems/Libs/Enviro-Whackos(call them what you will) are more hellbent against Nuclear power plants than they are against coal fired power plants.

WHY?? Because they oppose electricity in general, and the progress out of darkness that it's given us in particular.
Then there's the matter of the evil capitalist benefits of jobs and corporate profits that they also detest.

To reduce it to two words, the thing that these "progressive" enviro-whackos want to stop more than anything else, is HUMAN progress.

Wind energy
I remember a few years back the environmentalist opposed windmills because they killed birds. Now, for some reason you don't hear anything about that point.

Obama has also proposed cap and trade which will kill our energy production even more. If he really wants to create 3 million new jobs he would allow and all of the above approach to energy production here in the U.S. That would actually create high paying jobs in the industry plus many supporting jobs. I really don't hold out hope for that happening.

The Empty Suit Communist

Said this:

So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can; it's just that it will bankrupt them because they're going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that's being emitted.

Obama's plan means the end of the US as we know it.

And people wonder why consumer spending is down.

GLOBAL WARMING THEORY
PROFESSOR WAGSTAFF PRESENTS HIS GLOBAL WARMING THEORY TO END ALL THEORIES. READ IT AT, http://stopthepresses2.blogspot.com/2009/01/global-warming -theory-to-end-all.html

I goofed...It should have read...
"I think it is necessary to make people in this situation understand that the reason that electric heat can be cheaper than home heating oil is that most of the electricity is produced with affordable COAL."

SORRY

Good article...
We need a more informed populous on this and many subjects. I think it would be helpful to clarify to the average homeowner that coal generated electricity is a much cheaper alternative than any other approach. As a homeowner in the Middle Atlantic states who can not get natural gas where I live it is electric heat or home heating oil. When home heating oil hit $4.45 a gallon it became all electric or nothing for me and millions of others in the northeast. I think it is necessary to make people in this situation understand that the reason that electric heat can be cheaper than home heating oil is that most of the electricity is produced with affordable oil.

The enviromental lobby is great at driving hysteria in a crisis like enviroment but nothing hits home like the kitchen table budget items like affordability when times are tough and all your elected officals can think to do is raise your taxes.
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