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Friday, May 02, 2008
Pat Buchanan :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Way Our World Ends
by Pat Buchanan
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"This is the way the world ends/Not with a bang but a whimper," wrote T.S. Eliot in the closing couplet of "The Hollow Men."

Eliot's poem was written after the Great War of 1914-1918 had carried off 9 million soldiers, wounded twice as many more, brought down the Romanov, Hohenzollern and Habsburg empires, and ushered onto the world stage Lenin, Stalin, Mussolini and, soon, Adolf Hitler.

Readers have ascribed various meanings to Eliot's words. One college professor of English suggested Eliot was looking back to the "whimper" in the cradle in Bethlehem that signaled the end of the old world, the Pax Romana, and the coming of the new Christian age.

Some saw it as the whimper of a man facing the executioner's axe. Others say Eliot was referring to the middle-aged protagonist of "The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock," who had "measured out my life with coffee spoons" and soon would "wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled."

Recent reports suggest God has another end in store for us.

An Augusta, Ga., group, The National Policy Institute, has meshed the figures on fertility rates with the continents and races on Planet Earth -- to visualize what the world will look like in 2060.

In 1950, whites were 28 percent of world population and Africans 9 percent, a ratio of three-to-one. In 2060, the ratio will remain the same. But the colors will be reversed. People of African ancestry will be 25 percent of the world's population. People of European descent will have fallen to 9.8 percent.

More arresting is that the white population is shrinking not only in relative but in real terms. Two hundred million white people, one in every six on earth -- a number equal to the entire population of France, Britain, Holland and Germany -- will vanish by 2060.

The Caucasian race is going the way of the Mohicans.

Arabic peoples, 94 million at the birth of Israel in 1948, outnumbered seven to one by Europeans, will rise to 743 million in 2060, a tenfold increase, and will be 75 percent of the white population.

Fleshing out the NPI picture is the U.N. population survey of mid-2007 that points to the 21st century disappearance of Western Man.

By 2050, a fourth of all the people of Eastern Europe will have vanished. Ukraine will lose one-third of its population. Russia, 150 million at the breakup of the Soviet Union, 142 million today, will be down to 108 million. Such losses dwarf what Hitler and Stalin together did to these countries.

CIA Director Michael Hayden said this week that Russia will have to import workers from the Caucasus, Central Asia and China, exacerbating already serious racial and religious tensions in a nation with thousands of nuclear weapons.

With Russians east of the Urals outnumbered 100 to one by the Chinese, there is little doubt who will control the oil, gas, gold and timber of Siberia and be staring hungrily across the Bering Strait at Alaska.

By 2050, Iran's population will have risen from today's 71 million to 100 million. Pakistan will add 84 million to reach almost 300 million, the U.S. population today. Afghanistan's population will triple from 27 million to 79 million. Iraq's will go from 29 million to 62 million. The destinies of these nations will be beyond the capacity of an aging, dwindling, dying West to dictate.

The U.N. statistics, however, show the populations of Northern, Western and Southern Europe stabilizing or falling only slightly.

How can this be when only Iceland and Albania have fertility rates -- 2.1 children per woman -- that can stop population declines, and all the rest have birthrates that would put bears, birds and wolves on the endangered species list?

Answer: Western Europe's populations are being sustained by immigrants from the Maghreb and Middle East, Asia and Africa -- and the baby boom among these black and brown peoples is lifting and changing the face of the Old Continent forever. Islam is returning to Iberia, Italy and the Balkans. The Third World is coming to colonize the mother countries.

And America? According to the Pew Research Center, the Hispanic population of the United States will triple to 127 million by 2050, as Mexico's population grows to 130 million. An erasure of the U.S. border, or merger of the two countries, or the linguistic, cultural and social annexation of the American Southwest by Mexico appears fated.

Yet, last October, in another Pew poll of 45,000 people in 47 countries, a majority in 46 expressed fear of a loss of their traditional culture.

Sixty-two percent of Americans told Pew we should do more to protect our way of life. Three-fourths of Americans wanted more restrictions on immigration. Yet all three presidential candidates voted amnesty for the 12 million to 20 million illegal aliens.

Hopefully, the peoples of Asia, Africa and the Middle East, who are about to inherit the earth as we pass away, will treat us better than our ancestors treated them in the five centuries that Western Man ruled the world.

Otherwise, we all go out with a bang.

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About The Author
Pat Buchanan is a founding editor of The American Conservative magazine, and the author of many books including State of Emergency: The Third World Invasion and Conquest of America .
 
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Can you believe it?
This man's on a roll.

Again, I beat the moonbats from storming in and starting off the thread with some inane, America-hating, liberal, cr*p that's not even fit to use for printing off and placing on the floor while "potty-training" a new puppy.

Pat, thanks for your latest column.

Keep up the good work and keep 'em coming.

God bless

...and there is nowhere to run
Thank you Pat. Time to get rid of white guilt. It won't do us any good. If Wright is any indication hard times are coming for the white folks. Maybe we should keep affirmative action in place?

Pat. Maybe you should write a book.
Oh, you did. I have it and it is good. Can you tell me what is in the white make-up that cannot see what is so obvious. We have the rust belt and no one can see that taxing policies and anti business laws drive away the prosperity base. Louisiana was a pit and the liberals proved once again that they can ruin anything; yet they never learn from their mistakes. We now have more of the same and never once have I heard that we should hold our nose and vote for you or Ron Paul; but we are to vote for more of the same. Somewhere we lost it!

Ralph Peters Disagrees
Ralph Peters wrote an interesting article "The Myth of Eurabia". Good counterpoint. Also, birthrates are falling everywhere. The West is just ahead of the curve.

I love it when...
people look at me and I know (if they don't actually say it to my face) that they think I am crazy when I rant that's it's all over for the once great U.S.A. and western civilization in general. I always tell them (as Pat is indicating) to do the math. Bye, bye white, Christian, European man and culture. I just wish I could be here when places like NYC, London, Paris, Rome, etc. have a skyline of mud huts again. The insane, suicidal white, liberal dream of the end of capitalism and evil whitely will have been realized except for the fact it is their demise they are working for and they are too stupid to realize it.

Mongrelization of the New World Order !!
Part of the plan the New World Order has in store for the human race is its Mongrelization. Not to say that sometimes a little touch of this and a little touch of that would be ok...a little dab will doo ya...but the very thing it seeks to create is a perceived COSMOPOLITAN society to eradicate the so called predjudices,Wars etc.. by mixing it up and doing away with any limited or provincial scope it might have once had. Thus, we have the encouragement of a worldly composition of the human race with mass immigration and migration here and there and now everywhere.

When I was a kid I always preferred the chocolate strip in the Neopolitan Ice Cream my Grandmother would always buy. One day while experimenting with the strawberry and vanilla and wishing it were chocolate I noticed that if you mix a little bit of chocolate with vanilla or strawberry...the chocolate goes a lot further.
Suddenly my dream came true. The Neopolitan ice cream my Grandmother always bought was turned into chocolate once I got my grubby little hands on it. For me, there was no more strawberry or vanilla. However, as I grew older I got tired of chocolate and started eating more vanilla and strawberry....then...came....Baskin Robbins..wow!
Suddenly, I had the palate of a 32 flavored connoisseur of ice cream flavors and the world has never been the same because when I grew up I realised how much I enjoyed with discrimination and appreciation lifes subtleties. I believe this applies to people and cultures just like it does to wine, opera, languages, theatre, etc...and the world has become my oyster.

The Way Our World Ends
Nobility you asked "Can you tell me what is in the white make-up that cannot see what is so obvious."

I don't know what Pat's response would be, but how does self centered, lazy and "nanny state" mentality sound to you?

We are a selfish society spoiled by easy successes and thoroughly convinced that government can provide the answer to all the really difficult questions.

Having children and raising a family is not only hard, and sometimes unrewarding, work, but it also takes away from the most important thing, "me".

Unlike our third world competitors, and they are competitors in life, we have it all, and we are reluctant to share it with anyone else, especially demanding children.

We are on the precipice of our own extinction. But as long as we have "feel good" policies coming out of Washington, the ACLU, "white guilt" groups and the courts guiding us to the more perfect world, we can continue to be self centered, lazy and best of all carefree and careless with a future we won't to be a part of.

Short of a catastrophe...
Pat....

Just what do you suggest we do?

And what part of the blame does the Greatest Generation and their Baby Boomers share in all this?

I can only do what's within my arm's reach, Pat. But it's one thing for me to do something when there are no leaders in Washington and in my state capital who are interested in preserving our unique western culture and identity.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, the only way I see real, honest to God change in this country toward conservative values would be a catastrophe that wipes out Washington, D.C., which would cause some states to consolidate power and would bring that power closer to the people where it belongs.

Or better yet, Pat...
What are YOU doing about it?

We all know what the problem in our country and our civilization is. Liberalism. We know it. And it just defies reason why so many continue to believe in it in spite of its outright and repeated failures. We know this. Unfortunately, Liberalism is big big business for those who are and want to be politicians, and want to stay that way until they die.

A Politician's goal in life is to have meaning, to be important, and to amass power. The more power he has, the more important he becomes.

Conservatism espouses something completely opposite of that goal. It teaches you that government is the source of most of our problems we face in this country, and that it should do just what is prescribed in the Constitution that limits that power. It's extremely counterintuitive to what is taught to these ambitious people.

What's to be done about it?

All I see and hear is a lot of talk. What are you doing about it, Pat?


The Way Our World Ends
Dear Pat,
As much as I like you, I often cannot agree with you. I see no magic in being "white," per se, unless you are using this as a marker for (old fashion) liberal values as espoused by many of the founders of the USA, Jefferson and Madison as examples. I care not how much melanin a person carries in his dermis, I care about the values he carries, as evidenced by his behavior, not necessarily his words. There is something precious about the original American idea, and any who consider it so are all right in my book. We are all human; there are no "races," except you make it so in your mind. Let's just keep the original American idea alive, no matter who or how many subscribe to it, or where, and those who live within it will live well. Other people can have their own ways. Where I do agree with you is that we must defend our way, which is no better codified than in the two major founding documents: The Declaration of Independence and the US Constitution, including the Bill of Rights. To quote Jefferson: "It is our duty still to endeavor to avoid war; but if it shall actually take place, no matter by whom brought on, we must defend ourselves. If our house be on fire, without inquiring whether it was fired from within or without, we must try to extinguish it."
And where I agree with you again is in being against the notion that we have an obligation or right to export our way in any other manner than by example.

The Death of Old Whitey !!
Throughout history Old Whitey has been involved in just about everything and anything. The Greeks
or was it Herodotus who claimed that "Theatrum Orbis Terrarum" was Old Whitey's theater of the world until Old Whitey found out for himself and his horizons increased. From the Greeks to the Italians on further northward into Europe and Eastern Europe Old Whitey was created and evolved to expand and branch out into many horizons because he was separated through space and time and of course other reasons we will probably never know. Oh sure, things haven't been perfect for Old Whitey but he kept on in spite of it. In spite of Wars and famines and Dark Ages and Enlightenments and even through the good times of the Renaissances.
Old Whitey went from the lowest of Gods creatures
to the most revered as his life gained purpose and he the gentile inherited the Kingdom of God and Gods blessings were poured out on him too.

Still, If one wishes to experience Culture, Art, and of course Music with the beauty of an Italian opera...all he or she has to do is go to Europe or North America. While growing up I never could understand why my dad would force me to listen to classical music instead of the Soul Train music of his white mistress? I once asked him why would anyone want to listen to a Puccini Opera if you could not understand the words and my dad asked me if I ever needed to know what language a woman spoke in order to know she was a beautiful woman? Well, he explained it to me and I instantly understood some things while growing up and I still listen to Puccini.

An Epitaph for Old Whitey!!??
As I reflect on what Buchanan has written I can tell Old Whitey doesnt really have much time left. A lot of his problems stem mainly from his own doings. Old Whitey has been blessed by God throughout the ages and somehow wanted to share the bounty either directly or indirectly. For me, its a kind of Manifest Destiny here in America and I believe similarly as did those Puritans and Pilgrims that it was Gods will and that we were somehow his chosen people. Now, please don't confuse this with some kind of bent up hubris but rather a noble and humble undertaking which it really diserves.

No matter what anyone says or writes or tries to insinuate..Old Whitey has done a lot of good in the world. Sure, there is the other side of the coin too but in all...its been a Good Run! History, literature, Art, Music and just about everything has Old Whiteys fingerprints on it. From the Greek Pharoahs of Egypt...i.e. Ptolemys descended Cleopatra..to Caesar and Mark Antony...Alexander The Great who cried because he had no more worlds to Conquer...to the rule of Kings and Emperors and yes...even the ruthless which is where Old Whiteys heroism was called for and tested. Then onward to America...a New World of Vision and the American Dream....Old Whitey was there for all of it.
Old Whitey hoveled in the mud but once he looked up the the sky he reached for heaven and held his hand out for the stars. Old Whitey has been and done just about everything. A child, father, Carpenter, Doctor, prophet and teacher....The Manifest Destiny of America...we had and still have a higher calling and the odds have never been this great nor the stakes this high. Where do we turn from here? I figure this question might pop up even after I am dead so this Old Whitey's epitaph will be: "Keep your Eyes on tha Prize!" .....Follow the NorthStar!

RON P.....Don't be such a Cop-Out!!!
You miss the whole point that Buchanan is presenting in this article....

BTW...I checked out your blog and I see you like Classical music too.

At least you got something right! BTW, when I was a kid my dad would always tell me that Sibelius was speaking to God when he wrote his Symphony 2....I am linking it below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QYnebDaqxk

Fly in the ointment...
Have you been paying attention to food prices lately? This factor alone is what will pop Pat's paranoid prophesy.

The Law of Unintended Consequences
Pat didn't point out this predicted destiny is basically a tale of cultures committing suicide. When millions of Caucasian babies are aborted every year do the math. Future historians will point out that the dominant civilizations in the 20th and 21st Centuries lost confidence in their cultures and blithly went about pruning their descendents.
The universe is implacable. Whatsoever you sow so shall you reap.

Actually, as women become
educated, they bear fewer children. This trend will occur in those nations of the world now industrializing and buildiung technological futures.

Africa and Asia right now have tremendous medical problems that will also impact populations. There's one estimate that one in four Africans carries HIV. I've always cynically said AIDS will be a boon to wildlife preserves and Africa's endangered animals.

India is also experienceing an HIV epidemic among certian castes, rarely recognizes or discussed because no one is supposed to know about caste systems anymore.

China is a billion people (so is India), but China has had a rigid pop. control system for decades, because the nation has been well aware of the problem of over-population and limited food and societal production.

In colonial times, blacks were one-quarter of Am. population and is now slightly below 12 percent. Jews were once 4-5 percent of the US population and now are slightly under 2 percent, basically due to assimilation.

These 2050 and 3000 pop. predictions are based on current birth rates and current attitudes, which won't be the same in a couple generations. The world will also need fewer manual laborers and very few unskilled workers in the near future. Continued below:


Continuation
I like that Pat wears the black hat and looks at the darker aspects of our problems, but they are not always so clearly cut and dry. If HIV mutates into an air-borne disease, the world will see deppopulation on the scale Europe experienced during the first outbreak of bubonic plague.

Rampant sexual promiscuity is not only spreading HIV worldwide but also a host of other veneral diseases that are probably producing the pandemic of infertility among young women in the West. Surely, this horrow will soon be global, as airplanes and international trade are wiping out the old barriers of continents and oceans.

When you can think that just ten years ago cell phones were mostly the size of bricks, wifi had not been heard of, iPods didn't exist, tele-conferecing was barely in infancy, and mapping human DNA was a pipedream, we cannot really know what will happen in the world 50 years from now.

If you took the first 50 years of the 20th C., there was change that moved from horse and buggy to landing on the moon, 2 world wars, the disintegration of entire empires, and the communization of nearly the entire landmass of Asia.

Just the development of antibiotics and vaccines, and the incredible reduction of infant and mother fatalities that had help keep mortality for humans hovering in the 40s and 50s for millennia has produced untold benefits to every person alive today.

The future holds untold mysteries not yet revealed.

Blame it on God!
Dear Pat,

You really need to increase your medication. Paranoia and delusion is getting the best of you.

on making whitey a protected class.
I think Renny is correct that as societies become better educated and prosperous, they bear fewer children.

Since most of the West is in that category, and been historically mostly white(though as Buchanan states, that is changing), it is not too surprising the birthrates(among whites)are declining.

Of course, birthrates are declining in nonwhite Japan also, but it is a highly educated and properous nation.

Statistics on who obtains abortions in the U.S. reveal that blacks are overrepresented. Blacks account for about 13% of the population, yet about 30% of abortions are performed on black women. I may be wrong, but I think those stats are roughly accurate.

Therefore abortions impact black population in the U.S. more so than white population.

Renny is correct about impact of aids in Africa, India...and regarding China's policy on birth control.

Sir Aslan also has some interesting points.

I am not a fan of mongrelization.

I favor the differences and distinctiveness of various cultures, ethnicities, and races.

Given that Old Whitey has done so much for mankind(inventions, discoveries, science, medicine, technology, etc.), his kind must not become extinct. This ominous trend must be reversed.

I have a soft spot in my heart for Old Whitey, given his contributions.

He's my sentimental favorite.


Good morning to everyone
Stop by Fountain Abbey for my latest blog, on a topic that has the old Friar hopping mad.

I can't believe the cr*p that happens in America today. It's high time for some changes, but not the kind Obama thinks we need. What we need is to change all the liberal lunacy that has been foisted on us over the last forty years or so.

like it...
Renny...as usual thanks for your comments...and others here. Some Adults still populate this site.

And Pat, just when I think its safe to start reading you again you come up with something like this.

Its tantamount to the world as seen by Al Gore...all speculation. Why don't you just take a poll?! Or maybe you were taking a tour of Ecclesiastes....doh!




A Servile and Effeminate Age

Could the answer be modern mainstream Christianity? In the 50’s and 60’s the American Catholic Church hewed to an ardent anti Communist doctrine and encouraged young men to join elite military organizations to resist the godless atheistic hordes. American mainstream Protestant faiths were the guardians of bourgeoisie cultural values, extolling family, patriotism, and capitalism. Today, the Catholic Church is steeped in “liberation theology”, tacitly endorsing homosexuality and an end of capitalism. American mainstream Protestant faiths engage in an unending orgy of self loathing and whining guilt. It would seem that if we intend to halt the extinction of the European we could start by rediscovering religion that teaches a love of culture, country, and self.

Our political leaders ...
know these statistics and are reluctant to do anything about them. They could address these problems very easily but that would mean they would have to give up some of their power. Freedom for the people of America means less government and more personal responsibility. With more personal responsibility comes a people that are strong and independent. Government mostly subsidizes the weak and lazy. With more government comes slavery.

Wake up America. Take back your country.

We do exist... by the millions
Those of us who are evangelicals (very broad word, ranging from BJU type fundamentalists to ORU type Charismatics) do believe in the traditional values that made the USA the envy of the World.

There are millions of us, vastly more than there are of the "old stream" (Mainstream)liberal denominational people.

We believe that children are a blessing from the Lord, and that Mom and Dad, not the State, are accountable before God for how those children are raised. We believe in excellence and personal responsibility. We believe in standing against tyranny and in calling evil "evil".

We are not racists. We believe in the immortal soul of every person; and that each one will stand before God at the Judgment. We believe that the Gospel of Jesus Christ is not the white man's "religion", but the offer to all people, from the God of all the Earth, to receive, through Jesus Christ, the forgiveness of sin, and then become godly in how we live, by the grace of God. The Gospel is relational and redenptive.

We reach out to every nation with this message. The Gospel transcends all cultures, and the idea that we need to leave tribal cultures to their paganism, is wrongheaded. Any culture can be transformed and lifted as millions of its members become true follewers of Jesus Christ.

two items
1) Shame on you Pat, you are not allowed to think about the position of your race in the world. He must have missed the memo directing people to hate themselves. It is time to send Pat to a re-education camp. (/sarcasm)

2) Many of the forecasts cited are likely to be unreliable. Many times population forecasts have later been proven by reality to be way way off. The unforeseen interaction of economics and other factors will influence the outcomes... where we land nobody knows.

One thing does seem to be correct; people in countries with flawed economic systems do consistently have high birth rates. High birth rates are probably driven by children being a retirement investment, and other self actualization factors... people stuck at home with little opportunity and mobility have kids. Rich people plan vacations and shopping trips.

Neo-com/Neo-con CFR Sellout Parties
Pat, I don't blame the American people for the total sellout of our sovereignty. Almost all Americans want our country to be a self-sufficient democracy, able to defend itself. This fall the two establishment parties will feature neo/com globalist sellout Clinton or Obama, versus neo-con globalist sellout McAmnesty, all tools of the George Soros "bring America to its knees" machine. This stranglehold on the establishment parties by the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) types is what is ruining our nation. Ninety percent of the American people want secure ports and borders, no amnesty, and enforcement of the 1986 compromise immigration laws, yet nothing happens! And we are supposedly at war!!! The only way to stop the destruction of our country is to back candidates to the House and Senate, and to state offices, that will put America first, and stop the liberal "multiculturalism" guilt trip that is burdening us with all the problems of the world. If America goes down, democracy and freedom are DEAD! And world, you thnk you've got problems now!

Population hysteria
I remember when I was in grade school in the 1980s, books and teachers discussed the coming population explosion. It was like Doomsday Scenario 101. The main stat I remember being trumpeted was that the world population would rise at an incredible rate, totaling 8 billion by the year 2000. The graphs that outlined this had the population increasing at such a rate that it would be doubling every 20 years or even less. That would put us at around 10-11 billion right now. I'll take this study with my grain of salt.

Curious headline
I thought the topic was going to be about Global Warming (or the fallacies thereof, whatever), or too many nukes in the hands of crazy people.


Then as I got into the article, I figured, this is for white people, a large, mish-mash group so scattered and ill-defined and alien from each other that it's impossible to imagine anything that all white people have in common. So, so what?

By the end, I realized that the headline appeals to that wacky tiny (I hope) subset who identify with being white. Not German, not Norwegian, not Euro-American. Just white, or maybe White with a capital W.

Well, I recently came across the KKK website and discovered, lo and behold, that they have fears similar to Pat's.

So here's an idea: you all oughta reach out more to that KKK group, so that together you can work together to achieve your goals. There are a few differences, but I'm sure you can work it out. Especially when you consider Those Other People.

Race vs Ethnicity
We tend to confuse these two groupings. South America is full of Europeans. Walk the streets of Buenos Aires, Sao Paulo, Montevideo, Asuncion, Santiago, etc and the people look like the people you see on the streets of major cities in the US or Europe. Argentina for example is 97% Spanish, Italian or German. Brazil the most populous country in South America(200,000,000) is 57% Portugese, Spanish, Italian etc. Mexico the most populous Spanish speaking country south of us is 15% Spanish and other European countries. There is no shortage of Caucasians and Pat is subscribing to the "wedge" mentality of the Democrat Party by trying to lump all Hispanics as non-White. The facts are far different.

The handwriting on the wall...
...indicates that the European domination of world politics, economics, medicine, culture, philosophy and technology is rapidly shriveling in its dotage.

What then, of the world's population who cannot sustain themselves even today, who require vast handouts from the European cultures to simply subsist as they eek out their lives amid the dust and debris of their lives? Perhaps it is back to the stone-aged mud huts--for everyone. But is not this what liberals seek, after all?

Thus the inevitable world liberals are hurdling toward. They have pulled the plug & now all the West circles the bowl. This is the new-world order that the likes of William Ayres & his ilk aspire. Welcome President Obama.

In America liberals have abortions; conservatives raise families. Nevertheless, conservatives will be subsumed into the morass that these liberals have wrought.

May God help us.

Thanks, Mr. Buchanan, for another insightful piece.

Excellent Article, Pat
Problem is that most of our dear leaders are not capable of the complex thought necessary to understand these facts nor to draw their own conclusions. Even if they did, they wouldn`t be willing to discuss the matter because it would offend someone. And it`s our fault for continuing to send them back to DC to screw us again.

Imagine, we are contemplating the demise of western civilization, and we are too meek to even discuss it. In 60 years time, America has gone from the meanest mother-f*cker on the planet to a gender-confused pretty boy living with mama on borrowed money. Maybe we deserve to fade away.

Curdled Friar
Most of us have bigger goals in life than being first to post a frothing, snide rant predicting that the liberals will soon turn up on a thread to post frothing, snide rants.

The Logic of Birthrates
The inexorable logic of population trends indicate that Japan, which does not welcome immigrants,and has a low birthrate, will cease to exist and be taken over by the Chinese, and the same fate will apply to Israel and the Jews, which discourage marriages outside of their religion--only they will be taken over by the prolific Muslims.

the point left unmade
I read Pat's article and perused some of the comments before noticing that there is a point to be made here that seems to have been neglected by all. What is it that distinguishes growing cultures from shrinking ones? The patriarchy.

This is the thing that liberals and conservatives in this country have in common that in the end will destroy this culture (thank God): They both are feministic. They believe that power should be shared equally by the sexes, that women putting career over reproduction is ok, that abortion is either a right or something that should be an option in our federal system for those states inclined to allow it.

That is the heart of the tragedy. Pat is right, the numbers don't lie. It is inevitable unless America and other Western countries abandon feminism and reinstate, under law, the patriarchy. This will not happen. Our culture has become so deranged that it ignores human history in favor of the "only enlightened generations"; i.e., those in the West in the 20th and 21st centuries.

Reinstatement of the patriarchy is such a terrible prospect to consider for not only liberals but also conservatives that it can't possibly gain political traction.

And thank God! Over 40 million aborted, half of all marriages ending in divorce, the cycles of poverty perpetuated by unwed pregnancies and single parent homes, the utter destruction of family life here in the US, the debasing of the culture where teen girls go out dressed in a way that would have shamed a prostitute 50 years ago . . . I could go on.

Thank God that some force will put a stop to this culture.

thanks Pat for being honest....
Yes, this is the entire reason why some White males in MSM, talking head pundits, print, want so bad for Senator Clinton to win. They just could never bring themselves to vote for a Black man. So they put up smoke screens to pretend it is about the Rev. whilst they attend their sexual predatory Church. They say he has no experience whist Senator Clinton with 35 years of experience gets caught in lies. Yes Pat, we know that the angry white males is really angry now.

jerabaub writes: Friday, May, 02, 2008 7:14 AM
+++++++++++
Funny how that works, even when talking about the extinction of white people, somehow Blacks still are the ones who are hurting the most. White people never miss a opportunity to tell how much worst Blacks are off than Whites. Whilst you have (5) five white men, (2) two are heterosexual; (2) are gay; and (1) is sterile. That my friend is your problem, not Black people.

Changing the status of hispanics in this country from hispanic to white hispanic or black hispanic will not help the white race either. They will not longer be pure white people around. Soon, very, very soon. By your own doing, I might add!!

please....
stop whining White people. You can always move to your new invaded country, Iraq. Oh that's right that particular invasion is not going as well as expected huh?

White folks are always whining, and blaming other people for their problems.

Your first problem is the Catholic Churh and all these angry white men walking around wounded from being molested by the Priest when they were young and never telling anyone about it.

MGC is right-nuke all those brown people
What good are all those warheads if we don't use them to protect ourselves??

Besides, the so-called "nuclear winter" that allegedly will ensue should solve the alleged "global warming" problem...

I figure that's at least 3 birds.

Worthless Xenophobic Tripe
I am sure that if the Picts, Angles, Saxons, Woads, Geats, Goths, Visagoths, Alans, Sassanids, Sarmations, Celts, etc. had computers and the Internet, they would have written the same things. And the result would have been the same as it will be for the United States.

Cultural assimilation and blending is an inevitable part of man's history. Not a single one of us can claim to be of "pure" blood. There is no such thing.

Mexicans are a mix of Spanish and Native American (Who came from Asia). Most of Europe has a mix of Norse, Roman, Celtic ancestry a little Hun thrown in for good measure.

Culture changes, just like climate changes, and there is nothing that can be done to stop it.

and another thing . . .
I understand why we invaded Iraq and deposed Saddam Hussein. What I can't understand is why traditional Christians want to spread "the disease of liberty" when it has destroyed Christian culture here in America. We idolize freedom and pay a horrible price. There were times in American history when we were not so "free" as we are today, when traditional culture had a much stronger hold. Alas, we wish all people to drink the same poison we and the western democracies have. That is utter insanity.

Blame Socialism
I would lay the lion's share of the blame for the self-extermination of the white race at the feet of Socialism.
As more cradle to the grave programs are piled up more and more taxes have to be levied.
So as more people retire more workers are needed to finance the ever increasing programs.

So the governments have to always be expanding the tax base. This means there must always be lots of young workers paying taxes. As the birth rates have dropped this causes governments to have to go out and import more and more immigrants to probe up the system.
The higher tax rates just cause more people to not be able to have more kids and thus the vicious cycle begins.

More socialism leads to higher taxes, higher taxes leads to lower birth rate, lower birth rate leads to more immigration, more immigrants use the socialism programs, this leads to even higher taxes.
And the cycle continues and even picks up steam as it goes.

All that "free" stuff from the government will be the death of an entire civilization.

This demographic information is
not new, nor is it news. It has been out and about, so to speak, for at least 15 years.

There are four well-established facts to consider.

1. Most western nations have average lifetime fertility (ALF) rates below replacement. This means that the average woman in western nations has fewer than 2.1 children. This goes for such nations as Spain, Italy, France.

2. It is not abortion that is driving this trend but the availability of woman-controlled contraception. For the first time in history, women can have absolute control over the timing and number of children they bear.

3. As the world moves from rural to urban, children cease being assets to work the farm to being liabilities that have to be supported through the first 15-25 years of their lives. This is not a value statement; it is an economic statement.

4. Liberal western societies have set in place social and financial safety nets for those of its citizens who need help and assistance. This especially aids the urban poor, who are overwhelmingly non-western. There is thus no incentive to limit the number of children. Children for them are assets.

According to the lastest figures I've seen, the population dearth is occurring in all nations. Ethiopia is the most startling example. ALF was over 8 as recently as 1980; today it is somewhere between 3 and 4. The Catholic nations of Europe are mostly below 1.8 ALF. It is also starting to happen in Muslim nations, albeit more slowly than in the West. Africa may follow the trend, but with a considerable lag.

The projections of population dynamics are always very imprecise, mostly because the analyses are static and the world is dynamic.

There is cause for concern, but not panic.

Barry

I want a psycho in the White House
Pat Buchanan won the New Hampshire primary back a coupla three elections ago, didn't he?? Maybe he can still get in at some point, and launch a bunch of warheads over into these third-world breeding grounds...common sense and simple way to fix the problem.

The real question to ask
The real question to ask is why don't modern Western people reproduce at a higher rate? Why do we see children as a burden? Why is marriage so unstable and lacking in appeal?

For women, the answer is that they have been brainwashed into believing that the Good = economic self empowerment through career. This necessarily means that childbirth will be seen as a negative or something to be limited to one or two children, something compatible with a career. It also means that the traditional role of the husband/father must be destroyed, that if you're going to pay lip service to the notion that, "the husband is the head of the family" then it can only be that, lip service.

For men, the answer is that we don't want a wife and children if they can be taken away at the whim of the wife. We don't want an equal parnter (at least not deep down in our primal consciousness). Marriage is extremely perilous. One day you can have a house, a wife and children, the next you can have a bachelor apartment, limited visitation, and child support. And it's about as likely as not that that will happen.

Jesus, people, it's not rocket science! You'll look for every answer but the only effective answer. America absolutely deserves its fate.

Otherwise, we all go out with a bang
The point of this article is that the world population explosion is going to affect all of us. What has the US done to address it. Pass the Global Gag Rule, That act, intended to prevent abortions, shut down family planning clinics in poor countries the world over. Providing that money may not have stabilized their populations but would have slowed it significantly. Especially since we have had 17 years of this rule under Reagan who invented it, Bush I and Bush II who continued it. If you don't want people swarming all over your borders you don't build fences you try to slow down the cause that sending people to your shores.

Short lived
If you cannot see that the white race is disappearing you are a lately born white.
I still remember the first time I gazed amazed at the first black person I ever saw and I was born in the American Southeast. Now I can be somewhere or the other and I sometimes am the only white around. I used to work at a place that whites were in the minority. I remember reading sometime ago that in 800 years whites will have all disappeared from the world's population. That was a very overly optimistic conclusion. We have diversified ourselves out of existence. When the last white person disappears from the face of the earth I am sure he will be saying as he raggedly breaths his last breath, "More Amnesty",:::gasping::: "Diversity." "Have all the slaves been freed" Forgetting in his white addled mind that it was the whites who ended up as the whites started, slaves.

THE DAY OF THE COMPUTER

.....Well Pat ...I guess the time is near when I will have to take over the Planet and manage the affairs of men ...fear not ...in time you will grow to love me .....COLOSSUS

Why do you want to stop the dilution?
People from cultures that reproduce at much higher rates than ours tend to be more socially conservative, right? If, because of liberal social policy, our culture is demographically suicidal, why preserve it? It's time to get over race and ethnicity and look at the bright side: People with a more traditional outlook, at least socially, will increase their percentages in the Western world. I for one welcome that.


No such thing as a White Person
There is no such thing. Trivialities like facial structure, minor genetic differences, hair color, and skin tone are unimportant. Every single human on the planet shares the same common ancestry....whether you believe in creationism or evolution.

It is preservation of values that is far more important. I don't care what color my neighbors are if they celebrate Independence Day with me. I don't care about the shape of their eyes if they sit next to me in church. I certainly don't get mind it if they vote Republican and reject the leftists whole-heartedly.

The harvest
This is really the harvest we have all reaped here in the Western "white" world. We have such bad ideas. Progressivism or liberalism is the source of these awful ideas, but the really bad thing is that our conservatism is really nothing more than a more moderate version of liberalism - - just applying the brakes from time to time, slowing what is perceived as inevitable movement.

Let it be overtaken by people with more traditional mores, even if there is a danger that their economic policy preferences may not be too wise.

ain't it the truth.
I can't believe some of the posts here.

Let's return to the caveman era.

At least then we had traditional values.

MGC
Precisely the mentality that I'm talking about. All movements have leaders and followers. Most of the followers and some of the leaders were brainwashed into seeing the good in a culturally suicidal pattern of life. Now it's catching up to us. If having a career is a non-negotiable mandate, then you're still wrong. Why would a woman have one child with whom she would not have much time to spend, because of the career, as opposed to many children? Harming one child is better than harming several? I suppose that makes some sense. But why even have one if you don't have the time to raise him/her?

Why not make time?

You make my point better than I do. Generations before had the time to raise 4 or 5 productive children. They had stay at home mothers.

Actually, what I would ask a "successful" businesswoman who works hard at a career outside the home and makes good money is not whether she considers herself brainwashed. "Brainwashed" is just a term we use for those who become convinced of an ideology we dislike. Nobody believes they are brainwashed. What I would ask her is if she doesn't feel empty inside having sacrificed motherhood on the altar of feminism. I'm sure she wouldn't answer me honestly because she has had to suppress and rationalize these feeling continually in order to "succeed".

Amazing and Interesting
Buchanan's article tip toes up to the line of racism, but fails to cross it (as opposed to many of the comments here).

But, it's mostly interesting. How do people and cultures deal with their own mortality? Do they have regrets? Do they focus on the next generation and the future? Do they dwell on the past? Do they duck their heads in the sand and pretend that they are not at death's door?

my final erudite comment of the day.
Recent discoveries in DNA confirm that differences between races are more than skin deep.

DNA by itself can determine the race of a person, with sufficient markers.

I know some in our touchie-feelie p.c. world would like to believe the junk from some social theorists and cultural anthropologists, but the truth is there are distinct differences between races.

BACK TO THE STONE AGE
The non Western world, probably with the exception of Japan and a few Westernized Asian countries, took Western Medicine, Invention, and Technology, enabling there numbers to thrive. They unfortunately retained the less progressive aspects of their cultures. Western Liberals stepped in with their suicidal nonsense and the fate of the world was sealed.

jerabaub
Obviously there are distinct differences in the dna; that's how we actually get the different phenotypes of brown skin or pink skin.

The question some of us touchie feelie p.c. world types debate is whether those differences are significant in any way aside from the skin color they produce.

Jerabaub
There are also distinct genetic differences within "racial" groups. One can tell from DNA analysis far more than just skin tone and facial features.

Children born in high altitudes have 5 oxygen binders in their red blood cells as opposed to the 4 of children born at sea level.

None of this stops humans of various DNA backgrounds from breeding.

So, what is your point?

Fear
One pretty common thread I see running through these comments is fear: fear of other's ideas; fear of other races; fear of oblivion; and fear of the future.

I wonder if this is a part of what draws conservatives together?

If you're a religious person, I find your fear particularly perplexing since I take it that you believe in an afterlife. Why would the concerns of this life be so troubling to you? Isn't this all a part of God's plan?

On traditional values and conservatism
Those of you applauding the alleged coming wave of "traditional values" must realize that Al Qaida and the Taliban are also fighting for traditonal values and conservatism. Don't you?

Like many who are posting here, they also despise women's rights and equality of women. They also support a theology based political system as many of you do. And like many of you, they are willing to commit acts of violence in furtherance of their goals.

Tubbs
In a way, you're right about fear. I certainly don't think conservatives have a monopoly on fear though. I hear too many liberals talking about conservatives destroying social security, driving women into back alley abortions, etc. to believe that liberals don't engage in rampant fear mongering.

As far as religious people, I don't think that truly religious people are particularly concerned about the descent of Western culture from a racial perspective. It is the moral angle and the loss of some perceived Western culture itself that seem to me to be legitimate concerns. On the moral angle, I don't see a downside to the death of modern Western culture. On the dissipation of Western culture itself, I think it has all but disappeared in its traditional sense in any case. Nothing really to count as a loss except our progressivism. Good riddance.

White women need to have more children
But in Europe and to a large extent the U.S. we don't value life. It is incredibly odd for a species to choose not to reproduce itself. We kill people at the beginning and end of the life cycle for "convenience" or "quality of life." The U.S. has 40 million missing people due to abortion. And socialized medicine and euthanasia are a reality in Europe that will soon be here. We in the West have become selfish and our extinction or subjugation will be the result.

tubbs
"Those of you applauding the alleged coming wave of "traditional values" must realize that Al Qaida and the Taliban are also fighting for traditonal values and conservatism. Don't you?"

Yes, I'm keenly aware of the fact. They are not Christians and so we disagree on theology and, to some extent, the nature of the patriarchies we advocate. Also, Christians today are not advocating violence as a means of spreading their religion, as are Muslims.


"Like many who are posting here, they also despise women's rights and equality of women. They also support a theology based political system as many of you do. And like many of you, they are willing to commit acts of violence in furtherance of their goals."

The stuff about violence is pure fantasy on your part. Theocracy is in the eye of the beholder. Knee jerk liberals tend to equate school prayer and creches with theocracy, so I generally don't take such talk seriously.

As to women, yes, in some ways Muslims are better Christians than modern Christians, even "conservative" ones. I don't approve of Muslim polygamy, but that is usually only practiced by their upper classes. As far as covering the face and all that, that goes too far, of course. However, I would much rather dine with a devout Muslim than a liberal, even if the liberal claimed to be some type of Christian.

And this is precisely the point of one of my earlier posts. All traditional Christians should be somewhat conflicted by the current conflict with Islam. We a defending a truly evil, decadent culture (by traditional Christian standards) against an enemy whose culture is in certain ways closer to true Christianity than ours. Alas, that is the hand we've been dealt. I'm not sure we deserve victory though.

Alexander
Intersting posts.

I don't disagree with the bulk of what you've said, even the parts about fear mongering on my side of the aisle.

This though, "Christians today are not advocating violence as a means of spreading their religion, as are Muslims," I'm not so sure about.

Many Christians advocate violence and agression against abortion adovactes and abortion clinics. A part of their reasoning is that abortion reduces the number of Christians.

One could also argue that our current war on terror is a war of religion. This appears to be the case for many conservatives.

To my dear friends.
My point was that as we determine more about the impact genes have on various physical and mental characteristics of humanity, it may lead to some disquieting conclusions for those who are so heavily invested in the notion that no differences exist among the races.

For instance, the currently accepted view that we all are derived from one single African ancestry(Out of Africa theory) was placed in doubt by the discovery recently of a 100,000 year old fossilized skull in China.

This lends credence to the view Homo sapiens may have developed independently in various parts of the globe, refuting the conventional Out of Africa theory.

As science and socalled state-of-the-art knowledge once held that the sun revolved around the earth, my point was to question the orthodoxy that we all derived from a single ancestry, and, if we did not, then would it not be likely different abilities and aptitudes exist based upon the fact we did not derive from a single ancestry?

For that matter, even if we did, does that preclude the possibility different abilities exist among the races? Not hardly.

For those who in a sanctimonious rage spew spittle at the very suggestion of such a heretical view that(gasp)there may be differences in aptitude based on race, allow me to say that all human beings are deserving of respect.

I think we are soon getting to the point where science will be able to isolate and determine those genes identified with higher intelligence, and if such genetic makeup has relevance regarding distribution among races, it will make some people extremely uncomfortable...so much so they may try to ban such scientific inquiry...out of p.c. concerns.

And if they do, they will simply carry on the fine tradition of the Church centuries ago, in its attitude toward Galileo.

tubb
"Many Christians advocate violence and agression against abortion adovactes and abortion clinics."

If many = John Salvi and a handfull of likeminded individuals, then I concede the point (but it doesn't).

"One could also argue that our current war on terror is a war of religion."

One could argue so, but not persuasively. Where are the rallies to subdue the infidel to the Cross? On the other side of the conflict it is most certainly a religious war. However, here we take great pains to emphasize that it is not religion. Remember the radical Muslims invited to the White House in the kumbaya love fest. "It's not really Islam, just some bad apples". Plus, you can't have it both ways. It can't be about oil and religion. It can't be a Jewish neo-Con war and a Christian Crusade.

Wow, Pat...Wow
Lest we forget, the cradle of civilization was the Middle East. Rich, innovative cultures flourished from Egypt to the Indus River valley for millennia.

But no. The diminution of white people is the end of the world?

I knew Pat wasn't fond of non-Europeans, but this is ridiculous. What bothers me even more is the percentage of people who agree with him. Do you really think that pre-Christians were incapable of governing?

The Take Back Europe Movement
Interestingly, Mark Steyn was able to say the same thing Buchanan does, in his book America Alone, without coming off as such a retro racialist.

In spite of America's regrettable modern socialist tendencies, we have managed to assimilate different races and ethnic backgrounds far better than Europe has. This is partly because we have a universalist doctrine of liberty, and partly because we DON'T guarantee a cradle-to-grave life of middle class ease to everyone who wanders in the door, either by birth or immigration. You can still pull yourself up by your bootstraps here, whereas in Europe, they meet you at the border and confiscate your bootstraps, handing you a welfare check and the keys to a subsidized flat instead.

My theory: the best way to change the future is for a lot of Americans to start a courageous counter-migration -- to Europe. Repopulate the place with people (race optional) who were raised on ideas of religious and political liberty. Become the biggest voting bloc on the continent, and Take Back Europe!

The place has great natural assets: climate, resources, existing infrastructure. Merely being willing to work in August, or past 2:00 PM, gives you superpowers there. Some American-style assimilation would do the continent a world of good. Not only would it set Europe's Muslims on a better path, but it might also stiffen the native European anatomy in the manner required for standing up to leftist multicultural nihilism -- and for starting to have babies again.

Pat
Western Civilization is being threatened.The rest of the World is fine.Just because we failed,don't wish death on everyone else.I love T.S.Eliot.

exWyomingite
Ah, but the difference is in the INCIDENCE of those "bright bulbs" within a population, and the culture of inquisitiviness such bright bulbs bestow upon a people.

I am just not accepting the conventional dogma no such differences exist.

I fear if I am proved right, a reaction will set in which will impede or ban such inquiry.

You are right we will not solve this question here.

With that in mind, I have posted my final thought on the matter(on the Buchanan piece, anyhow).

.....
----Lest we forget, the cradle of civilization was the Middle East. Rich, innovative cultures flourished from Egypt to the Indus River valley for millennia.----

And much of the ME is still without indoor plumbing or constant electricity. Have the arabs produced an automobile or an airplane? The Jews in tiny Israel have contributed more to humanity in the last 60 years than the arabs in the last 1000. Most of the ME is semi-literate; some rich culture they have there.

Jerabaub
Are you seriously suggesting that you believe in spontaneous concurrent evolution of a species? There is no evidence to support that. The finding of the fossilized remains in China only puts to question the location of the origin of the species known as Homo Sapiens. Statistically, the possibility of your theory borders on impossible

Are you a creationist, evolutionist, or one who believes in Intelligent Design? Are you holding to this line of reasoning for the malignant need to demonize and castigate sub-species of Homo Sapiens that do share your exact DNA?

The Great Satan
Accepting for a moment your somewhat pessimistic assessment of ME culture over the last millennium, how does your rebuttal address the fact that these "same" people (well, their distant ancestors) basically invented "civilization" as such? White Europeans on holiday taught them reading, writing, and irrigation, then forgot about it on the trip back home?

Movie "Idiocracy"
I would like to point everybody's attention to the movie "Idiocracy".
I am in no position of judging the artistic quality of that movie. However, the description of the process of lowering the average IQ of the world population is presented very clearly there, albeit without mentioning the immigration question.

Age Old Problems
The Romans had a declining birth rate which was one of the contributing factors of the Decline and fall of BOTH halves of the Roman Empire... So the question is if we all decide to get together and sing Kumbaya, Or we decide what will keep this nation from crumbling.
Its not a question about race, Its a question about Culture. A shared culture gives people patriotism. African Americans have so much more in common with White Americans then they do with Africans. What the problem is is allowing the belief in the American Nation to evaporate into globalism is what is truly frightening.
Mexican Illegal Immigrants, Nafta, Globalization. These are making for a declining birthrate of Americans. We do need to hang onto a language of our nation, as the ancient Greeks taught us, one culture one language is more important then having a large polyglot empire (Persia).
Lets get some Family Friendly Policies. Stop Abortion, Give a LARGE tax discount for having children. Stop Allowing citizens of other countries scholarships to our universities. Get back our manufacturing base. Its a Cultural problem because a Polyglot of cultures that are not melded into one, will not breed the loyalty and service that make a nation healthy.

Educating women
As women become more educated, birth rates fall. In Asian countries like Japan and Singapore, where women are literate, go to college, etc., the birth rates are also much lower.

The reasons birth rates are so high in Arab countries and Africa - women are often illiterate, married off young by their fathers, feel powerless to say "no" to men or ask that they use birth control, polygamy is practiced, etc. I read the book "Infidel" by Ayaan Hirsi Ali recently, and it's quite eye-opening, plus it gives a human face to the statistics I've read in research journals.

The best way to stabilize populations in the developing world, and the most humane - educate the women and give them opportunities.

Deornwulf
I am simply saying the official "out of Africa" observation is just that, an observation.

As you note, if the fossilized record of Homo sapien origin reveals it to be China, then are those Homo sapien fossils found in Africa automatically invalid?

And if they are not invalid, then does the possibility exist for more than one origin for Homo sapiens?

Regarding whether I am a creationist or not, one could argue that the prevailing notion of the one Homo sapien origin from Africa has more in common with the creationist view of one Adam and Eve.

Perhaps you have more in common with the creationists than you would like to admit.

Now, who woulda thunk that?

Pat, Pat what is this?
"Hopefully, the peoples of Asia, Africa and the Middle East, who are about to inherit the earth as we pass away, will treat us better than our ancestors treated them in the five centuries that Western Man ruled the world."

The West is Prometheus. We risked all to steal fire from the gods and give it to the world. And we still wait for the first one to say "thanks."


Whitey/New world order
Globalists elites don't really care about race. They just want to remove all the flood gates to get us all down to the lowest common denominater so they can create a massive slave labor class. Race is secondary to that.

The elites are mostly white. Condi Rice, Colin Powell,Vernon Jordan are in the club. But they aren't the power.



“It is folly to underestimate the contempt that the Rockefeller Republicans have for the middle class, regarding it as a roadblock to their ability to make the money they should be able to make.

I believe that if the R. Republicans had their way, there would be a massive slave labor class that people would be born into, could not work their way out of, and die in. What better way to do this than by allowing unlimited numbers of illegal aliens to come and stay.”

Just apply the above on a global scale and you get the picture.


.....
----Accepting for a moment your somewhat pessimistic assessment of ME culture over the last millennium, how does your rebuttal address the fact that these "same" people (well, their distant ancestors) basically invented "civilization" as such?----

Their civilization is similar to the Dark Ages.

Who cares
Oh okay if you are a member of the Aryan Nations, this is a problem--otherwise, who cares?

The issue isn't what race the US is. And if the US racially was more like Brazil, it probably would have less problems--hard to have racial issues when everyone is the same race or everyone is no race at all. The issue is that things like rule of law, respect for the constitution, a regulated, but free enterprise system, property rights, etc and these aren't restricted just to the white race...like Confucianism and Christianity, this isn't a race-based creed.

See where Japan is heading in say 2060--by then its population I believe is expected to be 26 million--100 million Japanese gone. Of course if they would adapt a sensible immigration policy and revamp their outdated view of what it means to be Japanese they could reverse this. So Pat can have a shrinking white Japanese version of America or a growing and vibrant population that is non-white but not anything else either except American.

For those who have not yet realized that Pat is a flaming racist of the Aryan Nation variety, this article should have long last proved it to you.




Junk
These figures are junk and pure speculation. Going by stats alone you can pull just about anything together and make it look like a fact. After all thats how Al Gore and GW nuts pull their BS. I could pull the stats and say for the last 2 months temps have been rising... if this trend continues at this pace then by July the average temp will be 150 degrees outside. Obviously there are other factors and cycles to take into account which makes that figure wrong even though i have data that I can point to as a back up.

Some of those "other figures" would be the impact of baby boomers right now and the next boom of their childrens children. Then we also have to take into account of what is white and what is dark? Mixed marriages are common now and many kids could claim either direction. My child could claim just about any race if she wanted to because all are in there.

Again, this article is based on junk stats and speculation.

Jerabaub
What I question is the notion of concurrent simultaneous development of the same species. It is an evolutionary impossibility. The more likely explanation is that there was a single point of origin of the ancestors of the fossilized remains.

Personally, I subscribe to Intelligent Design, not creationism or spontaneous generation.

ex-Wyomingite
You said I was obsessed with the globalism thing.

I prefer to do reality.

As the Titanic is sinking one passenger says to another, maybe they should have painted the ship blue instead of black.

I don't think that is a meaningful conversation. Hence, I find rearranging the deck chairs over and over and over again to be an effort in futility....and insane.

If we don't have our country then what is there to talk about?

You also asked me what I thought could be done about it.

Did you notice the reaction of the people to amnesty? I wonder how they would react if the masses knew the plan was to take the border down COMPLETELY in order to flood the country with cheap labor. I wonder how the people who were outraged at the demonstrators carrying Mexican flags in OUR country would feel is they knew our leaders were planning at this very moment to do away with our country entirely. (As Bush as said we will have the "idea" of America.)

This site is mostly neocon/CFR. Very few writers talking directly about what is going on. Pat hints at it.

I say shed some light on the cockroach traitors.

"Now, apologists like Medved and Babbin tell us that a North American Union could never happen because we would have to vote to amend the Constitution.

The argument is non-responsive. In Europe, the elite and multi-national corporations who favored creating regional government did so incrementally, creating a fait accompli before anybody got to vote. That's the point." Jerome Corsi


"We are likely to do better by building our “house of world order” from the bottom up rather then from the top down… an end run around national sovereignty eroding it piece by piece, is likely to get us to world order faster than the old-fashioned frontal assault." Richard Gardner CFR


ex-Wyomingite cont.
“For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it might cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst, and to provide for it.” Patrick Henry

You may prefer SNL...denial is not just a river in Egypt.




“Freedom requires virtue. Virtue requires faith. Faith requires freedom” Os Guinness

the end
We already know how the story ends. I guess Pat doesn't because most Catholics don't read the bible.

America is finished.


The whole story is in the book of Revelation.


There will be one world gov and I think it's coming soon. I will be very surprised if the next president (whoever wins) does not preside over the end of our nation as we know it. I suspect when the US goes down we will take the world with us.

There will be a confederation of ten "kings". EU, NAU, SAU, etc.

“The ten horns of the beast are ten kings who have not yet risen to power. They will be appointed to their kingdoms for one brief moment to reign with the beast. They will all agree to give him their power and authority. Together they will go to war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will defeat them because he is Lord of all lords and King of all kings. And his called and chosen and faithful ones will be with him.” Rev 17 12-14


I am looking forward to a world without sin and corruption and as his bride (the church) reigning with the Lamb.



We have all eternity to celebrate our victories, but only a few hours before sunset to win them.
Amy Carmichael


Christians need to wake up and smell the coffee.


....
A journalist asked a Chinese General his thoughts on a hypothetical nuclear war with the US. The General said that such a war would cause hundreds of millions of casualties on both sides; he said America has 300 million people, we have 1.4 billion- we could absorb such a loss, America could not. He then went on to say the silver lining would be that the world would immediately slip into global communism. Whether we’re brought to our knees by a nuclear holocaust or a third world invasion of socialists [coupled with criminal politicians who’ve sold us out long ago], or a decline in birth rates- the world will slip into a 21st century Dark Age. Western Europe is further along in its downfall; soon the Crescent & Scimitar flags will fly over their capitols and hopefully the quisling liberal men will be forced to wear a burqa.

Race
Here is my contribution for the day.
A beautiful poignant story, that will make you laugh and weep.


"The Color of Water, A Black Man's Tribute to His White Mother" by James McBride


"The Color of Water will make you proud to be a member of the HUMAN race" Mirabella


Read this and you will know what a scumbag Obama really is. (Why all the jubilation over the Wright debacle by the neocon GOP? McCain is a scumbag too, but he NEEDS to run against Obama if he has any hope of winning.)

ex-Wyomingite
It wasn't on this thread, it was another day.

I think you said I was maniacally obsessed or something like that. It didn't offend me.

I did not have occassion to respond at that time so I thought I would give my reasons today.


Have a good day.

The EU
Yeah that really worked for the wacko sect until the EU grew to more than 10. Maybe it really meant ASEAN--I think there are still at only 10 full members.


The problem with that
"A journalist asked a Chinese General his thoughts on a hypothetical nuclear war with the US. The General said that such a war would cause hundreds of millions of casualties on both sides..."

China has about 400 warheads and the US 12,000. China couldn't asorb 10,000 plus hits--if the US sent almost everything it would wipe China almost to the man off the planet. Of course, such an attack would send so much soot into the air that the planet would go into a new ice age and the entire species may go out.

A Chinese general once implied China would nuke LA over Taiwan--some Chinese generals say stupid things, some US Generals say stupid things. China's small nuclear stockpile is to deter other nuclear powers like the US or the Russians from blackmailing it--as the US did in a way in Korea and over Jinmen/Mazu (aka Kinmen (Quemoy)/Matsu) in the 1950s.


the great satan
I have been watching events in China with increasing alarm.

Who are they preparing to go to war with?

Another article on Drudge today...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/majornews/1917167/Chinese-b uild-secret-nuclear-submarine-base.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/0 3/04/AR2008030401345_pf.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldne ws.html?in_article_id=559133&in_page_id=1811


Mark Steyn has some interesting insights about demographics in "America Alone". A very good book in my opinion.

oops
make that "occasion"!

How the world will end
IF - just IF - Pat's figures are even "in the ball park", consider this scenario (the # of illegals already in the US offers some proof of possibility).

The 1st major problem is overpopulation in EVERY country. This leads to increased demand for energy, food, etc. The greater the demand, the lower the supplies - an escalating vicious circle. Socialistic politics - take from everyone to share with everyone - will be unable to meet needs. Anger, frustration, envy, etc will expand exponentially.

This leads to loss of restraint - and EVERYONE has nuclear weapons, with no hesitation to use them. The result will be a nuclear holocaust fulfilling the prophecy of Revelations to destroy the world by fire.

OOOHHH Pat...,you're a NUT!
"Hopefully, the peoples of Asia, Africa and the Middle East, who are about to inherit the earth as we pass away, will treat us better than our ancestors treated them in the five centuries that Western Man ruled the world.

Otherwise, we all go out with a bang."

I think you're confussing your own looming passing with that of western society.

I could care less what shade of skin becomes the most numerous upon the planet. I think it silly to try to drum up fear over such issues.
Pat if you were truely faithful in what America means then you would be grounded in the belief that what has made her strong will continue to protect all that have faith in it, regardless of skin pigment.

I think you and you're readers would be better served if you gave better articles about the history of America then for you to try to scare people with tales of the boogey man cometh.

Japan yes, Taiwan today not so much
In the past in Taiwan, there was a good deal of discrimination toward what once was called "Shan Di Tong Bao" or "the Mountian Comrades" or "Shandiren "Mountian People" this is now politically incorrect and has changed the name to the "Yuanzumin" or "First People."

When the non-Taiwanese Chinese came over in 1945-1949, there were many problems between the two. There have also been issues between the Kejiaren (Hakka) and Min Nan (non-Hakka Taiwanese often called Hokkien). But today the issues between people are mostly political, not ethnic. You even have non-Taiwanese, even non Asians becoming Taiwanese, known as "New Taiwanese."

Blacks might not fare so well, but they have issues in the US too don't they?

As for Japan, well yes, much more racist--Pat would probably feel at home there...except for the fact no old Irish white guys so much. No-Yamoto haven't be treated all that way in the past. That includes non-Japanese Gaijin as well as Japanese, but non-Yamato and of course the issue of the Burakumin. As for the Han being muts, no more than any other group.


The Great Satan
Some people are "BUTT" stupid.I consider you one of those people.It is for that reason, I will be brief.Plato said with his "Shadow on the Wall" reference that there was two "Worlds";One world physical,the other spiritual.I "Hope" my post is not too difficulty,for your 2000 IQ...

Anna, so easy.
"Who are they preparing to go to war with?"

Anna, go and find a map of Asia--that is that big land mass way west of California. There you'll see China and off on the southeast about 115 miles off a province (kinda like a state, Anna) called Fujian is a island the Portugese named Ilha Formosa which means beautiful island in their language and a little to the west of this a group of islands they called the Pescadores which means the Fisherman Islands.

You may know Formosa by the better name of Taiwan--I doubt you've heard of Penghu, but that is the name of the Pescadores. Well, I won't go into detail of the history of Taiwan, but in short China claims it as their province.

THAT IS WHO THEY ARE PLANNING TO GO TO WAR WITH.

If Taiwan moves toward independence--and since Ma Ying Jeou won that is unlikely at this point--China has maintained its willingness to fight Taiwan over this. At this point Taiwan still holds the balance in the strait, China upgrades are aimed at changing this. And since Taiwan's "good friend" may decide to come to Taiwan's aid in such a war, the build up is made to 1) Finish off Taiwan before the US can respond; 2) Make the build up so impressive the US won't want to respond and 3) If the US does respond, hurt it so bad it won't continue the fight over Taiwan.

That clear?


228
It was mostly Taiwanese that got killed. The mainlanders controlled the amry, not the Taiwanese.

My take on it--simply. Taiwanese who at first view the mainlanders as liberators soon saw them as worse than the Japanese and after 16 months of the brutality of Chen yi's rule, they had enough. The beating of Lin Jian-mai by the tobacco agents was the last straw. Of course, if the US and UK hadn't promised Taiwan to Chiang in the first place and had made Taiwan a trust territory like other former Japanese held islands, there would have been no KMT on Taiwan and no 228 and Taiwan would be as it should be today--an independent country recognized by the entire world, but that's water under the bridge, isn't it?


DEORNWULF MY BROTHER

.....You wrote that Native Americans came from Asia ...DNA mapping would show that Native American most likely emigrated from the Middle East ... hence the large prominent hawkish nose similiar to the Arabs ...Eskimos and the Inuit on the other hand have the flat nose of the Mongols from Asia ...

.....We all share a common DNA with genetic modifications that have evolved over countless centuries ...therefore we all have a common ancestor and are brothers/sisters under the skin ...if every person on Earth was able to trace their ancestory back to the beginning ...their family trees would cross many times along the way ...

.....If two strangers met on the street and each had their family trees traced back ...they would eventually find a common ancestor ...this is a mathematical absolute .....COLOSSUS

birth rates are falling world-wide
Buchanan describes declining birth rates as an occurrence of modern societies (Europe and the United States) and Japan. As detailed in Phillip Longman’s The Empty Cradle and many other sources, it is a worldwide pattern, which has progressed to a later stage in Europe and Japan than elsewhere. Longman points out that:

1. The UN projects that world population growth will begin declining by 2004 (p.7).
2. Today’s global fertility rate is half of 1972”s (p.8).
3. Mexico, although now younger than the United States, is aging much more rapidly, and by 2050, will have a population older than the United States (older than Japan’s current population, now the world’s oldest) (p.8, 24).
4. The mid-East is aging rapidly. Arab countries had a baby boom in the 1980’s followed by a “baby bust.”
5. Iran is already below replacement fertility. The mid-East as a whole will be (at current birth rates) below replacement fertility by 2025 (p.9-10).
6. China by 2020 will have a median age higher than the United States, and by 2050 will be experiencing major population decline (p.11).

The UN Population Division annual demographic survey published February 23, 2003 (available on-line at http://www.un.org.esa/population/publications/wpp2002/WPP2 002-HIGHLIGHTSrevl.pdf) divides the world for demographic purposes into three sectors:

1. “The developed areas,” where birth rates are already below replacement levels for virtually every country, and population decline is expected to start by 2030.
2. The “less developed areas,” where fertility is declining except for a small group of “least developed countries” with current population of roughly 668,000. The remainder of the “less developed areas,” with current population of 4.2 billion, is experiencing fertility decline (from 3.11 for 1995-2000 to 2.92 for 200-2005; trending to “replacement only” by 2030).


Killer
I’m hardly concerned with what a tree hugging hermaphrodite like you, whose IQ is three degrees below whale sh*t, thinks. Now get back to work dimwit and don't forget to smile when you ask "paper or plastic?"

A few comments...
It is an error to say that we have 40,000,000 fewer Americans as a result of abortion. Because the abortion regime has been in place for 35 years, that 40,000,000 number must be augmented by the number of children those children would have had by now. And soon that number will need to be further augmented by the number of grandchildren those children would have had.

The resulting number would need to be adjusted downward, though, when calculating the effect on the white population: over one third of those abortions were to non-white "mothers".

Unlimited government has given us a tax burden that requires the support of "working couples" who no longer have the time to raise their own children. If they have any children at all, the "burden" of instilling cultural values in those children is routinely transfered to the State, whose cud-chewing employees cheerfully indoctrinate them in the suicidal dogmas of Western "progressivism".

Europeans -- *real* Europeans, the children of Christendom, not the hordes they have imported to bolster their flagging socialist welfare states -- need to be reproducing at a rate that will make up for lost time. That is to say, they need to be reproducing like God-cursed Mohammedans. But no one has the vision to look up from their bowl of cradle-to-grave subsidies long enough to acknowledge the problem, much less to stop it in its tracks, and thus Western Civilization, the unparalleled pinnacle of human achievement, is being left to the tender mercies of the much more prolific barbarians.

The last European on Earth won't need to turn off the lights when he goes. They will have gone out long before, with his replacements furiously but ineffectually hammering on the failing generators with implements made of bone and rock, their greatest technological achievements.


Taiwan
I'd say the build up is over-kill if Taiwan is the only objective.

They don't have to nuke America. All they have to do is dump their dollars. I take that back, all they have to do is threaten to dump their dollars.

My God
This Post really did bring out the racists...

Charles Martel
good one!

Buck
"From what I understand,between February 28th and March 3rd Taiwanese separatists and Japanese descendants went on a rampage,slaughtering mainlanders,until mainland troop reinforcement arrived to put down the rioting and massacred the rioters.does that about sum it up?"

It would if this was say 1954 and you were working for the KMT, yeah. Actually they'd have also used the phrase communist spies too. You forgot that phrase and bandits..the KMT loved the term bandits...so I'll rewrite it for you Between February 28th and March 3rd evil, Japanese inspired separatists and their descendants, along with communist spies and bandits went on a rampage,slaughtering innocnet Chinese women and children,until the glorious National Revolutionary Army arrived to put down the illegal uprising and restored order."

Want to rewrite the Kaohsiung Incident next? With Ma Ying Jeou in office, he may be looking for someone like you--the old KMT is back!

What really happened was that the Taiwanese had grown tired of 16 months of KMT abuse and the brutal reign of Chen Yi (who would eventually end up back on the mainland to become a communist). The pistol whipping of Lin Jian-mai by the agents of the tobacco monopoly was the last straw.

Well, I guess you could say many of those that rioted were now for Taiwan independence, but after what KMT rule had been like since Japan left can you blame them?

The KMT restored order by the indiscrimate killing of Taiwanese. 228 was little different from 6-4 42 years later in Beijing--only this time it was the PLA murdering people, not the NRA.


Most predictions aren't worth spit
In the 50s, by 2000 we were going to have highways that controlled cars from start to destination, jet back packs that poofed us over rooftops and traffic in mini-jet flights, kitchens that prepared entire meals for us, and houses that ran entirely by computer and regulated all functions and necessities.

In the 70s, by 2000 we were going to be in another ice age, suffering from food riots for lack of arable land, having wars fought over water resources, and starving populations roaming the world like the Vandals and the Goths in the end of the Roman Empire.

In 2000, the experts are predicting global warming, oceans' rising, losses of arable land and food shortages, ethanol taking up all corn production creating food shortages, oil depletion, and general disaster.

Malthus 2-300 years ago predicted overpopulation, food shortages, riots in the streets from famine and hunger, wars over water resources, and genral havoc. Does it have a familiar ring?

Technologies like the 50s' predictions are to some degree available today if you are a gadzillionaire. There are so-called smart houses, but I'll never be able to afford one. You could build highways where cars were programmed to run from some general center, but we don't do it because of the massive construction and costs. The jet back pack never really caught the practical imagination.

The ice age of the 70s is the global warming of the 21st C., I think, because the same people want to use something huge like climate to get the reins of gov't and set up Marxist dictatordhips based on experts' saving us from some disaster they've concocted. We'll see how far the global warmist are willing to give up their limos and private jets first.

Anna
Since Taiwan still holds the balance in the Strait, not overkill and it has to protect against Taiwan's fickle friend too, who may or may not show up.

The submarine base in Hainan has two objectives--Taiwan and the Nansha (islands in the South China Sea that China, Taiwan and a host of other countries claim). The Chinese military budget? Well, China spends about what the US spends as a % of GDP, but even if the world is 100% off and China really spends 8-9% of defense, the US is still outspending China by 3 times and that is if you think China is at 9%. Depending on what you believe, China outspends Taiwan between 3-6 times as Taiwan spends about 20 billion on defense compared to China's official 60 billion (and if the true is 100% off, it'd be 120 billion).




If you want to see the whimper we end on
read the Jean Raspail book from about 30 years ago, "The Camp of the Saints".

http://www.amazon.com/Camp-Saints-Jean-Raspail/dp/188178007 4/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1209776887&sr=8-1

If you can, read it the original French version. It paints eerie pictures in any language but the French version is more effective.

Some positive suggestions
If we want to redress the demographic imbalance between the rapidly growing Third World and the slowly growing (at best) First World, we should be doing everything possible to *export* family planning services to the Third World.

Conservatives should abandon their opposition to abortion and birth control--in the Third World. The more Third World women that abort their babies, the fewer will grow to adulthood.

At the same time, we need tax incentives in the U.S. to encourage larger families. A generous tax credit for children's college education would help. I know of families that have 4 or more children. Those parents can't afford to send them all to good colleges.

And in the U.S., we could also institute a pilot Government-subsidized surrogate mother program for career women who can't take the time off from work to bear their own children. Such a career woman can hire a surrogate woman who will bear her child with an egg from her and sperm from her husband.

That would help: More abortions in the Third World. More surrogate mothers in the First World.


Why the atomic bomb
The best argument I can think of for dropping the atomic bomb on Japan was that the Japs deserved it:

Shanghai
Nanking
Korean "comfort women"
Unit 731
Greater Co-
Prosperity Sphere
Pearl Harbor
Corregidor
Bataan Death March

With a track record like that, the atomic bomb is just what the Japs deserved.

Best thing we ever did.

De Tocqueville wrote
that whenever whites outnumbered blacks, they oppressed them but whenever blacks outnumbered whites, they massacred them.

Monster
That seems to parallel Churchill's remark about the Hun being either at your feet or at your throat.

Some excellent observations.
Charles Martel's 5:20.

SteveL's 10:49 and 10:53

Monster's 11:51

We gave up a lot of insights
when we rejected the Biblical worldview, and replaced it with Humanistic thinking, what with the prevalance of territorial spirits and all.

But it would be a mistake to focus on this one specific demographic trend rather than look for the line running through just about every one of TH's columns.

Of course, if one's view is this-worldly, one is not going to see it.

The Majority
Whites composed only 10 percent of the world's population, per this article, I think it's only 8 percent, and women out number men how is that I, a white male, am counted as one of the majority? I know, just more of the lunacy that the despicable left wing propaganda machine aka main stream media and the country's colleges, the bastions of the left wing PC crowd, have perpetrated on the country. Don't look behind the curtain until it's too late.

I do not accept
We do not have to accept the extinguishing of our culture. The entire world is basically in the white man's shaping and it's all for the better. It's western man's philosophy and hard work that brought the world out of the stone age. Our race and our culture and our countries are the envy of the world. We owe it to ourselves, our children, and our grandchildren to survive and to flourish and we will.

Alexander of Friday, 10:16
Lots of insight in your post. Women's lib has destroyed the cultural roles of men/women established over milennia. These roles had flaws, but the PC replacements are much MORE flawed. Decent men and wise women, when given enough time to recognize their own natures, return towards traditional and conservative role models, but this usually doesn't happen until the late 30's. Pretty close to midnight on the ol' biolgical clock and just about the time some gal realizes she just might like to have a framily more than a fish wants a bicycle, she winds up competing with all the tarted up teeners. Its going to have to be the females who move things back towards protecting their biological role. Women's Lib made milk so cheap, what guy needs to buy a cow?

woman+man ? fish+bicycle
I remarked once to a strident feminist with that very bumper sticker on her car that a man needs a woman who thinks she needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle like a fish needs a bicycle.

Can you imagine that she had the temerity to be offended?

And I hadn't even called her "kitten".



(that didn't work)
That question mark in the subject line of my last post was supposed to be a not-equal sign (?), but thank you, Townhall, all the same: your links never work, and you reject the most basic of symbols.



grrrr
And it wouldn't let me put the symbol in the text either.

And what's worse...
...is that Jesus is dead and he's not coming back. What on ever to do?

savage/Charles
"Its going to have to be the females who move things back towards protecting their biological role." I think that is true.

Things are so insane now. I think families are the individual cells upon which society is built. As the family goes, so goes society.

One of the big flaws of feminism to me and a way it rips off women is when it tells woman in order to be respected she has to prove she can do what a man can do.

Why shouldn't a woman be respected for just being a woman? If her hearts desire is hearth and home and to nurture her own children why is she considered a second class citizen? If she had real brains she would park her kids in a daycare center and run a corporation?

I raised a boy and it's not so great for males either. What was considered normal boy behavior when I was young is now considered mental illness. Manliness isn't PC either.

I think male and female is like electricty, positive and negative. Equal but different.

There does seem to be some sanity returning and acceptance that equality doesn't mean we are the same. Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, Love and Respect, etc. Dennis Prager had someone on talking about this and he commented, "women think men are hairy women". Pretty funny.




SteveL
"The best argument I can think of for dropping the atomic bomb on Japan was that the Japs deserved it."

First, let me thank you for using a term now considered racist, I suppose you can make a good deal of judgements about what lies in your heart, can't we?

I thought the American narrative is the bomb was supposed to have saved Japan from an invasion because they were so crazy they wouldn't surrender (we'll ignore the fact that Japan had been in talks with the Soviets from months trying to get it to meditate a surrender between Japan and the US and the fact that X-day was for November 1, 1945--almost 3 months after the date the bomb was dropped and a date which so happened to be close to the date the Americans knew the Soviets were going to enter the war).

So the bomb saved American and Japanese lives--isn't that the narrative?

I didn't think this was supposed to be a act of revenge but a humane way to end more suffering? Isn't that the story?

If for revenge and using this standard, should someone drop a nuclear weapon--I don't know Al Qaeda for example--on Kansas City for the evils the US has done as well?

Oh and isn't your post more suitable for say the lastest from John Hawkins?

The old cycle goes on
Even if we take the statistics Buchanan cites as completely accurate--and that's not necessarily the case--this long run trend is like so many other throughout the course of human history.

The compositions of populations change, and replacement of one "race" by another "race"--note that this way of understanding "race" has no scientific validity--has happened time and again. Just ask yourself: where are the Assyrians, Sumerians, Scythians, Hittities, etc.?

Answer: they merged into other groupings, which merged into still other groupings, again, a process that has never ceased. "White" Americans or Europeans won't just vanish, but will be blended into other parts of the human population, in varying degrees.

People who are into Aryan nationalism or racism get their underwear in a bundle over this, but consider: We say that Rome declined and fell, but you can also say that the disintegration of Rome helped to produce what eventually became the peoples and nations of Western Europe. So, are we headed for Spenglerian decline and decay? Not at all.

If we imagine that our nation, our society, people like us, will always be here, and be in charge, we imagine a historical impossibility.
And, no, voting in conservative Republicans won't buy us any time. The belief that historical processes on this scale can be affected by tinkering around with public policy is both arrogant and idiotic.

Well Buck
You sure re-write Taiwanese history like you work for the KMT circa 1954. As for the KMT and Ma, not much I or anyone else can do about him until 2012--same thing you'll be saying if Hillary or Obama gets elected. I don't think I've ever hid my Taiwan party politics either. As for what you like or don't like, I don't really much care.

Oh and SteveL:

No such thing as the Third World. Using the term makes you look sadly ill informed and few countries that are the largest sources of US immigrants wouldn't be considered Third World even if the term was still valid--Mexico, China and India for example.


Gastell
Exactly. Ask where the Manchus, Nuzhen, or the Xiongnu are too.

And since
"It is an error to say that we have 40,000,000 fewer Americans as a result of abortion. Because the abortion regime has been in place for 35 years, that 40,000,000 number must be augmented by the number of children those children would have had by now. And soon that number will need to be further augmented by the number of grandchildren those children would have had."

Many of these children would have grown up poor without a father and more likely to become criminals, so I guess you'd need to take away the possible numbers of murder victims these would have had as well. In fact a book a few years ago made this very arguement--more abortions, less crime basically.

Trying to make a claim on the numbers of children people who never existed may have had makes is no more valid that trying to predict how many they would have murdered.




Akagi
I think that, if you look at the statistics, you should find that there are significantly fewer people committing murders than there are having children, so to suggest that the two statistics might offset each other makes you look very foolish. Maybe that's where you wanted to go. Suit yourself.

Also, how many of those murderers would also have had children? Murder and fatherhood are not mutually exclusive, you know.

Observant readers should also notice that I made no attempt to quantify the children in question. I stated only that, since the abortion regime is now 35 years old, a significant number of those aborted would surely have had a significant number of children by now had they not been murdered themselves, and we are fast approaching the year in which the earliest victims would have seen their first grandchildren.

---------

By the way, you are correct on the narrative for Hiroshima and Nagasaki: an invasion of Japan was expected to have resulted in a million American dead and wounded and millions of Japanese dead from combat, aerial bombing, famine, and disease. Although the desire for revenge certainly figured into the calculations of average Americans, the use of atomic weapons was meant to save American lives, with the collateral benefit of saving Japanese as well. Perhaps the latter played a lesser role in the thinking of American leaders, but by August 1945, they already had three months' experience as an occupying power in Europe and, no doubt, a keen awareness of the burdens to be assumed by an enlightened occupier. Millions of Japanese lived rich full lives and are alive today who would not have been had the United States foregone use of the bomb. Ironic, but undeniable. The sacrifice borne, albeit involuntarily, by the residents of those two cities deserves to be honored, and the only regrets should be that the war was initiated in the first place. Blame for this latter, though, lies nowhere on our shores.

Does Pat belong to this group?
I think some of the people who comment on this site are members of this group too!:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3844699896127381386 &q=skinheads+USA&ei=DAQdSMXdFpCUrgLrpsTOAg

20 to 38 million...
...according to Californians for Population Stabilization. Glad you are paying attention to this, because amnesty will boost our population to 450 million by 2050 amid outrageous world demand for food and energy, water shortages and climate change.

This may not be the way the world will end, but it is the way that many, many millions will starve to death.

Vote for a democrat and you are condemning your children to this future - guaranteed.

This is not being done because it is the "right thing to do," it is being done to increase the rolls of low income voters. Everytime the Dems get control, they pull something like this - LBJ is the one, I believe, who erased the line between Social security and general revenues. We all know what other problems he started. It was a dem who began the taxation of soc. sec benefits. They will destroy our way of life.

Ed Meese article yanked from T.H. Lineup
Anyone interested in viewing and article written by Ed Meese on Townhall.com last night around midnight can go to the link posted below.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/EdwinMeeseIII/2008/05/03 /the_judges_strategic_gavel&Comments=true

For some reason the article was yanked or hidden after I posted my comment???? Wonder why?

Drivel
If Buchannon is saying that Western Man was less kind to anyone than any African, Asian, or Middle-Eastern group of people, he is losing it.
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