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Monday, August 25, 2008
Mike Adams :: Townhall.com Columnist
Real Men Don't Do Pornography
by Mike Adams
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Author’s Note: Having broken one or more of the following rules in no way excuses a man from following them in the future.

A divorced friend of mine was complaining to me recently about the pool of women available to him here in the coastal Carolina region. His specific complaint was that too many (I think he said “all”) of the women were carrying too much baggage to have a successful relationship. I’m so tired of hearing “men” make this complaint that I’ve made it the subject of today’s column.

The thesis of my rebuttal is really simple: It is not entirely fair and accurate to say that most adult women are carrying a lot of “baggage” or have a lot of “issues.” (Remember when people used to have problems, not issues?). It is much more accurate to say that most adult women are profoundly wounded and scarred by the things that “men” have done to them when they were not really acting like men. Below, I’ve listed a few examples:

Real Men Do Not Go To Topless Bars. I wrote about this topic two years ago in a column called “I Had a Dream.” But, it is worth repeating that topless bars are little more than fronts for organized crime. This includes the punks who operate the strip club near UNC-Wilmington. These people take women with low self-esteem – often victims of sexual abuse – and get them hooked on cocaine that is sold in their club (again: an organized crime front). To the extent that “men” frequent these places, they fund the destruction of the life of someone’s daughter. This is a disgrace and no such “man” can even remotely be characterized as a Christian.

Real Men Do Not View Pornography. I recently asked an Obama supporter whether he ever viewed pornography on the internet. He said he did “occasionally.” I asked whether he would ever want his daughter to star in a porn flick. He said “never.” When I reminded him that the porn star has parents, too, he vowed to reconsider his continued viewing of internet pornography.

Something that “men” who view pornography do not realize is that it trains the mind to be sexually stimulated by seeing images of many different people nude and engaged in certain acts. Eventually, the viewer becomes unable to be stimulated by just one person. Thus, a “man” who views pornography is much more likely to hurt his wife by engaging in adultery. And when he’s caught, he’s much more likely to hurt his children with a painful divorce. Those who believe that porn affects only the viewer are simply uneducated, dishonest, or both. Where there is pornography, there is also co-lateral damage.

Real Men Do Not Have Sex With Women They Do Not Intend To Marry. I once read a survey indicating that the number of sex partners a woman has in a lifetime is only a fraction of the number of sex partners a man has in a lifetime. This can be explained by two factors: 1) men lie in an upward direction when asked how many people they’ve slept with and, 2) women lie in a downward direction when asked how many people they’ve slept with.

This becomes a problem later on in marriage when a woman is unable to forgive herself for having a lot of sex partners. This guilt is biologically, and not culturally, induced. And once a woman has lied about her past to a prospective husband, she cannot communicate with him about her guilt. The couple begins to have problems whose true origins are never addressed.

The only solution to this problem is for men to stop having sex with women they do not intend to marry. Men have it within their power to stop contaminating the future-wife pool. A little self-control can do a lot to strengthen a dying institution.

Real Men Do Not Engage In Post-Marital Sex. Saying “I used to be married” is a pretty lame excuse for engaging in post-marital sex. And, if you have children, especially girls, there’s a really good reason to avoid it. Put simply, if you have young girls and you start having sex after marriage your girls will find out about it from your ex-wife. Of course, your ex-wife will have learned about it from your mutual friends.

There’s a good chance that your young daughters will still look up to you even after a nasty divorce. They may want to marry someone with many of your qualities. Don’t send the message that they need to sleep with such a man in order to get his attention.

Real Men Never Relinquish the Role of Spiritual Head of the Household. God did not give the Ten Commandments to a woman. Nor did He send his only begotten daughter to save womankind. If your potential spouse has trouble understanding this, you need to reconsider your relationship. And once your children are grown, your leadership obligation continues. If your child has strayed spiritually – whether into paganism or atheism - it may or may not be the result of poor modeling on your behalf. Regardless, men have an obligation to fight for their children’s spiritual redemption. A man’s willingness to do so determines whether he leaves behind a legacy that glorifies God or one that glorifies Satan.

In a future installment, I will deal with the issue of “real women.” That installment will talk about the things women are doing to hurt other women. “Real Women” will include, among other things, a comprehensive discussion of fake boobies, why I don’t like them, and how they contribute to global warming.

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About The Author
Mike Adams is a criminology professor at the University of North Carolina Wilmington and author of Feminists Say the Darndest Things: A Politically Incorrect Professor Confronts "Womyn" On Campus.
 
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Question for Dr Adams.
Do real men have relations with their students?

Have to disagree
I love Mike Adams's columns, and this is probably the first one I have ever disagreed with. I wish I had read this earlier. The problem is that you are looking at such a narrow range of people. For example, what about women who love pornography? Would you say the same things?

And more importantly, what about couples?

Pornography doesn't have to drive a wedge between a man and his spouse; plenty of couples enjoy it together, including me and my wife. That goes for strip clubs too.

Your point about no-one wanting their daughter to be in porn is a very good point. But consider this - how many of you would be happy about their daughter appearing nude in an R-rated movie? Yet, I'm willing to bet that 99% of the people reading this enjoy many R-rated movies, including ones with nudity. Does that make you all hypocrites?

Or, how many of you would be happy about their son or daughter making a career working the counter at McDonald's? None? Yet, I'm willing to be that 99% of you enjoy fast food as well.

The list goes on. To each his own, but don't begrudge those of us who very much enjoy the female form.

Of course, I don't condone anyone being forced into the business, or the drug use. But that's a better argument to regulate the sex industry more, which might be a good idea.

Thank You Mr. Adams

Your timely reminder of the kind of country that you right-wing types would inflict upon us is just the motivation I need to get out and keep campaigning for Obama.


I married a REAL man!
My husband and I married when we were 28. He was a virgin but I was not. He valued women and looked forward to the one woman he would devote his life and body to. I fell for the "my body, my choices" values of feminism. He came into marriage pure, I was hurt and emotionally bruised. Of course I had changed my attitude and values long prior to marriage (mostly due to a crisis pregnancy) but had to learn to trust and appreciate men.
What good has come of marrying a man like my darling husband?
-- I know I am loved and cherrished
-- I trust when he says he will never have and affair
-- Our three sons have learned to esteem women and do not treat dating as a recreational sport
-- Our three sons (oldest 25) look forward to sex in the context of marriage and have all taken a vow to "wait."
-- Our daughter has a terrific model of the type of man she wants to wait for
-- My husband does not watch pornography and still sees me as the sexiest woman he knows
-- My husband is a fabulous lover who seeks to please only me
-- Our marriage is happy and healthy after 20 years.
-- We need not worry about "post marriage" sex

Mike, you hit a home run on this one! Real men don't let their little heads dictate how they live their lives and how they will "love" women. Real men find value in values that create happy healthy lives for themselves and thier families.

To those who doubt, what harm can possibly come of living life this way? The least you can do is admit that extramarital sex and pornography undeniably causes harm no matter how much you try to deminish it.


Steve says @ 4:21 Aug. 26th...
"Jesus treated all equally."

Yeah, but He didn't treat 'em the same.


Thank You for Pornography Article
Mr. Adams,
I want to thank you for your article. I am a divorced man with two teenage boys. Your explanation of viewing pornography opened my eyes. I try to follow the Lord's Word, but am hopelessly human. I adhere to all the other items you mentioned, but I have to work on viewing pornography. I owe it to my boys.
52 year old Dad of Two Boys

Sad but true
As a longtime barroom entertainer, I second Mike's views.

A lot of people (men and women) ensnared in lascivious living wind up having such a terrible self-image (i.e., guilty conscience) that they do not seek forgiveness (from the Lord or their eventual spouse). So they stay miserable.

Forgiveness is key, especially for women whose husbands have developed an internet porn habit. Porn is hateful, but only love can bring back the husband from his misery.

Love the sinner, hate the sin, and replace bad habits with good ones. One day at a time.

And yes, I've been there, in NC the criminal biker drug games run the strip clubs. They give pretty girls free drugs for 30 days, then stick them with a bill.

In shock, the girls say, "I can't afford $250 a day!"

The thug says, "Honey, you can make that in two hours at the cluuuub."

Case closed.

WTF?
Ok mike, you are really outside your pay grade on this one - a divorced man cant have sex? Viewing pornography - never mind the internet - leads to adultery? Men are the christian heads of a household?

I dig most of your stuff, dude, but this is . . . wow . . . 'nuff said

ricardo - md - pornography
And thus you display for all to read - the vast emptiness of your intellect and immaturity of your self.

The majority of people seek ways to diminish the negative aspects of their self that must be displayed for others see. But then we find some, whom, for unknown reasons, seek to display all that makes them look foolish, ignorant or immature for all the world to see.

Real Men Do Not Have Sex With Women They
To far too many individuals, male and female, have chosen to engage in sex as opposed to making love. When it comes down to the brass facts, any animal can engage in sex, even across breeds. That does not improve the "statue" of the animal. Again, far too many of these individuals have reduced the act of making love to an animalistic act of "sexual release". If they are honest with themselves, they will admit that there is no lasting satisfaction gained from the "sexual act", especially when compared to the value of "making love". Many will claim this not to be true "for themselves", but anyone can lie, and a lie to one's self is, next to attempting to lie to GOD, the worst lie.

"Making love" is a special act and must be reserved for that one special individual in your life. GOD made the act extremely pleasurable so that a husband and a wife could and would share a deep and lasting feeling for one another. To demean this act by reducing it to the level of an animal is saying to yourself and the one with whom you engage in the act that you consider both to be no better than a stray dog. As a stray dog will "mate" with any and all dogs of the opposite sex, whenever the chance presents itself. In short, over the long term, sex for the purpose of animalistic release is demeaning to the soul and destructive to one's emotional well being.

Note to those who will assuredly make snide comments. As you do not know me or my current or prior circumstances, your baseless, uninformed and less than intelligent comments will have no meaning and even less value, so save your time.

Pr0n is a con but it's our choice
Pr0n has its place and uses. Men are smart enough to know the limits of pr0n's usefulness the same way no man expects to be fed by watching a cooking show.

Pr0n may be "harmful to one's soul" but so are a lot of things, including dead-end jobs.

Prostitution should be legalized or decrimmed for consenting adults. Wasting valuable police resources on a victimless crime when murderers and rapists abound is the real sin.

now that hurts
.

dave742
"If you want to say that my wife and I are adulterers, that is fine. It’s just a word."

It means more than you have defined it as, but OK.

Now, if you want to say that you and your wife are married, that is fine. It's just a word.

Jim
Hmm, so you were taken in by a group of “silly, clueless morons”. Well, I guess it’s no shame being taken in by the best. And look at it this way, you got to party on and blame the whole thing on someone else. Now you can become a “Mike Adams” conservative. You know, be all consumed with patriotism, masculinity, gun toting and “sheep dogging” yet never actually risking your well being and serving your country in any tangible way.

Being part of that generation ahead of you, I must have been a little moronic myself. I never relized there was such an easy way out.

WOW
Mike...you're an idiot.

Rep. Adams?
Right on Mike, you nailed it on the head- as usual.

Ever think about running for office?

I grew up in the 70s--
and went to college in the 80s. I thus did the whole culture of the day thing--live wild, rock and roll, sex drugs and rock and roll, etc. etc. I now have to call it what it all truly was: a huge bunch of crap!! This doesn't mean I still can't dig good rock. It just means I now see that the generattion ahead of me, the people and professors who influenced me and my lifestyle, were silly, clueless morons! Don't get me wrong--I can laugh about the idiocy now. But thanks a lot guys and gals--you really did me no favors.
I grew up. I learned the hard way that it was all crap. This column probably hits too close to home for some people. That's what a conscience does. Thanks for the great piece, Mike! (By the way, I finally DID meet a rare, great gal who is uncorrupted by our culture---AFTER I grew up, of course!--and we just had our first child. Life is now GREAT!!)
(Mike, it was great to hear you and meet you at UNH a couple of years ago!!)

religious bigotry
This list had potential, but by the end you realize its nothing more than religious bigotry.

hell the only reason i read it is because it had pornography in the tittle.. Opened the link and there were no photos, im disappointed.

ok, ok
For once I got to hand it to Adams. I do look at certain magazines, movies, sites. Can't help it - but wouldn't want my daughter to be that girl.

Ken Walrus
"There is no legal obligation or peer/societal pressure for a woman to be a good wife, while men are still expected and required by law to be the financial providers."

Dam! You got all of that one! A bigger Truth, there is none.

To Lucifer666
That they are human is not enough. Unlike us they get enormous support from our society, yet still seem to be so unhappy.

Hole in the head
this guys brain must have leaked out a some point in time.

Swampfox
"Why do think that heterosexuals have so much trouble with relationships"

They're human!

To steve
"Do not forget that those who wrote the bible and tell all the fun little stories in Christanity were males who all thought that a woman had no place in life other than to have sex and take care of children."

I get so weary of correcting people who think they know the bible, but actually have no clue. Here's some quotes from the bible:

'A wife of noble character who can find?
She is worth far more than rubies.
Her husband has full confidence in her
and lacks nothing of value...
She considers a field and buys it;
out of her earnings she plants a vineyard...
She sees that her trading is profitable,
and her lamp does not go out at night.
Her husband is respected at the city gate,
where he takes his seat among the elders of the land...
She makes linen garments and sells them,
and supplies the merchants with sashes...
She is clothed with strength and dignity;
she can laugh at the days to come.
She speaks with wisdom, and faithful instruction is on her tongue.
Her children arise and call her blessed;
her husband also, and he praises her...
Give her the reward she has earned,
and let her works bring her praise at the city gate.'
Proverbs 31:10-31

There you have it: the ideal wife of the bible: strong, dignified, not afraid to speak out, engaged in business, running the household, praised in the public square, even her husband's success is partly attributable to her.

If ancient Israel as a whole lacked respect for women, it seems that God inspired the authors of the bible to work for change. For which He deserves thanks and praise.

Post marriage sex 2 of 2
His sons can start to see women as temporary and his daughters can start see women as temporary. There is a nasty pattern developing here that needs serious alteration.

It also creates a sense of chaos. Not knowing who will be around for the long haul can subtly affect children. My father "committed" to two more women. Is it any wonder we have a generation of younger adults that are "commitment" phobic? The word used in the context of relationships that are temporary is nonsense.

Trust is a seriously tough issue for some of these children. When you are raised by a single mother who got burned, you are usually modeled and taught fierce independence. When you marry the single mother you may have to deal with the emotional baggage and general resentment toward men. My step dad sure did.

Learning to be independent has its pros and its place, but never learning to be safely dependant on a man at times when it is appropriate, can make a future marriage very difficult. Some of those kids learn it from substitute sources like a sibling. This is once again, a child in an adult’s role. A good husband wants his wife to be completely confident and trusting of him-especially if he has earned it legitimately and maintains through consistent behavior that he is worthy of it. Without it, resentment builds.

As some of these adult children get older and marry and have successful marriages and families, they have to face the fact that what CAN be done to build and maintain a good marriage is not what one or both of their parents were willing to do. The adult child is in a mature relationship which is increasing in depth and breadth overcoming obstacles and challenges through self discipline, self sacrifice, and unconditional love while the parent is in yet another short term, relatively shallow, dead end relationship well into retirement.

Post marriage sex 1 of 2
The post marriage sex issue from the child’s perspective:

My parents are Baby Boomers. I was born in 1973. My father was a drunk and an adulterer within 2 years of their marriage. My mother had the brilliant idea of having a baby (my brother) 7 years into the mess to "make him more responsible." I was the surprise that arrived 11 months later at the peak of his drinking. A week after I was born she threw him out.

As you can see, I was not raised by mature adults. When the dad is a frat boy for the rest of his life (he had 2 more failed marriages when I was 4 and 16, and a very long line of girlfriends of marginal quality) it causes a distortion problem with his children.

The single biggest distortion is not seeing the father as an adult. He sobered up and by age 4 he had the usual every other weekend and a week in the summer visitation. The only thing a father can do in that situation is be a playmate to his children. Real relationships are an investment of time and energy. Not possible in that situation. Joint custody is essential.

Rotating large numbers of women through your life is not a great example for children. It does not set a tone of permanence. When those women have children by previous relationships like my second step mother did, and a bond starts to develop between those step siblings, it is a tremendous loss when the relationship ends. It reinforces the idea that people you grow to love are temporary. What about the times the mom's boyfriend/husband told her children from a previous relationship, "I love you like my own kids." and then the relationship ends? It is extremely rare for a former stepdad/mother's boyfriend to continue a life long relationship with that child like he would with his own kids. What is that child to take away from the experience?



Real Men....
Do not forget that those who wrote the bible and tell all the fun little stories in Christanity were males who all thought that a woman had no place in life other than to have sex and take care of children.

To say that God have the spiritual leadership role to men only is to say you speak for God. God also says you should treat all other humans as you would want to be treated. Well if a man does not want to be lorded over why would he lord over a woman.

Yes there are roles in marriage and life. But a man and a woman joined together in marriage and as a family are equals. The male does not have a role that is better than or greater than the woman. And the woman has no role that is greater than or better than the man. To say that a man MUST and ALWAYS be the leader of the household goes against the basic teachings of Christ.

I do not recall Jesus ever saying to a woman...
woman go make me some bread! Jesus treated all equally.

And while I believe in the idea of Jesus Christ and that he is son of God sent to save us all. At the same time if the bible writers had created a story in which God sent a woman to die for us, it never would have been taken seriously by the masses.

Those who are religious persecute just as much as they are persecuted.

To Dave
"If you want it to be a moral imperative for me, I will oppose you"

And there is where your irrational fear asserts itself. Neither I nor anyone else on this board advocates making topless bars and casual sex illegal across the board. Contrary to what you might assume, the majority of Christians are NOT interested in turning the U.S. into a theocracy.

Rather, I would try to *convince* you through persuasion. If you will not be convinced, then I have done what I could and you will presumably continue in error, to your detriment.

Real men
It shouldn't be real men don't have sex with women they don't intend to marry. It should be they don't have sex with women they aren't married to, i.e. only their wife.

A few more issues
A few more issues that I have found:
She is trying to beat a drug addiction.
She has an ex stalking her.
She has STD’s.
She has a child or two, out of control and using drugs.
She is two or three months behind paying the rent.
Trying to help most of these women, especially the ones with small children, is an exercise in futility.

Excuses, Excuses
Dear Mike: I see that you've gotten just about every secularist dissemblance possible in response to this article. At the core of them all, of course, is the viewpoint that there is no God and that, therefore, Man has no inherent responsibilities to Him or even to his fellows in his conduct. It's all a "personal choice". And if women and children (even those directly dependant on him) should be abused or exploited for the sake of his desires, then so be it. What a convenient (not to mention "tawdry" and "twisted") world liberals have created for themselves. Is it any wonder that women and children, who once occupied the top rung of human existance, have since been relegated into "tools of the trade"? The word for this is "decadency"... and it is a lethal societal disease.

"Real Men, ect..."
Mike, you have great advice for all the wrong reasons.

It's not that we should be "Real Men" and look out for the moor, misguided, incapable women. We should abstain from all of those things that you mentioned for our own good.

No one told these women to become whores, drug addicts or to sleep with criminals. They made those decisions on thier own but for some reason, women are never held accountable for their actions. It's always some honest hard-working guy that has to pick up the pieces.

Is This A Joke?
I keep wondering if this is a spoof. Have the feminazis gotten to Mike? Look, sexuality is a private matter. Preaching on sex from a political commentator is disturbing. Real men do all sorts of things sexually. Mind your own business Mike. Man is not monogamous. Marriage is a social construct - a way to force men to pay for sex in order that children can be supported. With feminism, men no longer need to serve that function. Women can rovide for children. Marriage is no longer required, and that's why it is disappearing. Men have no parental rights in our feminized culture, therefore they have no parental responsibilities either. Men should be free to purchase sex without being tied to an 18-year child support requirement.

Belated answer to JohnnyP, CVN65
You've probably already inferred that I'm one of the naturalised (to US) immigrants with an old-country wife. My reasoning against going for an American citizen wife is somewhat different, basically distillable to the following:
(*) in 1997, an attorney misfiled (wrong category--causing much dealy) my Green Card petition (from TN-1--lots of pitfalls)--which reduced my potential search pool to those with Canadian or American citizenship (as I could not trust Consular/Embassy officials to be cognisant of NAFTA--a distrust reinforced by my running into a NAFTA-non-cognisant INS official at Atlanta Airport in 1999).
(*) I didn't want to increase my existing ties to Canada--ruling out any Canadian-citizen spouse
(*) obvious (though denied by many morOntarians) cultural similarity between Americans and Canadians

Continued
Mr. Adams, you are doing a grave injustice to those younger men out there who read your writings. Once again, you are solely blaming them for the actions of women. Or does having a vagina between a human's legs relieve them of personal responsibility? You errently lay unearned guilt at the feet of young men who do not deserve it. It's interesting that you note that a woman's "sexual guilt" is "biologically induced", yet you seem to imply that the male urge to have lots of sex is somehow culturally induced, or even a moral failure, rather than being a biological derivative. (Ask any woman who has ever had to take testosterone for a medical condition if the sexual urge is "cultural". You might be surprised.) You take the young male consumers of pornography and strippers to moral task for their choices, but there is absolutely no indication that you hold the females doing the pornography and stripping to any sort of moral or cultural standard. Why is this? It seems to imply that because they have a vagina between their legs, they are morally inculpable. I believe you would find that Islamic societies and yourself hold common ground in this regard.

If you bother to ask some of your male students why they would choose to view pornography and strippers, rather than deal with an actual woman, they will give a variety of answers, but most will, in essence, follow this line: western women's attitudes and behaviors have become anathema to western men. Put another way, they would rather watch porn and view strippers than have to deal with a western woman's attitude and behavior. They find it easier.

(continued)

To Bozo
No, I think that TV has a great effect. But then so do other mediums of popular entertainment. I tend to watch the news networks. Everyone looks like they are between 30 and 40 years of age. With the women tending to be perpetually 30. Where are the real people?

bostguy123
No sir. Try and actually read instead of just reacting. John does not just oppose homosexuality, he claims he “absolutely cannot disassociate in my mind” and that he can asses what they think in their hearts. He even used the expression “Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwww!!!!!!” I cannot comprehend a straight adult male saying that. Now I know it’s very important for the sheep here to vigorously nod their heads to anything Adams says and to huddle together if someone dares disagree; but do you think you can take a moment to consider the tone of what John actually wrote?

Swampy
There's not enough bandwidth on this site for me to get into the effects that TV watching has on the average person.

You think it's inconsequential?

aspacia
another lame response and showing a total lack of introspection or understanding.

Remember Ashcroft?
Swampfox "Is eroticism porn? There are many nude statues in museums and even in the halls of Congress. Where does one draw the line?"

Remember when Ashcroft covered up the Justice statues for his press appearances? He spent a large amount of taxpayers' money to do this, too.

Cheeky monkeys, those Republicans. Probably want a spanking with a large hair brush. Well, naughty boys deserve to be punished!

interesting
I noticed that not one liberal made a comment about taxes and the crisis of the burden on the middle class in a previous article.

But they did jump to defend their rights and their knowledge on porn and sexual perversion and how it makes them feel good and anyone who disagrees is antiquated in their thinking.

Thankyou for proving my point.

jack
The truth is the truth. If you want to read the fiction that you live by go to your lib web sites otherwise get lost.

Its a free country and if some choose to print the truth tough for you.

The truth hurts.

Go hook up with will and compare ideologies.

lib scum
This article will really turn the rocks over.

Any man who disagrees with this article has a guilty conscience( or is not a man )

Real MEN vote Republican!!

There is no bigger turn off than a whiny liberal "man". Actually I call liberal men feminists.

Any woman who raises her son to be, think or act like a liberal should be ashamed.

What the hell hatched will?

The original David from IL...
Is now K-9. I should have known when I set up this account three years ago that something more 'unique' than a first name may be in order.

Uh oh...
Appears there's another David from IL who holds opposing viewpoints to my own. Guess I'd better figure out how to change my screen name to save TH'ers some confusion. Hmmm.

Great article, Doc.

for Jack
"Finally, George Bush, our first Catholic President--sort of (he's faithful, he's pro-life)."

That would be Kennedy. He was the only Catholic president.

Bush is Methodist, I think. However, he believes in that born-again crap, so not sure about the affiliation.

To Bozo
With your rationalization everyone who watches TV should be a raving heterosexual......wouldn't that be everyone in this country?

make that
...those who study Marketing are ver aware.

The first looks are free; the rest are gonna cost you.

holdmyw
"Sorry Doc. I love your stuff, but this just reeks of psuedo-science, speculation, anecdotal ramblings and, forgive me, horseshit."

It does?

Given our understandiong today of the effects that viewing ANYTHING has on the brain and the alterations in synaptic connections that repeated exposure to specific stimuli has on those connections, I'd say it's far from "psuedo-science", as you call it.

Maybe you aren't aware of the effects of advertisement but those who study Marketing aren't.

The Dysfunctional Family
The Greatest Story Ever Told is the story of a slightly dysfunctional family. Adam is the father; Christ the undisputed hero. But along the Way, we find Cain and Abel; King David; more true heroes (The Maccabees).

After Christ, we have Hamlet. Clearly, his step-dad drinks too much and his mom's dysfunctional behavior is transparent. Hamlet himself is a mess. Didn't he get the Message?

In our time, we have Bill Clinton. Talk about a tragic hero! Like Moses, he led us to the brink of the Promised Land--he himself has yet to enter in, or so it would appear. (His recent, ongoing anger is not a sign of Jonas or a sign of "recovery"; rather it is a sign of chronic rebellion and chronic, abject pride.)

Even more recently we have Senator Obama. Senator IT'S ABOVE MY PAY GRADE Obama. So close, and yet so far...from the Promised Land.

Tonight Ted Kennedy speaks. Talk about a post-modern dysfunctional family, and "Catholic" to boot.

Finally, George Bush, our first Catholic President--sort of (he's faithful, he's pro-life). But he's not America First. Not with his buddies, Saudi Arabia and Putin.

We've got a long way to go, especially since the next president, likely McCain, will be even more hawkish than Bush.

But McCain had the guts to admit a serious moral failure--his divorce. There is indeed hope, even though McCain doesn't seem to have read "Marching Toward Hell," by Scheuer.

Unless we come to terms, in our policies, with realism, with the contents of "Marching Toward Hell," we will never make it to The Promised Land.

(As individuals, however, the means to redemption are right there in Confession and Holy Communion.)

To John
Can we stop the name calling?

Not buyin'
QUOTE:"...“men” who view pornography do not realize is that it trains the mind to be sexually stimulated by seeing images of many different people nude and engaged in certain acts. Eventually, the viewer becomes unable to be stimulated by just one person."

I'd really like to see the data that supports this.

Sorry Doc. I love your stuff, but this just reeks of psuedo-science, speculation, anecdotal ramblings and, forgive me, horseshit.

Let's see some backup for this. I don't need the Sunday School Party Line. You diminish us all with rubbish like this.

To Lucifer666
Why do think that heterosexuals have so much trouble with relationships...... even with all the support our society gives to them?

The Pink Nazi Trolls in TH
The constant intake, both orally and via the anus, of all that HIV/AIDS-tainted semen has clearly affected Will's ability to articulate one rational thought.

Tinsldr2
" But if, as Adams laid out all but his last point based on secular positions his 'thesis' does not make the grade."

Correctly, although a bit cumbersomely, stated.

The question becomes, then, whose perpsective should a man base his relations with the opposite sex on? The world's or Scripture's?

I would be interested in hearing your argument for your position on that question.

JohnnyP
Another insecure male who needs his a$$ wiped by a wife/female.

Too funny

Why Adams Arguments fail
Ok wasnt going to post on this column again but an email I recieved made me think on it more.

The problem I have with Mr Adams column is that he takes his religious view and tries to rationalize it by secular means. His positions are valid religious beliefs but not valid arguements without the religious components.

This is what Adams wrote: "The thesis of my rebuttal is really simple............. "It is much more accurate to say that most adult women are profoundly wounded and scarred by the things that “men” have done to them when they were not really acting like men"

Ok point by point:
Topless bars --- while they might be bad in themselves dont support his thesis that women are scarred by the things men do unless he was refering specifically to strippers and that was not the point of his 'thesis'

Porn--- how is that baggage for a non porn star woman? many women enjoy watching it too. unless a woman is forced to watch how is a man Scarring her by his habits? No proof that porn leads to adultry. A lot more men watch porn then have sex outside of marriage. I bet most adultry also involves people that drink alcohol.

Sex without intending to marry? Give me a break, no factual basis to his claim that a womans guilt is biological as he claims.

Same with post marital sex for divorced men. What i would want my children to learn is that sex is not something to be ashamed of when between consenting adults and is meant to be enjoyed.

Now if Mr Adams wants to use Scripture as others have done to make a point that is fine. You can't argue with scripture because it is black and white. Just understand that those who don't believe in your scripture may hold other positions. But if, as Adams laid out all but his last point based on secular positions his 'thesis' does not make the grade.
Tinsldr2@yahoo.com

ok, so i am not a real man
does that make me a girl?

as if being an ignorant. As if being an ignorant Christian gun owner leads to moral superiority. who the hades does he think he is. sorry but this guy is often simply a jerk.

Doesn't Negate Adams
Jack, none of what you wrote negates what Adams wrote.

Also, the Bible does not CONDONE all it RECORDS, but thanks for brining out that tired hit-and-run Bible mocker line.

Will
From one Homo to another thanks for get way off the point of the M. Adams column and thereby making the rest of us look stupid.

Fabius & Joycey...
Fabius: So sex has but one purpose, to procreate, and that's all?? So it's just an evolutionary chance (sorry, I know you don't believe in evolution, I'm sure) that dolphins - one of the most highly intelligent animals on the planet, after humans - have sex for pleasure. And it's just a CONINCIDENCE that it's enjoyable to entice us into populating the earth? This is ludicrous. I suppose it's conincidence that fire is not only warm, but also illuminating...phew, we got lucky on that one.

If you truly believe this, then how do you explain -- with just one example -- the praying mantis that after sexual intercourse, the female bites off the head of the male, killing it? HOW IS THAT ENJOYABLE??? That species would be dead and extinct if they had to procreate according to only what "enticed" them....They'd never have sex, that's for sure.

I truly feel sorry for your wife (and for you) if you've only had sex those few certain times to produce children.

Joycey: Seriously? Sex is just a gift for married people? Young men would not get married if sex was available without marriage??? I don't know what planet you live on, but here on Earth sex IS available without marriage...and young men and women engage in it ALL THE TIME, and somehow, some way, still get married.

A gift for married people? Sheeesh....that sounds all nice and good, but try living in reality, not the "reality" that you'd like to bubble yourself inside of.

Idealistic not Realistic
Here's a fun stat for you Mr. Adams: over 80 percent of the population has had intercourse with someone other than their spouse. Also, pornography has grown immensely over the years and gained acceptance, but according to the department of justice crime has gone down significantly compared to fifty years ago when porn was illegal.

It's clear you're painting a picture of an ideal man in the image that you see him. But the real picture isn't so rosy. Men like sex (and women like it too). Human beings can be promiscuous and monogamous, depending on a multitude of factors. That's how we're wired. To deny it is to deny our own biology.

And the Judeo-Christian mythos is not a good place to preach gender morality. The myths of the old and new testament condone rape, abortion, infanticide, and incest. Read the Bible and you'll see it there.

This is a free society. It's okay to be against something. But don't just spew nonsense and claim it as truth. That's just being dishonest.

Tallil2long
OK. The fact that humans are not a monogamous species does not in and of itself disqualify it from being a moral imperative. If you want monogamy to be a moral imperative for you, that’s fine with me. Have a god time. If you want it to be a moral imperative for me, I will oppose you.

Real Men
Mike is a real Christian. An enormously funny s t r e t c h to link a Black man to pornography (i.e. a bigot) followed by an equally hilarious justification for trying to convince other REAL Christians God wants us to treat women as inferior. Good Job!!!!!

NOW NOW MIKEIE!
Mr. Adams,
Have you been watching the mens session of General Conference again??? You spend enough of your time bashing the Mormon Faith (Latter Day Saints) and yet you spend a good bit of time in columns like this and it is like you were their listening to the talks from the leaders of the church?!? I can not recall you bashing any MORMONS just Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon and yet you are preaching the vary things that every six months we here from PROPHETS, ELDERS, PASTORS and sometime PRIEST'S. Makes me wonder if you are a CLOSET LATTER DAY SAINT who can't give up his cigars and Drink. I could be wrong but I sure have to wonder. I belive that all will be judged acording to their works and their faith the Atonemonment of Jesus Christ will be more than an eye opener for most people who belive that they ARE SAVED or that they are the only ones who are right. Judgement will be interesting to say the least. Anyway Mr. Adams it was a Great Coulmn and you points need to applied in all of our lives just to better men and women....

Oops was it Fabius with the sex problem?
I forget.
Any way David.
THe atheistic/humanistic world-view or religion or philosophy does a great deal of proselytizing. What are you doing right now?
Who controls public education?
Who controls most of the media?
Who makes most of the movies?
Humanist proselytizers that's who.

David, Sex has a purpose.
Marriage and sex should go hand in hand. It is a gift for married people. Obviously young men would not get married if sex was always available without marriage. Men being what they are. I heard about some acting couple say he and his wife had an experiment. They had sex everyday for 3 months straight to see what would happen. Apparently all went well. It wouldn't hurt you and your wife to try the same experiment. I don't see the need to be theoretical about your problem.

will
you need to be stoned now. You are really creepy.

AS A COMPARISON?
Mike,

How about a rebuttal comparative for the ladies side on how real lonely women are to act in their real lives....can't hurt.

Is eroticism porn?
There are many nude statues in museums and even in the halls of Congress. Where does one draw the line?

To David
What I was getting at is this:

You stated that you do not believe monogamy to be a 'universal truth', but in support of that position you offer merely that 'humans are not a monogamous species'.

Yet by your own admission you think it wrong (a 'universal truth', by implication) for humans to harm each other, despite the fact that humans are obviously not a peaceful species.

Therefore, the mere fact that humans are 'not a monogamous species' does not prevent monogamy from being a moral imperative (or 'universal truth'), any more than mankind's demonstrated disposition toward violence prevents peaceability from being a moral imperative.

Reply to Tallil2long
"Humans are prey to all sorts of impulses and inclinations, some of which are very harmful to ourselves or to others."

I agree. I don't think humans should harm other humans, or animals, even if it can be characterized as part of a human instinct. I don't eat meat because I do not want to harm animals. What, specifically, are you getting at when you say this? I think it is morally wrong to have extra-marital sex without your spouses consent, because this would harm your spouse. Me and my spouse are doing nothing that harms the other. If we did, the spouse would notify the other, and we would stop. If my spouse said tomorrow that she wanted me to stop having sex with other people because it started to bother her, I would stop immediately. So would she.
Or are you getting at the pornography thing? What specifically is harming other people that should not be done?

Reply to Fabius
"Saying that you are honest does not mean that you are good."

I agree.

"'Honesty'...is not the basis for a moral code."

I agree that honesty is not the basis for a moral code. I didn't think I said it was. We were talking about morality in relationships, and I brought up honesty as being the closest to an "absolute truth" in that context. I never said that honest was the basis for my moral code.

To David
"I think it is abundantly clear that humans are not a monogamous species. "

It is abundantly clear that man is not a PEACEFUL species, either. Yet we need to work on being peaceful rather than just accepting that we are violent and wallowing in it.

Humans are prey to all sorts of impulses and inclinations, some of which are very harmful to ourselves or to others. The proper response is not to shrug and go on doing wrong, but rather to struggle to live up to higher ideals.

Ten Commandments
Michael, while I'm generally inspired and in total agreement with your posts, I have to question your comment:

"God did not give the Ten Commandments to a woman."

That's like saying you gave your wife's present to the FedEx guy!
The "Comandments" were to and for all, Moses "delivered" -- not based on gender -- but on humble receptivity and obedience.

I think you were really reachin with your "manly" post.

Respectful regards,
Michael H.

Reply to Fabius
"So, you are a determiner of your own morality?
How do you know what is right and wrong?"

My conscience tells me what is right and wrong.

"What is your reference point for judging your actions?"

My conscience is my reference point, and I prefer not to leave this up to another human or some “Lord.” Remarkly, human morality is remarkably similar when not interfered with. All atheists/agnostics that I know, ragardless of culture, have moral positions very similar to mine. That’s because we are all relying on our human conscience, and this turns out to be pretty consistent. It’s only when people give up their authority do these things start to diverge. Misinformation and in-group/out-group thinking are also big factors in morality divergence.

?
This is the oddest thread...

Women as Victims
I noticed that Adams' next column will be about what women do to other women. He just wrote about what men do to women, but he won't be writing what women do to men? So women are always the victims? (By the way, I agree with just about everything in his column.)

As for any of you men who were married in the 1960s or before are still married - congrats and good for you. Unfortunately, times have changed because men have allowed radical feminists to change the culture, courts, and laws enough that it is much more difficult to find a suitable wife in America, and so that marriage guarantees only two things: 1) The spouse who earns more (usually men) will pay the other spouse money, sometimes for life, should there be a divorce regardless of who broke the vows, and 2) The man will be financially responsible for any child born to his wife, whether or not he was a party to the conception. The temptation to be paid for the rest of her life and free of the constraints of marriage has proven too much for plenty of women, who are much more likely to file for divorce. There is no legal obligation or peer/societal pressure for a woman to be a good wife, while men are still expected and required by law to be the financial providers.

http://walrus.blogtownhall.com/2008/08/25/mike_s_adam_on_th ings_real_men_don%e2%80%99t_do.thtml

reply to CVN65
"Is it really all relative? Are there no absolute truths?"

I can’t really think of one right now. I certainly don’t think that monogamy is an “absolute truth.” I think it is abundantly clear that humans are not a monogamous species. The thing that I think comes closest to an “absolute truth” is honesty. I think we should strive to be honest always. Of course, if a mentally challenged person asks me if they are smart, I will not be “honest” and say yes. I will not say “no” either. I will point out the abilities that they have. So even that is not “absolute.” But I am painfully honest to my wife, and she to me. It causes a lot of difficult conversations, but we get through them, and we get stronger because of it, and there are no secrets. I was extremely jealous when I was younger and believed in monogamy, but I grew out of it. I like my life being based on honesty and not what “Lord” or another human tells me to do.

"Is your word as good as the word of the Lord?"

I am the Lord, in my religion. Don’t worry, so are you.

"And, lastly, do words cease to have all meaning when they can be "interpreted" in any way a person sees fit? "

When I hear the word “adultery” I think of having sex with someone other than your spouse without their consent. I would never do this. I don’t think the same word should cover extra-marital sex whether or not you have your spouses consent, because I think these are very different things. If you want to say that my wife and I are adulterers, that is fine. It’s just a word.

To will
"Mike, the reason "god" did not give the 10 commandents to a woman is because the ancient jews who wrote the bloody thing DID NOT CONSIDER WOMEN EQUAL.... "

If the Ten Commandments were given to MEN, then the scriptures were speaking to MEN when they say:

'You shall not commit adultery'
Exodus 20:14

Further, the bible says to MEN:

'But a man who commits adultery lacks judgment;
whoever does so destroys himself.'
Proverbs 6:32




"Ancient jewish men at the time who were caught in adultery were not harmed."

Oh? Read on, will:

'If a man commits adultery with another man's wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death.'
Leviticus 20:10



Finally, if OT Israel was misogynist as we would define it, God was working on that problem through the inspired authors of his scriptures:

'A wife of noble character who can find?
She is worth far more than rubies.
Her husband has full confidence in her...
She gets up while it is still dark;
she provides food for her family...
She considers a field and buys it;
out of her earnings she plants a vineyard...
She sees that her trading is profitable...
Her husband is respected at the city gate,
where he takes his seat among the elders of the land...
She makes linen garments and sells them,
and supplies the merchants with sashes.
She is clothed with strength and dignity..
She speaks with wisdom, and faithful instruction is on her tongue...
She watches over the affairs of her household...
Her children arise and call her blessed;
her husband also, and he praises her...
Give her the reward she has earned, and let her works bring her praise at the city gate.'
Proverbs 31:10-31

Note that the ideal wife runs the household, engages in industry and commerce, and is even given part of the credit for her husband's success and stature!

You do err, not knowing the scriptures.

inkling revival from 3:51pm
I just scanned the first 20 posts on this thread and found only one that even mentioned that bit about the gay diver's performance, so shoes is just flat-out wrong...

Let's see: GM's post at 1:55pm - "Will is in company with Satan"

And it really started with John at 11:59am, writing: Why do I have this feeling that all these gay posters trolling TH "admire" Matthew far more for his body than they do his diving skills! These swishy little queens probably play and replay that Youtube video 24/7! Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwww!!!!!!"

This is the only reason I even brought it up, so, no I'm not flat-out wrong. I was commenting to John when I made my response.

As to you thinking I'm gay, my wife would probably disagree with you as we will celebrate our 2nd wedding anniversary on October 7th of this year. We have our ups and down but couldn't be happier.

The truly funny part is that people like you like to think that if someone defends another person, then they must also be very simliar to that person. I like to defend the rights of everyone on the planet being equal in the eyes of the law. So while I am not gay, I respect their wants to have equal rights.

I don't know who Will is, and if he's a troll, you may be right? Who knows? But there are trolls on both sides...

Off topic
Whew, did this thread get off topic. But this happens every time Dr. Adams writes about anything concerning morality. At least Will didn't hijack the thread this time.

Fabius
That was odd.
Sex has the duel purpose of keeping marriages together and procreation. When procreation days are over sex is still necessary for a healthy, happy, close relationship. Sex is physical and mental and spiritual since we are all of the above.

John
"Sticking one's male member into a pile of feces is not too far removed from sticking your cold hands into a warm, steaming pile of s*it - just because it "feels" good."



Thank you. Spread the word so guys quit asking me why I don't want to be on the receiving end of said act.

David
Is it really all relative? Are there no absolute truths? Is your word as good as the word of the Lord? And, lastly, do words cease to have all meaning when they can be "interpreted" in any way a person sees fit?

Seems Every Straight Guy is a Closet Gay
Botsguy wrote, "Ah, the old if you object to gay sex you are a closet gay theory, havent heard that one in .. oh 5 minutes or so."

Sir, on the one hand, doncha find it sort of odd that these homosexuals constantly proclaim the rightness, the justness, the moral urgency of their cause, and when challenged on their deviant sexual behavior immediately label someone a closet gay? Like, what's up with that? Is their idea of name-calling to accuse someone else of being what THEY are? Talk about cognitve dissonance!

Homosexuals Are Inveterate Liars
Shoes states: So, I'm still wondering though if that made John's stomach churn to think of my wife and I doing that. :)"

Shoes, I made my deep aversion and disgust to sodomy quite clear in an earlier post, but allow me to make it even clearer. Sticking one's male member into a pile of feces is not too far removed from sticking your cold hands into a warm, steaming pile of s*it - just because it "feels" good.

Get lost, Bwucie. You're as gay as they come, and you are not a married heterosexual, you fraud.

Did he really say that?
Did Fabius really say this the following? "Nothing of value is created by an orgasm unless a baby is the result. After a man has an orgasm, he wants to go to sleep and forget what a fool he made out of himself. Women want to stay awake and gloat that they have made a fool out of the man."

Bozo and Joycey
Thank for your concern, but my wife and I are quite happy. Maybe even giddy. Weeee!!!!!!!

Fabius Cunctator: Shadow Boxing?
My post previous posts were regarding Mr. Adams and general criticisms. Not to you in particular. I couldn't disagree with you more regarding everything you said in your post at 3:34 pm, but I don't think it matters.

"What is your belief? If you have something better, let me know?"

I don't think that my personal beliefs regarding religion mean anything. My personal beliefs are right for me, and I am sure your beliefs are right for you. I have no desire to have you adopt my beliefs, and I don't know why it's important for other people to try and convert people to their religion. (If I were to guess, I would say these people aren't really that sure about their beliefs, and subconsciously they think that if they can get people to believe the same things as they do, this will hep to validate their unsure beliefs).
In my view, we can have completely different religious beliefs and both be equally "moral". Morality, in my view, is not correlated to religion. I could really care less what your beliefs are, as long as they don't infringe upon mine. And vice versa, of course.

Just in case you didn't know
Shoes offered this observation:

"Secondly, on your above comment of Misty May, I just find it funny that the first poster on this thread got RIPPED by the TH community because he commented on a gay diver's performance. But no one could live with the fact that maybe, JUST MAYBE, the poster simply wanted to congratulate him..."

I just scanned the first 20 posts on this thread and found only one that even mentioned that bit about the gay diver's performance, so shoes is just flat-out wrong...

I take it from your comments, shoes, that you're gay. I cannot understand what it is about gays that makes them seem practically ALLERGIC to truth. The gays I discuss with online are fairly well addicted to misrepresenting, the way you just misrepresented the reaction to will's post (will is a regular troll here, and reflexively turns every discussion into a referendum on homosexuality, so it would not have surprised me if he HAD been ripped a bit. Fact is, though, he wasn't.)

Any ideas?

David
Your wife does not love you. I'm Sorry you do not know what it means to be really happy. I hope you do not have children or neices or nephews or any children in your life. Not even neighbors.

Hey David,
If, in some future scenario, where technology has advanced to the stage where your head could be kept in a vat with tubes running into it to keep it alive and through electrodes attached to your cranium, images of experiences and emotions and the like were pumped into it, would you call that real life?

I would posit that what you and your female partner have is a reasonable facsimile of a marriage but I would not call it a marriage.

It's more what I would call an "arrangement" designed to perpetuate the selfishness you both refuse to relinquish while enjoying the perks of a societally accepted fascade.

To Fabius
May I ask were you born into Roman Catholicism or did you select it. If I am not mistaken, Mike Adams is not Roman Catholic.....but, a Protestant.

bostguy from 3:26pm
HAHA!! Nice one...I guess I should have been more clear, since people here have a need to focus on the actual act of sex, rather than the relationship that people have.

I'm more of a giver and she's more of a receiver in that department, but no, she doesn't complain of soreness afterwards. Of course, that's why it's not an "every time" we have intercourse, it's a once-in-awhile thing. So, no, it's not painful when it's not forced and both people go slow and enjoy it.

So, I'm still wondering though if that made John's stomach churn to think of my wife and I doing that. :)

bostguy
Where the heck was the spew alert you SOB? Funny, funny stuff!

David at 1:47PM, wrote
"We have never committed adultery, using our definition."

As the Church Lady would have said, "How Conveeenient".

Fleetw1978
To whom was that addressed, Dr. Adams? If so, it is not the first time this accusation has been made. In fact, every homosexual poster on TH loves to make just that assertion. They seem to feel that, if they have what may be perceived as a flaw, then everyone must also be flawed. Sort of like the porn addict that thinks everyone else is a porn addict in private. Dr. Adams goes deer hunting; there is no way he could be gay.

shoes
"Or does it sicken you to know that my wife and I both enjoy anal sex"


i know you cant speak for your wife but isnt your butt sore afterwards?

Fabius Cunctator: Honesty vs Morality
If I were to proselytize for my way of life, I would talk about Honesty vs. Morality.

Let's say you have person A who meets a member of the opposite sex and wants to have sex with that person. If person A says nothing to their spouse out of a sense of "morality", they are not being honest, whether or not they actually have sex with that person. I don't think that not confront your feelings or not sharing them with your spouse makes you a moral person. I think a lot of people do this routinely.

If me or my wife meets someone and wants to have sex with them, we will tell the other person and ask them if it is OK. We are being honest to each other, and I see no problem with our morality. I think you have to be honest in order to be moral.

Fleetw1978
Thanks for proving my point! post123

MikeR
John
“every time I see a homosexual "man," I absolutely (sic) cannot disassociate in my mind what it is he does sexually with other men” Now you really sound obsessed. No matter how much it may churn your stomach, you still can’t help yourself. Are you sure you’re not a little light in the loafers?

Ah, the old if you object to gay sex you are a closet gay theory, havent heard that one in .. oh 5 minutes or so.

To:Fabius Cunctator
I have no problem with someone writing an article trying to "convert" me to there way of thinking. The issues I brought up were:
A) An individual who referred to Iran's "insidious expansion campaign" to convert people to Shi'ism. I doubt if that same person would have a problem with Mr. Adams' proselytizing. If Mr. Adams can try to convert me to Christianity, why is Iran trying to do the same thing (if it is true, which I doubt) "insidious"? I think the reality for most people in the US is that someone trying to spread Christian values is "moral" and "spreading God's word," but trying to spread Islamic values is "evil" or "insidious." I do not agree with this in-group/out-group worldview.
B) If you are going to try and convert me, you will have a much better chance being successful if you use facts and give reasons for why I should change my mind.
C) If you give reasons that are fabricated and not supported by facts, you will not change my mind.
D) If you use reason that are fabricated or unsupported by facts, I think you are being dishonest. I don't think someone that is not practicing honesty should lecture me on not practicing morality.

Fabius...
I'm not putting words in your mouth. I'm quoting you...directly.

Dave said that a column was posted making claims with no proof. You said, "That is what Townhall is all about" without refuting that claims are made without proof.

I'm not putting words in anyone's mouths.

Fabius Cunctator from 2:33pm
Dave said: "Ironically, on another thread someone posted an article claiming that the "evil" Iran is trying to spread Shi'ism throughout the Middle East. The article showed no evidence of this, but that is besides the point. I find it funny that over on this thread we have all kinds of proselytizing going on. If I don't belong to the same religion as you, I cannot be moral. I guess it's not proselytizing if it is the "correct" religion. Funny."

You responded: "Call it what you want, "proselytizing", salesmanship, persuasion, reasoning, or converting; that is what Town Hall is all about."

**
So that's what TH is "all about" in your opinion? Converting & Salesmanship whether or not there's any proof of what you're selling? Well, at least you're honest enough to admit it.

John from 1:43pm
Your answer to whether or not you were proud of an American Olympic diver for winning gold was: "Nope. And the reason for this response is every time I see a homosexual "man," I absolutley cannot disassociate in my mind what it is he does sexually with other men, and it makes my stomach churn. Sorry, but that's the way it is, pal."

Are you just as sickened by two lesbians? Even if they're both really attractive and love each other? Does it make your stomach churn at what they do sexually with each other?

Or does it sicken you to know that my wife and I both enjoy anal sex? Not every time mind you, but there are times when we both just enjoy it. Plus it helps to avoid any unwanted pregnancies. We're both married and heterosexual and we enjoy it. Does this make your stomach churn?

So every time you look at a husband and wife, the only thing that goes thru your mind is the sex? You just imagine what they do to each other sexually and it turns you on? Well, I'm sure I speak for a lot of people on TH when I say that I hope my wife and I don't see you out on the town at dinner, if that's all that goes thru your mind.

As for the "closet gay" thing I wasn't going to say anything at all. You brought it up, not me. Your behavior is resembling that of many men who are hiding a hidden desire that they're ashamed of, but I'm not saying that is your reason. It's probably not, since you're so adamant about it.

proselytizing
Ironically, on another thread someone posted an article claiming that the "evil" Iran is trying to spread Shi'ism throughout the Middle East. The article showed no evidence of this, but that is besides the point. I find it funny that over on this thread we have all kinds of proselytizing going on. If I don't belong to the same religion as you, I cannot be moral. I guess it's not proselytizing if it is the "correct" religion. Funny.

tedmug from 1:41pm
You said: "The olympics are a good example. For example, Misty May is a good volleyball player but why is it really necessary for her to show us her butt cheeks. I am not saying that they are not nice but they should be for her husband to see."

First of all, my only point was to congratualte you on 40 years of marriage. It takes hard work, determination...and yes, some luck, to make it that long.

Secondly, on your above comment of Misty May, I just find it funny that the first poster on this thread got RIPPED by the TH community because he commented on a gay diver's performance. But no one could live with the fact that maybe, JUST MAYBE, the poster simply wanted to congratulate him. Instead, it became "Oh suuuure...I'll bet he was only interested in seeing the guy in his speedo."

But you mention that Misty May has "nice butt cheeks" and it doesn't raise a single eyebrow. Not one for watching another girl's butt, or for not turning away to not look, or whatever.

It's this kind of hypocricy that destroys a certain aspect of the moral fabric as well.

I can easily tell that you haven't been around athletics in a while though. Today's athletes are so well-trained and so equal on so many levels that each person is going to look for that extra edge. And that comes down to gymnasts wearing tight leotards, swimmers wearing speedos, and sand volleyball players not wanting baggy outfits to get in the way of their play. They're not wearing those outfits to tease you or be an exhibitionist...it just so happens that you're the one noticing that.

Again, I congratulate you on your successful marriage. Take care!

Atheists know nothing about morality.
Atheists are always ready to say all actions are okay. And because we think everything is okay that makes us the nice guys. But all actions have consequences. Where will you be when you hand out your bad advice to others and they are suffering for taking it.
All I can say is keep opinions at your cocktail parties so the children in this country have a chance to turn out normal. Every child understands intuitively the concept of natural and good and evil. Try not to pervert them with your corrupting ideas. In other words stay out of the schools, off the television and out of films. Your ideas are more deadly than drugs, alcohol and cigarettes combined.

Forty years
If my wife and I had been married for six weeks only to succumb by any means our marriage would have been a success. "Til death do us part." Forty years is only significant because we are still living. But let me be clear. It is better to leave words such as hope and luck and fortunate out of the conversations regarding longevity of marriage. They are deluding and confusing. They allow for the exit strategy. Too many couples go into marriage with an exit strategy that is not legitimate. The only acceptable exit strategy is death. "Oh, how serious!" Yes it is a serious matter only for the prepared. Lives are at stake.

John
“every time I see a homosexual "man," I absolutely (sic) cannot disassociate in my mind what it is he does sexually with other men” Now you really sound obsessed. No matter how much it may churn your stomach, you still can’t help yourself. Are you sure you’re not a little light in the loafers?

Reply to Joycey
"If you are viewing pornography you are committing adultry in your heart."

I will reply since you addressed me, but I'm not too interested in this thread other than to point out that Mr. Adams alluded to some reasons for having the opinions he has without having any factual basis for those reasons.
As for your sentence above that I quoted, I have no problem with this being your opinion. If that's what adultery is to you, then find someone that agrees and enjoy your life. My wife and I have been wife-swapping for over a decade, and to us adultery is having sex with someone else if the spouse is not there. We have never committed adultery, using our definition. I think people should do whatever they want, as long as they are honest about it. My wife and I have never been dishonest to each other, and we have sex with other people all the time.
If I write an article about my opinions, that is no problem. If I fabricate reasons for my opinions, that is a problem. If I say that people who wife-swap get divorced less frequently, and have no evidence for it and simply made it up, then I am being dishonest. I don't think Mr. Adams is being honest in the way he presents his opinions. He judges other peoples lifestyles, but cannot be honest when he does so.


tedmug

“will their marriages to work” that’s one way to express it. Another of my favorites was “family loyalty”. Yes, they cover a multiple of situations. However, I think you mistook Shoe’s benevolence in his comment. Luck does have a great deal to do with it. Luck is what keeps you from dying in tornadoes, car crashes and of cancer. Luck plays a major part in being able to have 40 years of marriage. That’s why we use the term “fortunate”. Perhaps you don’t know how lucky you are since you never had to bury a wife no matter how much you “willed” it to work or how much you prayed.

reply to svpallava
No, he didn't address it. He alluded to body characteristics, fake boobs, and hurtful things, but did NOT allude to the woman's role in the "real man" failings.

Double Uggers!
Shoes writes:

"Oh my God John! You are the epitome of a false Christian who hates anything associated with anyone homosexual.

Are you not proud of our American diver who took the gold medal in the Olympics?"

Answer: Nope. And the reason for this response is every time I see a homosexual "man," I absolutley cannot disassociate in my mind what it is he does sexually with other men, and it makes my stomach churn. Sorry, but that's the way it is, pal.

BTW, save the "closet gay" schtick - it's getting old. Curiously enough, most of you homosexuals use this as an "insult!" Sort of like a pedophile accusing his detractors of being closet child molesters!

If it's of any interest, I am not a Christian. But I do defend them every chance I get. I would far prefer a world full of committed Christians than a world full of homosexuals and lesbians. Not even close, thank you.

Shoes
you said:
"I think more people realize that marriage takes hard work than you give credit for."

Not nearly enough, my friend, not nearly enough.
And it is hurting our society. It is hurting individuals in our society. Our society is obsessed with sex. Sex is sold like a commodity. The sex act, the promise of sex, the vicarious enjoyment of sex is everywhere. The olympics are a good example. For example, Misty May is a good volleyball player but why is it really necessary for her to show us her butt cheeks. I am not saying that they are not nice but they should be for her husband to see. The small bathing suits she and others wear are not really necessary for volleyball excellence. Seems to me that there is a lot of compensation going on there. It would seem that to be an excellent beach volleyball player one must first be an exhibitionist as well.

David, Shoes
If you are viewing pornography you are committing adultry in your heart. Remember the word "lust". It has caused a great deal of trouble over the years. Pssst and woman know when their husbands are lusting after other women.(it's very obvious and stupid)
There are ways to deal with being away from your wife successfully. Ask men that are successful.

tedmug @ 1:03pm
I guess my use of the phrase "luck" was just an expression. It wasn't meant as "Gee, I hope we're lucky enough to work thru our problems." It was meant more along the lines of "I hope neither of us gets hit by a bus, or develops cancer, or whatever." There are a lot of things outside of your own doing that can prevent a marriage from lasting 40 years... THAT is what I meant by hoping to be "lucky enough".

I think more people realize that marriage takes hard work than you give credit for. Almost every one of my friends that I've grown up with, as well as met recently are married and we're all making it work. It's never perfect, but it's worthwhile to say the least.

That's why I congratulated you!! On your "luck" as well as your skill.

Behaviors
Great column. Could you be specific in what behaviors women who have had many sexual partners exhibit. My guess is lack of desire for their spouse and a general contempt for him.

Shoes
you said:
"Sure we've had ups and downs, and there will be plenty more along the way if we're lucky enough to reach 40 years of marriage."

You see, luck has nothing to do with it! That is the problem with marriages today. Moderns hope their marriages will work. People of my generation will their marriages to work.

Thank you for saying this
Professor Adams, thank you. Men and women need to hear this message. I'm glad that you pointed out that any sensible man doesn't want his daughter or sister to be involved in this business--he knows that it's harmful and wrong for the women that he cares about. It's so true that women are in pain from the commonplace wrongdoing in this part of life. It affects us so much, and this is true because God made us to love and to follow and to help and to take care for others. Women are more easily deceived and men are more naturally the leaders. So, men, act like a real man and stop leading others, as well as yourselves, into evil deeds. We will each of us, man or woman, stand before God and give account one day.

tinsldr2 from 11:50am
First of all, thank you for your service to this country. You are a braver man than I am....of that I have no doubt.

Also, thank you for pointing out that not everything is just black-and-white, right-and-wrong, polar opposites. Spending that much time away from your wife must be hard, and if you're looking at a video to release some sexual tension, then I see absolutely no harm in that, and no threat to your wife or marriage. But the guys like Mike Adams (and his followers/agreeists) want to simply say that it's wrong. Period. There are always circumstances to just about every rule...so for anyone to blindly pass judgment is simply wrong.

You and I probably disagree on most things political, and that's ok. But I respect your opinions and views...and admire your courage to serve in our military.

Reply to Gerald @ 12:14
Adams addressed that in the last paragraph (with a correction of one of his quotes):

"In a future installment, I will deal with the issue of 'real women'. That installment will talk about the things women are doing to hurt other women. 'Real Women' will include, among other things, a comprehensive discussion of fake boobies, why I don’t like them, and how they contribute to global warming."

Only opinions
Not much in this article can be defended using evidence. For example:

"Thus, a 'man' who views pornography is much more likely to hurt his wife by engaging in adultery."

I looked up if there were any papers which correlated pornography users with adultery. To my surprise, I did find a study that found a significant correlation between the two:

Stack, Steven; Wasserman, Ira; Kern, Roger, “Adult Social Bonds and Use of Internet Pornography” Social Science Quarterly Mar2004, Vol. 85 Issue 1, p75-88.

However, even though the two are correlated, this certainly does not mean there is a causual relationship. It does not mean that viewing pornography causes adultery. As one alternative, the paper says that "persons with previous exposure to adultery… may simply have learned a positive attitude toward such behavior, which may contribute to their attraction to cyberpornography. If forms of sexual deviance are related to cyberporn use, the present article cannot determine the exact nature of this association.”

There is no evidence that viewing pornography increases the chance of committing adultery. This guy has a lot of opinions, but none of them are grounded in science.

"Womankind" (#55)
Krystalbird, I do not believe that Mike was saying that the Son of God did not bring salvation to women, but that the "feminist" idea that God is female and a woman must do the work for women is utterly wrong. I doubt that Mike takes issue with Galatians 3:28 nor that he extends this statement beyond the benefits of salvation. (The way some people extend this statement makes it impossible for Christians to have children, since such people deny that any difference exists between male and female.) I have no doubt that MIke himself includes all people in the word "mankind."

John
That’s a very good question. Why do you have that feeling? Also, I’ve heard only some gay guys and teen girls say “Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwww!!!!!!” There might be more in your closet than just clothes.

Good Article
Nice to see conservative values are still in America.

Real Men
About this contamination of the future-wife pool, les be realistic.

Unless its rape, the "future wife" is right in there getting just as down and dirty as the guy --- and enjoying it just as much.

How about a column on "real women" that admonishes them on the flip side of the men issues? It takes two, Dr. Adams, at least unless you fly solo as a course of habit. But that is another column, isn't it?

Great column Mike!
Thanks for the note at the top.

baseballdoc
".....Though the temptation was strong, I never strayed because I did not want to risk hurting my family ...my daughter is 38 and she still calls me Daddy too"

Good for you!

tedmug
Congratulations on 40 Years!! This October will mark just our 2nd anniversary, but it has been a great two years overall....Sure we've had ups and downs, and there will be plenty more along the way if we're lucky enough to reach 40 years of marriage.

But God forbid, if something should happen where we just couldn't stay married any longer and our interests & desires moved in opposite directions (and I don't mean infidelity) and divorce was the only real option to keep us both sane and happy, then I would hope that both of us were able to move on and find happiness afterwards in the arms of someone else... I'm not so stubborn as to not hope that for my wife as well. I work so hard to make her (and both of us) happy, and I'm not going to want her to stop finding happiness if we were to get divorced.

I think that's a tremendous lesson to teach your children, if it ever came to that...in fact, it's a hard subject to broach but it's a worthy lesson to be taught anyways. To have you child know that no matter what happens, you shouldn't ever stop trying to find happiness.

worthless column
When Mike writes about guns and cigars he is at his best. When he writes about the liberal things going on in schools he is ok. When he attempts to be a pastor I just skim through the column if i click it at all.

I have been happily married and faithful for 21 years. I married my perfect mate and best friend. I also am serving in the military with 5 deployments behind me during my 20 plus years of service. Thats a lot of time for a man to be away from his wife and if I watch a video to get through it I still feel like a man. An ADULT knows the diference between fantasy and reality. And while I may fantasize about another woman actually acting on it would be repugnant to me.

While i don't believe in Divorce except in extreme cases (infidelity or abuse), if God Forbid I was ever single again, I would most likely eventually date and Sex would definately be part of the equation. I certainly wouldnt look negative on an adult that has premarital sex or an adult that was single by whatever means (Widow, Divorce, etc)having sex.

If your religious beliefs don't allow you to enjoy your natural desires that way thats fine, then don't based on your beliefs. But don't try to pan it off as some how impunging anyone elses masculinity.

Anyone wishing to reply email me as I wont be checking this column by I am always reachable at Tinsldr2@yahoo.com

REAL MEN HAVE HONOR II

.....RETIRED GEEK ...

.....Second the motion ...when I was young and in my prime I lived in Baton Rouge and did a lot of work in New Orleans ...I had a new car every year, a big home and a great paying job that kept me away from home for days on end ...needless to say I had many oppertunities to be unfaithful ...

.....Though the temptation was strong, I never strayed because I did not want to risk hurting my family ...my daughter is 38 and she still calls me Daddy too .....COLOSSUS

Retired Geek
Too funny.

Attractions and software

My wife and I were walking through a mall, when a 'Perfect Specimsn' of my opposite sex was walking in our direction (she wasn't contributing to global warming).

I walked into a column and bumped my head, I was rubbing my head when I asked my wife, why didn't you say something so I wouldn't walk into the column?

She said "That is your problem NOT mine".

I said - Well I didn't write the 'Attraction Software - I just run it.

Swampy
When all is said and done and that great DVD player in the sky is played back, it is going to be aweful to see the extent that the distortions and misconceptions in relations between the genders have contributed to the rise of homosexuality, particularly in the Post-Christian industrialized Western societies.

Swampfox
I don't think Mr. Adams is trying to pick on women here. I read most of his comments are on the hypocrisy of men in this area. Perhaps I am mistaken.

I personally like Matthew Henry's take on the subject:

"That the woman was made of a rib out of the side of Adam; not made out of his head to rule over him, nor out of his feet to be trampled upon by him, but out of his side to be equal with him, under his arm to be protected, and near his heart to be beloved."=quote

and again:

"Eve's being made after Adam, and out of him, puts an honour upon that sex, as the glory of the man, 1 Co. 11:7. If man is the head, she is the crown, a crown to her husband, the crown of the visible creation. The man was dust refined, but the woman was dust double-refined, one remove further from the earth."=quote

Somehow I don't see an attitude of "treating women as chattel" in these or Mr. Adam's words.
It is those who would advocate women disrespect themselves as a piece of meat who "treat them as chattel".

Men?
I'm sorry to say it's taken me most of my life to even recognize what a man is - and you are correct. Real men do not need pornography. Love Kipling's work. I was 1 of 7 kids in an alcoholic home raised through the Catholic school system. I thank God every day for the contrast I was shown by my beloved Sisters. I hear many say how mean they were. Compare to a drunk parent it's much easier to see their unselfish and angelic characteristics. Unfortunately, I was forced to transfer to the public schools before graduating and lost that daily contact with those whom I now see truly had my welfare at heart. My point is that I had very little, if any, examples of real men. Didn't marry a real man - first or second marriage. Had NO idea how to raise my son to be a real man. I can see now that had I had more reinforcement in my faith I very well could and would have made better moral decisions. I am so concerned about our young women today because I see them not only being exploited by not real men but are seemingly so willing to exploit themselves. I know this is wandering all over but I was trying to be brief. In any event, pornography diminishes us all. What they really n eed is mutual respect.

repug cheaters
Nobody is saying that sex is bad. In fact, Adams is placing far more value on it than you are.

The more valuable the thing is that is wrongfully taken, the more serious the crime.

Real men don't have sex with...
I have to say I agree with most of the above. There is one part I think didn't go far enough. Mike, you say that real men don't have sex with someone they don't intend to marry. I'm going to take it a step further and say real men don't have sex with someone they're not married to.

I do like that the article started off saying that breaking one of these rules in the past in no way excuses men from following the rules in the future. I had, to my regret, sex before being married. I had stopped at one point, and was celibate for almost 10 years until my wedding night. I also struggled with porn addiction for years, and have been without it for some time. Turning from those made me more of a man than any other experience in my life.

Shoes
Just celebrated forty years with my one and only wife. It has been a breeze. Of course not. Forty years together with anyone is a piece of work. It is hard to do. Any regrets? Hell, no! We have worked to provide stability and love and nurturing for three people who deserved nothing less. It would have been a sin to deprive our three sons of that just because of our selfish immaturity. Any regrets? No. I am not a perfect man, but I can proudly and gratefully call myself a man after all. Too many men give in to their sinful natures and can take no pride in their masculinity. They allow their male sex drives to rule them and hurt others. This makes them less than men.

So many good posts
Ernest Your comments are proof that wisdom comes with age. You are definitely not out of the loop, sadly it's the generations that came after you that got out of that loop, each generation straying farther and father.

Mom of 4 Excellent posts. I've been blessed with such a man for 47 years.

Bozo That's the problem, I have two d in laws
that haven't a clue. The younger doesn't understand that true freedom comes from caring for others, from self sacrifice and she doesn't see why she should give anything. She's pretty much stifled any romance, a college grad, working mom she's doesn't understand that wise
women know how to treat a man. He wanted so badly to treat her like a queen, as he's seen his own father treat me.
We used the biblical blueprint for running our house, and these silly girls think they lose
some kind of power, then by doing it the right way..like the old saying, behind every successful man, is a woman. Or the hand that rocks the cradle... Instead they have bought
the feminazi lie, they are as good as any man
and to prove it they have lost their virtue, and cheapened their future marriages.

Real Men have Honor

My wife, daughters, mother and sister and all of the women in my family must be exceptions to the rest of the women in the United States.

All of them are intelligent, attractive and absolutely 'Delightful Beings'.

I have never strayed in 42 years because I could not face my wife or daughters if I did - thay trust me and my daughters still call me daddy - even in their forties.

I have been tempted but would NOT break the trust of my wife and daughters.

Pornography is a NO for me because it debases women and those performers are someones daughters. How can I ask for others to respect my daughters if I don't respect someone elses daughters?

I am responsible to God and family for my decisions and actions.

Real men have honor and stay true to their obligations. If you have failed repent and fail NO more.

John
Right on john!

Why So Few Real Men?
One reason there are so few "real men" is that guys have been raised by their never-married or divorced mothers, some of whom do everything they can to discourage contact with the father and to badmouth the father. What the boy grows up learning is that "irresponsible jerks obviously get sex without responsibilities". Then they encounter females who show off their bodies and are sexually easy and even aggressive.

They look around and see their male coworkers, friends, and relatives who are either miserable in their marriages or had to give up a lot in a divorce, and they ask "Why bother getting married? I can be an irresponsible jerk and still get plenty of women to have sex with me with no strings attached."

I do believe that sex is for marriage, but I also believe our laws and courts have done plenty to discourage men from getting married, and most of these men will have sex anyway.

Matthew Mitcham
Dear Will, I saw Matthew Mitcham on TV the other day and I knew that he was gay before you said it today. For a young man to forsake his masculinity and exhibit feminine affectations is nothing less than a tragedy. You rejoice. You should be ashamed.
Where is his father?

The Downward Spiral of the Culture
DCortez states, "I agree with everything except the porn thing. Maybe he is speaking from personal experience..."

If there's one striking character flaw that defines today's hedonistic liberals, it's that of automatically projecting their own lack of moral fiber and self-control onto anyone who criticizes their behavior. This smug attitude is, of course, designed to relieve them of any personal or moral responsibility for anything they do.

Ironically enough, and Dr. Adams alludes to this in his column, they themselves work day and night to pollute and destroy the culture, and then step back from the mess they created over the last 40 years and say, "See, everybody does it!"

It's not difficult to figure out the social dynamic here, not to mention the progressively worsening situation. If enough degenerates can ultimately persuade everyone else that what they are doing is "normal," then they know they can always point their finger at someone else, and thus never have to feel guilty about anything they do.

This applies as well to the mainstreaming of abortion, homosexuality, habitually foul language, incredibly vulgar music, terribly nasty TV programming, routine teenage sex in all its forms and on and on and on! Yeppers, "everyone" does it, and that's the way they want it!


Swampfox
typical leap to the absurd.

All Christian teaching that I have heard, never say women are chattel. The teaching typically says the husband should be the head of the family and accept the burdens of leadership… and be a “servant leader”. Wives should respect their husband, be a good helpmate, and also be a “servant leader”. Mutual respect and admiration is consistent theme.

Ridiculous feminist distortions twist healthy civil behavior and practices that fit most couples to sound like slavery or exploitation.

Really good column, Mike
Mike, fine job today! Your points are well stated and well substantiated. It is interesting to see how the scoffers come out. I can see through their weakness and false bravado. It is sad; they are so messed up. And they are making a a mess of things. Who will clean it up?

You're on the Right Track, Mike
To write an article that gets such a varied response as this, from both Believers, and unbelievers, and from unbelievers who think they're Believers, readily demonstrates that you're on the right track with your messages!

Keep up the good work!!

VectorRector
There are many good women in the US... the problem is most of them are already married.

Tell the single good women you know to have faith. Tell them to be more up-front with their belief that pop culture sucks and they do not believe all men are evil, or all women are the universal victim. I wish them luck.

I have found my happiness and pray to god both of us continue to build a good relationship. This is the first and only “first marriage” for both of us.

Prior to my marriage with my bride from abroad, I had tears in my eyes on three occasions. First is when my mother died. Second is coming out of surgery for knee reconstruction. Third was after my first chemo-therapy treatment (I am cured 15 years now).

Today, I get a tear in my eye at least once a week when I see my sweet and gentle wife... I realize how fortunate I am! Through determination and thinking "outside of the box" I solved a 25 year challenge.

Sounds like Mike
It sounds like Mike might be headed to the ministry of some church where women are treated as chattel. I wonder what he thinks about all those females being in his classroom? Does he think that they don't belong there?

I'm so sad ...
for the men who have been so wounded by women in today's culture that they feel the only answer is to look overseas for a woman to relate with. I apologize on behalf of my gender. Having said that, I hang with an amazing group of women ranging from 35-50 who honor men, live morally, and take care of themselves. Sure there are size 14s among the size 6s in our gang, but all are fashionable, lovely and caring, if not the sex bombs modeled for the mass culture. Some are virgins -- that's right -- never had sex in their three decades plus. None are prudes, all are world travelers, and all are successful in their careers as actresses, journalists, administrators and health care providers (without being hard-nosed). Rarely do we get asked out on dates. We're out here, fellas. Don't give up.

krystalbird, additionally
"As for Dr. Adams statement that God didn't send his "daughter to save womankind," I always thought the idea of "womankind" was encompassed by the term "mankind," and never needs to be expressed separately. Whu' hoppend? So, therefore, women never got saved?"

I hope you see the flaw in your syllogism, right?

best position...!
THE BEST POSITION...KEEP IT HONEST AND
BETWEEN YOU AND WIFE!AND THERE ARE PLENTY OF SCRIPTURES BACKING THAT POSITION !
smile
elvis

krystalbird
Keep in mind that I stated the women there were also "accomplished".

Being "gentle and quiet" without a concommitant basis for being so can be an imbalance and it may have been that imbalance that produced your unhappiness.

Read Proverbs 31 for a better view of a balanced woman.

FROG
Wow! That sounds hot!! Can you tell me what Chapters and Verses will provide the positions and technique for “many wonderful ways” of satisfaction?

both sexes have issues... but
Both men and women need some training in how to behave and relate to others.

The think that galls me is that it is acceptable to say men need training, but if you say a woman needs training in public... you will be recipient of social wrath from all sides.

bozo
good post.

RW
Good job, RW.

Now the triumvirate is complete.

"will", "LetsAllRelax", and "RW".

Better known as "Moe, Larry & Curly".

Dear Bozo.....
I wish life was so simple as you make it.
I'm one of the "quiet ones" who help the host clear the table, etc., and I can tell you I was one unhappy, mixed up gal.

As for Dr. Adams statement that God didn't send his "daughter to save womankind," I always thought the idea of "womankind" was encompassed by the term "mankind," and never needs to be expressed separately. Whu' hoppend? So, therefore, women never got saved?

Please, one of you men help me out.

RW
Good job, RW.

Now the triumvirate is complete.

"will", "LetsAllRelax", and "RW".

Better known as "Moe, Larry & Curly".

CVN65, two things....
First, I believe Mike's point about post-marrital sex was in relation to still being single. Yes, you can be celibate if/until you re-marry.

Second, in response to your 9:07am post, not ALL American women are as you state. Initially, my wife and I had a rough time deciding who was going to lead. Mostly because I was too passive. As I have learned to assume the leadership role, my wife has responded in ways I never dreamed of. She had a difficult time responding to my needs because I wasn't doing things I was supposed. Obviously that is no excuse for her not doing her part, but I recognize and understand how it plays into her subconscious thinking.

Yesterday morning, we went for a nice walk. when we got home, my wife attacked me and satisfied me in many wonderful ways. She then commented how safe she felt when I stepped between her and a charging Boxer that had come out of nowhere. One well place kick to the jaw sent the dog on its way with a yelp. I had no idea she would respond in such a way. (Now I'm planning on calling friends to have the let neighborhood dogs loose on purpose!).

Sometimes women, and men for that matter, don't fully understand how their innate needs affect their behavior. Go to the creator's workbook for the information. It's called the Bible.

JohnnyP
"Ha ha... and the various reason is they had an opportunity to date American women! "

Unfortuantely, it's not a laughing matter.

The American woman has first been starved of images of what makes for true contentment in their souls and then systematicaly fed images that promise that contenment but which are diametrically opposed to the intrinsic needs of their unique makeup and design. This leads, not to contentment, but its opposite: insecurity, which taints all of their interactions with others.

Yeah, I'm really looking to settle down with a woman that thinks she's a Rambo, a Sarah Connor, or a fighter pilot. Or who thinks the culture is holding her down by promoting the idea of the gentle and quiet spirit in a woman.

Went to a dinner party recently where many accomplished women were in attendance and the one who eventually caught my interest was the one who quietly, and without drawing attention to herself, went and helped the host with the dishes.

I have to wonder
I have to wonder what it might be like to sit in Dr. Admam's classroom.

inkling_revival
"The jeering is all about men who won't hold to that standard, trying to sound hip and clever so their pathetic weakness won't be so obvious."

"pathetic weakness"

Well put.

Am I the only one who finds people who define themselves by who they sleep with sad and kinda creepy?

Real men
I am sorry Dr. Adams, but real men move on after their marriage fails. Not engaging in "post-marital" sex? So, after one leaves a spouse, they should be celibate? The price for leaving an abusive relationship would then be a lifetime alone? Please. I often find wisdom in your words, Professor, but this gem goes a little too far.

Promiscuity and porn are dangerous
I agree – promiscuity and porn are dangerous. They can easily lead to unhealthy views and psychologies.

For me, strip clubs and porn should be avoided if one is married. Those things are probably not good for singles either, but it is more complicated.

Mike Adams' columns...
... remind me of a line from that wonderful old misanthrope Mark Twain: The problem isn't the number of things we don't know, but the number of things we're absolutely certain of that are wrong.
So Adams believe that real men, if divorced by their wife, need to stay celebate the rest of their lives? I can't wait until Adams' wife dumps him, and he faces a sudden reality check.

svpallava
I don't think that that is it at all. American women are downright rude to men. I work with all women in my office and hear a few of them darn near brag about how they don't "give it up" for their husbands. Why do you think there is so much infidelity? If American women gave a rat's petoot about thier husbands' happiness, we would see a great decrease in topless bars, porn and cheating. The fact is that women don't see that they bear any responsibility in responding to their husbands' needs- we are just walking wallets that need to help with the kids and the housework. When they decide that they no longer want us around, they are given the kids, the house and at least half of our income. Women from other countries, particularly developing countries, do not do this; they seem to appreciate their husbands and, gasp, respect them. These are the type of women that men wish to love and revere- the type that you don't feel a fool for being with.

Man & Woman
Excellent article, am looking forward to more of the same.
Being 79 I feel "out of the loop" in today's convoluted social mores. Having grown up in a Christian home and environment, I don't relate to the lack of self-esteem and mental confustion demonstrated by the younger generations.
Homosexuality is a mortal sin as described in the Bible (and also in the Koran). Christ taught us to "love the sinner, but hate the sin." Humankind is God's creation; we each carry within us the Holy Spirit endowed by our Creator. What happens to our soul depends on what happens on judgment day.
Adultery includes viewing or participating in pornography by married people. The adulterer harms not only himself and his partners, but also contributes to the breakdown of social mores.
Sexual promiscuouity by the unmarried reduces them to the level of monkeys, and also contributes to social breakdown.
Those who indulge in adultery, sexual promiscuouity, or homosexuality make poor human beings, and equally poor marriage partners and parents. Children of such unions cannot be expected to grow into morally responsible adults.
Generally speaking our younger generations have lost their way and therefore their perspective of what constitutes all that is good in a human being. They have become amoral. Many believe the liberal hype of group mentality and the "common good" instead of individual responsibility and accountability for one's own decisions involving their moral lifestyle and financial wellbeing.
We can only hope that the various religious movements to restore sanity in our younger generations will succeed in turning the current situation around.
Keep up the good work, Mike. I am convinced that there are enough of us reading and listening to those like you to make a difference for good.

To MikeR
I know a young man who I believe would benefit from the discipline and character in the military, but my biggest concern with recommending it is the loose sexual morality that I see there (not officially, but certainly accepted unofficially). I am afraid that in helping him develop certain parts of his character, the military may end up damaging his ability to have a close relationship with a woman in the future. Make no mistake, as someone who has both struggled with porn and known and counseled other people (men and women) who use porn, it does damage a person's ability to relate to member's of the opposite sex.

omg pron
I agree with everything except the porn thing. Maybe he is speaking from personal experience, maybe he lacks self control, maybe he's the kind of guy that can't go to the beach without drooling. For me, peeking every now and then doesn't turn you into a deviant any more than looking at the stars and wondering about the mysteries of the universe make you an atheist.

svpallava
"increased number of naturalised immigrants who want a spouse ONLY from the "old country" for various reasons. "

Ha ha... and the various reason is they had an opportunity to date American women!

Mother of 4
Kipling's "IF" is the greatest poem in the english laguage. I have a framed copy next to my desk. All men should heed its wisdom.

Reply to Hostile Knowledge @ 01:36
The response to that is much broader than your assumptions; one of the reasons is an increased number of naturalised immigrants who want a spouse ONLY from the "old country" for various reasons.

Add another commandment
Real men do not put ads in 'matrimonial--male' (or US equivalent) nor scan the 'matrimonial--female' section when bride-searching.

(the comparable commandment for "real women" will be posted in response to Dr. Adams' "real women" column).

Mud covered lives.
Which came first the chicken or the egg?
Do rejectors of God hate God because of His moral statutes or do they hate His moral statutes and therefore hate Him.
Men behaving badly all comes down to an unwillingness to allow the Creator to tell them how to behave.
No one really wants to be obedient.
This is who we really are, it is our nature.
We need to be saved from ourselves.
We can't get out of the mud on our own.

Women NOT "Equal"
The notion that women are "equal" to men in America is where most of our problems start.
Men and women are definitely NOT "equal", be it physically, intellectually, spiritually or biologically.
Men are more productive in all of the above. Men are programmed,by nature, to spread their seed as wide and as far as possible, after all, they can have hundreds of offspring annually. This is a natural urge to reproduce.
Men are, again by nature, risk takers, and risk is what allowed us to move from caves to airconditioned/heated dwellings.
Thank God for the difference!

inkling_revival
I am sure the reasons why men go abroad vary a great deal.

Most places outside of the US and Europe have not been completely infected with the feminist ‘chip on shoulder’ virus. Most places in the world, women do not view themselves as the universal victim, and have not been trained from a young age to devalue and resent men.

In many cultures, peaceful co-existence in the family is valued. Aggression and competition is discouraged.

An interesting thing is that the stereotype of the men going abroad is much different from the reality. A few years ago the federal govt studied spousal and fiancée visas, and found that the American men involved have higher than average levels of education and income. The marriages have a higher success rate.

Porn...
...is also the number one cause of ED. So Viva Viagra...I think not.

Slight change with HUGE meaning!
Mike says that men should not have sex with women they do not intend to marry. No, men should not have sex with a woman to whom they are not already married to. Does the term "putting the cart before the horse" mean anything to you?

American Men
American men are like "Pigs";They dirty up all the other "Pigs" in the pen and then complain, that there is no one decent to marry.In almost every case they are correct,fore they are indeed not DECENT...Mr.Adams, I have included you in this most esteemed group.

aspacia
Programmed responses - predictable.

"Subject: Insecure Men!"

Of course it is the man's fault... no other explanation can be found.

"Albeit, I do agree regarding how porn victimizes women"

Of course women are victims... no other interpretation is valid.

Morality
Thank God for a politically incorrect columnist. I am an Orthodox Jew and do not agree with all your beliefs concerning Christianity. But I DO support your moral positions.

Insecure Men!
Albeit, I do agree regarding how porn victimizes women. However, I live in Vegas, and many women choose stripping as they a chunk of money, much more than this poor educator does. For that matter, a valet on a good shift makes more than I do as well.

I make more than my male significant other, and he treats me as an equal. We both play with guns (target practice), and enjoy most of the same activities, except he is a Nascar bug, and I am a political bug.

Geez, men, be thankful that women can now economically, and physically care the family because this relieves you of the full burden.

A Deist

Kipling Understood
If...

Rudyard Kipling

If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;

If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:

If you can dream - and not make dreams your master;
If you can think - and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;

If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to broken,
And stoop and build 'em up with wornout tools:

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breathe a word about your loss;

If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: 'Hold on!'

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with kings - nor lose the common touch,
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much;

If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run -
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man my son!

Why go overseas?
JohnnyP, why are American men seeking brides overseas? Is it the male-hating attitudes of American women? Their self-indulgence? Their independence? I'm curious.

So few real men,
Well said, Dr. Adams.

There are so few real men left in our society of self-indulgence and outright cowardice.

Real men have physical courage to face danger on behalf of those weaker than themselves.

Real men have moral courage to resist evil in all its forms.

Real men have self-restraint to avoid acting in ways that have long-term negative consequences for others.

I'm married to one. I'm trying to raise 3 more. I know others. But nowhere near all the male persons I know are real men.

We need to remember as individuals and as a culture that manliness is a virtue.

There's been the expected snarking...
...but none of the jeering has attempted to explain what's detrimental about men acting in the manner prescribed in Mike's article. I'd really like to hear the attempt.

No, I'm not interested in why you think nobody is harmed by pornography, or your excuses for allowing yourself pre-, post-, or extra-marital sex. I want to know what's HARMFUL about MIKE'S article. What harm has he done by promoting a sensible standard of self-restraint?

I think it's a fair question. The tone of derision suggests that you think he's saying something insanely stupid. So, let's hear it. What harm is done to society by men choosing to hold themselves to standards like those he describes?

The clear answer is, no harm at all. The jeering is all about men who won't hold to that standard, trying to sound hip and clever so their pathetic weakness won't be so obvious.

Hostile Knowledge
Go abroad? I did... and happy that I did.

Many of my male friends whisper to me they wish they had gone abroad also.

There are tens of thousands of American men who have gone aboard to start a family. If you keep your eyes and ears open, you will notice professional colleagues popping up all around you who have slipped the noose and found a good wife.

Why Mike used quotes around "men"
Reply #2 in this thread illustrates why Mike had to use quotes around the word "men." Some fellow named Pilot shuffles the primary responsibility for his moral behavior onto all the women in his life. Good grief, if there are women around who might drop their panties if I ask them, I can't possibly be expected not to ask, right? Pardon me while I spit.

No, Pilot, the responsibility to keep your pants zipped up tight lies with you alone. Women are responsible for their own promiscuity, but they're not responsible for yours. Only you qualify for that.

Yes, we all know how strong is the impulse to chase la femme. Believe it or not, you're not going to die if you restrain it. You may feel uncomfortable once in a while. It's not fatal.

waste of space!
This is only a waste of space to those who are guilty of the acts described in the article. Where there is no moral compass, this is foolishness, but to one who has this compass it is vital food for thought and action!

mrbmrb
When you mentioned a waste of space, it almost sounds like you are talking about yourself. If so, it would be the first appropriate comment you have ever posted on TH.

and brides wear white
what a silly wast of space.

REAL MEN
EXCELLENT piece and advice. Should have wide distribution to the "real men" of this society (sic).

For ALL of us,
"... marriage between a man and a woman is ordained of God and that the family is central to the Creator's plan for the eternal destiny of His children.

All human beings—male and female—are created in the image of God. Each is a beloved spirit son or daughter of heavenly parents, and, as such, each has a divine nature and destiny. Gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose." ... There's more.

Will: Matthew Mitcham
Thanks for the info. He's been spread all over the newspapers, especially as he won a medal late in the games when the Poms were pulling ahead, but I didn't know. After all, I don't read the sports pages. I just look at the pictures :)

Amazing
The so-called "pastors" on TH give us nonsense, like praising Rick Warren and advice on Christians drinking, and we get sound scriptural counsel from a guy in the pews.

Keep hitting them out of the park, Dr. Adams, whether they hear or refuse to hear.

Will, God Did Not
give Octavian, Roman emperor, 27 BC -- AD 14, anything. No, the Senate declared him "divine," and bestowed upon him the appellation, "Augustus." Octavian never liked this "name," but accepted it, because he was issuing edicts, and the Senate was making rules and regulations, to restrict homosexual behavior Whatever gods they believed in, they needed to put the force of divinity behind their edicts, rules and regulations.

Will, Octavian is recognized as the greatest, most successful, ruler of a people, in all human history. His purpose was to help the Empire last as long as humanly possible. Every edict issued by him was to this purpose. His opinion, and that of his Senate, even those in the Senate practicing homosexual behavior, knew it was not a good thing for the Empire.

Will, even atheists, who have an interest in the continuence of their civilization, know that too much homosexual behavior is not a good thing. Wahtever you think is beside the point.

Oooooooh, my HERO...
Oh, Mike, you are sooooo deep and meaningful.

I especially like this bit of hunky, male self-worship '...God did not give the Ten Commandments to a woman. Nor did He send his only begotten daughter to save womankind'.

Hahahahahahahahaha...

An aside to Will:
Mike doesn't get it, so there is no point using intelligent argument with him, the same as it's not possible to 'change' Mallah Ohmar, Bin Laden, the Saudi Moral Police or Dick Chaney.

Women get what they deserve....

*I* didn't put on tight clothes in high school and get good grades -- or do the same in college.

*I* didn't exploit affirmative retribution to get a job I didn't deserve.

*I* didn't have people buying me things or the rest.

Now these women are in their 30s and 40s and not being so cute anymore, aren't able to do this anymore.

So sad....

Like, I care? As others have said, there is a reason why men are marrying foreign brides....

Another homerun, Mike
Great column. I forwarded it to my son, who, strangely, has become far less permissive now that he has a daughter.

When you write about real women, I hope you'll consider that the two post-pill, post-legal-abortion generations have been sold a bill of goods that has left many badly scarred. Don't be too hard on us.

will is in company with satan
He quote scripture selectively as Satan does. He often tries to refute christians with hebrew texts. I suggest will is an atheist Jew but who knows.

and his note to gay posters which includes just himself likely, about the homosexual olympian really says alot about his lifestyle; he says he's awesome as a commentary about how the guy looks in a speedo. perversity is always on his mind. nice one cupcake!

Every subject is not about every one!
It's quite pathetic to read some responses to the "Real Men" article, where those individuals operating in the cult mentality of their personal and imagined religion can't receive a word from others and can't help themselves from throwing out the bible with the bathwater when it doesn't align with their cult belief system and can't perceive its contents when it doesn't embrace what they've chosen to believe. "Beware of the concision" is a bible commandment that they are unaware of. The willfully ignorant cannot see how they reject the bible and its contents, while attempting to use the bible as a weapon against those that believe it and whom also understand its interpretation in context. The bible says something about not being able to beat understanding into a fool with many stripes, and those that cannot understand that godly instruction only applies to those that believe in godly instruction and how its true interpretation applies to us today. Of course the fool thinks that I'm talking about someone other than them!!!!

do real men publicly ridicule the people
they work with?

Nuff said.

did not get the set up for this article
so, is his divorced friend running into a lot of (ex?) porn star/topless
dancers / who have lie about how many people they have sex with?

Is that it?

Because, I have a feeling that is not it.
So, imo the article has nothing to do with the set up.

And "real" men are honest with themselves and other people - come
to think of it so are "real" women.

Men looking abroad...
Maybe somebody should ask why so many men are increasingly going abroad looking for wives.

reply to previous commentor
Buddy, did you kind of miss the point of this article? Had you read Tanakh and/or B'rit Hadashah("Old" and "New" testaments) you would have seen the examples of women large and in charge. You also missed what The Holy Bible has to say about "gay" people. Doesn't say they can't swim, Cupcake. Why don't you address the point of Dr Adams article, and that is responsible, loving behavior, whether you admit to believing The Bible or not. (and for the record, Lev 20:10 states that both the adultress and adulterer must be put to death, not just the woman, or person pretending to be a woman. Please, for your own credibility, either read and understand scripture or quit quoting it)

At Least
You got there first Will. You are notable only because of the poor beliefs you have and your support of the gay/lesbian agenda. You are undoubtedly a loser and with your attitude you always will be. Take your screed elsewhere, like to a far left site. Is George Soros still looking for posters? You might want to check it out.