Townhall.com, Where Your Opinion Counts
Talk Radio:   Bill Bennett   Mike Gallagher   Dennis Prager   Michael Medved   Hugh Hewitt   
BREAKING NEWS  LeftArrow - Townhall.com : Conservative, Political, Republican   RightArrow - Townhall.com : Conservative, Political, Republican  
Columns, funnies & more in your inbox!
  • Check the boxes and send us your email address to receveive your free newsletter
  • Your daily must-read of conservative columns, cartoons and news. Coulter, Sowell, Krauthammer and more.
  • Townhall.com’s weekly inside scoop on what’s happening behind the scenes in the world of politics. When news breaks, we report.
  • Signup to receive the latest daily Townhall cartoons
Monday, July 07, 2008
Mike Adams :: Townhall.com Columnist
My Right to Unlimited Rights
by Mike Adams
Vote on It:
Average Vote:
[+] Text [-]
 
Poll
Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


Not long ago, I was having a gathering of about eight people at my house. The last guy to show up walked right into my kitchen and then protested because he couldn’t find any bottled water in the refrigerator. Next, he complained that we ate all the snacks before he showed up thirty-five minutes late. When he finally came into the living room to sit down, he asked what we were talking about. I told him we were talking about economics, which involves not just demand but supply. I joked that he wouldn’t have to demand any bottled water and snacks if he’d remembered to supply some, too. That drew a laugh from one of our mutual friends.

This trait of being more in love with consumption than production is one shared by most of my socialist colleagues in academia. They base their lives on the idea of taking “from each according to his ability” and giving “to each according to his need.” The problem is that they do a better job of articulating their needs than promoting their abilities. This is, of course, because socialists are generally short on abilities. They seek socialism because they think being guaranteed an average outcome is safer than trying to beat the average in a system based on merit, which is otherwise known as ability.

Anyone watching the 2008 presidential race has doubtless seen a similar dynamic among supporters of Barack H. Obama. Most of his supporters have been talking about rights without any mention of the notion of responsibilities. Like supply and demand, and need and ability, the terms rights and responsibilities are best understood in relation to one another. For example, I have a 2nd Amendment Right to Bear Arms that the government cannot simply take away from me on a whim. But I also have a responsibility for everything that occurs between the time I discharge a bullet and the time the bullet comes to its final stopping point.

But consider the following list of “rights” that supporters of Obama have recently told me that we all have:

Everyone has the right to a college education. I can’t imagine what it will be like as a college professor once Obama implements this one. I’ve been teaching to the occasional unqualified black and the occasional unqualified athlete for years. But now that everyone, including, presumably, the mentally retarded, has a right to a college degree, I might just retire and become a firearms instructor. Hopefully, Obama will not grant a Right to Firearms Education to both idiots and the insane. (Author’s Note: This one came from Obama himself).

Everyone has a right to breathe clean air. This is a really bad idea for the Obama campaign. If everyone starts to enforce his right to breathe clean air in the presence of swarthy young Muslims, Obama might lose an important part of his electoral base.

Everyone has a right to free health care. I recently learned this from an incoming Drexel law student appearing on The O’Reilly Factor. Bill did a great job by asking her whether this right is in the constitution or whether it just comes from the fact that she is a really nice person. She was forced to admit that it was not in the constitution. She should do really well in law school because she’s a really nice person.

Everyone has a right to demand that the rich pay taxes in proportion to their ability to pay taxes. I recently learned this from an incoming Yale law student on the same segment of The Factor. Everyone agrees that the rich should pay more taxes than the poor. What is controversial is the notion that they should also pay a higher percentage of their income in taxes. But that was not the issue in this segment. The issue was whether the existing gap in the proportion of taxes paid by the poor and the rich should be widened and, if so, by how much. When someone says we have a right to tax the rich “in proportion to their ability to pay” they mean “tax them until they can no longer pay” or “tax them until they are bankrupt.” Many people who hold this view were not actually alive during the Carter Administration. But they have taken history classes from people who assure us that he was really not such a bad president.

Every gay man has a right to feel comfortable. I heard this one from a first-year law student at Yale. He actually informed me thrice that his right to be comfortable as a gay man trumps the First Amendment. I guess they don’t teach constitutional law until the second year of the Yale law program. But the question is: How did this sissy get into Yale Law School?

After spending only a little time listening to followers of the Dali Bama I have concluded that, in Obama’s America, everyone gets to declare at least one new fundamental right regardless of whether it is written into the constitution. And so, naturally, I am going to declare first that I have a right to unlimited rights. (This is sort of like making one’s only wish a request for unlimited wishes).

My second declaration of a new right is a little more complicated. First, I believe that I have a right to demand that you show me a copy of the U.S. Constitution every time you demand a new right. And if you cannot identify the constitutional basis of your proposed right, you forfeit that right as well as your right to vote in 2008. And, of course, I get to cast the vote you forfeited.

So, those of you prone to simply announce fundamental rights without any constitutional basis should beware that this could soon deprive you of the right to vote. Until now, it’s only deprived of you the right to sound intelligent.

Share:
Vote on It:
Average Vote:
 
About The Author
Mike Adams is a criminology professor at the University of North Carolina Wilmington and author of Feminists Say the Darndest Things: A Politically Incorrect Professor Confronts "Womyn" On Campus.
 
TOWNHALL DAILY: Be the first to receive Mike Adams' column. Sign up today and receive Townhall.com daily lineup delivered each morning to your inbox.
Yes! In before Will!
The triumph of my week!

The Dali Bama
Oh, that's good. I like that.

The top right on the liberal agenda?
The right to whine incessantly about how the country is so unfair!

Prissy Mike Throws Stones
1.
Mike. Why not consider the guy complaining about a lack of bottled water and "snacks" at a gathering to be a callous jerk and move on? Why do these inconsequential actions have to parlay themselves into a springboard for your (dopey) political allegories? (You're not much of a cogent storyteller, Mike. The "morals" and points of your trumped-up stories always seemed so forced and hammered on. Nothing graceful about how you abjectly pigeonhole "socialists", "militant" gays and feminists, atheists, advocates for gun control. You lack the grace of a true writer).

by the way,
SOCIALISM: the belief or theory that a country's wealth (its land, mines, industries, railways etc) should belong to the people as a whole, not to private owners.

SOCIALISM (American Heritage Dictionary): The stage in Marxist-Leninist theory intermediate between capitalism and communism, in which collective ownership of the economy under the dictatorship of the proletariat has not yet been successfully achieved.


SOCIALISM (Webster's): A theory or system of social reform which contemplates a complete reconstruction of society, with a more just and equitable distribution of property and labor.


2.
Calling the first-year law student a "sissy", Mike? Really. How laughably lame & petty. You post a column week after week throwing your prissy little stones at the gay population and feminists and you call the law student a "sissy" to, again, hammer on a dubious point about "rights" (I don't buy your version of events), you big priss.

Careful what they wish for.
"Everyone has the right to a college education."

I think this one has been over exercised too much already. Look at all the educated idiots we have running around.

"Everyone has a right to breathe clean air."

If a person doesn't feel that the air in the present location isn't clean enough to breith, they have the right to relocate to another area that might meet their standards of "clean air".

"Everyone has a right to free health care."

Does this include hypocondriacs?

"Everyone has a right to demand that the rich pay taxes in proportion to their ability to pay taxes."

Yep, we can "demand" all we want, but when you start forcing others to start forking over their wealth, I believe that is called thievery.

"Every gay man has a right to feel comfortable."

Fine, don't hang around where heterosexual men hang out.

Positive Rights vs Negative Rights
What Mike described above are categorized as Positive rights, and negative rights.

Positive right is a right of something having done for you. Negative right is something having NOT done against you.

For example Right to education is a positive rights, it entails everybody must be provided education or else it is counted as a violation of right to education. Similarly, right to guns is actually a negative right, more accurately defined as Right to not having aggressed against keeping and bearing arms.

Property right is a negative right, the right to NOT having aggression towards one's property, and not "everybody must have property".
IF someone is aggressed against a negative right, that is considered as its violation.

Capitalism is all about negative rights. Socialism/Left-Liberalism is all about positive rights.

Similarly nobody has a right to education though everybody has a right to not be stopped from having education(that is if they wanna go to school, can go to school, they must not be stopped from doing so as it was done under Jim Crow laws era).

Whenever any liberal tells you "oh you violated my so and so(positive) right" just tell him on the face that in America we never had, and will never have a positive right, if he still insist, make some random positive rights on his face "Right of not taking Liberal Cr*p", "Right of having equal money as the person you're talking to".

Liberal Wine
What's a liberal's favorite wine?

Life's not faaaair! I want Obama to fix it noooowwwww!

Rights talk is doublespeak
Since rigts are transactional (meaning they exist in a relationship) talking about rights for a group is usually a covert way of talking about restricting the rigts of another.

Women rights mean less rigts for men
Animal rights mean less rights for humans
People's rights mean less rights for the aristocracy

and so forth.

Obama talk about healthcare, for example, is about controlling cost by rationing individual choice. It increases the power of the Federal government while restricting the natural unrestricted decisions of disorganized individuals. (also known as freedom)

Equally, his educational proposal links federal funding to community service, again an expansion of governmental powers by constricting individual choice.

No dictator is going to ask you to vote him into power so that he may coerce you. Instead they always talk about abstract "rights."

The rigts of the "poor" (a constructive abstraction)
The paradise of the proletariat (bordering on fairy tale) etcetera,

"New" Rights Are Real
Aside from caricaturing progressives' efforts, commendably often successful, to have government and our society recognize and uphold "new" rights that clearly are vital in the 21st century, Mike S. Adams and much of the right-wing claque--dare I use Rush Limbaugh's silly but tellingly accurate term and call them "dittoheads"?--they ignore the realities that impel recognition of such rights.

Properly understood in a modern industrial and technological society, the rights vital for individuals to enjoy true freedom and justice are not solely traditional negative rights under which government is justly forbidden to intrude upon certain spheres, such as freedom of speech or religion, or freedom from arbitrary imprisonment; those rights also include affirmative, positive aspects of life that require action by government and others, including society generally. to realize--including, yes, social and economic rights.

They also include rights of individuals against arbitrary or unjust treatment by other private actors, including both other individuals and corporations. The logical locus for enforcement of these rights, of course, is democratic government.

Lest anyone doubt that these rights indeed are protected under the United States Constitution, look to much of the whole of American history from (and especially) the Progressive Era and the New Deal, not to mention the 14th and, importantly, the Ninth Amendments to the Constitution.

To reclaim the rights we have lost or found endangered over much of the last 30 years or so, especially under the shameful regimes of Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush, we need and will have a New New Deal, if not a Second American Revolution. Be part of it.

Scott Enk

A Proud Liberal and Shameless Agitator!

senk8105@sbcglobal.net

Gruntz a shameless agitator
Unlike a lot of sissies, he had the cojones to state his view here.

After I quit laughing because I mistakenly thought it was a satire response, the man actually believes his own drivel.

According to him his correct, indisputeable drivel trumps anything else.

Dr. Adams makes a good point with humor to help it along. Gruntz here is unashamed to respond to it in the stupidest fashion possible, further explaining the point of this column.

Appreciate you weighing in Gruntz but in the future post something factual rather than ideological. And keep posting, it is amusing.

I forgot about Will
Will tried, he really did, but the word 'prissy" did it. Somehow it had to relate to Will's professed homosexual preference. And Will couldn't stand it and told Dr. Adams off, the beast.. Has Will ever posted anything that did not have something to do with homosexuality?

The liberals
Are huge skinflints when it comes to helping people out of their own pockets but love using (abusing) the power of the government to enforce their fairness patrol doctrines.They empower themselves by manufacturing victims and then giving those victims super rights.Where the heck did immigrants rights come from,especially illegal ones.Affirmative action and hate crimes should be unconstitutional because they violate equal protection under the law. Hate crimes are even more egregious as they punish thought..To a liberal the constitution is merely a guideline not a chiselled document. To them dipping a crucifix in urine is a fine example of free speech but talk radio isn't. Diversity is based on skin color and group think rather than free wheeling discussions and a diversity of opinion.Liberals are the ultimate paradigm thinkers.Nothing is allowed to violate those prisms no matter their aversion to comon sense.Obama is so anti-traditional America it gives me an impulse to take anger management classes every time I hear him speak.

Teachers Unions
are against merit based pay. Why? Because it invades their paradigm of fairness. Suppose teacher A drew a bad straw of students and teacher B drew the good straw. Why should teacher A be punished over what they had no control over? Some people might look at it as a cahllenge to turn the bad straw students around but not a liberal.Liberals also hate the idea of personal responsibility and despise being evaluated on performance.Gairness in and of itself is inherently unfair because it rewards under achieving.There's a parenting crisis in this country today because kids manipulate their parents guilt into giving them undeserved rewards because Billy down the street has one.When these kids get to working age they don't think it's fair to have to work for something. Finally the parents get fed up with their super dependence and throw them out of the basement. This is what Obama's appeal is, the permissive parent.In my opinion spoiling a kid is a form of child abuse because it doesn't prepare them for the real world.

we have generations of people
here who have been promised their "rights" by a left wing press and the communist party of Democrats. They have a right to anyting they want as long as they are in one of the "protected" class of people that support the commiecrat party.

The biggest dichotomy
It's curious that the wish list of any lib special interest(yes, that's exactly what they are) is articulated under the guise of rights. Think (fill in the blank group) rights, be it welfare recipients, gays, ethnic minorities, or whatever. What these groups want are actually privileges not rights. The big difference is that every right you can name is accompanied by a commensurate responsibility. Privileges have no strings attatched.
One other set of concepts that libs frequently confuse is opportunity and outcomes. When a desired (by libs that is) result is not distributed prorportionately among all segments of the population, it has to be due to discrimination. Next follow quotas and affirmative action campaigns. What a pantload.

Rich Professors Supporting Obama

Sometime do a background check on who is supporting Obama - around here it is those with six figure incomes.

*I* don't have a six figure income - I want my right to confiscate the property of the rich leftists. And they had better be careful lest we get a true populist movement in this country where it isn't me saying this in jest but a real attempt in real life.

Why can't we tax Birkinstocks?

In life there is no fairness...
Is it fair that I'm not 6'4" tall and weigh 240 lbs and playing middle linebacker for my beloved Cowboys? Is it fair that I'm not blessed with Brad Pitt's looks and making $20 mil a movie? Is it fair that I wasn't blessed with the talent for music that any well known musician has? Or that I don't have the out of this world intelligence that Albert Einstein was blessed with? No. I am blessed with the talents, skills, looks and personality that God chose to give me. Do I look to the courts to legislate fairness and hold back others that are more blessed with those talents and skills that I don't have? Do I look for the government to tax people that have more than me based on their use of these talents? By all means NO! Equality of opportunity is what this country was built on (yes I know the howls that will bring from the left side of the aisle on issues like slavery and women's rights but for the most part these have been rectified in the last 44 years). There will never be equality of outcome due to the fact that we are NOT all created equal. You can give two people the same opportunity and you will get two different outcomes due to inclination, talent and just random circumstances. The only way to ensure equality of outcome is to eliminate equality of opportunity. And that my friends is the biggest drawback to socialism, communism and any other so called equal society that you may have.

Liberal Views
When I asked one of my liberal friends why he was voting for Obama, he answered that he was Democrat. When I asked him if he also believe in income redistribution he said yes, we should help less fortunate people. Then I asked him why he went out of his way to hide his income and pay no income taxes, he said as long as someone else paid the taxes it was ok....just not him. This mindset is what we are combating. Oh...by the way, he makes over $250,000/year.

vote rights
Where does the constitution give you the right to vote? There is an Equal Rights ammendent but I can't find the "Right to Vote" in the constitution.

About those abilities...
The people who are waiting for BHO to line their pockets at the expense of the wealthy are in for a shock. Already, he and michelle have announced 100 hours of community service to get a degree and 50 to get a GED. That's service in an abortion clinic or some other approved liberal cause of course. Military service or police service or such will NOT count.

Everyone's right to a college education.
I had to laugh when I read that one. Mike, you should have been at my house when my husband and I told our new "financial advisor" that, no, we did NOT want to start saving for our children's college education....and then assured him that we did NOT want to set up a college fund for our children...and then reiterated that we did NOT intend to provide for our children's college education...and then, etc.

I think you would have enjoyed the expression on his face as much as we did. Our view is that, if our children decide to go to college, there's always the service academies, GI Bill, and other ubiquitous scholarships, grants, and loans. If the granters of such look at our children's records and decide they're not a good investment risk, who are we to argue with them? As loving parents, we're biased in favor of our kids, but supporting their college education when they're young, healthy, strong, and optimistic and eager enough to take on the world limits our ability to support ourselves at a time when we're no longer young, strong, and eager to take on the world.

Dear Mr. Gruntz
Please read "Animal Farm" by Orwell. It's an entertaining story, even if you don't know about allegory. When you study it and read about the character "Boxer," think about you and me. (I'm assuming that you work) Note how well he was treated by the "more equal" rulers. That is your future after the revolution you predict and pine for. Lastly, think about... glue.

Hand up
not hand outs.

There are plenty of people out there that need a hand up at one time or another. Those are the proud folks that find a way to stand up on their own two feet, vice the worms that want hand outs.
Susan, I know a couple of pukes here that are the same as the person you describeb. They're also voting for Obambi.

Why just soak the rich?
I often wondered why those "fairness and justice" types don't just do themselves what they demand of us. If you think the planet is destroying itself with carbon, then simply boycott everything made or delivered with carbon
energy.If you think more taxes are needed to help the needy, then give from your own pockets and spend your days at shelters washing the homeless or whatever. If you think negotiations with terrorists will work, walk the ghetto streets of East LA at night and talk to the nice people there who confront you. If you think the planet's too crowded -leave it voluntarily. If you think jail is too harsh, march and demand a law to release violent felons to your personal neighborhood. Need I go on?

Everything you think is how to screw up and control the lives of those of us who don't agree with you.

Mr. Enk...
Perhaps you might consider this quote from Professor Gary Galles of Pepperdine University.
"How can there possibly be liberty and justice for all, when, in the name of justice, people claim rights to income, food, housing, education, health care, transportation, ad infinitum?
We can't. Positive rights to receive such things, absent an obligation to earn them, must violate others' liberty, by taking some of their income without their consent. They are really just wishes, convertible into benefits for some only by employing the government to violate others' rights not to have what is theirs taken.

Hand Up, Not Hand Out Yes!
Great comment...hadn't heard in a long time...needs to be repeated loud and often.

Susan
was your friend John Kerry ?

sparky
Hmmmm, forcing one to perform in a setting not of one's chosing - such as having to perform "community service" in order to "graduate". Isn't this simply a form of slavery?

There seems to be so many "out in left field" opinions here that one can not address them all and still have a life.

Larry (Can't find "Right to Vote")
Try Article 1, Section 2:"The House of Representatives shall be composed of Members chosen every second Year by the People of the several States" "chosen by the People" sounds like a voting right to me.
How about Section 4:"The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof"
Article2, Section 1:"The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America. He shall hold his Office during the Term of four Years, and, together with the Vice-President chosen for the same Term, be elected, as follows:" He's elected, which kinda, sorta means the People voted, right?
17th Amendment:"The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, elected by the people thereof, for six years" Larry, there's that same phrase again: "elected by the People"

Of course, the 14th, 19th, 24th, and 26th amendments specifically address, and I quote "the right to vote...shall not be denied...or abridged".

Although there is no specific Article, Section, or Amendment saying "The People have the Right to Vote", the subject is certainly mentioned, which is more than can be said for the so-called "rights" MIke mentioned.

What is a "Right"
A "right" to a conservative is a restriction on government power

A "right" to a liberal is a benefit provided to some and the expense of others.

Will: Wealth comes from Labor. A country can have vast natural resources, but they don't become wealth until somone makes something USEFUL (and thereforte valuable) out of them. o matter how you slice it, the Liberal version of a "right" involves the involuntary confiscation of the sweat of someones brow (this is how Lincoln defined slavery)

Gruntz: You obviously don't understand the theory of Constitutional Government. You, like Obama, believe in an interpretation of the Constitution that was
1) specifically repudiated by Adams, Jefferson, Madison, Jay, Hamilton, and Paine
2) Felt to be dangerous to Liberty by those same men
3) Specifically repudiated by the Ratifying conventions
3) Breaks the Separation of Powers, joining the Legislative and Judical Functions together
4) Renders the entire system non-sensical and moot

In a Constituional Government, Gruntz, the PEOPLE are the ultimate power. The People never agreed to live under the system of rights you propose. The current "rights" you speak of are usurpations (just read the 10th amendment) You simply want to use the despotism created by Judges deciding what the Law SHOULD mean to violate MY RIGHT to have the AGREED PROCESS for CHANGING THE CONSTITUTION FOLLOWED.

Susan
if I'm not mistaken, the first time I heard that comment was in a John Wayne movie!

essie
are you trying to confuse Larry with some well known facts.
Shame on you!
LOL

Right to Vote?
There IS no RIGHT TO VOTE.
The Constitution left sufferage entirely up to the States. Amendments have made it illegal to refuse sufferage based on gender and Race.

Otherwsie this is within the regulatory domain of each state. Children do not have a right to vote, because they don't have the judgement or ability to take care of themselves. I just wish Adults who behaved in the same way were also denied....

Can I demand my "rights" now too?
Like the RIGHT to have my vote counted, and tallied, even though I voted absentee ballot because I was out of the country in Kuwait on military orders! (Florida 2000, New Mexico 2000) Should I go on?

I DEMAND that EVERYONE that is LEGALLY eligible to vote, takes a test to ensure that they understand the issues, not remember the Madison Ave. PR team's 10 second commercial. Before voting. This can be accomplished discretely and privately. They pass the voted ballot is recorded.

I demand that each voter only vote once, per election. Not volunteer to be driven to more than one polling location to vote repeatedly.

I DEMAND the RIGHT to have citizens, and residents RESPECT the flag that might well be my casket cover. It is not to be burned in protest (although the reverent burning of an old flag by the Scouts is okay by me), trampled upon, worn as clothing, draped like a curtain, or otherwise abused.

I insist that EVERY PERSON pay their fair share, in taxes, or in community service. No more lazy welfare queens, meth addicts and crackheads. Get off your butts and get to work.

Our prisons are full of criminals, build more. I would rather see another prison built than release "animals" to prey on society. For those criminals in prison that are making the effort to change, I would support them. If for 5 years AFTER release, they are not back in prison, have been paying their taxes and contributing to society give them all their rights back.

Those that "WORKED" their lives however, I feel shown not have to work themselves into the grave. The severely injured and maimed, if they wish to, and many I personally know do, I want to see them respected for their sacrifices and not shunned into dead end corners at work.

Good column until the end
People are uncomfortable with gays and lesbians. I would suggest the next time you go on that 3 day hunting trip tell your buddies that you are gay.

One new freedom that I would like to have this political season is not have watch endless/pointless political campaign commercials.

Liberal Views
Several of my clients are liberals, entrepreneurs who make 6 figure incomes, who have benefited from a healthy economy. They all try to pay as little taxes as possible, but they are always for the government doling it out to people who haven't earned it. They just want the government to 'pay' for everyone's health care, including the illegal immigrant's. But they all hate Bush and will vote for anyone Democrat. Try as I might I cannot convince them of their erroneous ways, so I am devoted to ensuring that conservatives will make it to the polls this November. It is sooo critical this year...and I thought John Kerry was bad. *And no, my friend wasn't John Kerry. He's got his wife to support him. :o)

Susan, why is that thieving scum
your "friend"? I have some liberal friends, but none of them are tax cheats and scofflaws. You should turn this scumbag in to the IRS so he can provide "according to his ability". I bet he also doesn't give to charity either, does he? He has the right to go to jail!

Oops, did I restrict his, or your, right not to be offended? Isn't that what the first amendment says, that everyone has the right to not be offended?

Neo kommies = neo slaveowners...
...Notice how so many of the "rights" these neo kommies (they are not longer "liberals") desire have to be provided by their fellow citizens. "Free" health care means enslaving the doctors, nurses, indeed the entire health industry, to suit their "right". Even with unions (think NEA, the teachers), it is the administrators (government bureaucrats) who get the top salaries.

Any other industry would be the same. Big Oil? Let Big Government control that, too - after all it is our "right" to have free, unlimited energy.

Food? Big Government should be in charge of that also.

Tax "the rich" totally out of their wealth. And then? There's no more wealth around to tax. Think about it, irrational lefties.

The rights expressed in the Declaration
of Independence are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. There is a practical order in the expression of these rights. The Constitution enumerates specific prohibitions directed at the government in order to insure the preservation of these rights.

How can there be a right to a college education, for example, when it has nothing to do with any of the fundamentals expressed in these founding documents? You could say that it comes under the heading of the Pursuit of Happiness, and that would be correct except for the expression of the right. Correctly stated it would be that you have the right to not be denied a college education should you meet the requirements of admission, including the ability to pay. That means that the right is already accepted and intact in today’s society.

Your right to the Pursuit of Happiness does not trump my right to Liberty or Life. My right to Liberty does not trump your right to Life… and so forth. That, of course, means that you can darned well pay for your own education. Stay the hell out of my pocketbook.

Negative Rights / Positive Rights ???
What a load of faux-intellectual horsecrap.

As far as Socialism goes. It has been a documented historical failure; over and over again. Socialism is just a step on the path to Fascism / Communism. Hundreds of millions of victims of Socialism and it's progeny, bear mute witness from the grave of the "Negative Rights" of being subjected to Socialists loving attentions.

My "Rights" are detailed in the U.S. Constitution & Bill of Rights. My 2nd Amendment "Rights" ensure that all the rest of my "Rights" are secure from all you "Great Thinkers" out there. If you guys are really sincere believers in Socialism , Negative Rights, Positive Rights ect ect; there are several Socialist countries out there for you to move to. Please.

As far as FDR's "New Deal" goes. FDR was a cunning, powerfull political animal and an economic idiot. FDR's "New Deal" policies extended the duration of the Great Depression by years. LBJ followed along in the late 1960's and established the "Welfare State", as we know it today, to the lasting detriment of those he was supposedly helping. Individuals can't be "gifted" out of poverty; that is a historically proven fact. Individuals can however be educated into the expectation and the actuality that hard work will be rewarded by success in life.

You have the "Right" to work to better yourself and to expect the protections of the Constitution / Bill of Rights to give you even footing to work from. After that everyone is on their own; win, lose or draw.

Dwain Cleveland

Adams
Very well said. I am increasingly aggravated by the lefty's shouting out all the "rights" they deserve. Talk to a person on welfare, and what will you come away with? They will be trifling on about how the government owes them, or this person owes them, or another owes them. The liberals are continually forcing the burden of their policies on the fewer and fewer people left working in the private sector. What is going to happen when over half the country works for the government?

There is no right to an education, let alone a college education. If we continue to help people who will not help themselves, we will fall to the waste side in bankruptcy. As SSGT said...hand up, not hand out.

SSGT
The best line in a John Wayne movie was in The Sands of Iwo Jima:

"Life is tough. It's tougher if you're stupid."

The Left should listen and understand.

I like Mike

If I weren't a lesbian-trapped-in-a-man's-body, I might think Mike and I were soul-mates.

Seriously, the rights enumerated in the Constitution are balanced by a fearful responsibility that accompanies each right. Those responsibilities are not enumerated; they are presumed to be understood by reasonable people who wish to exercise those God-given-Constitutionally-expressed rights.

Spidey-3:53
Very well said. I see that no one has tried to refute what you wrote-because they can't. It should be required reading.

spacecadet-7:39
Also, extremely well written. You and Spidey should teach a class. I've never understood the hatred and jealousy aimed at the productive. I have always strived to learn from someone successful. Ironically, the wealthy the left does not despise are the "truly" lucky ones. Actors who make a ton of money with no discernable or substantive contribution to society, are praised. Executives who actually bring substantive contributions to society are reviled by liberals. Why don't liberals want a cap on what Hollywood or an individual actor can earn? This makes more sense than punishing the productive.

Positive rights vs. Negative rights
Mike, your column highlights the difference between positive rights and negative rights:
http://www.johnlocke.org/lockerroom/lockerroom.html?id=8162

In short, positive rights are rights that are conceived in the minds of politicians and are bestowed by government; they tend toward statism because they need government to take things away from people in order to give them to people.

Negative rights are rights that are inherent in individuals themselves (among these are the rights to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness) and are bestowed by Creator God and must not be taken away by the government. They tend toward freedom because they limit government's ability to take from people.

I Don't Know About You, But
I have a right to drive a car in a city free of elitist bicycle pukes!

There are very few actual
Constitutional Rights -- even including the Bill of Rights and all amendments. Most people, even law students, sad to say (having taught many of them) do not understand that the Constitution mostly limits the power of the federal government, grants certain rather limited rights to individuals, and leaves most powers to the states. There should not be any substantial "federal common law" (although sadly there is a ton of it -- including, for example, DOMA), and there is no Constitutional right of privacy and, hence, no Constitutional right to an abortion. As the SCT just rules, the right to bear arms probably an individual right, though it was not crystal clear. Despite what various courts have ruled, because of the "badges of slavery" language, the status of black people as a protected class may well be higher as a Consitutional matter than any other group. I mention these various things only because if you actually read the Consitution, you find that both the left and the right have been quite wrong about what the Constituion actually says.

Will
Being gay doesn't make a guy a sissy. Being so fragile that you think your "right to be comfortable as a gay man trumps the 1st Amendment" makes you a sissy.

Haircuts
On the subject of demand vs. supply:

One day a florist goes to a barber for a haircut.

After the cut he asked about his bill and the barber replies, "I cannot
accept money from you. 'I'm doing community service this week." The florist
is pleased and leaves the shop.

Next morning when the barber goes to open his shop, there is a thank you
card and a dozen roses waiting for him at his door.

Later, a cop comes in for a haircut, and when he goes to pay his bill the
barber again replies, "I cannot accept money from you. I'm doing community
service this week." The cop is happy and leaves the shop.

Next morning when the barber goes to open up there is a thank you card and a
dozen donuts waiting for him at his door.

Later a Republican comes in for a haircut, and when he goes to pay his bill
the barber again replies, "I cannot accept money from you. I'm doing
community service this week." The Republican is very happy and leaves the
shop.

Next morning whe n the barber goes to open, there is a thank you card and a
dozen different books, such as "How to Improve Your Business" and "Becoming
More Successful."

Then a Democrat comes in for a haircut, and when he goes to pay his bill
the barber again replies, "I cannot accept money from you. I'm doing
community service this week." The Democrat is very happy and leaves the
shop.

{Get ready - You're going to laugh out loud}

The next morning when the barber goes to open up, there are a dozen
Democrats lined up waiting for a free haircut.

And that, my friends, illustrates the fundamental difference between left
and right.


will
You really priss me off!

Weisshaupt in CO
Congrats on your views. I agree but there is something else that a lot of folks don't take in consideration and it lies in Article V of the Constitution.
"No State without it's consent shall be deprived of it's equal sufferage in the Senate"
Yet members of the 39th Congress meeting in December 1865 refused to seat the 22 Senators and 58 Representatives from the 11 Southern States 7 of which had just help ratify the 13th Amendment.
The war was declared over in April of 1865 when General Lee signed the surrender.Right?

Rights
I have the right to free speech without limitation by someone's interpretation of political correctness. This election has been characterized by hyper-sensitivity to anything even remotely associated with race, to the detriment of meaningful discussion about the issues. For example, black racism is real and we have the right to discuss whether the candidates support extremist racial positions. Radical Islam is a real threat, and we have the right to discuss whteher the candidates support Islamic beliefs over religious freedom.

Unfortunately, the Obama cult crys foul over any such discussion.

negative vs positive rights
The Federalists argued that the Bill of Rights were unnecessary, as rights were inherent (negative) and that the delineation of rights in a formal addendum to the Constitution would lead people to believe that their rights descend downward from the central government. In other words, its flawed to assume that because a right is not outlined in the Constitution, it does not exist at all. That is why Madison insisted on the 10th Amendment.

I disagree with Adam's implied argument that only positive rights are justifiable, but I agree that a right to one's property (upon which this country was founded) cannot co-exist with "rights" to other people's property.

Gruntz the blind
Mr. Gruntz "evil private corporations" don't come to your house and use snipers to put a bullet through the head of your baby, your dog and your wife, that is a function of government.

It is a significant difference.

Goggle; Janet Reno:Rubby Ridge
Goggle; PolPot:Killing Fields
Goggle; Robert Mugabe

Why is socialism popular?
Adams notes people vote for equal outcomes because they fear to be rewarded according to their ability. This mindset is becoming more prevalent, and self-reliance less prevalent as society becomes more complex. A farmer knows dang well he doesn't want to trade his own judgement for that of someone far away who will not be punished/rewarded for the outcome. An assembly line worker seeing no result from good or bad effort, may well vote for a union's promises, or the siren song of tax the rich. Our schools are failing miserably in creating self-reliance and accomplishment in our children. I don't mean feel-good words about diversity and universal self-worth. I mean actual accomplishments so at each level the student can see the results of effort and feel that satisfaction that comes from control of one's environment. Kids that know their merit will be rewarded seek politics that reward merit.

On the subject of rights....
Let's take health care as an example. You say you have the right to health care...What if I don't want to become a doctor. What if no one wants to become a doctor...do you force someone to become a doctor?

A right is a right only if it is available to everyone with NO obligation on anyone else to provide it. As someone else said earlier, rights are being confused with privilege.

WiseOne - loved the joke!

LMAO
A racist, homophobe LMAO a perfect conservative Thanks I will keep this piece on hand to show the few people still remaining on the fence

Hal Drunkahue
Shut Up, Take a Hike ang Pull the Cork out of your Lunch.

Ssgt
We should tax according to Body Weight. Fat Girlymen like Hal Drunkahue, Jerk Murtha and Al Bore will be in the 90% bracket.

rights
There seems to be an assumption in America that everyone has a "right" not to be offended! Change the law, anything, so that I will not be offended by someone else's opinion or voice in the public arena. This is the beginning of loss of free speech in this beloved country, because if I am offended, then I can sue for damages and shut the mouths of those who are guilty! What a travesty of justice! I cite Don Imus as an example of this prevalent attitude as a prime example of being able to express an attitude that offends someone. So shut him up, as he is not politically correct!

Georgetwin
LMAO you are such a whiner

Socialism vs Freedom
Today’s Liberals may or may not believe “from each according to his ability, to each according to his need’ but they certainly do not practice it. To do so would require acknowledging that those with the ability to work harder would have greater needs in order to sustain their efforts, whether their efforts are physical or mental. What they actually practice is ‘from each according to his productivity, to each equally’.

To my conservative friends, I would point out that we err when we claim that socialism never works. It works just fine, for example, in ant and termite colonies where individuals are genetically engineered with certain abilities to perform certain distinct tasks for the greater good of all. Some forage for material to stock the colonies food farm, some nurse the eggs, some maintain the infrastructure, some tend to the queen, some protect the colony. Those whose work requires more physical exertion consume more of the food. In doing so, they are oblivious to the efforts and even the existence of those who produced it, and none are free to choose the role they will play. That is what is required for socialism to work, a lack of freedom and, to compensate for that, a lack of self-awareness.

Mankind has self-awareness and therefore requires freedom. Freedom is equal opportunity.

Health Care
I know that few care about us "rich doctors" but...if there is a right to receive free health care then there must also be an OBLIGATION for doctors and nurses to provide health care...for free. No wonder the "best and brightest" are avoiding medical school.

Hal Drunkahue
Hey Gutless Wonder, Did you peg The Breathalyzer on the 4th?

Hal Drunkahue
Hey Gutless Wonder, did you Redline The Breathalyzer on the 4th?

Big fat government.
Our home is worth 1/2 of our next door neighbors. Our home is 1/2 the size. We chose a small home. Our neighbor pays a great deal more in taxes. This is something I don't understand. Why is he paying a higher property tax? We use the same roads, police, fire dept., library, parks and schools. He does not use them more than we do. Why is he paying more? Shouldn't we pay taxes according to use. The elderly are getting tossed out of their family homes because they cannot afford to pay the rising property taxes on fixed incomes. Does the government have a constitutional right to take more money from the rich than from the middle class and poor? Why? Shouldn't local governments scale down to bare bones their employees. When I go to city hall the place is full of people sitting around doing nothing. How can we the voters prevent this? Is it the government's constitutional right to grow as fat as it wants sucking down more and more of our livelihood?

anderson659

Halfwits like Gruntz really crack me up. They get out their college ruled paper and their #2 pencilsand start scrawling their grand plan for all mankind. They see themselves as wise and comassionate, when in reality they're hopeless dorks.

Notice when you hear them talk about remaking society or fostering radical change, it's always change that happens via the business end of a gun. That is, of course, the government's final answer to any arguement.

Gruntz is just another in a long line of fools who've attended too many liberal humanities classes.

http://www.trythinking.net

Up All Night Doctor
makes an excellent point about "free" health care. Such a system will ultimately make all doctors government employees. What the public will receive, for the most part, is the type of service we receive at the motor vehicle bureau when we go to renew our driver's license. I for one would prefer to pay for quality medical care instead of free bureaucratic medicine.

The medical profession was once considered in high esteem. Now it seems that most of the new doctors come from the Third World. The system is already deteriorating.

swamp fox
oh, dont be such a pansy. it was funny.

Up All Night Doctor
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 12:17 PM EST Subject: Health Care
...I know that few care about us "rich doctors" but...if there is a right to receive free health care then there must also be an OBLIGATION for doctors and nurses to provide health care...for free."

With logic like that you claim to possess an MD?

"... No wonder the "best and brightest" are avoiding medical school. "

Are they? And why is this not the case elsewhere? Are you claiming to be among the best and brightest?

Up All Night Doc
How dare you expect to make a profit on the misery of others! They really, really need the care, so they should get it, free of charge, if necessary. We will let you keep enough money to have a modest home and pay off your massive student loans. Do not expect to live as well as a lawyer, banker or lobbyist, though. You see, we do not care if you studied in college while others partied, we do not care that you gave up most of your youth and energy to pursue your profession, we do not care about the holidays, school events or kids' brithdays that you have missed to take care of us, all we see is that you make too much money and we aim to end that. WE can, and will, demand that you work for Big Brother, at our fee schedule, on our time demands and still maintain private malprctice insurance so that you can be sued but WE can not. We also will not consider tort reform or a "loser pays" system so that our constituents can feel free to sue you at any time for any reason. Now get back to work, we need the tax dollars from you rich guys, you greedy, heartless bastreds.

Hal
Look at the personal attacks spewing from him today.

Isn't it logic that if healthcare is free, then the provider must be providing it for free.

Though, the premise of the argument is wrong in the sense that the healthcare is not free. So basically, democrats are lying to the American people.

I see Hal couldn't possibly see the meaning of that though. haha...it takes the best and brightest, and you are a liberal...so...

Charles
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 12:32 PM EST Up All Night Doctor
makes an excellent point about "free" health care. Such a system will ultimately make all doctors government employees."

Why??? Is there no other way?

"...What the public will receive, for the most part, is the type of service we receive at the motor vehicle bureau when we go to renew our driver's license."

Really? WOW I just renew online very quick and very easy

"I for one would prefer to pay for quality medical care instead of free bureaucratic medicine."

Are you getting quality medical care now? How do you even know LOL

"The medical profession was once considered in high esteem. Now it seems that most of the new doctors come from the Third World. The system is already deteriorating. "

I still hold the profession in high esteem and I do know many of the second world docs are very highly trained and excellent

Up All Night Doc
Just kidding. I am in the same boat as you. I will turn the sarcasm button off now. Just like Hal Drunkahue to propose something but never bother to follow it to it's logical conclusions. Hal, just how do you think Free Health Care for All will end up? Did you consider all of the docs that will retire a few years earlier than they had planned? Or all of those that choose another profession rather than be a goverment slave? Unlike you, I have experience providing healthcare in the military, VA, public health and private settings. Guess which types are the least productive and least cost-effective? Vets only go to the VA because it is free; if they could go elsewhere, they would. When I was in Boston, the wait time to see a VA dentist was two years- is that your idea of timely care? I would advise you to only speak about topics you know well, but that would limit you to speaking about working on a losing political campaign and being a government servant.

Hal on drivers license
"...What the public will receive, for the most part, is the type of service we receive at the motor vehicle bureau when we go to renew our driver's license."

Really? WOW I just renew online very quick and very easy

-------

Can't do that here in MN. We must go to the DMV, wait forever in lines that hardly move because the government employees are in slow motion. Get up there pay the government some more so we can drive. Basically it wastes a couple hours if there are even 15 people in the building.

Fundamental Opportunities
I call liberal "rights" like health care and education fundamental opportunities. I think it's a much better term.

I have often contemplated that if someone took a snapshot of my life right now, they would say I have an unfair advantage over others. My monthly mortgage payment is $670 for a 3200 square foot house. I have two cars, but no car payment. I don't have to pay a credit card bill. I have a comfortable but not extravagant upper middle class income.

However, if you look back at each decision point in my life, I was at a disadvantage if anything. Far from being given a leg up by my parents, before I moved out a week before my 18th birthday, I was frequently asked to cover utility bills for my family. There was never an option presented to me that wasn't available to everyone else in the country who had made the same decisions up to that point.

Now I'm being asked to pay to provide the same things I worked years to earn to others who squandered those exact same opportunities, because I'm more "fortunate"? No thanks.

This is why I'm a foster parent. Children need to be insulated from their parents' worst mistakes, but having met some of the adults democrats want to protect, I believe there needs to be a lot more suffering for adults' own mistakes. Providing a hand up is important, but what the government currently provides is ridiculous. It reminds me of trying to hold a two-year-old who squirms and squirms until you can't hang on anymore, then acts as if it was your fault they fell down, instead of being grateful for you preventing a much worse injury.

Hal
I don't know about you, but in Pennsylvania everyone is required to go to the motor vehicle office to have a photograph taken, even after the license id renewed online. So are are either lying or not from Pennsylvania.

How can I judge medical care? I judge the quality of medical care by the results.

I would prefer a white male American born and trained doctor. Guess I'm just prejudiced. I do have one very competent female doctor, but one always needs to be careful about affirmative action pass-throughs. As for Third World doctors, there is no way to judge their education and training, so I prefer to pass.

CVN65-UANDoc
Hal Drunkahue is upset today. Somebody stole his bottle opener and he can’t get his lunch open.

Medical Care
Is socialistic medical care is SO superior, why did Fidel Castro come to America for treatment? I mean, he would have gotten the best doctors in Cuba, yet he thought he would be better here? Why is that, especially if, as Hal claims, socialistic healthcare is soo much better.

A new gov't enforced right
Since the right to a college education means gov’t funded education, and the right to health care means gov’t funded health care, why not a gov’t program to fund our right to keep and bear arms??

I’ve got just the program! Go here and get in line! Remember, over 160 million people lack adequate protection. Do it for the children!

http://redhead.blogtownhall.com/2008/06/30/the_left_on_righ ts.thtml

CKHustler
Why the logic and facts? This is Hal that you are posting about- don't confuse him with logic. Following an idea to it's logical outcome is anathema to the left; they are only interested in intentions, not the actual results. They don't care about the unintended consequences, they will just find a scapegoat like "Big Medicine" or "Big Nursing" and, with the help of the MSM, put the blame on them. Try to woo Hal with catchphrases and buzzwords. I suggest "If you like Osama, Vote for Obama" :)

Georgetwin
"Somebody stole his bottle opener and he can’t get his lunch open."

don't you twist off the pacifier?

Georgetwin
Is it his famous "Irish Seven Course Meal" (a six-pack and a potato)?

essie
Reply # 30
Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 9:04 AM EST Larry (Can't find "Right to Vote")
Try Article 1, Section 2:"The House of Representatives shall be composed of Members chosen every second Year by the People of the several States" "chosen by the People" sounds like a voting right to me.

How about Section 4:"The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof"

Ah, but the legislators chose their Senators (wish they still would), and Electors still choose the President. The state legislators under federalism had broad powers to determine their representation to the federal government, and who was included in the franchise.

Charles
Sadly, Hal is from PA. He probably meant that he could renew his registration online. He didn't write anything about his driver's license. Where in PA are you hailing from?

Ssgt
Like his Sissy Mary Buddy, Weasely Clark, Hal Drunkahue needs booster shots of Liquid Courage throughout the day.

Hey, Mike !
Mike, you are mean !

Your every column makes one poster sooo mad, he posts to say things that are totally unrelated to the theme of the column.

You should be more nice to silly-willy.

Why not write it a tribute such as this humble offering:




A prissy, a hissy,
a blue and pink sissy.


Oh Will, a shill,
a bill, and still.


A bird, a nerd,
a snerd, a furd.


I'm gay, every day,
You Nay, I pay.


A , nickel a sickle,
A dirty brown pickle.


There now, you Mr. nasty Mike.

Go back to your disgusting hererosexual, Christian lifestyle !
You dirty 'straight' !



CVN65
Berks County, still mostly a beautiful suburban and semi-rural area, but with a festering sore (City of Reading) at its center. Reading is now majority Hispanic, many of whom are illegal aliens.

Medical care is a significant issue. If someone has a medical emergency requiring emergency room care, even if fully insured, one must wait in line behind a mob of illegal aliens who use the emergency room as their family doctor, with the taxpayer and insurance customer paying. "Free" health care will only make this worse.

CKHustler
"...Isn't it logic that if healthcare is free, then the provider must be providing it for free."

no it is not I guess you skipped ;ogic in school?

"...Though, the premise of the argument is wrong in the sense that the healthcare is not free. So basically, democrats are lying to the American people."

Reaaly??? Which plank of the Democratic Party says healthcare should be free?


Georgetwin/CKHusler/All
Back when I was in HS Bill Cosby had this album out.

http://www.amazon.com/Why-There-Air-Bill-Cosby/dp/B0000062T I

Yes, he did have a career as a standup comedian before he went to TV and no, his material was not obscene.

Anyway, the point is the answer to the question on the Album Cover was, contrary to the picture, for HalD to waste by breathing.

What a waste of O2 and space.

Hal Donahue
Democrats want to insure cradle to grave care for all. Is the purpose of the Democrat support for late term abortions to limit the number of people who get to the cradle?

Hal
Do you still maintain that you can renew your driver's license without going to a PennDOT office to have your photo taken and license issued? Or are you like the rest of the Obama cultists in denying everything, no matter how trivial, even when caught in a lie?

Government employees at every level are worthless slugs, and doctors under any universal health care system would be virtual government employees. If the liberals can no longer blame private insurance companies, they will neeed to blame the doctors for costs and cut their salaries accordingly. This will drive out all but the incompetents.

Hal
"...Isn't it logic that if healthcare is free, then the provider must be providing it for free."

no it is not I guess you skipped ;ogic in school?

---
explain how it could happen otherwise? Money has to come from somewhere if people aren't paying right?

And to this "free" healthcare...if millions upon millions aren't going to be paying for it, since they already don't pay taxes, who is paying for it? Its free for them right?

My cars have rights too then!
My cars want to blast down the road at 100+ MPH. So they have a right to a perfectly paved and banked roadway.

-Ray
NRA Life Member

Doc, Doc, You do be da same... :-)
CVN65
Location: PA

Reply # 16
Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 12:48 PM EST Subject: Up All Night Doc
How dare you expect to make a profit on the misery of others! They really, really need the care, so they should get it, free of charge, if necessary. We will let you keep enough money to have a modest home and pay off your massive student loans. Do not expect to live as well as a lawyer, banker or lobbyist, though. You see, we do not care if you studied in college while others partied, we do not care that you gave up most of your youth and energy to pursue your profession, we do not care about the holidays, school events or kids' brithdays that you have missed to take care of us, all we see is that you make too much money and we aim to end that. WE can, and will, demand that you work for Big Brother, at our fee schedule, on our time demands and still maintain private malprctice insurance so that you can be sued but WE can not. We also will not consider tort reform or a "loser pays" system so that our constituents can feel free to sue you at any time for any reason. Now get back to work, we need the tax dollars from you rich guys, you greedy, heartless bastreds.

~~~~

Continued...


For Larry, essie and others...
...discussing the 'right' to vote.

From Article 1, Section 2 of the Constitution:

"The House of Representatives shall be composed of Members chosen every second Year by the People of the several States, and the Electors in each State shall have the Qualifications requisite for Electors of the most numerous Branch of the State Legislature."

I'm no expert in interpreting the Constitution, but it seems to me that the Constitution establishes in this clause that the only requirement for "Electors" is that the people who are allowed to vote for their representatives to the US House must be the same ones that vote for their State House of Representatives.

It is my understanding that in 1789, when the Constitution was ratified, it was standard 'law' in each of the 13 states that only male property owners could vote.

Even the famous "equal protection" clause (14th Amendment) does not declare voting as a universal right, but merely that the right of voting cannot be subject to discrimination for race, creed, color, or national origin.

Also, the Constitution is replete with references to the rights and authorities of "Citizens", with a capital "C". This is in distinction to "the People" and certainly in contrast with aliens of all stripes.

Since the beginning of our founding there have always been limitations and restrictions on who could vote. Such could not have been the case if voting were an 'inalienable right' under the Constitution.

CVN65
"..Hal, just how do you think Free Health Care for All will end up? Did you consider all of the docs that will retire a few years earlier than they had planned?"

No one wants free healthcare least of all me. Do you enjoy workijng more and more hours for less and less pay all the while watching your quality of life drain away. If you do not think healthcare in the US is briken than you are almost certainly part of the problem

"Or all of those that choose another profession rather than be a goverment slave? "

That is how capitalism works. Are you not now a slave to the insurance companies now? every get tired of begging?

"Unlike you, I have experience providing healthcare in the military, VA, public health and private settings. Guess which types are the least productive and least cost-effective? Vets only go to the VA because it is free; if they could go elsewhere, they would."

LOL you are so wrong. Every day I see vets refusing to go to the VA because it is too far away.

"..When I was in Boston, the wait time to see a VA dentist was two years- is that your idea of timely care?"

Not at all and you Republicans still refuse to fully fund VA but guess what it is much better now. But I know little about the VA except there is a high satisfaction factor from those who use it.

" I would advise you to only speak about topics you know well, but that would limit you to speaking about working on a losing political campaign and being a government servant. "

LMAO wrong I have far more skills and government servant is least of them LOL

Posted or Not? Doc and Doc...
CVN65
Location: PA

Reply # 16
Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 12:48 PM EST Subject: Up All Night Doc
How dare you expect to make a profit on the misery of others! They really, really need the care, so they should get it, free of charge, if necessary. We will let you keep enough money to have a modest home and pay off your massive student loans. Do not expect to live as well as a lawyer, banker or lobbyist, though. You see, we do not care if you studied in college while others partied, we do not care that you gave up most of your youth and energy to pursue your profession, we do not care about the holidays, school events or kids' brithdays that you have missed to take care of us, all we see is that you make too much money and we aim to end that. WE can, and will, demand that you work for Big Brother, at our fee schedule, on our time demands and still maintain private malprctice insurance so that you can be sued but WE can not. We also will not consider tort reform or a "loser pays" system so that our constituents can feel free to sue you at any time for any reason. Now get back to work, we need the tax dollars from you rich guys, you greedy, heartless bastreds.

9th amendment...
I know others brought it up, but this article (trying to be funny I know) seems to have forgot that the 9th amendment exists. Just because something is not in the constitution doesn't make it not a right...

Charles
" Subject: Hal
I don't know about you, but in Pennsylvania everyone is required to go to the motor vehicle office to have a photograph taken, even after the license id renewed online. So are are either lying or not from Pennsylvania."

Photo card was five minutes too

"How can I judge medical care? I judge the quality of medical care by the results."

You could be inn trouble then ignorance is not bliss

"I would prefer a white male American born and trained doctor. Guess I'm just prejudiced."

Your call I just want the best available
.

Summers
"Democrats want to insure cradle to grave care for all. Is the purpose of the Democrat support for late term abortions to limit the number of people who get to the cradle?"

What a truly excellent post....

Hal
If socialistic medical care is SO superior, why did Fidel Castro come to America for treatment? I mean, he would have gotten the best doctors in Cuba, yet he thought he would be better here? Why is that, especially if, as you claims, socialistic healthcare is soo much better?

CKHustler
".. Why is that, especially if, as Hal claims, socialistic healthcare is soo much better. "

Hal does not claim that

Doc and Doc... Sorry if double posts...
TH screwing up still...


AMEN! CVN65, Doc.

Your previous: conservs will see the spoof, libtards will think you are one of them. I know better!

My son got his Medical training in the Army, and now works as a P.A. in Georgia.

He makes more money than I do as an ex-college Professor, and working Engineer. I shout HOORAYYY ! Yes, I believe his way was harder than mine.

He did it the HARD WAY, Mustang! Raw Boot to Captain, and retired after 23 1/2 years active duty. Saw action in Gulf I, Bosnia, and Gulf II. Obtained his College Degrees the Hard way. A little bit at a time.

Mustangs, from my readings, have to hold themselves to much higher standards than officers to even be considered as officers. This Does not, in any way denigrate our excellent Officer Corps. ( OK, hul donkyhoo is an exception ).

I myself, worked my way through college, while working full time, and supporting 7 people. I have zero sympathy for those who sit on their hal donkyhoo, and expect others to take care of them.


"Eternal Father, Strong To Save, whose arm doth bind the restless wave..."


Rats
(and mice)
USN 1960-1966 FTG2, TinCan Sailor, WestPac, DESRON9


CVN65/CKHustler
"...Following an idea to it's logical outcome is anathema to the left; they are only interested in intentions, not the actual results. They don't care about the unintended consequences, they will just find a scapegoat like "Big Medicine" or "Big Nursing" and, with the help of the MSM, put the blame on them. Try to woo Hal with catchphrases and buzzwords. I suggest "If you like Osama, Vote for Obama" :)"

I guess you are indeed part of the problem if you cannot notice how sick medicine is...

Hal
Then what are you claiming of socialistic healthcare? It sounds like you REALLY want it for some unknown reason. If your not claiming its better, then why do you want it?

Charles
"...Government employees at every level are worthless slugs, and doctors under any universal health care system would be virtual government employees."

I know that is how conservatives really feel about the military, police, fire etc but I seldom see a conservative say it out loud thank you for being honest

"If the liberals can no longer blame private insurance companies, they will neeed to blame the doctors for costs and cut their salaries accordingly. This will drive out all but the incompetents. "

It really depends on how you set it up bottom line system broken and it is destroying our declining businesses

Hal
This is not to say that I think our healthcare system is going well. Illegals are a main part of the problem. They should be refused all care. They came into our country illegally and should not reap our rewards. Its part of breaking the law.

Lawsuits are another major part of the problem. Anytime the prosecutor loses he should have to pay the defenders lawyer costs. That would at least partly solve the problem. Frivolous lawsuits should be thrown out much more often as well.

Just those two problems together would save the American people millions.

Charles
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 1:22 PM EST CVN65
Berks County, still mostly a beautiful suburban and semi-rural area, but with a festering sore (City of Reading) at its center....Medical care is a significant issue."

So finally you see why what we have must be repaired. You are not an island you are part of a society. Healthcare needs fixing

" If someone has a medical emergency requiring emergency room care, even if fully insured, one must wait in line behind a mob of illegal aliens who use the emergency room as their family doctor, with the taxpayer and insurance customer paying."

Bush the torturer told them to go there or did you miss that??? How do you know they are illegals by the way?

some form of universal coverage would eliminate it

Ratas y Ratones
"...Mustangs, from my readings, have to hold themselves to much higher standards than officers to even be considered as officers. This Does not, in any way denigrate our excellent Officer Corps. ( OK, hul donkyhoo is an exception )."

LMAO guess who is a mustang LOL

Summers
"...Democrats want to insure cradle to grave care for all. Is the purpose of the Democrat support for late term abortions to limit the number of people who get to the cradle? "

Do they???? And you folks claim every sperm is sacred geesh extremes are seldom right

Mr. O'Donahue! You are
whistling our of your backside as usual when you say conservatives feel that our military, police, fire, etc. are worthless slugs. No way Jose. More problems with your hemorrhoids?
Oh by the way I recently learned from anonymous sources that The American Medical Association is planning a study on the effects of Cranial Rectilitus (CR) and hemorrhoids on the thought processes and being able to express one’s self coherently without obfuscating. They will pay $1000.00 to each candidate and already have several volunteers who suffer from CR. Most notable are yourself, MDoggg, Perry Winkle, MRC2, Taft, and Wobbie. Several more are needed to get accurate results. They are also planning a companion study using hypnosis on other volunteers to see if CR can induced with hemorrhoids to follow. This is the first study of its kind and the results will be published in the New England Journal of Medicine in their Fall report.

PS: Several politicians who are known to suffer from CR were invited but they declined to participate citing conflict of interest.

serious question
"If everyone starts to enforce his right to breathe clean air in the presence of swarthy young Muslims, Obama might lose an important part of his electoral base."

What does the skin tone of young Muslims have to do with clean air? Actually, what do young Muslims in general have to do with wanting to breathe clean air and why would they be against it? Am I not understanding a joke?

HalD
What moral right do you claim, that you believe that you or others are entitled to a portion of someone else's earnings? What or who is your ultimate authority for such a belief?

Just askin'.

Even The Best systems Have Losers..

You are a loser. You always will be. Loser !

Hal Donahue
Location: PA

Reply # 1
Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 2:17 PM EST Ratas y Ratones
"...Mustangs, from my readings, have to hold themselves to much higher standards than officers to even be considered as officers. This Does not, in any way denigrate our excellent Officer Corps. ( OK, hul donkyhoo is an exception )."

LMAO guess who is a mustang LOL
Flag as Offensive... No I will not flag you as offensive because I want everyone to see how stupid and worthless you are,

Loser.

A present, soon... :-)

Hal:
You are still a Retired, Passed Over, REMF, Sad Sack, Feather Merchant Desk Jockey, Garritrooper, Southern Hating Bigot, Murtha As$ Kissing, Liberal Moonbat, Alleged Oil Company VP, ENRON Board of Directors Member, Citer Of His Own Articles as Proof, Historically Challenged, Economically Ignorant,Little Man Who Could Walk Under a Door, A Self Important Pompous Windbag, Lard as$ed, Democratic Party Fanatic

Mr Donahue! From what
I read from your comments during the short period time I've visited TH, you sir, if you are a Mustang, are the exception to the rule that Mustangs are outstanding officers. No wonder you were forced to retire rather than being RIFFED back to your permanent enlisted rank. That's what happens to walkin' eagles.

The Blackbird & Lumberjack
Personally, I think the only reason Hal made LTC was that his CO was embarrassed to have a middle-aged junior officer in his command.

CVN65 #73
You didn't mention the hundreds of thousands of debt they incur to go to medical school, and the additional hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt they incur to get all the equipment they need for their practices. They have to pay all this debt before they can think about buying that small house you mentioned. Let's not forget the malpractice insurance they have to buy for all the bs lawsuits they face for something that was not their fault.
BTW our family doctor is a woman from South Korea and she is excellent.

Hal
I don't include the military in the category of "government employees", by which I mean civil service types.

Police and fire personnel are not as bad in terms of effort, but compete with the rest of the slugs when it comes to milking the system for unjustified overtime, excessive benefits, bogus disability claims, etc. Retirement at half pay after 20 years, regardless of age, is a ridiculous concept.

Most other government employees are hacks who couldn't cut it in private industry.

In emergency rooms, those who can't pay should wait their turn behind those who can, unless their injuries are life-threatening. There is no right to medical care.

How do I know they are illegal aliens? If they only speak Spanish and are not from Puerto Rico, the probability is high that they are here illegally. Most of the Hispanic population here is from Mexico and the Dominican Republic, mostly illegal. Either way, if they can't pay, go to the end of the line (or go home where I'm sure the medical care is much better).

The illegals here are either drug dealers or mushroom workers. The drug dealers came from New York, where they were driven out by Rudy Guiliani. The mushroom workers are hardly needed (the world can survive withouit edible mushrooms).

MOBY !

Please, all. envision a large open septic pit, full of feces. Now envision hul donkyhoo doing the backstroke with a large container of cheap Vodka, resting on his belly. You might think it is Moby, but it is none other than our resident hul, in his natural envirionment,

This REMF is not fit to lick the boots of a real serviceman or woman. And, given his environment who would want that.

Glad you asked, Jean Kerry, that is who. Another? John Murtha. Another? Botox Pealousy. Another? Oslammayomama Oblameya.

Hey hul, What does that stuff taste like. I do not really want to know, I just enjoy poking iron rods through your wothless hulk.

OBTW, yer fren, wobbie says, "i luv yu bro, come, play wit mi soon."






BlackBird-LJ7392
While I was on vacation I heard Weasely Clark made some disparaging remarks about John McCain. What did Hal Drunkahue, The Defender of Veterans, have to say about that? The Drunk says only Conservatives denigrate Veterans. What does that make Jerk Murtha, Weasely Clark and John Kerry?

ca #115
When I read that post, I had the impression that the muslims are considered the "unwashed" with the resulting smell.

CKHustler
"..Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 2:07 PM EST Hal
This is not to say that I think our healthcare system is going well. Illegals are a main part of the problem. They should be refused all care. They came into our country illegally and should not reap our rewards. Its part of breaking the law."

Well that is only in areas the hardest hit areas are rural I think I saw. Low income low insurance with urban areas next. Illegals are part of the problem but they work (and I must add you Republicans allowed it by not enforcing the rules). Are you saying that being an illegal should carry a death sentence in a medical emergency? Worse do we go no ID no service? I can see it now; your wife runs you to the ER in the middle of the nite with a cardiac problem and you are refused service because no ID

"..Lawsuits are another major part of the problem. Anytime the prosecutor loses he should have to pay the defenders lawyer costs. That would at least partly solve the problem. "

See and maybe CVN can jump in here Drs do not enforce standards every doc I know knows someone they would not send an enemy to see. Maintain standards and then let's talk

"Frivolous lawsuits should be thrown out much more often as well."

That appears to be hjappening

"Just those two problems together would save the American people millions. "

that may be right if handled properly but it is a multiple BILLION problem

Hul d, yer present...

Scranton LA meeting... [ LA = Liars Anonymous ]

hi, my name is hul. hul donkeyhoo

"Hi, Hul "

yes i am a ly-aholic.

i started this meny yers ago even before i bribed my way into the militarry, by pretending to be a human.

i kwickly lerned haow to braun-nose, suckup, and pander. i also lerned parasitic toadyism, i foun a leeder an i grabbed his butte, surgically implanted my lips, an rose to the rank of lt. col., REMF. (hic) LMAO (hic)

REMF is a VERY elite groop of about 1 in 10,000 to 20,000 in the miltery, this is out uv sum 3 to 4 millions of truups. (I reely wuzzent un ov em cause i hate therm)

REMF; it is very hard to get into, the vast majority cennut do it because thay hev weak stomachs.

My best move, en the one thet mad me lt. col, was i reed a r-tickle in new jerk times, thet say,
only 1 in 10,000 rounds of ammo ecturly disable enema.

then troops rekwest 10,000,000, yes 10 million rouns! ken yu bereve thet? (hic) LMAO


LMAO, so i sent the troopz 1000 roundz with a note. when you use the effectively, i will send yu anuther 1000 rounds. LMAO (hic)

Quit wasting ammo !!!


Orderly, get in here! We're going to the club, AND YOU ARE BUYING, or you get a poor evaluation!

Now dimmit, now!

Not sure when mi downfall wuz... mebe it was hittin un mi orderly. Or maybe it wuz hinnit on the bartender. (hic) LMAO (hic)



KER THUUMMPP ! OH KRUD .
LMAO
i jerst fall off the barstool (hic) LMAO (hic-hic)

Anne, yor a jrek en yu caused this. i hat yu !!!! Makin foon uv mi concussions, i no you got this frum thet jerk the rat!

Oh crud, now i stitter when i hic.~ (hic-hic) LMAO!

OBTW, LMAO means 'Lying My Arse Off" LMAO (hic-hic)


Oh Boy...
Hal blurts out that extremes are seldom right.

Seeing as how he's a Left Wing Extremist, I would have to agree...

Ron
That was written tongue-in-cheek. I am still dealing with my student loans from school and will be paying that "second mortgage" until about the time I retire.

Oh Please Hal...
"Illegals are part of the problem but they work (and I must add you Republicans allowed it by not enforcing the rules)."

Simply not true...this was a failure on both sides of the aisle. But leave it to you to give democrats a pass...

"I can see it now; your wife runs you to the ER in the middle of the nite with a cardiac problem and you are refused service because no ID"

This is simply left-wing hysterical rhetoric. Thanks for proving that extremes are seldom right.

Hal
You grossly underestimate technology. There are many ways to identify a person and we are rapidly finding new cheap ways to do it.

If you are fooling yourself that the government can give us great healthcare, I suggest you run over to Burts column about our education system and what they did with that. The government cannot be trusted to handle our healthcare. They are increasingly inefficient and wasteful.

Theoretically universal healthcare should work, as should socialism. The thing neither accounts for is human nature. That is the reason socialism will never work as well as capitalism. Human nature does not allow it to work.

Hal Drunkahue
Location: Corner Bar, Scranton, PA

HIC! LMAO! I’ll bet you Ignorant, Gun Lovin, Bible Thumpin, Conservatives had lots of fun over The 4th of July. What VILE Racists you all are, to celebrate a country built by Slavery. To celebrate a country where ILLEGAL residents are denied FREE HEATLH CARE. HIC! LMAO! You Rural, Racist, Southern, White, Conservatives PAY FOR YOUR OWN Healthcare and think you are special. What about The Drug Dealers and/or Addicts in places like Boston, LA, Baltimore and Scranton, PA, The Irritable Bowel of Pennsylvania? HIC! LMAO! I suppose you think they should pay for their own insurance too. NEVER MIND that the money they spend on crack could be used to buy insurance. You Racist Animals think ILLEGALS should have to pay for Health Insurance too. HIC! LMAO! NEVER MIND that they are BREAKING THE LAW by living in America. You Racists think they should all be locked up! HIC! LMAO! A Liberal, FDR for example, WOULD NEVER use profiling to incarcerate a specific ethnic gro…er…NEVER MIND! I REFUSE to waste anymore time on you Idiots. I have to go file a Police Report, some lowlife stole The Cork out of my supper! HIC! LMAO!

Max Power
Did you see where Hal Drunkahue found YET ANOTHER Ugly Shrill Woman to order him around? Michelle Obama! LMAO!

hull down

hull down? Means over the horizon.


OBTW, Hul, 100 % of service people who have served honorably, are disgusted with you. Why? Look in the mirror.

Hul: I only see slime.

Rest of the World: Exactly.

OK, maybe I have been too harsh with such a floating chunk of feces. Nope, I am dead on target.

Shouldn't you check yourself into GITMO? You are an enema to this great country.

May rats chew off your appendages, and mice crawl up your nether regions,



Oh, and just to cheer you up, 99% of the other posters on this site have 20 times or more than your accomplishments.

I know you enjoy that!


What does your pool smell like?




Rights Are Not Created By Constitution
When you indicate that any asserted right must be found in the Constitution, you do a disservice to the true meaning of the American Revolution - that our rights are not derived from any government, but from our Creator. "We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men . . . are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights." The miracle of our system is that "We the people" agreed to relinquish a few rights ("the consent of the governed") to our government for the good of the whole. The framers of our Constituition specified the limited power of our government, and then, bowing to those who felt it did not do enough to protect the rights given to us by our Creator, subsequently drafted amendments to specify which rights are so important to us that the governmant cannot, under any circumstance, deny us those rights. This Bill of Rights also stipulates that the enumeration of those most important rights was not meant to deny the existence of others.

That being said, one cannot create rights simply because one thinks they are good. One cannot create a right to free medical care. One might assert that society has a moral obligation to provide free medical care, but a moral obligation does not create a right. One might argue that society would be better off economically and socially if all citizens were better educated through free college educations, but that does not create a right. Free medical care and free college educations means free for some at the expense of depriving others of their property (money) to pay for it. Therefore free medical care and free education cannot be a right, because it deprives others of their most fundamental right to property. The rights to life, liberty and property are considered the top three most important rights, in that order, and are unassailable.

Hal re:2:57 post
For once you are correct about something: every doctor knows other doctors that essentially suck. Sometimes, most of the time, it is a difference in philosophy but all too often it is sheer incompetence. The establishment is terrified to take these docs to task because it will stir up a huge hornet's nest plus they are scared that they might be next. One may say the same about lawyers, architects, barbers etc. It is disingenuous to speak about the tort problem as if you know something about it; loser pays and medical review are in place in several states and have worked dramatically to lower the volume and monetary totals of med malpractice claims. It is not complex- sue a doctor and lose and you pay his/her lawyer fees. That way, the doctor does not win the case only to see their malpractice fees go up anyway.

Will and Gruntz
Will, are you still trying to justify your lifestyle and thrash Dr. Adams with your swishy stick? It's like this ... shut up.

Gruntz, I see someone else pointed out the fact you are somehow losing yourself in your mumbling. About the only thing in your ramblings that made anything close to sense was saying the 14th amendment addresses "rights" and that it does. It simply says we have equal protection under the law. That means we cannot be treated differently for the same outcome, poitive or negative.

The 9th amendment is harder. Our founders had difficulty writing this one. Essentially a faction did not want to have a limit on themselves or prosperity because they did not list some "right." Another faction simply wanted to write a provision against extending the power of the Congress (thereby reducing individual) and not write some "vague" protection of "rights" not listed therein. As I say it is too complicated. In the end the 9th is farly worthless. Some libertarians want to point the 9th to "natural rights" and we can see how difficult that mouthful of mush can be. I certainly believe the 9th was added to pacify the angst between the federalists and the confederalists. I like the text Madison drafted better than what became the 9th. He wrote, "The exceptions, here or elsewhere in the constitution, made in favor of particular rights, shall not be construed as to diminish the just importance of other rights retained by the people, or as to enlarge the powers delegated by the constitution; but either as actual limitations of such powers, or as inserted merely for greater caution." Made more sense.

Currently the 9th is viewed as an amendment that limits the reach of the federal government. That is perhaps the better way to interpret it.

Ron
Subject: ca #115
When I read that post, I had the impression that the muslims are considered the "unwashed" with the resulting smell.
--------------------------

Thanks Ron. I thought that was what Adams was implying. That still doesn't explain the word "swarthy" in his phrasing, unless he just doesn't know the meaning of that word. Also, I was unaware that young Muslim men smell particularly bad, let alone bad enough to cause air pollution. Of course, it comes one paragraph after Adams uses only "unqualified black" students and "unqualified athletes" as his examples for people that aren't necessarily college material so it's possibly just another not-so-subtle racial message.

The Blackbird

"...whistling our of your backside as usual when you say conservatives feel that our military, police, fire, etc. are worthless slugs. "

Judge them by their actions not their words


Rondak: Sufferage
Rondak:

Not being familiar with the incident in question, I don't want to comment on it. Its entirely possible that those senators were deprived of their right to be seated, or that those states were not yet in compliance with the terms of the surrender, and were therefore NOT seated.

But no one would claim that the US Government has been run without mistakes or usupations of power. People are involved and therefore such things are GOING to happen, even with well-meaning people in office.

Obama proposes that Judges have a duty to decide what the Laws SHOULD be, and will appoint judges who feel empowered to do so by policy. This is dangerous to liberty and breaks the very principles of our government. It is one thing with the princples of our government are broken by a well intentioned but misguided act, worse when done deliberately, and even worse when the breaking of such principles is advocated as policy.



ca
"...What does the skin tone of young Muslims have to do with clean air? Actually, what do young Muslims in general have to do with wanting to breathe clean air and why would they be against it? Am I not understanding a joke?"

Not a joke plain prejudice

AliveInHim
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 2:31 PM EST HalD
What moral right do you claim, that you believe that you or others are entitled to a portion of someone else's earnings? What or who is your ultimate authority for such a belief?"

Sure you soaked up society's largess and now that payback time is here you want to skip out on your debts

"Just askin'. "
Just answering

Hal Doofus Scribbles:
Subject: ca
"...What does the skin tone of young Muslims have to do with clean air? Actually, what do young Muslims in general have to do with wanting to breathe clean air and why would they be against it? Am I not understanding a joke?"

Not a joke plain prejudice

When it comes to prejudice, you have absolutely no room to talk given your ant-Southern hatred and bigotry. So, SFTU

Charles
"Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 2:49 PM EST Hal
I don't include the military in the category of "government employees", by which I mean civil service types."

"Police and fire personnel are not as bad in terms of effort, but compete with the rest of the slugs when it comes to milking the system for unjustified overtime, excessive benefits, bogus disability claims, etc. Retirement at half pay after 20 years, regardless of age, is a ridiculous concept."

OH dear now I understand you are jealous LMAO
What do you do in life?

"Most other government employees are hacks who couldn't cut it in private industry."

Oh the government wouldn't hire you huh?

"..In emergency rooms, those who can't pay should wait their turn behind those who can, unless their injuries are life-threatening. There is no right to medical care."

How do I know that YOU can pay??? The biggest deadbeats I see are folks like you that get wiped out completely because of poor or no insurance

How do I know they are illegal aliens? If they only speak Spanish and are not from Puerto Rico, the probability is high that they are here illegally. "

That isn't true at all at least not where I live in the NE PA

"The illegals here are either drug dealers or mushroom workers. The drug dealers came from New York, where they were driven out by Rudy Guiliani. The mushroom workers are hardly needed (the world can survive withouit edible mushrooms)."

Why don't you get out and clean up the mess are you a typical conservative complainer not a doer?

Hal Donahue
Some Muslims, i.e. Albanians, are caucasian. Are you sterotyping all Muslims, Hal?


CKHustler writes:
Hal
Then what are you claiming of socialistic healthcare? It sounds like you REALLY want it for some unknown reason. If your not claiming its better, then why do you want it?

Because like any Dumbbuttcrap, he wants the government to control another aspect of our lives.

Blackbird
Honey Chile, top of the day to you!

Hal
AliveInHim
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 2:31 PM EST HalD
What moral right do you claim, that you believe that you or others are entitled to a portion of someone else's earnings? What or who is your ultimate authority for such a belief?"

Sure you soaked up society's largess and now that payback time is here you want to skip out on your debts
--------

You call that an answer? haha!!

So basically here is what Hal just said.

You were smart in making life decisions, and now you will be penalized for that. This person over here was busy drinking himself into poverty while you worked hard, but he deserves the same healthcare as you do!

hahaha!!! socialism at its best!

More on the 2nd Amendment "right"
that that ruling everyone loved so much said can be "regulated".

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,377203,00.html

DC now is contemplating coninuing the ban on semi-auto pistols because the SCOTUS said certain types of firearms could be banned.

Infringment will and is occurring where it stated simply "no infringment" is allowed.

Rights and What is "Fair"
I have heard a lot of politicians on both sides (but mostly on the Left) talk about "fair" prices for this and that. Currently the most popular fair issues are fair prices for gasoline and fair prices for health care. In these statements, the pols are always talking about what is "fair" to the consumer. I cannot remember, and I challenge anyone to remember any time, ever, when the phrase "fair price" applied to the producer of the goods or service in question. Never happens. QED TANSTAAFL

Vic writes:
More on the 2nd Amendment "right"
that that ruling everyone loved so much said can be "regulated".

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,377203,00.html

DC now is contemplating coninuing the ban on semi-auto pistols because the SCOTUS said certain types of firearms could be banned.

Infringment will and is occurring where it stated simply "no infringment" is allowed.

I am sure that the criminal classes of DC, will follow the ban on semiautomatic pistols.



Lumberjack7392
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 3:52 PM EST Subject: Hal Doofus Scribbles:
Subject: ca
"...What does the skin tone of young Muslims have to do with clean air? Actually, what do young Muslims in general have to do with wanting to breathe clean air and why would they be against it? Am I not understanding a joke?"

Not a joke plain prejudice "

"When it comes to prejudice, you have absolutely no room to talk given your ant-Southern hatred and bigotry. So, SFTU "

LMAO

Vic
on semi-auto guns? haha!! so are they going to piece together the same law using certain types? Like, we ban all automatic guns, and all semi-auto guns. Whats left for handguns? lol

That amendment will spark a civil war someday

CKHustler/ AliveInHim
"Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 4:03 PM EST Subject: Hal

"...Sure you soaked up society's largess and now that payback time is here you want to skip out on your debts"
--------

"You call that an answer? haha!!

So basically here is what Hal just said."

No what I said above is what I said

"...You were smart in making life decisions, and now you will be penalized for that. "

Smart or lucky? Any successful person I know usually admits that luck had a lot to do with it. and the investment your community made for you like roads schools public safety

"...This person over here was busy drinking himself into poverty while you worked hard, but he deserves the same healthcare as you do! "

LMAO what about the guy who got cancer at 20 couldn't get to school struggled and still can barely make it? What about that solid steady guy who is a little "slow" will never get much above minimum wage? You always go to the extremes life seldom is so clear cut

"hahaha!!! socialism at its best! "
that isn't socialism at all

Hal Doofus Scribbles:
Lumberjack7392
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 3:52 PM EST Subject: Hal Doofus Scribbles:
Subject: ca
"...What does the skin tone of young Muslims have to do with clean air? Actually, what do young Muslims in general have to do with wanting to breathe clean air and why would they be against it? Am I not understanding a joke?"

Not a joke plain prejudice "

"When it comes to prejudice, you have absolutely no room to talk given your ant-Southern hatred and bigotry. So, SFTU "

LMAO

Hal, you'd have to laugh for many millenia to laugh your amazingly large lard as$ off. And you are a bigot.

And your response is about what I would have expected, a total non-sequiter.

CKHustler
"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 4:22 PM EST Subject: Vic
on semi-auto guns? haha!! so are they going to piece together the same law using certain types? Like, we ban all automatic guns, and all semi-auto guns. Whats left for handguns? lol

That amendment will spark a civil war someday "

You best hope not......

Hal
If that isn't socialism, what is?

You are taking from one to give to another. That is basically the definition of it!

a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/socialism

so how is it not socialism?

Have you ever heard that you make your own luck? Work hard and make smart decisions and you will succeed. You always assume you are better than others and they can't make it. I suppose that is your superiority complex showing again.

Lumberjack7392
YAWN

Hal Doofus Scribbles:
Lumberjack7392
YAWN

Just about what I would expect from you, yhou bigot.

CKHustler
Revolvers

Unlimited rights
The Ninth Amendment states, "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."

A problem occurs when a large group of Americans maintain that this broad statement of rights includes the right for them to use the force of the imperial government to get into my wallet and to take away some of my rights.

Vic
Yea, but thats next! dum dum DUMMMMM!!!

If they can infringe on each part separately, then they can get the whole eventually. So really, if they do that, this ruling meant nothing.

hal, where is he runnin?
I asked about why he wanted healthcare if he didn't think socialist healthcare was better, and he ran.

I asked what socialism is, if universal healthcare is not it, he ran...

Hal...where are you runnin?

Good song btw. Where are we runnin?

CKHustler
One fallacy in Hal's thinking is that, somehow, you used up the largesse of public schools and highways and now you are 'not giving anything back'. Public schools and highways are not largesse, they are part of the infrastructure needed in any country that has hopes to be something other than a third world country. Furthermore, THIS 'LARGESSE' IS FUNDED BY TAX DOLLARS PAID AT THE TIME, JUST AS YOU PAY TAX DOLLARS TODAY. They have never been a 'free gift'. What does Hal want, child labor? Then, his Party should be against abortions, including late term abortions. More children, more workers, more taxpayers, more taxes, better 'infrastructure'.

I know a fed who favors a .357 Python.
He can pump all 6 into a circle the size of a tennis ball from 15 yard (further than the average gunfight in the real world) so fast it almost sounds like full auto.

If it ain't broke and it works for you USE IT!

-Ray
NRA Life Member

Re: Mustangs?
Does a stint at OCS following a mediocre career in ROTC count one as a "mustang" to you guys?
Rats like his 5" and I prefer a MK-48 ADCAP. Chacon a son gout!

-Ray
NRA Life Member

Wrat Wrangler writes:
Re: Mustangs?
Does a stint at OCS following a mediocre career in ROTC count one as a "mustang" to you guys?
Rats like his 5" and I prefer a MK-48 ADCAP. Chacon a son gout!

No, by definition a mustang is a former enlisted.

More manufactured rights
Oh, but it's even worse now. The liberals used to clamor for the right to health care. Now, they clamor for the right to health INSURANCE. The right of the parasite to leech off the medical system is no longer enough for them. Now, they want respectability to go with it; they want the appearance of self-sufficiency as they take the unearned.

For Republicans, the Senate outlook is b

How bad is it?

LATIMES-Mississippi, one of the nation’s most conservative states, has not elected a Democratic senator in a quarter-century. It has voted for Republican presidential candidates in the last seven elections.

But this year, there is a real chance that the state will send a Democrat to the Senate.

That prospect is a window onto a remarkable political trend that has been eclipsed by the fireworks surrounding the 2008 presidential contest: Democrats are running strong Senate campaigns in states such as Mississippi, Alaska and North Carolina that Republicans have long taken for granted.

read more

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/for-republicans-th e-senate-outlook-is-bad

Summers/CKHustler

"...Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 5:48 PM EST CKHustler
One fallacy in Hal's thinking is that, somehow, you used up the largesse of public schools and highways and now you are 'not giving anything back'. Public schools and highways are not largesse, they are part of the infrastructure needed in any country that has hopes to be something other than a third world country. "

WOW perfect you nailed it but be careful many here think they are handouts and frills they do not have to provide - you are in RINO territory

"Furthermore, THIS 'LARGESSE' IS FUNDED BY TAX DOLLARS PAID AT THE TIME, JUST AS YOU PAY TAX DOLLARS TODAY. "

You bet they were and you don't pay them or scream too much. I wonder why. I owe my community and that is why I came back and that is why I work now to give something back

"...More children, more workers, more taxpayers, more taxes, better 'infrastructure'. "

Higher earning happy citizens equal better life for all
It is only money folks admittedly said by one who has a bit,,,

Hal:
You are not a mustang, just the south end of a north bound horse.

Melinda
Given your attitude about Dr. Adams, I suspect the only friend you have is the one the one you see in a mirror, and even that's a little iffy.

Outryder's educated idiots
"Look at all the educated idiots we have running around."

Mike Adams went to college.

CR-Hemorrhoid Study
The AMA has received the names of some more volunteers for the Cranial Rectlitis- Hemorrhoid study. The following have graciously volunteered:
Van, Will and Sophie. A former poster by the name of willibeax has volunteered for the hypnosis study. He just lurks on the threads now. He sent me an e-mail saying his heart was broken when his suppressed desire wouldn't elope with him. Life is tough. :-(

Wrat Wrangler
"Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 7:00 PM EST Re: Mustangs?
Does a stint at OCS following a mediocre career in ROTC count one as a "mustang" to you guys?
...-Ray NRA Life Member "

LMAO not quite. Are you a Vet? So often NRA types just sit at home slowly stroking their weapons....
LMAO

The Blackbird
"A former poster by the name of willibeax has volunteered for the hypnosis study. He just lurks on the threads now."

Willi got tossed???? WOW and they still let lumber wander around....

Hal Doofus Scribbles:
Subject: Wrat Wrangler
"Date: Jul 7, 2008 - 7:00 PM EST Re: Mustangs?
Does a stint at OCS following a mediocre career in ROTC count one as a "mustang" to you guys?
...-Ray NRA Life Member "

LMAO not quite. Are you a Vet? So often NRA types just sit at home slowly stroking their weapons....
LMAO

And you are a pro at stroking things. BTW, when was the last time you had an original thought?

Hal Doofus Scribbles:
The Blackbird
"A former poster by the name of willibeax has volunteered for the hypnosis study. He just lurks on the threads now."

Willi got tossed???? WOW and they still let lumber wander around....

They let you babble on, and toss out insults at will.

Hal Donahue
Why moan and groan about taxes? Like death, they are a certainty in life. I pay mine without complaining that I didn't qualify for a 'tax incentive'.

I appreciate the tax reductions for several reasons, not the least of which is the fact that more people paid taxes, actually paid taxes. I do have a problem paying for services for able-bodied people who have never paid taxes. And, I do have a problem bailing people out on their mortgages.

You forever accuse others of not doing their part. What, precisely, do you consider any person of legal age in this country should be doing to satisfy you?

Lumberjack7392
"...And you are a pro at stroking things. BTW, when was the last time you had an original thought? "

LMAO no ROTC here and thoughts? Almost always LOL