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Monday, June 11, 2007
Mike Adams :: Townhall.com Columnist
Three Kinds of People
by Mike Adams
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When I was growing up my father used to say there were two kinds of people in this world. When I would ask him “What time is it?” he would say “There are two kinds of people in this world: Those who ask what time it is and those who wear watches.” He had so many variations on the theme that I eventually decided there really were two kinds of people in this world: Those who dichotomize and those who do not.

But, later, with the help of Lt. Col. David Grossman, I decided there are three kinds of people in this world: Sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs.

The sheep form the largest segment of our society. According to Grossman, these are the people who are living in a constant state of denial. They are generally incapable of doing violence to another person and largely unaware of the existence of evil in this world – the true evil which is, thankfully, confined to a minority of the population.

The classic sheep mentality was demonstrated to me on September 12, 2001, which was, of course, the day after the worst terrorist attack in this country’s history – though certainly not the worst we will see in the coming years.

This sheep - unsurprisingly one with a PhD in the so-called “social sciences” - approached me with a request: “Hey, Mike, is there any chance you have a spare gun I could borrow for awhile?” To understand the significance of this quote one has to know something about the sheep who uttered it; namely, that he was adamantly anti-military and anti-gun on September 10, 2001.

However, in the first few hours (maybe few dozen hours) after 911 the sheep panicked. He was worried that the transportation system and banking system would be shut down indefinitely. And he knew there were crack and heroin addicts living in the vicinity of his neighborhood.

But when order was restored in this country – admittedly, faster than both he and I expected – he calmed back down. He hasn’t put a hand on a weapon in the five and one-half years since our conversation. He is back in a state of denial where he feels most comfortable.

But there are others among us who are fully aware of the existence of another class of persons we will call the “wolves.” These people are sociopaths who prey upon the sheep and wish to do them evil. My awareness of the existence of these people led to another noteworthy conversation on the evening of August 31st, 2001.

Shortly after purchasing a new car, I stopped by Wal-Mart to get some cleaning accessories and, as usual, picked up a few hundred rounds of ammunition. My girlfriend was waiting for me at the condo and spoke to me as I stored the ammo in my gun safe – the only one I had at the time. That was the first time she got a glimpse at my numerous weapons and the thousands of rounds of ammunition that accompany them.

“How many guns do you have?” she asked. I told her. “And how many thousands of rounds of ammunition do you have?” she then asked. I told her that, too - though you can rest assured I will not tell the reader or the ATF, which, in my opinion, should be a convenience store and not a federal agency.

My girlfriend was so alarmed that later at dinner with her parents she mentioned our conversation. I don’t know whether she told them about how I warned her of the existence of the Islamic wolves who would some day release an atomic device in our country in the name of Islam. Nor do I know whether she told them about the domestic wolves I also warned her about. These are the folks whose withdrawal from addictive drugs in the wake of the chaos following a nuclear explosion would lead them to prey upon the sheep not prepared with gun safes that look a lot like mine.

But I do know that she apologized the following month. When the second tower fell, she knew who was responsible. She knew I was not just crying “wolf.” More importantly, she realized that I was a member of the third class of people: the sheepdogs.

Sheepdogs, unlike sheep, are fully prepared to kill other human beings. But, unlike the wolves, they do so in order to protect those whom they love – most of whom are unable to fend for themselves. Their willingness to kill is a function of their love for their fellow citizens.

There are many people who find it odd that I shoot firearms on an almost daily basis with other sheepdogs like my good friend and occasional bodyguard, Barry Whitehead. They would certainly find it odd that we compare notes over who fired the most shots through the same hole in the head of an Osama Bin Laden target. And, needless to say, they would certainly not understand why I kill literally hundreds of live animals per year (usually small varmints) in order to perfect my skills in hitting targets that actually move.

But the wolves are still out there and we do not know when they will attack. But they will. And, for most of you, the sheepdog is your best and only hope.

Dr. Adams just read “On Combat” by Lt. Col. David Grossman (with Loren Christensen). He recommends you do the same immediately.

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About The Author
Mike Adams is a criminology professor at the University of North Carolina Wilmington and author of Feminists Say the Darndest Things: A Politically Incorrect Professor Confronts "Womyn" On Campus.
 
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How sad it is that the sheep will
often follow the wolves, thinking that they are the sheepdogs.

Meanwhile, the sheep listen to the wolves when they instruct the sheep to turn and bite the sheepdogs. And like stupid sheep, they follow directions.

There has been entirely too much punishment of law enforcement and military people, and too much reward of law breakers.

The sheep have been hypnotized into believing that this is the right way to go.

And they will keep following the wolf as he leads them to the pen where they will be shorn and slaughtered, paving the way for the wolves to take over.

Oh, Mike....
... if you truly have THOUSANDS of rounds of ammunition in your home, I truly hope that you have a sprinkler system or something like the fireworks shops down there have, as you essentially are living amongst the same dangerous cargo.

Once you get beyond a thousand rounds, you have a very serious fire safety question in storing that stuff - not unlike storing fireworks or gasoline. Put it out in a shed that you will tell the fire department to "let burn" because of what is in there and the hazard to going in after it -- that is one thing.

But to have this in your home, probably in your bedroom where it would be a hazard to the folks trying to save you and yours in the event of a housefire -- that is irresponsible. And is your gun safe fire rated to 7000 degrees (mine isn't) - the ammo would get 'cooked off' and not be fun to be around.

I agree with you on everything else but this -- ammo will burn and if you are between it and your route out, that won't be fun...

Wolves
Some of those wolves occupy positions of power, like than dingbat mayor of Washington, D.C., and are intent on de-fanging the sheepdogs. Then they'll have free access to the sheep if they decide to devour them.

Sheepdoggin'
I find it very scary to put ones self between the sheep and the wolf when you have no "fangs." I carry a Gerber lockback knife as state laws make it too prohibitive for me to carry my .45. My wife and I agree that this is a safe alternative, and she actually feels comfortable when we find ourselves in potentially dangerous situations.

Cheers to you sheepdogs!

Small arm ammunition cooking
off is not a big hazard, although it will contribute to the fire load. The force of bullets cooking off is usually so low that the lead doesn't even leave the case. Of course, if you hand load it depends on the kind of powder you use. Faster burning powder creats more force when cooking off. If you have black powder weapons, store black powder outside because it IS an explosive instead of a propellant.

Old joke...
..."There are three kinds of people.Those who can add and those who can't."

Two Kinds of People
Great article.. I really enjoy your articles. I esp. liked the one several weeks ago re. the right way to approach the Bible in general & the NT in particular. I used it in a Sunday school class as we were winding up a study of Revelations.
Thanks, and keep up the good work.
Tom

Welcome to the World!
Doc Mike, welcome to the world I was raised in. And you should store ammo separate from weapons, that way when it cooks off it will not damage said weapons.

I have borne arms all my life. It is not a right. You, American Citizen, are required to have shoulder arm, side arm, munitions and equipment consummate with serving as a soldier of the line, circa 1750s. A standard set forth by Maj Rogers and other militia officers at the end of the French and Indian War.

Hey Brewer...
If you and your wife "find ourselves in potentially dangerous situations" so often that you need to arm yourself, then either:

1) You are excessively paranoid and potentially dangerous to those around you; or

1) You live in a really bad neighborhood and should move.

I hope it's the latter.

2hotel9
Arms and munitions and equipment commensurate to a revolutionary war solider? Is that what all the fuss is about?!? I thought the NRA was fighting for our right to carry AK-47s and other assault rifles in public. Whew, am I relieved!

I think it's a splendid idea - roll back gun control to allow average citizens only the arms available in 1776. When's the last time you saw a crazed shooter take out 30 students with a musket?

Where do I sign?

To g_gaisford
Actually the theory is that you should keep and bear arms that are the equivalnet of what the military has.

And if all of the students has been carrying that loon would not have shot more than one or two before he was mowed down.

It's better to have one and not need it, than to need one and not have it.

Pirate
I'm not sure where your getting your information, but...

Without a closed system (a gun barrel) for the expanding gasses of the cartridge to propel the projectile through - there isn't much (if any) danger. And – gun powder is a very poor accelerant, a pile of it burns too quickly to even ignite wood.

But a few thousand rounds in a house fire would certainly SOUND like a war! :-)

Note to self - stop on way home and buy more bullets.

And Pirate –
I should also add; if Mike’s safe is anything like mine (he’s probably got one way nicer) it is fire rated at 1200 degrees F for 30 minutes. The only places in a house fire that have even a chance of exceeding that temperature are the kitchen and garage areas. I don’t know anyone who keeps their gun safes in the kitchen or garage.

You should actually study a few facts before you make less than informed posts.

Now – are you a sheep? What’s your real reason for wanting people to store ammunition “out of reach?”

Mike my Grandfather had a.....
twist on this. He claimed there were those:

1. who made things happen;
2. who watched things happen:
3. who wondered what the hell happened.

I do believe I'll have to merge the two, in the meantime it's time to clean the .45

Enjoy....

The kinds of people
There are the people who think teevee is reality; the people who think the MSM is reality; and the people who live in the real world and ignore both of the above.

There are people who on the day the Challenger blew up were barraging the teevee stations in Atlanta to take off the coverage of the Challenger and put on their soap operas. Some of these people called actually in hysterics.

There are people who can't understand the connection between their screaming, flailing two year old daughter and Paris Hilton -- and that their adulation and obsession over the latter is being sucked in and digested by that daughter.

There are people who wonder if anybody who works in their 62 story office building was paying attention during the very thourough evacuation and protection one hour presentation plus the smoke masks and emergency kits handed out to everyone last week -- and realized that people do not develop plans like this unless they know something you don't know but should.

There are people who wonder if anybody understands how easily the Financial Centre of Toronto could be destroyed by five determined people who are paying attention every day...and who were sitting on the subway trapped for an hour underground with no lights or air and wondering what would have happened if it had not been one of the weekly suicides on the track ahead but in fact a suicide bomber...and who wonder whether the people at the TTC can stop stuffing money down their pants long enough to consider this possibility either. But doubt it.

My 2 cents
Hey Prof, are you just now figuring that out? Man, you've spent WAY too much time hanging around the campus.

I can't hold that against you. And a....welcome to the club.

nam - better joke
There are 10 kinds of people in the world - those who understand binary, and those that don't.

g_gaisford...
..."I think it's a splendid idea - roll back gun control to allow average citizens only the arms available in 1776. When's the last time you saw a crazed shooter take out 30 students with a musket?"

Good idea! And while we are at it,lets roll back voting rights to 1776 when only white,male,property owners 21 or older could vote!

Where do I sign?


safe safety
if you have a lot of weapons and ammo you can afford to do it right.

when i collected full auto in oregon i had the safes made, deep bolted to a concrete floor in an oversized garage and built a concrete room around them.

i wa not interested in turning on the tube and seeing my weapons and ammo used by wolves downtown. for people nervous about gun nuts, please take the time to know one. having the right to carry and the right to own, is a huge responsibility. i think you will find very few looking forward to making the news by using firearms even legaly against wolves. just because we will, does not mean we either seek or desire. killing someone was always my biggest nightmare. as a single dad, the girls and i had a plan. we had a retreatable safe place with arms and communication most likely for each us to be able to get to. i darn well was not gonna kill someone for trying to steal a tv and stereo. however,proceed to the end of the hall and come after the family, and hasta la vista baby.

Brewer
Gerber does make a nice lock-back. A flick of the wrist pops them open and often a glittering knife is more intimidating than a pistol.

However, a 230 gr JHP in a Colt .45 (ACP) is my choice for a truly threatening situation. "Don't leave home without it!" I cannot imagine a reason why I would solicit the government's permission to defend myself. Indeed, I cannot imagine even informing the government that I possess such a resource.

bporter...
...put me down as one of those who don't understand binary! :-)

Gee
Isn’t it swell that Mike is such a good doggy and so brave too as he shoots Osama Bin Laden targets? Gee, it sure was convenient that he didn’t convert to sheep dog conservatism until after he was too old to serve in the military.

Mike is a Treasure
Mike,

You talk and sound like men I knew when I was young. Too bad that so many young men have been wussified in all the wrong ways. Starting with knowing right from wrong and how to be a male member of society.

Thank God for you and your ilk who have not allowed the brain-washing to change your God-given nature and who have channeled your testosterone into righteous paths.

MikeR
You guys kill me. Adams didn't serve so he's not entitled to have an opinion or voice on political issues?

You better hope this never becomes a national policy or you and your leaders will be completely out of Washington.

MikeR
Inane and irrelevant to the topic as usual.

RE: Pirate
You've watched too many movies. Smokeless gunpowder used in modern ammunition is no more a fire hazard than a stack of newspapers. Ask any firefighter, and he'll tell you the same.

Black powder, however, is a different story. Firefighters don't like that too much.

Even worse is something I bet YOU yourself have: propane gas tanks. You tell a firefighter that you have one or more of those tanks for your grill in or near your burning house, and those firefighters will just sit back and watch your house burn down because if those tanks blow, they'll destroy the entire house and anyone inside.

Jimbo,
storing the bulk of your ammo away from the gun isn't an awful idea. It goes without saying that you will have 3 or 4 clips for each weapon handy.

Splendid Ideas
"G. Gaisford" writes, "I think it's a splendid idea - roll back freedom of the press to allow average citizens only the media available in 1776. When's the last time you saw a crazed pedophile send kiddy-porn worldwide with a hand-operated printing press?"

Actually, that's not EXACTLY what G. wrote -- but the idea is the same.

Serving in the Military
Serving in the military does not necessarily make you a man or a patriot. Benedict Arnold and John Murtha have proven that. Both of them cowards and traitors.

Icedog
Expanding on MikeR's logic:

You can't talk about politics unless you've held elected office.

You can't have a conversation about fuel prices unless you work for an oil company.

You can't complain about congress unless you can prove you voted.

You can't have an opinion about foriegn policy unles you have held a diplomatic post.

You can't talk about immigration unless you are an illegal alien, excuse me, migrant, uh no..... undocumentd... no it would now be "Guest Worker".

beowulfe
Very good point. Not to mention the number of people who have full or partially full gas cans around the house (for lawnmower, weed eater, etc.). I attended an EOD demonstration in which they blew up just 1 gallon of gasoline....the size of the fireball was staggering.

Best Quote!
If townhall ever does a "Best of Book" or "Best Quotes" book, then this NEEDS to go in it.

"the ATF, which, in my opinion, should be a convenience store and not a federal agency."

Icedog
Yah, you guys kill me too. Dr. Adams is entitled to have an opinion and voice on any topic he likes. That is not and never will be the point. The problem is that he wanders from the point about human nature to brag about his proficiency with weapons. And braggadocio it is. One should be proud about their ability to hit the bull’s eye, but Mike behaves as though he’s actually defending the country. I will be the first to admit what a lousy soldier I was, but at least I was one and I’ll be damned if I going to listen to some young braggart talk tough without commenting.

Cookie: Now I know that this thread is supposed to be about what guns we own and how bad liberals are, but curmudgeons like me like to comment about what’s actually written and not just engage in some kind of mutual admiration society. Of course, that doesn’t work with dogs does it? They don’t think do they? They just mindlessly follow their master or the pack.

Leroy: To expand on one’s logic, you must follow a linier path, not make a jump. If I were to do the same to you, I might conclude that no one can comment here unless they are in complete agreement with a pre-established set of beliefs.

RA
you left out john kerry

MikeR...
I think the problem people have with your earlier post - at least, the problem I have with it - is that it was completely unrelated to the topic. It was plainly just a personal attack on Prof. Adams. Until you can account for your own behavior, you should be careful about attacking the tact of other posters' logic.

Things do change
My lottery number for the draft in 1969 was 312, and my draft card read 1-A-H which the local draft board said was, "Women and children first" when I asked what the H was for. I was very happy I wasn't going to Vietnam.

Then I began to grow up. I got married, cut my hair, raised a family, bought a gun, voted conservative, support our military, got another gun, still voted conservative and I hope to vote conservative in 08.

A long way from 1-A-H. And with Mike my favorite target is Osama.

MikeR
... has need of a spell check, a grammar check, a logic check and more importantly a reality check.

best column ever
I have read most of your Townhall columns. I enjoy your satirical wit...a lot.

But I believe that this is the best, most interesting column that you have ever written.

One day I suspect that your neighbors will be glad that there is a sheepdog living next door.

Leftist Trolls All Over TH
MikeR, like leftists everywhere you have a serious problem comprehending the written word. Adams never said how "bad" liberals are, but he did beautifully illustrate how mindlessly stupid they are - like you, for instance. In point of fact, he actually has a certain fondness for you sheeple seeing as how he would lay down his life to protect you. OTOH, sheeple like you would turn his *ss in to the government (wolves) for a jelly doughnut and cup a coffee.

As for Adams "bragging" about his proficiency with firearms, THAT is the point, you imbecile! If we had a country full of guys like Mike Adams, most of our problems would vanish overnight. One thing I CAN guarantee is we woulnd't have murderous, psychotic bastards calmly walking through a school and blowing away 30 plus people.

MikeR
I find it very interesting and enlightening that Adams talks about a portion of our society who are “gutless sheep living in denial” and you see this as an attack on liberals...Adams never mentioned liberals or conservatives.

It looks like your conscience knows the truth.

Icedog et al
Actually, there are to kinds of people - those who think that there are three kinds of people and those who think that those who think there are three kinds of people are just satisfied with reducing everything to a stupid metaphor.

Two kinds of people
Those who have guns and potential victims.

Those who pay taxes and leaches.

Leftist Trolls Make Us Barf!
Icedog, we have to reduce these social problems to simple metaphors so little socialist street urchins like you can "grasp" the underlying reasons why things are now the way they are.

It's not an accident, sir, that we now live in a country wherein fully 95% of the people have a death wish and are scared shitles** of firearms. Neither is it an accident that of this 95%, a significant percentage in the MSM, academia and positions of public trust are intent on disarming that remaining 5% who are more scared of the government and criminals than they are of firearms.

If you leftists interpreted the 2nd Amendment the way you do the 1st, we'd all be allowed to park an A1A Abrhams tank in our driveway and install a few rocket launchers on the rear deck.


The sheep
unfortunately comprise a huge portion of the demograhic in the democrat party...the ignorant demographic. These people can be best described by example. Some of them were going to vote for Al Gore because of the way he kissed Tipper at the convention when he was running....nuff said.

Audi, you made good points

Benedict Arnold
RA

Be fair. Arnold was a traitor, but certainly no coward. I don't know enough about Murtha to say.

Sheepdogs...
WOOF!

Five Years Old?
The other day somebody posted on townhall that he was teaching his five year-old child to shoot a gun. I asked whether this was for self-protection, protection of property, or hunting but he did not reply. I'm not trying to be snotty here but am interested in a serious answer. What is the rationale for teaching a child to handle firearms at age five? Have worked with children and would question whether at that age they have the physical, emotional, or cognitive development for such a task. Does the NRA have a position on this? Comments? Just curious.

furthermore
I like referring the public at large as sheeple anyway...

MikeR
If all you have to contribute is name calling and insults, that is fine. But don't fool yourself into thinking there is any virtue in it.

MikeR writes:
"I will be the first to admit what a lousy soldier I was, but at least I was one and I’ll be damned if I going to listen to some young braggart talk tough without commenting."

I too spent time in the military and was quite bad at it. When the inevitable occurs, my family plan is to head straight to my non-military brother's home where all the guns are ready to go. I'm not so foolish to think that being a sheepdog requires military experience. My brother understands the threat and is prepared to deal with it, unlike some former-military sheep.

Lilly writes:
"What is the rationale for teaching a child to handle firearms at age five?"

With a large segment of the world teaching their children from birth on to hate non-muslims, it makes sense that others begin teaching their children how to deal with haters from the earliest ages.

BLAM! - Right Between the Eyes!!!
Bman, your retort to Lilly was absolutely devastating! You said, "What about teaching elementary aged children how to put a condom on a cucumber???"

This is the way to slam right back at these socialist street urchins. Take their smart-*aa questions designed to propagandize and turn it 180 degrees around - right back at THEM!

This is what I do in social conversation. I turn it right around on these leftist pinheads and will not continue the discussion until they give me an answer.

Of course, they always say, "Well, they're not the same!" At which point I ask to to explain in detail why they're not. The conversation usually ends right there.

AudiR10
Your post about the bluehairs wanting their soaps after Challenger reminds me of when I was last in San Diego for a long (2.5 month) Navy avionics school.

I woke up on a Sunday morning, expecting another student to show up at my barracks door ready to go get some brewskis so we could blow the whole day watching NFL and NASCAR. I noticed that the light coming through the window shades was rather dim, which was odd since the forecast was for a nice clear Chamber Of Commerce type day. I opened the door as he was walking through the parking lot, and noticed the smell of smoke and that all the cars had a thin layer of fine ash on them. I looked up and saw the sun, well barely saw it. There was an area of the sky that was red instead of gray, and it was somewhat circular. Oooooooookay, there's a big fire in the area. No big deal. We still need to go get our beer before kickoff.

No such luck, GIs. We got our beer and munchies, but there was no NFL on the tube. All day long, the network affiliates were all-fire, all the time. San Diego was surrounded by about 6 major wildfires. By the 2nd quarter of the 2nd game, they finally put the games on in a box in the corner of the screen, but kept yapping about the fires.

On Monday, the fires were actually threatening large populated areas. Quite a few houses burned and lots more got evacuated. It was much worse than Sunday. Well, everything but the TV was. Ya see, the bluehairs got their soaps, with fire updates happening in the commercial breaks.

iandelor
Your point about personal attacks is well taken and you are right to chide me. Please note the vehemence and language used to attack me and perhaps you can explain the difference.

MARC: My you seem to be quite good at providing that almost comical level of hypocrisy that make TH so much better than the other sites. Now that you mention it, I think I did see Dr. Adams patrolling my neighborhood last night. He was so cleverly disguised that almost didn’t notice. He must have had a busy night too because this morning on my lawn I found the tiny remains of 2 terrorists, a dictator, several Muslims, at least one union thug, a democrats (duly elected) and the last liberal on my street.

Chezjacq: You got me there. I can’t deny my poor writing skills. Of course, don’t ever make the exact same comment about one of the conservative regulars. You’ll become immediately assailed on all sides with righteous indignation.

JailTheSocialistStreetUrchins (I love that name): My reading comprehension is fine. Might I suggest that you take a moment to actually read what I wrote? You will find that I never said that Dr. Adams was talking about liberals. Furthermore, I wrote that one should be proud of their marksmanship but that the style is that of a braggart. For example, what difference does the type of target make to the point of the story? It is obvious that you have strong feelings for Dr. Adams, but as for me, I have no reason to believe that Dr. Adams would lay down his life for anything since it’s all talk so far. Now if he had actually served in the military or been a police officer, I would feel differently; and that has been my point from the very beginning.

Icedog: I also find it interesting and enlightening since I never said anything of the kind yet you somehow came to that conclusion. I said that people on the thread would be talking about their guns and putting down liberals. So far, that’s been fairly accurate.

Georgetwin: I’m so flattered that you quoted me. Unfortunately, I’ve never called anyone a name and I don’t use personal insults. Keep trying though. This is the closest you’ve ever come to making a point.

SimJim: You’re going to your brother’s and not Mike’s?

Simjim
Excellent point regarding the kids being trained as Jihadis from birth.

My first experiance with firearms was when I was about 6, on a BB gun range at a YMCA daycamp. My little troop had just spent about 30 minutes plinking away and were on our way back to the storage locker for the weapons when we noticed a few camp counselors aiming BB guns up into a tree. Someone pointed out a copperhead snake up in the branches. Our counselor lined us up, pointed out the target, made sure we all had good aquisition, and gave the "ready, aim, FIRE!" order. The other counselors popped at the same time. Dead snake fell through the branches. A shovel was used to remove the head to make sure. 8 little guys rejoiced at our triumph!

A couple of years later at camp with the Indian Guides, my 'tribe' spent all of our free activity time on the rifle range (.22s) or on the archery range. A bunch of well-trained kids we were. That's where I spent much of my free activity time every time I went to summer camp.

Just wish I had the time and accessability to some ranges now. I'd be training my wife and daughters, or getting someone better than me to train 'em.

JailTheSocialistStreetUrchins
You might want to reread the post from jo j (not me). You fired at the wrong target.

MikeR
You were the first person to inject "liberal" into this thread. In fact, the words "conservative, Democrat, Republican, politics, etc." were never even brought up before you. A couple posters used the word "sheeple" and you read that as a slam on liberals.

Liberalism Is A Sickness
MikeR, if leftists have one thing in common above all else, it's that to a person they will shamelessly disown their past positions when confronted with them, and/or flat out lie about what it is they said. Here's what you said, sir:

"Cookie: Now I know that this thread is supposed to be about what guns we own and how bad liberals are, but curmudgeons like me like to comment about what’s actually written and not just engage in some kind of mutual admiration society."

Mike, if that doesn't constitute an observation on your part that Adams was talking about liberals, then Hickory Dickory Dock = Mc2. Absolutely no other construction can be put on that statement - none.

I also notice constant, gratuitous references on your part to your military service. While this may not apply directly to you, I further note that almost every anti-war or Bush-hating troll that comes into TH, various Yahoo chatrooms, Google Groups and so forth constantly remind the rest of us of their "military service."

At last count, when we add up all these leftist trolls on TH boards, Google Groups, Yahoo and sundry other chatrooms, we now have some 945,346,875 "Veterans Against Bush and the War"
running around the country.

Since that's over three times the entire population of the United States, perhaps we should ask the US Census Bureau to be more careful compiling their next census in 2010.

Icedog
Yes, I was the first. Let’s call it a prediction based on experience that turned out to be correct. Do you have any other straws you want to grasp?

Laugh out loud funny!
lilly, the drive by poster, is crabbing about people not answering her.

Sheepdog
Thanks for another good article, Mike.
(I'll read the book & get more ammo for my safe)
v/r Dan

2 types of sheepdogs
Good article.

"Nomadic shepherds on the Steppes of Hungary have kept two kinds of sheep dogs since the ninth century. One was a big white guard dog that protected the flock at night and the other was a small active herding dog, the Puli, that actually herded the sheep by day. They did not cross breed the two types and through the centuries the unique characteristics of each became firmly fixed."

Perhaps the guard sheepdog is the police/military and the herding dog is the Church, presently replaced by the MSM?




MikeR
My point was that you should just say, "Thank God for the sheepdogs. Due to their efforts I can freely criticize my country and trash its history and reputation, while remaining completely safe from the wolves”, instead of trying to nitpick Adams’ column without actually countering any points he made.

Well.....
I never cared too much for truly bad soldiers and sailors. And, I have to say, that just being in the military carries no guarantee that that person will necessarily lay down his/her life for anything.

JailTheSocialistStreetUrchins
I see it’s back to reading comprehension. As you noted, I was referring to the thread. The thread is what we are engaged in now. Dr. Adams does not comment on the thread. He is the author of the article.

Gratuitous in this case means ‘not called for by the circumstances’; and constant means ‘continually occurring or recurring’. As I only mentioned my military service once, neither word applies. I can’t answer for how you came up with that figure or the comments of others, but I can say that I’ve never made an anti-Bush statement, so that entire statement doesn’t apply. Why don’t you take some time and figure out what really bothers you about my comment and write that instead of things that bother you in general.

Icedog
This next straw is an even further grasp. I’m not criticizing my country or trashing its history and reputation. No comments even remotely connected to that were made. If it will help, I’ll write a retort myself of what I’ve actually said and sign it with your name. You seem to be so desperate to get me that it is clouding your reasoning ability.

g_gaisford writes:
g_gaisford...
..."I think it's a splendid idea - roll back gun control to allow average citizens only the arms available in 1776. When's the last time you saw a crazed shooter take out 30 students with a musket?"

And while we are at it, lets roll back the First Amendment to only protect newspapers. There was no TV or radio in 1776. We can get the left wing commentators off the air.

Where do I sign up?

Shep rules
Can't say enough good about Dr. Adams and his savvy survival stuff. What a swell way to begin the week! Ya wanta drill holes at a distance, ya gotta have the right bit tosser. To paraphrase one of my heros, "Walk softly but carry a Glockmeister tuned Glock!"
Time to run my dog pack, my mod. G-32 on my hip. God bless our Union and Dr. "Shep" Adams.

Mike from tucson...
Actually, it is a Republic.

The Sheepfold . . .
Three kinds of people: an excellent analogy!

The sheep (those who see no evil until they are surrounded by danger) are all in one sheepfold: the Democrat party! Unless we have more sheepdogs in Washington (those who have a realistic and rational view of the international scene) our nation will face danger as it has never faced before. It is sad to me that the Democrat party has been captured -- hook, line, and sinker -- by those who see America as the cause of all the world's problems.

Only then will the MoveOn.Organization do what might save our nation: ORGANIZE.....AND MOVE ON to some other place

Should have said . . .
Uh Oh, a type I didn't proofread.

In the last paragraph I should have said, "MAYBE THEN the MoveOn.Org. will do what might save our nation: "ORGANIZE.....AND MOVE ON."

MikeR
MikeR writes:

"Isn’t it swell that Mike is such a good doggy"

Typical Liberal Lies!

And some sheep think they're sheepdogs!
9/11 turned everyone into wanna-be vigilante heroes. Mike, if you don't think you're one of the 'sheep' for boasting about your weapons stash and how you're ready ta use it against any islamo-commie who steps foot on yer land, think again.


Peace would be unique. The peaceful are not sheep.

what I worry about
What I worry about is when the sheep having defanged the sheepdogs and the wolves shows up, I expect the sheep to throw up certain targets, food, to the wolves to save themselves from the throatcutters. No I am not armed. I was raised without guns and feel very uncomfortable with them around the house.


The Lord is my Shepherd
and it's true that He has sheepdogs. I am grateful for those who are willing to put their lives on the line to protect and serve the general public, and I don't have any problem with guns per se, but I don't feel the need to have guns to protect myself or my family. I've put myself in God's hands and am confident that I am never out of His sight and care. Though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil. Not a sparrow falls to the ground without the Father, and I am of far more worth to Him than a sparrow. Any sort of "tragedy" that might happen to me is nothing that He doesn't know about, nothing that He doesn't have the power to stop if it doesn't form part of his good will, and nothing that doesn't work together for good with all the other things going on in my life.

MikeR: Really?
MikeR writes: Monday, June, 11, 2007 8:54 AM
Gee
Isn’t it swell that Mike is such a good doggy and so brave too as he shoots Osama Bin Laden targets? Gee, it sure was convenient that he didn’t convert to sheep dog conservatism until after he was too old to serve in the military.

Really? You selectively extend gravitas to those who have actually served in the military. Especially the typical disaffected, Bad Conduct Discharge/General Discharge, former junior enlisted types who agree w/ your charming politics. Not in principle mind you, but as a way to thumb their noses at the “military establishment” that essentially rejected them. Such man-children generally have a myopic view of rank in terms of “class” and privilege w/ no regard for the underlying responsibilities, i.e., being responsible for the well-being of someone else aside from their own sorry skins. I am a Service-academy educated, field grade reserve officer & I grow tired of the whole left-wing “Chicken hawk” invalidation technique employed to silence anyone who disagrees w/ the Left in principle WRT Iraq. Why? Because all of you enlightened leftists were completely silent during the Clinton Administration’s many military misadventures, i.e. necessary wars for the following reasons:

(a) No strategic value other than UN/European popular opinion:
+ Our misadventures in Bosnia (Bombing/killing hundreds if not thousands of innocent women & children in Belgrade)
+Our misadventures in Somalia, where several US Rangers/Delta force soldiers were killed because the Clinton administration wouldn’t authorize the use of armored vehicles (too OFFENSIVE you know)

(b) Racial politics: Black congressional caucus playing the race card & invading Haiti IOT put their pet Marxist thug, Aristide, back in power in Haiti.
We’re still in Bosnia & Haiti- where’s our exit strategy?? Now the same mental defectives want us to “redeploy” our troops to Darfur, Sudan

Bottom line, said misadventures had no strategic value WRT the interests of the US. Men died for the sake of appearance over substance. The demonstrated physical cowardice of Bill Clinton was immaterial to the Democrat Party when considering the validity of the Somalia, Bosnia & Haiti (I WAS THERE) misadventures vice “muscular leftist “ Iraq WAR critics’ (i.e., Senator Webb) apparent gravitas due to previous military service. According to Democrat double-standard logic, said gravitas apparently grants Mr. Webb an esoteric insight into the nature of the Iraqi conflict currently not accessible to we non-Democrats. Or am I wrong?


Georgetwin
I really though you were going to try and contribute something for once, but I see you’ve reverted to pejorative statements. My quoted statement is not a lie, typical, liberal or otherwise. Dr. Adams wrote, “More importantly, she realized that I was a member of the third class of people: the sheepdogs.” In this statement he identifies himself as a dog, figuratively of course. I commented that in my opinion that was good. Of course I was being ironic at the time, but no falsehood occurred. I think you are expending too much energy trying to be derogatory.

We can satisfy lilly
by teaching our children to put the condoms on snub-nosed revolvers. Just call the shorties liberals.

Demosthenes
You are on a strange tangent that really bares no connection with the statements I made or the point behind them. Through dealing with the comments I have received in response, I have made my position clear. Perhaps you have not taken the time to read them or you did and misunderstood. In short we have an individual who has devoted many words to describe his martial abilities and the motives behind them. Yet, in light of this, he has never availed himself to the service of our nation or community. I find that to be an odd contradiction. To me, actions speak much louder than words. I am not calling Dr. Adams a chicken hawk. I am calling him a big talker. I have made no comments regarding our present war or politics in general other than to say comments on this thread will probably have an anti-liberal component. Your entire comment and line of reasoning belies your name.

mike r.
Everyone is clearly confused and irrational except for you.


Signing on "late"
MikeR writes: Monday, June, 11, 2007 8:54 AM

"Gee, it sure was convenient that he didn’t convert to sheep dog conservatism until after he was too old to serve in the military."

Why does that matter? Even Jesus extends His grace to those who come on board at the last hour. We serve in different ways.

What about someone who designed air-to-ground missles, flight simulators so the the stealth bomber pilots were trained before the plane was built, training simulators for a new class of mine sweepers, new methods of teaching software engineering for the Air Force, and the software that NORAD uses to send and decode messages? Is that serving?

Yeah, Right
MikeR, we all know a leftist troll when we see one, and your kind are now stinking up the joint. Christ, we can't even have our own conservative website without you little socialist street urchins following us like little puppies.

Cowards?
'Benedict Arnold and John Murtha... Both of them cowards and traitors.'

Are you sure about this? So if a guy disagrees with your view of the world he is a coward and a traitor, no matter what he had before you found out he disagreed with you?

Armed and Protected
There is sure to be a group of the "sheep" who will complain that by being armed and ready to protect ones self, that is provaction toward the muslim lunatics. They want everyone to sit, unarmed, unprotected and ready to submit to the forced conversion to islam.

What is difficult to comprehend is that many of these "sheep" declare that they are non-religious or anti-religious. Yet, they basically demand that the rest of the civilized world be unarmed, unprotected and ready to submit to a world controlled by an islamic mob. Do these people ever think of what it would be like to be forced to walk around in a hot sheet, head wraped in a rag, unable to enjoy life, simply following someone else' opinion of what GOD wants man to do?

Mike R
Chuck says: Your Head is in ur butt.

Ammo IS a HazMat and Fire Hazard!
> beowulfe writes: Smokeless gunpowder used in
> modern ammunition is no more a fire hazard
> than a stack of newspapers. Ask any
> firefighter, and he'll tell you the same.

I *was* a firefighter and was told to be very worried about ammunition in a fire. I was told that while the bullets wouldn't go anywhere, the brass would schrapnel and pieces of that could go flying and potentially hurt you.

I was also told that live power lines are dangerous and when you see one smoking and sparking on the ground, stay away from it.

At some point, you just follow orders and assume that maybe the folks telling you this sort of stuff are right. I have seen downed powerlines and I stayed away until the power company pulled the fuse. And while I have never seen an ammo fire, I (being young) did pull the bullet out of one of my rifle rounds (not so sure I would do it now) and touched off the propellent that I had poured into a pile. It was an impressive flame, although I can't say how hot it burnt at.

But there are two more things:
First small arms ammunition (the technical shipping term) is considered a ORM-D Hazardous Material. If you trust the government, there is a reason WHY it has the ORM-D labeling.

Then I looked at the Mass State Fire Regulations and 527 CMR 13.11 specificly addresses the transportation and storage of this material that is supposedly as safe "as a stack of newspapers." MA law (527 CMR is considered law by another law) limits residential storage of primers to 5000 and smokeless powder to a total of 48 lbs. (Black powder is limited to 5 lbs.)

Local fire departments are given the authority to regulate the storage of these materials.

Massachusetts has strict fire regulations, in part to some rather tragic past occurances (Coconut Grove fire comes to mind) but they aren't going to write section 13.11 without a reason for it...

So I come back to what I said before: if you are going to have large amounts of ammunition in your residence, you need to think about it being a potential fire hazard.

I also was told - and this seems logical - that smokeless powder (a propellant) burns in the absence of oxygen. This is VERY significant in firefighting, you can't use removal of oxygen (smothering) as a means of putting the fire out if it burns without oxygen in the first place.

By contrast, something like Gasoline is limited by the air supply. You can put a match into a FULL gas can (not that I would do it) and all you would get is a torch. Think about what a "fuel/air explosive" is (and how dispersed the fuel has to be) to understand how poorly something like gasoline will burn.

So I will stand with saying that more than a thousand rounds (100 boxes) of ammunition should be considered a potential fire hazard. Sure there are lots of other dangerous thing (watching the dumb blond cashier toss a can of starting fluid around scared me) but why take unnecessary risks?

Only Rhe Strong Survive
To Dave Stone:

You, sir, are a man of great wisdom and exhibit a profound understanding of the human condition. Far too many in this country, and this includes most conservatives as well, have this silly notion that this experiment in democracy is written in stone and will last forever. Not so, Dave, and even our forefathers a couple hundred plus years ago realized as much. Freedom and liberty are periodically wriiten in the blood of those who will fight for it.

Your comments reveal what I have always felt, Dave, which is that what is now happening to this country cannot be by accident. Those who wish to be in control will sacrifice the entire herd if need be as long as they think they will be left standing.

The key to really getting all of this under control is to root out and kill these bacterium before they cover the entire Petri dish. We temporize at our peril, for once they control the levers of government entirely, Soylent Green will be as a Sunday afternoon picnic. The time is coming when hard men must soon act, or they will perish along with the sheep.

Lilly asks the following:
Lilly asks re. 5 year olds being taught to use guns; if the NRA has a position on this?

Im an NRA member and coincidently was taught to use a gun at 5. Im not saying that 5 is THE age all kids should to be taught gun use. I was an above average IQ kid, mature for my age, well coordinated and well adjusted. The prime reason I was taught to use a gun was for safety. This is also the NRA position. I grew up in a home with guns. Statistics show that kids who are taught respect and are familiarity with guns, are less likely to misuse them or have accidents. Yesterdays headlines in my local news paper, the San Francisco Chronicle bore tragic testimony this. [“5 Year Old finds uncles’ gun and kills himself”]
This kid had never handled a gun before the day he found his uncles gun and blew his head off. Whether a kid should be taught gun safety at 5, 6, or 7 depends on the kid. But they should be taught.

NOTE: After I demonstrated proper use and respect for guns at 5, I was given an air rifle at 6 and a .22 rifle at 8. At 12 I was given the key to my dads gun locker, with access to all his rifles, and hand guns. This was common practice where I grew up. By the time I was in 13, I and my friends took guns to school, as all High Schools had rifle teams. How "Politically Incorrect" these days. And here’s an interesting point. There were NO incidents of gun misuse, either deliberately or accidentally. So I submit that it’s not GUNS that have become the problem: WE have.

ummm....
Yes, I know that 1000 rounds doesn't correspond to 100 boxes - of anything I can think of - but I was trying to make a point. At some point you gotta say 'fire hazard'...

Anyway as to the issue of fire safety training in highrise buildings, I would inquire if anyone recently got a grant. There is a lot of "homeland security" money out there and not all of it is being wasted on utter stupidity.

0r one's suspicions might well be right. We will never know all the things that were done for us during the Cold War and we will never know about this one either.

Ragnar & Lilly
Taught my three young men firearms safety from the start: when I was a cop and had my issued and off-duty revolver in the house. The first time they fired a high powered (M14) rifle, they were 10, 7 and 4 respectively. The smaller ones fired it with Dad as the main recoil absorber as one recoiling mass, but my big one did it on his own after the first shot.

When I ran a range for my IRR group, they would come with me, watch others handle weapons properly and get to fire some. Lilly, shooters are a gregarious, friendly bunch and love to teach the PROPER respect and handling of weapons.

My youngest got to fire a .50 sniper rifle at the range, and later, when he was in ROTC, fired the .50 BMG. When asked how he liked it, he replied, "Well, Sergeant, I actually prefer the .50 sniper rifle." Caught a load of flak for the remark, came home, told his mother (retired reserve ANC 0-5, Desert Storm vet) of the flak, she e-mailed the ROTC PMS and said "if Cadet A told anyone he fired that weapon at his father's range, he did and God knows what else he's fired there." She happened to outrank everyone at the ROTC department at the time. He told me later what she had done. I also outranked them (FA Reserve Component 0-5, Abn, Rgr, Vietnam REMF), so I never had to comment to them.

Saw the Grossman article (at that time) years ago, and yes, I'm a sheepdog. Proudly, responsibly and forever.

Even Conservatives Are Now Total Wusses
The mere fact that so many fuc**ng wussy, PC "men" even worry about all this bull*hit tells you all you need to know about the downward spiral in this once great country. There was a time not too long ago when most men would have told the freakin' government to take a fuc*ing flying leap. Now they ASK the government what is LEGAL. See anything wrong with this picture, boys and girls?

Self-Proclaimed Sheepdogs
When the sheepdogs serve the statists or tyrants, what differentiates them from the wolves? I am sure that the SS, Stasi, NKVD, Securitate, SAVAMA and a host of others also considered themselves to be sheepdogs. They preserved public order and served the interest of the state.

Remember when the BATF were called "jack booted thugs" by the NRA and others during the Clinton years? Were they wolves, sheepdogs, both? How about now? If they come for the contents of Mike's gun safe, what will be his thoughts?

What about a federal agency monitoring Internet postings for comments that seem to advocate the killing of our fellow citizens. Is it a wolf or sheepdog? Are the posters wolves or sheepdogs? When the sheepdogs start making meals of the sheep, they revert to the feral nature and lose their way.

Mike Adams is a humorous read. I hope that his over-the-top style is just satire and done to freak out the Brady bunch. Otherwise, he borders on sounding like he has a firearms fetish.

My firearms are just another set of tools in the home. I know that one needs more than just guns and ammo to survive a societal collapse. Mike should ditch the condo and purchase some tillable acreage in the hinterlands. He can't hold out like Omega Man in a condo surrounded by bad guys.

Gunner
Over the past month I’ve seen numerous posts from Lilly. She’s an extreme Lib. So my guess is that trying to reason with her on the issue of guns is wasted effort. She usually reacts out of emotion rather than reason, (typical for Libs). I’ve never seen her respond to those criticizing her, though she’s quick to respond to those she disagrees with. This includes almost everyone who posts here; the majority being conservatives.

P.S. Im also a retired 0-5. USN

Liberasl Think Life is a Party.
Alopekos teumesios, you haven't a freakin' clue, do you? Sir, do you understrand, do you even begin to fathom that when it begins to all unravel that all bets are off? Do you even begin to understand that when heads and body parts are literally rolling in our gutters that you might have made a "slight" miscalculation?

Sir, we are heading for a revolution of unimaginably violent proportions within 30 years, and it will pit white people against brown-skinned peasants from Mexico - and with Washington DC itself supporting them. It will be a revolution of immense proportions, and when all is said and done, when we take care of these Mexican hordes, we will go after those in our government who urged them on.

Sir, when people support revolutions, other people take names. There is a cost to everything. In cases like this, it's your life if you bet wrong.

And maybe I am a total wussie...

Look, it is against a half dozen laws to toss a bunch of full 100lb propane bottles (the circa 1950's ones that stand 4 feet tall) overboard and let them drift in on the tide - so you can pick them up on the beach when they ground out. (It is even better if you don't own said beach and the property owner doesn't like you doing this.)

But if one does this, one wants to be very VERY sure that every one of them has the protective cover screwed over the valve because if one of those valves gets snapped off, the entire tank is going downrange like a 180 lb bottle rocket.

The government says that McDonalds is supposed to chain the CO2 soda tanks to the wall. And if they do this, they won't have tanks going through the wall and have to pay damages to cars in the parking lot. (Actually, I think it was only one car - and the tank made it out there...)

The government says that if you have a FryOLater with a whole bunch of grease heated to something like 700 degrees, you gotta have some fire suppression equipment. If you have ever seen one of those catch fire (and I have) you kinda realize real fast that having this sort of stuff is a really nice idea.

There is a regulation that prohibits any house in Massachusetts from requiring a key to exit (the double core deadbolts) - because if the place catches on fire and you don't have your keys with you, you burn to death. Now you can put one of these things in if you want to - but if you do, well I know someone who leaves his key in the inside lock when he is in the building....

The evil government requires that every gasoline tanker have the number 1203 on it so that folks know that it is gasoline in it. Isn't it a good thing to identify which tanker has gasoline in it and which just has milk?

So you can toss all the ammo in your house you want, you can fire dirty weapons and even do a few 20/12 shotgun bursts for fun if you like, but if you are going to do something dangerous, at least know that it *is* dangerous.

When cleaning a weapon, is it wise or a woose to check and make sure that a round isn't chambered in it?

You Say You Want a Revolution..
Jail,

So, tell us how you really feel about Bush and the immigration bill.

What's my miscalculation? I have my bug out bag ready and my supplies cached for staying put. I'm probably the only civilian in my county with radiation dosimeters and potassium iodide tablets. I'll bet that my stash of supplies make even Mike Adams look woefully unprepared.

I don't care to join your revolution. I just plan to hunker down with other rational survivalists and keep my family alive by whatever means necessary. That plan works much better for me than fantasizing about living a gory, first person shooter game. Hint - It's better to move than to die.

*****************************************

Pirate,

C'mon. Give it up. Ammo is dangerous. That's why we buy it. Ammunition is only a fire hazard in the sense that it makes an already existing conflagration more dangerous. It's not the same as keeping cans of gasoline next to your space heater. When you look at causes of fires, it doesn't even get on the list.

Between us Sheepdogs
Hooah Mike

I say: "Risk Management"
> alopekos teumesios writes: Ammunition is
> only a fire hazard in the sense that it
> makes an already existing conflagration
> more dangerous.

My point exactly.

And the reason why you would want to make a minor fire into a major fire IS?!?!?!?!?
And the particular reason why you would want the minor fire in the place where you and yours are sleeping to become a major fire BEFORE YOU CAN GET OUT is because?

It is one thing to have a fire and a couple of boxes of ammo that might or might not cook off. But if you increase the amount of ammuniton, you are increasing the likelyhood that any one particular box will cook off, that it will be able to set off adjacent boxes, and the general fire load increase from the whole mess.

One beer and you can drive home. One keg and you probably can't walk so well...

And my point is simple: as gun owners we have to be perfect because there are so many against us. We have to think safety because the other side thinks safety in the context of no guns at all. And if you wouldn't fire a dirty weapon (unlike someone whom I know who shot the bolt out the side of a .308 because it was so very dirty) and if you wouldn't look down a barrel without making sure a round wasn't still chambered, why wouldn't you want to be safe about storing vast quantities of ammo in your personal residence?

Like, umm, WHY?

How many rounds can you fire out of a civillian weapon before the "barrel melts down" or at least needs to be cooled before it can be safely fired again? And how many hundred rounds do you honestly expect to fire before whatever incident you are firing at is resolved, one way or the other?


OK, I Submit
Pirate,

Fine. I bow to your safetyness.

I buy in bulk for economy, not for war. I keep them in separate steel military containers. Most are buried in the soft, dry sand of my interior crawlspace with silica gel packets inside. Unlike our friend JailTheSocialists, I don't believe that I can survive a firefight where thousands of rounds are exchanged.

mikescott
No not at all. What we have here are a few people who are angered by my comment. That’s fine and they are free to respond of course. Unfortunately, they are attributing all manner of things which I never said or inferred. I will not sit idly by in the face of false accusations. I don’t think it’s a matter of confusion or irrationality. It’s a matter of grasping any straw in an attempt to lash out at me.

Rich D. I will say it once again. It matters because Dr. Adams is telling us how much he practices and how skilled he is in hitting moving targets along with his general preparedness and desire to defend the country. I find it contradictory that he has never taken the opportunity to actually use his skill, preparedness and desire. In short, talk is cheep.

JailTheSocialistStreetUrchins: Is English a second language for you? You seem to have consistent problems with the definition of words and their usage. An urchin is a mischievous and often poor and raggedly clothed youngster. That doesn’t apply here either figuratively or literally. As for your greater point, I don’t think your desire for censorship is shared by others at TH. Of course, I see where it could come in handy for you as you have no ability to form a rational argument against an opposing view point.

CharletonHeston: Wow, you sure set me straight. Do you realize that comments like yours show just how little there actually is to refute my position?

mike r
No, Mike R. I really mean it. Though you are unspeakably persecuted, you truly are everyone's superior. Seriously.

All I can say is:
Arf, Arf...

Bulk Ammo and Danger
I am always amused by ignorant people who assume that ammo stored in bulk, or even modern propellants (gun powder) stored in bulk are some kind of dangerous fire hazard. The truth is, it represents little to no real danger. However, these same people routinely store gasoline in a five gallon container in their garage. Now there is an unstable accelerant, and potential explosive. You want to talk about risks, keep it right next to the paint thinner and the denatured alcohol by your work bench in the garage. Then drive the riding mower into the garage and store it after cutting the grass, and don't bother to clean off the dry grass on it.

But, oh no, it is far too dangerous to keep gunpowder in your home.

A guy in Baltimore, who I will call an idiot for his racist views (only), was held in prison under a million dollar bond. His crime; he was in possession of a few pounds of gun powder more than the law allowed. They held him there, wrecking his life, until he surrendered and entered a plea bargin forfeiting his rights for the rest of his life. Irrational and horribly abusive power exercised by the state is far more dangerous than the risk of having gun powder.

Things that go bang
I’m sure there is someone out there who is just dieing to tell me about their fire codes and the statutory limits on both modern smokeless powder and gun powder. It is also funny how we accept things as being so, just because someone passed a law or made a rule.

Perhaps someone with real knowledge of physics and or chemistry would like to, use the stability, ignition point, rate of combustion, potential explosive force, burning temperature, as important factors to make a comparison between common ordinary gasoline and modern smokeless powder and gun powder.

Among the reasons that smokeless powder and gunpowder are used in ammunition are the facts that they are relatively stable and easy to control and store safely. The next time you drive by a natural gas storage tank at the local gas station to fill up your tank for the grill, think about that.

Coming again to save the day
Good column, but haven't you seen the film "Team America" ?

For those of you who haven't seen this masterpiece of puppet satire, expect the following:

(1) Strong language
(2) Puppet violence
(3) Political humour that for once doesn't focus exclusively on conservatives ... liberals are in for a severe bashing.

There's a passionate speech at the close of the film in which the hero divides the world into three types of people.

For the sake of this forum, I have included asterisks:

D***s Sheepdogs
P****s Sheep
A******s Wolves

These three types map quite well onto your sheep, wolves and sheepdogs model.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Team_America:_World_Police

MR, Do we really have a disagreement?
MikeR writes: Tuesday, June, 12, 2007 8:57 AM

Rich D. I will say it once again. It matters because Dr. Adams is telling us how much he practices and how skilled he is in hitting moving targets along with his general preparedness and desire to defend the country. I find it contradictory that he has never taken the opportunity to actually use his skill, preparedness and desire. In short, talk is cheep.


Form what I know, he came to his persuasion lately, and has been doing his best to spread the word, so I can't fault him for not joining the service long ago. Are we OK with that?






old crow
How do you know I wasn't talking about the sheepherders union, Eh?
Seriously, I've found the term; "Union" used many times over the years to suggest the great alliance between our member states. Ex: In the "great War" the northern soldiers were called 'Union' soldiers while the southern were called, among other things, Rebels.
I believe that President Lincoln himself was not loath to use the term.
Thank you for your comment.

Oh Oh!
To be clear, in using the term 'Great war' in a past post I meant the Civil War. To be accurate I believe the term 'Great War' has been more often applied to the WW 1.

Mike from Tucson
What is this "Civil War" you talk about?

Would that specifically be "Mr. Lincoln's war", also known as "War of Northern Agression".

;-)

On Killing
Yes, you may consider yourself to be a sheepdog but according to Lt Col Grossman, that doesn't necessarily mean you'll be able to shot to kill when face to face with a wolf.

Three Kinds of People
Sheep, shouldn't be allowed to vote... they're stupid or ignorant, or both and don't seem to care.

Cal
Northern aggression? I thought it was self defense. A well organized criminal element tried to steal federal property.

WestTexan
Sheep can’t vote. In most states, you must be a US citizen, at least 18 years of age on and registered to vote. Some states have restrictions based on felony convictions and other factors (such as residency). Your state's voter registration form contains full eligibility requirements

It's a mind set.
sjra tommy says:

"On Killing
Yes, you may consider yourself to be a sheepdog but according to Lt Col Grossman, that doesn't necessarily mean you'll be able to shot to kill when face to face with a wolf."

Not ever soldiers and policemen know if they will be able to do this until the time comes.

I once had a job as an armed courier for an armored car company. Part of the firearms training involved what it takes to survive in a life or death showdown.

At the end of the day, there is only one justifiable reason to use deadly force, and that is when your life or the life of another innocent is threatened with deadly force.

When that time comes, many a seasoned policeman and soldier has frozen up.

There are many times when the mere posession of a firearm by a law abiding citizen has ended a criminal encounter without firing a shot. Most of these never get reported.



MikeR
The citizenship requirement doesn't keep Mexican's from voting in either Texas or California. Our Stupid-endous Legislature (read the Demonkats) voted down a requirement for a photo id to vote.

Three Kinds of People
Lt. Col. Grossman wrote another book titled, "On Killing". At a handgun class at the SigArms Academy in New Hampshire our instructor (a SWAT team sniper) made an off the cuff remark saying. "Well, you may have a handgun in your house for protection, but that doesn't mean you'll be able to use it." Then he made a reference to this book. Bottom Line : The majority of people (85%), including soldiers cannot kill another person in a face to face situation even if you know the other person is trying to harm you. Having a firearm may give you a false sense of security since you may not be able to pull the trigger.

This article...
MA: "More importantly, she realized that I was a member of the third class of people: the sheepdogs."

Aha. Now I think we can all feel MUCH safer... knowing Dr. Adams is out there ready to protect us! I somehow doubt, though, that his gun(SS) would have been of much help had he been in one of the actual towers....

MA: "There are many people who find it odd that I shoot firearms on an almost daily basis with other sheepdogs like my good friend and occasional bodyguard, Barry Whitehead. They would certainly find it odd that we compare notes over who fired the most shots through the same hole in the head of an Osama Bin Laden target."

Y'know, this sort of reminds me of English Bob in "Unforgiven". Brilliant at fast and trick shooting... but when faced with an actual HUMAN target, who could actually shoot back... he just froze....

MA: "And, needless to say, they would certainly not understand why I kill literally hundreds of live animals per year (usually small varmints) in order to perfect my skills in hitting targets that actually move."

Oh. I thought it was because he actually ENJOYED killing "small varmints" who cant shoot back... but that's just me...

MikeR
Keep up the good work. Your comments are what I MOST enjoy about Dr. Adam's articles. I appreciate Dr. Adams because he does leave himself open to valid criticism on a consistent basis.

As for who's a "sheep" and who is not???? Well, I dont know whether Dr. Adams is one or not, but did you notice that some posters who cant think for themselves, and dismiss every criticism without addressing the ACTUAL criticism, sort of like... sheep??????

You, Sir, are certainly no sheep, because you will make your point and stick with it. For that, and your past military service, I salute you.

SJRA Tommy
Re; "Three Kinds Of People"

Im not sure where Lt. Col. Grossman got the figure that 85% who own guns wouldn’t use them. But Id agree that a significant number would not. So are you saying most people shouldn’t carry guns for protection, not knowing if they have what it takes to kill? I recently gave my wife a compact 9mm. Will she use it if necessary? I hope so. But to concede your point, I cant be sure. None the less, having had personal experience of using a gun in self defense, Id rather she had the option. Incidentally, when I was faced with that choice, I had no problem pulling the trigger, without hesitation or remorse. I gained a lot of personal insight from the experience. At least I now know Im not one of the “85%.”

Dubious Statistic
I would like to see the raw data on the study that says 85% of armed people cannot shoot an attacker. I am having trouble imagining how those data were collected. Was it based on polling questions or analysis of actual crime scenes?

If it affected populations equally, it would seem that 85% of first time gunfights for police officers should result in their death or injury. Is this correct?

I recall that the IDF had discovered in a study many years ago that during firefights fewer than 20% of the soldiers took part effectively. Most were taking cover or were suppressed by the enemy fire. However, taking part in a firefight between military units is a big step change from confronting a bad guy in your living room.

While many folks may not pull the trigger so quickly to save themselves, I would bet that more than 15% of parents would shoot if they were the last line of defense between a killer and their children.

re: Three Kinds of People
This is totally off topic, but this isn't the first time I've encountered somebody who's referenced this sheep/sheepdog/wolf analogy to describe their approach to terrorism or even life . . .

What a strange analogy because people are actually analogizing themselves to sheepdogs . . . wouldn't it be better to be a german shepherd? Why would you not aspire to be a german shepherd (smart, confident, a learner and analyzer, as well as a planner, not just big)? Haven't looked this up, but doesn't the word 'shepherd' even kind of sound like a 'sheep' 'herd'er? Why settle for the rest when you can have the best?

My larger point being that fighting isn't just physical - it can be mental too. Arm yourselves with guns and train if that's your thing. But why stop there . . . why not also use your brain to develop fossil fuel alternatives (great to see all the investment being made in ethanol) and a nuclear missile defense system? etc . . .

PS
Actually, after a quick skim of Wikipedia, 'sheepdogs' are just herders with the exception of a rare Italian breed called "Maremma Sheepdogs". Sheepdogs rank #63 in doggie intelligence but excel because of their 'herding instinct' and are very obedient.

German Shepherds are 'Sheep dogs' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheep_dog) who rank #3 on the doggie intelligence scale, and have found jobs in a wide variety of fields, not just herding and guarding sheep, but also police work (narcotics), the military (explosives), search and rescue (cadaver), seeing eye work, and even pet therapy. What they lack in natural ability they will make up for with instinct. They are natural leaders.

Maybe the person who originally came up with the analogy had 'Sheep dogs' in mind (? dogs who work with sheep ? ) not the breed 'Sheepdogs'? Anyway, for the big picture please see my comment below :)

Sam the cat says,
"My larger point being that fighting isn't just physical - it can be mental too. Arm yourselves with guns and train if that's your thing. But why stop there . . . why not also use your brain to develop fossil fuel alternatives (great to see all the investment being made in ethanol) and a nuclear missile defense system? etc . . . "

Yeah, that would be real helpful when confronted by an armed robber, rapist, terrorist, etc.,

The would be rapist is beating your wife or daughter, and you cautiously approach the scene, and in an authoritative voice say, "I know how to make ethanol out of chicken droppings"

Yeah, that would end that situation in a satisfactory manner.

I think there is a typical liberal mentality that if they just had an opportunity to chat face to face with a crazed killer, they could get the person to be reasonable. In the extreme, they are usually the ones to walk meekly into gas chambers or stand with others in line against a wall while they are executed one at a time.

Lilly,
Children should be taught about firearms for the same reason that they are "potty trained". To prevent them from messing themselves or others. 5 years old is, admittedly, a bit on the green side and 8 years old is better, but I can't remember how old I was when my father taught me to be "gun fearing". I can't remember when I did NOT know about how to properly handle guns, so I must have been young. But given the difference between knowledge and ignorance, better some than none.

Jimmy Joe
Your Mom's a hoe ...

Bucko
Re: “Lilly the Looney Lib”.
This ubiquitous pest keeps showing up on Town Hall despite the fact that she gets destroyed when ever she posts a comment. She’s obviously a masochist who loves looking like an idiot and being humiliated. This Looney Lib posts irrational rants which have neither logic, nor proof. Her comments to other posts are rarely to the point. Her typical tactic is known as “Hit & Run”. She drops her bombs and leaves. She never responds to criticism, as she has no ammunition with which to respond. So it’s a waste of time responding to her. My advice to all is just ignore this idiot. Perhaps then she’ll eventually go away.

mikescott
Hmmmm. To further use the "sheep" analogy, as the saying goes, being attacked by you is like being savaged by a dead sheep. Ba Ba Ba etc etc.

And how, pray tell, does this little remark of yours further any argument, apart from illustrating the size of your little mind?

re: Cal
First off I'm a GIRL skippy, so I wouldn't have a wife - how precise can your judgment be if you couldn't even discern that from my posts . . . german shepherds are also girls you know . . .

Second off, the whole german shepherd mentality relies on preparation, prevention, and targeted attacks/defense that are narrowly tailored and not overbroad.

If you're worried about rape, don't go out alone at night - if you must, stay around groups of people or ask for an escort to your car. Stay in well-lit areas and know self-defense. Don't carry a lot of money, don't wear a lot of jewelry into a bad neighborhood if you're going to be alone, and constantly scan the environment and trust your gut (the key being that your gut has to be accurate, not just paranoid and defensive - the self-defense defense when you kill somebody is only available when the threat is reasonable, imminent, and proportional)

I don't see how a gun would have really helped a hotshot like you with the 9/11 terrorists anyway. Or Kelsey Smith if the guy had knocked her unconscious from behind. I agree that in some instances a gun could be useful, which is why I said if that's your thing then go ahead . . .


Oooo a little touchey there Sam
For starters, in some of our states women can have wives.

I never said that a handgun would have helped with 9/11, however if somebody on one of those planes had a gun, it might have helped. an off duty cop, air marshal.

I'm not worried about rape, however, my wife was in a situation once where she may have been, but when she showed her licensed .38, the would be preps left quickly.


Cal
Regarding your post about your wife using a gun in self defense: This bears out what the NRA maintains: that such use is more common than the Liberal press acknowledges: the reason being that many cases go unreported. I assume this was true in your wife’s case.
I gave my wife a 9mm carry gun. But unfortunately we live in “The Peoples Republik of California” where it’s impossible to get a gun carry permit. Therefore she may be reluctant to use it for legal reasons. Technically, we’re both “criminals” as we carry "illegally". But I have no reluctance to use deadly force, having once done so in self defense. Having “Been there & Done that”, it’s comforting to know in which percentage group I belong in.

Ragnar
This is the second time in a few short posts in which you have referred to the fact that you have used letal force. Why the two references?

A follow up question: was it absolutely necessary, or is it possible you were perhaps a little trigger happy? I ask merely as a point of information.

Sam
For what its worth, I thought your posts most sensible. Dont know why you get tagged as a "liberal" just for making sense.... And I dont see what you said has to do with "walking meekly into a gas chamber".

Ragner
I hope you will be able to correct me on this, but I suspect two reasons for your mentioning this twice. First, you may have a guilty conscience, because letal force MAY not have been ENTIRELY necessary. Second, which is FAR worse, you may think there is something macho about having done it.

But your attitude strikes me as distinctly unhealthy. R.E. Lee, perhaps the greatest soldier in American history, and a most tenacious general, fought, but inflicted casualties on the other side with regret.

I think, if you have in fact used letal force, the proper feeling afterwards would be one of regret, not "comfort".

Why should I own a gun?
I am in favor of the Second Amendment, support our troops and don't see much usefulness in gun controls, but at the same time don't see much need for owning a weapon. I am 60 years old and have never needed one, never been the subject of random violence, and don't know anyone who has. I, of course, am white, and don't live in an inner city, but in a nice California suburb, protected by the local police. If things changed, I'd get some self defense weapons, sure, and I'll vote to protect you're right to make your own decision, but right now see little reason to spend the money myself.

JimmyJoe
You misinterpreted my post.
I take NO comfort in having once had to use lethal force, in an unfortunate situation, wherein I had no other option. My only “comfort” is knowing what group I belong in; having been put to the ultimate test. My only hope is that in the unlikely event my wife should ever have a similar experience, she’ll also prove to be in that 15% group. Too many people who don’t have the mind set to use deadly force often hesitate and have the gun taken from them, with tragic results.

Mind set
I have gone through the state mandated firearms training when I got my concealed carry permit, and a also through a training course for Private protective services when I had a job for a while working for an armored car company when the Information Technology consulting business was a little slow a few years back.

The two courses had many things in common, but the training for the armored car company included some case studies of actual shooting incidents by police and people in the private protective services business.

This included both the nuts and bolts of the incident, who, where, what, when, how, but also the aftermath, the social and legal aspects.

In a police action, a policeman may draw his weapon to subdue a subject by threatening deadly force. As an armored car driver/guard, your only legal use of a firearm was self defense when you were threatened with deadly force and you believe that your life is in danger. You can't legally use deadly force to protect property, only human life. You basically don't draw your weapon unless you are going to fire.

The training drills were centered on responding to the threat of deadly force, once you determined that was imminent, you drew and fired, to where it became a reflex action.

This is a little different from, say, a homeowner, responding to the sounds of somebody breaking into their home, where they would probably already have their weapon out.

In any event if a person is going to keep a firearm for personal protection, either at home, or in the home, it is a good idea to enroll in training program that covers both the mechanical and legal aspects of using deadly force.

This is also something that is not for everybody. By the same token, those folks who do not feel comfortable with a firearm should not be trying to restrict law abiding folks from doing so.


MassachusettsLiberal writes:

"Tell Your Gay Friends and Family . . .
. . . you are welcome to live in teh great state of Massachusetts. Please come and raise a family. We have very little crime and a high standard of living. Massachusetts is a state where individual freedom and liberty "

Of course, he left out that they will be paying some of the highest taxes in the country and putting up with some of the toughest gun control laws in the country,

They don't call it TAXachusetts for nothing.

Cal:

Rating 19th out of 50 with New York at number 21, it hardly seems that Mass Lib has anything to crow about. Interstingly enough Hate Crimes for sexual orientation is 5th per capita – must be all those hate-filled P-Towners accosting the heteros that dare invade their turf.

Yes, come to the People’s Republik of Massachusetts. Where you don’t have to worry if your vote will count, because you won’t actually be afforded the opportunity. Our constitution, in practice, reads as follows: of the gays, by the gays, for the gays. Any wonder, why the State is losing population?

Cal
Re: Mind Set:

Agreed: Mind set is vital when it comes to using lethal force in self defense. There are 3 factors involved in a decision to carry a gun: 1: Technical competency; (Basic combat fire arms training). 2: Legal competency; (Understanding both the penal code regarding appropriate use of lethal force, and civil code as to “other consequences”).
3: “Mind Set”. (The emotional / psychological capacity to use lethal force). Of these 3 factors, “mind set” is the only one which can’t be taught. And factor 2 can affect Mind Set. As you point out, there can be Legal consequences, even when the use of lethal force is justified. And these consequences can be financially ruinous. This is especially true in Lib states, like "TAXatchusetts" where those who shoot attackers, though innocent of “criminal” wrong doing, are often sued in civil court; incur enormous legal expenses, and pay huge damages. And if the shooter is carrying a gun “illegally” as I my wife do, the likelihood of civil penalties increases. This is why Ive advised her leave the scene of the shooting if ever forced to use her gun. A misdemeanor charge for carrying without a permit is nothing compared to the consequences of civil litigation.

Ragner
I sought clarification on what you said, and I thank you for that. But I still find it strange that you felt the need to make two references to your own use of letal force above... Personally, I doubt very much that 85% number. I think almost anyone is capable of using letal force given the circumstances. I say this not on the grounds of research, but on my own observation of human nature.

JimmyJoe
Re: the 85% figure. I agree. It’s questionable. Although the required “mind set” lies in a (“grey area” > no pun intended); and impossible to assess with accuracy, I believe the percentage of “sheep” is far smaller than 85%.

I believe I mentioned my unfortunate use of lethal force twice in order to respond individually and specifically to 2 previous posts concerning such use.

alopekos teumesios
"Remember when the BATF were called "jack booted thugs" by the NRA and others during the Clinton years? Were they wolves, sheepdogs, both? How about now? If they come for the contents of Mike's gun safe, what will be his thoughts?"

Actually, that was coined by US Rep. John Dingell (D-MI); the NRA Prez was simply quoting him.

Later there was an op-ed in our paper by Paul Craig Roberts titled, "What Happens When Law Enforcement Becomes Lawless?"

We depend on government at our peril.


Cad Man
Cad Man,

You're preaching to the choir, Brother Cad. I try to depend upon government for as little as possible. About the only thing they do for me is collect my tax money and my trash. God willing in a few years, I will move into the hinterlands and try to live even more self sufficiently.

gun safety
I would like to comment on several posts.

My father taught me to shoot and to respect guns at age six. I did the same with my children. None of us ever considered 'playing' with a gun or picking up a gun without permission. None of us have ever had a gun related accident.

Our neighbor's house recently burned. He had numerous guns around the house as well as in the gun safe and he had a lot of ammo in the safe. It did indeed sound like a war, but the firefighters did not experience any problems from these weapons.


Sheepdogs are Wimpy
There is a stronger breed of canine than wolves and sheep dogs. They are Junkyard Dogs, they eat sheep for breakfast, wolves for lunch and laugh at sheepdogs for dinner and maybe even eat a couple for dessert.
Sheep with excess ammo that live in Condos are misguided sheep.
Junkyard dogs win every time because there are more than 3 types of people.

Good and Bad
There are two types of people, the good and the Bad, and the latter is clasiffied by the former.

To all gun-owners and fathers

Happy Father's Day.

You are looked upon as the defenders of America since the founding of our country.

Thanks

3 types of people
Right on Mike,

I've always said there are 3 types of people.

Sheep
Wolves
and Lions

Lions being the protectors of the sheep instead of sheepdogs. Either way we agree on many things.
You can never have too many guns or too much ammo.

When the stuff really hits the fan some of us will be able to look after our own and hopefully the sheeple next door.

"Keep freedom in your heart and a gun in the closet because the wolf is always at the door."
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