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Monday, October 22, 2007
Michael Barone :: Townhall.com Columnist
We're Not in 2006 Anymore
by Michael Barone
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Things are not working out as Democratic congressional leaders expected. For the first eight months of this year, they struggled to find some way to shut down the American military effort in Iraq.

They took it for granted that we were stuck in a quagmire in Iraq, with continuous high casualties and very little to show for them. They pressed hard to get the Republican votes they needed to block a filibuster in the Senate and were cheered when some Republicans, like John Warner, seemed to lean their way. They worked hard over the August recess to pressure Republican House members to break ranks and vote with them.

But the Republicans mostly held fast. Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell skillfully parried their thrusts in the Senate. House Minority Leader John Boehner persuaded most House Republicans to hang on. Then, over the summer, the news out of Iraq started to get better.

Mainstream media types tend to think that, while rising casualties from Iraq are legitimate news, falling casualties are not. But even so the word got out: The surge strategy was producing results. Anbar province, given up for lost in 2006, turned peaceful and cooperative in 2007. U.S. casualties and Iraqi civilian casualties were down. Brookings scholars Michael O'Hanlon and Kenneth Pollack, no fans of the administration's conduct of the war, announced on July 30 (in the pages of The New York Times, no less) that this was "a war we might just win."

The congressional Democrats got ready for one more push in September. But the testimony of General David Petraeus and Ambassador Ryan Crocker cut the ground from under their feet. Now, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (who declared last spring that the war was lost) and Speaker Nancy Pelosi seem to have thrown in the towel. The Democratic Congress will not use its power to appropriate to end the surge or to bring the soldiers home.

That leaves the left wing of the party angry at its leaders and the party split on the war, much as it was in 2002, when about half of congressional Democrats voted to authorize military action.

The Democrats here suffered from a lack of imagination. They could not imagine that the United States military could perform more effectively in 2007 than it did in 2005 and 2006.

George W. Bush seems to have had a similar lack of imagination until the November 2006 elections woke him up. But he chose a new commander and a new strategy, and things have changed. Democratic leaders have acted on the assumption that the status quo of November 2006 would persist indefinitely.

The Democrats have found themselves on the defensive on other issues, as well. Last week, the House Democrats were forced to delay a vote on their version of the revision of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, which among other things would have prohibited surveillance of communications between suspected terrorists abroad and persons in the United States without a court warrant.

The House Democrats were responsive to left-wingers' theoretical concerns about abusive surveillance and unconcerned that most voters don't want the National Security Agency to hang up when Osama bin Laden calls the United States. In any case, they were undercut when Senate Democrats agreed to a revision that did not contain that provision and others unacceptable to the Bush administration.

The House Democratic leadership also backed down last week from its determination to bring a resolution condemning the Turkish government's massacre of Armenians in 1915-16. The Turkish government took umbrage at this, and its parliament voted to authorize military action in Iraq's Kurdish provinces against anti-Turkish Kurdish guerrillas -- a nightmare scenario in the one part of Iraq that has been consistently peaceful and pro-American since 2003.

Senior House Democrats like John Murtha and Ike Skelton said the resolution was a bad idea, and Nancy Pelosi reversed herself (as Speaker Dennis Hastert did on the same issue in 2000, at the request of Bill Clinton).

Democrats are coming face to face with the fact that there's a war on -- and that Americans prefer success to failure. If the choice is between stalemate and withdrawal, as it seemed to be in November 2006, they may favor withdrawal; but if the choice is between victory and withdrawal, they don't want to quit -- or to undermine the effort.

Last week, Democrat Niki Tsongas won a special election with only 51 percent of the vote, in a Massachusetts district where John Kerry won 57 percent in 2004 and would have run much better in 2006. History doesn't stand still -- we're not in 2006 anymore.

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About The Author
Michael Barone is a Fox News Channel contributor and co-author of The Almanac of American Politics. He is Senior Political Analyst for the Washington Examiner and a Resident Fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, a Fox News Channel contributor and co-author of The Almanac of American Politics.
 
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Barone still delusional over Iraq
The ebbs and flows of casualties in Iraq hardly means we've got functioning government there.

Of course, Baron ignores the fact that in Iraq, this whole national unity government bit along with constitutional democracy formation makes no sense.

Everybody but the neocons like Baron appears to know how it works. Conservatives certainly do.

First, a group of people with shared cultural values, wants, desires, and goals form a cohesive group.

This cohesive group forms a civil society.

Over the next SEVERAL decades, the civil society forms ingrained institutions such as private property rights, free markets, and other constitutional orders that reflect the society’s culture.

These institutions lead to elections within a constitutional framework.

The whole notion that you can start at the end, by holding elections, and work backwards, boggles the mind.

The Republican party is the last entity that I would have expected to accept such a hair-brained scheme. But then, the idea did not come from most Republicans. It came from a small clique that hijacked the party.

The problem is not that the people of Mesopotamia are evil, or that they do not want and deserve liberty and freedom -- they do.

The problem is that some outside force that didn’t know what it was doing came in and screwed up the procedure for getting there.

Starting In Iraq
Frank C
Iraq started with an interim election to detrmine who should write the constitution]

Then they had a National Referendum on the constitution. Then they had constitutional elections for the current government. Now we need to work to ensure current Govt has control of the country by building coalitions and agreements. Are we making progress in my view not fast enough.

Does it take decades before you can have a constitutional gov? I don't see why it should. mant countries have had radical change of Gov without decades before they got constitutions.

Not sure when I will be back on here, If anyone wants they can check my blogs or email me at tinsldr2@yahoo.com

There will always be "Frank C's"
Whenever the subject of success or failure in Iraq comes up, there are always the Frank C's who bring in the tired old "some outside force came in and screwed up the whole procedure for getting there" routine. Frank, baby, it's OK, you can call us what we are: The United States of America. We've been attacked and had our citizens murdered, not only on 9/11 but for many years by the terrorist Muslims. They have plans to murder all of us. You want to pretend otherwise, but foolish people always will exist. Even the Democrats realize we have to remain in Iraq. It's OK, Frank, now go back to bed.

Delusional Frank C
Frank C is delusional. Without our getting rid of Saddam, the Iraqi people would not toda be building a constitutional democracy. The outside people trying to undermine that process today is al Qaeda in Iraq. That is a fight we need to win.

Conservatism once valued competence.
Now it champions mediocrity.

Now it coos over leaders who come up with a "surge" after four years of ineptitude and denial and covering-one's-own-political-hide that killed our best and bravest by the thousands.

Now it praises that as good performance.

It believes in low expectations for America and whines, "Mistakes were made," when it once would've (correctly) found mistakes of this size unacceptable.

Thanks to this love of mediocrity, we can either lose or tie this war by now. Let's hope with all might for the tie.

Most right when the people err
G.K. Chesterton said that the Church must stand strongest for the right when the people are wrong.

I believe President Bush is of the same mind with his conduct of the Presidency. Race strategy is not set by the fat guy with the 8 Painted on his bare chest, sitting in the arena with a hot dog in one hand and a beer in the other; it is set down in the pits by the men who know. Similarly, the tinkling cymbals and clanging gongs of the Hippie Camp do not set foreign policy. They are the ones who can barely pay the minimum on their credit cards and who persist in thinking NA$CAR and F1 are not rigged entertainment. They are easily seduced and deceived into believing that what they can observe from the top row of the stadium is all there is.

Perservere, Mr. President. Ignore the hoots and jeers from the cheap seats. History will be your judge.

Lets be Frank C
Barone isn't a party hack - his one of the few big media types that doesn't just parrot MoveTotheLeft.org (or The Weekly Standard - for balance). Iraq has been a big misrepresented disappointment for many of us but for the left to constantly wish doom for political gain is sad and destructive.

The way it is.
Barone is correct democrats backed down on changes on FISA, and on genocide resolution.

Unfortunately, the democrat party has been seized by leftist zealots, fanatics.

Most Americans favor monitoring of communication between terrorists overseas, and their enablers here in the U.S., even without a warrant.

Insofar as Iraq is concerned, I guess you can bathe a pig, perfume the beast, place ribbons around his neck, even place a blanket on him which contains the scroll: "The surge is working"...but at the end of the day, you still have a pig. And Bush plan on Iraq is precisely that...a pig.

If prospects for GOP are so positive according to Barone, anyway, for 2008, why are record numbers of GOP incumbents in both the house and senate, electing not to run for another term? Maybe they are reading the tea leaves.

Why are GOP donations so lackluster if things are looking up for the GOP?

This war, even with the surge, has cast a pall upon the GOP. And for that, Bush, and only Bush, is ultimately responsible.

Barone is correct. Americans do not want to "lose" in Iraq, but it is equally true that Americans now believe the war was a mistake.

And that's the way it is.

Democracy until we leave
As most clear thinking people will admit, We can stay in any muslim ruled country and push democracy with armed force and huge amount's of money. The minute we leave it will be back to a blood spilling islamic theocracy. Most of the supposedly informed Christian should know that the Bible say's that the son's of ismael will be hacking each other to pieces until Jesus comes back. So it was a good idea to take out saddam but every minute after that was a total waste of lives and money. Staying there is futile when we could have had a fleet in the gulf in case of trouble and triple the protection of our own country. Even the Ronald Reagan republican's are knowledgable on these point's, but can not say get out of there for fear of being called a demoncrat or a coward.

footballfan5
It's good to know there are people out there trying to get the Republican Party back on the right track -- in the hands of Conservatives, not neocons.

Get a load of this statement from Tinsldr2:

"Does it take decades before you can have a constitutional gov? I don't see why it should. mant countries have had radical change of Gov without decades before they got constitutions."

I thought only liberals would claim that a government holding a piece of paper called a constitution meant constitutional government.

The constitutional orders mentioned in our Bill of Roads didn't pop up out of nowhere when the document was written: They formed of SEVERAL decades or hundreds of years.

And they didn't come about from elections.


Raising the Bar
Oh, now I see, Iraq is a failure, because a "functioning government must have...a group of people with shared cultural values, wants, desires, and goals form a cohesive group."

By that definition, only dictatorships have "functioning governments"....do you really believe Pelosi and Cheney, "share the same values and desires"?

Libs such as FrankC prove that the US will never be successful in Iraq.

Lib: "Iraq is a failure because "X" hasn't been achieved."

"X" is achieved

Lib: "Well, Iraq is a failure because "Y" hasn't been achieved."

"Y" is achieved

Lib: "Well, for true success you must...blah, blah, blah."

Robert. when Clinton
ws president and all his administration and senate democrats spoke of the weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and the danger we faced from them were they all lying? Since you on the left have peppered your arguements with "he lied" what do you suppose the republicans will do if dems regain power in '08? Tit for tat??? More deadlock. After all, you dems plowed that path.

We NEVER Needed 9/11 As n Excuse to
FINISH the job in Iraq libtards. UN Resolution 687 IS ALL that was needed. Signed by Saddam's right hand man himself. We never even needed the 17 following resolutions saying basically the same things as 687 did. WE HAVE HAD THE RIGHT TO FINISH THE GULF WAR SINCE DAY 91 OF THAT FAILED 90 CEASE FIRE AGREEMENT. You libs live in a fantasy land, always have, always will. You can flail away with tortured logic about Dick Cheney lied this, and that. A 12 year old OVERDUE job got done. Now why we are still there is another story, but we had the right to change the regime in Iraq by signature of that very Iraqi regime, and did so (also the same foreign policy stated by Clinton himself in 1999).

not 2006
what the repubs have going for them is a dead head congress being managed by those two "leaders" pelosi and reid who can't seem to do much other than take their marching orders from the far left. Unfortunately the msm continues to give a pass to pelosi or reid or their disapproval numbers might reach 98% of the public. Further boredom and fatigue is affecting the missus clinton. Other than her daily 1 or 2 new ideas there is nothing generating excitement on the part of the dims. The only thing less attractive than the missus clinton ios the combinatiuon of edweirds and oblahma. There is momentary excitement when the real man in the edweirds family, his missus, opens her mouth for more ridiculous charges. Missus edweirds, step up you accusations

Right on...
Eagleone, you are absolutely correct as you stole the words right out of my mouth.

Robert, all Clinton did was to allow our pilots patroling the no-fly zone to be shot at day after day by the Iraqi military. After 9/11 the game changed. Saddam never came clean about his WMD programs and was a well documented sponsor of terrorism (remember, he openly subsidized suicide bombers).

Robert
You DEMS are so obsessed with Dick Cheney you wouldnt know a lie if it was sticking out of your rear-ends. Muslims have been killing us for years, Im sure that if you get away from MSNBC and Chrissy Mathews and Dumberoff you will see that there is more out there than their ranting and ravings. Now lets see Embaasy's being blown up, Colbart towers Kaboom, USS COLE boom boom, First World Trade Center Bombing, Somalia (Black Hawk Down) Now what does all these have in common? (MUSLIMS killing AMERICANS) OOOPS forgot
Beirut bombing. Its been going on foreever so dont know what is a lie about remark of Muslims attacking and killing us. Saddam might not have assisted in attacking us on 9/11 but I bet if he were still around he would take great pleasure in taking credit. HAND EM HIGH

Robert
"Desert Fox.

Clinton dealt with Iraq...appropriatly."

Ah yes, Desert Fox. I've seen this argument many times before. Look, if Desert Fox got rid of Saddam's WMD programs, why didn't Hillary Clinton and other Democrats say so and refuse then to vote for the use of force in Iraq?

One would assume she had at least some familiarity with one of her husband's allegedly more successful military operations, right? It is only in the aftermath of the overthrow of Saddam that people bring up Desert Fox.

"We estimate that Saddam's missile program has been set back by at least a year."
-SecDef William Cohen, Oct. 19, 1998, 3rd day of Operation Desert Fox
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/iraq/1998/98 121915_tlt.html

Hardly the same as saying Saddam's WMD programs were ended or canceled or destroyed, isn't it? And you yourself admit that it is reasonable to assume he was pursuing WMDs.

The final deciding issue wasn't the presence or lack of WMDS, BUT THE LACK OF TRANSPARENCY. That was the only real thing Saddam ABSOLUTELY had to become. Transparent. You lose a war, you don't get to have secrets. You don't get to continue on acting as if you didn't just lose a war that you started.





Silver lining...
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid are the two best things that could have ever occurred to awaken the conservative movement in America. Somebody please hand them another microphone so they can both verify my previous statement!!

Robert
"The Iraqis were well amazing is the word for it. Most of the time the triple A that they offered was half hearted; and the missiles...LOL"

The lack of Arab marksmanship is not the issue.

The "issue" is that Saddam offerred a $200,000 bounty to any soldier or crew that could bring down a coalition plane flying in a no-fly zone he agreed to in order to end the 1991 Gulf War.

What that demonstrates is a dictator who did not HONOR the 1991 Cease Fire. Who in fact ENCOURAGED his soldiers to violate that cease fire agreement.

It illustrates a dictator who had no intention of abiding by any sanctions. One who put his image as an Arab strongman as more important than abiding sanctions imposed upon him by the world community in response to an illegal, aggressive war for territory he initiated against Kuwait in 1991.

He was recalcitrant. Unrepentent. Stubborn. Sorry, but when you lose a war that you started, you don't get to be any of those things and continue to be the dictator. At least Bush didn't think so. Clinton thought otherwise, apparently.

Eagleone and Go 99... (part 1)
are correct. We can view the Iraq War in one of two ways:

1. A resumption of hostilities of the '91 Gulf War due to the Government of Iraq failing to abide by the terms of the cease fire which ended hostilities. Notice I said a 'cease fire which ended hostilities' and not a 'peace treaty'. Saddam agreed to dismantle his WMD program (we know he had WMDs because, well, HE USED THEM) and allow full and free reign to UN weapons inspectors.

For 12 years he hampered UN inspectors, delayed them, and refused them access to numerous sites they wished to visit. This prompted Clinton to bomb Iraq after one of the times UN inspectors left in disgust.

Also, US and British aircraft patrolling the UN mandated no-fly zones were coming under daily attack, which was cause again to resume hostilities per the cease fire agreement.

Bingo
Robert is right, the US was wrong "...to turn the lives of all the Iraqis upside down."

Why should we care if half a million or more brown-skinned people were murdered by their leader and the rest were forced to live under constant threat and dictatorship.

Although the Balkins posed no threat to the US, at least Clinton decided to take military action to save fellow white people.

Keep spreading the word Robert, our movement needs more vocal leaders such as yourself.

Robert
I'm surely glad you found "safe" passage through the no-fly zone. That however doesn't make it right. You shouldn't have been put in that situation to begin with.

I presume now that your home, I can shoot at you on the street as long as I'm a poor shot.

ROBERT
My statement was in reponse to the 9:30 you gave to uwcharlie. It looks like to me all he stated was that Muslims have been killing us for years. What has that got to do with Dick Cheney lies. Please read well because I know you DUMBOCRAPS take your talking points from Move on.ORG and George Soros. Unlike you I think we will win in IRAQ , not like your great LIBSCUM leaders NANCY P and Dingy Reid with We have lost in Iraq. So Becuase your fearless leaders stated that remark should I hold you accountable for their ignorance.



Robert
If Saddam wasn't sheltering terrorists, then who is Abu Nidal? Just another tourist who decided to retire to sunny iraq?

What is Ansar al-Islam? Where they just a social club in Iraq?

Why did Zarqawi precede us to Iraq if they had no intention of supporting terrorists? Is he so stupid he went to "terrorist-hatin' Iraq" to hide because he didn't know any better?

Sorry [General, Admiral, Doctor, Professor, Captain, Pilot, pick one or add your own title] Robert, but Iraq was a haven for terrorists prior to any US activity there.

Not to mention those checks to suicide bombers. OR do you not consider them terrorists?

Robert Part 2
It is funny to see you changing your tune. First it was that Iraq was a folly and unwinnable. now it is that Bush didn't change to a winning strategy soon enough to suit you.

So, do you admit you were wrong when you said ti was unwinnable? And, if so, why didn't YOU recognize the "Marine Corps Strategy" you are praising was correct?

You see, you said the war was unwinnable, so, just like the President, you didn't recognize that a surge would work either. So aren't you (and the Democrats) criticizing the President for making the same mistake you (and the Democrats) made? Not recognizing that a surge would work?


Robert,
I'll say one thing, you are entertaining, in a tiresome sort of way.

Response to Robert
Fine, pretend Abu Nidal was in Iraq despite Iraq's "strong anti-terrorist stand". What about Ansar al-Islam? they had large camps in Iraq. Explain how that shows Iraq was not a sponsor of terrorism. Or how about cutting checks to the families of suicide bombers?

Fine, dismiss Abu Nidal if you want, but why ignore the rest of my post? Maybe because you can't explain away Ansar al-Islam and those checks?

Robert
I think that people have debunked your pilot story on other postings so could you please do me a favor and stop the lying?

Robert
So, because the terrorists in Iraq provided training, logistics, shelter, aid, etc, but didn't carry out any attacks, we shouldn't care about them?

So, the wheel man in a bank robbery should be set free as well, I suppose? The logic is the same.


Robert
Why do libs always cheer for involvement in the "next" possible conflict.....but, never the one we are in at the time? You guys are like dogs chasing cars.

Yes
Yes, Robert, I do. If a nation knowingly harbors groups which intend to harm the US, I believe we are justified in invading that nation.

The stupid democrat counter argument is "then why haven't we invaded Syria?" The answer is, we are justified in attacking, but not obligated to do so. We have the right to choose when and whom to attack. I say simply that supporting groups hostile to the US justifies an atatck.

Or do you think Jefferson committed a war crime in attacking the Barbary Pirates? The justification is the same.

Also
I note your argument has changed today from "Saddam didn't support terrorists" to "Saddam didn't support anti-US terrorists" to "Saddam didn't support any terrorists who actually attacked the US".

Why the backtracking?

Whining Crybabies
The Liberals have not been able to deliver ANYTHING they promised their Far-Left Masters. So they revert to old Liberal Standards, Whining, Crying, Name Calling, Lying, Cheating and Cowardice.

Robert, Your Outrage is Misdirected
You keep making the point about whether Iraq was a threat to us and the world. The WORLD decided that he was and launched the Gulf War. Now we did decimate about his of his CONVENTIONAL military and we thought that was enough for the Iraqis to follow through with THEIR OWN regime change. Instead, Saddam himself reniged on 687 well before the 90 days were up by launching helicopter attacks on the very people Bush Senior hoped would finish the job. So I blame Bush Senior as much as I blame Clinton for inaction. Saddam was encouraged to do and act as he did because before the ink was dry on 687, the coalition forces started a massive withdrawl. Saddam knew the resolution was a farce and he proceeded as such. By the time day 90 rolled around, our 500,000 man force was down to about 150,000. Saddam was free to do what he wanted to do. AND WE LET HIM.

Robert, your beef should be with the US administration and State Department that lets the USA get duped into being the military arm of the UN. We all know that the UN is useless and that without our military as the hammer, there is no resolution worth the price of the paper it is written on. The lesson Robert is not to let the USA get trapped into doing the UN's dirty work. Let the UN fall flat on its face all by itself and then let democratic nations join to truly preserve peace, NOT SUPPORT AN ORGANIZATION THAT HAS FORGOTTEN ITS MANDATE IN FAVOR OF A ONE WORLD SOCIALIST GOVERNMENT.

Robert
"Terrorist is a loaded word"

Just curious, if you had to give them a label, what would you call these groups:

The 9/11 hi-jackers?

Al Qaeda killing troops/people in Iraq?

Palestinian suicide bombers?

Robert
Ahhhh! The Barbary Pirates were a demonstrated threat against...US interests. But, Saddam posed no threat to US interests....thanks for clearing that up.

Robert
You ask if somebody violating (and thus negating) a cease-fire agreement is a good enough reason to continue on where we left off before the cease-fire?

Um. Yes. That is generally the thing that SHOULD happen when you violate a cease-fire. Or violate an oil embargo. Or plan to assassinate a former American head of state. Or attempt to assassinate

"Problem is that it was valid to assume Saddam had WMD...it was an assumption but it was a good one."

Your words Robert, not mine. If Saddam had gone totally transparent, it would not have been necessary to have Desert Fox. You seem to be advocating periodic punitive bombing missions against targets in Iraq rather than the regime removal Bush acted on. Hitler's weapons programs were not halted by day and night bombardment by American and British bombers. It was troops on the ground and the overthrow of the Nazi regime that ended that.

You yourself say it was reasonable to assume he wasn't in compliance. SecDef Cohen in 1998 on the day before Fox ended estimated that we'd only set back some of his programs by a year.

And you blame Iraqi civilian deaths on US, when we gave their government HOW MANY chances to straighten up and fly right? If he'd cared a whit about his own people, none of this would've been necessary. If you are going to hold the American people responsible for Bush, how about you do the same and hold the Iraqis responsible for Saddam?

But you'll probably say he was a murderous dictator they couldn't overthrow, right? Isn't that also a good reason for us to do it? In addition to the reasons already stated?

Robert
I dont know whether I am part of a tiny group that supports following through with 687 or not. It really doesnt matter to me. What matters is what is right and what we did was right. How we did it was foolish. We were way too soft after our stunning 3 week sweep of Iraq. The lessons of VN were ignored once again and yet another war was run from the Oval office instead of the by the military. Rumsfeldd plan for the war was fantastic but for the occupation was an utter disaster. Most of your comments would be moot if Bush Jr. had let the military do its job the way they had learned several times in the past.

Robert
Freetothink

How do you think Clinton handle OBM? How about the Cole bombing? How about the Africa think? Black Hawk Down (grin)remember?
OBM thought the U.S. was weak with the immoral Clinton in Blow House(another grin) OBM'S word's not mine.
The U.S. should have just looked the other way after 9/11 and focused on globe warming. I mean really, we only lost 3000 lives(big grin).


Freetothink

Lib Lies
The libs like Robert come on TH not to convince us that what they are saying is the truth regardless of the facts.Truth is they are trying to convince themselves that their lies are true.They truly believe that if they repeat it often enough they will believe it to be true regardless of the facts. GOD BLESS AMERICA

Americans can be stupid.
Surprisingly this is a pretty accurate article. As a Democrat (soon to be independant, lol) I find the democrats in congress to be spineless wimps who refuse to stand up to the president and the conservative movement by stopping this war. The Democratically controlled Congress has the power to do so. All they have to do is stop funding the war. Period! It's that simple. If there is no money, there can be no war. Congress controls the budget.

But noooo, the Democrats want to play politics. Like in 2002, they want to risk the lives of our brave soldiers all because they don't want to be considered unpatriotic nor do they want the perception as the party that "loss the war". Pathetic! This is why their approval numbers are in the toilet. They want to say "we don't have the votes", when they have the cash to stop this moronic, idiotic poorly planned war.


Then we have our so called "front runner" Hillary Clinton, who in my opinion is an opportunistic liar. In a political move, she has just given the president the opportunity to take action against Iran, then goes on TV and criticizes his competency!

No one seems to be serving the American people, and I'm beginning to believe that we Americans aren't very bright or informed. We voted these morons in office (both democrats and republicans), we supported this idiotic
War. (Both democrats and republicans) And now Americans have supported front runners (both democrats and republicans) who are dishonest, opportunistic liars. As I stated earlier American's aren't very, bright. In fact we can be down right stupid!

Citzen Carrier
Doesnt it amaze you how LIBS are always protecting the enemy before they would accept anything that Bush has done. Like OBL using DUMBOCRAPS talking points during the 06 elections and still to this day they(DEMS) think GWB is the TERRORIST.

HALD have you found my Jet yet, Cheney is after ME


Robert

AQ
What a joke that Clinton tried to take out OBL and AQ As I recall Clinton took out a Asperin Factory in SUDAN. And Clinton did a far better job at allowing Osama to basically do what he wanted to AMERICA. I would bet you that the REPS would have backed Clintoon more if he had the B#LLS to do more. Problem was he was droping a few SCUDS of his own on INTERNS and then trying now to blame BUSH on BILLY(THE SCUD)CLINTOONS f
ailures. Just like a typical DUMBOCRAP.


HALD load up the PLain we are heading to SUDAN to blow up a TICKLE ME OSAMA plant

Robert

Just returned from DC
The bumper stickers are all for Hillary, and they are all waiting to be employed by her once she wins by national acclamation.

However, Zogby just published a poll showing 50% of the country says it will never vote for Clinton. Older people have higher numbers, but even among younger women (18-40) who are predisposed to Hillary, 43% say they'll never vote for her.

All the Dems. are wedded to military defeat, demonstrate all too often that their distain for the military altogether, proudly announce their plans to raise taxes, and proceed with unbounded assurance to plan to overtake US healthcare and people's private medical lives as if these were universally accepted ideas.

They live in a la-la land of Daily Krap and movealong. where no real Americans who don't like taxes, want less gov't intrusion, and admire military volunteerism actually appear.

An Immoral Nation..
I'm sorry Rob, but you lost me at "immoral nation".

We are bad, OBL is just.

We've heard it all before on Al-Jazera...

Is Robert unemployed?
How can you he on every thread at all hours of the day all the time?

renny
just inform the missus clinton which special interest group you are a member of, either real or imagined and you will hear her spewcific bribe. The only unacceptable minorities are working white males or things that push conservatism

Roberts "Morality"
Robert keeps bringing up the word morality enough times to hope he convince us he knows what it means. Much like all the GOP hopefuls in last nights debate kept invoking Ronald Regan's name in hopes they could convince us they know what true conservatism really is.

Robert, morality is in the eye of the beholder. To stand by and watch 50,000 shiites get killed by Saddam while we supposively were flying in our no fly zones is IMMORAL. To let another million plus Iraqis starve via our unsuccessful sanctions program on Iraq is IMMORAL. To let the UN orchestrate the UN Oil for Food Program to make millions of dollars for UN cronies at the expense of the Iraqi people is IMMORAL. To tacitly give aid and comfort to the Wahhabist cause throughout the world by letting Saddam and OBL thumb their noses at us for nearly 10 years is IMMORAL.

You see Robert, your form of morality actually kills more people than mine. It would be nice if NOONE had to die and we could all just get along. However, the ostrich head in the sand approach is NOT MORAL. Its the opposite.

"Immoral Nation"
"A moral nation needs proof of an attack on its interest or its homeland to destroy another country.

An immoral nation just acts as a bully.

Robert"

Your words Rob, not mine.

Do you read your own posts? In your follow-up to my post you "explain" why OBL is justified, and we are immoral.

I don't need to put words into your mouth, you're doing just fine on your own.

Sticking it to Pelosi
Sadly the Democrats do not have a veto proof majority and that's why the going has been so hard this past year. The Congressional Republican sheeple are closing ranks and circling the wagons to protect their own big time. Typically Republican sheeple are sore losers and ist pigs so they're going to spite Speaker Nancy Peolsi every chance they get. They women in authority and are smarting over the fact that she's third in line to the Presidency.

Robert
My kids, my friends, and my relatives are already fighting for their country. I try to do my part in country by fighting folks like you who really dont have a clue. Danfur is actually running true to form for UN causes and we are wisely staying out of it militarily until all understand once again, the cume ba ya approach just doesnt work against muslim fundamentalists. Soon enough Robert.

what conservatives don't get
is that people have made up thier minds on this.

the polls are not moving.

http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm

B.S.
Robbie said:
"But of course it wasnt Mr. Bush's kids or any of the other "GOP faithful" kids who were in teh fight."

Oh, I see only young, dumb, Democrat kids are serving now. We "GOP faithful" keep our kids safe at home.

Your pathetic!

Robert and his fallacies
Robert - You, sir, are an idiot. If this was the 18th century, I would call you out.

Hey, I'm not a firefighter nor are my children. Guess I can't support fighting fires.

I'm not in the National Guard nor are my non-existent children. Guess I can't support sending the NG into New Orleans.

I'm not a border patrol agent nor do I have any children who are. Guess I can't support patrolling our borders.

I'm not an illegal alien or immigrant, guess I can't support immigration reform.

Getting the picture here?

We certainly get the picture about you. You have decided that Bush is evil. You have decided that Cheney is evil. You have decided that the military action in Iraq is wrong. You have decided that terrorists have more rights to live than American citizens. You have decided that the US Military should never be used in actual conflicts, just talked about for the next one. You have decided that Iraq never had nor ever wanted WMD's so it must be so.

Since you are apparently God, you're doing a poor job of it! Get with the program and fix things instead of wasting your time here.

AudiR @ 7:24am
Eloquent post (like so many of yours). Wish I could have said it half so well.

ROBERT
I Like how you are always coming up with the same old Why aint Bush kids in the war. Why didnt Chelsea join the Military when BILLY (THE SCUD) CLINTOON was attacking Bosnia and sending our troops there to fight. See sounds pathetic when we ask how many DUMBOCRAPS have sent their kids to fight in the War that they voted for. There is more REPS that has family members their than the (WE HAVE LOST THE WAR) DUMBOCRAPS. I bet you have never wore the uniform and never would you COWARD.

HALD have you found my immorality i thinks i have lost it fighting Capt Hook

ROBERTA

Robert
Gee, I've told you to go away so many times --- since you seem to be on here night and day --perhaps you are a stay at home dad or mom or a deadbeat with no job. Perhaps, we who work, are supporting your rear end. Are you one of those cradle to grave --live off the tax payers parasites? Funny how things happen -- when Clinton and the Dems were in, a liberal said -- "well you guys won now --let's see if you can do any better." Well the Rebubs really didn't. So now, the worm as turned again -- now, the same liberal said to me --"well, we are stinking up the joint so I guess they all stink!"

Very true my liberal friend!

Tinsldr2
"Does it take decades before you can have a constitutional gov? I don't see why it should. mant countries have had radical change of Gov without decades before they got constitutions."

To answer your question, yes it could take decades. In our history it took 10 years, 1777 to 1787 in which time we were working on a confederate form of government.

In Japan after WWII it took 6 years or so to get a democratic govt.

Both examples did not have radical terrorists attacking their own populance. Neither did they have oppressive governments that scared or killed it's own people. Things are different in Iraq and a government cannot be made in just a few months, remember the surge did not really take effect until June of 2007, so how can we expect a full Iraq demoracy in just a few months when it took us 10 years.

Just something for you to think about.

Back to Barone
Sorry to redirect the discussion back to Barone, but I believe that the Republicans have demonstrated that they can hold the left at bay both by filibuster (taught them by Ted Kennedy and KKK Byrd who led the same approach in 2003-2006).

The things the Republicans need to learn from the Democrats' failures is that you have to be FOR something, not just reactionary against. Like the way they did with the Contract With America. Until we do positive things, the battle will see-saw back and forth. The voters of America have decided that they can understand, and vote for candidates, with laid-out p9lans. Do so, Republicans.

The Republicans...
will continue to lose next year, but, sad to say, I think Barone's analysis is generally correct. Democrats will merely continue the policies of Bush and end up offending everyone as he did. They are seemingly paralyzed by what they are and cannot change. Bush was no alternative to them, as they are no alternative to him. They can only make matters worse.

chuck says:
"What a joke that Clinton tried to take out OBL and AQ As I recall Clinton took out a Asperin Factory in SUDAN. "

Well, Bush has taken out two countries with the blood of nearly 4000 servicemen on his hands and still OBL makes videos. How is that preferable to Clinton's lesser, though far far far less costly approach? OBL is still free, Al Queda still exists, and we're hundreds of billions in the hole with tens of thousand of wounded and thousands dead. How is this better?

max Power says:
"Only a self righteous blow hard would compare Clinton to Reagan, they are simply opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to character. You should be ashamed for making the comparison..."

It's true, folks. Both were liars, but when Reagan lied, they were REAL whoppers, like he had NO IDEA that weapons were being sold to Iran! Clinton also lied - about private matters of no consequence, but lying to a judge about consensual sex is FAR FAR worse than lying to America about selling weapons to the country that had just released our hostages and, if you believe Warpublican alarmists, had declared war upon America.
But hey - Reagan was a man of honor - when HE cheated on his wife, he did it on the sly - in a hotel room - George Bush the First was even smarter, planting his mistress in China - but CLinton - he DID IT IN THE WHITE HOUSE. ANd as we all know, infidelity is a crime of geography - not lying and cheating...

Miser NY Dog
Clinton's crime was not sex, it was PERJURY! You bunch of libs want Scooter Libby sitting in prison for perjury, but you never put Billy boy or AlGore with him.

Other crimes Billy boy never was brought up on include:
Selling overnights in the Lincoln bedroom
Giving away defense secrets to China
Improper use of FBI files

You can talk about Reagan all you want. The Mafia was in the White House from 1993-2000. And you bunch of losers want Ms. Godfather back!

God Help the USA

What the devil is the above post about?
Clinton was a more moral liar because he looked America in the eye and said, "I have had sex with that Lewinsky woman" was better than Reagan's divorce 50 years ago? And what do you know of Reagan's divorce from Jane Wyman?

Clinton lied to his draft board,
was the first draft dodger to be a US pres. (his criminal behavior was given amnesty by Carter),
lied to the people of AK that he would finish his last gubenatorial term,
lied to the world when he said he smoked pot and never inhaled,
lied to Hillary for decades over the women Hillary then proceeded to degrade and abase in order to keep Bill in power,
lied under oath in sworn depositions to federal and state judges for which he lost his law license,
lied to the Senate when he asked in 1998 for a resolution to change regime in Iraq--which the Senate voted 98-0--but Clinton did nothing with it,
lied about selling US missile technology to China to raise money for the 1996 re-election run which was investigated until his second term ran out,
and lied to the military when he never even learned to salure properly to the service people sworn to defend his rotten soul with their lives.

NY DOGGIE
You proved my point. If Clinton would have taken out OBL then Bush WOULDNT have invaded no countries, we WOULDNT have lost almost 4000 troops and Al Qaeda WOULDNT be able to do the things they do and Billions of dollars WOULDNT have been spent. So want part of WOULDNT HAVE dont you understand? If BILLY(THE SCUD)CLINTOON
WOULD have understood what was the outcome do you not think he WOULDNT HAVE DONE more to stop OBL?

AQ
I dont care what you libscum can come up with next. All I know is that your Dumbocrap party wants to lose this war for Political power and you know its true. Now how many of you want me to come up with proof? That is always your dropback when you are confronted with a situation that you know is true but just want to cause people heartache. I know that BILLY(THE SCUD) CLINTOON was talking about Sadaam having the same things that Bush stated about Iraq, the difference is that your LIB President was SCUDDING INTERNS while our troops were being killed around the World. OOOPS now you will want me to come up with proof of that. Im glad Im not a blogger because you people come up with things that even you cant prove all the time. I also like the Bush Lied trrops died theory, I guess troops being killed in the embassies in Africa, Colbart Towers, The USS COLE, Somalia(Black Hawk Down) had nothing to do with Clintoons incompetence to think that fighting Terrorist should be handled by the Police. Why you Libs protect an Adulterer(While President)is amazing to me. The REPS get someone who emails interns about Gay things and you blast him forever, even though he committed no crime and per Clintoon lying under oath is OK. Dont blame the REPS for him (CLINTOON) for lying to a judge about that woman.

Robert
Before 9/11` our world had changed also the problem was that CLINTOON ideology about terrorism didnt change. Ive heard people talk about use the INTEL on IRAN before anything is done. DAAAA
that was the problem with IRAQ, everybody intel stated he(SADAAM)had WMD's and they where wrong so why would we review the intel on IRAN if it comes from other countries, ie Russia,Italy,France,Germany,England and all the other countries whos intel told us the same thing about IRAQ(WMDS)I say bomb the whole region and turn it into a CAMEL FARM. Why are LIBS so ate up with the GAY thing? Does that mean you are HAPPY.LOLs

King Liberal
The best weapon that Sadaam had was The DUMBOCRAP party with their loser attutudes and BLAME America policies. To bad they hung SADAAM before Nancy P and HARRY REID had a chance to recue him. They seem to have the political pull with the other Commie Countries they visit so my theory is the LIBS where the WMDs and still are. We know you hate the troops and all the military just listen to your own Parties comments about them. When you can actually stand up for the people that are willing to die for your country and its beliefs(HA HA) then someday we (REPS) on this internet will listen to YOU. To bad that Clintoon didnt have the B#LLS in the 90's to do something about SADAAM /OBL.

OOOPS I forgot he was militarily involved(MONICA)
SCUDS AWAY, boy wait until they put that $10 tax on cigars you LIBS(BILLY BOY)will be wanting to show children how to put condoms on cigars so they can be reused. SCUDS AWAY



LIBSCUM DOG
Oh its ok to blame Bush who just took office but not the Commie who was running the office with neglect for 8 yrs. SCUDS AWAY. I wonder where all the data went about 9/11 that SANDY BURGLER took (STOLED) and put by accident(HA HA)in his pants. Do you think he was trying to impress someone with all them documents stuffed down his PANTS. Do you think he was trying to hide something? We all know that Clinton dropped the ball on OBL so quit your LIBSCUM tricks and trying to blame someone else. Just like a DUMBOCRAP trying to hide something from the People of this country to save CLINTOONS Legacy. If you want to impress me LIBSCUM find out what Sandy Burgler stoled. You guys have more or at least the same amount of crooks in Washington than we do. SCUDS AWAY. WOW if you keep telling LIBS lies they will start beleiving them. SCUDS AWAY. Bush I might have put the troops there but we didnt have no problems until BILLY(THE SCUD) CLINTOON started the bullcrap with the WARLARDS.

High Casualties in Iraq
In the scheme of things, is 3800+ casualties and, of course, a large number of wounded really out of line, or unexpected, in a conflict of this type and magnitude? We suffer perhaps 10 times this number of deaths every year on our highways. The Democrats routinely trumpet this as THE reason to get out of Iraq. Surely, there are ways to neutralize this contention without sounding heartless. It simply takes some time to formulate.
My limited experience with grievously injured military personnel, primarily amputees, persuades me that they believed in their cause and accept the sacrifices they made because it was for God and Country. It was their duty. Of course, there is a minority who lament their injuries and this is understandable. I am not criticizing them. I merely note they are in a very small minority. None of the pundits ever celebrates this selflessness. This does a grave disservice to our noble warriors.
If the current Republican strategists and speech writers can't develop a strategy, they should be replaced by those who can. In the meantime, good writers like you must take up the cudgel.

A Better Foreign Policy
It's a good idea to point out Democrat failures with regard to to the war and failure to support, understand or influence our foreign policy. But this administration has failed in many respects as well - The surge is helping for sure but without a consistent overall strategy at work we're taking a step back for every two steps forward.

Please consider reviewing and sharing the following foreign policy statement by presidential candidate Mike Huckabee.

http://www.mikehuckabee.com/index.cfm?FuseAction=Blogs.View &Blog_id=507

Mike has been surging in grassroots support lately, but it seems like not too many people realize he has a strong grasp of the whole war on terror. From Afghanistan, to Iraq and Iran he understands the nature of the threats we face, both the challenges and the opportunities. And he has some very good ideas about how he as president would go about meeting them.
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