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Friday, February 16, 2007
Lorie Byrd :: Townhall.com Columnist
Giuliani: A candidate to consider
by Lorie Byrd
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If I thought the most important task the next American President would face would be dealing with abortion policy or protecting second amendment rights, a Giuliani candidacy would not arouse my interest. Because I will be looking to the next President first and foremost to address issues of foreign policy and national security, though, Giuliani is a candidate I am enthusiastically considering.

It is clear to me that even in a best case scenario, there will still be enough to do in Iraq when President Bush leaves office, that his successor will devote the majority of his or her time and attention to matters of foreign policy and national security. Even if Iraq were miraculously transformed into a perfect model of democracy and tranquility over the next two years, there would be enough challenges from countries like Iran and North Korea, and from international terrorist groups, to keep national security priority number one.

I have written in the past about some of the reasons I like Rudy Giuliani as a presidential candidate. Each time I have, I have received mail from fellow conservatives who think I must not be aware of Giuliani’s positions on such issues as abortion or gun control or other social issues, or that I must not think those are important issues. I do believe those issues are important and I don’t agree with many of Giuliani’s positions on them.

When I look at candidates, though, I am considering the biggest challenges the next President will face. Americans are moving closer to the conservative position on abortion and gun control. Gone are the days that Democrats could count those as surefire winning issues for them. In fact, in the past two presidential campaigns alone I have seen more pictures of camouflage-wearing Democrats toting shotguns than I probably have in my entire lifetime. As technology continues to improve and makes it clearer (literally, as 3-D ultrasounds become clearer) that an unborn child is just that, a child, not a mass of tissue, then public opinion will continue to move in favor of life. There is still much work to do, but I see issues like abortion and gun control being impacted much more significantly by the Supreme Court, than by the President directly. Giuliani has said that if he were elected president, he would seek individuals like Alito, Scalia and Thomas to appoint to the judiciary.

One of the biggest problems we face in America today is the willingness of too many to accept defeat and to blame America for the world’s ills. On the subject of Iraq and the war on terror, this country is embroiled in a battle of wills and of philosophies unlike anything we have seen since The Cold War, and before that, the Vietnam War. Whether we decide to continue the fight or we decide to accept defeat will depend in large measure on whom we choose to lead for the next decade. The next presidential election will be incredibly pivotal.

There are a few traits the next president will need to possess to effectively lead. Rudy Giuliani has already exhibited many of them, having a proven track record, not only as the mayor of New York City, but also as a prosecutor.

We need an articulate leader. I greatly appreciate President Bush and respect the resolve he has shown over the past six years since September 11, but he has obviously not done the best job communicating the reasons behind many of the actions he has taken. Rudy Giuliani gave a rousing speech at the 2004 Republican National Convention and has frequently, through interviews and speeches, given articulate, yet clear, arguments on behalf of the administration’s policies.

We need an action-oriented leader. On the Larry King Show this week, Giuliani noted that many voting for the non-binding resolution on Iraq are not willing to back up their words: “We pay them to make decisions, not just to make comments…The ones I think have a better understanding of what their responsibility is and are willing to take a risk are the ones who are saying we've got to hold back the funds, we've got to vote against the war or we're for the war. And maybe it's because I ran a government and I tend to be a decisive person… I think one of the things wrong with Washington is they don't want to make tough decisions anymore.”

We need a leader who knows the stakes. Rudy Giuliani saw the result of ignoring the threat of terrorism first hand, up close and personal on September 11. He not only saw the sights and heard the sounds of innocent Americans jumping to their deaths from the Twin Towers, but he lost personal friends that day.

We need a leader with guts who will not be intimidated by murderous thugs or pompous politicians. Giuliani exhibited courage as a U.S. Attorney who prosecuted mob bosses and corrupt politicians, obtaining 4,152 convictions and gaining recognition as “the most effective prosecutor in the country. “

We need a bold leader willing to take unpopular positions and accept seemingly overwhelming challenges. When Rudy Giuliani became the mayor of New York City, very few, if any, believed he could turn the broken city into one of the safest and most impressive in the world. When describing the amazing feat Giuliani accomplished in revitalizing NYC, Patrick Ruffini recently noted that “nothing he accomplished in those years came through half-measures or trimming his sails.” He acted boldly.

We need a leader committed to finishing the job in Iraq and addressing the threat of global terrorism. Rudy Giuliani did not quit in New York City when the odds were against him and I don’t believe he will give up when faced with some of the great challenges this country will face over the next decade.

In addition to the characteristics above, Giuliani has shown great leadership on economic issues, including lowering taxes. For these reasons, among others, he is currently at the top of my list of GOP candidates for President.

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About The Author

Lorie Byrd is a Townhall.com columnist and blogs at Wizbang and at LorieByrd.com.

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A Great Guy, BUT...
As a Catholic (Anglican Rite), and as a Priest, voting for ANYONE who publicly approves of abortion under ANY circumstances is not an option. I think Rudy is a great man, and did a magnificent job as Mayor of New York, especially on 9/11 and after. I respect the job he did in cleaning up that city, and the man has remarkable leadership qualities. However, abortion is the Holocaust of today. Millions and millions of souls have been lost to this despicible, abominable practice, and my conscience refuses to allow me to support anyone who will not stand up to end this outrage.

The middle is where the swing votes are
Guiliani is one of those candidates who could do very well in a general election if only he can get past his own party in the primaries. He has very broad appeal to swing voters and I think he could grab a significant number of votes from Democrats, especially if that party is dumb enough to nominate someone very liberal like Obama. I realize a lot of conservatives want a pro-life religious conservative candidate, but that will be a lot tougher sell in a general election where the tide is already anti-GOP because of the war in Iraq. With Guiliani you at least get a business conservative who supports tax cuts and doesn't want to socialize your health care.

Why compromise
The last time we conservatives decided to compromise early in the game, we ended up with Bob Dole!!

Earlier in my life, I was saddened when Ford beat out Reagan for the nomination, but my Dad told me to stick to my guns and not give up on getting a conservative elected... And the rest is history.

Let's not give up on getting another Regan especially when the Dems are eating their own young. Abortion is real, it kills millions, Global Warming is a farce. Gun control is a very scary thing remember that Hitler and Mao both flourished with its help. These are not little things to just let go of to avoid getting Hillary, these are very important issues that we must not give up on. Rudy is not the man we want to lead us.




Giuliani: Not an Option
Great choice, a RINO like Guliani or a marxist like Hillary.

What will it take for the american public to start voting on principle in lieu of voting for the perceived lessor of two evils.

We MURDER 3500 unborn children every day. 2nd Amendment rights are what keep this nation free.

Seems to me Lorie you need to keep searching because our only way to move forward, is by looking behind. If we stick to the tenents of our constitution and reverse the policies that have dragged our society into moral depravity and self-destructiveness then we just might leave our world a little better for everyone.

http://www.constitutionparty.com

If you don't respect life
you're not likely to respect much of anything else. Only a pro life cadidate for me!!! One issue voting is paramount -- it's like voting for God as opposed to voting for God.

Open Borders War on Terror?!?

Rudy declared New York City to be a "Sanctuary City" for ILLEGAL ALIENS. How is he going to fight a "war on terror" while KEEPING OUR BORDER COMPLETELY OPEN TO MEXICAN CRIMINALS AND ARAB TERRORISTS WHO CHOOSE TO ENTER OUR COUNTRY VIA MEXICO?!?

Re: Rubberduck Crusader concerns
I had felt the way you did...but a President doesn't make the decision re: laws like Roe Vs. Wade...the judges will. Rudy's statements re: the judges he would appoint..answer that to my satisfaction.Ysterday, I heard a woman on Bill Bennett's show say that her husband would vote for Hillary if Rudy was the nominee. How foolish is that? If social conservatives (AND I AM ONE) hand over the White House to a liberal dem..because of such short-sightedness...well...sorry for the analogy... talk about throwing the baby out with the bathwater. THESE conservatives will have blood on their hands in the war on terror...and many babies born and unborn will not survive the horrific consequences that follow!

EXCELLENT PRO LIFE POSTS
Yes, a country that murders it's young and calls it "choice" not to mention murdering the infant as (s)he is being born by the gruesome and barbaric procedure known as partial birth abortion will not survive and once you discard life like a piece of trash you hold nothing sacred and society crumbles. Nothing has value and anything goes. We are at over 48 million babies murdered by abortion since 1973. This madness needs to stop now and it does matter very much.

Hunter/Santorum 2008
No open borders candiates. You can't have homeland security without border security.

Virginia Patriot
You're going to put an obscure member of the House of Representatives at the top of the ticket and an ex-senator who just got tossed out of his office as the #2 choice?

I don't think so!

Although I don't approve of everything he believes, the only person out there with the charisma and ideology for the job is Newt Gingrich.

I could see Gingrich/Tancredo or Gingrich/Hunter as an alternative to Giuliani or Romney.

Logical choice?
>So make the best logical choice: Rudy (Because he can handle the bad guys: Mobsters, Muslim terrorists).<

So, I'm guessing you supported Kerry in 2004, since he successfully prosecuted mobsters in Boston and was integral in exposing the BCCI Bank scandal that laundered money for Muslim terrorists.


Liberals
Rudy if he gets the nomination will insure a democrat majority for the forseeable future. It puzzles me why any one that considers themselves to be conservative would be advocating the most liberal candidate this early in the process. Lorie should be writing opinion for the New Youk Times.

agree with Lorie and CherylF
I am staunchly conservative and pro-life, but I could hold my nose and vote for Rudy, because without a savvy and tough leader who knows that the jihadists are enemy #1, there won't be a Judaeo-Christian country to conserve. And getting the 'original intent,' strict constructionist judges is most important. I would prefer Brownback, Huckabee or Hunter, but they're not getting any traction.

Why do we have to choose now?
Let's just hold on a minute or a year and let some of the baggage take care of itself. It is quite possible that all of the "front runners" will self-destruct and then where will you be with your support for a lost cause. It is probable that several of the "front runners" will do exactly that and remove themselves from contention (whether or not they admit that is the case).

I have not seen one "front runner" that I could vote for without holding my nose because the alternative is Hitlery or Osama (whoops, I mean Obama).

what an article
The author begins her article with a statement downplaying the importance of the right to life. If you don't have life, the remainder of her concerns are null and void. Giuilani is just another democrat with a loud voice and extreme moral problems (Clinton by another name)if we Republicans can't do better than this Hillary or the Muslim will be shoe-ins.

Disagree
I'm afraid I cannot agree with Lorie. I think this country needs leaders with high moral values now more than any time in the history of this nation and I don't believe Giuliani fits that description. I believe we as a nation will fall from within therefore I believe domestic issues are by far the most important when considering who to vote for in upcoming elections. Thank you for letting me voice my opinion.

You People Better Wake Up!
Abortion and Gun Laws be damned!

We have THREE enemies beating our country to shreds and our ONLY chance is to decide on someone with balls enough to act.

1. We have the Army of Islam at war with us. They started the war, we didn't. They are 1 Billion strong but we CAN defeat them; but not by the pantywaist measures our Military are forced to take at present.

2. We have our Southern Border overrun by an Illegal Invasion. They are NOT here for "..jobs no American will take.." They are here for YOUR job.

3. We have traitors and turncoats in our government and in the MSM that need to be rooted out and prosecuted for giving aid and comfort to an enemy in time of war.

If you are worried about gun control think about this: Guns don't spoil, melt or dissolve. Get 'em now if you are worried that much.

But if we don't handle the three problems outlined, all the rest of the problems won't matter.

You better find someone and find someone who can carry the election and find them before '08. If we get a candidate that will deliver on the main issues and then nit pick each and every secondary issue we will still be fighting among ourselves as Hillary/Obama are inaugurated.

And right now such issues as abortion, anti-gun or homosexual marriage are just secondary.

Rudy the best candidate
for those common-sense conservatives who aren't one-note Nelly voters; for those who support traditional/conservative/Republican federalist principles, rather than social policy promulgated from on high in Washington... for those conservatives who believe that the most important issues that will face our nation will continue to be security-related, that those who hate America hate us all, no matter if we are conservative or liberal, pro-life or pro-abortion, Republican or Democrat, white or black or brown, straight or gay, theist or atheist, etc... and that we will need strong leadership- and articulate leadership, to clearly explain just what it is that is at stake. We will need a candidate w/ a proven record of advancing pro-growth economic policies (not simply Romney-like rhetoric on those issues) even in the face of a legislature of the opposing party.

True conservatives will support a candidate like Giuliani, because on the issues that unite all Americans, he IS conservative. Big Government Nanny-Stating "conservatives" probably will have to look elswhere.

Anti-gun is NEVER secondary
Sorry, Buck. This is one very crucial item that we should never rank unimportant. Gun registration, then confiscation is a precursor to unbridled tyranny. Read your history, Buck?

Don't let the media tell you how to vote
It is way early in the game yet, folks and already I see people that are willing to sacrifice their principles and vote for someone who is NOT conservative.

It was mentioned above that someone preferred to vote for Tancredo or Hunter, but they're getting no "traction". That all has to do with who the mass media is pushing. Geez folks, when was the last time you checked into the media ownership? Because it isn't what it used to be... an independent media.

Don't let them tell you for whom to vote. Stay honest to your convictions and principles and vote accordingly.

Good luck in the DNC primary...
The only way the Left can win is to destroy the Republican Party from within. They have lost the public argument and cannot win on the issues, they have to have despotic judges do it for them and they have to undermine conservatives in the Republican primary. (This is the entire reason they have state drives for open primaries, non-partisan legislatures, messing with the electoral college and other electoral scams.)

I receive no benefit from the same things just because they have different designer labels:

I might has well vote for Bullwinkle, there isn't a dime's worth of difference between them.



Sorry, Lori ...
I'm tired of voting for candidates who are only "half" a conservative, the fiscal half. Half just doesn't cut it for me anymore. I want to see fully tried and true conservatives on the Republican ticket. This country used to at least stand for all that was good and honorable. We've disintegrated into a mish-mash of relativism and socialism with liberals and middle of the roaders calling the shots. I'm not giving in ... I want my country back and the only way to do that is to make a mark and stand on it!

I'm Pro Life but still like Giuliani
Because he has demonstrated himself to be able to lead under fire.

Ten years ago, I was a one-issue voter, pro life all the way. Now days I am still pro life, but after 9/11 the world changed, and I see a need to change along with it.

Giuliani LIVED 9/11: he came close to dying in the collapse of the second Trade Tower, and I know that National Security is not just an abstraction to him.

He has shown his mettle in an emergancy, and I have confidence that he is not just electable, but is also up for leading our country through these trying times.

Random thoughts on this passing scene
If I forsake everything I hold dear I could vote for one of these idiots. I don't think so however. Giuliani has no homeland security record. He reacted well to a crisis. He sure as hell didn't prevent it and there no evidence he would have acted any different than Clinton or Bush. (Both losers in my estimation) Give us a break.
So the conservative choice seems to be between 'snake the grass' John McCain and
Rudy pro-abortion, pro-gun control, pro-qay, womanizing, I think I'm conservative, Giuliani.
Heaven help us. It is very obvious we cannot think for ourselves.
I disagree with Rubberduck. Giuliani may be a great politician, but I cannot consider him a great man. There is a vast difference.
As for Buck, he may need to look at another country. If America could survive FDR, JFK, JEC, GHWB, WJC and GWB it will not collapse under any of these politicians.
We are what we are, and it is what it is. There is a higher law than the Constitution, or any self determination by mankind.

Rudy may just be the man
I want to learn more about Romney, but if the election were held today, I would vote for Giuliani!

No vote for Rudy here
Lorie says "One of the biggest problems we face in America today is the willingness of too many to accept defeat" - and Rudy has accepted defeat in maintaining our borders and sovereignty.

Anyone who proposes "amnesty" under any euphemism will NEVER get my vote.

Anyone who proposes taking my right-to-carry defensive weapon will NEVER get my vote.

Anyone who feigns to want to protect America but who is really aiming to protect AmeXica will NEVER get my vote.

EVER.

Fred- it is between Romney and Giuliani
for me too.

I would be happy with either one of them.

McCain may have values that are closer to mine, but he is too much of a wild card.

I am a bit disturbed that McCain is so worried about the welfare of the enemy. If you fight a war that way, you are destined to lose. While we don't want to be fascists, we also don't want to be weenies.

I know for sure that Giuliani would have the perspective of a man who knows what the enemy can do. McCain looks too much from the point of view of the POW, and can't be counted on to be on our side when push comes to shove.

Hustler
Take a closer look @ Giuliani's record as Mayor; the cutting of taxes, reforming/reducing welfare rolls, increase in jobs, the reductions in crime (aided greatly by Bill Bratton and his work) the privatization of city services, the selling of unnecessary city assets (properties, television and radio stations, etc...) increasing the admission requirements to the city's public college, standing up to the various public employee unions, and the city's myriad and multiple race hustlers (no pun!) and doing all of these while saddled w/ an overwhelmingly Democrat City Council, and a city media and cultural elite largely at odds w/ his agenda. The two issues where he could be better- abortion, and gun rights? Disappointing, but he has also endorsed federalist principles on these, ie, what works or what me palatable or necessary in/for NYC need not be applied to rural Mississippi, or Utah, etc... rather than the one-size-fits-all legislation on too many issues we have seen come from Washington in recent years, EVEN WITH an- ostensibly- conservative Republican Congress and President. If you think you're going to find a candidate who espouses every one of your views to your satisfaction, you'd better run yourself! NO candidate can meet any person's wishes 100%. But you would do well to give Giuliani's entire record a closer look.

Fred: as a conservative and Republican from Massachusetts, I would say; don't believe the hype on Romney. His record of actual achievement as Governor is pretty thin, and he's a flip-flopper on a Kerryesque scale.

Strike Ten
Rudy is awful in so many ways. He has at least ten strikes against him.

1. Rudy supports the butchery of unborn babies.
2. Rudy supports widespread illegal and legal immigration. Thsu, he supports the demographic revolution of the histroic American nations.
3. Rudy supports "gay" rights, including the prosecution of PRIVATE businesses for not hiring sodomites.
4. Rudy lived with two sodomites after his second marital breakup which amounts to an endorsement of immoral living.
5. Rudy has divorced twice, a bad example for a country that is drowning in divorce.
6. Rudy has fathered a dysfunctional family, another bad example for the country.
7. Rudy's budgets in New York City rose 50 % in eight years.
8. Rudy's city tax cuts were small. He plans no large tax cuts as president.
9. Rudy plans to continue Bush's wasteful war in Iraq.
10. Rudy is actively anti-Catholic and his term in office will be one in which conservative and liberal Catholics (for different reasons) will be constantly asking Archbishops and Bishops to discipline Rudy, including the request of excommunication.

Strike Eleven
Rudy is a gun grabber.

No Giuliani, thank you very much!!!!!
I do not want another Bush.

I will be the first to admit that I have not examined Giuliani's record very closely, but I do know this: He is very poor on individual rights.

If there is a New York Libertarian here, maybe you can run with the ball on this as I live out west and only know second hand.

Gun rights, I believe are very important, and it is not about duck hunting. It is about self-defense, and Thomas Jefferson declared that the right to keep and bear arms would serve to keep the government in line.

At the risk of appearing to hide behind Mr. Jefferson I will point out that that was *his* idea, but I do concur.

I am sick and tired of anti-gun administrations, and I think I can safely say the last several have been. At least from a Libertarian standpoint.

Obviously international policy is important. Being anti-war and wanting to bring the troops home from the over 100 places they are, *today,* and wanting to stop meddling in foreign affairs (Washington said we must have peaceful trade with all and entangling alliances with none), I guess I'd probably oppose Giuliani, but as I say I have not studied him thoroughly.

As a Libertarian I will most likely support the L.P. candidate or Ron Paul.

Welfare for the Rich
Howee, Rudy believes in amnesty for the 20 million strong (give or take a few) illegal alien invasion force currently deployed within our border. Yes this is an issue that has severe cultural and social implications that don't necessarily rate as high on your list for consideration of a Presidential candidate.

But amnesty will also have severe and catastrohpic economic effects as well. The lone act of amnesty will set in motion the importation of millions more through chain migration and the further encouragement of more illegal immigration. The numbers could go higher than 100 million in a relatively short period of time by some estimates. The vast majority of these "immigrants" are of indigent means and will require services and care well in excess of their contributions. Already faltering programs such as social security and medicare will be further destabilized. As they gain citizenship they will vote to continue the gravy train of "goodies" and will only accelerate our trajectory toward full socialism.

So in my opinion, Rudy is no purveyor of free market, pro-growth, limited government economic policies when he supports this amnesty nonsense. Republicans who support amnesty support it because it is welfare for the rich. Democrats who support amnesty do so because it ensures their future reelection.

Rudy
I agree 100%. Rudy will not forget 9/11 and he is a political street fighter. What you see is what you will get. And just maybe this country may last long enough to worry about the 2nd amenment, abortion, SS, global warming and alternative energy.

Open borders
As much as I like Rudy, he's an open-borders guy. Lorie Byrd apparently hasn't noticed, but the border states are literally being destroyed by illegal immigration. Bush has been an utter failure in this regard.

There are a lot of things to like about Rudy, but this country simply can't afford another open-borders president. The economy of Mexico is in a precarious condition, and unless we start taking very firm steps to get full control of our sudden border we soon will see a wave of illegal immigration that will dwarf what we've seen up until now. In many places, mostly along the border, America will cease to be America.

How can we elect a president that would allow this?

Dudes, where's your party?
Conservative Republicans should have nothing to do with Giulani. He is not--contrary to a piece in National Review online--some new kind of "social conservative." He should be unacceptable to real conservatives, for all the reasons given by a number of people who responded to this column. Romney has it all; the business cred, the capacity to keep the Christian conservative base of the Republican party happy enough to support him, and the lack of any really bad baggage to hold it all together. Giulani is damaged goods; you don't want him.

Dear stormy
Today, 4000 unborn babies will be butchered. Tomorrow, Saturday, a peak day, many more than 4000 will be butchered. Many more than were killed on September 11, 2001. And Rudy Guiliani is all right with that. He is a moral defective.

Open border president
Open border president, we have one already. I will not vote for anyone who has a comprehensive immigration policy in the past, present or future.

Open border president
Open border president, we have one already. I will not vote for anyone who has a comprehensive immigration policy in the past, present or future.

Getting to Rudy's supposed "strength":
One way we are going to beat those islamofascisterrorists is NOT by giving up our property rights and the responsibility for our own security. Rudy has shown from the days he was DA that he will violate property rights to achieve the desired objectives. He will take away our freedoms in the name of "security."
I don't even need to address his ridiculously strained posturing on judicial issues (guns/abortion) to be against him.
If Newt humbly apologizes to his ex and the nation for his hypocracy and infidelit(ies!), he's the guy. Otherwise, Brownbeck or my friend Tom Tancredo carry the banner in '08.

Oh how I wish a conservative woman (Star Parker?, Condi (getting more lukewarm every day)?, Lynne Cheney, the Rep from MN?) would step forward. Alternatively, Maybe Ken Blackwell will rejoin the fray.
TimC

Giuliani for press.
Sorry Lori: If you do not respect life in its most innocent form, i.e. the unborn. No other right or issue matters. I am 71 years old and have been listening to the same argument all my voteing life it just does not fly.
Charlie;

Strike 12
Rudy is comfortable, just like George Bush, with the whole affirmative action/quota apparatus in America.

Sammy
How far is Rudy's stance on dealing w/ the illegal entrants already in our country much different from that of President Bush? If we could wave a magic wand and instantly be rid of the 11m-20m (depending upon whose counting) that would be great. Realistically, what do we do to remove them all? Do you have the answer? Does Mitt Romney? Does anyone?

The Fence is a stupid idea; it is mere symbolism. These folks will cross inhospitable deserts, mountains, and rivers to get here, they're going to be deterred by a fence? Comprehensive immigration reform and border security are needed; utlizing technology to better watch our borders, increased hiring of Border Patrol personnel, allowing state and local law enforcement to arrest and detain for deportation those they find here illegally, increasing penalties upon businesses who knowingly hire illegal entrants while at the same time increasing ops for some sort of regulated temp worker program.

I don't know how we responsibly, realistically deal w/ the millions of illegals already here. And I've read no one who has any responsible realistic solutions, either.

I find it interesting...
... that otherwise conservative posters like Lydia seem to pooh-pooh the gun-grabbing agenda of the Left. I guess one of the "benefits" of living in Kalifornia is that I get a front row seat at how pernicious and never-ending that battle really is when the Left holds sway.

I find it disturbing that so many seem willing to desert their principles simply to win. If you win by becoming a clone of the other guy, you haven't really won anything at all.

As I wrote the other day, I'd rather swim naked in a vat of Ebola virus than vote for Giuliani.

Rudy Guilani
I agree we should or need to vote with the overall picture in mind.I hope to here his take on the border mess.
Thanks Billy

Cutting and running towards liberalism
Since alot of conservatives seem to be cutting and running towards the most liberal of Republican candidates, it looks as though true conservatism will take a back seat in politics till 2012.

The MSM has picked the frontrunners for Repubs and they party faithful (not the principled faithful)has bought it hook, line, and sinker.

When these liberal Repubs suffer for the next four years after 08 election, maybe then they will return to their principles instead of voting for the most popular face on the election block.

God helps us all in 08.

A spot on analysis Lorie!
A few comments from a southern Christian conservative that lives in the heart of the bible belt. I could support Guiliani for president if Newt doesn't enter the race for many of the same reasons Lorie outlined in her commentary. I am looking for a leader of the nation, not a politician or a pastor. As far as a troubled personal life, it doesn't seem to affect his leadership abilities and it certainly didn't affect King David's leadership abilities. (Let him who is without sin cast the first stone). Being pro-choice is not the same as being pro-baby killing. The genie is out of the bottle on this one folks. Most women aren't forced into clinics to end their babies lives. What we as Christians need to do is try to change these folks point of view one heart at a time. The fact that Rudy would appoint strict constructionists to the bench is enough for me. If it surprises anyone that a conservative Christian could vote for Rudy, don't be, their are many who think as I do. Witness Rudy's reception in Hattisburg, Mississippi!

Howee
Rudy's stance on dealing with illegals is absolutely NO different than Bush's. Bush isn't running for reelection (thank God).

We do not need any reform of immigration (comprehensive or otherwise). What we need is a committment to enforce the laws already on the books. Take away the "freebies" and dry up the jobs that lure them here and the majority would self-deport. Do like Ike did in the 50's and you solve the problem. Do like Reagan did in the 80's (amnesty) and you will only get more illegals. There is no such thing as a "Guest" worker program -- every plan I have ever seen allows these "guests" to stay forever as long as they jump through a few minor hoops. Guest Worker Programs are simply a legal conveyance for the former illegals.

You just simply can't give the moniker of fiscal conservative to anyone that supports amnesty. There is nothing fiscally conservative about supporting the wholesale importation of the world's indidgent into a welfare state such as modern day America.

Rudy agrees with man-made global warming
I am disappointed that Byrd, a columnist I like, cherry-picked Giuliani's appearance on Larry King Live in addition to trying to down-playing the two elephants in the room, abortion and guns.

Byrd failed completely to mention that Rudy said he agreed with the theory of man-made global warming while talking with King.

I have to question why anyone claiming to be a conservative would even go on King's show. It has little audience and that which it has is 99% liberal.

Giuliani is a lib in RNC clothing. He wants an open border, abortion on demand, high taxes, gun control, and will no doubt sign on to any anti-global warming initiative enacted by the Dems in Congress no matter how much it ruins the economy and without regard to whether there is any truth to the theory.

"Comprehensive" Immigration Reform
For George W. Bush, compehensive immigration reform is a euphemism for opening up the immigration spigots for the benefit of big business and the Democratic Party. One wants cheap labor and the other wants the votes. Bush, who grew up very sheltered with a gang of Mexican domestics in his parents' home, can not be trusted on the issue.

The cheapest way to deal with the immigration chaos is the prosecution of the corproate big-wigs who encourage it to happen. If the CEOs of Tyson's, IBP, Smithfield, Oscar Meyer, Hatfield, Perdue, Swift and dozens more were cuffed, booked, forced into orange pajamas, tried, convicted and imprisoned, illegal immigration would probably slow to a trickle. Most corporate businessmen are too soft and unconditioned for prison. Fear would work!

Workplace roundups should bve intensified as well. If we can spend $ 400 billion and counting to bring democracy to the Euphrates, we can spend tens of billions to police our borders.

Abortion Should not be the Issue

.....Rubberduck Crusader ...

.....A few points to ponder ...Rudy does not (technically) favor abortion ...he says that he is personally against it but that he supports a womans right to choose ....this position also happens to be the Law of the Land which the President swears to uphold ...

.....I would prefer that Rudy was pro-life ...I wish everyone was pro-life ...but I have to live in the real world because I cannot live in a world that does not exist ...

.....the President cannot overturn Roe ...he can only appoint judges who might ...Rudy has promised that he would do this ...right now we are living in a dangerous world and we desperately need a bold leader who can protect us from terrorist attack ...right now Rudy looks like the man for the job ...I will reserve judgement until I hear what he has to say in the debates but I will not vote against him on the abortion issue ...We know where Hillary stands on abortion and can anyone except defeat loving cowards accept her as our Commander-in-Chief? .....COLOSSUS

Rudy
the nuts and bolts of the the issue :Republicans need to keep control of the Presidency! We have lost control of both the House and the Senate, and if we don't unite, the GOP will lose the Office of the President and maybe the Congress will be veto free. Rudy is a leader during tough times. Vote for the candidate of your choice and then support the Candidate that is selected by the GOP.

Rudy is a globalist
Rudy is a globalist, just like Bush and the liberal neo cons of the party.
Either the Repubs are conservative and for America's sovereignity, or theyre for big government globalism.

If Repubs go the globalism route I will have to leave the party.

Buck is right...
We have to keep our priorities in order -- First is our national security, including defense, intelligence and Homeland Security. A candidate must show strong support for the military.

Without control of illegal immigration, especially on the Southern border, there is no real security, and this is almost as important as the war on terror.

Then comes stopping the spread of government and reversing the trend toward socialism. A president has to be strong enough to use the veto whenever necessary to reject the pork-laden appropriations bills, even if it means having to wait for Congress to re-write important spending bills.

Other social issues pale in contrast to the safety of our nation and the need to confine the government.

Rudy
Giuliani: a candidate to consider? Not on an unborn child's life!

Davy's Crock
As Merry said to the ent, Treebeard, "but you are part of this world...aren't you? If you leave the party where will you go? You will just trade one world-view for another. I prefer the conservative world-view to the liberals world-view. It is not enough to be against everything, you need to be for something. Where is good citizenship these days?

Rudy's comments
So far Giuliani seems like the best canidate we have on our side right now, and most iomportant of all the only one you can beat Hillary Clinton.

Guiliani said on Hannity and Colmes on the Fox News Channel some time ago that he's really not for abortion and opposes partail birth but we have to respect the woman's right to choose, even though I disagree and think abortion should be illegal no questions asked those decisions are made by congress and the supreme court.

We need a president who will win in Iraq and keep pressure on the terrorists after President Bush leaves office and someone who stop the flow of illegal immigration and seal off our borders and Rudy i beleive is the right man, we have to turn the other cheek when it comes to some of Giliani's liberal views whcih will i don't beleive will ever be legal and hope he gets the GOP's nomination, because anyhting is better than another Clinton in the white house or an inexperienced Obama.

NO MORE...

...New Yorkers (city slickers)! No more Hillbilly socialists! No more deranged POW's! No more RINO Texan's with more hat than brains! And if one considers LBJ and Ross Perot, let's make that no more Texans at all.

I am a Westerner. A native Californian. I don't want any more people like Barbara Boxer, the California Senator who "immigrated" from Brooklyn, NY, or Gray Davis, the former recalled governor of Calif. who is also came from Brooklyn, NY. I don't want any Southern, "Slick Willies" and their brides, or "Ranchette" cowboys who ride mountain bicycles instead of real horses.

I don't want to have to bury my hunting rifle because a New Yorker, Giuliani, is the President. I don't want to have to wait for the mushroom cloud because we have a crossbreed President, out of Bill Clinton by Jimmy Carter, as the first Marxist woman elected to the White House.

Barry Goldwater, Ronald Reagan and Dwight Eisenhower were the "Real Deal" and they were from the West or Mid-West. There's someone out there West of the Mississippi that will make a good president. But considering who we are considering now, why should any one who is really capable of being president consider running at all.

A Case Study in Leadership
In addition to the excellent qualifications noted in the article, Guiliani also possesses that undefinable quality of leadership that allows him to connect with the electorate on a personal level, which inspires comfort, respect and trust, even when his positions are not popular.
We have a country divided 50-50 on most issues. We need the type of leadership that Mayor Guiliani has demonstrated now more that ever, a leadership articulate, determined and focused, with a dash of wit and humor.

The first Presidential prerequisite
A long consistent history of NOT enforcing immigration law.

VOTE ON THE CURVE
When you vote for a candidate, you have to vote "on the curve".

Do you compare a candidate to the non-existent ideal candidate, or do you vote for a candidate as the best choice among those actually running? If you hold out for the ideal candidate, you probably sit out a lot of elections. Who would you rather see as President:

Giuliani or McCain?
Giuliani or Romney?
Giuliani or Brownback?
Giuliani or Hillary?
Giuliani or Obama?

If none of these are acceptable (I know, it's not every candidate or potential candidate), it's not too late to draft somebody else. But come election day, you have to vote for somebody who's on the ballot.

You may have to hold your nose when you cast your vote, but it's better to elect somebody you agree with 50% of the time than somebody you agree with 5% of the time. Don't think you can push the GOP to rebuild by electing one of the Democrats, either. A Hillary or Obama presidency will cause irreversible harm to this country. Jimmy Carter was president for only 4 years -- 26 years ago -- and we will never gain back what we lost while he was in charge.


caved?
How did he cave? He is one of the strongest leaders I have ever seen. If some one votes against your beliefs that does not mean he caved. He has clearly stated his positions time and again. If you disagree then disagree but dont make stuff up.
I would also voting for liberal causes that are so far out of main stream that they will never get passed to score political points is a good thing.
On Boarder control, I agree it is a magor player in my decisions but i do not see any one running on building a wall with infrared machine guns. He will at least build a virtual wall; a step in the tight direction.

JeffreyP
You wrote: " But come election day, you have to vote for somebody who's on the ballot."

Says who? That's where you and the rest of the Republican Giuliani supporters seem to miss the message. That's the message the RNC seems committed to NOT GETTING. That's why they're now in the minority of both houses of Congress.

Out here in Kalifornia, the Governator's stood for election twice. I refused to vote for him both times.

I'll do the same if Giuliani or McCain are the Rep candidates.

If this is the best the R party can put up, they'd better get used to the idea of being the minority party for a long time to come.

yes cave
Cave implies change of position..
as long as I have watched him he has been rock solid (unchanging).

Here's a link
For those of you Giuliani fans, and especially for those who aren't, check out the info at this link:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0212072giuliani1.html

If Hilary sticks an "R" behind her name, you gonna vote for her?

Rock solid for illegals
in a post 9/11 world we can no longer afford to tolerate illegal immigration. Rudy established New York as a sactuary city. I will not vote for anyone who will not uphold the law. WE NEED COMPRHENSIVE IMMIGRATION ENFORCEMENT!

Not Rudy
Rudy favors homosexual unions, wants to go after those evil gunshows (every one I've ever been to is such a hotbed of illegality).
He favors abortion...need I say more?

Rudy is just another big-government, open-borders rainbow "conservative" like Bush 1 & Bush 2.
Once elected, there is no doubt he will veer to the Left.

Haven't we had enough of fake conservatives!?!

MESSAGE TO LORIE: The foundation of national security IS THE SECOND AMENDMENT.

Without it, we can kiss everything else goodbye!

Rudy's personal life a problem
Nowadays most people don't seem to care about a politician's personal life, but I still do. It says a lot about his/her ethics and priorities.

Rudy was divorced twice, and that may be acceptable, depending upon circumstances. But the way he lived openly and defiantly with his third wife before they married, ignoring basic morality and setting a rotten example to young people and the world at large, alienated me completely. I don't believe I could ever vote for Rudy.




Rudy's personal life a problem
Nowadays most people don't seem to care about a politician's personal life, but I still do. It says a lot about his/her ethics and priorities.

Rudy was divorced twice, and that may be acceptable, depending upon circumstances. But the way he lived openly and defiantly with his third wife before they married, ignoring basic morality and setting a rotten example to young people and the world at large, alienated me completely. I don't believe I could ever vote for Rudy.




No way
I am not voting for Rudy. I like him personally, but he is not Presidential material for MY party. I am sick of the RINOs. Why do you think we lost the last election? I am tired of voting for people becuase 'they are better than the Democrats'. It just is not going to happen anymore. Period. If the country has to go down the crapper for a couple of decades then so be it.

The Republican Party will continue to lose ground as long as they are the party of Liberal Lite.

1. I really do want smaller government.
2. I really do believe in my 2nd ammendment rights.
3. I really do think the government should not be in the social engineering business.
4. I really do think taxes should be lower.
5. I really do think we should use our military power to protect ourselves and our interests.
6. I really am not a socialist, rich-hating, anti-corporation communist.

The current POTUS got my vote in the last election because of the WOT. He would not have otherwise. He is way to liberal for my party. Forget 'compasonniate conservatism'. The left has a stranglehold on compassion. If that is what you want, vote for them.

Rudy and Mitt
Primary elections can be brutal. Remember Fritz Mondale questioning Gary Hart, "Where's the beef?" in 1984. George H.W. Bush condemning Ronald Reagan's economic scheme as "Voodoo Economics" in 1980. Al Gore was particularly vicious to Bill Bradley in 2000. As was Bob Dole and a cast of thousands in their hysterical attacks on Pat Buchanan in 1996. George W. Bush was not particularly kind to John McCain in 2000.

Mitt Romney and John McCain, who all of a sudden is not the frontrunner, will have to get good and nasty about Rudy Guiliani. That should be easy. Guiliani's lifestyle is repellant and so are a majority of his political positions. He must be crushed or, at the very least, sent limping into the general election.

Howee
More leftist B.S. on immigration:

"How far is Rudy's stance on dealing w/ the illegal entrants already in our country much different from that of President Bush? If we could wave a magic wand and instantly be rid of the 11m-20m (depending upon whose counting) that would be great. Realistically, what do we do to remove them all? Do you have the answer? Does Mitt Romney? Does anyone?

The Fence is a stupid idea; it is mere symbolism. These folks will cross inhospitable deserts, mountains, and rivers to get here, they're going to be deterred by a fence? Comprehensive immigration reform and border security are needed; utlizing technology to better watch our borders, increased hiring of Border Patrol personnel, allowing state and local law enforcement to arrest and detain for deportation those they find here illegally, increasing penalties upon businesses who knowingly hire illegal entrants while at the same time increasing ops for some sort of regulated temp worker program.

I don't know how we responsibly, realistically deal w/ the millions of illegals already here. And I've read no one who has any responsible realistic solutions, either."

No one is demanding that we immediately deport all 30 MILLION or so illegals. Nice idea, but not possible.

Of course fences work. Have you no clue as to why so many illegals are now crossing in the deep desert? It's because we've already built border fences near population centers. The fences aren't perfect, but they help--a lot.

As for dealing with the ones already here, the solution is simple: Serious enforcement of laws against hiring illegals. When hiring illegals consistently means paying big fines and/or going to jail, jobs for illegals will dry up. When the jobs dry up, they'll go home.

This means:
* Don't give them driver's licenses.
* Don't give them Social Security benefits.
* Don't give them free health insurance.

Strange, so many RINO'S have no hair.
Rudy out in Calif. of late with the geeks in
"sillycon" valley.
1. gobal warming is real
2. I understand you guys needs and yes if you need more workers from outside the U.S. you
know you can depend on me.

not a little rino
A VERY LARGE RINO WHO'S COMPANY HAS HAD VERY LARGE CONSULTING CONTRACTS THESE LAST YEARS
FOR THE CITY OF MEXICO CITY,,

end of story,
DEAR REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE,
THROW ANOTHER ONE , WE WILL DO THE
SHARK THING AS LONG AS YOU THROW US
THESE "FAT RINO FISHEY THINGS"

Abortion and Gun Control...
You pegged the issues perfectly, Lorie, but I'm sorry, this just isn't going to work. The man's a RINO, and as such, is no different than the DEMS.

When politicians are asked about their stand on abortion -- only in the case of President is it a paramount issue, for ONLY he (or she) appoints people with the power to overturn Roe-v-Wade. ONLY THE PRESIDENT appoints Supreme Court Justices. And it's highly likely that the next President will be able to replace two pf the most liberal justices (I had to hold my nose when writing that word) in the next term.

Furthermore, nothing is MORE important to our nation's defense against the Islamic enemy than our guns. Nothing. Period.

The ever-left-drifting Republican party had better learn the REAL lesson of the election of 2006 -- We will not accept any more RINOs.

Townhall...
Will you PLEASE get off of the Giuliani and McCain horses ... they are absolutely unacceptable to the base and will lose. You cannot win the election by abandoning the principles of your base.

Passion...
I just can't let it go, this article really ticked me off...

Does the Republican party really propose that we choose between two anti-gun, pro-abortion New York Liberals; Hillary or Rudy? Are they serious?


Davy's Crock wrote:
[quote]Davy's Crock
As Merry said to the ent, Treebeard, "but you are part of this world...aren't you? If you leave the party where will you go? You will just trade one world-view for another. I prefer the conservative world-view to the liberals world-view. It is not enough to be against everything, you need to be for something. Where is good citizenship these days? [/quote]

Good citizenship starts with voting on principle and not the lessor of the evils. Many good conservatives have recognized that we desperately need a SECOND party in the U.S., which is why the Constitution Party is growing like wildfire.

Take back your country by voting on principle.

rino
when asked about gun control,rudy said in n.y. it did not stop any one from hunting,hunting?

Rudy Giuliani
A way for Rudy Giuliani to get the Pro-Life vote in order to get the
Republican Nomination and still to save face, is for him to be
Pro "INFORMED" Choice.

Peggy Holder
Big Bear Lake, Ca.
California Pro-Life Council

Wayward1
Don't you mean a "third" party? But what do we do if their is no "Constitutional Party" candidate to vote for? Good citizenship is considering all the person's running and voting, not on imagining the perfect candidate and not voting.

CC
Sometimes not voting IS the right thing to do.

Or have principles come to be meaningless nowdays?

There is a message here that needs to be understood, and the R party has refused to acknowledge it since 1994.

solution to the illegal immigration prob
From what I've heard Giuliani say he says that he will secure the border, we know Tomcrado and Gingrich would and even Richardson governor of New Mexico (D) if your willing to vote for a dem.
Here's the solution to illegal immigration.
1.Put 20,000 armed national guard troops on the border to back up the B.P (temporially until we build up the B.P) allow them to detain illegal aliens and hand them over to the B.P. and allow them to fire when fired upon. Those who are captured trying to get into the coutnry illegally wil be documented and sent back, and if they're caught again they face a jail term of 6-10 years.
2.Build up the B.P by 70% over the course of four years and stop sending agents to jail when they fire on an illegal when they feel they are in danger.
3.Build a large wall along the entire border regardless of cost, we shouldn't worry about how much it costs to protect our country. On that wall put cameras, motion sensors, heat sensors, etc. and stations every 20 miles giving the agents easy acsess to where ever the illegals may be, and reinforce the wall underneath so nobody can dig underneath it.
4.Dealing with those already here sending them all back would be great but it's not sensible. We need to tell them to come forward and we will allow them to be here as guest workers and give them green cards, they have to learn and understand english and they must be here for 6 years before becoming citizens, if they commit one felony or two misdemeanors they will documented and deported. If they don't come forward then we track them and deprt them.
5.Put heavy fines and jail terms on those businesses who hire illegals letting them know that it won't be tolerated.
6.Once all of that is done then we can worry about a guest worker program, allowing people to work and once the job is done they go home.

solution to illegal immigration prob
From what I've heard Giuliani say he says that he will secure the border, we know Tomcrado and Gingrich would and even Richardson governor of New Mexico (D) if your willing to vote for a dem.
Here's the solution to illegal immigration.
1.Put 20,000 armed national guard troops on the border to back up the B.P (temporially until we build up the B.P) allow them to detain illegal aliens and hand them over to the B.P. and allow them to fire when fired upon. Those who are captured trying to get into the coutnry illegally wil be documented and sent back, and if they're caught again they face a jail term of 6-10 years.
2.Build up the B.P by 70% over the course of four years and stop sending agents to jail when they fire on an illegal when they feel they are in danger.
3.Build a large wall along the entire border regardless of cost, we shouldn't worry about how much it costs to protect our country. On that wall put cameras, motion sensors, heat sensors, etc. and stations every 20 miles giving the agents easy acsess to where ever the illegals may be, and reinforce the wall underneath so nobody can dig underneath it.
4.Dealing with those already here sending them all back would be great but it's not sensible. We need to tell them to come forward and we will allow them to be here as guest workers and give them green cards, they have to learn and understand english and they must be here for 6 years before becoming citizens, if they commit one felony or two misdemeanors they will documented and deported. If they don't come forward then we track them and deprt them.
5.Put heavy fines and jail terms on those businesses who hire illegals letting them know that it won't be tolerated.
6.Once all of that is done then we can worry about a guest worker program, allowing people to work and once the job is done they go home.

Lone Wolfy:
Giuliani, when he was Mayor of New York City, was a leader of ALL the people, it did'nt matter if you were democrat or Neo-Con he was a leader and thats why I will vote for him in 2008; Giuliani met the call to be Mayor of a overwhelming democratic city, which has a large Gay population a large minority population, and a budget bigger than most countries on this earth. And he won a second term, because he knew how to deal with ALL the people and not just pander to the conservative right. In 2008, it will be Giuliani/Romney vs. Clinton/Obama, for all the marbles.

Giuliani? Maybe, but....
As a moderate libertarian who would *like* to have a viable Republican candidate to vote for in '08, Giuliani seems like the most tolerable among the GOP front-runners...but that's not saying much. Apparently he's been a strong leader, and sometimes we do need those. He's probably the most electable of the Republicans, and that's significant when the likely alternatives are Hillary or sleazebag trial lawyer Edwards or liberal media idol Obama. I don't care how many times he was divorced, or that he's not against abortion and gay marriage. It doesn't bother me if he's not in favor of building a Berlin Wall between here and Mexico. I'm not a purist enough libertarian to believe in completely open borders, but I'm not a "deport 'em all and let God sort 'em out" type, either.

But Giuliani's support of gun control does bother me. Apparently he thinks it's constitutional and effective; he's wrong about both. I'd have to at least be convinced that he's not going to push to extend and nationalize New York-type gun controls, before I could support him.

And David Kopel, an analyst of gun-rights issues, has noted that Giuliani's record on *other* civil liberties, as prosecutor and mayor, isn't great either. I want to be tough on violent criminals and terrorists, but I don't want to dismantle the Constitution to get at them.

Somebody else who identified himself as a libertarian said he'd vote for the Libertarian Party candidate or for very-long-shot GOP candidate Ron Paul rather than for Giuliani or any other likely GOP nominee. I can sympathize; I've voted for LP candidates in several previous elections. But I've about given up on the LP as a serious political factor, and I really would like to keep Hillary from returning to the White House. I hope Giuliani can convince me he's tolerable, or that someone else emerges from the GOP pack that I can stomach.

If Giuliani is the nominee
I will write in Ron Paul name even if Giuliani wins the nomination for Repub Party, and will encourage every conservative I know to write in his name as well.
I will not vote for the lesser of two liberals.

Now is the time for the repub party to latch onto Constitutional Rule of Law or go the course of social liberalism.

Give me liberty or liberalism.

Hmmm it's a no brainer, I'll accept nothing less than my God-given right to Liberty. No man or party can take that away and be justified.

Sensible?
Centurion, why is sending the illegals back to where they came from not sensible? You undertake this very long, detailed, and complete method to erecting a barrior to the illegals and then in a complete about face advocate amnesty in the guise of a Guest Worker Plan for those already here. If illegals are a bad thing (and I agree that they are) then why should we want any?

Your solution is akin to spraying the perimeter of your house with pesticide to prevent termites from entering your property, and then doing absolutely nothing about the termites already in your house. Just doesn't make sense. And neither does granting amnesty to 20 plus million illegals and setting in motion the next wave that will come seeking the next amnesty.

Two Liberals?
It gets annoying when the liberals on the writing staff of Townhall.com keep coming out of the closet pushing tired old leftists like Rudy Giuliani.

Consider Giuliani? Yes, I consider him to be just another RINO. The good Mr. Giuliani made his name by persecuting Michael Milken, who had the temerity to challenge the dominance of the Wall Street Bankers for providing credit to smaller and start-up businesses. This had to be stopped, and Rudy stepped into the fray and sent a better man than himself off to the slammer. He is in favor of infanticide, gun control, unlimited immigration, and a surveillance state. This turkey is a conservative? Only if you are trying to conserve a crypto-Marxist police state. As a free American, I am not looking for a strong leader. I can manage my own affairs quite nicely, thank you. Besides, Rudy only looks like a leader because the two draft dodging cowards at the top of the executive branch were off hiding when their failed immigration policies came home to roost. I would be far happier with a presidential candidate who actually took their oath of office and constitutional duties seriously. That has not happened since the days of Calvin Coolidge. Possibly not since Grover Cleveland. Quit floating these trial balloons, and go find yourself a real conservative to run in 2008.

Duplicitious Giuliani
Giuliani did NOT manage City Agencies very well. The dramatic events of 9/11 and subsequent PR campaigns cover up these issues. For example, Rudi did not permit City employees to notify INS re illegals. (This policy was the same under Koch and Dinkins). However, he's taking credit from the Feds who were reponsible for deportations, usually in cases of criminal prosecution. Extensive multicultural/diversity training was required in several City Agencies, especially the Agency for Childrens' Services. I remember the case of a girl from Guyana who was tied to a tree and beaten as she did not complete her household tasks. I was pressured not to initiate a Neglect Petition as cultural differences were a factor. Under Rudi and Commissioner Scoppetta lax drug policies were also perpetuated. Parents involved in recreational drug use of crack/cocaine were often scored low on the SUNY UCR forms. Lack of staff and poor organization re implementation of services and resources highlighted the Rudi/Scoppetta Administration. Following the fatality of Elizabeth Izquierdo, Giuliani censored Free Speech re policy problems and we were unable to bring these issues to the forefront. We won in Court, no monetary gain, just Free Speech for Public Employees. No, Rudi is not a good example of what a President should be! If you listen closely, you will find no substantive ideas on policy, only emotional rhetoric that anyone of us good Conservatives could give! Also, all of you dedicated readers, please read FORBES, Nov.13th'06 edition re Rudi's investments in Camelbak (with Kerik, an Iraq venture) and especially Applied DNA Sciences and see how he really manages his concerns (not to mention his ex-wife) These companies all went belly-up after he took huge profits! Also, before Welfare Reform was foisted upon his Administration, Duplication of funds, (caseworkers would often find parents who worked and received welfare and child-care benefits),was often not acted upon by the IG, although we wrote memos and letters (which ended up in the round file)! I brought up this issue on Bob Grant's radio show numerous times. Anyway, speaking of the old maestro, in his words, Rudi is a "fake, phony, fraud."

Giuliani and Conservatism:
The wicked witch of the north, Ann Coulter, has said that she could not support Giuliani because of his stance on abortion, gun control and gay rights, of which, I, a moderate Republican support. Giuliani learned when he was mayor of New York, that you have to protect the rights of all people and not just a few, that you may be against something in your heart but you cannot let those feelings get in the way when you govern millions of your fellow man, gay or not, black or white, jew or gentile. Thats why Neo-cons don't support Giuliani because he follows the path of a good leader.

1844 Revisited
The Commodore & his Lady unto Townhall: greetings.

Why did the Commodore & his Lady cite 1844? Simple: the Whigs went for ideological purity, instead of pragmatism, or electability; the end result was Young Hickory, James Knox Polk (Andrew Jackson's "Last Hurrah").

Until the Man from Galilee puts His Foot down on the Mount of Olives, we will have to go into the polling booth and vote for the lesser of evils.

September 11, 2001, changed the viewpoints of many an American, including the Commodore & his Lady.

For the GOP, the question still remains:

"With which candidate can the Republicans defeat Hillary?" And the GOP is divided, as it has since the factions arose in 1976: the RINO faction, as represented by Gerald R. Ford; and the Far Right faction, represnted by Ronald W. Reagan.

(Both men have gone on, so the Commodore & his Lady can use them as exemplars.)

The issue is organization; the Internet has enabled the base to organize to some extent, but the issue still remains. The GOP must unite behind a specific candidate, well ahead of the General Election.

As for the Democrats, they do not have a viable candidate except Hillary. All the others have announced, but the early primaries will force the other candidates to accept being the #2 behind Hillary Rodham Clinton. And she has a lot of issues to consider, if not avenge, chief among them being the GOP decision to impeach her "husband".

Bring on the Asteroid, unless the Man from Galilee intervenes first.

BrianR
I really am trying to understand your point of view BrianR, but I just don't. Millians of people don't vote in elections for one reason or another, but don't ask me what message they sent anyone. The only people that have a real impact on our system of government are those who vote. Those that pass bills and make law are the one's who vote yea or nay, not the ones who abstain or are not present! If a slate of candidates doesn't measure up find one who does and campaign for him or her and back her to the hilt but if you lose in the primaries don't say your taking your toys and go home and sulk. Stay engaged, write your senator or congressman, etc. The squeeky wheel will eventually get the grease. I never met a principle that ran for office. I have known people with principles that do. I have very strong principles myself, but I realize that very few candidates will embody them all if any! Name the last time you didn't vote on principle and then tell me what impact it had...I'd be real interested in hearing your answer!

82nd Airborne
You wrote: "she could not support Giuliani because of his stance on abortion, gun control and gay rights, of which, I, a moderate Republican support."

Well, I guess that's certainly a redefinition of the phrase "moderate Republican". Sounds exactly to me like leftist Democrat.

CC
Let me make this real clear and simple. As long as the R party knows that it can count on the sheep to vote for any jacka$$ they're inclined to run, regardless of his conservative chops, they have no reason to do anything to mend their ways.

It's as plain and simple as that. Maybe it'll take a bad Dem president to make things change, just like we had to get through Carter to end up with Reagan. If so, so be it.

As I've said so many times before, just because some yahoo sticks an "R" behind his name doesn't guarantee him my vote.

Man, I get annoyed having to explain over and over again something that seems to me to be such a no-brainer.

I'm Still Waiting BrianR
for you to give me an example of a time when you didn't vote and it had the desired effect of making the Rupublians come to their senses and realize how valuable you were to them.

He'll not succeed...
without the conservative base.

He might have gotten elected in liberal NY, AND done well through 9/11, but we need a man who will stand up for the rights of the unborn as well.

Guiliani does't have it.

It saddens me... so much promise, but he's so far he's sold his soul to the leftists on social issues.

Is Newt running yet? :-)

CC
That's irrelevant. I vote on my principles, which happen to be a lot more important to me than the outcome of any single election.

You do know the meaning of the words "principles", I hope?

BTW, in the past, I haven't had to take this approach, as the R party until post-Reagan used to run pretty good candidates. Those days, sadly, seem to be gone.

2nd Amendment Rights
Anyone who thinks gun control is not an issue is kidding him/herself. I will not vote for a gun grabber.

Fighting terrorism and illegal immigration are the most important issues in this election but if we do not protect the 1st and 2nd Amendments we will not have any rights.

The courts may interprete the laws such as abortion, but the president appoints the federal judges and anyway; who wants to be governed by an immoral man?

Yes, Rudy did a good job post 911, but make no mistake- he is a liberal.


BrianR
Let me quess then. You didn't vote for George H.W. Bush because he broke his no new taxes pledge and it had the effect of....congratulations, eight years of Slick Willie Clinton! And let's see. You didn't vote for your local Rupublican congressman or Senator in California because they are JUST LIKE THE DEMOCRATS! That paid off handsomely with Madame Pelosi as Madam Chairman in the House, Harry Reid ruling the senete, Murtha threatening to cut funds for our troops, Rangel as head of the WAYS and MEANS committee. Oh voting on principle must make you feel sooooo good. I must try it! Did I get any of my guesses right or am I way off base here?

CC
Not even close. So far off base you're not even anywhere near the ball park.

You sounded pretty foolish while you were doing it, too.

Liberty, Hustler
Read My Post Again.

I did NOT say vote for Giuliani; but I DID say you had better get someone and get them soon that will prosecute the War and close the Border.
The way to circumvent a Giuliani Candidacy is to get out and sweat your azz off for someone who has our values. Because the politicians of both parties seem to have already started the '08 run we all need to get out and do it now. I am fortunate enough to live in a state with 2 Conservative Senators and a Conservative Representative but I will be active in their re-election bids, even if the only thing I can do is make coffee and sweep up the campaign hdqtrs.

Liberty, Hustler, as far as gun control goes, if you already have 'em, what is your problem. If they tell you to bring 'em in and register them, and you DO, you don't need 'em. If you ain't got 'em, get 'em now. They aren't toys and you don't need to parade them out to show to every Tom, Dick and Harry. Like a friend said, "The first time someone needs to know I have a gun is when they see that bright, orange flash."
Hustler, I am not looking at another country. I put in too much time and effort here but I already have whatever I need to protect my home and myself or else I would be making the gunshows. If you feel you don't have what you need, I suggest you try checking them out. If you are worried about government interference with firearms, you are a day late and a dollar short. The ATF is all about gun control.

to CC:
Wayward1
Don't you mean a "third" party? But what do we do if their is no "Constitutional Party" candidate to vote for? Good citizenship is considering all the person's running and voting, not on imagining the perfect candidate and not voting.


No, I mean exactly what I wrote. Under the First Bush we had the roots of the FTAA, Under Clinton we saw Nafta - Under Bush 2nd we have Cafta and the SPP. Neither Democrat or Republican has done anything to stop the erosion of our borders, in fact both parties have promoted it. Both parties have done nothing to stop abortion, both have continued to allow the outsourcing of our jobs, both have sat idly by as the Dept. of Education, our higly learning insitutions and Hollywood have fostered a decadent and depraved American culture that both angers and repulses other societies - most notably devoutly religious Islamic ones who give their lives to prevent our narcissistic value system from corrupting theirs.

I meant exatly what I said. It's time AMerican woke up to the fact that there is only one party in the U.S. and it is mastered by the grandest of pupateers.

American needs men and women of principle and a SECOND ploitical party.

Pragmatism vs. Idealism
So, who is stepping forward as a candidate that has a solid, positive record of experience and accomplishment and expresses unwavering commitment to all of the issues I deem critical. Let me think, ....oh Jesus.....No, I guess he has not thrown his hat in the ring.

Let's get the idealism crap out of our system folks, unless we choose to throw reality out the window!

Now, given the fact that EVERYONE falls short of perfection, who comes closest? OK, none of them comes very close, that's true. But, one doesn't have to look too closely to see that there are some highly qualified candidates with solid records, positive philosophies, and workable ideas. Conversely, there are others with little accomplishment, negative philosophies, and vacuous ideas.

If candidate "A" grades a 70%, would you rather hand the election to a candidate who grades a 30%, just because you disagree with him or her on a minority of issues? Come on. Reality hurts, but it beats the alternative by a long shot.

Pro-abortion, anti-abortion...
What's the difference?

Ronald Reagan was president for eight years, and he didn't stop one single abortion.

I'm glad he was against the practice, but practically speaking what it got us was a few judges but not enough to turn the tide.

If Rudy wants to appoint judges that would overturn Roe, then yippee. New York State and a bunch of others would still vote to keep the practice legal.

But you and I could choose not to live in those places. Dems would flock to them and it would become ever more clear that they have aborted their long-term chance at an electoral majority via the Roe effect.

Giuliani says he wants Scalias in the federal courts. They are available and all he has to do is nominate them and then got to battle for them against the Kennedy/Leahy bunch. Compared to Bush, I think Giuliani would eat their lunch.

He knows abortion will never be outlawed in San Francisco or Boston. But I don't think Giuliani is averse to letting the people of Texas and Kansas decide for themselves.

It would be ironic, wouldn't it, if strict constructionists appointed by "pro-choice" Rudy wound up being the justices that finally tipped the balance of the court against Roe.

Not saying it's likely. Just that it would be ironic. Giuliani's views on gun control will not translate into a rerun of the Brady fiasco. Every Democrat knows that Brady street ends in an electoral cul-de-sac. That's why one of the memorable Kerry quotes from '04 goes like this: "Where can I get me a huntin' license?"

They can just try it and see how far it goes.

My vote, early on, leans toward the Mormon. Funny how Romney is the only major Republican hopeful without multiple wives. Rudy, McCain, Gingrich...serial marriers. The Mormon is the monogamous one! And I'm not talking about serial monogamy like the others--I'm talking lifetime monogamy. He and his wife seem, unlike the Clintons, to actually enjoy each other.

I think he's worth looking into a little deeper.

Pragmatism vs. Idealism
Washingtonian3 suggests that he'd vote for a candidate that supports 70% of his views. Well I would agree with that statement but show me a candidate that actually lives up to 10% of their campaign promises or platform and I'll roll over!

With the exception of Ron Paul and Tom Tancredo (that I'm aware of) all of our elected officials are bought and paid for by the corporate lobbyists. We have gotten to a point in our political spectrum where a Marxist (Hillary) and a empty suit (Obama) stand a fair chance of winning the next election. On the Republican ticket we have Giuliani who will strip us of the 2nd amendment and open our borders further.

You suggest Pragmatism vs. Idealism!!!

How about facing realty, stepping up and realizing that if we don't get a Constitutionalist in office we're going to be known as the United Socialist States of America, extending from Anchorage to Panama. Along the way you'll find that the true wealth in the U.S., that belonging to the middle class was re-distributed to Mexico to balance our economies, thus eliminating our middle class.

Wake up sheeple.........

Rudy looks good in a dress

To Rubberduck Crusader
How can you describe Rudy as "a great guy" while at the same time describing abortion rights as a modern holocaust? The two seem to me to be incompatible.

More to the point, and I urge all conservatives to think (and not emote) about this:

If the choice comes down to Hillary vs. Rudy, who will you choose?

If you say you would only choose a pro-life 3rd party candidate (or you would stay home), I say shame on you, because you in effect you will be voting for Hillary and betraying your values in the name of sanctimony and utopian naivete, in which case I would say you prefer the martyrdom of your cause celeb to the actual achievement of your presumptive goal of overturning Roe vs Wade.

Option for Rudy
So here we are ... all professing how principled and conservative we are! I do agree with all of it ... but, there is a BUT.

Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney are definitely at the top of my list. I really wish Rick Santorum or Tom Tancredo stood a chance. BUT they ALL will surely take a beating from the liberal media, the liberal teachers and college professors influencing the next generation voters, the unions, etc. etc.

I DO NOT WANT ANOTHER PEROT DEBACLE IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY. BILL CLINTON DID NOT WIN THE ELECTION, PRESIDENT BUSH LOST TO PEROT!

The gentleman may be right when he said that it may take another Carter to wake up this Conservative Party.
However, while we try to get it right and are
butting heads with each other, 4,000 babies a day are still being killed. We need to DO SOMETHING to save these innocent lives NOW.

85% of something is better than 100% of NOTHING!

WE need to get to ALL of the “Pro-Choice” candidates,
not just the Republicans. Their game of semantics over the last 34 years sickens me. Clever to be “Pro-Choice” instead of “Pro-Abortion”. We stop them cold in their tracks when we ask. “Are you pro “INFORMED” choice?”
We, too, can play their semantics game.

We need to convince candidates who have committed to being “Pro-Choice” to be “Pro-Informed-Choice” thus saving face and not being accused of a flip-flop, etc.

This is a fact - presently, the alternative counseling at abortion clinics is one line to the mother - “You realize there are alternatives, right?” THE END!

"Informed" Choice would mandate that abortion providers
*show the ultrasound pictures to the mother
* explain the stages and development of the baby
* inform that the child being killed feels pain
* thoroughly explain all other options
including the Birthright Organization's offer to provide
a home for the mother until birth and even
after the birth if she wants to keep the child.

If, after being shown all of the above, the woman still
chooses to kill her baby, there's not much we can do.

But, as I said, "85% of something is better than
100% of nothing." We would save a lot more children
if the mother had to first see a film of the developing child.

It may take some time after the elections to get mandates informing alternatives to abortion. But, it makes much more sense to get candidates on our side before the fact. I want a President who will appoint pro-life judges and who will sign pro-life legislation, not veto it as Clinton did.

SO, if Rudy Giuliani were to come out as “pro-INFORMED-choice and he does win the primary, I would vote for him.

I do not know how to get to Rudy Giuliani and express the “INFORMED” option to him. To those of you who are supporting his candidacy, perhaps you could relay this message.

Thanks.
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