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Sunday, July 08, 2007
Kevin McCullough :: Townhall.com Columnist
Calling a 'Spade' a 'Muslim'
by Kevin McCullough
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It is ironic isn't it?

On week after eight Muslim doctors were taken into custody for plotting three car bomb attacks in the U.K. only a week ago, and following the discovery of a plot in which forty-five Muslim doctors intend to penetrate America's borders and do the same thing - the reigning champion on Jeopardy this very weekend - is a Muslim doctor.

He's smart, well put together, and very, very knowledgeable about all of the categories in his two day run that relate especially to American politics, relatively unknown heads of state in the Middle East, and fared very well on some relatively obscure chemistry questions too.

Does that make him a jihadi bomber?

I'm not asserting anything of the sort - but the questions now run through my mind that didn't only two weeks ago.

We were told by liberals, and the anti-war left that these poor Muslims were acting out against the United States because of western aggression and 'unfair' economic policies that locked the jihadis in dirt poor conditions. We were told that they were just uneducated blokes whose only possible avenue of response had to be violence against innocent people.

I guess that line of reasoning doesn't hold up when 53 prominent, highly educated, and evidently pretty financially mobile physicians have decided that they will use their Mercedes, Land Rovers, and Jeep Cherokees to destroy us several dozen at a time.

Reacting to the newly uncovered "45 doc" plot against the U.S. this week I observed on my Monday broadcast that it seemed the terrorists had observed our decision to cast suspicion against "poor jihadis" and simply altered their tactics to be less noticeable. Physicians are able to move much more easily from nation to nation, and after all they've taken the Hippocratic Oath to uphold life... right?

As my phone lines lit up one caller, 'Debbie' from Philadelphia, professed to working as an airline flight attendant, she recounted multiple eerie and creepy encounters with Muslim men on recent flights. Her estimation was that these men were purposefully "testing her reaction" as well as the rest of the crew to see what would be done. From one passenger going to the lavatory only to return wearing a bandana (a la 'United 93') to an Arab male who refused to take his seat because he was asked to by a mere woman.

The very next caller was 'Ellie' from Brooklyn; she chastised me for allowing Debbie to tell of her experiences. She launched accusations of Americans’ ignorance when it came to Arab/Muslim customs. She hatefully espoused that 'Debbie' was bigoted for having felt the least bit odd, when in fact "odd" things were happening around her. And in one mad rampant spew at the end of her call she accused me of needing "sensitivity" training, instructing me to use my air-time to spread the truth about Islam and to teach its true meaning.

I replied by responding that the concerns Debbie had, were not the least akin to bigotry. The airline flight attendant is the rule of law on international flights, when she tells the man politely to park his backside in his seat, I could care less what his Arab or Muslim culture informs him of. He has but one responsibility - and that is - to sit the heck down.

It was the observation of many of my show's staff that Ellie was quite likely a plant of some sort, attempting to disseminate exactly what our enemy wants us to think.

And on that initiative - they seem to be winning.

On Friday British Prime Minister Gordon Brown instructed his ministers to no longer use the word "Muslim" when referring to terrorist acts like the ones carried out in London and Glasgow. He also had the "war on terror" removed from the vernacular of the two week old government. His reasoning?

“There is clearly a need to strike a consensual tone in relation to all communities across the UK. It is important that the country remains united.”

And there it is again, that same blasted idea of a "consensual tone."

But does anyone ask the question, "What are we consenting to?" Nobody is arguing persecution for any one religious or ethnic group here, but for the record I'm fed up with all the "consensual tone" we westerners have had to concede on the issue.

Saying "it is important that the country remains united" begs the same question.

United around what?

It seems to me that the enemy is given lots of cover when we force the matter of linguistic correctness upon the masses. We have bent over backwards so as to not offend Arabs and Muslims. So much so that some are starting to ask - when are the Arabs and Muslims going to start helping us with these issues of security?

If consensus must be had then let it be the Muslim community who demonstrates their willingness to work with the larger society by conducting thorough internal investigations, coughing up the perpetrators, and demonstratively wiping their hands of the murderous thugs. Let us see their unique outrage that they share our pain and are willing to stand with the infidel and against their brother - for the cause of justice... consensually speaking.

Up and until that day comes I refuse to criticize good and decent, hard working innocent people like 'Debbie' from Philadelphia who in the aftermath of 9/11, sometimes worries about odd behaviors she sees expressed by religiously self-superior Arab males.

And it will be a very long time, for me personally, before the phrase 'Muslim doctor' will be able to be uttered in my presence without some sense of defensiveness quickening my heart rate.

"That's 'common sense' for $2000 Alex..."

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About The Author
Kevin McCullough is the nationally syndicated host of "'Xtreme' Radio and columnist based in New York. He blogs at www.muscleheadrevolution.com. His second book "The Kind Of MAN Every Man SHOULD Be" is in stores now.

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common sense for 100
Not every Muslim is a terrorist, but just about every damned terrorist IS a Muslim, specifically males from 18 to 45. End of story. Therefore, we should focus our suspicions on that demographic group and heighten the scrutiny they are subjected to in life. It is called good policework and national security, not racism.

Lastly, before some idiot liberal brings up Timothy McVeigh, he did not act in the name of Christianity or as part of a broader religious crusade, he was just a nutcase who happened to be Christian. Even the abortion bombers operated on such a small scale that to compare them to the current Muslim problem is grasping at straws in the extreme.

the apologist
would be a better name for you, incognito.

Get this straight: I don't care what the history is -- NO nation is pure. All nations, to one degree or another, have done morally questionable things; they are, after all, comprised of sinful human beings. Even with the best of intentions, nations can and do get things wrong.

But for you to dredge up the history of the last 2000 years in an attempt to provide COVER for evil of the foulest kind, as practiced by people whose stated aim is to terrorize and murder to acheive mastery of the world, in my mind, makes YOU COMPLICIT in their evil deeds.

Are you really that stupid? brainwashed? unthinking?

Tell me, when was the last time our government snatched innocent people for the sole purpose of filming their beheading for internet and television viewing?

Tell me????

You're so far gone you can't see the difference, can you? America has to be perfectly pure and innocent of ever doing anything wrong -- is that when you'd see we're different from sociopaths, nihilists, people who bring little boys, baked (yes, as food), to their Iraqi parents in order to intimidate them?

Get a grip.

Jihadism before Israel
incognito writes: "I believe that the Holy War in the Koran is a reaction to the Holy War in the Bible."

Well, you're wrong, and the proof is the incessant jihad that Islam has conducted against India for a thousand years, even though India isn't exactly a Jewish nation. It also ignores the civil wars that have been raging in Africa, in which Islamists have been trying to get control of Somalia and Arab Muslims have waged a genocidal war in Darfur against the native black African population there.

Jihadism is a front for naked Arab Muslim imperialism. They yearn to restore the caliphate that disappeared with the Ottoman Empire. Osama bin Laden made that very clear when he spoke of the "humiliation" Muslims have suffered since 1920. (What happened around 1920? It was the abolition of the caliphate, and that was 28 years before the establishment of Israel.)

Like the Germans in the 1920s and 1930s, the Muslims are freaking out over loss of their empire and wounded pride. And just as Hitler came along to promise the Germans he would take revenge and restore German pride, the Islamists make the same promises of revenge and pride to the Muslims.

To blame Israel is a classic "post hoc, ergo propter hoc" fallacy--Israel was established in the mid 20th century, jihadism ballooned in the 20th century, therefore you seem to think these two events are strongly connected.

Israel is simply ONE example of what irks the fundamentalist Muslims so much: They believe that all of the Middle East belongs to THEM, to be ruled by devout Muslims only just as it was for centuries. They pounce on anyone who acts "uppity" whether it's Lebanese Christians or Indian Hindus. Israel is intolerable to them because they cannot stand the idea of any non-Muslims having political power in the Middle East.

As for the rest of your description of 20th century history, it's way off base. A complete discussion of 20th century world history is outside the scope of townhall.com, so I'm not going to bother engaging you with it. Suffice it to say that your views aren't exactly mainstream, and are shot through with factual errors. The overwhelming majority of Americans are still very proud of their country, and of its track record in helping to liberate ONE BILLION people from Fascism and Communism during the 20th century.

That the Nazis, Japanese militarists, and Soviet Communists are gone from the planet is due in no small part to America.

Which must really stick in your craw, I'll bet.

Dr. al Zawahiri
The "exploded myths" mentioned here are carefully crafted to be self-serving, such as the one about poverty and terrorism.

So what if this group was a bunch of doctors. Doctors in al Qa'ida are nothing new, since bin Laden's #2 man is himself a SURGEON:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayman_al-Zawahiri

And bin Laden, well he's a billionheir, with about as much moral grounding and usefulness as our American heiress.

But in other parts of the world, particularly in Palestinian areas, poverty is one of a number of factors leading to desperation and despair (and certainly not the only one), and that leads to people willing to blow themselves up for a cause they have been brainwashed into believing will bring something positive to those they leave behind, or at least do something very bad to those they blame for their desperation and despair.

Of course, the leaders themselves -- who don't go blowing themselves up -- aren't always coming from despair. Those doctors who planted the bombs weren't about to kill themselves, and neither has bin Laden or al Zawahiri.

So this "myth" as stated carefully Mr. Connor and Rev. McCullough is not more shattered than it was when Dr. al Zawahiri or billionaire bin Laden first turned on a camcorder.

Muslim doctors
< < the reigning champion on Jeopardy this very weekend - is a Muslim doctor. > >

You'll probably breathe a little easier, Reverend McCullough, to know that more than 99.99% of Muslim doctors are not jihadists.

Also, I'm pretty sure that Jeopardy is prerecorded, so if the contestant had been an Islamo-fascist contestant hell-bent on blowing up the studio to support the establishment of an Islamist caliphate by striking a blow against the dissemination of knowledge and information (Jeopardy's mission), then we probably would have heard about it already.



Avoid jihad and jihadist --> Use hirabah
We in the West have co-opted the term "jihad" and "jihadist" when that very use may be causing our own goals to become murky even among those who aren't supporters of armed struggle with non-Muslims.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hirabah#Relation_with_Jihad

Here's an interesting bit from NPR on the subject:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6406405

Professor Douglas Streusand says that's why U.S. officials should stop using the term altogether. Streusand is an Arabic and Farsi speaker with a doctorate from the University of Chicago. He teaches Islamic history at the Marine Corps Staff College in Quantico, Va. In a paper written for and circulated among top military brass in the Pentagon, Streusand argues that describing Islamist militants and insurgents in Iraq as "jihadists" is hurting U.S. policy.

Why? Because according to Streusand, "for a Muslim, jihad is a good thing. It literally means striving in the path of God." By describing insurgents or terrorists as "jihadists," he argues, we imply we are fighting meritorious Muslims. To make the point clearer, he says it would be as if al-Qaida called its enemies "freedom."

His suggestion? Use Islamic legal language. The term he suggests is "hirabah" -- literally, an unjust form of warfare.

----

Purplestater again here...

Yeah, calling bin Laden and his minions "jihadists" seems like the wrong tact if we just end up inadvertently praising them as "strivers in the path of God." I'm trying to think of a parallel with Christianity and one thing I came up with is someone trying to bash those among the Christian faithful for their support of the War on Terror by calling them "Christian soldiers." Well, that simply would not have the negative ring that was intended, would it?

Calling them hirabi (committers of hirabah) would be much more fitting to Muslim audiences as it rolled off the tongue of President Bush or PM Gordon: they're a bunch of unjust fighters, pirates, and spreaders of disorder, a serious punishment in the Qur'an.

scrutiny at airports
Ah, the 80-year-old wheelchair-bound nana so heavily scrutinized at the airport.

Indeed, wheelchair-bound octogenarian grandmothers have become so beleaguered that they have formed a nationwide lobbying organization so that the TSA will stop harassing them: Committee to Restore Ordinary Nana Existence (CRONE).

Nah, I'm quite happy that everyone gets scrutinized as much as they do. Clean-cut Timothy McVeigh and his co-conspirators, for example, wouldn't have triggered any of the racial profiling checks.

And then there's folks like Adam Gadahn or John Walker Lindh, who would blend in very nicely if they shaved off their beards. The same is true of many light-skinned Muslims of Lebanese or European, or even far North African descent. Some of them have blond hair and blue eyes even!

Yep, al Qa'ida in fact had planned to use such "European-looking" hirabi to do terrorist attacks.

So it's not just Arabs (Iranians, by the way, are not Arabs) or people we might think "look Arab." A terrorist can look like any one of us. Yes, even an Islamist terrorist can look like any one of us.

See, by making sure that everyone has a chance at deep scrutiny, they can't use our own prejudices against us.

http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/homepage/abox/article_1206394.php

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Walker_Lindh

This guy says it better
http:/Forgottenprophet.blogspot.com

oops
Make that http//forgottenprophets.blogspot.com/

“Islam vs. Islamist”

I found this review of the movie called “Islam vs. Islamist” on a blog called “A View from the Right”. The movie is very controversial, in fact PBS who helped fund the movie, refused to show it during prime time.

The part I find interesting about this review is that it points out the flaws in NEOCON logic, as well as the LEFT, on the Middle East. NEOCONS think we can convert the culture to be like the West and the LEFT believes in “happy talk” about the issues with Islam. Please read and tell us what you think.

“Islam versus Islamists: Voices from the Muslim Center,” a movie that was produced by Frank Gaffney for the current PBS series on Islam but was then rejected by PBS, was shown in a special screening in a Manhattan movie theater last evening to which I was invited. The movie is very good, and it is a scandal that PBS has spiked it. It consists largely of interviews with various hard-line Muslims in North America and Europe who explain very clearly what they’re about: the Islamization of the societies in which they live, something to which they are commanded by their religion and which, as one of them happily puts it, their host societies have given them the “margin” to pursue. Alongside these very confident and articulate exponents of sharia, several moderate Muslims, the heroes of the movie, are featured. In a telling pattern (the significance of which the filmmakers themselves don’t seem to catch, see below), after the movie describes and interviews each of these moderates, we are told that the entire Muslim community in the city where each moderate lives is against him, is hostile to him, and sees him as not a true Muslim. In one instance, the moderate Muslim in Paris has a 24 hour a day security detail to protect his life from his fellow Muslims who he revealed in a film he made about them.

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/%e2%80%9cislam-vs-islamist%e2%80%9d

Lib excuses
For those of you who still advocate excusing Muslims extreemists, I will repost my 6 pm post from yesterday:

Most suicide bombers are Muslim
From Psychology Today, the top 10 Truths about Human Nature that are not PC.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20070622-000002.xmlSee item 4.

Sure McVeigh did not fit the profile of a Muslim terrorist. However, if we started profiling the Muslim terrorists the rate of successful attacks would drop by leaps and bounds. Then we could expand the profiling to other less conspicuous people.

These reports of suspicious Muslim activity in the planes have been described by security officials as “practice runs” by the security people and more than likely they are correct.

To those of you who advocate soft approaches to security and pampering the “poor beleaguered Muslims”, I have news for you. If there is another successful attack in the US of any magnitude, the people will not be as “easygoing” as they were last time. The reports of Muslims being harassed last time (mostly false) will turn into Muslims being killed (mostly true) this time. Also, any politician who objects is likely to be handled roughly in more ways than one. Liberals who protest will be treated the same as the Muslims.

No this is not something I am advocating. This is something that will happen because of human nature. So if you libs do not wish to see a major terrorist attack in the US followed by civil unrest and mass killings, I suggest you get on board with a little common sense.

Hey, gabby...
I'm with you....

What you think you know
When my kids were very little, I generally had a house full of small children because (1) I like small children and (2) the parents of said small children generally had no interest in knowing where or with whom they were, and I was concerned that something might happen to them.

One afternoon I had to walk to the bank machine and one child who was playing on the verge, a little boy about 4, came and asked where I was going, then said confidently, "I will go with you." I asked him if his Mama hadn't taught him not to go away with strangers, and he said with perfect faith, "You are not a stranger. You are the lady with the kittens!"

I took Junior home and told her what had transpired, and she was quite alarmed, but I subsequently learned that children are frequently unable to consider someone a stranger (and thus a threat) if they know anything about that person or if the person seems to know anything about them. (This is why you never put your child's name on his gear where a stranger can read it.)

I am beginning to wonder if there is not some kind of problem with adults too; they think they know that this man is a doctor and therefore he cannot be a terrorist.

Could it be that we need to undertake more training in teaching people there is a difference between what you think you know and what the truth actually is?

Support our troops?
I wonder what Gabby would have us do with Muslim servicemen:

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=42671

The fact that a permanent Islamic mosque, the Masjid al Da'wah, has opened at Norfolk Navy Base must really tick her off.


"Sensitivity " training is actually ...
...desensitivity training. This is because great American principles have been bastardized (largely by leftists) into meaning precisely what they don't mean at all:

"Freedom" has come to mean do whatever you want if it makes you happy, results be damned and blamed on others.

"Liberty" has come to mean contrive by whatever means to take whatever you want because you entitled to it.

"Diversity" has come to mean everything anyone of any culture does is okay- even revered, regardless of the results, because that is the assumed essence of "freedom" and "liberty".

As a result, people have been largely cowed into a state of desensitization toward behaviors and practices we should absolutely NOT tolerate- particularly if those behaviors and practices belong to third world people . One look at our child "protective" services should be quite enough to convince even the most misty-eyed liberal that everything is NOT relative and that great harm is being done to society under the banners of "tolerance" and "diversity".





Sensitivity training
It's ironic that the woman who called in (Ellie of Brooklyn) thought Kevin should have sensitivity training, when in fact it is Muslim immigrants who need it.

Hey, Purplestater, what's your solution to all the honor killings, rapes of women dressed "inappropriately," and threats to apostates and critics that is going on in Europe right now? According to your posts (the first of which was directed at the wrong columnist), it's all our fault, or there's no problem, or if there is a problem we can't do anything about it anyway because it would be anti-PC to do it.

So, what's your solution to all this horrid behavior? We in America don't have to worry too much about this sort of thing -- yet. But Europe does, and they are in even more in the throes of PC-thinking than we are.

So, what's your solution?

A Spade
A main reason why there is so much poverty in the Middle East is because the despot leaders and their corruption in taking all the money, and supressing the common people. A good example is Arafat who took to himself all the moneys that the US gave for the poor homeless Palestinians. Right, the popular leaders never give themselves up for a suicide bomb, they always protect their lives. (I guess they don't like virgins.) It seems they think that the poor, umemployeed, homeless masses are just expendable numbers with no use to live in this life.

Muslim is NOT a race
When did Muslim become a race? That's like saying Christian is a race. Wasn't several terrorists white Americans who converted to Islam?

I'm tired of hearing CAIR and other organizations saying that extremists have hi-jacked the "religion of peace."

It's my opinion that all Muslims silently SUPPORT jihad and terrorism, but ONLY the extemists do it openly, while the rest of the Muslims let them do the despicable dirty work.

Nervous in North Carolina
I was at a flea market recently. Fairly innocous place, place you would probably feel safe at, just people selling stuff. Anyway, happened upon several "people" wearing burkas. It took my breath away and that image has not left me. Here is why: Americans are used to seeing people - their face, their mannerisms, hopefully a smile and then assessing wether we feel safe. However, what I saw I could not assess. Is all I could see were eyes. The burkas were large and black and one person seemed bigger than me, and I am a 5' 8" woman. So I kept wondering what was under there? Was it a man? I suspected so. They are infiltrating for sure and anyone can hide under a burka. Why would anyone want to wear one of those things, except for deception. Summers here are brutally hot and this was a hot day. Several years ago a muslim was retained for taking videos downtown of major banking facilities. If immgration is cancelled for muslims and everyone thinks it is racist (which it isn't) then stop all immigration. Problem solved. No one from another country has a right to live in the United States.

TK_libertarian
"Lastly, before some idiot liberal brings up Timothy McVeigh, he did not act in the name of Christianity or as part of a broader religious crusade, he was just a nutcase who happened to be Christian. Even the abortion bombers operated on such a small scale that to compare them to the current Muslim problem is grasping at straws in the extreme."

Doesn't that just show that they are better organized and brighter or at least better educated than our christian extremists?

Problem solved. No one from another coun
"Problem solved. No one from another country has a right to live in the United States."

Well there goes much of our business, education, heathcare and science workers for a start... uh oh

Karl
Most of these posters are about fear and hate if you watch and listen. Should have been here when immigration was really hot LOL

John Konop
That is the essence of the argument.

Is there any fundamental distinction between what is termed "radical Islam", and "Islam"?

I think the only real difference is in tactics, or methods. Socalled "moderate" muslims eschew violence, while radicals don't.

I believe the goals are identical...which is the ultimate Islamization of the planet: one group prefers persuasion and demographic shifts to accomplish the goal, while the other group prefers violence, death and forced conversion to realize the goal.

Neocons are every bit as delusional and dangerous as leftists. They believe Islam is a peaceful religion/ideology.

It is nothing of the sort.

It should be no surprise neocons are as delusional as leftists, given the history of the neoconservative movement...which largely consisted of leftists within the democratic party who gravitated to the republican party beginning in the late 1970s, bringing with them their leftist values, and in the process twisting and distorting the historic foreign policy philosophy of the republican party to suit their ends.

jerabaub LMAO
Oh no baby, the neo cons are ALL yours. You gave them a home and you supported them just like you did the racists in the south. They are the Republican Party and conservatives

Hal Donahue
I'm going to raise the same problem for you that I did for Purplestater. What do we do about all the honor killings, wife beatings, rapes of women dressed "inappropriately," death threats and even killings of apostates and critics, and the demands for shari'a?

These people come with a lot of cultural baggage, as Europe is slowly figuring out. And while our problem with these people is nowhere near as big as Europe's, it seems that you think we cannot help but let these people in. That means lots more problems and lots more problems.

So, what's your solution?

The muslim problem
I for one will never let a muslim doctor treat me. If everyone does this, maybe they will go home and take care of the poor in their own country. People think the immigration reform bill was just about mexicans, but it would have applied to all illegal immigrants. Stop the influx of foreign students and make more room in our schools for American children. Give more aid to our kids. Step up deportation for any violation of our laws. They want to cut your head off for a violation of their laws, I just want to deport them. Our politcal correctness will be our demise. It needs to stop. When Patton caught insurrgents they shot them by firing squad. We need to go back to that. We don't need Gitmo, just more ammunition.

Islam is despicable. Period
Islam is a despicable religion and their is no defense from the fact that a religion that inspires hatred, murder and destruction is nothing good.

JFP
"I'm going to raise the same problem for you that I did for Purplestater. What do we do about all the honor killings, wife beatings, rapes of women dressed "inappropriately," death threats and even killings of apostates and critics, and the demands for shari'a?"

You stop them plain and simple. They are not in compliance with our laws. We had the same problems with other immigrant groups like the Irish, Italians and Eastern Europeans although they tended to unite more around criminal organmizations to get a piece of the pie

Muslims must apologize
Muslims must apologize for the crimes committed in the name of alah if they are to be believed as sincere in their rejection of terrorism. But their silence is far more eloquent and says one of two things,
1. That they approve of terror in order to impose Islam upon the unbeliever or,
2. They are just as terrorized from the potential consequences or raising their voices in protest.

Pionero
"Islam is a despicable religion and their is no defense from the fact that a religion that inspires hatred, murder and destruction is nothing good."

In that case add christianity to the list. See Lebanon and Northern Ireland and the former Yugoslavia

Islam, what a horrible religion
The more I learn from Islam the more I find it to be despicable and unredeemable. If only those moderate Muslims appeared from whetever it is they are hiding... If they trully exist.

RE: incognito's post
LOLOLOL! Now that's a new one, 'Holy war in the Bible'. Where exactly is that passage, may I ask? Because I've read the bible cover to cover and have never seen any such thing. (Hint: Because it does not exist.)

Muslims Are Trapped
Muslims are trapped by contradictions of humanitarian and despicable acts in Wahabbi Koranic interpretation. Since there is no pure Islamic state, the whole world must be Dar ul-Kufr (The Land of Unbelief). Since Islam must declare war on unbelief, they have declared war upon the whole world. No peace-loving Muslim is allowed to decide. It hasn’t solved the centuries-old madness afflicting Arab-Persian tribal illiteracy of reason. The most revered Muslim scholars living today can not undo the contradictions; because the contradictions do exist. It is beyond their power. The power is entrenched in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia whose two cities of Medina and Mecca order a penalty to all found there that are not Muslim. The penalty is...death. All Muslims living worldwide are required to pray toward Mecca. Or...be condemned by Koranic demands and blackmailed into silent submission through Fatwa fear. Suicide becomes proof of ones allegiance. False-Relief is felt by those unhappy when they are taught who is to blame. Taught by persons now living in wealth and power, enjoying tutors’ euphoria, while fooling those seeking spiritual sanctuary; namely, Imams, Mullahs and Ayatollahs. The one to blame is therefore the teacher. As long as the teacher has the power, no-term-limit-bloodline and can point out one Koranic demand for exclusive Islamic domination, this paradox of human destruction will continue forever. Madness is a lucrative business. As perpetual targets, Western civilization has no choice. Until overwhelming force is applied as in the forces needed to stop the WW2 elitist cults of Japanese racial expansion, Hitler’s racial Arian supremacy, Communism’s social delusions or any “Chosen People” illusions we will all be victims of this madness. Exclusive domination when allied with the false-tolerance of it is the mutating force working on stage and will be enjoyed by all salacious audiences willing to pay for the ticket. The Hebrew theater creating its own victims is no different. Apathy in Europe is creeping to the United States regarding Islamic World Destiny and the sled of false-tolerance upon which it slides. Massive mortal trauma is inevitable to wake up enough nations to muster the will to cure the fever of contradictions that afflict Al Qaeda’s insane mind. Reasoning will not do it since ‘reason’ did not name it Holy-War. The Western World is stupid in not accepting the given name Holy-War, instead calling it War-on-Terror. Calling it Holy-War is the first step civilization has in defeating the juggernaut of mind-numbing Islamic World Destiny’s road to human destruction.

Leftie lies, lies, lies and more lies
Not only do Leftists lie continually, but they insist that others lie as well.

Take the latest edict from PM Gordie Brown )the disappointing successor to the fabulous Tony Blair).

Not only does he wish to live in a fantasy world where terror is not primarily being caused by Islamic crazies, he demands that his underlings follow suit and pretend that they don't know where these attacks are coming from.

One can only wonder if the Brits used the same Orwellean policy back in the day when they used to be regularly bombed by the IRA.

If they did, then one wonders how they ever figured out who to negotiate with?

Oh Donahue
Oh Donahue, Oh Donahue. The tragedy of Lebanon is precisely the consequence of Muslims trying to erradicate Christians in a land to which they where originally welcomed by them and where they are now a minority thanks to Muslim terrorims and violence. Ireland and Yugoslavia are political problems, not religious ones. To call them religious in nature is a benighted falsification of history and reality. I will concede that all religions when it reverts to its fundamentalistic roots and instincts unleashes the worst of Man through its superstitions and feeling of superiority.... something that Christianity left behind in the Middle Ages, whereas Islm has not since it still is, and probably will never surpass due to its inability to show self criticism and correction, within a Middle Age mentallity of Holly War and rejection of modernity..... except when it comes to gaining the means of exerting the highest degree of weapons and destruction. That's the only kind of technology Muslims are keen about.

From Churchill to Chamberlain
England has gone with the departure of Tony Blair from Churchill to Chamberlain in the figure of Gordon Brown, who now embodies the infamous appeaser. Wonder what his Munich will be.

To JFP
This is Hal's plan:

Democrats have a plan that is comprehensive-- from repairing our military, to winning the war on terror, to protecting our homeland security, to ensuring success in Iraq and freeing America of its dependence on foreign oil--and it will finally prepare America for the security needs of the 21st Century. And we honor the sacrifices our troops, their families and veterans by making sure we take care of them when they come home.
_______________________________________________

They will repair the military by cutting funding, as they did under Clinton when they has a Demo congress.

They will wi the war on terror by treating it as a law problem and giving lawyers to the terrorists, as they did under Clinton.

The will free us from dependence on foreign oil by magic since no program they have ever implemented or tried to implement gives us more oil in the US.

They will ensure success in Iraq by surrendering and leaving. I's just the success of the Iranian backed shia is what they are going to get.

They will honor the veterans by givinbg them socialized health care because they will cut the military budget as they did under Clinton. Perhaps they will honor them by writing a law making it illegal to spit on them as they walk through the airports?

Naaa, that's already considered assault and is against the law.
_________________________________________________

In any case, this is the Demo talking points for security straight from their site. That is Hal's strategy.

To JFP
Sorry for all the typo's, did not run it through a checker.

To bad we lost the Crusades
I used to believe that the Crusades where a bad thing..... now I realize that the only bad thing about them is that it failed to win the craddle of Christianity back from the Muslim evil invader.

Pionero
In Lebanon the Christians were not without sin said by one who was there

"I will concede that all religions when it reverts to its fundamentalistic roots and instincts unleashes the worst of Man through its superstitions and feeling of superiority.... something that Christianity left behind in the Middle Ages,..."

Two points: first, it is the 14th century in Islam what were Christians doing in their 14th century? Second, not left behind, look at the abortion bombers etc but controled by civil government. Having been in the above countries I have little doubt that a return to what you call fundementalist roots is far too easily accomplished

quite a jump there
< < Hey, Purplestater, what's your solution to all the honor killings, rapes of women dressed "inappropriately," and threats to apostates and critics that is going on in Europe right now? > >

Wow, I say that doctors and financial elites being part of the Islamist hirabi and now I'm supposed to come up with a solution to that, as if pointing out that we've long known about these doctors and financial elites somehow constitutes a denial of problems among some fundamentalists in Europe?

Okay. Give me a link to some news that talks about the problem with quantitative and qualitative descriptions so I know what we're looking at here. Like is it a hundred such rapes and killings a year in France? A thousand? Ten thousand?

< < According to your posts (the first of which was directed at the wrong columnist), > >

No, not the wrong columnist. Both Connor and McCullough both addressed the rich-doctor-as-terrorist angle like it was some great new piece of evidence.

< < it's all our fault, or there's no problem, or if there is a problem we can't do anything about it anyway because it would be anti-PC to do it. > >

Huh? What the hell are you smoking and/or drinking? That's not at all what I was saying. What on earth are you referring to?

< < So, what's your solution to all this horrid behavior? We in America don't have to worry too much about this sort of thing -- yet. But Europe does, and they are in even more in the throes of PC-thinking than we are. > >

Well, if this really happening in epidemic numbers as you say (and if it's happening at all, that's really too much), then this is a problem of fundamentalism. I know many, many, many moderate Muslims and they loathe the attitudes and the behaviors of such extremists. So that would indicate that the solution would at least involve cultivating a stronger power base for moderates and secular Muslims.

That might mean that people on sites like this might really need to finally separate in their mind that there is a real difference between moderates and fundamentalists among Muslims. Help them get more power, clout, and security, treat them like the Americans, Brits, Canadians, etc., that they are instead of looking at them as outsiders who are threats just because of where their family came from or because some jackasses are trying to co-opt their religion.

Leaders like bin Laden, of course, want non-Muslims in the West to react in rage to ALL Muslims they see because they hope that daily encounters of hostility by non-Muslims will eventually nudge moderates and secular Muslims over to their side. So go ahead and do bin Laden's bidding by lumping all Muslims together as extremist fundamentalists just like bin Laden and his hirabi ilk.

Hal Donahue a prime example
His comments, like the one equating Muslim terrorists with the mess in Northern Ireland, is an example of liberal relativism. There are no objective facts by which liberal Hal can judge Islam as a hateful and harmful religion. To him, one cannot judge, but accept all. It's multiculturalism, postmodernism, and moral relativism at its very worst. The most annoying thing about him is his arrogance when he posts here. I suggest we stop responding so he will go away.
BTW, I posted the other day that I will no longer be treated by a Muslim doctor. Their religion commands them to fight the infidel. These doctors evidently set their religion before their Hippocratic oath. When is an infidel more vulnerable than when they are sick? I don't trust any of them. And that's called simple self-preservation, which I believe is a human imperative.

Why no denunciations?
I agree with many here who have posted about "peace-loving Muslims." If by peace-loving Muslims we refer to Muslims who are not suicide bombers and those busy blowing up cars, restaurants, shops and other places where civilians gather -- then where exactly ARE those peace-loving Muslims?

They never routinely denounce jihadists as extremists and murderers. It is their silence which is deafening, and their absence from the public eye which is suspicious. Never a peep from them about the hijacking of their religion; it's non-Muslims who are so fond of designing that fancy and empty terminology.

I was raised (probably like many here on TH) by parents who taught me that if I saw something wrong, to say nothing and to do nothing about it was as bad as to have committed that wrong myself. We have millions and millions of Muslims doing exactly that, and the world not only turns the other cheek, but designs empty verbiage to excuse their behavior and provide a barrier to hide behind.

When all the peace-loving Muslims speak out against their extremist brothers, I will be willing to consider them peace-loving. Not until then. Maybe that's guilt by association -- but that seems to be the Muslim way.

Spades & Muslims
Damn! Did you read that NY Times story about the three Lutheran grandmothers from Norway who were plotting to bomb ... No? Double damn.

The ineluctable conclusion to "Almost all the terrorists are Muslim," is "Almost all Muslims are suspects." No, this logic wouldn't survive much scrutiny at the Lyceum (cf. "Organon"), but I can support it with some pretty tight mathematics (modern Game Theory).

I still wait for someone in the TH community to suggest the current (Islamic) interpretation of Averoes' writings (references, please?).

Hal Donahue
"You stop them plain and simple. They are not in compliance with our laws."

Do you understand what you've committed yourself to with this reply? You have come down on the conservative side of the debate on assimilation. Leftists think that immigrants shouldn't have to assimilate. This is basically what multiculturalism means, that each immigrant group will run its own affairs. And what is behind this is the weird cultural relativism of the left, which says that all cultures are equally good, except Western culture, which is bad.

With your answer, you're denying all this. Do you understand that?

And you have probably committed yourself to sensitivity training for Muslims. After all, what are you going to do when relatives of those who break our laws are bewildered because the action (an honor killing, for example) is perfectly legal back home? Sensitivity training looks like the answer here.

Here you go again Donny
Firstly it is the XXI Century. Whatever historical comparison you can make between Christianity and Islam is completely improcedent; it is comparing apples and oranges. Secondly you cannot even beging to compare the crimes that anti-abortionist commit with the all emcopassing acts of terrorist mass murder that jihadist conduct where the target is every living, walking human being they get in their sights irrespective of age, sex, race or religion. It is simply and insane world view and religion which has no redeeming value whatsoever whereas Christianity believes in mercy and forgiveness.

Your line of thinking is nothing more that an ardent, failed, fanatical and completely failed attempt at drawing an absurd moral equivalence.

Anyway you mention me the same number of terrorist acts carried out in the name of Christ during the same period of time that Muslims have conducted theirs in the name of their allah and I might grant you the possibility of being right on something. Go.

Muslims cannot be trusted
After finding out that the latest brand of Muslim jihadist, no not Sout East Asian disenfranchised citizens, happen to be MD's who are supposed to treat the sick I will make it a keen point to make sure that the next time myself or any in my family needs a doctor they will never see a Muslim doctor. They'ved done a great job in creating distrust when it comes to faiths and it is clear that Islam is a faith to reject, pure and simple no apologies required.

Hal Donohue
Google, or otherwise research, the neoconservative movement.

Its intellectual gurus were Leo Strauss and Irving Kristol. Kristol is a "leftist" who was a communist(follower of Trotsky)in his younger years and who gravitated to the democratic party later in his life. Norman Podhoretz was another neoconservative intellectual guru who, like Kristol, became disillusioned with the pacifist tendencies of the democratic party in the 1970s(George McGovern and Jimmy Carter).

Unfortunately, some will assert that a Jewish cabal controlled the neoconservative movement. It is probsbly true that many prominent members of the neocon movement were Jewish, but many non-Jews(Cheney, Rumsfeld)subscribe to the neocon philosophy, which envisions a very aggressive, robust foreign policy and regards any attack on Israel as an attack upon the United States.

I have nothing whatsoever against Israel, and wish her the best.

I just don't think our foreign policy should be beholden to what is in the interests of Israel.

I stand by what I said. The intellectual gurus of the neocon movement were leftists, originally more at home within the demoratic party, than the GOP, and who, when they migrated over to the GOP, carried their leftist values with them.

Incognito
Your comment was thoughtful, knowledgeable and right on the money. Unfortunately, it doesn't permit the majority of people who love tohate muslims and think everything in the entire world can be summed up in a binary way (good/evil, liberal/conservative, muslim terrorist/white-picket-fence Christian,) ideas like yours will be met with the kind of hostility you've seen here because it meets 2 other binary forms of thought: my ideas are good/everything else is trash, and most importantly, the "one cause/ one effect" rule that governs the universe.

If you're looking for a mature and interesting discussion of complicated ideas, I'd suggest you leave this site and work with your google.

JFP
I am a moderate. and "You have come down on the conservative side of the debate on assimilation. Leftists think that immigrants shouldn't have to assimilate. This is basically what multiculturalism means, that each immigrant group will run its own affairs" this is not true. Slow assimulation is what has happened in our past and most likely now. There is clear unacceptable actions that were imposed on all immigrant groups. Your error is you see it as an all or nothing to my mind

jerabaub
"I stand by what I said. The intellectual gurus of the neocon movement were leftists, originally more at home within the demoratic party, than the GOP, and who, when they migrated over to the GOP, carried their leftist values with them."

And I stand by mine. You guys gave them a home and let them lead we would not and did not in the D party

Demons of Satan
As in any religion, there are those who are disciples of Satan. The elite are tricked by Satans lies. Demon worship, in itself, is a religion.

Islamist Terror
Whenever Islamic terrists will attack the White House (it has been done before, by other types os nuts, you may recall) or they simply blow up Congress, then the Islam apologists, will say:
"My goodness, it must be our fault, that they are so angry at us! These are basically good people, you know, whom we have so badly mistreated. They are right, in their violent reaction". It is always the victim's fault, that someone killed him.

incognito
The only reason that subverting third world governments, supporting terrorists and killing the innocent would not be OK is if it did not work to protect you. Those tactics may or may not be effective. Killing the innocent was done on a massive scale during WWII. Would you have had us not win that war?

Policy must be driven first by the need to survive and you can argue for a variety of tactics to achieve that end but generally it comes down to being a lot meaner than your adversary.

purple stater
Is purple the color of the states that you wish
to control..you know,,,like red states & blue
states???
Maybe they do look like you!!

incognito
don't forget to strike a consensual tone..right
before the axe whacks your head off.
Say, 'i'm sorry my neck got in the way of your
axe'.
How people like you remain so damned ignorant
amazes me.

incognito
In addition going back to your original post I am left with the impression you see the Muslim world reacting to us in a very different way if our policies had not been so intrusive. Throughout history it has been either intrude or be intruded upon. Europe might look a lot different than it does if the Muslims had not intruded and hung around for a number of years. All nations have acted in this way.

I think the problem we have with the Muslim world is not in the past but is in the Muslim ideology and culture. I am more than willing to cease military action and bring our troops home and let the middle east manage it's own affairs in a peaceful manner. But just as the Palestinians will not be happy until the last Israeli is dead, millions in the Muslim world will not be happy as long as western civilization exists. Singing 'Kumbaya' isn't going to change their minds.

hal Donohue
I agree with you - assimilation happens, especially in cultures that are tolerant and where the incentives to assimilate are attractive. I commonly hear people on the right talk about Mexicans as unwilling to assimilate but the fact is every single one that I know wants it especially for their children.

Without giving it a great deal of thought, it seems to me that the most closed groups in this society have been religiously-based, including the Mormons, who are certainly Americanized but are not at the center of popular culture. But the Shakers, Quakers, Mennonites, Amish, David Koresh, Jom Jones, etc., etc., while certainly not similar to each other have their non-assimilation styles in common.

So Ironic...
In reality, no one on the left is advocating blind acceptance of Islam... We're the "godless libs", remember?

If anything, it's Christian conservatives who have propagated the notion that in this country one cannot question those "sacred" beliefs. For a liberal who believes in the civil liberties guaranteed by our constitution, American citizens will always have the right to challenge each other based on religious beliefs, as they are no different from any other belief, whether it's a belief that global warming is a man-made phenomenon or the belief that the ten commandments should be on display in a County courthouse. ALL beliefs can and should be challenged by those with an alternative point of view, whether they come from scripture or science.

Christian conservatives are the ones who have constantly attempted to silence criticism of religious beliefs, as illustrated by Hein v. FFRF, the recent supreme court ruling that prevents Americans from filing lawsuits to block the government from spending taxpayer money on behalf of religion. This decision will help to ensure the continuation of the "faith-based" bureaucracy within the federal government, which exists to promote faith-based funding, shows preference to funding religious over nonreligious groups, and holds conferences for faith-based groups, which has cost taxpayers multimillions, if not billions, of tax dollars, all in blatant violation of the establishment clause of the constitution.

So guess what? You live by the sword, you die by the sword. You can't guarantee special protection for your religion without providing that same umbrella of protection to Muslims.

Hal Donahue
If you want to call your solution slow assimilation, fine.

My beef is with people who call me and others who bring up these problems racist, Islamophobic, etc. Let me remind everyone what these people are like. I quote from Kevin's column above:

"The very next caller was 'Ellie' from Brooklyn; she chastised me for allowing Debbie to tell of her experiences. She launched accusations of Americans’ ignorance when it came to Arab/Muslim customs. She hatefully espoused that 'Debbie' was bigoted for having felt the least bit odd, when in fact "odd" things were happening around her. And in one mad rampant spew at the end of her call she accused me of needing "sensitivity" training, instructing me to use my air-time to spread the truth about Islam and to teach its true meaning."

Unfortunately, people like Ellie dominate our media and schools.

Oneway
Great post. I was noting all of the previous ideas that were merrily being attributed to liberals without any kind of reality check.

Thanks for taking the responsibility!

Hal Donohue
I think we might agree.

1. Neocons were, and to my mind, still are leftists, always were. They became disillusioned with the pacifist tendencies of the Democrat Party in the 1970s, and began looking for a home within the GOP.

2. The GOP allowed this neocon movement to hijack its foreign policy.

And now we are witnessing the results.

JFP
For the sake of credibility, I wouldn't quote anything from a column by McCullough as evidence of a larger truth. Why don't you go out and meet some actual people?

I go to a physician who happens to be Muslim. In JFP world, perhaps I should worry that she might put explosives in my Blood Pressure sphygnometer.
In Jo-Jo's world we just talk health, occasionally children, schools, and remodeling.


A question
I have heard alot of Jewish people say that attcking Neocons is a form of Anti-Semitism. What have I missed here? Does anybody know how this apparently torturous connection is made?

JFP
"My beef is with people who call me and others who bring up these problems racist, Islamophobic, etc. Let me remind everyone what these people are like. I quote from Kevin's column above:"

Your problem is best shown by a tale. I went to observe a Hazleton, PA anti immigrant rally in Scranton, PA. The crowd was small and nearly if not half the rally supporters were skin heads, neo nazis etc... They are your fellow travelers and when not repudiated show your whole support group as supporting them and as all you list above

jerabaub
We argee they hijacked the party but having known a few I am not at all certain leftist applies either more a belief in might makes right and pax americana

Answer to JoJo
Possibily the feeling is that anyone who is anti-neocon is anti-Semetic because the "neo-con" movement was started by Irving Kristol (Bill's dad) and other Jews who became disillusioned with liberalism. A large number of "neo-cons" today are Jewish and Jews are heavily identified with neo-con leadership.

Neo-cons want a tough foreign policy (including nation building). Traditionally, they also are big supporters of free trade. Neo-cons differ from traditional conservatives (paleo-conservatives on a number of issues including immigration, abotion, outsourcing jobs, etc.

I'm not big on neo-cons, but I view Fred Barnes as the biggest boob in the neo-con movement. I don't think Fred is Jewish, so I guess I'm not anti-Semetic.

For once we agree
Hal -

For once we are agreement - neocons are social liberals who believe in nation building and intervention in foreign countries' affairs (when it suits their idea of what is best for America).

I had to chuckle when you labeled yourself a moderate. By your definition of a moderate, david Duke would probably qualify as a "moderate."

bc3
My liberal friends think I am too far right and my conservative friends think I am way to far left. That must make me moderate LMAO

No Donahue
No Donahue... it makes you somebody who is nobody. As it is impossible to make any logic of your stand, hence making it impossible to know where you even stand, it means you are nowhere and thus are nobody.

Pionero
WOW it took you that long to read these posts????

Hey all I am is a concerned citizen trying to send a little bit of light into the darkness here. Insult away I am used to it LOL

Stop apologizing for being Americans
Stop apologizing for being the targets of the murderous attacks of an irrational religion called Islam. There is no justification for their attacks and there is no reason for us to stop and look to see if there is such justification somewhere. The cries and wails of 'What did we do to offend them' is a nonsensical waste of time and detracts from seeking the means to better kill them in return, since that is clearly the best way, actually the only way, of dealing with jihadists.

The only thing to do is to stop and look to a more effective way of killing those Muslim monsters.

No Donahue
No Donahue.... I've spend my time in the crapper doing more useful things than reading your brand of written crap.

"Rand"y
Hal Donahue a prime example
His comments, like the one equating Muslim terrorists with the mess in Northern Ireland, is an example of liberal relativism. There are no objective facts by which liberal Hal can judge Islam as a hateful and harmful religion. To him, one cannot judge, but accept all. It's multiculturalism, postmodernism, and moral relativism at its very worst. The most annoying thing about him is his arrogance when he posts here. I suggest we stop responding so he will go away."

Gee sorry I missed this. " It's multiculturalism, postmodernism, and moral relativism at its very worst". Hmmm better to have a closed mind?

FYI ignore away I will still post as long as allowed trying to bring just a touch of humanity and rationality to the proceedings

Pionero
"The only thing to do is to stop and look to a more effective way of killing those Muslim monsters."

If you don't know your enemy it is far more likily he will at least hurt you badly.

Hal Donahue
I'm not sure what I said that prompted your last remark to me. I'm not anti-immigrant. I just want them to obey and respect our laws and customs.

incognito
First, thanks for the link.

Second, "Besides, liberals are supposed to be more accepting and tolerant of differences."

Sure, up to a point. Liberals and especially leftists are not very tolerant of people here in America who prefer 50s culture over 60s culture. They generally do not like people who think that a woman's place is in the home, that homosexuality is a sin, etc. All of which makes their acceptance of the sexism and homophobia that is rampant in Muslim societies rather strange.

bc3
Thanks, I kind of figured it was something like that but I was confused because I had used the term for a long time and never thought about who was Jewish and who wasn't. Then, I heard a talk-show guy say that "neo-con" was code for "Jewish" and therefore anti-semitic. Go figure.

JFP
You said you hated being called racist etc. I was only trying to point out how people wrongly in your case I think lump you in the "group"

Must run but perhaps later

Donohue
Hang in there, Hal. The only problem is that in mnost discussions of merit there is an exchange of ideas in which each side considers the other and then decides for one reason or another how it affect their point of view.

When was the last time you saw anything remotely like that on Townhall? I just don't think the touch of humanity that you are trying to bring to the table is something understandable here - you are automatically regarded as the bearer of a poisoned meal. Humanity, clear-headedness, objectivity, reflection and honest observation without Hallmark-card emotion evokes the kind of rage and fear that you see, with people suggesting that you be ignored or annihilated.

Globalism is Already Here
Some townhall posters seem to believe that it's 1950 and we're all neighbors of Opie and Beaver Clever. Folks: last month my husband was in the hospital twice, was in the Emergency Room, was on Intensive Care, and had surgery. This was at a huge urban medical center. Here's a bulletin, everywhere we went in that hospital at least 50% of the doctors were from other countries. Many were people "of color" and appeared to be Middle Eastern or Southeast Asian or Indian or Pakistani, although Eastern Europe was also well-represented. Some had absolutely no accent and seem to have been born and raised here. Others had a strong accent and didn't seem to have been here long. All were skillful; the guy who actually did the heart surgery was from India; I didn't inquire as to his religion.

So, what are you-all suggesting? That we should refuse treatment unless the doctor is blond and has an Alabama accent? That we should question the ideological background of all the foreigners we meet? Perhaps vet them with a questionnaire? Get fingerprints?

There's a doctor who lives in my apartment building. Again, I don't know his religion but he is from Iraq. He's been here 20 years and has never married because he spends all his money getting his humongous family OUT of Iraq and settling them in other countries. And yet when he came through an airport recently with his ancient diabetic father he was forced to throw away Father's insulin and syringes before they'd let him on the plane. I'm thinking that if you are Muslim or even hail from a Muslim country and are NOT in your worst nightmares anything like a terrorist, your life must now be quite a hassle.

I share everybody's horror at what happened in London and Glasgow. There seems to be some kind of psychosis that affects these folks who want to blow themselves up, which has to be the most extreme of all counterintuitive acts. But the world we live in is ALREADY globalized. We can't just shut out everybody who isn't Anglo and all foreign products. Spanish-speaking immigrants are already here, all over the place. Arabic-speaking physicians are in our hospitals, where BTW about half the nurses are Filipino. Read the labels on what you buy in the grocery store, on the shellfish and the fruit especially and even some of the canned goods---it's from someplace else.

Townhallers seem to think they can close the door and everything will be normal again. Too late.

I remember learning in a college American History course that during World War I people killed Dachshund and German Shepherd dogs out of patriotism. Am I being silly to think of this? A year ago I bought an Oriental rug from some kind of Middle Eastern guy, don't know what kind, and as we discussed price etc he assured me that he is a Christian. That he felt he needed to say that, frankly, made me sad. And I expect that some on townhall will say I shouldn't have bought a rug from him at all. That makes me sad too. Let us not turn into The United States of Paranoia.

Jo Jo
I noticed in one of your posts you correctly said that many Mexicans want to assimilate. This does not change the need to keep immigration legal and does not solve the enormous problem of the ones who don't want to assimilate. You also suggested to another poster that he 'go meet some real people". You should accompany me to work for a week- you may get the delightful, enlightened exchange of ideas that is so hard to find on TH.

I am guessing that you live in a well to do area and don't have a front row seat to the lawlessness of massive increase in drug and gang activity in the form of Latin Kings, DDPs, and MS13. Perhaps your hospitals and Planned Parenthood clinics haven't had to close because of the unmanageable influx of illegals. Maybe your schools aren't completely overburdened with demand for special education and ESL programs, and day care centers for the middle school students children (yes- the babies of the 11, 12, and 13 year olds) to the point of financial implosion. You may have missed the chance to connect illegal after illegal with social services while monies earned through work is sent back to Mexico or Central America. Come with me and meet some "real people"-the ones being hurt by your lofty ideals.

I think you feel quite enlightened and self satisfied from an extremely safe and protected physical and financial distance. Its just a guess I'm always right about.

TTo Nervous in North Carolina
I hear you: you were scared when you saw a woman in a burqa and though perhaps she was concealing under it some form of menace. And you ask why, other than for deception and concealment, anyone would wear a burqa since it's so hot in North Carolina.

1) It's even hotter in the Middle East than it is in North Carolina, and women have worn the burqa there for a long time, even when they weren't going to blow anybody up but were just going about their business.

2) Muslim women wear the burqa for modesty (although I suspect sometimes this modesty is forced on them by men who don't have to wear one). And certainly the logic of this is odd to our Western minds. I don't know much about Muslim culture but it's my understanding that they think men will go mad with desire if they see a woman's body. And yet I have seen a poor burqa-clad woman on the street on a day when I was wearing shorts and somehow the man accompanying the lady managed to control his passions although the street was full of American women in shorts. So go figure. Sounds to me like a way to keep a woman on a short leash. I feel really sorry for the women.

Shortly after 9-11 a plane was turned around and the Air Force scrambled when a female American passenger heard several of her fellow passengers, who were dark-skinned, speaking another language; she was quite sure they were Middle Eastern terrorists getting ready to blow up the plane and so advised the flight attendant. Turned out they were a troop of actors from India speaking Hindi, on their way from one performance venue to another.

Those of you who are active in churches, why not get your church to sponsor some way for you to get to know Muslims living in your town so you don't have to be so scared of one another? This sounds to me like a worthy project.

incognito
It is still true that the Hebrews are just one tribe amongst many. It appears that they are more than willing to live and let live along side the other tribes of that area. They have been repeatedly attacked and yet cede land to the Palestinians in the hope that an understanding can be reached that will allow all to live in peace.

Please tell me what you think the odds are that the Palestinians are interested in peace with Israel. I think the idea that Hamas has any intention of leaving any Jew alive in that area is laughable. Who do you think is acting in good faith?

What we call it..+note to purplestater
purplestater: Thanks for your 6:10 post- very informative!

I have long thought it would be productive to get the right term. I recall the Brits were chided by many here in the wake of their 7/7 attacks for using the term "bomber" rather than "terrorist". The critics interpreted that as an unwillingness (for some PC reason) to call it what it is. I disagreed--first, I suspect that the British (who are far more savvy at this than we) were on to something. Second, I myself have never liked the terms "terror" or "terrorist", because I assume that the perpetrators would very much like to be called that. My attitude is "You do not terrorize me. You may kill me, but you do not terrorize me".
I would much prefer a term that is truthful and at the same time does not glorify or edify them in any way. Yours sounds like an apt choice.

The POOR BOY Libs
__Its a matter of their ideology.All aspects of turbulance,turmoil,is associated with,having been,the outcome of personal destitution.The POOR BOY,liberal leadership,will spin these 53 physicians,has poor nomads,who struggled for years obtaining an education.How these poor nomads,first embraced the teachings of Islamic faith for spiritual guidance.How,during that time,radicals within the religion offered them financial backing in their nobel venture of medicine.These POOR BOY liberals will tell you,how these poor nomads,now physicians,were between a rock,and a hard place.When the radical element,that had been supporting them,called in a favor these physicians felt obliged to them.How these poor ignorant physicians didn't have enough where-with-all to act intelligently,and cover their tracks.The POOR BOY libs will have their base crying a river of tears for these poor ignorant physicians.

Islam is a Terrorist Organization
Islam is a Terrorist Organization but President Bush cannot say so (although after 9/11 he correctly said we were on a Crusade).

How can he say Muslims are our enemy? Iraq is a Muslim country that he's trying to give liberty too. He cannot call them the enemy at the same time even though over the long run they will likely turn on us if Islam does not tolerate others..

Muslims are caught in a Murderous Cult. They have to abandon this ideology. Leave Islam!

This is the long haul.

I first suggest that leaders and the Pope cry out that people living in Muslim countries be tolerated and free from all intimidation from Islam. If that ever happens we will be on the road to peace and freedom for even Muslims .


Why cannot Muslims let the other guy do his thing if it brings peace to all?

incognito
I asked you and others for a solution to what is happening in Europe right now with honor killings and so on. Hal Donahue at least gave an answer (one that I actually respect).

You, on the other hand, brought up stuff our ancestors did 300 years ago. Why is this relevant? And why would it excuse what Muslims are doing today, especially to women?

Then you added: "Maybe you should sincerely ask yourselves for the first time in your lives, why do you think we ever had any business messing around in the Middle East, in these ancient cultures, in the first place?"

Again, what does that have to do with my question? And, I might add, there were naive people like you in Iran back in the 1970s. They hated the way that the West was always meddling in Iran's, and the Middle East's, affairs. So, they banded together with Muslims and got the Shah evicted. They then realized their big mistake, because the Muslims took over and made their lives miserable. They are still paying the price for having allied themselves with Muslims. Lots of them were murdered, by the way.

But now I have a new set of questions (which of course you won't answer). Since you think we shouldn't be meddling in the Middle East, how about in Darfur? Do you think we should meddle there? And do you think we were right not to meddle in Rwanda? How about Zimbabwe? Should we meddle there? I understand that that country's top cleric has asked the West to invade. Should we?

paul 5:35 A LONG HAUL
__It amazes me also.Wondering why Muslims do not stand up,with greater force,to deny islamic radicals their abilities.The more I reflect on it,the I see elements of the same denial in our own society.Why don't more Americans stand up to the liberal,secular,agenda that seeks to destroy this nations foundation?More than likely,its because their comfortable in their own little bubble,and they perceive any actions might burst that bubble.They are safe,and secure,behind closed doors,not needing to confront turmoil,has they tythed their share for someone else to correct the problem.I'm sure many,in the Muslim society,fear retaliation,and loss,if they speak up.Just like here in the U.S.,people rarely speak up when they know a neighbor is scaming someone,has their probably profitting from a scam of their own.Its a long haul thats going on for centuries.Individuals securing possessions according to their passions.

Different prospective
Many of you mentioned Europe's problems with muslims that are mysteriously not present in US. I'm fresh from the boat here and I'm from Europe. I was musing about this fact over a drink with an american female friend in occasion of Chirac's ban of any kind of religous symbols in french scools and asked the question "Why do they (muslims) always raise hell in Europe about these things and never here?" My american female friend looked me in the eye and said very calmly and seriously "Because we are armed and we would shoot their a*s".

After giving it a brief thought, I more than agree with her.

Keep that 2nd amendament alive and kicking. At ANY cost.

Half of this discussion is nonsense!

How about this?

A few years ago (after 9-11) I was working with a young man from India. He had been an American citizen for several years...since he was in middle school, he had been raised a Christian, (Roman Catholic to be precise) and his first name was Abe (Abraham.) His command of the Eng. language was as good as mind (and Eng. major.)

Having recently returned from a trip, he humorously described how he had been singled out at the airport...

I asked Abe how he felt about being singled out, and Abe's response was, "Look at me! They'd better damn well single me out, otherwise they're going to let someone through who shouldn't be allowed on any flight!"

Now, that might not be an exact quote; it was a number of years ago. But I can tell you that it was pretty close to an exact quote, and absolutely the gist of what he said and believed!

Do you terrorist apologists get it? Not all terrorists are from the ME, but all terrorists are Muslim... or, so far, at least ME in appearance.

If anyone, such as Abe, gets offended because they're pulled over or singled out, and DIDN'T have the attitude Abe had, I'd be VERY SUSPECT, as should anyone.

Have we lost all touch with whatever common sense we might have had left????



on using hirabah and hirabi
SunThe1, glad someone was paying attention. Though I don't agree with a lot of what some of the pundits and commenters write here, I am of the opinion that most are reasonable people who can get the point of what I said in 6:10.

If nothing else, I would like to see hirabah/hirabi replace jihad/jihadist in our rhetoric about these murderers and would-be murderers.

except the ones who aren't
Anne wrote:
< < Do you terrorist apologists get it? Not all terrorists are from the ME, but all terrorists are Muslim... or, so far, at least ME in appearance. > >

All terrorists are Muslim? You mean like the Irish Muslims wreaking havoc through numerous bombings in the British Isles for the past four decades? You mean the Islamist Sendero Luminoso, wreaking havoc in Peru? How about the Islamic FARC in Colombia, which is intrinsically caught up in our War on Drugs?

Oh, I forgot the jihadists Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols.

purplestater
Alright, we give, only ninety percent of the terrorism is by Muslims. Also you left out the group that is perpertrating most of the terrorism in the U.S. theses days, the animal rights activists.

purplestater: Okay, so you named two...

out of HOW MANY? That's not even enough to stay in the discussion!!!

You can't possibly be saying that because of McVeigh and Nichols that we ignore the the fact that 99.9999999999999999% ARE Muslim, and regardless of what country they live in currently, they are of ME descent?

Please tell me that you don't think that because, no matter what security system we use, that there is no guarantee that we'd get all terrorists, and therefore it's not worth it?

How about this... so far EVERY person we've intercepted HAS been a Muslim, and whether or not they were a citizen of the US or some other country, they were Muslim...

Do yourself a favor and get in touch with some common sense.



TruLib: Good call! LOL

I keep forgetting about the PETA people!

Certainly a different kind of terrorist, but terrorist never the less. :-)

(They're so stupid and annoying that a few years ago I JUST HAD to buy a full length mink! They made me do it! LOL)




It's Amazing
I'm amazed at how many far-left nut-jobs Town Hall attracts.

Must be a slow day for the Kos Kids.

incognito
I read all of your sanctimonious blather and drew one conclusion: You are shot in the a$$ with your moral superiority. The objective of evry one of your comments had this behind them: Everything said on this site is wrong. so what irrelevancy, non sequitur, exaggeration and distortion of fact and history can I bring to bear to produce a plausible sounding rebuttal to every normal, logical statement made by these inferiors?

Spin that one.


calling muslims by name
you identify a killer by naming him.The one solutyion that will work is massive retaliation and extermination of barbarians that refuse to be civilized. These doctors prove the hopelessness of reaching people who should understand killing is not how to advance a culture. This blood-cult roots go very deep if the highesdt intellegent of their societies take this course of action

Live Free or Die: That was not nice!

Now incognito is going to have to go back to his liberal cave and whine and cry about what you said.

Tsk, tsk, tsk.






Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiightttttttt.........
"Calling them hirabi (committers of hirabah) would be much more fitting to Muslim audiences as it rolled off the tongue of President Bush or PM Gordon: they're a bunch of unjust fighters, pirates, and spreaders of disorder, a serious punishment in the Qur'an."

Uh, the term "hirabi" will NEVER "roll off the tongues" of either Dhimmi (Bush or Brown) -- Bush, because he is also speech-impaired, and Brown, because he is obviously a pathetic loser.

Still, hirabi/hirabah are probably still good terms for all of us (who really care) to master.

Thanks for the tip.

immigration etc
If Ted Kennedy wishes an open door policy on immigration let's give it to him, only with a certain qualification...the first 100,000 have to relocate to Boston and reside there for at least 10 years.

incognito
You state a belief that the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is at the heart of the problems in the middle east. A lot of people agree with you. I think that position is incorrect. The heart of the troubles in that area is the mullahs in Iran.

They have been waging a war with everyone since 1979 and were it not for them the Palestinian problem would have already been resolved. They want Israel destroyed and if all the Palestinians have to die to achieve that end it is OK with them.

They have used Lebanon in the same manner with much the same results for the Lebanese people.

The mullahs are putting men and munitions into Iraq to try and make sure that a stable democracy doesn't take hold there. The mullahs have created a totalitarian state in Iran but have a problem in that their hold on power may be tenuous. Being bracketed by even semi-free nations is a threat the mullahs can't risk.

Our servicemen are being killed at the direction of the Iranian government for the crime of trying to give the Iraqi people the right of self determination.

We should be working to fix the real problem in the middle east which is Iran. Do that and you put the people of that area in a position to reorder their lives in such a way that they all are more secure.


incognito: Sorry, you are a idiot

and stunningly stupid!!!!

"...you people.." and "Shove that one!"

I do hope you get banned... We do not need the likes of you and your foul writing around here!

Take that right back to your liberal cave where obviously, that's the way "you people" live.



Incongruous ito

Would somebody show this jacked up jack a$$ to the door. Thank you.


incognito
It is evident from your pseudo intellectual dissertation you know nothing about the Middle East. Take it from one who has lived in the region.

A little knowledge
Incognito is living proof that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

one quintillion Muslim terrorists...
... dancing on the head of a pin, probably.

Anne wrote:
< < purplestater: Okay, so you named two... out of HOW MANY? That's not even enough to stay in the discussion!!! > >

Actually I mentioned three, and those were the three that quickly popped into my head. There are others, such as Mara Salvatrucha (though some wouldn't call that a terror organization, they use terror methods to get ahead and they are well-organized).

< < You can't possibly be saying that because of McVeigh and Nichols that we ignore the the fact that 99.9999999999999999% ARE Muslim, and regardless of what country they live in currently, they are of ME descent? > >

First of all, I am by no means saying that we ignore the fact that Islamist terrorists remain such a massive threat. You see, Anne, it's not an either/or kind of thing.

What I'm saying is that the racial profiling method would be idiocy for a number of reasons. First, al Qa'ida is already in a position to GET AROUND such profiling by using European-looking operatives for their taks. People who don't look any more "Muslim" or "Arab" than Ben Affleck or Johnny Depp. Al Qa'ida has already been discovered years ago to be working on this with great seriousness. How "Muslim" would John Walker Lindh or Adam Gadahn look without their beards?

Second, it ignores that fact that there are other terrorist threats. In the UK, for example, there was until very, very recently the threat of Irish Catholic nationalists blowing things up in London. And in the US, until 9/11, far and away the largest terror attack ever to occur was by a bunch of clean-cut White guys born and bred in America.

Third, treating a group of people with hostility because of what they look like is a very good way to engender hostility from some of them. This is true of almost any group, Muslim or otherwise.

< < Please tell me that you don't think that because, no matter what security system we use, that there is no guarantee that we'd get all terrorists, and therefore it's not worth it? > >

If that is what you got from what I wrote, you need to stop and rethink how you interpret things that people write, especially those who may not see eye to eye with you. You see, you have stereotyped the way I see things, and that has made you completely miss my point.

No, I don't think it's NOT worth it because there's no guarantee we'd get all the terrorists. No, what I'm saying is that whining about apocryphal 80-year-old nanas in wheelchairs being frisked is wrongheaded because our security at airports needs to be across the board, not just against those we fear the most. Terror organizations are looking for weak points, and using racial profiling would be a foolish exercise in narrowing our security focus.

Oh, and by the way, when you say that "99.9999999999999999% ARE Muslim," you are saying that for every one non-Muslim terrorist, there are 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 (one quintillion) Muslim terrorists. Hmm... the number of terrorists is more than 150 million times the population of the Earth?

Wow, that really sheds a lot of light on your way of thinking.

< < How about this... so far EVERY person we've intercepted HAS been a Muslim, and whether or not they were a citizen of the US or some other country, they were Muslim... > >

Not true, particularly if one counts the period before 9/11.

< < Do yourself a favor and get in touch with some common sense. > >

I can't. It's too difficult when the one quintillion terrorists are chasing me!


"need response"
incognito,

You wrote three paragraphs dealing with ancient history so you could conclude " . . . that the Bible is the basis for Western civilization's establishment and support of Israel."

Next you say you're "not talking about" ANCIENT history:

Then in a later post you demand a response from me; you write:

"[I} specifically said in my paper that I was not talking about ancient history but the history from the previous generation, my parent's generation.

Why must you all distort and twist things around? Can you explain this away or not? You are all very good at these diversionary tactics. Just answer the points, specifically."

Allrighty then.

First you DO talk about it, then you say you're not talking about it.

And you accuse ME of twisting things around and diversionary tactics.

Pardon me if I get confused.

Perhaps what you meant to do was, first, to make a point about the connection between the Bible and modern-day Israel. Then you meant to say that what you really wanted to EMPHASIZE is the modern history of the region (heavy with Anti-American bias, I might add).

At any rate, you never did respond to my assertions about you -- and these I am even more convinced of, given your subsequent postings.

I already answered you: all nations do bad things at times. Get over it.

Right now our existence is at stake -- and we're going to protect ourselves, regardless of the history.

From Ron Paol


From RON PAUL September 12, 2001 after the 9/11 attacks

Did President Bush and lawmakers make a mistake by not listening to Ron Paul when he said “killing of innocent civilians will only serve to flame the fires of war and further jeopardize our security”?

NightVision-Yesterday, Americans were awakened to find ourselves in a war, attacked by barbarians who targeted innocent civilians. This despicable act reveals how deep-seated is the hatred that has driven this war.

Though many Americans have just become aware of how deeply we are involved in this war, it has been going on for decades. We are obviously seen by the terrorists as an enemy.

In war there is no more reprehensible act than for combatants to slaughter innocent civilian bystanders. This is what happened yesterday.

If there is such a thing, a moral war is one that is only pursued in self-defense. Those who initiate aggression against others for the purpose of occupation or merely to invoke death and destruction are unforgivable and serve only to spread wanton killing.

In our grief, we must remember our responsibilities. The Congress’ foremost obligation in a constitutional republic is to preserve freedom and provide for national security. Yesterday our efforts to protect our homeland came up short. Our policies that led to that shortcoming must be reevaluated and changed if found to be deficient.

When we retaliate for this horror we have suffered, we must be certain that only the guilty be punished. More killing of innocent civilians will only serve to flame the fires of war and further jeopardize our security. Congress should consider its constitutional authority to grant letters of marque and reprisal to meet our responsibility.

Demanding domestic security in times of war invites carelessness in preserving civil liberties and the right of privacy. Frequently the people are only too anxious for their freedoms to be sacrificed on the altar of authoritarianism thought to be necessary to remain safe and secure. Nothing would please the terrorists more than if we willingly give up some of our cherished liberties while defending ourselves from their threat.

It is our job to wisely choose our policies and work hard to understand the root causes of the war in which we find ourselves.

We must all pray for peace and ask for God’s guidance for our President, our congressional leaders, and all America- and for the wisdom and determination required to resolve this devastating crisis.

READ MORE

http://www.controlcongress.com


Sheesh
Townhall really needs to get some relegation on these threads....they get hijacked and go in entirely different directions at the drop of a hat. Often multiple threads are hijacked by the same folks over and over again....

makes me want to participate less and less...

muslims
if indocrinated from birth why are so many shocked that these doctors have adapted this attitude. Coming from barbaric societies that only know violence amongst it's own citizens and having governments that run police states that victimize their own citizenry why should anyone be surprised. Having the most backwards societies on earth that not only dwell 1000 years in the past but think that destoying the west will be the event that will propel them to prominance. These doctors prove the message of hatred has not been overcome no matter how much exposure to the west they receive. If successful persons of muslim descent living in the west cannot overcome this learned hatred, what hope is there for the other millions living in the ME who get a daily recital of state sponsored hatred towards the west?

Assimilation
Once the Muslim population in this country is as large as it is in the European countries, any facade of assimilation into our culture will cease to exist.

Just as the Euorpean settlers to this country did not assimilate into the indian cultures when they expanded in sufficient numbers, and the American settlers in Texas and the American south west did not assimilate into the mexican culture we, through political correctness first and intimidation later will become irreversibly balkanized.

Our culture is is sufficiently splintered that we can very easily be a victim of a divide and conquer approach until the muslim populations are large enough to be a "spoiler" in local, state, and national elections.

Hate crimes and speech code regulations will facilitate spreading the political power of radical islamists here, just as it has in europe.

wildwest writes:
"muslims
if indocrinated from birth why are so many shocked that these doctors have adapted this attitude. Coming from barbaric societies that only know violence amongst it's own citizens and having governments that run police states that victimize their own citizenry why should anyone be surprised. Having the most backwards societies on earth that not only dwell 1000 years in the past but think that destoying the west will be the event that will propel them to prominance. These doctors prove the message of hatred has not been overcome no matter how much exposure to the west they receive. If successful persons of muslim descent living in the west cannot overcome this learned hatred, what hope is there for the other millions living in the ME who get a daily recital of state sponsored hatred towards the west? "

----------

WW I agre with you 100%.

And trying to reverse this trend with political correctness will not help one bit.

For those political correctness losers out there who keep bringing up McVeigh and Rudolf as proof of some kind of moral equivilance between christians and Muslims, Bullchit.

For those who try to blame our support of Israel for the acts of Muslim terrorists, again Bullchit.

A majority of Muslims cant even get along with each other without going jihad. Sunni's, Shia,and Kurds all trying to exterminate each other while trying to exterminate all of the non belivers at the same time.

Now would one of you Muslim appeasers please explain how the existence of Israel or our support of it accounts for Sunni's and Shia's trying to kill each other.

More on assimilation:
How about out immigration policy adds these rules:

1. For every Muslim Mosque built in this country, a christian church or Buddhist temple must be permitted in Saudi, Iran, or Syria.

2. We will only allow one Saudi citizen to immigrate here and be allowed to get a green card for every non muslim that Saudi allows to immigrate into Saudi.

Likewise for Syria, Iran, Pakistan, etc.

3. Muslims who imigrate here from Saudi, Syria, or Iran may only own a copy of a Koran if Saudi, Syria, and Iran allow their residents to own copies of the the old and new testament, writings of Buddah, or johnathan livingston seagull.

It is time for some reciprocity here.

This is how I would deal with honor killings, etc. here in this country.

For every woman who is killed by her family for some imagined transgression against the Koran, the entire male line of the family who does the honor killing will be executed. For every muslim woman who is raped during one of these stupid muslim farces of an offense against sharia, the entire male line of the family doing the raping will be publicly castrated.

Now, if that doesn't facilitate assimilation, then start deportation proceedings.

mr cal
muslims don't believe in assimilation. They think every society they emigrate to should adapt their perfect life style. These self hating barbarians raised to hate will never be civilized. Their actions prove it. look no further than the doctors in great britain

As A Half Arab American Woman..
Kevin said this, above:

"It seems to me that the enemy is given lots of cover when we force the matter of linguistic correctness upon the masses. We have bent over backwards so as to not offend Arabs and Muslims. So much so that some are starting to ask - when are the Arabs and Muslims going to start helping us with these issues of security?"

While I am normally about 100% in agreement with most of what Mr. McCullough has to say, these comments he's dropped about 'Arabs', and lumping them in with 'Muslims' above, are pretty unfair and unenlightened to me. Although it is true that there may be some people with some Arabic heritage who are Muslims today, there are also people of Persian and other national origins who claim allegiance to that faith. In fact, most Muslims I have ever casually met almost never say they are Arabic, or hardly at all...
The lumping together of the words 'Arabs' and 'Muslims' by Mr. McCullough is a thing I find hurtful and offensive. I understand Mr. McCullough is trying to convey ideas in an expedient way, and so must be sure to express his views in a convenient manner In his efforts to do that, however-and whether he intended it or not, he has, effectively, cast in a bad light, and unfairly accused many millions of innocent individuals, just because of his casual and ill-informed use of the word "Arabs" in some of his column this week.

Comedies which parody Arab Americans are silly, and the irony they employ can be an amusing breather from the heaviness and sadness that accompanies issues of our day. Even as a half Syrian American, my family can see this kind of parody and understand the reason for it, and even, occasionally laugh, at the use of truths told in a way which uses humor. My problem with Mr. McCullough's comments, is that, while the rest of his column may be accurate and correct, his slip of the lip, or in this case, the pen, blames, castigates, and disinherits millions of good Americans, many of whom fought in our wars to defend our nation, because a journalist irresponsibly wrote in a way to lump in one group with another. I *do* understand the confusion. But, for the sake of law-abiding and decent citizens, who would only defend this country, it is critical to be clear! Normally, Mr. McCullough is quite clear about his use of words, and thorough, so, this is disappointing to me.

My Grandmother and Grandfather's family came to this country in the 1920's, via American legislation that helped them come from Damascus, to Canada, with a stop in Michigan on the way. Eventually, my Grandparents came to the Greater New York area, and raised and reared many lovely children. Those children, my Aunts, Uncles, and my Dad, grew up to be hard working, patriotic and law abiding citizens. None of my family was of a Muslim background. They were all of a Byzantine Christian faith. The children grew up to be successful salesmen, artisans, chefs, singers, and one became a United States judge. Most became parents, with children of their own, who learned to appreciate the beautiful, rich and diverse culture from which came my Father's family. Most of the men, including my Dad, worked and joined the armed forces. My Dad, because he was too young at the time, joined just the ROTC. My Uncle, his older brother, spent time helping serve their country in WW2 and also in Korea. An opportunity to sing patriotic songs was never lost on my family. My Aunts, who were especially musically talented, never missed a chance to sing in rousing renditions of "God Bless America". I could go on and on about the blessings and success my extended family has seen since coming to America.

As I noted, we never had a Muslim family member, and this was not a faith practiced by my Arabic family. Muslim families, and also the ones who sported traditional garb, were never seen in our old neighborhood, until they came in the late 1970's and took over a local church-which they bought and renovated into a mosque. By the late 1980's and into the 1990's burkas and Muslim people with their families and businesses could be seen everywhere. Maybe my story is not as unique for Arabs of a Christian background. I *can* say I do not personally identify with Muslims, nor their faith, just because my Dad's family is Arabic, or because I have a Middle Eastern (maiden) last name. I think the country, and the Western world lost it all when they left out "God" from schools and society. I also think that before the Muslims came here, the standard Judeo-Christian society gave America its greatest and most proud days as a nation.

This is not to put Muslims down. It's just that throwing the word 'Muslims' in with "Arabs" is a bit unfair and really potentially quite confusing and hurtful to a lot of good people, my Dad's family included. These dear ones have done a lot of good, and would never ever dream of hurting anyone, let alone the good people of this land they hold so dear, which has given them so much..

Mr. McCullough often speaks quickly, and unapologetically about people and things he finds
"morally wrong". Generally speaking, he is often correct. I wonder if he would ever own up to his own mistakes, particularly in this instance, when he has, unfortunately, misrepresented a lot of good people..

Dealing With Suicide Bombers
America had to deal with suicide bombers before, in WW2, ones who also flew planes into Americans. We stopped them by bombing the devil out of the place they came from until the "things" that sent them told them to stop. That is the only way to take care of this threat I can think of.

Last Chapter Say's - We Win!!!
All the monsters that make up Islam, ignorant or not, complicit or not, are all headed for the same place; and they'll have plenty of company to be sure.
Our job is to be patient and to preach the good news to all the people. Easier said than done, considering all the monsters in the world, but we need to do it nonetheless in order to be obedient to His mandate.

Here is something to look forward to from Revelation 21:26-27, concerning the new Jerusalem:

26.The glory and honor of the nations will be brought into it. 27. Nothing impure will ever enter into it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those who's names have been written in the Lamb's book of life.

Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.

reply to purplestater 7/8/07 7:50pm
purplestater writes: Sunday, July, 08, 2007 7:50 PM

"All terrorists are Muslim? You mean like the Irish Muslims wreaking havoc through numerous bombings in the British Isles for the past four decades? You mean the Islamist Sendero Luminoso, wreaking havoc in Peru? How about the Islamic FARC in Colombia, which is intrinsically caught up in our War on Drugs?

Oh, I forgot the jihadists Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols."
------------------------------
purplestater, this has been covered before: The IRA didn't bomb people "for the glory of God" and shouting "Praise Jesus!". The Muslim bombers and headchoppers do believe they're doing Allah's work, and their Quran* supports this.

The Sendero Luminoso (Shining Path) was a Communist group and never killed for Jesus or God. FARC and the ELN in Columbia are leftist rebels, funded by illegal drugs, and do not kill in the name of Jesus or God. Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols did not kill in the name of Jesus or God.


The quote about Muslims and terrorists is:

"It is certainly true that not all Muslims are terrorists, however, sadly we say that the majority of terrorists in the world are Muslims".
- by Abd al-Rahman al-Rashid, September 23, 2004
http://www.worldpress.org/Mideast/1941.cfm

*One of the "justifying" quotes from the Quran is
(Qur'an 9:5) "When the sacred forbidden months for fighting are past, fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, beleaguer them, and lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war."

Now please quit posting false equivalencies.




more justifying...from our book!
Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and possess the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants." (Isaiah 14:21 NAB)


"If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst." (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB)

"As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you. But these instructions apply only to distant towns, not to the towns of nations nearby. "As for the towns of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as a special possession, destroy every living thing in them. You must completely destroy the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites, just as the LORD your God has commanded you. This will keep the people of the land from teaching you their detestable customs in the worship of their gods, which would cause you to sin deeply against the LORD your God." Deuteronomy 20:10-18 NLT


I think the biggest difference between us and them is most of us don't take our holy text seriously.

MrsV
Enjoyed your post. It reminds us the U.S. Government leaders and the even more influencial
Media are totally "remiss" in educating Americans
to the "Identity" of the non Northern Europeans and their emigrants to the largely English Speaking Countries of the world. Hubris?

To our feeble, myopic educational establishment
which thinks it requires months of classroom instruction to teach teenagers to get pregnant (or not) and to reduce the chances of preventing STDs, the job of explaining the difference between farsi and arabic, Suni and Shia, Isriael
and Palestine, Moslems and Christian middle easterners, Sharia law, Ottoman Empire, Attaturk,
Moors, and who WAS Ottoman, a foot stool, or what? What do we know and understand about the
Muslims of South East Asia-they are not Middle Eastern in thinking or ancestry!
I hope this opens a real discussion; the only thing educational you are likely to find on this subject.

MrsV
Thank you for your post and your point should be taken by all. Your love of our country is obvious and all Americans should be proud to have you as a fellow citizen.

Mrs. V the new Persian Arab...
Perhaps Mrs. V needs to understand her own history a bit better. Arabs and Persians do not normally self identify with one another.

Ask many of my Egyptian friends.

She also seems a bit sensitive about the Arab Muslim connection - when 98% of the Arab world is in fact Muslim.

Lastly it is easy to understand what the substance of the column is arguing - that we can NOT give cover (through our linguistic pickiness) to those who wish to kill us. Obviously people who do NOT wish to kill us are NOT the ones being criticized in the column.

And good people of common sense can easily discern that from the column's context...

Maybe Mrs. V was just having a bad day...

Is it possible?


KMC, Please..no more jive..Life's time
KMC wrote:

"Mrs. V the new Persian Arab...Perhaps Mrs. V needs to understand her own history a bit better. Arabs and Persians do not normally self identify with one another. Ask many of my Egyptian friends. She also seems a bit sensitive about the Arab Muslim connection - when 98% of the Arab world is in fact Muslim. Lastly it is easy to understand what the substance of the column is arguing - that we can NOT give cover (through our linguistic pickiness) to those who wish to kill us. Obviously people who do NOT wish to kill us are NOT the ones being criticized in the column.
And good people of common sense can easily discern that from the column's context...
Maybe Mrs. V was just having a bad day...
Is it possible?"

For Mr. KMC, please, no more jive..Life's time is too precious. I will try to make this quick..

First of all, I am not "the new" Persian.
I am American, and I make my 'Yes' a yes and my 'no' a 'No'. In other words, my words, and dealings, are not duplicitous, or unclear.

I do not appreciate the tone of Mr. McCullough's reply. I don't need to have a Scottish-American man, who was born in the South, explain the history of half of my family, born a century ago, in the Mid East. I am sharing an honest life story, and am not stupid..So please don't patronize me..

I shared in my *own* comment above that most Arabs and Persians did not identify with each other, so I am not sure why Mr. KMC is reiterating what I already said here..

I am sure if people were scapegoating, and writing columns placing your national origin, and half of your family, into questions of a moral nature, especially with them being good citizens and INNOCENT, we'd be seeing plenty of fur flying at the KMC household, because of all the jokes, lies and skewed reporting about the Scottish people.

This is just an example, but my points have been clear. I think Mr. McCullough is just trying to taunt and bait me, and take advantage of me and my point here..Which is a shame, I once thought better of him..Or maybe he is displaying a reply sharing some clarity. I get the point that terrorist actions leave no time for distinctions. But that wasn't my point, anyway..

And while we are on in Mr. Mc, all of the Arab world was not ALWAYS Muslims. Plenty of Egyptian Christians know all too well about how Islam life has been forced on them over there..And who knows..maybe some over here..So, I don't see the need to debate obvious realities with me. Besides, I don't see the point..

And no, I am not having a "bad" day..
Though I appreciate the concern..

..from a guy who could not care a rat's buns for little me anyway..

p.s. KMC, confusion..
And, furthermore. I do not appreciate your misrepresentation of me on here.

I am not 'the new Persian Arab'...

I never said I was that...

And your saying I am suggests I am dishonest, and a liar, or a person who misrepresents myself. None of which are true. Not that I really need to explain that here. I do not appreciate your implication about me either, since many Muslims who are hostile to our nation *do* have a Persian national background...

And to think you'd announce it on a Townhall post, as if you're ferreting a mongrel out of the wood work. Shame on you!

Your inference is dishonest, untrue, unfair, disrespectful and rude at worst. Kind of shady, and a big baby, at best. But, this is the not the first time I have been misjudged, and misrepresented by Mr. KMC.

Personally speaking, it took me over two years to simply get a respectful, kind and honest communication from him, that was not laced with odd misjudgments coming *my* way about me. And we are really only strangers to him, and acquaintances in just being fans of his show...

So, Mr. KMC while, after two years of a stranger, *me*, constantly being berated and misjudged by *you*, and then all finally making a nice peace, via email, only with *me* to be berated and misjudged by Mr. KMC AGAIN-via email.just recently...

I don't need your fooling around, and looking to bother me once more at your column, because you are just looking to bully about, and bust my chops, and be silly and act this way with me...because you can...

The unfortunate side effect of some, who must deal with the big issues of morality and decency in our culture on a large scale, is they, sometimes, and unfortunately, get it wrong with SOME folks time and again...

Those poor ones-US-have to suffer for just being constantly misconstrued and misjudged, by some Christian guy who thinks a gift of discernment about SOME makes him an authority on the souls of ALL...

I think NOT Mr. McCullough...

At least, NOT when it comes to me and MY family...

So, now I have made it clear, let there be no silly games and misunderstandings...

Do not call my good evil anymore...

I didn't appreciate it then, I don't now...

You've done it way more than enough via an email. Though you don't know us. And once is enough on here!

Do not tread on me...

Your misjudgments and lack of love and mercy are showing...
And brother, you need that more than anyone...

I will forgive you, and all your misjudgments, and let it go here.

But you should not play with people, especially when it comes to slandering and constantly misrepresenting them, Mr. McCullough, as you have me...

It's tiring...

And not befitting a brother in Christ, who is to think the best, and be more mature...

I really do forgive you. And am glad I got this off my chest...

I hope you take the tip...

We are judged with the measure of mercy and truth we show, when making judgments...

Be sure, brother, of yours...

And who you castigate. Call evil...

Good grief man, just who do you think you are?!


There are plenty of liars about you...

You aren't one. I don't believe...

Nor are we...

So why lie about your sister or brother?

And believe lies for all your undoing?

All this is why I have no doubt you could care less about a stranger, like me, who you are free to misrepresent, via email, and now, in a public-though somewhat anonymous forum.

I don’t know who you think you are to imagine you are psychic to be looking
into the soul of me, a fan who has not slandered you, and generally only spoken up for you here.

I am tired of this nonsense by those who could care less about me and my family than a stranger off of the street!

Sinful waste of time and nonsense!

So stop, if we have the same God, or He'll ask a reckoning.










This is *NOT* irony
A Muslim doctor as the reigning champion on Jeopardy after the Muslim doctors in the UK were charged may be interesting, a coincidence, a kooky development, whatever.

It is not freakin irony. This word is so misused.

It would be irony if a Muslim doctor sent a package bomb to Alex Trebek's house, but he didn't include the right postage and it returned to the doctor's house and somehow blew up.

muslims
show me one thing brought forth by mohamed that is not evil or inhumane.violence,murder,robbery that is islam.

hah!
The first sign of an uneducated writer is that they don't know the definition of irony.

And here we are.
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