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Sunday, April 22, 2007
Kevin McCullough :: Townhall.com Columnist
Why Liberals Embrace Violent Massacres
by Kevin McCullough
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In what is widely seen as a violent and horrid week in our nation's history one thing became increasingly clear: Liberals will tolerate, embrace and even advocate for violent, maniacal, and bloody killing that takes innocent life. They will do so especially if they believe it benefits them politically.

It was a tragic week in so many ways.

Starting with the still unexplained naked, raw aggression of one university student snuffing out 32 faculty and students on the campus of Virginia Tech, followed by copycat threats and even arrests across the nation, and it ended with one more lone gunman snuffing out the life of a hostage at NASA.

What was even more disturbing was exactly how far liberal democrat candidates for president would go to pander for a vote.

No reflective, thoughtful, or civilized person in America this week could dare to look upon the unwarranted bloodshed of the innocent and have even one ounce of tolerance for such actions. The trauma these events had on our collective psyche as a nation seemed to erode differences amongst people who see themselves as separated by partisan disagreement. For these few days the moral absolute of not shedding innocent blood, even the Old Testament biblical mandate of "Thou shall not commit murder", was easily agreed upon.

Yes?

For Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, and John Edwards the answer is a shocking, "NO!"

These candidates refused to see what all of America could easily see that the taking of an innocent person's life - especially young people that have still so much to live for, so much to yet accomplish, so much to see, do and contribute to this world - is always morally evil.

They made speeches, sent out campaign letters, and blasted e-mail lists not 48 hours after the killings at Va. Tech that not only refused to call the violent taking of innocent life evil, but had the gall to insist upon voters making a statement in 2008 - by also embracing their beliefs.

Let me say that more clearly.

The three leading candidates for President for the Democratic Party want you to support their candidacy for President in 2008 because they believe you agree with them on the violent taking of innocent human life.

Edwards went so far as to say that the prevention of such violent massacres showed, "A hard right turn that is a stark reminder of why Democrats can not afford to lose the election of 2008."

They also very much oppose legislation that would seek to stem the tide of such violent killing. They all three side with the view that law abiding citizens should not have the right to carry firearms for their own protection, all the while knowing that criminals can, do, and will access guns through every imaginable illegal means. This week all three also spoke out in opposition to a federal law that would prevent massive, wide-scale violent assault upon children by means of other deadly weapons.

And when the nation's highest court found it unconstitutional for grown adults to kill children through the use of stab wounds to the head using scissors, knives, scalpels, and forks - Clinton, Obama, and Edwards couldn't get to a microphone fast enough to criticize the court's ruling, and personally give their stamp of approval to such procedures.

The way they justified these very public statements was to pawn it off on the mental state of the child's parents. Claiming that the parents should have the right to utilize such a murderous procedure because of the mental pain and anguish it would cause for the parents to continue to be parents of said child. But does this now mean that a child loses its right to live, just because their parents go insane? Mommy goes crazy - you die.

The candidates also attempted to use the laughable argument that such a decision should be allowed to be made between the parent of the child and a local doctor. Evidently the child can be denied constitutional protection to their life if a parent and doctor so agree. And for the record the American Medical Association has publicly stated that such a procedure is never medically necessary.

At one particular medical clinic where such decisions are made in the metro New York area (Englewood, New Jersey), it was estimated on the day of the court's decision that the law would save roughly 1500 children's lives in the next twelve months alone. By last count there are dozens of such clinics in the metro New York City area. At a minimum count that's 360,000 lives saved every twelve months in only one American city.

One thing the candidates did not do in embracing and even demanding for the continuing of such violent killing - was explain the details. The child is killed by the sharp stab wound to the brain, then just to really make sure that the kill has occurred the "doctors" use forceps or some other squeezing device to mash the cranial material (brains, skull, etc.) into mush. Then - to really, really, really make sure the child is really dead - they suction out the brains and toss the body, sometimes with its deflated head still attached into the dumpster.

This massacre does not happen to children at the tip of a Glock 19 or a 22 Caliber, but there is no medical doubt that the method used to butcher these children inflicts every bit as much pain. There are horrific stories of these children struggling violently as the cold steel penetrates the base of the skull.

In reality, this week should be a mixed week of emotions. Overwhelming sadness at the eternal loss of 33 innocent people at the hands of two suicidal killers on one hand, and a small bit of hope at the prospect of now ending the cruel and torture based method of killing unwanted children on the other.

It is a sad and tragic reality that Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, and John Edwards do not want more citizens to be empowered to protect themselves from violent massacre, but the fact that they also have publicly opposed legislation that would protect even innocent children from such slaughter with open and avowed hostility is worse.

And worst of all they believe you will vote for them because of it...

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About The Author
Kevin McCullough is the nationally syndicated host of "'Xtreme' Radio and columnist based in New York. He blogs at www.muscleheadrevolution.com. His second book "The Kind Of MAN Every Man SHOULD Be" is in stores now.

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sanctimonious
the author is nothing but a liberal hater.

http://www.republicansforchoice.com

... yet accurate
He nailed it - Democrats and Liberals will scream about how a woman's right to choose has been diminished without discussing the detail of the decision and the fact that it was specifically about partial birth abortion.

The only life the Left wants to save
is that of any convicted killer on death row.

First, do no harm
Partial birth means birth, the baby (and it is a viable human baby that can live outside of the mother's womb) is living until a doctor crushes its skull and tears off its limbs. What part of murder do people not understand?

And Brian..
...when putting a killer down it is to be "humane."

JimmyC
Based on the experience here in Cali, so "humane" as to no longer be possible to carry out any executions.


Bring 'em..
..to Texas. We ain't got no problem here.

religiouslib
"the author is nothing but a liberal hater?" That don't make him all bad. A man after my own heart!

Jimmy Carter
I hear tell they have an express-lane there!

Gaining Perspective
40,000,000 DEAD BABIES isn't a "Massacre"???
Rosie O'Di**o doesn't think so.

Partial Birth Murder
I have never understood how anyone could participate in this "procedure" which is murder.

Nor can I understand how it continued to be legal for so long. I am very glad the Supreme Court has ended this forever. Yet some Dems complained. Funny, I haven't heard a word of this protest from the MSM!

I take in a fair amount of news coverage but somehow missed the outrage from the Leftists. Perhaps they didn't want their position to be so clearly understood as a result of their protests?

While I agree...
so, so much with everything said, the WAY in which it was said is exactly why so many people can't even take the right-of-center position seriously. Yes, liberals like people to die, they go to bed every night dreaming of people being shot. That's the attitude that costs republicans elections. We all watch as liberals love to call pro-death penalty supporters "murderers" and tell us that we "hate" the poor because we don't want to give them ever more handouts; why do we, on the right side, then follow that same idiotic methodology of political discourse? I think, at this point, more votes and more progress could be gotten from simply looking and acting in a more civil manner than accusing our opponents of bloodlust.

McCulough should be ashamed
You're doing exactly what you accuse the democrat politicians of,using this tradgedy to score political points against you rivals. You use words tha aren't true for their shock value and you try to degrade and instill hatred towards a particular group. Have you ever read the sermon on the mount,or is your Christianity just a means of getting political power?

Perhaps truth is the issue
I don't think that leftists enjoy death, but I do wonder if they see it as the critical thing it is.

I heard some of the memorial for the victims. I didn't see how a lot of what was said had anything to do with the actual event. Global warming, endangered species, third world privation were thrown into the rememberance. Then Obama compared it to Don Imus.

It's harder and harder to find people seeking or offering plain truth. Not that I hold vast amounts of it, but I do see more and more obvious attempts to latch personal interests to real-life events, regardless of truth or accuracy. This postmodern age is about people getting what they want, no matter what they have to say and ignore to get it. There's no way to solve anything in such a culture.

I'm not proud of this, but I found it harder than usual to put my heart into something this. The memorial was a creepy, disconnected thing, which didn't surprise me, and made me wonder if those speakers really appreciated what had just happened.

Ian you have a point.
I think things are so big and impersonal,and complex that many people have to find ways to make themselves feel like they matter,like they have some power,or connection,or importance,tha they make a difference. Some people do it by screening out other people, some peole do it by doing things to get an audience,or to have power over others or to seem more important ( or intelligent, or beautiful ,sexy ,rich succesful,competent etc.) than others. Some do it by being as good as they can at what they do ,or by loving the people they love as much as they can,some do it by destroying things to prove they aren't helpless. Not feeling helpless is very important for young men in particular.

Sam, calm down
It's just an opinion column.

It's not like he's running for public office or anything, you know?

Tools
I don't believe that libs enjoy death, but they do enjoy using it as a tool when it occurs.
I'm positive that they mourn each and every death until their speeches are written. Then they open the toolbox and go to work.

Religiouslib:
Come on now! Liberals? what's not to hate?

Party of death
I believe the left views humanity as a stain. The only death they don't embrace is that of the convicted murderer. The murderer has to be rewarded for helping reduce the stain.

More Tools
The test of any politicians integrity has to be the tools that are used to advance their agenda. We have to look at how both sides of the political debate will use certain events to get ahead. Obama tieing VT to Imus and the Edwards' use of cancer to help their campaign come to mind.

I am more aware of it when a liberal does it because I don't agree with them but I am sure the liberals see it in conservative politicians use of events.

I try to tell myself to step back and make sure what is being said is real rather than just a way to sell snake oil. Goes for both parties.

Barbarians
Agree Marc. How can any sane person be in favour of partial birth abortion, knowing HOW it is done? Barbaric. And yet these people actually exist in droves. Different planet.

Do liberals enjoy death?
I think on some level they do--the death of others, that is. It makes *them* feel more alive. I'm reminded of J. R. R. Tolkien's creation, Shelob the huge primordial spider. He wrote of her "battening" on the lives of her victims until she thought she could fill the universe with herself. I can't think of a more graphic description of a liberal.

Let's Count
As of now there are 19 responses to this article. Five are anti-abortion. Six are pro-death penalty. Five are general I-hate-liberals. So allow me to make a couple of observations:

1) Using Democrats' response to the VT killings to ballyhoo the cause of anti-abortion, pro-death penalty, and pro-firearms IS political---it politicizes the VT events. McCullough is doing exactly what he accuses Democrats of doing.

2) I notice that not a single poster has picked up on McCullough's complaint about Democrats being anti-NRA. After a week in which a psychotic student used two legally obtained guns to kill 32 people, and in which a disgruntled employee shot and murdered his supervisor for suggesting that improved job performance was needed (with a gun also obtained legally), possibly posters dimly recognize that their argument for a gun culture begins to sound sick.

Their solution.
Liberals have a predictable format after something like VT:
A. Deplore how horrible it was.
B. Call for more gun control and counseling of the future potential mass murderers.(Wonder why they haven't got a counselor to Bin Ladin?)
C. Call for citizens to rely on the police, while at the same time:
1. You cut the police budget
2. You allow parasite Plaintiff's Attorneys to go after every police move.
3. You exempt large chunks of the population from police enforcement by declaring them minorities.(Rodney King)
C. You protect future killers with PC emphasis on "self esteem" and Privacy Laws.

lilly
I will comment further.
I have said it before and will say it again.

If tomorrow, all firearms disappeared from the world, it would be a short amount of time before they reappeared. If Nyguen Trang, the Viet Cong could create a function weapon using scrap iron and a file, how much better could Joe Doe do with a drill press and high quality steel?

An article in today's Lexington Herald noted how the Democrats are aligning themselves with the pro-gun views because their lead is so thin.

Yes lily....
and during that period how many people were killed with legally obtained automobiles? Your short-sighted, simplistic proposal to pass more laws to be ignored by criminals and further restrict the rights of law abiding citizens is a knee jerk reaction to a complex social issue.

We, have allowed a culture of violence to evolve and have de-sensitized a whole generation to the consequences of violence. We ensure that our children have access to to all the technology to enable them to tap into these perversions of the human mind and then we are shocked when they act out their fantasies.

Blaming guns for these acts is no different than blaming automobiles for traffic deaths and ignores the root causes.

Lilly
Please explain how restrictions on a certain tool will stop an individual bent on murder from completing the act.

Lily
I find it odd that those on the left have no love for a right that actually is in the Constitution (Right to Bear Arms), yet falls all over themselves in love will a right that I cannot find when I read it ("Right" to abortion).

Lily, P.S.
By the way, the "right" you love kills far more innocent people than the right I love.

to brianr
yeah, and the Left would have wanted to save the life of the Virginia Tech shooter, too.

to religious lib
Have you read the Bible lately?


In what is widely seen as
a violent and horrid week in our nation's history one thing became increasingly clear: Bushtards and fake cons-liars will tolerate, embrace and even advocate for violent, maniacal, and bloody killing that takes innocent life. They will do so especially if they believe it benefits them politically.


I am not very religious
but I believe that a civilization is not a civilization that does not value life. Also, why is that Lily and others like her who do not agree with the articles points only attack the author's motives not his ideas?

No s***!
"Liberals will tolerate, embrace and even advocate for violent, maniacal, and bloody killing that takes innocent life. They will do so especially if they believe it benefits them politically." well...DUH

Why not just induce labor?
If the mother suddenly decides in the third trimester that she doesn't want to have the child (and can't be persuaded to stick it out for a few more weeks), then why can't labor be induced, the child born, and, if it survives (as it is more and more likely to do), put up for adoption? Why must it be killed?

sashal
I don't want to misconstrue your meaning. Please expand on who it is that advocating the taking of innocent life.

Dim non-recognition
lilly writes:

"Using Democrats' response to the VT killings to ballyhoo the cause of anti-abortion, pro-death penalty, and pro-firearms IS political---it politicizes the VT events. McCullough is doing exactly what he accuses Democrats of doing."

True, but when you say:

"After a week in which a psychotic student used two legally obtained guns to kill 32 people...possibly posters dimly recognize that their argument for a gun culture begins to sound sick."

you then do exactly the same thing yourself! Perhaps you haven't dimly recongnised this irony?




Another to lillie
There is no excuse or argument to support Bill's wife, Barack Obama, or John Edwards stance on killing babies that were about to be born. That is just sick demented behavior.

Moving on to support for CCW. There were two (at least) heros that day that tried to save their students and others. The black teacher who confronted the killer but only had his bare hands to try and subdue him with. And also the holocaust survivor who blocked the door while students escaped through the windows. These brave men died that day at the hands of the killer. If these same two brave men had been allow to carry a concealed weapon on this campus many lives could have been saved including their own. The first teacher I believe, confronted the gunman after the first two killings. So theoreticly Thirty lives could have been saved had Concealed Carry been an option on the campus.

Sashel, facts please
sashal writes:

"Bushtards and fake cons-liars"

Sounds like a piece from Cho's demented rantings. Duck, guys.

Lilly
If you are still lurking about please explain what you view as 'the gun culture'.

Gun related deaths
pale in comparison to alcohol & drug related deaths on campuses...but of course these deaths (just as tragic) carry no political pop

and i must admit being a conservative that:

1)i tolerate, embrace and even advocate for violent, maniacal, and bloody killing that takes innocent life
2) i do so especially because i believe it benefits me politically

cripes, i've been exposed - hope they don't find out i once voted for McGovern, Clinton (1X), Nader & Carter


TruLib
Kevin is advocating

Tom
Coward? Duck? Why don't you fight, like N.Boortz and J.Derbisire are advocating

To Spartacus
All week I've heard your argument that armed tragedy can be avoided by arming everyone. I don't see how you can operationalize that plan. Let's look first at the campus situation:

1) Would you require all professors to carry guns? Would they be disqualified from teaching if they failed to qualify on the range?

2) Would they be required to have guns on their person at all times? Suppose they were teaching dance or basketball or archaeological digging? I had an uncle who taught physical education at a university---his speciality was coaching the acrobatics team.

3) If only some professors were armed, what system would be in place to make certain that all students were protected at all times? Would they choose a course section based on the marksmanship of a given professor?

4) If you plan to arm students as well as professors, would you lower the gun age to accommodate kids of any age? Would you you require firearm competency for college admission?

5) Do you anticipate any problem with an armed student population that is sometimes known to get drunk and to be an at age with raging sex hormones and to become sometimes furious with a professor regarding a grade?

6) The solution "one armed man could have taken out Cho" is correct only if that armed man has instant access to his weapon and if he is an accurate shot. Neither is necessarily true.

7) Envision a roomful of 30 or 40 (or more---I have been in lecture sections of 500) of armed students, perhaps half of them shooting guns. Collateral damage would be significant. Young people are sometimes emotional. The police, arriving, would have difficulty identifying the initial criminal shooter.

8) So far we are talking about classrooms. What about the library, the dining hall and kitchens, the labs, the chapel, broom closets, stairwells, and just plain open areas like parking lots, quads, ROTC drilling fields, and wooded areas? Who patrols there?

9) The argument that nobody would attempt armed assault if he anticipated the other party being armed suggests that we would be wise to turn our society into an armed camp. Turn your mind now to the shooting Friday at NASA. All that supervisor did was advise an employee that he was not meeting the terms of his job description and needed to shape up. Isn't that what a supervisor is supposed to do, supervise? Would you argue that he should have had to defend doing his job by preparing to shoot anyone who objected? Should a doctor have to arm himself before delivering bad news to a patient? Should an attorney?

Concealed Weapons Permits
At least in this state(Utah), getting this permit is a procedure that is lengthy and exhaustive. Those who have them are the most educated and responsible gun owners in the state.

I would support this type of training and procedure for any gun owner.

Lilly
Hyperbole doesn't serve your argument.

There is a middle ground between "gun-free zone" (a large bullseye painted on the campus) and the required arming of every professor that you mention. No one is advocating that.

What we are advocating is that people have the ability to make the choice for themselves -- kind of like the position your side advocates for abortion, when you think about it.

The difference being, of course, that gun rights are actually something written in the Constitution, not divined from astronomic phenomena by pseudo-intellectual pashas in black robes.


lilly
It would certainly be wrong to require either students or professors/teachers to be armed.

Would you approve of a system which protects those students who fear guns by posting outside each classroom where the professor refuses to be armed, "This is a gun-free classroom"? In that classroom, no student would be allowed to have a gun, either.

Except Cho.

Way Out Dave
So Liberals embrace massacres - wow - that is a sick statement made by a sick person - talk about using the tragedy at Virginia Tech for political reasons - what the hell is this column about?

Killer
You have hit on a major difference in the two camps approach to this problem.We see that humans can not solve every problem. On many things the most you can do is ask what is the best trade off. For the left every problem has a solution if you just work on it long enough.

Unfortunately the law of unintended consequences always comes into play. The mentally ill were being badly treated in many ways so laws were formulated to protect them. Those same laws made it difficult (not impossible) to deal with Cho. Cho is walking loose and thirty two die.

Make some more laws to deal with what Cho did. And the unintended consequence is?

religiouslib
You Troyskyites use the term 'liberalism' as the politically correct replacement for the term 'communism' which is indeed hated by main-stream Americans (especially those having relatives whose lives were lost in WWII being forced to defeat Hitler to ensure fellow fascist Stalin would remain in power).

Lilly
You have so far failed to address the efficacy of denying a certain tool to someone with the desire to murder.

Conservative Logic
a) Last week a psychotic man killed 32 people.
b) Liberals favor legalized abortion.
c) Therefore liberals applaud the psychotic who killed 32 people.

And you folks wonder why people think you're silly?

Religiouslib:

I do not hate Liberals. I hate their ideals. I hate their actions. I wish I could make them see the truth. But I do not hate Liberal people themselves.

Party of Death
When I realized that the death of babies was the most important item on the democrat agenda, I became an indy voter. When protecting life has no meaning, the soul dies and any reason to exist ceases. I understand very well why dems want the war lost, high American casualties, and islamic triumph over the USA. When looked at in the whole scheme of things, killing babies is a natural way of thinking for them.

No pain, no gain
Who can forget supporters of Bill Clinton saying that the former president wished he was still president when 9/11 happened so that he could build on his legacy as a great president. Liberals embrace violent massacres? You bet. Like ambulance-chasing lawyers, they make their living off the misery of others. Sharpton, Edwards, Jackson, just to name a few. Whenever we have a Karina or a Virignia Tech tragedy, these scoundrels would put on their capes and swoop in to save the victims, when in fact, they are secretly hoping more of the same. One's pain is their gain.

ALL LIFE IS SACRED.

Writes one Liberal. I agree wholeheartedly with statement. I agree to the extent that my own life is sacred and for that reason I believe that I should be able to defend it even if I have to take the life of an aggressor to do it.

Therefore, the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution is a must that we who seek to defend life can be armed.

Two Faced Townhall
You're complaing that the Democrats use this shocking event for their own ends. Yet you do nothing but rant about your own political agenda.

The NRA gun obsessed fetishists must have been licking their chops after the first news broke. "Oh, Guns. Guns and more lovely Guns, (pant, pant)". "
"Hey Frank, Sh*t, look at this, man. Time to push those Liberal Gun Haters to abdicate their low moral idiocy and allow babies to carry guns to kindergarten".
"Sure gotta let them babies protect themselves against them Evil Liberal Murderers"
Sure, Frank, We'll train 'em to be re-spons-ible citizens".

Dodge City is alive and well.

BrianR
"Hyperbole doesn't serve your argument.
There is a middle ground between "gun-free zone" (a large bullseye painted on the campus) and the required arming of every professor that you mention. No one is advocating that."

Well said, BrianR. Liberals go to the same school of hyperbole. Their argument against ANY war is always "Would you send your own kid to the front line?" Another good one is "Would you want 80,000 drunk fans at a football game all packing handguns?" All these silly hyperboles sound very intellectual, but have very little practical value to solve real problems.

Another Moronic Column
Talk about grasping at straws.

In the first part of the column the "author" simply makes derogatory comments about the Democrats. No connections to anything. Just what terrible people they are. No connection to the massacre in Virginia.

At the same time, he is talking about the Democrats pandering for votes. Excuse me, but this entire column is a fine example of pandering to the lowest level of his support.

There are some fine writers at Townhall, Will, Buchanan, Buckley, Dean and others.

This is not the first time I've read this type of tripe from Mr. McCullough.

If this is the best you've got, you're in trouble.

Scenario for disaster...
You're in collage, you have your favorite gun under your belt, (for respobsible use only), you hear shots, you pull your piece and start running TOWARDS the trouble, you come round the corner and there's a guy carrying a gun. Do you ask him nicely, politely, if he's the bad guy? Or do you just shoot and ask later, that is if you can ask and if he can answer.
Now imaging this happening throughout the campus.

High Noon.

lilly, lilly, lilly... I can't believe
you are misrepresenting what is said so completely:

>>>
All week I've heard your argument that armed tragedy can be avoided by arming everyone.
>>>

No one said that everyone MUST be armed. But the 2nd Amendment gives EVERYONE that right to be armed. If you choose to go unarmed... then by all means - go unarmed. but do not take that right away from someone else.

And when that someone else shoots another in self defense or even defending you and yours with his rightly held arms - don't castigate him.

When enough of the bad guys get the message that he will be shot dead post haste and NO ONE missed his going, then we may enjoy the peace you so desperately seek. Knowing that uncivilized behavior will not be tolerated dampens all the fun of a massacre - don't you think?

lilly
... "addresses," in her slam-dunk-in-her-own-mind way, the organizational challenges of ENSURING that people are armed when faced with a shooter.

However, a key benefit of allowing concealed carry is that it is a deterrent to attacks like Cho's, since a criminal can't know who else is armed.

Cho was psychotic but highly methodical. There's a not-insignificant likelihood that if CCW were permitted on the VT campus, he would have chosen instead to plan a bombing. Preparing for that would have involved a criminal "footprint" larger, and more obvious to fellow students and law enforcement, than hiding a couple of small arms.

And of course, if VT had CCW, there MIGHT have been someone armed in one of the classrooms Cho entered, or somewhere in the building and able to respond. With VT a gun-free zone, that possibility was fully eliminated.

Two realistic shots at better containment of Cho, versus the none that came with declaring VT a gun-free zone. No one is saying that CCW would assuredly have prevented or interrupted Cho's attack, but it would have increased the odds against him.

Not a fan of "odds" versus "certainty"? Then don't take any more stairs. Accidental deaths on stairs in America this year are likely to be 49 times the number of deaths at VT last week.

Lillly...
After terrorists shot up Israeli schools, all teachers and parent volunteers were required to carry semi-automatic weapons while at school. The result: An end to the shootings. What about this is so difficult for you to understand?

Regarding partial-birth abortion, if, as the left claims, it is for the health of the mother, how is her health endangered if the last two inches of the baby exit the birth canal? Perhaps some liberal out there will enlighten me.

No it doesn't
> But the 2nd Amendment gives EVERYONE that right to be armed.<

As long as everyone is in a well-regulated militia.

Israel
For Lilly (what a beautiful name!)

I wish someone here who is familiar with the facts would review recent history in Israel.

As I remember there were a number of horrible shootings and killings in schools in Israel in the 1960's and '70's.

The Israelis (sp?) then trained teachers in the use of guns and allowed them to take them into their classrooms.

Result?

No school shootings/killings since then.

Again...someone truly knowledgeable of recent history please check this out.

Letsallrelax: Again
Your "Scenario for disaster..." is meaningless.

Here's how I'll answer it. Given: I'm a legally gun-carrying teacher (too old to be a student). I hear gunfire, pull my piece, and head toward the sound of the guns.

I see an armed civilian. Do I immediately open fire? He11 no; it could be ANOTHER legally armed civilian.

So, just like anyone else with a lick of common sense, I wait to see what he does. If he points his piece at me or another person who is clearly in the victim category, I open fire.

There! That wasn't so hard, was it?


Bigfoot: Israel and Switzwerland
are the two examples I always use in discussing this issue.

Switzerland: mandatory gun ownership. Every household has weapons and ammo, in most cases a fully-automatic assault rifle. Very low crime rate.

Israel: Most people own guns, and public carry is the norm. Very low crime rate. Many bomb-carrying terrs blown away before they could trigger their devices.


spartacus3344
Liberals can't understand what we are saying because it must be intellectually comprehended. Liberals are guided by emotions and feelings.

Same Old, Same Old
Kevin, you write well, and your analysis is quite right. It isn't politics or hate which bring you to write this, it's just the realization of what the Liberals think and how they act at times like this. The Liberal mush-heads who post in these pages really don't understand why you and others write these sentiments.

The VA Tech tragedy was one that probably couldn't have been prevented, though it would have been substantially mitigated by the proper use of the second amendment. If Cho hadn't used guns, he could have used a bomb, poison spray, machetes, fighting robots, etc. How would Lilly and her Liberal friends have dealt with those? I'm sure they'd talk about banning fertilizer and kitchen knives.

Liberals will always jump to use tragedies to their [perceived] political advantage. As Kevin writes: "They made speeches, sent out campaign letters, and blasted e-mail lists not 48 hours after the killings at Va. Tech that not only refused to call the violent taking of innocent life evil, but had the gall to insist upon voters making a statement in 2008 - by also embracing their beliefs."

That's how Liberals work. They jump to take advantage of each and every major event that occurs---even the tragedies---for their own purposes. And when you call them on it, they claim you're a hypocrite by doing the same thing. Can't win, can we? Well, maybe. The truth will always win in the long run---but to get Liberals to understand it? Well, that's the big problem.

And any discussion of the taking of innocent life logically includes the subject of abortion, which is a blot on humanity's lifeline. This procedure [whenever done] is a horrible throwback to the defeated, violent socialist regimes of the past [and some in the present.] And the partial birth abortion is particularly horrendous. It's been well described elsewhere.

I still fail to understand why Liberals are so quick to agree with the death of innocents in practice, while decrying them by mouth. Do they back up their arguments with actual facts? No, they change the focus to the accuser and bring up anything that will deflect the discussion from their weaknesses. And you can forget about calmly presenting facts and figures in any discussion with one. Liberals are pathologically incapable of understanding facts that show them to be wrong. Therefore, they attack the messenger in any way possible.

It's sad and depressing, particularly in these pages. Why don't you Liberals go pedal your claptrap over at the Daily Kos? You'd find vacuous, kindred spirits there. And if you're a Conservative wondering about that 'gem' of the Internet, just click on my name and check out my blog. I spent several hours at the Daily Kos, washed several times, partook of my medicinal martini [or two, or three], and wrote an analysis.

May the life-force multiply without Liberal intervention.

Switzerland
More for that beautifully named lady, Lilly...

In Switzerland I believe all able bodied young men and women are required to serve a year (or two?) in the military. And after discharge they must keep a loaded weapon in their homes.

Is this not so?

I believe the murder rate in Switzerland is the lowest in Europe, and I've never heard of any mass killings in their schools.


Click on my name
to read my blog essay on the topic "Guns and America".

utah....
never mind

your mind is closed on the subject

tnmcoy
The answer to your questions may be found in the words of the Apostle Paul: "The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron." The left has no conscience. They readily admit now that abortion indeed kills humans beings and that the unborn feel pain, but they do not care.

A right, not an obligation
lilly; "All week I've heard your argument that armed tragedy can be avoided by arming everyone"

As an example of typical liberal legerdemain, most of the libs here misrepresent our concern for the 2nd Amendment as some sort of mandate that everyone MUST carry guns.

I don't own a gun and never have. I don't care for them and exercise my RIGHT to NON-ownership. It's the other side of the coin, the fair and logical opposite of the right to carry.

Unfortunately, liberals don't seem to believe in two-sided coins. It's all-or-nothing, their way or the highway. Abortion at all cost, even that of torture and infanticide.

Nor do they seem to advocate real "rights" as they were written in our Constitution, but only mandated absolutes, with the usual .. the UNIVERSAL .. unintended consequences.

Spartacus: Thank you, sir
I appreciate it.

BTW, great job on the slave uprising!


Abortion "Rights"
Brian at 11:09 talked about...

"...abortion rights...being divined from some astonomic phenomenon..."

Were not those "rights" divined from some "...emenations of penumbras...or penumbra of emenations..." or some such mind twisting mumblings?


On the right to keep and bear
We have that right and the right is simply acknowledged in the 2nd. The militia is everyone capable of service. All of this was written down because the founders knew the largest threat to any of us was the tyranny of government. The threat has not changed.

Liberal Folly
To illustrate the mind of a liberal, let's take one of Solomon's proverbs (27:22) and substitute the word "liberal" for the word "fool":

"Though you grind a Liberal in a mortar, grinding him like grain with a pestle, you will not remove his folly from him."

Could it be that Solomon was prophesying about today's liberals?

Spartacus, Bigfoot: LOL
Spartacus: LOL, yeah! How'd that Jersey accent work for him in Old Rome, BTW? I'll bet that crucifixion thing really hurt!

_________________________

Bigfoot: Yeah, exactly! Penumbras and emanations. You have seriously got to laugh at that (and I realize the incongruity of that statement, but it fits)!

Spartacus
Man, that deserved a Spew Alert!

Going now for my dishrag to clean up the coffee spray.


Sashel
sashal writes:

"Coward? Duck? Why don't you fight, like N.Boortz and J.Derbisire are advocating"

I'd love to (debate that is....it's pretty hard to get in a real fight with you online...ot that I would want to fight you anyway....I'm sure we can resolve this peacefully!). But it's you who are running away. A couple of us have asked you to expand on the following:

"Bushtards and fake cons-liars will tolerate, embrace and even advocate for violent, maniacal, and bloody killing that takes innocent life."

So far, none forthcoming. We await with baited breath...

BOYCOTT NBC 4 RECKLESS DISREGARD!
One aspect in this tragedy is the NBC complicity resulting in the broadcast of the "exclusive" tapes. Below is the letter I’ve written to Steve Capus, President of NBC News.

I would urge those reading this to post it on to as many web sites as possible and forward it to others, urging them to do the same.
______________________________________________
Mr. Capus,
When I learned of your decision to broadcast the “Exclusive” video and accompanying rant mailed to your news office by the deranged individual responsible for VA Tech shootings, I refused to view it and all subsequent NBC coverage of this event. I realized your decision to broadcast the tape was self serving and only facilitated this person’s agenda by giving him the public platform he desired, while encouraging others to follow. In allowing him to achieve this ultimate agenda, you are culpable. Subsequent events confirm this. Within days following the event, others seeking similar notoriety have made threats to schools around the country. Why? It’s not just that they’re deranged. Should they act on their threats, they achieve international "recognition" and “fame” they crave, due to news media executives who are thoughtless and stupid enough to broadcast their videos and rants; thus providing additional inducement to carry out their plans. The forum you provide facilitates this. In the likely event of copy cat incidents, encouraged by airing this tape, you will share some of the responsibility. It’s also likely the families of future victims will sue both NBC and you personally, claiming your reckless indifference in airing the tape encouraged others to claim their moment of fame. Should this happen, I’ll be the first to urge such litigation on as many web sites as possible. Your shortsighted decision to broadcast the tape was based primarily on your quest for ratings. Your greed and indifference is despicable. Well, you got your ratings. And I suspect greed and indifference are integral parts of your character.

Normally, I write letters that are civil and polite, regardless of circumstances. My upper-middle class background encouraged this. My education and subsequent professional career reinforced this requirement for civility and politeness (in most cases). However, in yours I must make a rare exception. Your monumental stupidity causes me to tell it like it is. The truth is; you’re a reprehensible, self-centered, greedy little prick. You could care less about the likely result of your ill-conceived decision. The consequences should be evident to any intelligent person. But as President of one of the largest news broadcasting networks in the world, your complicity in the agenda of a deranged person, by airing his tape, is inexcusable. As President of NBC News, you’re charged with the responsibility for balancing the Public need to know with Public welfare. You have grossly lost sight of this responsibility and overstepped the bounds of balance.

This letter will be published on numerous blogs, with recommendations that NBC be boycotted. No American with any intelligence or sensitivity should watch your network. And the NBC Board of Directors should fire you for your reckless and callous disregard. And that, “sir”, is about as polite as I can be. Don’t like my tone? Too bad. You’re welcome to contact me and discuss it. But we both know you won’t. It’s unlikely the sycophant admin assistants you hire to read your mail will show you this letter. In your obsession with ratings and disregard for the consequences, you will disregard public opinion as well. But perhaps the opinion of the NBC Board of Directors and some of your major sponsors, who will receive copies of this letter, may get your attention.

BOYCOTT NBC 4 RECKLESS DISREGARD

Spartacus: Stop!
I'm running out of dishrags!


You're on for the java and ammo-fest.

Same offer if you hit LA. Be sure to get your anti-lib inoculations before boarding the plane, though.

Tom
I asked Sashal about that earlier and he said Ken was the guilty party. At that point I moved on.

Still waiting for Lilly to explain a few things that I asked her about.

Liberal sophistry
It seems that liberals are incapable of rational thought.

Letsallrelax posted a hypothetical about ROE after gunfire is heard on campus. BrianR set him straight on that.

Liberals seem to think that when someone straps on a gun, his/her attitude becomes "shoot first at anything that moves".

Anyone with a modicum of training knows better. You don't simply start blasting away at everything. Target acquisition includes evaluating the target as friendly/hostile/indeterminate or unknown.

Even in real combat, the military doesn't use letsallrelax's tactic for ROE. In an NDP (night defensive position), you are informed of the ROE. Only in an area designated as a free fire zone can you fire on movement or incoming fire.

You are also informed if there are friendly units operating in the area. In letsallrelax's hypothetical, a trained gun owner would have to assume that there are "friendly" students in the area, and therefore "shoot at movement" ROE doesn't apply.

Caveat: I tried to keep this short, so it's not all-inclusive.






DavidMac
You are wasting your time as it is obvious there can never be a situation where the responsible use of force can be justified.

bigfootbob re: Israel
Re: Shootings in Class rooms in Israel: CORRECT: Since teachers in Israel began carrying guns to class, there have been No shootings. This is a subject I happen to know something about as I travel to Israel frequently as part of my job.

As to NUT CASE LILLY: I suggest we all just ignore her.

Partial Birth Infanticide
During the oral arguments about this case, Chief Justice Roberts asked a question of the attorney defending the procedure.

This is a paraphrased, not an exact, quote; I do believe it accurately conveys his question:

"You say this is a safer procedure than earlier term abortions because fewer instruments are inserted into the woman's body. Would it not be better, then, to allow the baby to be fully born and then kill it? No instruments would have to be inserted into her body."

There was no answer.

How could there be?

Spartacus: Thanks
But there's a heavy responsibility involved, too.

I had to promise that if I ever leave town, I have to take the flag with me.


I have a solution
We should pass a law limiting partial-birth abortions to women who are only partly pregnant. Seems obvious to me. But that's me. I'm an absolutist nut.

A "Choice" To Kill..
I often note how Kevin's columns have titles that seem to truly frustrate liberal readers. Yet the tragic irony, is, that not unlike most of his Sunday writings, his analysis is true. Like his usual fare, ~KMC's parallels are right-on today.

Years ago-in a blind and frantic vote for -supposed-suffrage-women fought for an imagined right-that was actually framed as a choice. No one ever elucidated on the specifics of this coveted choice.

A pagan generation flowered into a "me" one, a selfish group of voters who fought for their choice to kill..their own kin..

I believe, with all my heart, that the vote this week was a miracle, based out of society's flinch in conscience.

I also believe, that somehow, in God's economy, the timing of this vote came on the very heels of
voters becoming-for a moment- more tender in their consciences about the very sanctity of human life.

Mr. Barak Obama, Mrs. Hillary Clinton, Mr. John Edwards, and those who side with them, do nothing less than advocate for The-Culture-of-Death.

Their words, acts, voices and deeds attest to the same blind-lunacy, the same creed that is now outdated, but was insanely followed by liberal pro-abortion protesters decades ago.

Life is sacred, and all human life starts at conception.

It is inconceivable, and morally wrong, that a world leader, with all their money and supposed favor, can walk in such arrogance, such presumption, to seek to act as God-Himself. Yet this is what they do, when they discuss issues of life and death, and the destination of our most vulnerable human lives today.

As for those who make it their vocation to deal in mire, like the newscasters and behind-the-scenes heads at NBC, they made their decision against Life long ago.

One need only take a few hours any evening to see the consensus of what networks think about people, and human life, to know what they have to say.

In short, on standard viewing, or cable, it is a fanfare of guns, flesh, violence, adulteries, carnality, and murder.

Not one night goes by that the stations have a thing that is edifying, uplifting personally, or God-glorifying to men, women or families.

They are tell-all tales of abuses, porn-images, killings, forensics and chicanery. The very worst of their fare knocks down Fathers, and Mothers, and sells wicked perversions, as some type of norm, to our kids. At this point it is merely nothing less than a Satanic agenda for evil's sake, as making money stopped being an issue for them long ago..

These network heads, and those who work with them in these industries, are also liars, and killers, of the highest rank,-by association. They peddle the worst of human tragedies and ills, and do so in a way that is blind, selfish, and unconscionable.

Just like their like-minded liberal friends in politics and media today..


Now How Do They Atone..
Now how do they atone for or celebrate all this?

They bow to a monkey, their uncle, and say the "ape" in them made them do it..

All the while talking about "Earth" day, and how to kill another made in God's very image, while they drink more heady brew..

The 1960's are over my friends, and little was wrought from that, except health food stores, a few songs, Martin Luther King Jr. certain clothing combinations,
and the children, me included, that were allowed to live..

MrsV: I wish you were right
Unfortunately, the Sixties *aren't* over, as all those self-indulgent radicals are now in positions of power in politics, education, and the media.

I'm of that generation (I'm 58), so that's not some sour grapes observation. I despised them then, and I despise them now.


These Are The Dying Dyers..
And that's about it for the

dying dyers and the deadly talk they talk of, and the deadly things they do..

GOP IS FOR MASS MURDER & GUNS GUNS
First generalizing what liberals THINK and Liberals want is stupid. WHO ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT. I'm and independent and moderate, but compared to you LOCK-STEP'ERS & kool-aid drinkers, at least I think about it and look at all sides first. Am 100% against late term abortion and elimination of guns. However one should not be forced and one should be controlled better, obviously if you use you common sense and forget special interest. One is a private matter between them and God and one is for the greater good of the nation.


Why not talk about facts and some common sense debate on what we might do about the mentally ill in this country, specifically mentally ill with guns. How about better gun back ground checks and required training. I bet a pro gun instructor would have red flagged this kid given time to interact with him over a course; 5-10 minutes with a gun shop owner is not enough.


NO WE DON'T WANT TO TALK AND DEBATE WE JUST WANT TO BASH LIBERALS and DEMS, RIGHT?

YOU WANT TO TAKE A STRETCH AND COMPARE IT TO ABORTION.

LOOK IF YOU ARE GOING TO TELL A WOMAN WHAT TO DO WITH HER PREGNANCY THAN WHY NOT TELL PEOPLE WHAT TO DO WITH THIER GUNS?

OH NO WE CANT DO THAT BECAUSE THE NRA IS A POWERFUL LOBBY AND THE GOP IS PANDERING TO EVANGELICALS.

DID YOU KNOW MORE THAN 30 US AMERICAN SOLDIERS DIED IN JUST THE LAST WEEK, WITH 100'S AND 100'S OF INNOCENT IRAQ CIVILIANS? WE DON'T CARE ABOUT THAT DO WE. BUSH CAUSED THAT WITH HIS POLICIES. THAT IS IMMORAL.

This article is BS propaganda, void of facts or real intelligence. I love how bug-eyes wraps VT and abortion together. True retardation in integrity and honesty. The only purpose is to bash Dem candidates and than has the nerve to accuse them of playing politics?

Its so sad that we pick people based on what special interest they serve. The result is we get people like Bush. Did you know the mineral payments from the oil companies has gone down by 66% since Bush has been in office. There are massive cover-ups and total lack of accounting of these contracts since Bush took over. Pay back is sweet.

The fact is the GOP is the party IN LOVE WITH SPECIAL INTEREST. They have to sign off with their little NRA, Evangelicals, Oil-Energy-Big Business. That is what Edwards was talking about. Why would you not want to be for reduction in green house gas? Well because the oil companies write you a BIG FAT MOTHER FREAKING OIL CHECK TO BUY YOU OFF. Like late term (3rd tri) abortion, who can you be against protection of the WHOLE WORLD.


I am not for abortion (YIPPEE) of any kind if its available, but that is the right of woman, the ones that carry the burden of giving birth.

What I am for is reducing the number of unwanted pregnancy and more available birth control and education. NO, we can't talk about condoms or the pill because of the religious left the GOP is pandering to. That is stupid. No where in the bible does say you can't use birth control. Is that what you want, make abortion illegal. When it was illegal woman died from coat hanger abortions in Mexico.

I agree no one should be FOR late term abortion. Clearly third trimester is barbaric, its now a viable human, no debate. What woman want is control of their bodies. My opinion is they should control their legs and keep them together first. I am more conservative than anyone when it comes to personal responsibility. But in a free country that is KEY. Like we expect most gun owners not to go on a rampage, we expect most woman to be responsible.

Why not outlaw all sin. Yep to heck with separation of church and state or the constitution; lets just put Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson and James Dobson in charge of a new branch of government to monitor and regulate sin. That will fix it. Wait we already have that. The evangelicals got an office in the Bush white house. One evangelical who served left and wrote a book about how the GOP was faking it, to just get evangelicals to vote for them. Duuh you think.

I hate Rudy but at least he stuck to his policies, unlike Mitt the liar, Mormon and flip flopper. The GOP candidates SUCK BIG TIME.

I am not for late term abortion or the elimination of the 2nd Amendment, but its easier for a mentally disturbed kid to buy a gun than rent a video. At least with a drivers license you have to go down and do a face to face, usually preceded with some training and a practical test. OH NO WE CAN'T HAVE THAT. Thanks NRA and GOP.

THE GOP IS FOR MASS MURDER AND GUNS, GUNS, GUNS, GUNS; PLUS THE GOP WANTS TO CONTROL OUR LIVES, WANTS BIG GOVERNMENT, MORE AUTHORITARIAN BS and MORE INFLUENCE AND INTRUSION TO OUR PRIVACY.

DOES ANY ONE THINK THEY CAN MAKE ABORTIONS ILLEGAL IN A FREE COUNTY LIKE AMERICA. I GUESS IF YOU LIVED IN CHINA, PRE-1991 USSR OR 30-40'S NAZI GERMANY TYPE TOTALITARIAN GOVERNMENTS, THAN YOU WOULD HAVE BE REAL HAPPY THERE. TOO BAD YOU DON'T LIVE THERE. THAN YOU COULD CONTROL AND TELL EVERYONE WHAT TO DO.

With freedom comes personal responsibility. If you are against abortion, than BY GOLLY go volunteer at pro-life centers, teach, donate money and pray, BUT STOP USING THE government to impose your will on the privacy of other people.

More over STOP picking your leaders based on one or two KEY special interest. All we end up with is pandering fools that don't attack the problems with common sense, rather than with ideology and special interest money in mind. Politicians will say and do what it takes to get and keep power, not do what is best. Don't be a mindless follower. Abortion is here to stay, make the best of it and get active with reducing it with your church or civic group. Guns? You know its out of control and the power of these guns are beyond what is needed for self defense or hunting. Back ground checks are a joke.

It's easy to see the insanity
of the left who condone and commit partial birth abortion.

They are willing to kill human babies, but will do everything in their power to make sure that bears, owls, frogs, whatever animals, are not killed and made extinct.

When an owl, bear,or frog is pregnant with their little cubs, tadpoles, eggs, do the liberals call these zygotes? Of course not, they call them baby bears, baby frogs, and baby owls.

But, a human baby is called a zygote. Liberals try to make people believe they don't know what that zygote IS. It's not a baby they say. Hmmm...I wonder what it is. Certainly not an animal like an owl or a bear because then they would want to save it.

All liberals who can think, think this one through to see if you can come up with how illogical this is and why we on the right who believe that all human life is to be protected think you are a bunch of murdering nutcases.

Jet pilot: Interesting post
You start out with the headline:
"GOP IS FOR MASS MURDER & GUNS GUNS"

followed immediately by:
"First generalizing what liberals THINK and Liberals want is stupid."

Kinda hard to take anything you wrote after that seriously, know what I mean?



Mr. Buck
What repubs have thrown someone in jail for burning the flag?

Why do liberals want to kill humans?
Of course liberals like mass killings of humans. Animals are natural and good, humans are destroying the world, and preach about God and Creation. Both of which are evil, forbidden doctrines. If true, the liberals could not play at being gods themselves. Have you ever meet a liberal that does not know what is good for every one else. Ted Kennedy and windmills is the prime example.

Mr. Buck
Your ability to argue the substance of the column is stunning. His points were valid and you simply dismissed them all and went straight to 911.

Oh - and name calling ISN'T a debate technique... unless your intention is to lose...

Mr. Buck
You still haven't answered my question as to what repubs put someone in jail for burning the flag?

As far as Bush bearing responsibility, I would say then that you must be able to make quite a case for Bubba Clinton's failures leading up to 9/11.

spartacus
LMAO at this: youmakewaterinhispants

Mr. Buck
I gather from your comments that you support some type of restriction on gun ownership. What action concerning gun ownership might have been effective in stopping the murder at VT.

Mr. Buck
apparently has resorted to the specious hyperbole that's so typical of the left: "they'd [Republicans] throw you in prison for burning a flag - and then take the tattered flag and wrap it tight around the mouths of dissenters."


[Peppermint asked Bucky-boy to cite an example of that.]

I would also ask Bucky: isn't it the DEMOCRATS who insist the debate is over regarding global warming and isn't it the socialists who say "dissenters of GW" should be jailed?

Aren't the Democrats trying to repeal the 2nd amendment without going through all that time-consuming ratification procedure at the state level?

Wasn't it the democrats who stonewalled Bush's nominees for the appellate courts judiciary by filibuster?

Aren't the Democrats trying to use the so-called "Fairness Doctrine" to stifle free-speech on talk radio?

Yet here comes Bucky-boy, claiming it's really the Republicans who are against free speech because they don't want the Armerican flag burnt by the socialists.

Requiring Professors
to be armed would also violate the constitution.

Mr. Buck
Another question for you. As you are such a staunch defender of the First Amendment what do you think of campaign finance reform?

Quick edits!
You wrote, "Evidently the child can be denied constitutional protection to their life if a parent and doctor so agree.

My edit would have read, "Evidently the child can be denied constitutional protection to his/her life if a parent and doctor so agree.

You wrote, "And for the record the American Medical Association has publicly stated that such a procedure is never medically necessary."

My edit would have read, "And for the record the American Medical Association has stated publicly that such a procedure is never medically necessary."

DavidMac
Excellent post to Mr. Bucky. And, I don't see him answering any of many simple questions put to him.
Has he run off and joined the PC police? Or perhaps, he is outside of his cave at this moment burning GW in effigy and his flag.

Lefty rants
Once again, you can tell a liberal by the rant (generalisation of course) A school child rant. They have gone into typical hysteria mode here. But it is fun to watch.

Buck 2
"Also, for those of you who crow about innocent lives being squandered, I notice not much of a mention of the calamity in Iraq and the loss of much innocent life there."

Come on. The vast majority of those killed in Iraq is by people who themselves claim they love death. And you know it.

Jetpilot
"I love how bug-eyes wraps VT and abortion together."

And yet you in the VERY preceding paragraph wrap VT to Iraq! at least read what you have ranted before posting. See that's the benefit of the written debate.

"The fact is the GOP is the party IN LOVE WITH SPECIAL INTEREST."

Like the Dems aren't....

"I am not for late term abortion or the elimination of the 2nd Amendment, but its easier for a mentally disturbed kid to buy a gun than rent a video. At least with a drivers license you have to go down and do a face to face, usually preceded with some training and a practical test."

Now that's a very good point. And I don't think any sane person could disagree.

"THE GOP IS FOR MASS MURDER AND GUNS"

oops, you're ranting again. Shades of Cho.

"With freedom comes personal responsibility."

Tell that to the left demographic base.

"More over STOP picking your leaders based on one or two KEY special interest."

The left never does that (!!!)

YouMakeMeLaugh:
"THIS SAME JERK DOESN'T FIND THE TAKING OF INNOCENT LIVES IN IRAQ EVIL!"

So you think he might be in league with the Sunni terrorists who are causing 99% of the trouble? Interesting theory...

Peppermint:
"It's easy to see the insanity
of the left who... are willing to kill human babies, but will do everything in their power to make sure that (baby) bears, owls, frogs, whatever animals, are not killed and made extinct."

Spot on! Crazy lefty animal rights activists (no question the left is straddled with an assortment of misfits. I think Cho would have voted left, come to think of it)

Mr. Buck:
"Maybe so pepper, but you can't deny a single thing I said."

That's because we can't even understand it. It's an incoherent rant. You lefties need to take a chill pill. Calm down, come off the dope, & think & write straight. That's better.... Everything's gonna be OK. (I think he's gone to sleep folks, dont wake him....)

youmakemelaugh:
"and the killers of 9/11 go unanswered to this day"

That's because they kind of died on impact...in the towers. What, you dont think they survived that, do you?

"Warpublicans never care about children"

Can we refer this guy to a counsellor? Read Cho's writings. There is some similarity in style.

youmakemelaugh:

true. very true. Fellow cons, it's been said that the left do humour better than we do, & reading their posts, we all must surely agree.






















Mr. Buck
I'm still waiting for you to answer my question.
What repubs jailed a flag burner?

Spartacus, Pepp
What happened?

I leave the room for a little while and all the fun starts without me.

Looks like a target-rich environment.

(So to speak, heh heh heh)

NY, guns & crime: Mr Buck
"Rudy... proves, of course, that gun control works, but let's pretend that his getting guns off the street and arresting gunners (albeit black ones - the ones that scare YOU) had no effect on the crime rate."

(he's awake again)

Mr Buck, have you read Freakonomics (Levitt) by chance? Co-written by Stephen Dubner, NYT (one of your guys). Anyway, Levitt has been hailed by both the left & right across the country & across the english speaking world for his insights. And he says that the fall in crime rate in NY had NOTHING to do with the alleged crack down on crime/guns there. Many on the left & right did not like what he says next:

he is absolutely convinced that Roe v Wade (& the availability of abortion) led to a dramatic reduction in teen/out of wedlock/poor (especially BLACK) births and therefore a corresponding fall in the demographic group most prone to crime.

On guns he says that Switzerland has about the highest per capita gun ownership of nearly any country in the world, and yet it is also one of the safest places in the world. And I quote next: "guns do not cause crime" (p131).

Peppermint
It is obvious by their writings. (as we all know) that those who believe in the Liberal-mindset, have adopted a belief that is detrimental to the entire world. It is only stupid, ignorant people who would believe in such
an ideology. And they make me sick to read or hear them!

Try as they might to convince others that they are right. They are to stupid to see that their very words discredit their beliefs.

As an example, they try and convince us that it is perfectly alright and legal to kill a baby ( a human being) at the moment of birth. When a fully formed human being (the baby) and part of it's head is exposed. That is the time to kill it! The Liberals call that "Legal Abortion!" Because in their warped, sick minds, the baby is not classified as a human being until it
is completely out of the mother. Now look at it from another perspective.That same baby, a few seconds later if allowed, is now out and laying on the mothers stomach. It would be Murder to kill it!

The same stupidity of Liberal thinking is demonstrated in all things. Especially
when it comes to guns. In the 'Liberal mind' all guns are bad, bad, bad! The world should be without guns! They completely, and conveniently, overlook the fact that a gun is nothing but a junk of steel,a machine. As is a knife, a club
or rock until it is used by a human being to cause harm to others. In the Liberal mind, it is the guns fault! As if it got up and did these things on it's own.

I ask you. Can a display of stupidity be more evident?

Mr. Buck
Why won't you answer my question? Are you missing my posts where I keep asking you to tell me which repubs jailed someone for burning the flag?
Please do tell me, I have an inquiring mind.

Mr. Buck
Your answer then is the total ban on the personal ownership of firearms. I agree that that would have an effect on a certain percentage of gun crime. Would it have had an effect at VT? Given the killer ignored the laws against shooting people at random would a law against gun ownership have stopped him.

I ask this because years ago I regularly broke the laws concerning the ingestion of various illegal substances. These substances rarely lasted very long in my presence but I was always able to replace them because there was money to be made.

There are now some two hundred million firearms in America. Your plan to effectively deal with those is?

Goshawk
On the money! I have never seen such stupidity as some of the arguments I see here when the libs drop their rantings.

Some I can't even make sense out of but then what is new with that and usually it is considered normal not to be able to make sense out of craziness.

Abortion is one of the most senseless arguments I have ever heard in my life. And, they are running out of arguments for this murderous practice as science, their god, marches forth with further evidence about that "thing" in the uterus.

But, to have a child's head outside of the mother, and have its brains bashed in, so that the mother and father won't be "inconvenienced" is about the most heinous thing I've ever heard.

What is that head? Is that a baby's head?
Who can possible make sense of this?? I become exasperated beyond belief at this kind of "killing" to be called "legal".

Spartacus
Yeah, and I'm hard-pressed to see the connection between VT and guns, and 9/11.

That's why I think I'll let it slide at this point.

Because.....

Listen up, Mr. Buck and ymml....

it's OFF TOPIC!!!!!!!!!!!!

TruLib: Stop with the logic, already!
Desist at once!


That's a point I've raised in the past. We're constantly told that we can't in any way remove 12 million or so illegals, but we can somehow make about 280 million guns disappear.

Laws are ridiculously ineffective in the war on drugs, but a gun ban law will cure this country of violent crime.

Ooooooookaaaay.........


Mr Bucky
Bucky (still ignoring Peppermint) posted, "supporters of capital punishment ALWAYS remind us, a dead killer can't kill again. Well, no gun mean no gun violence."


Uh, Bucky, aren't you a little confused? Executing the killer DOES have the effect that he/she will NEVER commit another crime. Taking the gun away DOESN'T.

Sophistry, thy name is Mr. Buck.

Mr. Buck
In addition, purchasing a firearm in Va. with the intent of selling it in N.Y. is against a number of laws in both states and at the federal level. Dealing with the theory that Rudy's actions created a drop in crime, why did not previous administrations enforce the existing gun laws to achieve the same ends? Are you saying it took a Republican to get tough on crime?

Brian
It may be that the liberals are pushing the liberalization of the drug laws with the hope that people in a drugged stupor will accindentally shoot themselves. Thank goodness I quit tha sh*t.

TruLib
Hahahahahaha!

Yeah, sanity's a cooler high!

Pepp...Brain, Spartacus
Pepp,Remember...Mr.Buck is the newest to attain Monkey-boy status...he likes to swoop,spew and drop the guano with the rose-colored glasses on. He is trapped in la-la-land. Can you say Juliet's Diary and bradical?

Brian- yeah you know things were going so well for a while...wa happen Luuu-cy?
Spartacus...I definitely had to keep the dishrag handy....

PS
Are we so sure Mr. Buck is different from monkey girl, Kimberly...she hasn't been around.

Cho shot victims over 100 times!
Cho had very big problems. But it was more important to the judge to protect his “rights” to buy guns kill etc. than to really have him locked up for a few days for evaluation.

Then what could the doctors really do? Give medications?
Any treatment that might really work would be banned by the liberals. Forgiveness and salvation could not even be discussed.

Result: lack of short term discomfort for Cho -> death for 32 people.

In Vietnam, we pulled out and millions died.
In Iraq, the current proposal is to pull our and watch millions die. Of course it would not be reported in the press, because the reporters would not be allowed to see or photograph it.

What does this pattern signify? Is it perhaps:
The life of an Arab or a Vietnamese is of less value than an American?
The lives of the VT students were of less value than Cho’s to the judge?

The judge couldn’t be sure what would happen.
We can’t be sure what will happen Iraq either.

Can we be sure that evil things won’t happen? Whatever happened to making an error on the side of caution where human lives are concerned?

Nee: Hey!
I live in LaLaLand!

Watch yer insults there, lady!

(Of course, I am the appointed State Guardian of the only American flag in the entire stste).


Nee
There is that shrillness level with both posters, Kimberloon and Mr. Bucky.

I guess I'll have to wait until the cows come home to get my answer from Mr. Bucky.

Someone has speculated..
...that "lilly" is "Kimberly."

spartacus
LMAO again. I do know that ymml was formerly arlying and gotchagain. He gets kicked off and comes back as one of his other personalities, but certain aspects keep leaking through to the new personality, such as the word "spew" which he is stuck on.

lilly could be one of kimberloon's personalities. Their posts contain about the same amount of irrationalism.

Yeah, guys, re Lilly
I'm having a decent convo with her over on the Diana West column.

Mr. Buck
Are you going to answer my question or do I have to get DavidMac to put a gun up against your head before you'll reply?

Mr Buck
Your conversational streams defy any conventional interpretation.

On this column, we've already addressed Switzerland and Israel; a little simple reading on your part would obviate all the rest of us having to bring you up to speed simply because you were late to the dance.

If you can't get current, you end up boring everyone in sight with comments we've all not only heard a thousand times before in general, but that others of your ilk have even made right here.

I'm sure you think you have a sparkling originality.

Please allow me to disabuse you of that notion.

Spartacus: Take a look
Her last post or two were actually pretty decent.


It is about control
Women have been jailed for explaining how not to become pregnant.

Big brother steps in and claims you must have 4 children, if able to woman! Please. I have the right to control my body.

Any man who has a child illegitimately, does not pay child support, must have a vasectomy!

Women usually have abortions for economic reasons.


Spartacus: Yeah! Shocking, isn't it?
.

aspacia: What?
Abortion laws are "about control"?

Let me guess:

Granny dress, Lennon glasses, unshaved legs, earth shoes, long braided hair, tie-dyed vest.

Did I miss anything?


Because they all share a currency with your statement.

Oh, yeah: a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle.

I think my work's done here.

aspacia writes:
"Women have been jailed for explaining how not to become pregnant.

Big brother steps in and claims you must have 4 children, if able to woman! Please. I have the right to control my body.

Any man who has a child illegitimately, does not pay child support, must have a vasectomy!

Women usually have abortions for economic reasons."

Oh, Yeah, that makes sense! For economic reasons.
Yeah, the price of a baby's life is pretty cheap I take it.

Mr. Buck
You've outdone yourself. You make the accusation but have nothing to back this accusation up except to say I gave you a trick question?

ROTFLMAO

Mr. Buck
This is a conversation. When someone asks me a question I attempt to reply respectfully. Are you capable of such civilized behaviour?

Aspacia
Many people think that some form of abortion should be legal. Many people think there should be no access to abortion. So you have a debate and come to a compromise of some type. That is what was occuring when the courts stepped in to decide the issue for us.

People that don't want that debate to lead to a political settlement of some type want the courts be the legislature. That is not their job. This whole thing has gotten so ugly because the people of this country were taken out of the process.

It may seem unfair and messy but the only way to come close to putting this away will be to put the people back into the process.

lilly

If you would really like to expand your knowledge and speak from authority on this subject, please go to a shooting range and TRY to qualify to use a firearm AND pass the subsequent examination. All the rules for being allowed to own a firearm are strict and enforced.

The requirements for GRADUATION are just a little more stringent than you think.

I believe if you were to do that, you would have a much more respect for the LEGAL gunowner, their maturity and responsible nature for the privilege they feel they have of being allowed to possess a weapon for whatever reason they choose.

As has been stated, all who believe in the 2nd Amendment DO NOT own guns. What we don't like about any of your arguments, you do not give us the right to make a choice.

The Supreme Court - not the Constitution - has given you a right of choice. Why is it that what is clearly spelled out as a fundamental constitutitonal right be denied and has less legal status than an arbitary decision of nine people who graduated from law school?

Chas128
It's sad enough without having this writer make up lies and represent himself as a republican.

He claims Edwards said..."Edwards went so far as to say that the prevention of such violent massacres showed, "A hard right turn that is a stark reminder of why Democrats can not afford to lose the election of 2008."

Then links to what he really said, which is - "The ban upheld by the Court is an ill-considered and sweeping prohibition that does not even take account for serious threats to the health of individual women," Edwards said. "This hard right turn is a stark reminder of why Democrats cannot afford to lose the 2008 election."

Quite a difference. A disgraceful difference.

When we, as Americans, can't discuss our differences, well - that's one thing. When we allow a hate monger breed the conditions that keep us from talking out our differences, then that's another - one I don't want to be part of or allow to continue.

Disgraceful.

Error on the side of Caution
The judge refused to have Cho evaluatied before releaseing him.

The judge did not follow federal law and report Choi as a mental health threat, which would have prohibited him from passing a background check.

Of course all of the goverment agencies don't really care anyway.

This is why we need the right to carry.

Chas
I think Ken was talking about abortion when he refers to violent massacres. If that is true then the statement makes sense.

dogjudge - your post of 12:55 PM

First you say that TH has many fine writers and then proced to list a few.

Then, you say that if McCullough is, "...the best you've, you're in trouble."

If you will read those two sentences over SLOWLY a couple of times, I think you will understand why I am shaking my head. To help you, the two sentences don't square up. I am not an English major, just a guy trying to understand what you're saying.

JD
If the process we have now is able to stop nutjobs from getting guns then no new laws are needed. Nutjobs getting guns and shooting up the neighborhood makes the gun grabbers arguments sound better.

McCullough is a DORK!

But we have this one small consolation:

No matter what horrible tragedy befalls our country or any other part of the world, we can count on a small measure of amusement from reading McCulloughs inevitable (and I do mean INEVITABLE) article blaming it all on Liberals.

Jessicalange
Actually the terrorist angle might play here. The perp was a foreigner that hated America and killed a lot of Americans. Could it be that all the other terrorists are just as loony as Cho?

Silly Lilly
Lilly puts together a list of questions that she thinks bolster her aversion to anyone on campus being armed. No matter what anyone says to people like Lilly, they will concoct an irrational argument that tries to justify innocents not having the means to defend themselves.


No one can claim that allowing legally armed people on campus will absolutely prevent a lunatic from attempting a massacre. However, there is no way that the Lillys of the world can guaranty that an armed potential victim will never be able to prevent an atrocity.


What I find so detestable about Lilly's position is that she seems not to really be concerned about the deaths. Her focus is on insisting that other human beings not have the ability to defend themselves with a firearm. I think that is the point Kevin was making. Lilly thinks that her silly ideology takes precedent over the POSSIBILITY that being armed might save lives. I think that is despicable.

One more thing liberals do
After reading McCullough's latest exercise in murky writing and bizarre arguments, I'm reminded of a very, very old book about "classic" StarTrek, in which a funny line appears. It originally applied to Klingons but someday McCullough will apply it to liberals, trust me. So here it goes in my new version:

"Liberals fart in airlocks."

Skip
Many people can not get past the emotional block that appears when guns are mentioned. I think we can fix things by re-naming guns. Maybe if we call them something else we can have a rational conversation.

spartacus
I'm thinking even further removed. How about doily? Or petunia?

Food
Must go eat ribs.
Goodnight

Flaming Liberal Multiculturalist..
..Stupid human being! You say.."No matter what horrible tragedy befalls our country or any other part of the world, we can count on a small measure of amusement" So very true, for Liberal
Moonbats like yourself! You and others like you will try use any tragedy to advance your sick beliefs!

The right to love a good massacre
VS. the right to sell a bad one.

As a Liberal, one must appreciate a good massacre once in a while. Like the last election for example, that is one massacre that was not only enjoyable to watch, but one we got to actually participate in. So what if some of us own guns, love meat and are personally pro-life. We have a right to vote for gun control and pro-choice issues. Gun Control laws do not keep weapons away from good people that wish to purchase them. Gun Control Laws clamp down on the sale of weapons and ordinance through unsecure channels such as a popular online auction site.
Some of us fully respect a rural redneck's right to shoot guns in the middle of nowhere. The square mile concentration of weapons and idiots are lower in the more rural areas.
Unfortuntely not everyone lives in the hills and kids like computers. The recent gun massacre was purchased via the internet. Is the banning of non-antique weapons sales over the internet an amicable solution? If a redneck really needs bullets he just gets them at the gun store they don't give a hoot about purchasing on the internet, unless of coarse, they are geek rednecks, also known as neocons.

I had my suspicions...
But now I know this is nothing but a parody site.
Great work!!

T. Tom Sawyer

I assume, at least for the moment unless I hear otherwise from you, that you are a Blue State liberal.

As I read your post, I am upset with the way you dishonor your fellow Americans.

A couple of "rednecks" I value very much are Sgt. Alvin York and Audie Murphy.

Sgt. York was from Tennessee (Al Gore's home State) and pondered long and hard about joining the Army in WW I. He was a very devout man and made his decision to put on a military uniform only after careful deliberation. His distinguished military career is a matter of public record.

Audie Murphy was the son of a poor Texas family. He went on to be the most decorated soldier in the WW II. His distinguished military career is also a matter of public record.

I am extremely thankful for men like them who are willing to give their lives for this country. Those two men were fortunate to return from their engagements to serve as an inspiration for the rest of us. We can not express our gratitude to them for their heroism enough.

Both of these men had something in common before they enlisted in military service. They both knew quite a bit about firearms. Perhaps that is one of the reasons they were able survive their wartime conflicts while others did not.

The weapons they used in those wars were not developed by either Republicans or Democrats. They became a reality in the world and it was to either learn to use them or be subjugated by them.

Are you upset because our country has more and better ones than our enemies and that many of our citizens understand the value of using them to maintain our freedom (which you also enjoy)?

If it becomes necessary to use weapons, you just can't line up a bunch of guys, show them which end is which, point out the direction they are to be fired and expect to have any reasonable degree of success.

For your information, the murder rates per 100,000 residents in counties won in the 2000 election by Gore was 13.2. In the counties won by Bush was 2.1. Those statistics were compiled by Professor Joseph Olson of Hemline University School of Law, St. Paul, Minnesota.

I think you owe the "rednecks" of American an apology.

Hey, Tom Sawyer
Got the web site addresses of those on-line places where you can buy guns?

My arsenal's running a tad low.

Make Mine Paisley, She Said..
aspacia wrote:

"What?
Abortion laws are "about control"?

Let me guess:

Granny dress, Lennon glasses, unshaved legs, earth shoes, long braided hair, tie-dyed vest."


Not actually the fashion statements of the 1960's *I* alluded to in my earlier comments..

But given the *choice* between abortion and tanned leather..I think I'll take the leather..

(This above, of course, the basic liberal logic when faced with the stunning -and real- parallel between *real* massacres and 3 decades of the slaughtering of the innocents/abortion..)

Because you know my friends..

It's all about *you*..

And it's all about *the choices*..

Emm Hemmm

MrsV
Actually, I wrote that comment, not aspasia. I wrote it *to* aspacia in regard to her posit that abortion is all about the control of women.

Further, in reading your comment, it's absolutely beyond me to figure out your point.


MrsV
However, I think you're on my side!

LOL

Out Darned Rot..
jessicalange wrote:

"I doubt
...that there a single rightwinger alive who could honestly give credence this KMC rot."


Well hun, think again..

Is that what you call a plain spoken and clear display of honest analysis?

Is that what they are calling that today?

*rot*?

Or isn't that what the innards of a dead baby, stabbed several times in the head, because he or she is your inconvenience is called, when you know longer want to see him?

Isn't that what his poor victim's body is called as your "doctor" tosses him in a trash basket, and
*ahem* suctions you? Just to call it a day..

*Rot*..

Or maybe I am thinking of some other crime scene..

Like in a recent shooting in an American school setting..in the 20th, or 21st century..

So many lives full of potential..

So many senseless victims..

Who had no voice at all in dying when, and as, they did..

Never a real reason for why..

Carnage..

Refuse..

*Rot*

A parallel?

Perhaps?


No, just all a bunch of "rot"..

Out darned spot..

I mean rot..

The slightest similarity?


Couldn't be..




Hey Townhall Editors Lookie Here.. :^)
BrianR wrote:

"MrsV
Actually, I wrote that comment, not aspasia. I wrote it *to* aspacia in regard to her posit that abortion is all about the control of women.

Further, in reading your comment, it's absolutely beyond me to figure out your point."


I was making a joke about 60's fashion, Brian, and tying it in with the fact that liberals often have very rusty logic.

Given the "choice" of almost-any-other-choice and abortion, abortion is not one I would choose..

But, I believe, for liberals, these choices about life and death are, sometimes, as silly, fleeting, and arbitrary as some fashion statements.

I think their logic takes tangents that are based on a very personal kind of ethics, but it's skewed..

My allusion to 1960's fashion was referring to a comment I made about the contributions, or not, of the 1960's earlier. I think you saw that one, and yes, we agreed.

I was trying to be ironic in my post, I hope that it's clear.

As for the comment about "choices", advertisers have been using that old phrase, in making sales pitches, for years..

I find political inferences in selling items particularly cloying..

But-it seems we are in agreement twice..
As your quote I inadvertently quoted..would have been my same idea..

I guess I understood the spirit of the quote/quoter, if not following the connection there..

(I don't do that often, but it *is* well past a hundred posts now..here..)

That's right my friends, solid journalism here..

We're all for hire Townhall editors..

At a price :^)

MrsV: LOL
Got it!

Reply To jessicalange, Stick to B Films.
jessicalange wrote:

"trulib
You mean, like Timothy Veigh? Seems he was a Christian radical nutjob, no?"

Ok, so check me if I'm wrong..It's late in the day, and I'm tired here..

Is this jessicalange gal suggesting that Christians are to be considered "nutjobs", and then paralleling us, or connecting us, to true ill-people, and actual killers like Mr. McVeigh?

jessicalange, if this is so, you best stick to Hollywood, and making movies about crazed old-time actresses and dead country singers, 'cause honey you are aiming at the wrong people, and this duff logic is getting the best of you..

This is what liberals think of Christians, and killers, respectively, there you have it...For them we are the sum total of a Nancy Pelosi Jr. Production. And hence, their inability to aspire to any moral code, or sense of ethics...

As any real examination of the facts of God's Word, and what believers have to say, would entail reason, and sound thinking, sans stereotypes, lies, and closed eyes and ears to these things.

This would require them to distinguish between *true* criminals, and other people...

This would lead them to place blame where it *actually* belongs...

This would take them on an outstanding, and never ending, personal adventure of the soul, where they can, actually, take a look at *whattheheckisgoingoninthere*.

As it stands, the liberals place the Christian alongside terrorists, and bombers, and roadside killers...

Lies, and sick reasoning, of course...

But, look what they did to Jesus, and He was/is God...

And let us not forget, these are the same people who believe that they are related to monkeys, and
idolize nature, and favor the ideas of past lives, and the like, which entail smoking a cool peyote, and worshipping one's dog...

I will not labor the point, by suggesting they are made in its image... (Dog, not dope...)

One will never get to truth if they keep slaughtering the truth-bearers jessicalange...

Lying is a terrible sin, while were on it, so is slander...

You shouldn't do it...

It's late...

I'm out of here...

Game, fold...





Mr Buck
Mr. Buck:

"In Switzerland, apparently, the populace can be armed and they don't kill each other.
In America it's just the opposite. Are you now proposing that Europe and America have the same values and behaviors? "

How did you manage to turn Switzerland into Europe? How does....no second thoughts, forget it.



TruLib
You said: "...it is obvious there can never be a situation where the responsible use of force can be justified."

Uh huh. We should all just allow a killer to kill us and/or our families.

Hint: Firearms are great crook-removers.

MrsV
"These Are The Dying Dyers..
And that's about it for the dying dyers and the deadly talk they talk of, and the deadly things they do.. "

??? Hey. Is that hate speech?

:-)

For BrianR: I don't know where you live in the Golden State, but there are a whole bunch of American flags down here.

Of course, Riverside County is about the reddest one in the state.

Labels
I wish you people would get it right. Extreme left wingers are communists. Extreme right wingers are fascists. Get it? You can call us liberals communists, not fascists. You are the fascists.

Feminists Condone Lies
The false allegations of rape that damaged the lives of 46 members of the Duke Lacrosse Team, nearly sent three to prison for thirty years each, and cost families many millions of dollars in legal fees was not a one-of-a-kind aberration of justice. Other infamous cases involving well-known individuals such as Kobe Bryant[1], John Fund[2], and CNN’s Tucker Carlson[3] provide additional public evidence that false rape allegations are a major public problem – one where the perpetrator is rarely punished.

While researchers and prosecutors do not agree on the percentage of false allegations, the consensus is that approximately 40% to 50% of charges are clearly false. This number does not include unresolved allegations held “in limbo” where evidence is too weak to try the case even under shield laws, relaxed rules, and comparatively weak evidentiary standards applied to rape cases:

* A survey of all the forcible rape complaints during a three-year period at two large Midwestern state universities found that 50 percent of the accusations were false.[4]
* In a nine-year study of all resolved rape cases in a Midwestern U.S. city of 70,000, the accusers recanted their charges 41 percent of the time. The 41 percent figure does not include the other accusations that the police department recorded as unfounded, for which there was insufficient evidence to establish the assault.[5]
* According to a report of the Defense Department Inspector General released in 2005, approximately 73% of women and 72% of men at the military service academies believe that false accusations of sexual assault are a problem.[6]
* Linda Fairstein, former head of the New York County District Attorney’s Sex Crimes Unit, noted, “There are about 4,000 reports of rape each year in Manhattan. Of these, about half simply did not happen. ... It’s my job to bring justice to the man who has been falsely accused by a woman who has a grudge against him, just as it’s my job to prosecute the real thing.”[7]

The culture of false allegations of violence bears unacceptably high costs. Families and innocent lives are destroyed by our wasted tax dollars, while real cases go ignored or unprosecuted. Judges and juries are fooled and make bad decisions.


1 Kobe Bryant, Rape Shield Laws, and the False Accusations Problem; http://www.hisside.com/3_21_04.htm

2 False Rape Charges Hurt Real Victims, http://www.equityfeminism.com/archives/years/2003/000062.html

3 Tucker Carlson and False Rape Allegations; http://www.equityfeminism.com/archives/years/2003/000062.html

4 Kanin, Eugene J., Ph.D. "False Rape Allegations." Archives of Sexual Behavior, Vol. 23, No. 1 (1994), pp 81-92.; http://www.anandaanswers.com/pages/naaFalse.html

5 Ibid., (4)

6 Sex, Lies, and Rape, Center For Military Readiness; http://www.cmrlink.org/social.asp?DocID=276

7 Fairstein L. Sexual Violence: Our War Against Rape. William Morrow & Company, 1993.

R.A.D.A.R

Its all the same
Liberals embrace violent massacre the same way Kevin and GOP/religious right embrace Rev. Phelps and his message at funeral sites during recent tragedies.


Lilly
So, no one was ever killed prior to the introduction of gunpowder? That seems to be the liberal position, if guns just disappeared all violence would cease.

hate to tell you, but when he wants to kill someone, man will find a way to do it. Whether you ban guns or not, murder will exist.

On the other hand, without guns, the strong (and males) have a huge advantage over women, the disabled, the young, and the old. Guns allow the less strong to having a fighting chance. ban all guns and violent conflicts will always go to the strong, or to those who have illegal guns.

Why do you want to see us return to a "rulle of might" existence, rather than allowing citizens guns that level the playing field and allow less strong citizens to defend themselves against aggressive brutes?

Seems you libs should be all for guns, as they most benefit the groups you supposedly love (women, children, elderly, disabled). Well, they do harm your criminal constituency, so maybe that is it...

Lilly
You seem to believe that by disarming the public, there will be no more murders. In your mind, government and law enforcement should be the only ones allowed to possess arms. Others have overwhelming supported your cause. Governments such as Red China and Nazi Germany. We know how that worked, don't we?

The biggest mass murderers in history have always been governments. Which, by the way, is why our Founding Fathers wrote the 2nd amendment, by the way.

Mr Buck(edup)
Normally, you and several of the libtards have no coherant comment to respond to, but this one drew a response: Your Question:

"What do you think would happen if a gun ban were imposed here in the states?? "

I would not recommend it. The response may be a little worse than you imagine. There are far more legally owned and carried firearms than you imagine - trying to put all of us at the mercy of the goblins who break the law would draw a rather firm reaction.

Reply To Goshawk
Who Writes:

".Stupid human being! You say.."No matter what horrible tragedy befalls our country or any other part of the world, we can count on a small measure of amusement" So very true, for Liberal
Moonbats like yourself! You and others like you will try use any tragedy to advance your sick beliefs!"

It also seems we can count on the inability of Rightwing zealots to read even short postings all the way to the end. Please check out my original post Goshawk, it's only 2 or 3 sentences. Maybe take a beer break after the 1st.

Nope
ken writes: Monday, April, 23, 2007 11:25 AM

"Labels
I wish you people would get it right. Extreme left wingers are communists. Extreme right wingers are fascists. Get it? You can call us liberals communists, not fascists. You are the fascists."

Fascists are leftwingers, too. Anybody wanting state control is a left-winger.

Also, I flagged your post as offensive because you used the racist term "you people".



Hmmm.
The article was just as much about Partial Birth Murder, but the libs seem to miss that.

Mentioning "gun" is like putting cheese on the liberal mouse trap. Oh, Dear! Where DO they all come from?

You don't believe me? Watch...

bushcheneyhalliburtoncoulterrighttowork.50cal




Hmmm, I wonder if I can get .50cal as a domain:

http://www.packing.50cal

Sonny
Thanks for your input. The comment I made had nothing to do with insulting rednecks or Sgt. Alvin York, but I like how you equate your argument. You say the nation is at war. Declare it.

Stupid Unethical Liberals
I'm not surprised by the candidates behavior. In fact I have come to expect it. Liberals candidates have always acted in a disgraceful manner when politics are involved. Look at their digraceful behavior at the funeral of the senator from Minnesota turning the funeral into a campain stop during the last election. There is no level they won't stoop to. What is amazing is that 50% of our country is stupid enough to vote for them.

Once again..
Once again another great article..Thank you for exposing the truth.
God bless you

a comparison
"We just have to deny him access to legal weaponry and we'll have no problems with him" Am I talking about Cho, Hitler, Bin Ladin, or Saddam?

"He's done nothing I know of to harm us, therefore we have no reason to take action against him. We'll just watch him and act if he does something bad to us." am I paraphrasing Clinton on Bin Ladin, or Liberals on Cho and Saddam (falsely in Saddam's case)?

"Precautionary steps have to be taken when dealing with the mentally disturbed. We must ensure that they cannot harm others." Am I paraphrasing gliberals on Cho, or conservatives on the homeless?

Isn't it wonderful how history repeats itself?

Goshawk repeats to ....
... religiouslib (Wow -- a one word oxymoron meaning "a more moron friendly manifestation of Marxism pretending to faith in God!") that the author is nothing but a hater of totalitarian socialists -- and contends that that don't make him all bad -- but rather a man after Goshawk's own heart!

Not "all bad?"

How does "does make him all Good," sound?

And a man after my own heart, too.

My god...
This is one reason I hate you, you spread ridiculous, insane even, lies about liberals to a public that doesn't know any better. You're like a bully. Stop victimizing them and making them out as something they're simply not.
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