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Sunday, December 16, 2007
Ken Connor :: Townhall.com Columnist
Huck Finned by USA Today
by Ken Connor
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In his newfound role as "front-runner", Republican Presidential candidate Mike Huckabee is the subject of increased scrutiny by the media. For many in the secular media, Huckabee's prior role as a minister is of far greater concern than his prior role as governor of the State of Arkansas. (A preacher as President? Heaven help us!) Consequently, Huckabee has been the candidate among the Republican wannabes who has had to field most of the tough "God questions" during their debates.

Without a doubt, the intersection of faith and politics is one that requires careful navigation. This is particularly true in America, where our founding fathers worked hard to ensure that religious freedom was preserved for their descendants. For many, religious liberty is the "first right" and liberty of conscience has always been highly prized in these United States. The Framers of the Constitution refused to establish a national church. Conscience was deemed to be a private domain where government had no right to intrude.

The secularists among today's media elites seem to think that candidates for office who profess fervent religious faith are incapable of playing by the rules set by the Constitution. Their index of suspicion for candidates like Huckabee—a man who has vigorously and publicly professed his faith—is much higher than for those candidates whose faith has been a "private matter" or non-existent. A recent editorial by USA Today entitled "Huckabee's Challenge" is a case in point. In their analysis of Huckabee's candidacy, the paper's editors raise "concerns in several areas", including his failure to declare whether Mormons are Christians, his disavowal of evolution, and the particulars of his intention to take the nation back for Christ. In their registration of these concerns, the editors demonstrate a poor understanding of the tenets of the Christian religion and of the Constitution.

The editors express concern that Huckabee's "equivocation about whether Mormons are Christians" creates questions about his "acceptance" of others' beliefs. They imply that Huckabee's failure to declare Mormons to be "Christians" also creates doubt about his understanding about the separation of church and state. Such criticisms are nothing short of muddleheaded. If the First Amendment means anything, it means that neither Mike Huckabee, nor anyone else, is required to "accept" anyone else's religious beliefs. That's part of the beauty of our Constitution. We are not required to accept any religious belief and we are free to reject them all.

Nonetheless, presidential candidates are running for Commander in Chief, not chief theologian. Whether a particular denomination falls within the orbit of the Christian faith is not within the ambit of a president's authority and, if he were to make such an official proclamation, religious and irreligious alike should be indignant.

Of course, there are profound differences between what historic Christianity and Mormonism have taught about the nature of God, the means of salvation, the virgin birth and the scope of the Scriptures; but, the resolution of these theological tensions is not to be sorted out by anyone in his or her capacity as a representative of the United States government. Therefore, Huckabee got it right when he declared, "I'm just not going to go off into evaluating other people's doctrines and faiths. I think that is absolutely not a role for a president."

USA Today sees a red flag in Huckabee's call for "taking back the nation for Christ" in 1998, but what they fail to point out is that Huckabee was speaking to a pastor's conference about the goals of the church, not government. Huckabee's comments had nothing to do with imposing religion by governmental decree, and the editors were duplicitous in implying otherwise. Although the secularists on USA Today's editorial board may not like it, in America the Christian church is free to compete for every single soul in the country—as is every other religion.

Finally, USA Today cites Huckabee's disavowal of evolution as a sign that he is blatantly anti-science, but Huckabee's statement is anything but anti-science. He stated, "I believe there is a God who was very active in the creation process. Now how did he do it, and when did he do it, and how long did he take? I don't honestly know and I don't think that knowing that would make me a better or worse president…. [Y]ou know, if anybody wants to believe that they are descendants of a primate, they are certainly welcome to do it…but I believe that all of us in this room are the unique creations of a God who knows us and loves us and who created us for his own purpose." Huckabee's unpardonable sin was not that he is anti-science, but rather that he affirmed the Creator's role in our creation—a view held by Americans like Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, and other signers of the Declaration of Independence.

Christianity is not antithetical to science. Throughout centuries, it was Christians who advanced the cause of science. Copernicus, Kepler, Galileo, Newton, Boyle, and Pascal, among others, were all Christians. This connection between faith and science was based upon Christianity's belief in a God who gave order and meaning to the world. Christians believed that God's consistent nature produced consistent laws by which the world operated; laws which could be studied and applied. This is why theology came to be known as the "queen of the sciences." From this basic investigation of God's nature and his creation came the vast body of knowledge we now call "science."

USA Today's editorial reveals more about the editors than it does Mike Huckabee. Their piece demonstrates a profound ignorance of Christianity and the Constitution. They prefer fear-mongering to a careful dissection of the facts. Regardless of what one thinks of Mike Huckabee, one can only hope that the editors will endeavor to remove the log from their own eyes before trying to remove the speck from someone else's.

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About The Author
Ken Connor is Chairman of the Center for a Just Society in Washington, DC.
 
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Lilly, all more formal education means
is more years of being exposed to propaganda of the educational system. Not necessarily a good thing! For an intelligent person sitting through high school is insufferable enough 'education' experience without having to deal with going to law school on top of it! Why trust a lawyer with being President? Wouldn't they have an interest in making more laws to obtain more business once they weren't in politics anymore? There's an MD running who might be able to undo some of the damage the lawyers have done to this country. I guess I'll just have to cast my vote for him...

A true conservative
is Fred Thompson. He was endorsed today by Rep Stephen King of Iowa. Stephen King is one who has fought against illegal immigration, and has been trying to free Ramos and Compean. He has the endorsement of the National Right To Life.
But he is getting no coverage on this. Michelle Malkin has a report on it.
Phyllis Schlafly of Eagle Forum has reported on what a bad governor Huckabee was. So has Michelle Malkin. Rush Limbaugh says that Huckabee isn't a real conservative, but says Fred Thompson is.
I am not fighting Huckabee for any reason other than I know he will be a terrible president. I know what he is.I , as I said lived in Arkansas, I have family in Arkansas. I live about 20 or 25 miles out of Arkansas, in Oklahoma now, so all my local news comes from Arkansas.
Huckabee stood behind Bush on the Amnesty program. He stood with Tyson Foods and bragged that Tyson employed 40,000 illegal aliens.
He is a liberal democrat posing as a conservative Republican.

huckabee a non-starter
I can't support Huckabee after reading his record commuting sentences for violent criminals, many of whom went on to commit additional violent crimes. I can vote for a democrat if I want that nonsense. Also, he's weak on stopping illegal immigration/invasion. I vote for the platform, not the personality, and this guy is scary. I'm a conservative, being religious is not enough to get my vote. This guy looks and smells like a liberal.

Tadpole
As a Debate judge, I just named you the winner. Excellent!

As a voter, I'm still jes' tryin' to figger it out fo'ks, so don' jump all over me. I jes' 'preciate Tadpole's point.

Which is--for all the candidates--rhetoric will lead you to the worst-case scenario. You gotta look at the more likely path. For Huck, find examples where he turned Arkansas into a theocracy. Are there any? (I don't know. But if what some of you say is true, there must be!)

Finally!
An article by someone that isn't in bed with McRomney. Mitt supercedes even John Francois Kerry when it comes to flips and flops and all the TH contributors are just jumping up and down to slander his greatest threat, Huck. I am not a Huck fan at this point, but if it were between Huck and Mitt, well Huck wins hands down.

You guys
can push this phoney "preacher" till the cows come home if you want a new Jimmy Carter, or Bill Clinton in office, then I will never convence you. You are so tied up on his being a Christian, you can't accept, or even see what he really is.
He says what the gullible want to hear, and instead of looking into his background, you squeel with delight and follow.
He is no Conservative. He raised taxes in Arkansas more than any other governor. He left the small state of Arkansas almost a billion dollars in debt, the Republican party in shambles, the Conservative base wrecked. He was totally in agreement with president Bush on the amnesty program, and gave the illegals in his state welfare, food stamps,and medicaid. He tried for college scholarships but lost that push, and called those who voted against it "racists and bigots". He stopped them from checking people as to their citizenship, even for voting!!He went to Mexico to visit Vicente Fox, and asked him to set up a Mexican consulaate in Arkansas, which he did, and Huckabee rented a gov. office to Mexico for 1.00 per year!!
There is so much I would have to write it in installments. I lived in Arkansas, and I know what a phoney he is. this man is dangerous, and will ruin us.

Why Huckabee will be president!
Huckabee is the best candidate to win the general election. The leftist media's strategy of making Christians seem like simpleton's will backfire tremendously and guarantee a victory for Huckabee. The leftist media seems to think insulting the VAST MAJORITY of this country is a good idea. Combine that with the dems running a candidate who is completely corrupt and un-truthful will guarantee Huckabee the presidency.

NO PREACHER IN CHIEF NEEDED
Evangelicals / Fundamentalists, have driven the Independent Conservatives (who are pro life) out of the party:

After
Reagan
Bush I
Bush II

we still have LEGAL abortions: Pro illegal Aliens: and LESS rights:

Huckabee is a proven PRO ILLEGALS
PRO criminals
PRO taxes
HE like other Fundamentalists are Bigots
like Jimmy Swaggart, Jimmy Baker and other fallen Preachers they have have NO ETHICS: they like every liberal have an excuse for having their hands in the pockets of influence:
they always have an excuse for criminals:

WE NEED:::: ENFORCE AND REFORM in this country
in a big hurry;

RON PAUL is un American
Ron Paul, who is PRO terrorists/ Anti America
and blames the USA for every negative event
in the WORLD and in History even before
the USA was a country

NEEDS to go run for President of a terrorist
nation: He is the least qualified to lead
this once great nation:

On inflating misinformation
Some of our comments are, I believe, shall we say, just a little bit tilted.

Like the one about Huckabee's lack of higher education: How many of the smart people on this forum received their Batchelor's Degree in 2 1/2 years? I have a Master's Degree but I still didn't do my Batchelor's in 2 1/2 years.

"He has always been for high taxes." I have heard the charge that he raised taxes by $500 million net while governor of Arkansas. Except the part they don't tell you is that 80% of that was a court ordered requirement to fix Arkansas' school system. $100 million of it was, I believe, for fixing of Arkansas roads at the time. Have you driven on Arkansas roads of about that time? Parts of the interstate between Little Rock and the Texas state line would shake your car to pieces. Everybody tried to drive in the left lane because it was so bad. I have been over that road both before and after it was fixed.

"He has always pushed for amnesty for illegals..." A small overstatement maybe? I believe the facts would show that the main emphasis was on education for the children of illegals. If you are opposed to that fine, but let's not inflate or distort our arguments.

He Gets an F on illegal Aliens / taxes
Huck, who is running for PREACHER IN CHIEF
is a Liberal in a preacher's cloak

Illegals devastate this nation every day and will eventually destroy it: THAT is forever;

the Iraq war is a point in time as were all other wars.

Huckabee is PRO give illegals benefits he refuses to give to our military; He is soft on the illegal invasion of our country:
He needs to go run for President of Mexico:
He is PRO criminals
HE has taxed every single item and service in his view: HOW IS THAT conservative:

His state has failed miserably in education
His ethics are very questionable
He sounds like another Swaggart and Jimmy Baker
Preaching while doing crime:


For Crying Out Loud...
Huckabee was a state governor for 10-1/2 years!

Why is everybody so hung up on his time as a pastor?

You need to check out the theocracy Gov Huckabee built in Arkansas. What? He didn't??!!! Oh...

Nanna/ Harry/ BG
Nanna,
You need to do more research and quit spewing anti-Huckabee talking points. So what if there was a Wedding Registry? That doesn't force anyone to buy them anything. Is it possible that the registry was put together by Mrs. Huckabee's friends?

Harry,
Excellent point - the media can't say bad things about Iraq right now so they stir up a religious battle between Huckabee and Romney.

BG,
The fact that you posted multiple successive times (again) underscores the panic you are feeling. A little intellectual honesty on your part would be appreciated - you know that Huckabee's comments about taking back America for Christ was in front of a bunch of pastors.

Thanks Ken
I believe you nailed it.

Failing the religious test?
Funny that the US Constitutions prohibition of a religious test to hold public office seems to protect everyone except practicing Christians.

About USAYesteryear
O'Connor writes "USA Today sees a red flag in Huckabee's call for 'taking back the nation for Christ' in 1998, but what they fail to point out is that Huckabee was speaking to a pastor's conference about the goals of the church, not government".

That they comment about a speech he made NINE YEARS AGO says plenty.

For BG: based on his record in Taxachussets, I am still leary of Romney.

Bot
You are so right about Huckabee. Also, upon leaving office he registered at a wedding registry, to furnish his new mansion.
---------------------------------------------

Fred Thompson is a truly Conservative. He always has been. He has voted that way constantly.
He is very knowledgeable. as he was on the House Foreign Relations committee, and has delt with these foreign leaders.
He has a great illegal immigration plan to get them out of the United States, and building the fence.
He is against abortion, though he feels Roe V Wade should be overturned, he feels that the states should be able to write their own laws, which they can't do right now. The "National Right to Life" has endorsed him as has another Right to Life movement.
He believes in trade with other countries, But FAIR TRADE,, no trade with a loss for us. No more cheating from China, and any country.
He is a constitutionalist.
He is a Christian, A member of the Church of Christ.(NOT the United Church of Christ)
An honest, honorable man, that will have my vote!!

The whole
issue of religion in the current presidential "wannabe" world began, fueled and perpetuated by a liberal press. Did candidates start the religion issue? I don't think so, it's the left leaning press and they want to keep it going.

I've heard both Romney and Huckabee say that a person's religion would have no effect on their vote for a presidential candidate.

Does Obama, Hillary, or any of the other candidates get lambasted as does Romney and Huckabee? Of course not, the liberal media only focus on those that threaten the left's anti-America bias.....say something about Obams's Muslim education and it's off limits....matter of fact is Obama's religious background getting any scrutiny at all?? Of course not.......

It's the media that's the enemy, always trying to deceive, destort, deny, and betray America.

Huckabee is no Conservative
Mike Huckabee was regarded by fellow Republican governors as a compulsive tax increaser and spender. He increased the Arkansas tax burden by 47 percent, boosting the levies on gasoline and cigarettes. The Arkansas Leader.com editorialized that Mike Huckabee raised more taxes in 10 years in office than Bill Clinton did in his 12 years.

The Arkansas Ethics Commission held proceedings 20 times on the former governor. During his tenure, Huckabee accepted 314 gifts valued overall at more than $150,000, according to documents filed with the Arkansas secretary of state's office. (He accepted 187 gifts in his first three years as governor but was not required to report their value.)


Two months after taking office, Huckabee stunned the state by saying he questioned rapist Wayne DuMond's guilt and that it was his intention to free the rapist, DuMond murdered a women in Illinois after Huckabee set him free

Huckabee battled conservatives within his own party who were pushing for stricter state-level immigration measures, such as:.
- proof of legal status when applying for state services that aren’t federally mandated
- proof of citizenship when registering to vote
- Huckabee failed in his effort to make children of illegal immigrants eligible for state-funded scholarships and in-state tuition to Arkansas colleges.
In a1992 :U.S. Senate race, Huck advocated quarantining AIDS patients, and cutting AIDS research.
Does Huckabee subscribe to his spiritual advisor Timothy LaHay’s views of the Rapture, United Nations, and a Palestinian state?” Huck’s use of the “Christian Leader” title and his attempt to denigrate Mitt Romney’s religion is a thinly-veiled attempt to impose a religious test in violation of Article Six of the Constitution.

Mike fails on so many levels as a true conservative.

God Help the USA
Huckabee is a danger because he appears to be at his core a person driven by other's acceptance; he doesn't only want, but NEEDS to be liked.
Hillary Clinton is on the other hand totally slef-absorbed and could give a shat at her core what others think about her; she'll do it her way, thank you. This is just as dangerous (ref: Nixon).
Obama is a neophite and appears to be a bumbling one at that; not what this nation, or the world, needs to face the times we are living.
Rudy and Mitt will say and/or do anything to get elected; there's just no honesty about these two (ref: Nixon, AGAIN).
McCain is too old and set in his ways (he has a short fuse to his temper as well), especially when it comes to the questions surrounding immigration/border security and the defense of the USA where it REALLY matters most, at home.
The best hopes for America and the free world are in the much ignored "second tier"; Duncan Hunter, as man of great knowledge and expansive service, comes to mind.
I hope that both national conventions end up being "brokered" with "dark horses" running on each respective Presidential ticket!

Huckabee, Mitt, Religion
Forget the religion and I'm a practicing Southern Baptist. Mike Huckabee is nothing more than another Jimmy Carter and if we nominate him we are begging for defeat. If, by some chance he wins, he will be as inept as Carter.

Mitt Romney is a slick candidate who will say whatever is convenient to win the nomination. I give him the fact he is a good businessman, but I think he's a bit too liberal for the Republicans.

Same goes for Rudy, but I'm leaning toward him because he at least understands what's at stake in Iraq and with the Islamofascists.

Self-Evident Truth Or Irrelevant Opinion
John Acton writes:
Sunday, December, 16, 2007 5:24 PM
Re: Government is for the Irreligious
---
A Spicy Comment:
I have never met a non-religious person among the atheists. They only claim that they do not believe in God. The secularist religion is one such example which sponsors every brand of morals, superstitions or beliefs that the mind can conceive.

"And this, from Thomas Jefferson:"

'No nation has ever yet existed or been governed without religion. Nor can be. The Christian religion is the best religion that has ever been given to man, and I as chief Magistrate of this nation am bound to give it the sanction of my example.'

"Benjamin Rush observed:"

'I have always considered Christianity as the strong ground of republicanism.'

"And John Jay declared:"

'No human society has ever been able to maintain both order and freedom, both cohesiveness and liberty apart from the moral precepts of the Christian religion…. Should our Republic ever forget this fundamental precept of governance…this great experiment will then surely be doomed.'

"We have many doubters among us today who deny this “fundamental precept of governance”— at great risk to their own nation’s experiment in freedom."

Why Religious Values Support American Values

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Religion/hl899.cfm

Elitist MSM and Neocon/Jacobins
Ron Paul supporters wouldn't have to spend so damned much time promoting his platform on the internet and in the streets if the mainstream media would just treat all candidates the same and give equal time to all. It's sad, but here I am, helping do the medias job for them

MSM AND NEOCON LOVEFEST WITH HUCKABEE
Oh! THOSE PESKY PAULITES WILL JUST NOT STOP WILL THEY???? Folks, CONSTITUTIONALISTS will not sit idly by while these imposters try to ram LIBERALS down our throat.

Sure, they have come up with the TOP TIER CANDIDATES and the SECOND TIER CANDIDATES based on their poll. First they subsidized Fred Thompson with endless Media Coverage to give him name recognition and now they are in love with Mike Huckabee and have had a love affair with him while subsidizing him with endless free media coverage although he has not even raised more than 500 million dollars.

They have ignored and rarely even talk about Tancredo, Paul or Hunter and expect the American people to just sit idly by while they dictate who they should and should not vote for. The American people can see through it all and know this whole thing is a SHAM !! JUST LIKE MOST OF THE EL TORRO POOH POOH WE READ ON TOWNHALL.COM by mostly NEOCON/JACOBIN CONSERVATIVE IMPOSTERS!
GET REAL!!

None of their polls mean anything to us because they are just like opinions and we all know that everyone has one of those too. Ron Paul is the 6 million dollar man tonight. He raises his money honestly and does not take any government or MSM media subsidy handouts like all of the rest. The Ron Paul train started out with I think I can and has since chugged along with I know I can. Well, I know he can too!! Go Ron Paul!!!

Old Last Place Fred.
Nobody wants old last place Fred. Why is he doing so poorly? Fred was doing better before he starting running. Man, I don't think I've ever seen such an over-rated cannidated, unless Giuliani turns out to do poorly also, which hopefully he will.

I for one am a TN resident who will not be voting for Fred. First off there are more conservative cannidates. Also he seems to have about the same chances of winning as McCain, actually probably quite a bit less. I don't think McCain is a likely winner, and with Fred being even less likely, I really think his chances are gone.

Mike Huckabee is a true conservative for the common everyday man, and is not some hollywood actor or celebrety.

Con4Fred.
I live in TN and don't want Fred. Not over Huckabee.

As far as calling him a RINO, that is just sad that you would be so foolish and spiteful. I guess your idea of a RINO is someone who is pro-life, pro-faith and pro-family.

If you will not vote for him then fine. Have it your way. It will not change the fact that Fred Thompson has no chance to win. None. Fred has gone down hill ever since he started to run for President and continues to go down.

You spiteful people who refuse to vote for anyone but your own cannidate are very unfortunate. There is only one GOP cannidate I have said I would never vote for and that is Giuliani. Others I would have to consider. But Huckabee is my choice, and I like Tancredo and Hunter also.

tnboy
Huckabee would lose the general by a huge margin.

It's darn near impossible to win POTUS if you don't pick up major support from the middle and Huckabee won't get many of those votes for the reasons that Huck thinks he's electable. In general people can take a man of faith, but it will be a very hard sell if that man is an ordained Minister. Then you have to figure real Conservatives like myself that won't vote for him. I have no problem with him being a preacher, but I do have a major problem with him being a RINO! Even his own states GOP want Fred over Huck, that should tell you something.

Huck Finned by USA Today
Mr. Connor conveniently omitted the fact that Huckaberry LIED ABOUT HAVING A DIVINITY DEGREE.

He is a disgrace to ministers everywhere.

Illegal alien hugger to boot.

Scrooge.
I saw a Christmas Carol play the other day, and the story of Scrooge kind of made me think of the way that so many of the fake conservatives are talking and acting. They have abandoned the noble pro-life cause, they have gone soft on the issues of the family and pro-family causes, and it seems they have been taking up a greed is good mentality.

I hope and pray that they turn their lives around like Scrooge did in a Christmas Carol.

Huckabee is the strongest cannidate.
All of these fools who are saying that the MSM wants Huckabee to win because he would be the weakest cannidate are either utterly against any cannidate other than their own, or they are people who do not think for themselves and they let the MSM think for them. It is your fake conservatives that have been saying this. Wake up people.

Think people. Please think.

They are the same people who have been saying that Huckabee would not win anything, then when he was doing well in Iowa they said that he may seem to be doing good but he has no chance of winning, then when his chances got a lot better and he became strongly favored they said that he would win nothing but Iowa if he did when, and Huckabee keeps proving them wrong.

Think People. Please think.

If a cannidate can overcome the odds and can do that well, then don't you think that such a cannidate is the strongest cannidate? Ofcourse he is.

We need Huckabee.
If you want a president that will be pro-life and stand up for you against the oppression of the militant homosexual agenda to force their sexuality in your face then you have three choices for President. It is either Huckabee, Tancredo, or Hunter. Thats it folks. There may be others that are somewhat conservative, but none of them other than the three I listed see the militant homosexual agenda as an important issue, and none of them support a marriage amendment. Because of the alliance of liberal democrats and liberal or moderate republicans, California starting in January will now have gender based off of feelings, rather than biology. This means your children are going to live in a world where boys will be on the girls basket ball them, be a cheerleader(in the girls uniform) and be homecoming queen. And that is not all. Starting at that same time, children will not longer be able to refer to their parents as mother and father. That is simply too offensive. And don't think that this is the end of the line. It will go futher and futher. There has already been gay marriage legalized in America in the Northeast. Which has grown and expanded to New Jersey and is still spreading. So if you continue to speak against Huckabee, just remember that you must be a very pro-homosexual person, as well as someone who doesn't care some much about the abortion issue. I am telling you that if you do not acknowledge that these issues are the most important issues we face today, then just give it some time. More and more you will begin to see.

OT
And to everyone else, sorry for straying so far off topic. Just can't stand leaving a direct question without a reply.


Nanna
I understand your confusion. My wife is a nurse, and when she starts spouting health care jargon, I am completely lost. I guess it is a hazard for any jargon-laden profession, you end up speaking a language no one else can understand.

Basically, I used to work for a company that provided web server computers for people who did not want to run their own machines. They also rented out machines to other companies who then sold space on those machines to others who wanted to host websites.

The PHPbb program which TNhillbilly is using for the forum was running on a number of those computers and, due to technical problems with the PHP programming language (as well as some bad programming in PHPbb), hackers could (in the worst case) use the program to gain control of the machine.

Actually, my experiences with PHPbb and a few other bits of software made me so leery of using PHP that I forbid developers from installing it on the machines I run now. Has caused a few arguments with the developers but it has kept us from having a lot of security problems.

(For those who are more computer savvy, I think my main worry is using a language that can't distinguish between a local file and a remote website. It just opens up all sorts of exploits more traditional languages would not. There are dozens of Romanian - pain.ro, puppy.ro, etc -- servers that seem to exist solely to provide PHP exploit scripts for hackers. Not to mention the ability to override variables by passing values in cookies or in the GET/POST line.)

Chew on this awhile.
__When I here the secularist left say the founding fathers did not want recognition of religion in government, I always like to give them this. Article 3 of the Northwest Ordinance 1787,
------------------------------------------
__"Religion, morality, and knowledge, being necessary to good government and the happiness of mankind, schools and the means of education shall forever be encouraged." Congress, at the time, recognized the quality of leadership this would provide a nation, our society. For the tenents of religious doctrine, practice, were reflected in the Constitution, and Republic rule. While the tenents of the secular, progressive liberal theory are of speculation, without ant proven results. Even the things they claim to have fixed and be the only individual power to do so, is hollow. For the American people, and their personal efforts, have addressed, and fixed problems this nation faced. The left has done nothing but profit from liberal legislation created during turbulence, and continued by lack of proven results.

Re: Do we really need another actor?
"Fred Thompson Also would make an excellent president."

Actually, I am lending towards Fred Thompson myself (if Alan Keyes isn't on the Florida Primary Ballot). His only "major sin" I can see is supporting McCain/Feingold's "Incumbent Security Act) - a mighty big sin for someone who purports to be a Constitutional Lawyer, IMMHO. The other fault is lack of enthusiasm for curtailing John Edwards' "extortion racket", aka the Tort Trial Lawyers license to steal and raise health care costs, etc.

Re: RINOs have always been around
"Since Reagan has left office, the Republican party has been inundated with RINO's."

Most of the Senate RINOs preceded Reagan, as do many in the House.

Some in the House that were originally part of he "Gingrich Revolution", caught "Potomac Fever" and became big spending RINOs. Some, but not all, paid the price in 2006.

Andrews, Nanna
Andrews, thanks for the heads-up. I'm running the latest version as of a week ago (also PHP and MSSql) but I do realize that no large program is secure.

I haven't even looked over the code yet, but thanks to you I will start looking at it. I'll watch carefully for the things you describe.

Nanna, he was referring to a Forum program I just started using. There have been, and will always be, security vulnerabilities in it and he advised me to examine it carefully.

Everyone: I'm sorry for the off-topic messages and will not do it again.

Re: Rudy loses the General Election
"BACK NY or NJ or PA and most of N. Eng. WERE ALL Dem. in the last elections. NJ hasn't voted Rep. since Reagan. But Giuliani has tremendous support in NJ, and we have signigicant electoral votes."

NO Republican Presidential candidate has won the General Election without NRA backing since "Tricky Dick".

Proof: George the First won the Presidency in 1988 with huge NRA support - the most seen up until that time. He fooled them into thinking he supported the "Right to Keep and Bear Arms" uninfringed. During his 1st Term he proved where he really stood on this issue.

In 1992, the NRA set-out the Presidntial election, and we got Bill Clinton, as we did in 1996 when "It's His Turn" Dole told the NRA to "shove it". In between '92 and '96, the NRA (according the great political guru Clinton) won the House and Senate for the GOP.

Bush the 2nd enjoyed massive NRA support in both his victories.

What is known about Rudi position on the "Right to keep and Bear Arms" is that he would be happy to make the US just like his former fiefdom of NYC - "a firearms free zone". He will never receive NRA support in the general election - PERIOD. Neither will John McCain, IMMHO.

However, Rudi has BOTH FEET solidly on the second "3rd Rail" of Republican politics - being pro-abortion. No way he can get elected as a Republican, and it is doubtful he can win the nomination.

hmmm
Lilly your spot on.

Baseballdoc, you maybe his brother, but I use to be one of his fav 5, then he took a wrong turn, tried to talk him out of it, but he wouldn't listen.

RINO Nation?
I consider myself a Christian Conservative and for years have waited for another Conservative to come along that was at least comparable to Ronald Reagan. Was he perfect? No, but he was a far sight better than anyone since. Since Reagan has left office, the Republican party has been inundated with RINO's. These are the ones that promise to advance Conservative priciples while campaigning, then act more like liberals after they get in office. Before the RINO's completely gut the GOP I am going to take a stand. Many pundits state that no matter who wins the GOP nomination that we should all get behind that candidate with our vote. I strongly disagree! If Conservatives don't draw a line in the sand now, the GOP wil die a slow death by a thousand cuts. Everyone uses the logic of "if the Dems win we are in big trouble". I don't buy the whole premise and here's why.... If the Dems win we slide towards Socialism at a fast rate. If a RINO wins we slide to a Socialism at a slower rate. Gee, what a chioce!

It's time we stop the slide. Right now in this election is the time we can toss the liberals back to the stoneage where they belong. If a RINO get's elected we lose. If a Dem get's elected we lose. The ONLY solution is to vote for real Conservatives. Now! This election! For 2008!

The way I see it there are only 2 real Conservatives running, Fred and Duncan. Fred has money and organization and stands a much better chance of winning.

Keep repeating this line to yourself "No more RINO's" and it becomes crystal clear.

Re: The Beguiling Serpent
"that eve talked to a snake with no alarm!does that mean eve was used to talking to animals?"

As I recall the incident:

"Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, 'Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"

Obviously the source of "snake oil salesman"!

However, "the woman" blows it:

"but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

God never said that "you must not touch it" - the beguiling one has her!

The beguiling one's next verses are even more interesting:

"'You will not surely die,' the serpent said to the woman. 'For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil'."

Of course the lesson is plain - when man attempts to "be like God" they "surely die".

The only remaining question then is: Was this "Beguiling Serpent" really the "Brother of Jesus"?

Andrews
sounds like good advice, but I don't understand one thing you said. I totally lost yu at Tnhillbilly you may want to be careful in 2004....From there on it was a dial tone.
I realize it wasn't meant for me, but I am just curious about what in the world it means?

As you can tell I'm not computer savy. I turn it on, find what I want, and type.


Dems. won't bring
BACK NY or NJ or PA and most of N. Eng. WERE ALL Dem. in the last elections. NJ hasn't voted Rep. since Reagan. But Giuliani has tremendous support in NJ, and we have signigicant electoral votes.

CA was solidly Rep. for nearly 30 years but has fallen off the Left Coast since the 90s. Arnie and Rudy are similar Reps. Rudy has a good chance of bringing CA back to Rep. electoral votes.

And, "values" cons. forget that Reagan was not elected by Rep. registration and cons. Rep. reg. is overwhelmed by NYC, Phila, Chicago, LA, but Reagan had has own "Reagan Dems." who voted him two landslides.

Today, the biggest slice of the electorate is actually the independents. Giuliani was elected twice in NYC on independents and Dems.

It depends on whether you want to win ot not. Ron Paul, Tom Tancredo, Fred Thompson, etc. are nice guys maybe but if nominated by the GOP none are going to win a national election.

If Rudy has coattails in NY, NJ, CA, PA, and New Eng., the Senate may again be solidly Rep. and the House not so solidly Dem.

It makes a difference. Dems. will not renew the Bush tax cuts, worth to you $2646 or $3026 depending on the source. Dems. will starve the troops in Iraq and anywhere else. Dems. will fulfill the gay, global warming, Fairness Doctrine, national healthcare, atheist, yadda, agendas.

You want more taxes? You want someone monitoring TH for what you write, you want to be kidnapped into a national health system that rations every medical possibility there is and sends you to drs. you've never heard of?

Nominate Huckabee or Romney and get torn to shreds by the secular MSM, see him on the defensive the entire election, and watch the group identify idiots elect any of the three Dem. offerings: CLinton, Obama, or Edwards, because one of them is surely going to be the nominee who promises the ranch and the GOP has to stop them.

Re: A winning combination?
"Giuliani could bring New Eng. states back to Rep. columns, PA, CA, NY,and NJ."

I believe Hillary! and Muhammed Obama could make the same claim for their Party. I believe we have more than enough GOP Senators like Olympia Snowe, "Jumpin' Jim" Jeffords and the father-son "Dymatic Chafee Duo", thank you very much. What benefits does the Grand Old Party get from another crop of these Country Club "Rockefeller Republican" Representatives? They were the reason that the GOP remained in the minority party "wilderness" for so many years. The Republicans didn't lose the battle for Congress in 2006 because it wasn't "liberal" enough, IMMHO!

TNHillbilly
You may want to be careful Back in 2004 I worked as an administrator for an ISP/hosting firm, and we found a LOT of exploits in PHPbb. I don't know if they fixed all of them, but a quick search showed that some may still exist.

At the very least, do not allow GET or POST to set any more variables than necessary, and be sure to initialize any and all variables in the code.

(If you don't do any scripting/programming, check the boards, as there should be patches for some of the worst PHPbb exploits.)

But having said all that, I am glad to see someone is responding to the TH problems with more than just griping. (To be honest, I am myself guilty of just griping.)

Kat
I know exactly what you mean. I have screamed it for months now. Some have listened,others refuse to listen.
I tried and tried to tell them he has double speak. He lies about his record, and slickly refutes any thing that is brought up against him.

I had family that tried to get work there, and couldn't because of illegal aliens. They are everywhere, in everything, making it impossible almost, for people, especially young people to work. Then he raised taxes to get more money for medicaid, because so many illegals were on it.People on welfare because they couldn't work. etc. etc.

Arkies hate him and know what he is.

My greatgrandson was shot there recently by them. Now he is in Texas because of fear of something else happening. Mexicans are taking over everything there.

Wake up people!!

Re: True Liberalism is Classical
"Given the disolution of the limits placed upon government by the 'unbridled passion of men' I believe John Adams was correct in his assessment. We are at the point where religious beliefs, morality and fidelity to the Constitution get little more than lip service from our supposed 'leaders'."

Spoken like a TRUE CLASSICAL LIBERAL!

Re: Huck's redeeming virtue
"By the time the MSM are done with huckabee, if he gets to the general election, he will be an abortion clinic bomber and follow the jim jones/ jimmmy swaggart and jim baker(whats with the jims) of christianity."

Actually, the thing that MSM has recently pounded the "Huckinator" for is, in my eyes, his greatest redeeming virtue. This was his answer to the AIDS epidemic back when it was a major death-dealing scourge. In his "off the wall" suggestion was what most epidemiology doctrine had called for with any "human communicable" disease - "isolation" of the carrier. This statement was made at time when hospitals through the US "isolated" AIDS carriers and used "extraordinary" safety precautions (masks, gloves, sterilizing equipment, anti-viral sprays, etc. when treating them.

The hypocrisy of the MSM is even more amazing when you consider that its "darling" - Castro's Cuba - arguable the worst Medical System on Earth, did exactly that and enjoyed the losest transmission rate for AIDS in the World. In this the Huckinator was surely a visionary "voice crying out of the wilderness".

The "politicization" of AIDS medicine got so BAD that "Public Health" practitioners were not even allowed to ask the AIDS victim for a list of their contacts. Go figure!

Fred Thompson
Also would make an excellent president. His plan on illegal immigration is Great!!
He has a plan on taxes. such as the flat tax. Your choice between the regular tax should you want to use your deduction. If not, then you could use the flat tax. He wants to abolish the "death tax",
He has plans for Social Security so that it doesn't go broke.
He wants to win in Iraq and Afghanistan,
He doesn't believe in abortion, though he wants to give the states the ooption, instead of federal gvt. They have no choice now.
He doen't believe in "Gay" marriage.
He wants to give more power to the states instead of the federal government.
He is a constitutionalist.
He believes in trade with other countries. But FAIR Trade. Not the way it is now. The other countries pay their share of Tariffs if we are expected to pay when our goods go to them. that will stop China's cheating.
Just a few reasons I like him. Oh and he is a Christian. A member of the Church of Christ (not the united church of Christ)

nana
They fall for his lies because they had the comfort and convenience of not living under his rule. He destroyed the GOP base in Ark. My family are in and around Paragould. Used to be a nice place when I was a kid. Seen it during Huck, it went down. Seen it after Huck, it is destroyed! So is the conservative spirit there. What a shame. Generation x (which I am a part of) is of age and a once proud Ark youth caved in to hand outs...thus the liberal, lazy voters. Huck stayed in office so long from the 'hand out' group. Look at Ark today. It is criminal what happened to it.

John Acton
Given the disolution of the limits placed upon government by the 'unbridled passion of men' I believe John Adams was correct in his assessment. We are at the point where religious beliefs, morality and fidelity to the Constitution get little more than lip service from our supposed 'leaders'.

Elvis, GREAT RANT!
ts deserved that and MORE!

Hey ts, I AM smiling.

DIVIDE AND CONQUER, NAME OF THE GAME!
Instead of trying to tear down the other persons favorite cantidate, how about telling us the positive attributes of your favorite? I am sick and tired of all the Jr High level bickering and especially the religious "one-upsmanship".

The list TNhillbilly gave us on Hunter is really very interesting. I would personally like to see him move up in the polls. I like him VERY much.

Huckabee seems like a very likeable guy but I think the libs are just building him up to knock him down. I wasn't too happy with the cheap shot he took at Bush yesterday. We havn't had a successful terrorist attack in this country since 9/11 and I think Bush deserves a lot of credit for that.

I still think Romney would make an excellent president, especially when it comes to getting the budget under control and controlling the borders. The flip-flop issue is completely bogus.

Rudy would be terrific on law and order.

Re: Government is for the Irreligious
"Except for a few anti Mormons, nobody cares what Mitt's religion believes in any more than they care about Joe Lieberman's religious beliefs or for that matter Teddy Kennedy's religious beliefs."

Hmmm! Interesting concept. How then do you account for this:

"We have not a government strong enough to restrain the unbridled passion of men. This Constitution was made only for a moral and a religious people. It is wholly inadequate for any other.” John Adams

"Reason and experience forbid us to expect public morality in the absence of religious principle.” George Washington, 1st President

Ah! I see, it takes an "irreligious government" to control an "irreligous people". Now, that make sense? Or maybe, it takes a "religious people" to control a "irreligious government". That seems reasonable. Then perhaps, it means that a "religious people" will elect a "religious government" and Freedom prevails. Oh the quandry!

Uncle B and Kat
My grandson is doing fine. His mother sent him to Texas with her cousin for awhile to recoup. She ha to work, and wanted to keep him away from those who shot him.

Kat. I'm so glad an Arkie showed up to back up what I've been saying for so long. I did live in Arkansas, and am now in Okla, about 29 miles or so out of Ft. Smith.
I know what he did to Arkansas, and it was pathetic. He is a liberal democrat posing as a Republican. And it's heartbreaking how many people are falling for his lies.

Re: Self-evident Truths from Heaven
"We must not run our government because of imagined reckonings based on the Heaven Hotline."

If not "Heaven" what do purpose"? "Hell" perhaps? The Founders recognized "Heaven" input the affairs of man's governence. How else do you account for:

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

Re: Presidential worth
"That is non of my business and has no bearing on the process of determining the next president. You need to go and ask Huckabee that ? as it pertains to him and not me."

History shows that our great Nation has survived Deists and Atheists, an devote Mormon should not prove catastrophic.

While Romney's personal record so exemplary "family values", is "public record" is not so impressive. IMMHO, I can't see how a devote Mormon could have only "come to Jesus" on the very much "political issue" of the "Right to Life". That, plus other recent "epiphanies" on other "social policy" matters, make me somewhat of "skeptic" on the Former Governor of the "People's Republic of Massachusett". Let's face it, anyone who can convince the same majority to elect them as Senators Kerry-Heinz and "Backstroke" Ted should be carefully scrutinized before accepting on face value. His LIE on questions related to devotions to the 2nd Amendment speaks volumes.

As for the "Huckinator", his smacks of all the "worse faults" of our present President. I respect his faith, and even his seeming "liberation theological" views on what Jesus' message means. However, I am not sure that GOP can handle another "compassionate conservative".

AS for my preference - in my "fantasy World" the hands-down" my favorite is the guy who isn't running, wouldn't run, and who probably could not the general election merely because of his name, although he wipe the floor with the present batch of Republican candidates, "despite his superior record - Former Florida Governor "Jeb' Bush. His record as Florida Governor put every other Governor to shame and his "social conservative" record is impectible! Of course, the Townhall commentaries might then just be ablaze with regards to Catholic Faith.

Re: Clair'voyance of the Infinite
"the traditional theological view is that Jesus is the Son of God but Lucifer is the creation of an all-powerful, all-knowing God. He knew exactly what he was doing. He knew exactly what would happen (because he sees the future perfectly), and created Lucifer out of nothing. That seems, to me, to create at least a dilemma, a little problem, called a problem of evil. Because then God knowingly is leading down the path that will lead to Auschwitz and the Killing Fields of Cambodia."

Does an Infinite Being have a "future" or even a "past"?

What is that "free will" thingy, anyway? Only a Calvinist would believe mankind is "Predestined" to do "Evil". Is mankind really a "robot", with no ability to not do "evil"?

Is "God made do you it" anymore of an excuse than "the Devil made me do it"? I seem to recall Adam used that very excuse to no avail.

What is "Evil" anyway? Guilt by association, perhaps? Is "knowing" the same as "leading"? Then "free will" is totally bogus, so do what you please, as you, afterall, are "just along for the run"!

Well Done Ken
The media has in fact done just that and keeps on doing it, Running a ring of deceipt through the noses of those who are afraid of Christianity.
All you libs and dems out there can't stand the idea that someone who claims Christ as first in their life should be in charge....gee they just might make a logical decision.....so far all this bashing of Huckabee has proved nothing...he apparently was elected to run his state over-whelmingly and most but as usual, not all were pleased with him, but then again probably all of you libs think Arkansas is just hicksville and doesn't count anyway. I for one do think he has merit, albeit that he didn't asnwer the question regarding Romney honestly, but then again for all you muddle-minded defenders of the Mitt blogs are delusional beyond belief. Romney hasn't been honest himself. He has consistantly failed to answer direct questions regarding his beliefs. It doesn't matter whether it belongs in the arena or not, the fact is, its already in the arena and needs to be answered. Period.

MD...Obviously you seem to think humans had nothing to do with the atrocities that have happened on earth. For some unknown reason I get the impression you think God created evil. If you do think that, then you need to watch your step because that borders on blasphemy and there is no forgiveness for it. But then again if you do think that you probably don't care anyway.

For answers to what Mormons say they believe you can go to their websites, (might be slanted though) After that Check out what Christains believe and go see ChristianAnswers.net or the Watchman Fellowship.

Ouch!
One man's dream is another man's nightmare.

TH is becoming a nightmare for me. It took at least 5 minutes for my message above to post. No wonder we see so many double or triple posts.

I tried to post a message to my TH blog and got an error page. It took three tries to get it posted.

In retaliation I've started a blog on my own machine. My long posts are not a problem here and response is immediate. Anyone can use it if they register. It's unmoderated so far...

If anyone wants to try it, look here:
http://rix3.rixgroup.com/phpbb3/viewforum.php?f=8

I just started it so there isn't much there.

NaNa & Onceamarine
You two got it! A lot of my family live in Arakansas and lived under Huckabee's leadership. They are conservative and Christian and let me tell you....Huckabee had them very unhappy! I doubt if Huckabee could carry Ark in a general election, which says a lot. As soon as I mention Huck to my gram in Ark, she gets to talking in tongues...she gets that mad. What makes her more mad is when people talk about what a great Christian Huck is when they've never lived under his policy's and conduct to know for sure. My gram, cousins, uncles, aunts, swear he ruined Arkansas by having them overrun by illegals, taxing the heck out of them, releasing bad convicts in droves in spite of the citizens protesting loudly, supporting civil unions again against the will of his constituents. And people talk about Bush's arrogance! He has nothing over Huck.

Nanna
Been a while since I have seen you post. I am hopeful things turned out well for your grandson.

Nomodo
You write: "I started getting excited about Huck, but he seems to disappoint me as much as he excites me. The latest story about his bashing Bush on Iraq shows that he has no real international depth. I am now thinking he is only a few degrees different from Ron Paul."

If you haven't already, I strongly suggest you read the actual article from Foreign Affairs, or especially listen to his speech to the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) from September. He fully supports the war in Iraq, calls it essential to our security. He doesn't want to install a timetable for troop withdrawal, but rather let Gen. Petraeus decide when it's necessary to withdraw troops. He makes a lot of really good arguments, which you can't get listening or reading clipped-off soundbites from people who are already opposed to Huckabee's candidacy.

Here's the link to the speech:
http://media.csis.org/csistv/?070928_huckabee

TROLL RESPONSE

.....Cornpone ...you said, "The media hates Huckabee" ...you better jump out of that rabbit hole son ...now take your corn cob and go to the outhouse ...

.....John Knoop ....your dream ticket sounds like a nightmare to me ...

.....Lilly ...I agree with you on the Huckster ...and you would replace him with? ...Hillary? ...Obama? ...Edwards? ...PLEESE !!!

.....Sarah ....let me set your mind at ease ...I confess...I am Satan's brother .....COLOSSUS

Huck Getting Grilled-Finally!
Finally Huck takes the heat the rest of the candidates have faced for months. It's only fair to have his record scrutinized. Huck and his supporters: if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitche. This isn't Sunday school. In fact, it looks like Huck's got plenty of skeletons in his closet. His support of illegal immigrants, high taxes, and soft crime laws is very concerning. In terms of electability, I'm convinced Romney has the best chance to beat Billary and is by far the most competent administrator of the bunch. Mitt, you've got my vote.

Huck is Scary
Huck's comments about "taking this nation back for Christ" were made at a Baptist convention purposefully held in Salt Lake City to convince the Mormons that they were wrong and all going to hell. Folks, this would be like the Mormons all descending upon Vatican City to convert all Catholics. This would never happen. Mormons don't do stuff like that. They prefer to share their faith in private one-on-one encounters. Southern Baptists ought to be ashamed of their crusade to show Salt Lake City Mormons the error of their ways. This is hipocrisy. And it's even more troubling that Huck was a keynote speaker at this event, showing yet again that he knew exactly what he was doing when he made that rhetorical comment about Mormon belief on Jesus and Satan. Huck is a wolf in sheep's clothing!


Reps. could win on the twin
issues of closing the borders and promoting English as the Am. national language.

They will do neither, as they are scared sh*tless tha MSM will all them names.

Tancredo owns these issues, but he can't get the nomination.

Ron Paul would cause military humiliation in the Middle East which would kick off worse problems than the worst of Iraq has ever been. He would also not use the military recept for illegal purposes such as closing the southern border. He would need special Cong. leg. to do that with the regular army.

Giuliani-Thompson would be a winning ticket. If the GOP can't vote for it, they'll get whatever they deserve from the MSM during the actual campaign and 8 years of utter hell from a Dem. pres. and Dem. majorities in both houses.

Giuliani could bring New Eng. states back to Rep. columns, PA, CA, NY,and NJ. Then it wouldn't need Ohio. Giuliani would attract crossrover Dem. votes (many Dems. can't stand the so-called "frontrunners" in their own process) and independents, who are today up to 40% of the vote.

If the people fixated on abortion cannot see it has NOTHING to do with electing a president, the movement deserves whatever it gets.

Hunter not hunter
:-)

Nomodo
Right on!!!
Thompson/hunter 08

I want a real leader
This talk about religion has muddied the waters. Rudy is a liberal. McCain is a media prostitute. Romney is a flip flopper(I am being kind). Who is left? Huck has a plan to eliminate the IRS - not a perfect plan, but better than what we have. I started getting excited about Huck, but he seems to disappoint me as much as he excites me. The latest story about his bashing Bush on Iraq shows that he has no real international depth. I am now thinking he is only a few degrees different from Ron Paul.

I wish Thompson or Hunter would start to run a campaign. Maybe those who share the religious beliefs of Huck could pray for a better candidate.

Not The Issue
I understand the article and have no quarrel with the arguments made. However, Huckabee seems to campaign in part on his religious views and invites this kind of discussion. If he was smart, he would talk about his values not his religion.

The bigger issue is his qualifications to be President from a policy perspective. I don't like his views on immigration nor do I trust him on national security.

The MSM and the Democratic Party on not attacking him full force today because they believe he is the easiest candidate to beat in the general election next year. They may be right.

All of the candidates have real problems. I am not sure Hunter or Trancredo are electable despite the marks referenced by TNhillbilly above. It will likely come down to Romney, Guiliani and Huckabee.

I want someone who will return to fiscal responsibility, secure our borders and enforce immigration law, be strong on national defense and be willing to confront the Islamists, focuses on less regulation and lower taxes, and values personal freedom and personal responsibility.

No nationalized, government run healthcare. No amnesty to illegals. No increase in taxes (If you have a $2.9 trillion budget, you have a speding problem and not a revenue problem). No more entitlements. No more government centric solutions.


Once a marine
This man, Huckabee, really scares me. I know what he is.
He is less of a conservative than Rudy.
He is a believer in big government. He said he would back a federal ban on smoking.
A federal ban on trans fats.
The government is trying to take over our lives. If I want a juicy cheeseburger, and a cigar after I ate it. That's my business. If I want to run to the store without a seat belt, I should be able to.If I wanted anything the government says is bad for me, then it's my choice, and should remain that way.Will this "preacher" bring back a ban on alcohol?
Not that I do any of the above, (exception cheeseburgers) but my neighbors should be able to if they want to.
This "preacher" is one of those the bible warns us of. "They heap to themselves, having itching ears" In other words, this man is scratching the ears of the gullible.Beware of this man.

This one's for boomer
It's a pity you have to start a response by questioning the comprehension of the English language of someone you don't know, but disagree with. My English may well be superior to yours. You do know the meaning of 'sassenach' don't you??

okay......you asked for it
lookie talent scout..you want to fight..you got it! have tried to be your e mail friend...but you insist on your half-butt information..i know about your "farmer " reference..you better dig a little deeper, PAL!plus your response had nothing to do with my e mail...duh!i could give you at least 25 scriptures that you and all your
scripture knowledge as you think it and your ministers could not answer them with any logic or rationality neither can you ! our 19 year old kids know the bible better than you!you can generlize all you want..and you take scriptures out of context..and avoid hard ball questions..with some general scripture! my e mail was just to lighten the day...but you had to get sarcastic! you said you have lived around mormons for 40 years and they dont want to talk about their religion..you need ex lax ,pal! i have been lds for 40 years and i can chew you up and spit you out from the bible! but what has this got to do with the election of 2008?
your out of it! i guess iam not in the mood for your ignorant sarcasm!any response you give will be ignored by me! elvis

As for the MSM, so called, ..

..If Huckster got the nomination, you would see an attack on him like never before registered in this country. They're just using him to part the waters in the conservative field. What they say right now, should tell you they are democrat supporters. Not for or against Huckster. Just for the Dems and against any Repub.

Of course if a Repub was to win, an uphill battle to say the least, the MSM would rather have Huckster. But that is not their battle plan, and believe it, they are in a battle plan. It's the MSM against all patriotic right thinking citizens. Don't trust any of them, not even Fox.


Right on Nanna, ..

..you live next door to this firebrand make believe reformer. He's a reformer all right. He'll reform the constitution with the judges he would appoint and leave us in worse shape than Obama would.

No thanks, we've had a president from Arkansas and now his She Wolf wants the POTUS. Are we supposed to believe this other wolf in sheep's clothing is better.??. The evidence says the contrary.


Very Interesting Precepts
elvis writes: 10:55 AM
interesting! talent scout.
that eve talked to a snake with no alarm!does that mean eve was used to talking to animals?
remember the almighty confounded all the tongues!
hmmmmm!? i wished our dogs talked ..our male dog drives me nuts with his barking! if he could speak human talk...i could get little better results from my commands..i could tell him no more tv for a week! i like your statement we have a choice..it is not going to be huckster!
!
elvis
--------

From a man who thinks a crystal ball reader is hearing from God.

It was charged that Joseph Smith was accused and found guilty of parting a local farmer from his money in a less than honest scheme, commonly known as 'money-digging' or 'glass-looking.

But calls himself a believer of the bible.
Suuuuure, smile now.

Cornpone - W-A-A-A?
"Well said. The MSM hates Huckabee, which makes me that much more determined to help him any way I can."

Gee, I just read through about 79 posts on another thread that accused the MSM of supporting Huckabee and giving him a free ride.

Which is it?


Wrong on MSM lodestar
Though I see the point Gunny makes and the clarity and sense of it, he's wrong.
The MSM has attacked any and every Republican who shows ANY momentum towards the top. The exception might be John McCain.
The MSM cares about KING making and cares not a whit who is KING as long as they can take much of the credit for that.
That said, they do want their King to be the QUEEN as we all know.
Restating my point, the MSM is not a lodestar for Republicans to choose their candidate. They simply want to chew up and spit out ALL our candidates and have tried. They've left Duncan Hunter, Sam Brownback and Tom Tancredo and up till two months ago Mike Huckabee alone. That is because none of them were a threat. They never showed momentum towards the top. And Huckabee's rise makes my point. He was third tier for a while for cryin' out loud.
And don't overblow that fact that I didn't mention Ron Paul in that list. Paul gets whammed not because he's a contender for the nomination but because he is the biggest ideological threat out there to their world since William Jennings Bryant. Paul is bending the ears of the whole nation with his words. Think of him more as a prophet than a messiah.

Wonderful Article....
Great job, Ken!

On the bright side, this election cycle is bringing to the surface discussions and questions that have been suppressed for too long. It seems to me that many are getting an education on the subjects of religion and politics, subjects that were intentionally avoided during the 12 years of government-fund (public) education.

If I believed
for one minute that Mike Huckabee was really going to do all he says, and that he believed what he says, that he is honest. I would be singing his praises. But I don't believe him for one minute.
He changed everything he has ever said or done. All this since he started running for president.
He has always been for high taxes. He has always pushed for amnesty for illegals, and for them to get college scholarships, welfare, foodstamps etc. He even thought they should have the right to vote!! That Dumond wasn't castrated in prison. but he was castrated. Some men grabbed him coming out of a restaurant while he was out on bond, they cas rated him. But even castration didn't stop him from raping, and murdering again.
Now he claims to be for the "fair Tax" just because it is so popular right now. But he knows he won't be able to get it to pass.
He claims to be for border control, and against employers hiring illegals, but just a while back, he was fighting for amnesty, and praising Bush for his immigration policy. He bragged that Tyson Foods hired over 40,000 ikkegal aliens in Arkansas.
He sees what are the talking hot points in the news, and rolls with it. He's so phony it makes me want to gag.
Dems are praising him to high heaven. There must be a reason why the liberal media is pushing him. think about it!!

Huckabee
For seven years now we have had a president who is long on faith and short on knowledge. Bush was to rely on experienced advisors, thus Cheney and Rumsfeld. So now here we are, once again, at the starting gate. And we are considering electing a man who has no formal education but an incomplete run at divinity school (Huckabee dropped out to become a televangelist).

Have we learned nothing?

We need a president with formal education in the law, economics, foreign affairs, and domestic social policy. No one man can know everything, and advisors will always be necessary, but to elect as president a naive man whose qualification is that he is a good Christian would be a tragic mistake. We hear the word "elite" used to mean "uppity person who thinks he knows better than us because he's been to school". Sounds like something from The Bevery Hillbillies.

Hunter, Tancredo
If you're looking for a real Republican candidate check out Duncan Hunter and Tom Tancredo. If you don't like either of them you can choose one of four chameleons or a Libertarian.

http://www.gohunter08.com/
http://teamtancredo.org/about/

Americans for Better Immigration ratings on all the candidates:
http://www.betterimmigration.com/candidates/2006/prez08_gop 1.html

Duncan Hunter voted against the 1986 Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act which amnestied millions of illegal aliens. He's my first choice for many reasons:
http://www.gohunter08.com/inner.asp?z=4

Do any of Huckabee, Romney, Guiliani, or Thompson post ratings like these on their web sites?

Duncan Hunter's ratings:
ACLU: 7% (indicates very conservative)
American Conservative Union: 92%
Americans for Better Immigration: A+
Americans for Tax Reform: 88.5%
Campaign for Working Families: 100%
Christian Coalition: 100%
Concerned Women for America: 100%
Eagle Forum: 100%
Family Research Council: 100%
Federation for American Immigration Reform: 100%
Gun Owners of America: A
NARAL: 0% (indicates a pro-life record)
National Federation of Independent Business: 100%
National Rifle Association: A+
National Right to Life Committee: 100%
National Tax Limitation Committee: A
National Taxpayers Union: B

Tom Tancredo posted these:
American Conservative Union A+
National Right to Life Committee A
National Rifle Association A
Family Research Council A
National Taxpayers Union A
Americans for Better Immigration A+
National Federation of
Independent Business A+


RE: The USA Today (et al)
It is all an attempt to get conservatives of various faiths arguing amongst each other on theology rather than discussing the issues which are important.

Issue #1

Keeping Democrats out of the White House

In '06 they were given control of Congress and in less than a year they have managed to prove every conservatives fear justified, and then some. Thank God their majority is so small that they are not always able to pass the legislation they want.

Issue #2

Finding a Conservative (Republican) candidate for President who will properly lead the government and the nation.

George Bush has violated the ideals of the Republican party. He allowed the Republicans to overspend on pork projects and assume authority over aspects of our lives which were left to the states and the people per the wording of the Constitution. One of his actions in response to 9/11 was to create more government bureaucracy, DHS, which was suppose to combine agencies and streamline the communication between them to help prevent such attacks from happening again. But in the end all it has done is made government bigger, given it more power to abuse out citizens for doing their duty (Border Patrol Agents Ramos and Compean), and failed to properly aid our citizens in a time of disaster (Katrina).

Issue #3

Finding a candidate who is not going to buy votes with money or favors.

Bush made clear his intention to buy the Hispanic vote with amnesty for illegals, which McCain also participated in. Romney made clear in the Iowa Straw Poll that he would buy votes by paying for the tickets for people to attend.

Does God thinks religion is a fallacy?
In the UK we see religious politicians as being 'whited sepulchres.' Belief in a Supreme Being is not sanction for any kind of Faith Branding or religious doctrine nor gives validity to any religious text. The original Bible did not contain the Christmas story(Provably, see Codex Siniaticus) or a resurrection and the modern Bible is (provably)a construct of ancient myths. Science does not claim there was no creative mind, just that there is no proof YET. The cutting edge of Quantum theory may soon give evidence of this force but it is likely to show that God exists, but does not need worshipping, and that the doctrine of religions is a fallacy, Non believers also have strong views about standards in society, possibly higher standards than the religious who are biased by doctrine.

Gross Hypocracy
1. Its the secularists who don't play by the rules. They get activists judges to turn the constitution on its head. A "living constitution" is anything a pagan judge says it is. A"living constitution" is the subversion of the constitution by tyranical traitors.

2. Huckabee doesn't beleive in evolution. No real scientist should believe in evolution. The overwhelming evidence we see today says evolution is impossible. Thats why evolutionists always claim their critics are practicing religion and not science. Every time an evolutionist starts to actually talk science they are made to look silly. The only way evolutionists can keep their faith is through the active censorship of the people and science that proves the imposibility of evolution. Evolution is science fiction in story form.

3. I am an Evangelical Christian but do not support Huckabee. He is an environmental wacko who will carbon tax us into a recession. And why? Because he's bought into the global warming scam. He is also soft on the war on terror. He sounds like Obama when it comes to national defense. He will also give amnesty to 15 million new Democrats who will create a socialist welfare state the Democrats want. Huckabee is a train wreck.

4. The Christians are supporting Huckabee because of the war being waged against all things Christian by the left-wing media and Democrats. Its a safe knee jerk reaction for them. The problem is they don't remember the worst president in the 20th century, Jimmy Carter.

If ignorance is bliss . . .
. . . there are a lot of happy Huckabee supporters.

huckabee copycat!
first romney and his evangelists that support
him state..he's not running for chief pastor! well..huckster then made the same type of statement..but after romney and his advocates! THEN OUT COMES..IAM A CHRISTIAN LEADER AD!WHAT PHONY DOUBLE TALK....!i dont know that he is a christian..GOD will decide that..but i know where he will lead us..super compassion for the rapists,criminals,illegals! i believe i heard mike say on tv..that the rapists that he pushed for a pardon was castrated in prison! false..he was not castrated in prison..in fact the police even suspected he did it himself to gain sympathy! this is what some records have said...
i dunno..but i wonder if mike is doing that thing that reagan(flip-flopper-abortion) said"here you go again!" but that expression"born again,saved" sure works magic with some christians...sure worked for that rapist! but that born again/saved christian went out and murdered..so much for that "once saved always saved!" sure didnt save that murdered person, did it?!
baseball doc..you make a lot of sense..most of the time! elvis

interesting! talent scout.
that eve talked to a snake with no alarm!does that mean eve was used to talking to animals?
remember the almighty confounded all the tongues!
hmmmmm!? i wished our dogs talked ..our male dog drives me nuts with his barking! if he could speak human talk...i could get little better results from my commands..i could tell him no more tv for a week! i like your statement we have a choice..it is not going to be huckster!
oncemarine ..right again..divide the gop..that is the strategy of demos!
elvis

SAM

.....Good luck with your tea party ...but unless Paul uses that money to raise an Army to march on Washington the way Caesar marched on Rome ...he has no chance to win the nomination in 2008 .....COLOSSUS

I smell a huckster,.

..Jimmah Cahtuh revisited and a national disgrace on foreign policy. I love southerners and greatly appreciate my local ministers of the faith, but this man smells to high heaven(sic) of a Huckster.

He is as they say, too good to be true. When a man of the cloth or of no cloth is so convincing and so easy talking, I say stand back and squint your eyes a bit. Take a peep through a small knot hole and ask yourself if he is not doing a job on all of us.

There have been occasional great communicators, but they are not robed in special cloth and saviors of mankind. Saving who.??. The wetbacks who go to work in the chicken slaughter houses of Arkansas.??. The same ones who do agriculture labor and cleaning and other menial chores and some not so menial chores for the big money boys of this nation.??.

No. First of all I see a splitter and an opportunist. This man is going to split for no good reason the votes for the GOP which depend in the final analysis on a lot of crossover votes from independent voters. He would be loved by some but feared by even more.

We need a solutions president, not a crusader and certainly not another bible thumper short on reality and long on socialism. Jimmah revisited but in newer clothing.


JARROD

.....The following applies to both you and Conner:

....."Therefore I speak to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand" ...Matthew 13:13 .....COLOSSUS

MEDIA TRAP

.....CONNER ....I think you are misreading the USA article ...

.....They are not attacking Huckabee ...in fact they would love to see Huckabe as the Republican nominee as they believe he would be easy to defeat in the National election ...

.....What they are doing is making religion an issue in the election to divert attention away from The Democrat positions on illegal immigration, taxes and the conflict in Iraq ...

.....In magic this is called mis-direction ...if either Huckabee or Romney is the nominee the Media will pound on their religious beliefs and try to pit Evangicals against Mormons and Secularists against Christians to hand the election to the Democrats ...

.....you are being simplistic and naive .....COLOSSUS

A Breath of Fresh Air
Ken Conner has written the most clear, concise analysis of the Huckabee situation I have read so far, and I've read a lot! He couldn't have said it any plainer or made it more understandable.

Some of the posters here remind me of children who cover their ears and shout, "I can't hear you!" because the one talking is telling a truth they can't stand to hear.

Reconsidering Huckabee.
I have been quite critical of Mike Huckabee on account of my impression that he exhibits a leftist social gospel, or agenda, as part of his Christian evangelism. I have no problem with his being faithful to Christianity, but I don't agree with a leftist social gospel that might use taxpayer monies to go about the globe alleviating poverty.

We have needs here in America. And government ain't the foremost answer to our problems, anyway.

BUT, in defense of Mike Huckabee, I was heartened to read on Drudge Report that he is very critical of Bush on foreign policy, and on Iraq.

All the other GOP candidates, except for Ron Paul, are lemmings who blindly follow Bush on Iraq and foreign policy.

So, altho Huckabee won't call Iraq a mistake, he at least is willing to concede Bush made some major blunders on tactics there, and condemns Bush's arrogant, my-way-or-the-highway foreign policy.

Romney immediately attacked Huckabee for having the GALL, the INDEPENDENCE, to actually conceive a thought on foreign policy that diverged from the administration's.

Huckabee is correct to criticize Bush. Romney is wrong to criticize Huckabee for expressing a thought that differs from the sycophantic GOP contenders who disgracefully "ape" Bush on Iraq.

I don't care about the
religion.

I don't want another Southern gov. for pres.

In the last 31 years, we've had Carter, Clinton, and Bush (II) for 20 years, 2/3's of the time.

And Huckabee is no fiscal cons. and his social cons. means nothing as a pres. Presidents cannot change Sup. Ct. rulings (Roe, no school prayer), interfere with local gun laws, change gay marriage laws in MA, or determine what Hollywood will produce.

A president can 1) strongly influence the budget, 2) conduct foreign policy, and 3) command the military.

All the social/"values" concerns are not Constitutional nor presidential.

I want a fiscal cons. with a strong executive experience in real governance. That's Rudy Giuliani, and if the Reps. don't nominate him, they are going to get one of the top three idiot Dems. as pres., a bigger Dem. majority in both Cons. houses, and all that entails: higher taxes, military defeat wherever, national health boondoggles, the gay agenda, you name it.

And Huckabee's vaunted sense of humor will be no match for Kennedy's in the Senate and Barney Frank's in the House.

And you all have a Merry Christmas, too.

mg-sassenach....
...are you incapable of understanding the English language. Huck said he believes in the role of a creator but how it was actually accomplished is not known to him. In other words he is rejecting the creation theory as presented in Genesis. He also acknowledges your right to believe that you are a descendant of a monkey. What more do you want? Does everyone have to agree with you?

But, just what in the hell does a candidate's views on evolution have to do with their ability to run the country?

And will somebody please show me where in the constitution that separation of church and state clause is hiding. All I can find is a prohibition on Congress establishing a national religion. How that gets interpreted as a prohibition of any religous activity (interpret as christian activity) on the people's property is beyond my comprehension.

How Did God Do All This?
Is there order and are there rules? Is evolution the mechanism by which God brought us into being? Could be. I think the scientists should keep working as it is obvious they are a long way from understanding our really wierd universe. The bulk of what makes up our universe is unknown to science. Dark matter and dark energy make up most of the universe and you can't see it and they don't know what it is. Ain't we smart?

Science and evolution: the real oxymoron

Modern science started with men who understood that scientific investigation presupposes a created order in the world around us…

‘Man by the Fall fell at the same time from his state of innocence and dominion over creation. Both of these loses, however, can even in this life be in some parts repaired; the former by religion and faith, the latter by the arts and sciences.’ [Francis Bacon-originator of the scientific method]

Evolution cannot make that claim. The darwinites borrow from the Christian world-view in order to live and work. They are intent on destroying the foundation on which they stand. That is why the Bible refers to them as fools. [Romans 1:22]


Choose whoever MSM attacks the most??
Gunney sez:

For you conservatives who still haven't made up your mind, the solution is easy. Reserve your vote for whoever the MSM is trying to destroy the most. They will act as your lodestone and point you to the correct conservative to vote for.

Well then that would be a vote for Mitt, as the MSM has never left him alone for one tiny minute. OR even Rudy, as at first, he was the candidate they feared the most could beat Hillary. They brought up every bit a dirt they oculd, and never mentioned one of his successes.

Huck is nothing more than a MSM tool to divide the Right, because MSM knows they can annihilate him on his record at any time, and usher in a new Democrat president.

The Evolution of Creationism
I have no intention of taking seriously, let alone voting for, a man who puts more credence in virgin birth than science. The country is built on science and technology. We already have too much emphasis on the supernatural and lack of education
Is it any wonder that Jefferson and Washington beleived in a grand scheme of creation by a creator - that was the teaching and fashion of their day. Afterall,they did precede Wallace and Darwin by a century.
Can you give me directions to the Flat Earth Society.

BULLS#*+
Connor's says....
(A preacher as President? Heaven help us!) Consequently, Huckabee has been the candidate among the Republican wannabes who has had to field most of the tough "God questions" during their debates.)

UMMMMM I guess Ken figures Mitt Romney doesn't count, because those are the only questions he gets... I have yet to see an interview where Mitt's beliefs are not a focus.

And for the love of Pete... Can we just drop Ron Paul... I for one don't want legalized drugs and whore houses. Or a surrender of all foreign wars. Isolation has never worked. That man is fantasyland for boys.

USA Today Usefulness
I have heard that parakeets get irritated when the paper is used as a bird cage liner. Another purpose - it is used to cover a small area of a motel desk to keep that area free from extra dust. It is "free" to patrons but since I've read it years ago, I'm familiar with it and choose to leave it to others.

Hey Gunny
So now MSM stands for Main Serpent Media. You get credit for that one.

Huckabee for President
Thanks for nailing the USA Today editors.There deep ignorance and transparent attempt at undercutting Huckabee or in turn any Republican candidate puts them squarely at the beck and call of Hillary Clinton.

Liberal bais is worrisome. Even Fox News (Bill Reilly) is beginning to show his colors.

I encourage all who read Townhall to pick up a pen and write a response and submit your counter argument for publication in the offending media.

The alternative is to stop buying said paper. Vote with your pocketbook.

The good ole MSM
By the time the MSM are done with huckabee, if he gets to the general election, he will be an abortion clinic bomber and follow the jim jones/ jimmmy swaggart and jim baker(whats with the jims) of christianity. He should say I refuse to answer any questions on theology and only answer policy questions. If you cant tell a persons values and ethics by answers to question like redistribution of wealth(supporting sloth), illegal immigration(already have legal immigration;gleaning), abortion(murder), energy consumption and independence(proper use of Gods blessings),same sex marriage(sodomites and lesbos). Come on, the answers to these and other questions tell you all you need to know. Any question about God from the media or debates is loaded and has an expected response. Lets separate his inner church from his inner state and consentrate of his leadership ability and policy stances. It is amazing how many gay, abortion and redistribution of wealth supporters on the left have got religion lately. That should raise more eyebrows. What kind of god do they worship with these disgusting policies.

Gunny and BG
Gunny, you are dead spot on.

BG, you are beyond silly. Huck hasn't made this into a crusade and a lot of what you say is stuff that you have taken out of the context in which it was said. Like Freddy Barnes, Hugh joinedatthehiptomitt Hewitt, your attacks are a waste of internet space based on as false innuendos and paranoia.

Anytime the MSM is concerned...
that's when conservatives should pay attention. Whenever the MSM is trying to lampoon a Republican candidate, that's the one to pay close attention to. It's the one who gets under their skin, the one they are afraid of. The louder they squeal, the more appealing that candidate should become to us.

Since the MSM loves McCain, I believe he is undesirable as a presidental candidate. Basically, by using that logic, I have been right 90% of the time.

The secular left hates Huck because he believes in the concept of good and evil. The Godless don't believe there is such a thing as evil, otherwise why would they be holding candle-light vigils for death-row inmates on the eve of their demise? You see, if there is no evil, then there can be no sin. It's those who are evil that hate religion because it forces them to see themselves for who they are. They cannot bear to do that.

That is why the serpent tempted Eve in the garden. He knew he was evil and he couldn't stand to see goodness prevailing in his world. If everyone is evil...all is good! A sick, warped view of life, but one that the leftists in this world want everyone to share.

For you conservatives who still haven't made up your mind, the solution is easy. Reserve your vote for whoever the MSM is trying to destroy the most. They will act as your lodestone and point you to the correct conservative to vote for.

Revival
Huck's campaign gives the anti Mormons an open license to attack the Mormons. It also gives the Huck and the aggressive Protestants a platform for Evangelizing their particular brand of Protestantism.

It is not just about trying to get the nomination it is also about crusading for Huck's particular religious beliefs (his personal beliefs not he SBC).

anti Mormons
The more the anti Mormons attack Romney's religion the more they make Huck look like a religious fanatic.

Except for a few anti Mormons, nobody cares what Mitt's religion believes in any more than they care about Joe Lieberman's religious beliefs or for that matter Teddy Kennedy's religious beliefs.

What they care about is can Romney run the Country well? The answer is yes.

However, if you make your religious beliefs the center piece of your campaign, claim it is your identity and claim to be on a crusade, everyone cares about your religious beliefs and rightly so.

Huck is using the nomination process as a revival circuit.


Crusade
Since Huckabee has been positioning for a long time as the "Christian" Candidate (look at comments in AR over the years and also decisions), the press is going to interpret what he does in terms of a Crusade.

That is not entirely unfair since Huck implies he is on a Crusade in his statement about taking back America.

Take it back from what and from Who? Fellow Christian George Bush?

What Huck has in mind is way beyond anything Bush ever did. That is what has the media concerned.

If you go on a Crusade you live and die by the Crusade.

This politics it is not a revival. If Huck wants to lead a revival let him do like Billy Graham.

Huck does not understand where religion ends and politics begins. That is dangerous, just like the Mahdi Army, Bin Laden, Hezbollah and a lot of other Middle Eastern crusaders.

Burning at the Stake
Huck has only himself to blame for the concern. He openly campaigns on his religion.

We have had plenty of religious Baptists and other Protestants who were good Christians as President (and as candidates) but Pat Robertson (Huck's Mentor) is about the only one I can remember who made his faith the defining issue of his campaign.

The focal point of Huck's identity and campaign is his particular interpretation of Christianity. Further, he has been very open about legislating it on everyone else.

That raises big legitimate issues about Church and State. If Huck becomes President we will have a defacto State Church, namely his interpretation of scripture. Everybody else will be a heretic.

Good thing burning at the stake has become politically incorrect.

religion is irrelevant except...
to the extent that a pol fathoms that he is on a heaven-directed mission to govern. Presidente Jorge might have been snookered by the neoCONS partly because of the Christian perception that the area now called Israel is properly Jewish per the will of God. Some say that the Huckster has embraced ILLEGALS because "it is the Xtian thing to do."

We must not run our government because of imagined reckonings based on the Heaven Hotline. Imagining that you know the will of the deity that you want to impose on others is the height of hubris-- and VERY dangerous in a political leader (see Osama). An interesting aside-- such self-righteous, bible-thumping types are often vindictive as hexx. Jimma' Carter is like that, and the Huckster is rumored to be.

The Scream
This article is about the liberal media's utter contempt for any candidate who does not profess faith in:

1.)evolution

2.)the equal (enforcable-by-law!) truthfulness of every religion ever conceived

Fortunately, Mike Huckabee can still run for office in a free, Constitutional America.

Not a good place to hash out your theological disagreements. You have bigger fish to fry, folks!

The Scream
This article is about the liberal media's utter contempt for any candidate who does not profess faith in:

evolution

the equal truthfullness of every religion ever conceived

Fortunately, Mike Huckabee can still run for office in a free, Constitutional America.

Not a good place to hash out your theological disagreements. You have bigger fish to fry, folks!

another ?
Ok,,, Hucks non-answer on the mormons is OK...

So is this,,,

Question....

Mr Romney do you think that Huckabee is a religious BIGOT by believing your faith is not christian AND by insinuating HE would never vote for a MORMON because of it?

Answer....

That is non of my business and has no bearing on the process of determining the next president. You need to go and ask Huckabee that ? as it pertains to him and not me.


What do BOTH answers imply?

Yea,,, you get it.

PS,,, ignoring the LOW BLOW of satan, mormons, and jesus is REAL noble of you KEN.

Ignoring this other comment proves how hopeful YOU are that others won't see through your silly comments.

You might keep this in mind
MD writes: Sunday, December, 16, 2007 1:19 AM
traditional theological view
"More comparable to what I see as the traditional theological view is that Jesus is the Son of God but Lucifer is the creation of an all-powerful, all-knowing God. He knew exactly what he was doing. He knew exactly what would happen (because he sees the future perfectly), and created Lucifer out of nothing. That seems, to me, to create at least a dilemma, a little problem, called a problem of evil. Because then God knowingly is leading down the path that will lead to Auschwitz and the Killing Fields of Cambodia. ...."

--------

Mankind was born into a world of good and evil, he has a choice in the matter.

This is not a parable, it is wisdom.
Genesis 2:17 -
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Now all this learning about evil cannot be said has been good.
And death has come for certain.

Genesis 3:1-5
1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Men still listen to the lying snakes and death does come.

So Satan is whose brother?
Ken, I am shocked that you would try to explain the context of Huck's speech when it is bigotry for anyone to say anything about mormon's. If you don't have anything wonderful to say about Romney - don't say it here. We republicans who want "shared moral values of political expediency" prefer people like Mitt because they have money and organization to beat Hillary. Using this argument, do you think Bin Ladin should be our nominee?

traditional view
"the traditional theological view is that Jesus is the Son of God but Lucifer is the creation of an all-powerful, all-knowing God. He knew exactly what he was doing. He knew exactly what would happen (because he sees the future perfectly), and created Lucifer out of nothing. That seems, to me, to create at least a dilemma, a little problem, called a problem of evil. Because then God knowingly is leading down the path that will lead to Auschwitz and the Killing Fields of Cambodia."

A glass of cold spring water
Thank you.

traditional theological view
"More comparable to what I see as the traditional theological view is that Jesus is the Son of God but Lucifer is the creation of an all-powerful, all-knowing God. He knew exactly what he was doing. He knew exactly what would happen (because he sees the future perfectly), and created Lucifer out of nothing. That seems, to me, to create at least a dilemma, a little problem, called a problem of evil. Because then God knowingly is leading down the path that will lead to Auschwitz and the Killing Fields of Cambodia. And I'm not sure that's a real improvement over the Latter-day Saint view. It just seems to me that if you are going to look at theological problems that you perceive with one view, you have to acknowledge that there are some real dilemmas connected with the other view as well."

www.evangelicalsformitt.org
http://www.evangelicalsformitt.org


a very perceptive article
Well said. The MSM hates Huckabee, which makes me that much more determined to help him any way I can.

Paul now has lowered his sights-he wants to be romneys running mate which is exactly why he went to Iowa to help romney outo fo a jam-dont give him any money-iutsa waste.



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