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Thursday, June 18, 2009
Ken Blackwell :: Townhall.com Columnist
Israel in Danger
by Ken Blackwell
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Editor's Note: Mr. Blackwell is an advisor to the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs.

When the Germans moved their capital from Bonn to Berlin, the U.S. Embassy in Germany moved to Berlin, too. When the Brazilians moved their capital from Rio de Janeiro to Brasilia, the U.S. Embassy followed suit. When Jimmy Carter extended diplomatic recognition in 1979 to the People’s Republic of China, the U.S. Embassy on Taiwan shut down and our diplomats obediently opened up shop in Beijing. So where is the U.S. Embassy in Israel?

It’s in Tel Aviv. It’s probably the only case of a U.S. Embassy not being in the city that the host country claims as its capital. And there’s a reason our embassy is not in Jerusalem: We don’t want to antagonize Israel’s Arab enemies.

*** Special Offer ***

This point gains special significance now that President Obama has sent former Sen. George Mitchell to Jerusalem. Mitchell is Obama’s enforcer. Mitchell’s task is to pressure Israel to “freeze” settlements in Judea and Samaria, on the West Bank of the River Jordan.

In his speech in Cairo earlier this month, President Obama essentially bought into the Arab position on Israel—that the creation of the Jewish state in the Middle East was a result of European guilt for the Holocaust. This position ignores the historical fact that Jews have lived in Judea and Samaria—and in their capital of Jerusalem—since long before their Roman conquerors dispersed thousands of Jews throughout the known world. Zionism—the political movement that holds that Jews have a right to return to their ancient homeland—began seriously in the 1890s. That was long decades before Adolf Hitler’s rise to power.

Obama’s bad history is now leading to even worse diplomacy. Jimmy Carter, perhaps panting for another Nobel peace prize, is in the Mid-East, planning to meet with others who want to de-stabilize Israel. Hamas—the terrorist gang that controls the Gaza Strip—will roll out the red carpet for the former U.S. President.

Carter calls all Jewish settlement on the West Bank “illegal and [an] obstacle to peace. The Israelis took Carter’s advice on Gaza. They dismantled all their settlements there. They handed over the land to the Palestinians. They followed Carter’s formula of land for peace. And what did they get? Hamas control of Gaza and 6,000 Hamas missiles raining down on Israel. Some deal. Some peace. It might better be called Carter’s “Piece Plan”—handing over territory to Israel’s sworn enemies—piece by piece.

Jimmy Carter has published books and articles likening Israel’s position in the West Bank to that of the apartheid regime in South Africa. He use of apartheid is intended to de-legitimize Israel and bring its downfall—just like the anti-apartheid campaign in the `90s brought an end to the white supremacist regime in South Africa.

Yet what is Carter advocating by freezing the natural growth of Jewish settlement on the West Bank? What Carter is saying, in effect, is that Arabs should be able to continue to live in peace in Tel Aviv, but Jews—and Christians—cannot live in Jericho and Bethlehem. Who’s the real supporter of apartheid?

Carter predicts that President Obama will take the next logical step after he succeeds in freezing Jewish settlements in Judea and Samaria: “In the future, I am sure, [Obama] will call for the dismantling of the settlements that exist.”

Since President Obama refuses to talk about moving our embassy to Jerusalem, isn’t it ironic that George Mitchell and his wrecking crew are operating out of their hotel headquarters in—where else?—Jerusalem. Mitchell’s deputy, Mara Rudman, a George Soros follower, is there. So is Gen. Keith Dayton, who is busily training an army for Fatah in the West Bank. Fatah is the name of the “political organization” that formed the core of Yasser Arafat’s Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO). Arafat, who personally ordered the murder of U.S. Ambassador Cleo Noel and his aide, virtually invented airline hijacking for purposes of terror.

President Obama’s national security advisor, Marine Gen. Jim Jones, is on record rejecting all Israeli claims to natural growth of their settlements in Judea and Samaria.

Question: If Jews cannot live in Judea and Samaria—where Jews have lived since before the Roman Empire—why should they be allowed to live in Tel Aviv? Tel Aviv was founded only in the early 1900s.

The plan to create a Judenrein—a Jew-free zone on the West Bank of the Jordan—is ultimately a plan to de-stabilize and then dismantle the Jewish state. This is not just a change from George W. Bush; it’s a change from Harry Truman!

That’s how far back U.S. support for Israel goes—right to the beginning of the Jewish state in 1948. But no more. The Obama administration will press and push, prod and peck away at Israel’s basic security needs. If Obama succeeds, Israel may not be destroyed, but she will be much weaker, much more vulnerable, much more in danger from enemies pledged to destroy her. Is that the change America wants? Is that the kind of change Americans voted for?

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About The Author
Mr. Blackwell, a contributing editor at Townhall.com, is a senior fellow at the Family Research Council and American Civil Rights Union.
 
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Memory Lapse?
How quickly we forget, Mr. Blackwell!

The United States was not always so one-sided in its dealings in the Middle East.

Once upon a time we were much more even-handed.

Somewhere along the way our Middle East policy was hijacked by AIPAC and the Israel Lobby.

Lest we forget, here was US policy before that hijacking after the 1967 War:

Under the Nixon Administration:

"The United States considers that the part of Jerusalem that came under the control of Israel in the June war, like other areas occupied by Israel, is governing the rights and obligations of an occupying Power. Among the provisions of international law which bind Israel, as they would bind any occupier, are the provisions that the occupier has no right to make changes in laws or in administration other than those which are temporarily necessitated by his security interests, and that an occupier may not confiscate or destroy private property. The pattern of behavior authorized under the Geneva Convention and international law is clear: the occupier must maintain the occupied area as intact and unaltered as possible, without interfering with the customary life of the area, and any changes must be necessitated by the immediate needs of the occupation.”

Charles Yost, U.S. Permanent Representative to the United Nations, UN Security Council -- July 1, 1969.

And what about under the Ford Administration:

“Substantial resettlement of the Israeli civilian population in occupied territories, including East Jerusalem, is illegal under the convention and cannot be considered to have prejudged the outcome of future negotiations between the parties on the locations of the borders of states by the Middle East. Indeed, the presence of these settlements is seen by my government as an obstacle to the success of the negotiations for a just and final peace between Israel and its neighbors.”

William Scranton, US Ambassador to the United Nations, UN Security Council -- March 23, 1976




It doesn't
matter what these pointy headed politicians say or do; Israel has a Protector that's seen them through battles where they were out numbered over the centuries.
Mr. Obama, had best be careful, he's playing in a spiritual battle that he will not win and will
cause this country to come under God's judgement, more than it is already.
Mr. Obama has chosen NOT to stop his idolators from outright worship of him (Evan Thomas, Chris Mathews, other media fools, and the
masses of braindead nincompoops that believe more in him than in Almighty God).
Pharoah of Exodus made the same mistake believing he was a god and challenged Almighty God..guess who won?
Herod the not so Great..same thing, accepted
the worship of the Israelites..he lost within a week.
The evil kings of Israel..same M.O. as the other two, sacrificing babies, worshipping false gods, leading the people into paganism..
once again..they lost.
So, Mr. Obama, is walking on very shaky ground, more quicksand than not when he challenges God
with his baby killing, support for perverse lifestyles and going after Israel...Nope..not a good idea. Wait and see..Be not decieved, God is not mocked.
In His Own Good Time God WILL remove Barry from power, right now God is using him, I believe to bring Americans back to an appreciation of the gift of freedom God gave us, and especially to bring us back to HIM!

Israel in Danger
Wow, do tell. Can anyone figure out why? I
can. Netanyahu and his supporters are rednecked raving right wingers who think they
will never be safe until all of their enemies
are gone. And the way to get them gone is to
deprive them of their land and the civil rights
or kill them.

When they deserve peace, they may get it. Not
until.

Tammy from IL
You better buy a history book and read it. (BTW Obama lacks a knowledge of history. It is the reason he cannot see the present or the future.)
Look at this website:
http://www.masada2000.org/historical.html
It will give you a basic idea about Israel.

Iran's leaders call Israel "the one bomb solution." Are we just going to sit and let that happen? Think Christian, who was Jesus? He was a Jewish rabbi. Who were his ancestors? His ancestors and He were Jews. Where did He live? I'll let you figure that one out on your own. Good luck.

Thank you for your article Mr. Blackwell. May God bless and guide Israel and confound and confuse those who are against her.

OBAMA, IRAN & THE BUSH DOCTRINE
Click my name and read my piece: Bush, Iraq and Iranian Contempt for Obama and the Anti-War Left

the vote
What I don't understand is, why did American Jews vote for Obama in such large numbers?

Right you are Ken....
Israel is the ancient homeland of the Jews dating back 6000 years. There was no "Palestine". There was a conglomerate of Arab peoples dispersed about the holy land. The so-called Palestinians are Arab peoples. Even the 1845 census showed a sizable population of jews still residing throughout the region.
The Jews were dispersed by Muslim Turks and other hostiles. Funny how none of the other Arab states with vast resources of land are willing to resettle the "Palestinian" refugees. There is a reason, it is the very same as to why Israel was attacked from it's very inception as a nation by those same Arab states. Also why there will never be peace as each time Israel capitulates and gives back territory they are attacked from it. Wake up Joseph from Illinois...take your biased blinders off.

Well Tammy luv
I gotta tell ya..READ THE BIBLE....it's not only a manuscript on how to live but it's also
the history of the Jewish people. I'm just repeating what I read in The Book..if I got
a reply from the likes of you, then I guess I struck a nerve. THAT's Israels God given land, the Arab/Palestinians are the interlopers. They are the ones who are teaching their kids to hate and to kill.
God doesn't change just because you decide he should, He is the same, yesterday, today and forever and when He makes a promise He keeps it.
He promised Abraham He'd Bless those who Bless Him and Curse those who Curse Him...that's to Israel. And if you want to see things get really worse in this country, just keep encouraging the person occupying the White House to turn away from this ally and favor it's enemies. If he does, (and I believe he will because he said he'd stand with the muslims) if you think we've got problems now, you ain't seen nothin' yet! So mock me if you will but remember, God isn't mocked.

Note how the headline...
... for this column could have used on any article about the Middle East written over the past 60 years. After six decades, couldn't it just maybe be time to acknowledge that Israel is located in the dumbest, most vulnerable spot in the world? It reminds me of those folks who build mansions on dry, eroded hillsides in California, and then cry when they're regularly wiped out by mudslides, or torched by wildfires. A God who decrees that you do really, really stupid things deserves some tough questions.

Arab Aparthied is fine
With the world at large.

No Jews allowed in many Arab Nations.

The UN and even some so called Americans support Arab Ethnic Cleansing of Jews, and the on-going Arab Apartheid in Gaza, West Bank, Jerusalem, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon and not even a peep about this racism and bigoted hate mongering by the Arabs against Jews.

O what a hypocritical day to be alive and watch for the coming judgment of this blind hypocritical generation of men

Inspired Words ... Jacob's trouble
No imagination involved, just saying it like it is.

Like it or lump it, its just the way it is anyway.
========================


Jeremiah 30:
1 The word that came to Jeremiah from the LORD, saying,

2 Thus speaketh the LORD God of Israel, saying, Write thee all the words that I have spoken unto thee in a book.

3 For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.

4 And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah.

5 For thus saith the LORD; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace.

6 Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?

7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him:

9 But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.

None other than Jesus Christ, the King

Joseph
Why are you so angry? I voted for Carter and regretted it. He proved to me he was not a capable leader. He was instrumental in creating messes we are still cleaning up today, to include Iran. Mr. Blackwell pointed out some historical facts about Israel's support of Carter's proposed solutions and the resulting catastrophies that followed for Israel. Carter is a misguided do-gooder who manages to leave a bigger mess than when he came. Even the Habitat for Humanity houses he was instrumental in are collapsing around the people they were built for. He should have stuck with peanut farming.

You, Joseph are coming across as a rabid Christophobic, antisemitic liberal from dalykos or Huffpo. BTW, your name comes from Jewish ancestry. Joseph was even the earthly father of Jesus. Now calm down.

Refreshing To See
Given the amount of anti-Israel propaganda and hate speak that is out there, it is so refreshing to see a normal person speak about the situation that is salient and logical. Thank you.

RW
The Jews were there centuries before the people of the Muslim faiths. Islam started around the 6th century (that's AD). Why should they have to move? BTW, the Palestinians never had a "homeland" or state or country and were ostracized by their fellow Arabs who still ignore them and only use them as useful idiots against Isreal.

To give an analogy...when MI becomes predominately Muslim, they as the dominate population then have a right to eject you from your ancestoral home because as you say you are dumb to live in the dumbest, most vulnerable place in the states.

I hope you can see the hypocracy.

Odd
I’m sure our country’s Native American population is comforted to hear so many individuals concerned about a people’s “ancestral homeland”.

I assume you’ll all be giving back your land now?


ADLoggy
It's spelled "hypocrisy," and the rest of your comment is no more accurate. The Middle East has been a crossroad for many races and civilizations over the centuries. Claiming that Yahweh staked a claim there just for you sounds impressive, but makes the geography no more coherent. Americans of Dutch ancestry aren't clamoring to move back into Harlem (much less setting out nuclear doormats because the neighborhood is dangerous).
The best solution for Israel's woes is several million Jewish immigrants from the country to the US -- everyone benefits.


Carter's bakvas "apartheid" definition
So, is Bangla dislike of the Biharis (Urdu-speaking Muslims still resident in Bangladesh, whose ancestors were from India's crimepit state) also considered apartheid? That is the best analogy of the situation "Palestinians" are in, due to their OWN CHOICES (they supported Haj-amin Husseini's covenant with Hitler, and assisted actively towards "final solution", and made themselves odious in other nations such as Jordan and Lebanon) as also are the Biharis (who supported Yahya Khan's genocidal "Operation Searchlight" against their Bengali--and gross-majority Muslim--neighbours).

Nor, as talent scout (09:19) stated does Dhimmi have any issues about Arab apartheid--and not just against Jews but also against "wrong sect" Muslims as in DMSA (Degenerate Monarchy of Saudi Arabia, which is run by Salafist rule and where Shias are hated vitriolically) and Pakistan (where Ahmadiyas were orally declared non-Muslim in 1974, and this rule was written-down in 1984 as Ordnace XX--note that Ahmadiyas such as Zafarullah Khan, Abdus Salam and Air Marshall Zafar Chaudry CONTRIBUTED TO their nation probably more than either Shias or Sunnis).

RW
You wrote; "The best solution for Israel's woes is several million Jewish immigrants from the country to the US -- everyone benefits."
Tell God that would you. I really think He needs some sound advice.

RW
You're right, sorry about the spelling. Sometimes I type and hit send too quickly. I disagree you though on the premise that because someplace was a crossroads for many races and civilizations that it wasn't ruled and owned by the Jews long before the Muslims conquered and claimed it. Regardless, the modern day geography is pretty coherent as there are established borders backed by UN recognition, just like here in the United States. Many in Mexico believe that we should give back the Southwest. If they started killing Americans and performing terrorist acts to get it back what would you do? Go back to Europe. Let them have it? Personally, I like the two state solution but have to ask why other Muslim countries who claim sympathy for the Palestinians won't pony up a little as well.

I would welcome the Jews here as you are right in that we would be the beneficiaries. But running away will only strengthen the extremists.


WORLD in Danger; Thanks B.O.
Posted this before B.O.'s last "Bash the USA Overseas Tour": The curtsying (the girly-man derision for his deep bow) by B.O. to the bedouin, somehow self-elevated "King" of Saudi Arabia was pathetic enough during his previous boondoggle to Europe. What kind of groveling, security diminishing assinineness, and U.S. bashing is our so called President going to inflict on the Nation this time on his upcoming visit to Egypt? 6/2/09


Buddy
Great idea! You first.

You'll be sorry!
To my Jewish friends and neighbors:

You will come to regret your unqualified support of The Annointed One. His words and actions show that he cares little about the the sanctity of a Jewish homeland or what happens to those who live there.

How could you have ignored TAO's Muslim roots, or the fact that he spent many years sitting at the foot of his Jew-hating pastor? Did you really think that he would be a supporter of Israel? Or Jews?

What prompted you to flock to his banner? What did he offer to you that was so special that you were willing to throw your ancient homeland and all who live there under the bus and help create a one bomb solution for the mullahs of Iran? It is fine to be liberal in thought and deed, but not when it compromises your core beliefs.

Perhaps the reason you supported TAO is because protecting and safeguarding the Jewish homeland is not one of your core beliefs. It's just something to pay lip service to when you go to temple and is quickly forgotten once you leave. Perhaps you're embarassed to be a Jew.

When the bomb drops and Israel is left a nuclear wasteland, it will be too late for you to change your mind. You'll have lost your ancestral homeland and whatever right you have to a Jewish state. And all because you helped elect a glib, smooth-talking, Jew-hating political hack from Chicago. Shame on you!

Al
Afraid not... only Talent Scout and Tea Party are allowed to speak for God ;)

RW
One other point. The current underlying conflict is based on religious ideology as far as the Palestinians are concerned. Isreal has already said they could live there in peace but under Israeli law and government. It is the Palestinians who reject living under Zionist law. As in the Balkins and elsewhere in the world where there are Muslim populations there is conflict when the law is not based on Sharia. Other religions tend to live under Sharia when in Islamic countries but seldom the other way around.

Jew-Hater in Chief ... Obama
The Jews voted for this fake POTUS in huge numbers because they fear a right-wing dictator ...

so instead they helped to elect a left-wing dictator who hates Jews and Israel.

WANT TO GET RID OF THIS DICTATOR?

THEN MAKE HIM ANSWER THE FOLLOWING QUESTION ...

WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE?

Visit http://www.worldnetdaily.com and find out how you can rid America of this facist regime.


USPatriot56

How?
How can this uninformed idiot have a job as an advisor on anything having to do with the middle east?

Settlements were not pulled out of Gaza as part of a land for peace deal. This happened fairly recently so Blackwell, if he were an expert in the region, presumably would have been paying attention. The Palestinian Authority wanted Sharon to pull out as part of a land for peace deal, but Sharon was trying to push the line that Abbas was not a partner in peace, and so openly snubbed him.

Anyone who does not know this should not be taken seriously as an expert on the region.

This is the most eggrigious bit of nonsense in the article. But other parts come close. Pretending that a limitation on growth in the settlement creates the apartheid conditions requires ignorance of the fact that the west bank contains jewish only roads which make it take hours for Palestinians to get to jobs in a neighboring town (or to a hospital when such is necessary).

And then amusingly he accuses Obama as using bad history based on a distortion of what Obama said. There is at least some chutzpah here.

obama and carter -bad and badder
The GOD of Abraham,Isacc and Jacob will certainly take care of Israel from now to eternity. obama and carter are nothing more than mortal minions working for satan along with the other DEMONcrats while they are alive.
The HOLY BIBLE tells us that the end times will be as in the days of Noah and as in the days of sodom and gomorrah. obama,carter and the other DEMONcrats are proof the prophecies have been fulfilled. JESUS is coming soon and you can count on HIM establishing HIS Kingdom in righteousness for eternity.
In CHRIST,
Danny B. Joyner
Brewton,Alabama
251-867-3200

Lon the Lefty from Pa...
is the IDIOT!
Lon is a Good Example of the Nauseating INSANITY of the LEFT and how they are SO INTOXICATED with Themselves Now, that they BLINDLY march singing Kumbayah .
Lon,
Every second we are that much CLOSER to the General Election of 2010,
and Guess what "Change" WILL MEAN,Then !

For Israel's sake...
...I hope they stand up to all of our bullying. I am not Jewish but I hate to see Israel trampled underfoot by some of our arrogant politicians.

Mr. Blackwell
Your article was very informative. Thanks. I just hope that the Nation of Israel is a TownHall.COM subcriber. I am sure the Obama controlled media want be pushing the valid points you are making. However, if Israel wants to put their faith in Obama and America instead of God, then I pray they want be scattered again by refusing to act in their own interest.

Israeli Prophesy
The return of Israel as a nation was prophesied in the Bible centuries ago. The way the prophesy was to come about confused many theologians for just as long, that some developed the idea of "Replacement Theology" in which the church became the new Israel. Ask anyone alive before the 1940s whether or not they would see a Jewish nation in the Middle East and they would look at you like you were insane.
The Jews have lived in that region since the days of Abraham. They had their own nations for centuries. Palatine never existed as a nation.
If prophesy is to continue, Israel will not fall. A massive army will invade and it will seem that all of Israel will be annihilated. But a miracle will occur and Israel will be save. This is also a sign of the beginning of the End Times. So, if this happens, repent.

It's troubling
to watch Obama snub our allies in so many trivial ways and then slam the door in Israel's face. I mean Iran wants to wipe them off the face of the earth,not just boycott or ignore them but KILL them ALL. Muslims are Obama's chosen people and that's becoming more evident every day. Kissing up to them is seen as weakness and there will be an attack just to see if Obama does a damn thing about it.

Here's the kicker where will the attack be?

Not really true
"When Jimmy Carter extended diplomatic recognition in 1979 to the People’s Republic of China, the U.S. Embassy on Taiwan shut down and our diplomats obediently opened up shop in Beijing. So where is the U.S. Embassy in Israel?"

In 1979, the US Liaison Office in Beijing became the US embassy and the US embassy in Taipei stayed where it had been since the 1950s on Xinyi Road in Taipei and where it still stands today and the Embassy of the Republic of China in DC stayed as well, the only difference were the names. The US embassy in Taipei became the American Institute in Taiwan (AIT) and the ROC embassy became the Coordinating Council for North American Affairs. The US ambassador became "director" and the ROC ambassador became "represenative" Under Clinton, Taiwan was allowed to change the name to the Taipei Economic And Cultural Representative Office (TECRO) and various branch offices known as Taipei Economic Cultural Office (TECO) serve as consulates in various US cities--Atlanta, Miami, Houston, NYC, etc. While both are officially "private" entities to uphold the fiction of Taiwan as part of China, the staff of AIT are State Department employees and AIT is funded by the US government. Employees of TECRO and TECO (except for the few foreigners--i.e. Americans) are employees of the MOFA.

RW
RW says: Afraid not... only Talent Scout and Tea Party are allowed to speak for God ;)

No RW, I'm allowed to speak for him also. He says he is going to move all the Muslims to Michigan. I think he's moved a lot there already. Hope you enjoy all your neighbors so grateful to be in America and looking forward to assimilating into Michigan's culture.


Lon knows what an idiot is
He has so much experience at being one.

More
"This position ignores the historical fact that Jews have lived in Judea and Samaria—and in their capital of Jerusalem—since long before their Roman conquerors dispersed thousands of Jews throughout the known world."

True, but so have many other groups. And few Jews living in Israel today have any connection to those living there in the First Century a.d. Is then the Chinese claims on Tibet or Taiwan then valid?

"Carter calls all Jewish settlement on the West Bank “illegal and [an] obstacle to peace. The Israelis took Carter’s advice on Gaza. They dismantled all their settlements there."

And the entire world community also calls the occupation illegal.

"Jimmy Carter has published books and articles likening Israel’s position in the West Bank to that of the apartheid regime in South Africa."

And in many ways the analogy fits. Should the Han it Tibet get to have "natural growth" too. Most have called this instead Hanification and cultural genocide.

"but Jews—and Christians—cannot live in Jericho and Bethlehem. Who’s the real supporter of apartheid?"

Yes, under Palestinian law, but not with extra nationality under Israeli law and defended by the IDF. Want to live in Bethlehm, fine, but as Palestinians. You may note that when India got independence most Brits left as they they did in Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia, etc. Even Jardine Matheson which had been in Hong Kong for over a century moved it incorporation to Bermuda after Hong Kong went back to China.

Israel in danger? Well, that is Israel's problem, not America's. Israel is not a protectorate or a dependency of the US, if it wants to be it should apply for US statehood.


Nancy
A side from the fact that that site is mostly pure BS.

In 1967, most of the Egyptian Army was not on Israel's border but in the south and the forces it did have on the border would not have been able to occupy Israel nor was that Nasser's intent. Jordon didn't attack Israel until after Israel attacked Egypt. And a website with the name Masada could hardly be called objective now can it?

As for what existed 2000 years ago...well plans to bring back the Qin are we? (okay to be accurate 2216 years ago).

maggie
"I mean Iran wants to wipe them off the face of the earth..."

A figure head president said that in basically a stump speech, yes. But do they have that ability. Let's see, Israel with one of the most advanced militaries on earth (mostly provided by the US and as a thank you it then helps arm the PLA)and a nuclear stockpile as large as China's (if you accept the upper limit assumption of 450 weapons)compared to Iran's second rate (at best) military with ZERO nuclear weapons. I suppsoe if I was an Iranian politician I'd say much the same...reminds me of "segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation FOREVER." I can list some other pandering comments too if you like. These haven't come to pass either.

akagi
so you say,Israel didn't start the war

talent scout
Appropriate commentary.

It's interesting to note that God told Jeremiah, "Don't even pray for these people, for I do not hear you" three times when they began to sacrifice their children to the "idols of Canaan".

DVangura
"The return of Israel as a nation was prophesied in the Bible centuries ago."

And so? Any proof the Bible is any more reliable than say Mary had a Little Lamb? or Nostrodamus?

"The Jews have lived in that region since the days of Abraham. They had their own nations for centuries. Palatine never existed as a nation."

And so have many other groups with their own nations. What other defunct kingdoms would you like to bring back...the Qing? The Mongols? I might also remind you before 1783 (or 1787, pick a date) there was no such thing as the US, Indonesia before 1945, Malaysia before 1957, Singapore before 1965, East Timor before 1999 (or 2002, pick a date). There has never been a modern country called Tibet nor save the very short-lived Republic of Taiwan in 1895, one called Taiwan. So is Tibetian calls for independence invalid? Was East Timor's?

"If prophesy is to continue, Israel will not fall. A massive army will invade and it will seem that all of Israel will be annihilated. But a miracle will occur and Israel will be save."

Loons used to say it would be the Soviet Union when that "prophecy" blew up in their faces, they then picked China.


DVangura
"The return of Israel as a nation was prophesied in the Bible centuries ago."

And so? Any proof the Bible is any more reliable than say Mary had a Little Lamb? or Nostrodamus?

"The Jews have lived in that region since the days of Abraham. They had their own nations for centuries. Palatine never existed as a nation."

And so have many other groups with their own nations. What other defunct kingdoms would you like to bring back...the Qing? The Mongols? I might also remind you before 1783 (or 1787, pick a date) there was no such thing as the US, Indonesia before 1945, Malaysia before 1957, Singapore before 1965, East Timor before 1999 (or 2002, pick a date). There has never been a modern country called Tibet nor save the very short-lived Republic of Taiwan in 1895, one called Taiwan. So is Tibetian calls for independence invalid? Was East Timor's?

"If prophesy is to continue, Israel will not fall. A massive army will invade and it will seem that all of Israel will be annihilated. But a miracle will occur and Israel will be save."

Loons used to say it would be the Soviet Union when that "prophecy" blew up in their faces, they then picked China.


Stan
"so you say,Israel didn't start the war."

Well depends really. No doubt Egyptian acts were acts of war, but so were US acts against Japan in the summer and fall in 1941 and most here I will assume consider that Japan started the war with the US. The war didn't begin until Israel attacked.

Misplaced guilt?
Obama should be an expert on that subject; it is one of the primary reasons he was elected.

Mel
"I am not Jewish but I hate to see Israel trampled underfoot by some of our arrogant politicians."

And why should Israel be exempt? US politicians and US government officials do that all the time. I'll give you just one example. In the 1990s, the Department of Health banned all cigarette advertising, which included foreign brands like Marlboro as well as local monopoly bureau brands like Long Life (I know, ironic name isn't it?). The US cigarette makers filed a complaint with the US Trade Representative Office saying this was an unfair trade practice (they argued that Long Life, etc were better known and thus had an unfair advantage), the US government threatened to put Taiwan on the Special 301 list of unfair traders which would greatly increase the tariffs on Taiwan exports and facing that, Taiwan reversed the regulation. And there are countless other examples of bullying by the US, so again, why should Israel be exempt?

Country Boy
"The GOD of Abraham,Isacc and Jacob will certainly take care of Israel from now to eternity."

He sure takes his time though. What the Roman's mess with the Apple of his eye and he waits what centuries to deal with them? What was he on another line or something? Wait I know, the Jews had afonted him some way and caused him to turn his back on them. That's the neat thing about gods, you can always explain why they do something no matter what happens...like a roulette wheel that is all black or all the numbers are 8, no matter how you bet, you win (as long as you bet black and 8).

I might remind you all that George H.W. Bush called for a freeze on the settlements too as did Clinton, this has been a long standing US policy--for 20-odd years now.

"JESUS is coming soon and you can count on HIM establishing HIS Kingdom in righteousness for eternity."

We've heard that too, care to define the term soon? And doesn't the Bible warn about predicting this and how is this any different from the Shia's 12th Imam or as far as that goes Quetzalcoatl.

Akagi
He sure takes his time though. What the Roman's mess with the Apple of his eye and he waits what centuries to deal with them?

_______________________________________________________________
Akagi, I guess God's timing is his but less than 300 years after Christ was crucified, Rome became a Christian nation. I would presume you would at least see the irony.

US
"so instead they helped to elect a left-wing dictator who hates Jews and Israel."

Any proof of this...no.

He did and as factcheck.org pointed out it is exactly like a Hawaiian certificate of live birth of one of their staff members born in Hawaii about the same time.

Any proof his father was in Kenya in 1961? No. Any proof his mother was EVER in Kenya? No. How do you guess he was taken from Kenya as an illegal alien to the US...she smuggled him in her carry on? The birth announcement in two Hawaiian newspapers days later was part of some plot?

You people are loons.

Also tell us how he is a dictator? Any dictator worth the name would close down places like this in seconds. Has the Weekly Standard and Washington Times been closed down yet? Is Rush off the airwaves? Fairness Doctrine right? He is still on the airwaves right? Let me clue you in a dictator doesn't wait for a fairness doctrine, the police show up, they close you down and they put you on trial and then you are in a prison cell on Green Island someplace at best...sometimes you simply vanish and they find your bones buried in an unmarked grave in Taipei County someplace 40 years later.


On the nail ADLoggy (11:40)
I have seen lots of times when Muslims write about "unfavourable (to Muslims) discrimination," (a) or "life under tyranny" when referring to Muslims living under the rule of non-Muslims (including non-religious-based or "secular" regimes, noting that they shill most when the regime in question is a popular-vote-republic (b)), but SELDOM (and then only by victims who successfully broke away) do they call it tyranny even for Muslims under ACTUAL Muslim tyrants (for non-Muslims under Muslim tyranny, substitute NEVER for SELDOM).

(a, b) both seen in Pakistani propaganda about India (which has had several Muslim federal-cabinet members ever since Partition--including a Home Minister***--as well as State CM, and Air Chief Marshall; as well some "rubber-stamp" posts such as President--three to date--or State Governor) as well as Arab/chav propaganda against Israel (which has had at least one federal-cabinet member, and where a Druse ran unsuccessfully for PM).

David
True. But Rome wasn't blasted off the planet, I'd expect if Rome messed with God's chosen people, God would be a little more harsh than simply conversion and even in that it wasn't until the 4th century long after the revolt in 70 a.d. and later what Hadrian in the 2nd century. And as you know the part of the empire that included Judea (later Syria-Palastina) lasted until the 15th century, so we are talking over a millennia.

Aren't the claims here is that God will deal a harsh punishment if anyone messes with Israel (and I might add most of Bibical Israel is part of several sovereign states), so what Iran attacks Israel, and 400 years later they all convert to Christianity?

No, Tea Party, God is not mocked
I don't know what Bible you're reading, but my Bible says that OT Israel's living in the land was always conditional on obeying the Mosaic Covenant (Deut. 28-30). God most assuredly kept His Word (re the times they were exiled).

Most importantly, my Bible also says that God FOREVER REMOVED the Mosaic Covenant (Hebrews 8:13) because the covenants were fulfilled in Christ.

Therefore, according to Scripture, the present secular nation that gave itself the name "Israel" has no Divine right to the land.

btw, my Bible also says this about the children of Abraham:
Gal.3:29 "If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

And the promise is not to inherit a strip of land in the Middle East (which was a foreshadow) but the True Promised Land.

ADLoggy
"One other point. The current underlying conflict is based on religious ideology as far as the Palestinians are concerned."

Hamas and Hezbollah, yes, but this wasn't the case with the PLO which were mostly made up of Arab Socialists and Marxists such as the PFLP and the PLF. Nor was the case with many of Israel's chief foes--Egypt, Iraq and Syria all of which were Arab Socialist regimes and not Islamic ones.

"Isreal has already said they could live there in peace but under Israeli law and government. It is the Palestinians who reject living under Zionist law."

Yes, peace under occupation is always an option. The Tibetians can live under Chinese law, the East Timorese could live under Indonesian law, etc etc.

"As in the Balkins and elsewhere in the world where there are Muslim populations there is conflict when the law is not based on Sharia."

Is Malaysian law based on Sharia? It is not. And millions of non-Muslims live quite happily there I might add.

Akagi
A good job of dismantling the Zio-prophets -- but please stop calling people "loons."

Alan
"His words and actions show that he cares little about the the sanctity of a Jewish homeland or what happens to those who live there."

I'm sorry. I thought Obama was elected to be the President of the United States, not the Prime Minister of Israel, shouldn't his concern be for the US and not what happens to Israel?

"How could you have ignored TAO's Muslim roots...Did you really think that he would be a supporter of Israel? Or Jews?"

A father who was an atheist and left him at two and a step-dad who was hardly religious at all and the so-called "Muslim school" was a secular school where non-Muslims as well as Muslims attended. And again, shouldn't he be a supporter of the United States and not a foreign state as president?

"...your ancient homeland and all who live there under the bus and help create a one bomb solution for the mullahs of Iran? It is fine to be liberal in thought and deed, but not when it compromises your core beliefs."

Their homeland is the United States, no? And let's see Israel nuclear stockpile 450, Iran's ZERO.

"Perhaps the reason you supported TAO is because protecting and safeguarding the Jewish homeland is not one of your core beliefs."

Should't the core belief be protecting the US, not Israel?

"When the bomb drops and Israel is left a nuclear wasteland, it will be too late for you to change your mind..."

Like that will happen. Again, Israel 450, Iran ZERO.

"...Jew-hating political hack from Chicago. Shame on you!"

Evidence of this "Jew-hating" would be nice, of course to many Israel firsters, any one critical of Israel or daring to put US interests first is a Jew-hater.

RW
It may been an insult to the the bird, but people who claim Obama is an illegal alien from Kenya are loons. The massive armies against Israel stuff equally so.

Mac
"Israel is the ancient homeland of the Jews dating back 6000 years."

And Georgia was the ancient homeland of the Mississippian peoples too. So? Every land has had various peoples living there at some point and one claim is no more valid than another...some book's claims notwithstanding.

The "there was never a Palestinian state" tripe again so? There was never a USA either.

Will the real God please stand up
"Tell God that would you. I really think He needs some sound advice."

I agree now which god are we talking about...there are so many of them.

Everyone is a bible teacher
And do not know what the bible teaches, like this one, and Charles too.
========================

Lori wrote:- 2:16 PM EST
No, Tea Party, God is not mocked
I don't know what Bible you're reading, but my Bible says that OT Israel's living in the land was always conditional on obeying the Mosaic Covenant (Deut. 28-30).
======================

Long before Moses was born.

Here is the Covenant that will not be broken.

The Jews was dispersed for disobedience, and gathered again by promise.

Genesis 15

1 After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.

2 And Abram said, Lord GOD, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?

3 And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir



.....


18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:






Ezekiel 11:
14 Again the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,

15 Son of man, thy brethren, even thy brethren, the men of thy kindred, and all the house of Israel wholly, are they unto whom the inhabitants of Jerusalem have said, Get you far from the LORD: unto us is this land given in possession.

16 Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Although I have cast them far off among the heathen, and although I have scattered them among the countries, yet will I be to them as a little sanctuary in the countries where they shall come.

17 Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will even gather you from the people, and assemble you out of the countries where ye have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel.


Interesting, yes
Chuck wrote:
1:17 PM EST
talent scout
Appropriate commentary.

It's interesting to note that God told Jeremiah, "Don't even pray for these people, for I do not hear you" three times when they began to sacrifice their children to the "idols of Canaan".
======================

Those people are dead and gone too, long ago.

God does not lay the sins of the fathers at the feet of the children.

Jeremiah 31:27-34
27 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast.

28 And it shall come to pass, that like as I have watched over them, to pluck up, and to break down, and to throw down, and to destroy, and to afflict; so will I watch over them, to build, and to plant, saith the LORD.

29 In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children's teeth are set on edge.

30 But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.

31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more

DVangura
I used to believe the stuff you've stated -- that is, until I studied the Bible more closely and found none of that is actually in there.

What's more, Judaism is a religion, not a race. Ethnic Israel (i.e. national Israel of the OT) ceased to exist in 70 AD.

As far as the slur "replacement" theology, it's quite the contrary -- nobody replaces anybody nor is anybody favored over anyone else "For God does not show favoritism"(Heb. 2:11). The question is, why should you?

Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Rom 2:28-29 A man is not a Jew if he is only one outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a man is a Jew if he is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise is not from men, but from God.

To establish peace,
win the war.

ISRAEL IN DANGER
Israel is God's chosen. My bible,1611 King James in Genesis Chapter 12 verse 3 (God is telling Abraham, And I will bless them that bless thee and curse him that curseth the; and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed! There will come a day when those who choose to persecute Israel and try to take Jerusalem will stand before an all knowing God and be judged. The whole of Israel including Jerusalem belongs to the Jews, not because of the Holocaust but because the God of Abraham, Isaac & Jacob said so. God Bless Israel.
A Christian who loves Gods chosen, the Jews

Akagi: Proof?
Obama IS a JeW-HaTeR. Yes he is.

He is siding with the very same people that DO NOT believe that Israel has a right to exixt.

People like YOU no doubt.

Besides that he spent 20 years listening to a racist/anti-semite preacher who honored Farakahn another vociferous anti-semite.

Obama gave money to this church.

So he FINANCIALLY supported a church that honored a widley known, undisputed ANTI-SEMITE and RACIST of the first order.

You may want more PROOF undoubtedly, but I have all the proof I need.

Obama is an anti-semite and a racist who wants to see Israel destroyed.

BTW ... the document that you are referring to that is presented on fact check as proof of Obama's birth is NOT a long form birth certificate.

The state of Hawaii will not even accept that document as prrof of birth in order to get a driver's license.

WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE?

VISIT http://WWW.WORLDNETDAILY.COM AND GET INFORMED!!!

We have a USURPER in the White House. He is no more eligible to be POTUS than George Soros.

USPatriot56


Who is sufficient to fight the God
Of Israel?

Obama?
Hamas?
Hezbollah?
ha

The Jews are going no where and will be right there when Jesus Comes, and Obama will be the one missing.

The arrogant fool fights against God and he will be broken, not Israel.

The Jews will see the Coming of Messiah when they get to the place they do exactly what Jesus told them Himself.

Matthew 23:

37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.


When the Jews come to understand the Messiah was Crucified and raised from the dead and accept His Righteousness, they will receive the Promise of God and as Paul wrote it down long ago.

Romans 11:
1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

.......

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance
======================

Someone will say, ...well how is God going to forgive all the Jews for their sins?

The same way He has done it for the Gentiles,hypocrite.

Shocked! Shocked!
That Obama, after 20 years of "reverend" Wright's sermons, turns out not to be a friend of Israel? That the PLO was making campaign calls on Obama's behalf during the US primaries, and Obama distances himself from Israel? That Obama fired some staff members for anti semitism during the campaign and turns out not to be a friend of Israel? That Obama equates Israels self defense with the holocust, and he is not a friend of Israel? That Obama conditions our help to Israel to stop Iran from going nuclear with the dismantaling of settlements, and he is no friend of Israel. This is about the only issue on which Obama can be said to be transparent. Any shock must be with those having a less than room temperature IQ.

The end of Palastinians
Some months ago a vacuous talking head on American TV declared that once that Iran gets a nuclear weapon that one bomb will erase Israel. One bomb will erase many if not most of the arab muslims that live in Gzza and the
West Bank but will kill probaly less than 15% of the Iraeli population.

Apostle Paul taught Christians
The truth about our relationship with the Jews.

Romans 11

1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias ? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,

3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
=====================

This is still the teaching of islam:

" they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

Here is what God says about the Jews:

"But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes."

"For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all."

2Co 9:15 -
Thanks be unto God for his unspeakable gift.

Jew or Gentile, both must come to Jesus Christ.
He alone removes the wall between us.

US
"He is siding with the very same people that DO NOT believe that Israel has a right to exixt."

And how is he siding with them such as saying there should be a freeze of the settlements, so I guess George H.W. Bush was too then?

"People like YOU no doubt."

Care to find where I've said this?

"Besides that he spent 20 years listening to a racist/anti-semite preacher who honored Farakahn another vociferous anti-semite."

I'd agree on this with Farakahn.


"Obama gave money to this church."

So, don't you?

"So he FINANCIALLY supported a church that honored a widley known, undisputed ANTI-SEMITE and RACIST of the first order."

And do you agree with everything your church does, you can't (although you will) disagree that he has done a good deal of good in the black community as well. Not a fan of his and he'd not like me I am sure, so just because Trinity honored him, doesn't by extension make Obama either a racist or an anti-Semite.

"Obama is an anti-semite and a racist who wants to see Israel destroyed."

Sure he does.

"the document that you are referring to that is presented on fact check as proof of Obama's birth is NOT a long form birth certificate."

And even if he did that you loons would claim it was faked. Again, no proof his dad was in Kenya in 1961, no proof his mother was ever in Kenya and none of you nutcases have ever come up with how he got into the US from Kenya as he appeared in Washington State just weeks after his birth.

"We have a USURPER in the White House. He is no more eligible to be POTUS than George Soros."

And you are as delusional as the loons that said Bush stole the election in 2000 (and 2004).



George
And what talking head said that was an idiot too. Iran is rational. Their leaders are spirting money out of Iran and into Swiss bank accounts in the expectations of sanctions this is not the act of a regime thinking the world is about to end. Israel is 450 nucelar weapons and Iran has zero. Iran helped the US in Afghanistan and opposed it in Iraq, both were rational in regards to Iran's interests and it has even pulled back the reigns in regards to Hezbollah and Hamas. There is even some question as to if Iran wants the bomb and even if it did get it there is little reason to believe Iran would attack a country that outnumbers it by hundreds of nucelar weapons. Despite what many lunatics believe, Iran is rational and inviting nuclear holocaust isn't rational.

Bill:

"That the PLO was making campaign calls on Obama's behalf during the US primaries..."

Like to provide us with a source on this one.

WOW a lot of lilly livered Lefties
Didn't realize so many lefties read Townhall.com. Israel is the miner's canary in the pit of worldwide terrorism. They have every right to govern their country as they see fit. Besides, as long as the Palestinians advocate the destruction of the state of Israel. The Palestinians deserve their own fate as long as they put up with the likes of Hamas and the PLO.

Land for peace is a failure that will never work until the radicals are thrown out of Palestine.


Texas Tom
Israel is in danger, of just maybe having to stop invading the West Bank. They should stop anyway, its very immoral and an act of war.

Agaki Malaysian Law
YOU KNOW NOT OF WHAT YOU RANT:

Dual justice system
The dual system of law is provided in Article 121(1A) of the Constitution of Malaysia. Article 3 also provides that Islamic law is a state law matter with the exception for the Federal Territories of Malaysia.[1] Islamic law refers to the sharia law, and in Malaysia it is known and spelled as syariah. The court is known as the Syariah Court. Looking at the Malaysian legal system as a whole, sharia law plays a relatively minimal role in defining the laws on the country. First and foremost, sharia law only applies to Muslims. With regards to civil law, the Syariah courts shall have jurisdiction in personal law matters, for example, marriage, inheritance, and apostasy. In some states, there is the sharia criminal laws, for example, the Kelantan Syariah Criminal Code Enactment 1993. Their jurisdiction is however limited to imposing fines for an amount not more than RM 3000, and imprisonment to not more than 6 months.[2] In August 2007, the then Chief Justice of Malaysia proposed to replace the current common law application in Malaysia with sharia law.[3]


[edit] Complications
Complications have arisen with regard to the dual justice system. An example of this will be in the context of freedom of religion. Article 11 of the Constitution provides that "Every person has the right to profess and practice his religion". However in the case of Lina Joy—a Malay who converted to Christianity—the Federal Court of Malaysia refused to allow her to change her religion indicated in her identity card (MyKad). The judges held that they had no jurisdiction on the matter—that it was a matter of the Syariah Court, as indicated in Article 121(1A) of the Constitution.

Source is Wikipedia.

Give it time as Malaysia's law is only about 60-70 yrs old.

Some facts
http://www.flickr.com/photos/activestills/2181019819/

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,598010,00. html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJTmhOzyEGw&feature=channel

TAFT
It's their land!

t.s.
When Jesus gave the parable about the good Samaritan, he might have been easily talking about today's Palestinians. Israelis policy of war on Palestinians is a moral crime and anti-christian.

Stan
I learned in Bible school, many years ago, that every-things God's.

Taft
2Pe 3:15
15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

-
As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

When you twist the scriptures to fit your politics, you do it to your own destruction

TS
I blog for several reasons. One to learn and to have fun. I have no reason to "twist" anything. If, you should find a fault in my logic or moral reasoning I'm all ears/eyes.

Let's hope Israel
doesn't go to war while were still in Obama's term, because Obama is a coward and will not support one of our longest, most loyal allies. He'll turn his back, leaving Israel to fight for itself against Islo-fascists in the middle east.. and if they do survive, our relationship with Israel, our strongest ally in the middle east, will be torched.

TAFT did you read the article?
Israel gave the Palenstinians the West Bank, and what did they get in return? Rockets launched into their country on a daily basis...

get over yourself you are clueless..

Akagi: Where's Obama's Birth Certificate
I do NOT give money to racist churches that HONOR known racists and anti-semites.

And yes by giving money to Trinity he IS by extension supporting their endorsement of Farakhan since donating to a church is VOLUNTARY.

So .... if the COLB that Obama has tried to pass off as a legitimate BC - which it is NOT - even to the state of Hawaii - is actually PROOF of his birth ...

Then answer this one ...

WHY has Obama spent - at most recent count - nealy 1 million dollars fighting court cases all over the United States which are only requesting that he produce an item which only costs about $25 - namely his authentic long-form Birth Certificate.

That is lunacy if you ask me and anyone - including you - who thinks that it is NOT lunacy to spend ONE MILLION DOLLARS for a $25 BC is a lunatic - and that means YOU.

Seems like a very stupid thing to do - that is spend a million dollars when all he has to do is buy a $25 BC?

So I ask again ...


WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE?

If you want to find out how you can force Obama to RESIGN from an office for which he is constitutionally UNQUALIFED to hold then ...

Go to http://www.worldnetdaily.com and get in on the fight to save America from FACISM.

Search the site and learn how Obama has faked his way into the White House - MOTHER-IN-LAW and all.


USPatriot56

Why Obama wants to HIDE his BC
Joseph Farah of WND has written:

#Perhaps something in that birth certificate, if it indeed exists, would contradict assertions Obama has made about his life's story. These might even involve his true parental heritage. Without a real birth certificate, no one really knows who his parents were. So it is ridiculous even to speculate about whether citizenship could be conferred upon him by his mother, when we don't know for sure who his mother is.


#Perhaps it reveals a foreign birth, as Hawaii allowed for in 1961 while still issuing the "certification of live birth" we have seen posted on his website.


#Or perhaps it will show just what Obama has claimed all along – a birth in Hawaii to two officially non-citizen parents, for the purpose of establishing "natural born citizenship" under the Constitution.

Want to find out more about our FAKE POTUS then go to http://www.worldnetdaily.com ...

USPatriot56

US
"If you want to find out how you can force Obama to RESIGN from an office for which he is constitutionally UNQUALIFED to hold then ..."

Good luck with that. Don't you think Hillary and McCain, etc didn't look into where Obama's mother was in August of 1961? If she was in Kenya they would have exposed that early on. So again, if he was born in Kenya how did his mother get him back into the US? There are few illegal aliens in the US from Kenya and those that are to a man come into the US legally on a US visa and then over stay. How did she get him in the US and a few weeks later he was in Washington? The answer is he wasn't in Kenya.



US
"So it is ridiculous even to speculate about whether citizenship could be conferred upon him by his mother, when we don't know for sure who his mother is."

He could be the son of a woman from the planet Xeon and his dad from the planet gluck gluck and it wouldn't matter. All that is required is he was born in the US (and even that isn't required--see George Romney and Hsiao Bi-Khim)and there is no evidence that he wasn't.

"Perhaps it reveals a foreign birth, as Hawaii allowed for in 1961 while still issuing the "certification of live birth" we have seen posted on his website."

Anything is possible, you could actually not be a moron, but evidence suggests this is a dim possibility.

"#Or perhaps it will show just what Obama has claimed all along – a birth in Hawaii to two officially non-citizen parents, for the purpose of establishing "natural born citizenship" under the Constitution."

To be a "natural born citizen" under that idiotic clause in Section 1, Article II you have to be born in the US and not be born to diplomats serving their country or children born to hostile troops in the occupation of US territory. That clause is actually silent on what exactly is a "natural born citizen" and it was the Congress that defined what that was in the Naturalization Act of 1790 which stated that "the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond Sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born Citizens." The very fact that citizens is plural here doesn't mean that the act requires TWO US parents.

Now under the law at the time, if Obama was born in Kenya, he would not have been born a US citizen (if the law then was as it is now he would have been), but since there is no proof he was born in Kenya, this is a moot point.



Matt--Part I
"Israel gave the Palenstinians the West Bank, and what did they get in return? Rockets launched into their country on a daily basis..."

The rockets are mostly from Gaza actually and Israel has no rightful claim over either Gaza or the West Bank and Israel occupation of these territories are viewed as illegal...even by the United States.

"Let's hope Israel doesn't go to war while were still in Obama's term, because Obama is a coward and will not support one of our longest, most loyal allies..."

If Israel is your longest, most loyal allies, you need better friends is all I can say. Let's see what your "ally" has done. It spied on you and then traded that information to the Soviets, it sold advanced air-to-air missiles to the PLAAF, the Python III, a weapon system you helped it develop. It helped the PLAAF develop the J-10, thus greatly upgrading the PLAAF's figher force. Based on the Lavi design and again something the US helped Israel develop. It sold information to China on how to defeat the Patriot anti-Missile system compromising both Taiwan's and America's anti-missile defense, it helped China develop its cruise missile program and then tried to sell PHALCON to it...a sale so offensive to the Americans, the Israelis were forced to scrap it. And then let's not forget the USS Liberty.

With friends like this, you don't need too many more enemies.


Matt--Part II
"He'll turn his back, leaving Israel to fight for itself against Islo-fascists in the middle east.."

Great! About time. And the PLO is and has always been mostly Arab Socialists and Marxist, not Islamists. I think the hackneyed term is Islamo-fascists.

"and if they do survive, our relationship with Israel, our strongest ally in the middle east, will be torched."

Again, if Israel is your strongest ally, you need a better crop of friends. And again about time the US actually had a rational policy in regards to Israel and it would if the US populace wouldn't keep bringing in the religious fairy tales.

Stan
"It's their land!"

Says who? Not the US, not the UN, not anyone, not even most Israelis. Who does...oh Mary had a Little Lamb again. And if we are going to use that, well, there are a number of sovereign states in the Middle East that have a good part of their territory included in the Bibical "Land of Israel." Should that be rightfully Israel's too? While we are reconstituting defunct kingdoms and empires, shall we give Poland back to Mongolia and China and Korea and and a number of other Asian and Eastern European states in whole or in part?

I suppose we could give your house back to the Comanche?


ADLoggy
Malaysian law is based on British common law.


CLEANS THE PLANET !

First I should state Im NOT a Supporter of Occupied Palestine aka (the so called State of Israel),. And I dislike the concept of Zionism. Having said that, I have no problem and encourage Israeli expansion in the West bank and Well Beyond. I’d love to see this expansion continue to include the entire Mideast, which would be divided with the US; we naturally getting the lions share. And I have no problem using Israel for our “wet work”. Why this seeming anomaly? Simple. Although I dislike the State of Israel and the concept of Zionism, I Utterly detest Islamists and hope one day our planet, consisting of all 1.5 Billion of these vermin, will be racially cleansed of this social disease. Although Jews may have no right the land they call “Israel”, Islamic vermin are inferiors and have no right to exist. The best way to save the Civilized world is to exterminate all of them and all traces of their existence. Only then will the world be safe.

Akaqi: WHY does obama HIDE his BC?
First. You do not understand what a natural born citizen is. A natural born citizen is a citizen born of 2 parents who are both Citizens of the United States at the time of the birth.

You are attempting to apply the 14th amendment “citizenship” status to Obama’s citizenship status.

The 14th amendment did alter or change the meaning of natural born citizen as referenced in Article I Section II. Being born in the US DOES NOT make anyone a natural born citizen. Sorry. You are completely wrong.

A natural born citizen must be a person born to TWO parents who are both CITIZENS of the United States at the time of the birth. At least one of Obama’s parents was NOT a US citizen at the time of his birth so that DISQUALIFIES him from being a natural born citizen and that disqualifies him from being POTUS.

But, in spite of all of your name calling, and ridiculing the US Constitution, you have NOT answered the ONE MILLION DOLLAR question …

WHY has Barack Hussein Obama aka Barry Soetoro spent ONE MILLION DOLLARS hiding his birth certificate?

In his ghostwritten BORography he even refers to having a long form BC and he claims to know where it was.

$O answer the real question …


WHY has Barack Hussein Obama aka Barry Soetoro spent ONE MILLION DOLLARS to hide his birth certificate from the American people?


USPatriot56

18Wheeler
But most of the 1.5 billion aren't Islamists. A good many that didn't care for Israel weren't either--not the PLO (mostly Marxists), Egypt, Syria, or Iraq (Arab Socialists) and good luck trying to take out a billion people.

"Islamic vermin are inferiors and have no right to exist. The best way to save the Civilized world is to exterminate all of them and all traces of their existence. Only then will the world be safe."

Gone to any Aryan meetings lately? And I find Kuala Lumpur pretty civilized. You know the Petronas Towers, etc. And who decides who has the right to exist or not? You?

"And I have no problem using Israel for our “wet work”."

Who is this "our," kimosabe? The problem is that the US has been doing Israel's wet work, not the other way around. Iraq ring a bell? Also, looking at how well the US has done in Afghanistan and Iraq, I'd not look to favorbly trying to take over the entire Middle East, you are free to try though...but I'll be watching for a nice safe distance on the otherside of the Pacific when you try that stunt. I'd rather not be in harms way when the blowback comes your way.

US
"You do not understand what a natural born citizen is. A natural born citizen is a citizen born of 2 parents who are both Citizens of the United States at the time of the birth."

Untrue. The clause doesn't define the term at all and the Congress in 1790 did and in that it did not require two parents. Second, the 14th Amendment you cite which becomes part of the Constitution does it not once ratified defines it quite clearly and this was affirmed in US v. Wong Kim Ark.

"Being born in the US DOES NOT make anyone a natural born citizen. Sorry. You are completely wrong."

No, you are 100% wrong and stupid to boot.

"A natural born citizen must be a person born to TWO parents who are both CITIZENS of the United States at the time of the birth. At least one of Obama’s parents was NOT a US citizen at the time of his birth so that DISQUALIFIES him from being a natural born citizen and that disqualifies him from being POTUS."

Sorry. 100% false and again saying this makes you look like what you are, stupid. Wait, calling you stupid would be an insult to stupid people.

So then is Bobby Jindal not eligible to be president because neither of his parents were US citizens? Please say yes so all of TH can see what an idiot you are.


US
One more thing, care to direct me to where in the Constitution the "two US citizens on US soil" as it pertains to the natural born clause is located...is this some invisible or hidden clause a la National Treasure that only you can see? Or care to direct me to a extant US law that defines this or a court decision?

Save your time, there isn't one.

I suppose you'll say "Well the founders (or framers) intent was that only..."

Well, go dig them up, bring the back to life and we can talk about it, because the courts and US law doesn't agree with their supposed opinions in this matter.

And the sooner the stupid clause is repealed the better too and we can drop such foolishness.

And YOUR "experience" with Muslims is?
Akaqi:
Having Lived in Muslim countries for several years, (and I assume you have not), I disagree and stand by what Ive said. The vast majority of these vermin loath us and have as their prime goal WORLD CONQUEST as the only way to spread their so called “faith” and exterminate all “infidels”. But keep your head buried in the sand if that’s what make you happy.

Akaqi: Checkmate!
You appear to be the STUPID one ...

Bobby Jindal's parents emigrated from India to the U.S. in 1970. They both became naturalized US Citizens. They were, therefore, BOTH US Citizens.

In order to be a NATURAL BORN US CITIZEN, A PER SON MUST HAVE 2 PARENTS WHO ARE BOTH US CITIZENS.

When Bobby Jindal was born he was born to 2 parents who were BOTH US CITIZENS at the time of his birth.

That makes him a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN --- unlike Barack Hussein Obama aka Barry Soetoro.

IN the case of Barack Hussein Obama -the fake POTUS - his father was a British subject and NEVER EVER became a US citizen.

Once again Obama is NOT NOW, NOR EVER WAS a child of 2 US Citizens at the time of his birth.

Therefore, he IS NOT NOW, NOR EVER HAS been a natural born citizen of the United States of America.

And we have not yet discussed the fact that when Obama moved to Indonesia, he was adopted by his Indonesian father (Soetoro), and Obama relinquished his US Citizenship at that time IF he ever had any citizenship status in the first place.

AND ONCE AGAIN ... you refuse to answer the million dollar question...

Why would Obama spend 1 million dollars in lawyers fees and court costs to hide his little ole long form birth certificate which can be purchased for $25 from Hawaii?

WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICTE?

visit http://www.worldnetdaily.com to find out how you can join in the battle to force Obama to show his birth certificate or RESIGN form office.

USPatriot56


18wheeler
"The vast majority of these vermin loath us and have as their prime goal WORLD CONQUEST as the only way to spread their so called “faith” and exterminate all “infidels”. But keep your head buried in the sand if that’s what make you happy."

You assume much? Have you lived in Malaysia? Singapore (with a large Muslim minority), been to Xinjiang?

And as Michael Scheuer has pointed out, the Muslims don't hate you because of who you are..."the hate us for our freedom" nonsense, but what you do and as I point out often, how many "infedels" have the Malay exterminated in Malaysia since 40% of the population is non-Muslim?

And for disclosure, I've had many good Muslims friends, Saudis, Turks, Malays, Javanese, Palestinians, and a host of others. None have tried to exterminate me yet and I (according to their faith) a Pagan.

akagi
Obama agrees with the Constitution.

Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5

"No person except a Natural Born citizen, or a Citizen of the United States at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution shall be eligible to the Office of President; neith shall any Person be eligible for that Office who shall not have attained the Age of thirty-five Years and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

April 3, 2008
Michael Chertoff (in a separate hearing, in answer to Senator Leahy (D Vt) question regarding this issue:
"My assumption and my understanding is that if you are born of American parents you are naturally a Natural Born Citizen."
Sen. Leahy "That is mine , too."

Operating words, PARENTS..Plural....CITZENS..Plural.

April10, 2008 Sen. Paatrick Leahy, D Vt
and Claire McCaskill D Mo, introduced a sense of the Senate Resolution regarding John McCain's status as a Natural Born Citizen and thus qualified to run for the presidency.
Leahy: "Because he was born to American citizens, there is no doubt in my mind that Senator McCain is a Natural Born Citizen." I expect that this will be a unanimous resolution of the Senate.
B.Hussein Obama was a co sponsor of this resolution.

Talent Scout
Thank you for the scriptural rebuttal, I am assuming Lori is one of those 'replacement' believers.
I have a friend who swore up and down that because of my British ancestry, I am a Jew because one of the lost tribes moved there????
My ancestry did not make me a Jew, however I am grafted into the tree...Praise God.

US
Not when he was born they weren't.

"When Bobby Jindal was born he was born to 2 parents who were BOTH US CITIZENS at the time of his birth."

Sorry. His mother had been in the US for 6 months and his dad for just a year--neither were US citizens when he was born in 1971. Both were in the US on student visas, just like Twinkie Girl's parents--that be Michelle Malkin if you didn't know my little name for her.

The more you post the more stupid you look, why not stop while you are behind.

"IN the case of Barack Hussein Obama -the fake POTUS - his father was a British subject and NEVER EVER became a US citizen."

Doesn't matter.

"Once again Obama is NOT NOW, NOR EVER WAS a child of 2 US Citizens at the time of his birth."

Doesn't matter.

"Therefore, he IS NOT NOW, NOR EVER HAS been a natural born citizen of the United States of America."

100% false.

"And we have not yet discussed the fact that when Obama moved to Indonesia, he was adopted by his Indonesian father (Soetoro), and Obama relinquished his US Citizenship at that time IF he ever had any citizenship status in the first place."

As I read the 1958 Indonesia Nationality Act, Obama would be ineglible at the time to be a citizen of Indonesia, but in any event, even if his father was able to obtain Indonesian citizenship for him and even as required under Indonesian law, he or his father renounced his US citizenship, the US would not have recognized it since it was done by a minor. See Afroyim v. Rusk. There is also no proof of this though proof is not something you seem to care much about.

As for why Obama won't release his records...who knows, perhaps he rather not give credibilty to loons like yourself. I won't release my BC either.










Tea Party
"Operating words, PARENTS..Plural....CITZENS..Plural."

Actually not. Nor has any court upheld this to be the case nor any US law. What Michael Chertoff and Senator Leahy think is besides the point. Obama is President and will be until at least January 20, 2013 (and most likely January 20, 2017--deal with it!).


Israel
Read EZ 38 and 39.


Akagi from GA
Try this website: http://theblankpagesoftheage.blogspot.com/2007/05/timeline -27-may-1967.html

Face the truth. All else is falsehood and lies. The UN and Russia were also major players in the 1967 war against Israel.

Here is another website:
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/67_War. html

Follow the trail. Examine each node. Only look for the truth and leave all else behind.
Make sure that what someone else tells you is truth. Life without truth is slavery.

Good Luck on your quest.

Akaqi: Wrong again. Checkmate!
You are correct that Jindal's parents emigrated to the US on student visas.

They came to the US in 1970, and took the oath of citizenship later in that year (1970).

Bobby Jindal was born on June 10, 1971.

Once again ... since BOTH Jindal's parents were US Citizens at the time of his birth Bobby Jindal was by constitutional definition a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN.

As Tea Party has already pointed out to you, Obama has agreed that a natural born US Citizen is a person who is born of two US Citizens.

The court cases you are citing are red herrings and Leo Denofrio has very eloquently refuted the cases you are atempting to use to prove your point - which you cannot prove because you are wrong.

But if you were right in all that you have said, it would seem to me that Obama and his million dollar attorney's would already have cited these cases and that would be the end of it.

But no, instead of using all of the information that you 'think' you have as evidence, Obama's million dollar attorneys NEVER cite these cases at all.

I guess you are smarter than them, huh?

AND YET AGAIN ... you fail to answer the one million dollar question ...

why has Obama spent one million dollars to hide his birth certificte.

Since it is quite apparent that you have no answer to that question, because NO ONE in their right mind would spend one million dollars to hide a $25 birth certificate.

Goodnight. I have to go now.

Nice talking with you.

WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE?

VISIT http://WWW.WORLDNETDAILY.COM AND FIND OUT HOW YOU CAN SAVE AMERICA FROM THE FAKE POTUS.


USPatriot56

Akagi the liberal
Here's what Rep. Bingham from Ohio thought a natural born citizen was at a meeting on the House floor in 1866.

Rep. John Bingham of Ohio, considered the father of the Fourteenth Amendment, confirms the understanding and construction the framers used in regards to birthright and jurisdiction while speaking on civil rights of citizens in the House on March 9, 1866:

[I] find no fault with the introductory clause [S 61 Bill], which is simply declaratory of what is written in the Constitution, that every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen…[6]

Notice he said parents (PLURAL) not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty. Barack Sr. was never an American citizen and he definitely owed allegiance to a foreign sovereignty by being a British citizen.

Akagi the liberal
Obama states that he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. If that is the case, he was then both an American citizen and a British citizen at birth because his father was a citizen of the British East African Protectorate of Zanzibar. Because Zanzibar had, in 1961, not yet declared its independence from Great Britain, Obama was, like his father, a British citizen under Section 32(1) of the British Nationality Act of 1948. Both Obama, Sr. and Obama, Jr. then automatically became citizens of Kenya when the independent nation was formed (from what had been Zanzibar) in 1963. Obama’s British citizenship automatically expired when he turned age 21. As a person born with dual citizenship, Obama is not a natural born citizen and is ineligible to serve as President. The framers of the U.S. Constitution intentionally excluded dual citizens from becoming President because of possible split loyalties. [219,258,492,549]


PERCEPTION NOT ALWAYS REALITY

Yes. Ive spent time working in Kuala Lumpur, Singapore and am aware of the demographics.
I also have Muslim acquaintances living near where I say in London, Sydney, Dubai and New Delhi. Its not the smiles and nice greetings they give you that count. Its what goes on behind your back that you’ll never know till its too late.

Now if you’re wondering why I work in all these places. Hint: Consider my Screen Name.

It's time for a LITTLE history lesson.
So far it seems that everyone here has failed to see to see the history of the 14th Amendment. firstly, look at the approximate date of the Amendment. Note that it was written AFTER the Civil War. The fourteenth was created for the benefit of slaves that were seen as "Property" until they were officially emancipated by declaration. (You DO remember President Lincoln's Declaration of Emancipation sometime in the mid 1860's?) This amendment was created for no other purpose than to give free and total rights of citizenship to African-Americans then and ti their posterity

Do not attempt to insert any other meaning into it . . . read some history and see!.

God Will Take Care
God will take care of Israel. They may go through perilous times, but He has made them an everlasting covenant and He keeps His Word. God will also take care of Jimmy Carter come judgment day. And I would not want to be in his shoes then.

Quite a twist Taft
In the way you insert this parable into the argument from the Arabs view.
======================

Taft Location: CA
Reply # 34
Date: Jun 18, 2009 - 5:05 PM EST
t.s.
When Jesus gave the parable about the good Samaritan, he might have been easily talking about today's Palestinians. Israelis policy of war on Palestinians is a moral crime and anti-christian.
=======================

For this parable to work in the way you use it, it would have to read like this.

A man walking down the street got attacked for being on the street.
So the guy kicked the muggers aze

Great Commentary
Who’s the real supporter of apartheid?

Answer: Barack Hussein Obama. The Sucka Swatter

Paul taught us
About this, and I am at a loss why the Apostle to the Gentiles gets ignored by anyone professing Christianity
========================

Tea Party wrote:- 9:17 PM EST
Talent Scout
Thank you for the scriptural rebuttal, I am assuming Lori is one of those 'replacement' believers.
I have a friend who swore up and down that because of my British ancestry, I am a Jew because one of the lost tribes moved there????
My ancestry did not make me a Jew, however I am grafted into the tree...Praise God.
=====================

Yes, its what the book teaches.

Ro 2:29 -
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart,........

We are in danger, also
Reports are that North Korea is going to launch a missile towards Hawaii. We are taking this threat seriously enough that we are sending interceptor missiles to the Island. But, if we are a super power, and if there is any such threat to us, why don't we just take it out on the launch pad? Do you think this message of weakness is not noticed by our enemies? You cannot win by playing defense all the time.

Missing the point
Mr, Blackwell is, of course correct, but he is missing or not mentioning the point.

The gang of radicals pulling Obama's strings could not care less what happens to Israel or the world as long as they achieve their goal of arbitrary power and unfettered looting rights at home.

Missing the point
Mr, Blackwell is, of course correct, but he is missing or not mentioning the point.

The gang of radicals pulling Obama's strings could not care less what happens to Israel or the world as long as they achieve their goal of arbitrary power and unfettered looting rights at home.

Binc
What I don't understand is, why did American Jews vote for Obama in such large numbers?

*****
Because most of the American Jews are not
Netanyahu lovers either. They are not radical
rightists, and they certainly aren't
fundamentalist Christians.

Tea Party
" gotta tell ya..READ THE BIBLE....it's not only a manuscript on how to live but it's also
the history of the Jewish people.

I Just love to hear from the sanctimonious
self-righteous people. Oh yes, you did strike
a nerve, but not in the way you may think.

I have read the Bible. I read it on a near
daily basis. I also study it. I don't believe that you are the one who brought up
Romans 2 but someone did. I think it was
Talent Scout.

Would the two of you like to know what that chapter and verse means. It means the rules
had changed. In the past a Jew was one who
was circumcised and followed the law. These
were God's chosen people. After the advent
of Jesus, the Jews (the Chosen) are those who
believe in and love God. It no longer is
defined by either circumcision or obedience
to the law.

Christians become the inheritors of Jerusalem,
and since the Arabs are much more likely to
believe in and love God than the racial
Jewish, they too are part of the inheritors.

But this is beside the point. As a government
who does not have an official religion, nor is
allowed to have an official religion, we are
stuck with legalities. The legality and the
morality of the situation is simply that
the League and then the UN, neither of which
had ownership of the land, gave the land to
the Jews, with the the promise from the Jews
that the land would never be used against
any people because of their religion.

That promise has turned out to be a big joke.

Bob
" God will also take care of Jimmy Carter come judgment day. And I would not want to be in his shoes then. "

You have lost any sense of morality, Christianity, and believablity when you condemn
a good man (or any man) to hell. This may
surprise you, but that is not your job and it is
not your call.

You may be in for a big surprise yourself.

What a Ridiculous Premise!
“The creation of the Jewish state in the Middle East was [absolutely not] a result of European guilt for the Holocaust.”
The Modern State of Israel, thus an Ancient State of Israel is a given, was established in 1948 pursuant to UN Res. 181 of 1947. That Resolution provided also for establishment of a Palestinian State, something that has never existed. The Roman occupiers and destroyers of Ancient Israel were the first to use the term Palestine, thus Palestinians, to wipe Israel off the map and from memory they hoped.
Hebrews – Jews – have lived in Israel continuously for centuries despite the Roman occupation and destruction, two exiles, the Diaspora, Muslim conquest, Ottoman Empire occupation and ongoing war to destroy both Ancient and Modern Israel. Israelis have had to fight for the existence of the state and for their very lives in Modern Israel beginning in 1947-48.
The Palestinians did not and have not formed a state. In concert with other Muslims and Arabs they do not want to do so in favor of taking over Israel and converting, subjugating or murdering all Jews and other unbelievers in Islam worldwide. Their aims since the founding of Islam by an illiterate pedophile warrior in the 7th C. ran out of Mecca by his own people have been to do exactly that plus taking over the world for Allah and establishing a worldwide caliphate with Shar’ia law. (cont.)

What a Ridiculous Premise!-2
Obama is a Muslim born and raised and has said so himself by now in many ways, many times and in many places. Mitchell is a lawyer representing Muslim interests.
No leader foreign to Israel has any right or business meddling in the affairs of the Sovereign Nation State of Israel. No Carter, Clinton, Bush and certainly not Muslim Obama. Carter, witless from the outset is a traitor to the U.S. and his own claimed Judeo-Christian beliefs. Clinton wanted a legacy to overcome his horrible record of behavior as POTUS. GHWB and GWB hardly messed with Israel; the latter only during the last year-year and a half of his presidency and then only halfheartedly knowing better all the time.
Obama gave SecState Clinton $20.3M U.S. taxpayer dollars to resettle Hamas from the Gaza Strip. He also pledged $900M U.S. taxpayer dollars to rebuilding the Strip after Israel’s defensive action in December 08-January 09. The money cannot be given legally to Hamas or any other known terrorist group by international law.
“The West Bank of the Jordan” is misleading Muslim, Arab, Palestinian propaganda. The West Bank in fact extends west to within a very few miles of the Mediterranean Sea. Looking like a huge butterfly with its nose in Jerusalem and wings spread north and south in tiny Israel the West Bank takes up about 1/4 - 1/3 of Israel compared in size to the state of NJ and bordered in depth by hostile Muslim countries. The Gaza Strip takes another chunk out of Israel, a chunk to which Israel has provided all essential services before and since the Hamas takeover in 05 and ongoing rocketing of Israel. (cont.)

What a Ridiculous Premise!-3
The mere idea that 13-14M Jews worldwide about half of them living in Israel along with others including Muslims, Arabs, Palestinians, Christians and Druze are a threat to 1.7-1.9B Muslims worldwide claimed by Muslims is ridiculous in the extreme.
If the West Bank and the Gaza Strip from which Jews were removed by the IDF in 05 in yet another failed land for peace deal is to be “Jew-free” so also should Israel be Muslim, Arab, Palestinian-free.
Less than 25% of illegally, legally registered voted for Obama giving him a 53 – 47-49% win, hardly a mandate and certainly no landslide victory. Of those 20%, a growing number and percentage have been showing voter remorse for months now. That in part accounts for Obama’s job (dis)approval today of -2 down from +28 on 1/21/09 by the most reliable, accurate, least biased polling service.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/oba ma_administration/daily_presidential_tracking_poll
Even GALLUP shows Obama at 58% his lowest reading thus far by that agency, based at Princeton University with headquarters in D.C, hardly bastions of anything but Liberalism.
It is past time to stop Obama in his tracks and to remove him from the office to which he is doubtfully Constitutionally eligible and was financed by George Soros, Islamic jihadists and others of similar evil intent to gain illegally as a usurper to the presidency of the United States.
That can be done by writing, calling and visiting your Representative, Senators, the USSC, Obama himself, AG Holder, the DNC, Federal Election Commission, media and others that might occur to you to force exposure of Obama’s records of eligibility – a certified, raised seal copy of his real birth certificate said to be held in HI and his college records of application, acceptance, attendance, scholarships, if any, showing citizenship – and his campaign finance records. (cont.)

What a Ridiculous Premise!-4
McCain’s eligibility was determined by the U.S. Congress; why not Obama’s. McCain’s campaign financing records are available, open and above board; why not Obama’s. There is no question Obama is hiding his records. The only questions are what exactly is Obama hiding and why?

The HAND of GOD...
I Can See The Hand Of The God Of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob On The Horizon As We Speak...Get Ready!

Leader with faith
Unfortunatly for our country and us as individual Americans, the USA's distancing itself from Israel must happen.
It is the time that God will raise up a leader of Israel with faith in Him. This leader will have such faith in God that through his faith, Israel will be victorious in a miracle war which will result in most of the world acknowledging that the God of Israel is the living God and turn to Him. I believe that this is a war that will happen soon, before the tribulation and will be similiar in time frame as the six day war in 1967 but with much greater destruction on both sides.
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