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Friday, October 05, 2007
Jonah Goldberg :: Townhall.com Columnist
Unlearned Lessons: HillaryCare II
by Jonah Goldberg
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Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


The year was 1993. Israel and the PLO signed an agreement on the White House lawn that, we were told, would lead to a lasting peace. Islamic terrorists tried to blow up the World Trade Center. When they were finally convicted, the federal government claimed an important message had been sent to terrorists everywhere: Stay away from the USA. The president also ordered the bombing of Iraq that year, to send another important signal that misbehavior in Mesopotamia would not be tolerated. On the home front, the president put his wife in charge of overhauling the health care system.

Well, considering this boffo record of success, it seems only fitting that Sen. Hillary Clinton would head back to the health care well.

To paraphrase William Faulkner: History isn’t dead; it’s not even past. This time around, though, Clinton claims history isn’t repeating itself with her new health care plan. Far from it: She has learned from her mistakes, and she’s “got the scars to prove it.” This time Clinton — as well as several of her primary opponents — proposes “flexible” reforms that would preserve consumer “choice.” This is supposedly the grand lesson Clinton learned from her many political scars: People don’t want government-run health care.

But she might want to study her mistakes a bit more closely because her alternative is to provide government-run health insurance, which ultimately is the same thing. Clinton’s plan would yank insurance regulation from the states and impose a series of federal mandates on employers, individuals and insurance companies. Insurers would have to cover anybody who knocks on their door. Individuals would be required by law to have health coverage, just as drivers are required to have auto insurance. Clinton claims she would make her system affordable by regulating both premiums and benefits, offering tax breaks and subsidies to the poor and middle class, and by offering a fallback government-run plan that would compete with the private plans. The Democrats insist this doesn’t amount to government-run health care, but it would be more honest to say that it doesn’t amount to government-run health care right away.

First of all, forcing people to buy health insurance whether they want to or not is somewhat at odds with the idea that her plan champions “choice.” More important, forcing companies to cover everybody means the risk pool for insurance companies gets riskier and, hence, more expensive. Costs would rise, and so young healthy people would rationally opt for as little coverage as possible, because presumably bare-bones coverage would be much cheaper.

Boosters of these plans claim that the healthy “competition” between the government and the private sector would drive prices lower. But how, exactly, can private companies compete against a government plan that cares nothing about making a profit? Because there’s no free lunch, the government costs would have to be made up elsewhere — through higher taxes and mandated higher premiums for people who can afford their own health insurance.

In states where such plans have been tried, such as Kentucky and Washington, the response by the private insurance companies has been a Monty Pythonesque “Run away! Run away!”, leaving behind pretty much only single-payer systems and angry customers, patients and voters. This is the model Clinton et al. want to impose at the national level. Indeed, John Edwards boasts that “over time,” his plan “may evolve toward a single-payer approach.” That single payer is you, Mr. Taxpayer.

Democrats may have invented new bells and whistles, but their thinking hasn’t changed much since 1993. Back then, they believed there was a “health care crisis,” and the solution required big-footed feds to stomp all over the existing system. What they didn’t take into account is the fact that millions of Americans were satisfied with their health care. The Democrats’ response now is to say, “but you can keep your doctor.” That’s nice, but it still misses the point.

Today, among the insured — a group far larger and more likely to vote than the uninsured — people actually like the status quo. A recent Kaiser Foundation poll on health care found that 88 percent of those with insurance thought their coverage was good or excellent while 93 percent were happy with their quality of care. And 64 percent said they were happy with their health care costs. Meanwhile, a recent Gallup Poll found that trust in the federal government is the lowest ever recorded. This is not quite the kindling for revolutionary change many liberals think is out there.

The GOP understands this. As Yuval Levin of the Ethics and Public Policy Center recently noted in the Weekly Standard, the Republican candidates as well as the White House have collectively pushed a number of reforms that would expand consumer choice without necessarily expanding government. By changing the way health care is taxed and using government purchasing power more efficiently, they aim toward decoupling the New Deal-era system of using big business to provide health care. Some propose following what Mitt Romney did when he was governor in Massachusetts and offering subsidies to those who can’t afford insurance.

None of these plans is perfect, but all recognize that the federal government cannot simply impose a solution without creating the sorts of problems that plague all other single-payer systems — rationing, long lines and ever-higher taxes. Moreover, these approaches are probably more appealing to the vast swath of voters who don’t live inside the Democratic bubble.

And that’s the irony of Hillary Clinton’s claim to have learned so much from her last failure, which cost Democrats the Congress and largely hobbled the liberal aspirations of the her husband’s presidency. If the most famous champion of nationalized health care in U.S. history wins the nomination and voters start paying attention, they might easily conclude that Hillary and her party haven’t learned anything at all.

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About The Author
Jonah Goldberg is editor-at-large of National Review Online.
 
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Free?
If anyone thinks that health care is expensive now, wait until Hillary makes it free

nationalized "healthcare"
With all the countries with nationalized healthcare out there, you would think that less people would be interested in this model. It such a huge failure in EVERY place it has been tried. It just doesn't work! Its like communism, it doesn't work anywhere but people keep wanting to try it.

Free????
you are right forder. Why can't people realize that there is no FREE LUNCH????

And why do these communists want to change a system that the vast majority are happy with??

I could see tinkering with a system that wasn't liked by joe average citizen, but come on Billary, most of us are quite happy with what we have, why can't you commies just leave us alone????

Hillary's Hellth Care
The indigent in this country get the best health care in the world, because the free market is subsidizing their care. Take away the free market and everything collapses...quality, availability, and choice.

ignorance abounds in the US
When are people going to learn the *utterly BASIC* principle that you can control price but NOT cost.

She can make the price whatever she wants, but if it is too low then we will have less people in the business. It will also drive up demand on existing healthcare providers: long wait times will ensue.

Of course people not paying 'her' plan will most likely be charged more to make up for her 'price fixing'.

All this stuff I learned in 7th grade, and she is what 58? Smartest woman in the world my ....

Pro-Birth or Pro-Life?

Sadie Fields from the Georgia Christian Alliance has been consistently out spoken about the rights of unborn children. Sadie has made it clear that pro-choice Americans are supporting a parent’s the right to murder a child.

Yet when it comes to the welfare of those children fortunate enough to be born, Sadie is willfully blind to how denial of needed healthcare could result in death for the child or the mother. How can she be so outspoken about a child’s right to be born, yet so quiet about a child’s right to life-saving healthcare?

I am shocked that Sadie rejects proposals like those from Mitt Romney and Hillary Clinton that require everyone to buy health insurance (similar to the requirement to buy car insurance). Why isn’t Sadie screaming for healthcare solutions that make sure every child is protected and parents are held responsible!

Instead, Sadie fights for unborn children, but then shamefully quits the fight after birth-which accounts for only 4% of childhood.

The Truth about Healthcare

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/pro-birth-or-pro-life

Pro-Birth or Pro-Life?

Sadie Fields from the Georgia Christian Alliance has been consistently out spoken about the rights of unborn children. Sadie has made it clear that pro-choice Americans are supporting a parent’s the right to murder a child.

Yet when it comes to the welfare of those children fortunate enough to be born, Sadie is willfully blind to how denial of needed healthcare could result in death for the child or the mother. How can she be so outspoken about a child’s right to be born, yet so quiet about a child’s right to life-saving healthcare?

I am shocked that Sadie rejects proposals like those from Mitt Romney and Hillary Clinton that require everyone to buy health insurance (similar to the requirement to buy car insurance). Why isn’t Sadie screaming for healthcare solutions that make sure every child is protected and parents are held responsible!

Instead, Sadie fights for unborn children, but then shamefully quits the fight after birth-which accounts for only 4% of childhood.

The Truth about Healthcare

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/pro-birth-or-pro-life

I will never accept socialist healthcare
If these big government idiots want to criminalize not having health insurance, the I guess I'll have to be a criminal.

There is no coice unless there is a choice to opt out of the entire government run mess.


John Konop:
You don't have to be forced to buy insurance to provide for your own healthcare. Many people prefer to pay their own way, and pay for the services they require. Do you have to be forced to buy government food insurance to feed yourself? Don't be silly.


We need help - a lot of help!
Somehow we have to stop ideas and people such as Hillary & most Democrats / liberals. Such as socialized medicine / healthcare! If we do not, I fear this counry is in for very hard times. And hopefully not the collapse of the country. Will there be evolutionary or revolutionary changes? Will taxpayers & voters say heck no we are not going to take this any more and start this revolution? I sure hope not, but ....! Will you join this revolution? I think I would!

Let's see the positive GOP alternative
So far, townhall.com has published a zillion columns attacking Hillary's proposals on various issues. But almost none offering comprehensive, positive, Republican alternatives.

Beyond motivating the loyal GOP base to turn out on Election Day to stop Hillary, what does the GOP have to offer the uncommitted voters and, the swing voters to get them to vote Republican on Election Day?

If the GOP has nothing to offer, the voters will take a chance on Hillary and her proposals because something is always better than nothing.

And the libertarian answer that folks have here: "Not the government's problem, so suck it up!" is going to fall like a lead balloon. Voters never want to hear that "Nothing can be done." Jimmy Carter learned that the hard way in 1980.

Our healthcare is not libertarian
"And the libertarian answer that folks have here: "Not the government's problem, so suck it up!" is going to fall like a lead balloon. Voters never want to hear that "Nothing can be done." Jimmy Carter learned that the hard way in 1980."

Actually, according to the libertarians, it IS the government's problem. Healthcare is only expensive due to regulations imposed by gov't and trial lawyers. Less government in the healthcare system works.

Random thought: Did you ever notice that the industries that we are most dissatisfied with are the ones that government already has the most control over?

Fact vs. Fiction
Stan

People who do not buy healh insurance are using tax payers as an emergency health care policy.


I agree with Moonkeeper.
The federal government has no business providing healthcare. And there is nothing in the constitution giving the federal government the right to meddle in it at all.

Even the wacky leftists can see that government healthcare has never worked very well, anywhere at any time. But they think they are smarter than everyone else in the world and this time it will work! No part of the federal government works very well or very efficiently, but if some politician gets up and says let me run it and everything will be wonderful, the idiot class believes it!

John Konop:
I pay for my own health care out of my own pocket. And I pay full price.

Insurance competition
"Insurers would have to cover anybody who knocks on their door. "

That's the best part of the plan. Right now, health insurance companies compete on the basis of: who can best keep people with expensive but treatable conditions off of their plan? (cancer, diabetes, multiple scelorsis, etc.). If they had to insure "anybody who knocks on their door", they would have to compete on the basis of: who can provide the best service?

Two of the many benefits of this would be: (1) healthier people; and (2) eliminating the cost shifting from the uninsured to the insured.

Stan
Stan: "I pay for my own health care out of my own pocket. And I pay full price."

That works well as long as you are in the 90% of people who make up 10% of health care costs. If, God forbid, you are diagnosed with cancer, or one of the neurological diseases, or have a heart attack, you'd quickly find yourself bankrupt, and then dependent on the government to pay your costs. (Either government, or else your health care providers would shift the costs of your treatment to those who can still pay.)

Kentucky
The problem Kentucky had was with "adverse selection". People with serious conditions who lacked health insurance and lived in nearby states moved to Kentucky because that was the only way that they could get care for their conditions. Kentucky got swamped with the uninsured chronically ill and costs soared. If the whole nation is in the risk pool, there would not be the concentration of the ill into one state, and its corresponding concentration of health care costs in one state. It would work nationwide when it failed in Kentucky.

GeorgiaGal:
About 15 years ago I had a minor cancer that required surgery, and that was at a time when (for a number of reasons) I had very little in savings. I went to a specialist and when I asked what it would cost, he had no idea. No one had ever asked that question before. He had to have a long conversation with his office manager before they could come up with a guess.

It turned out to cost 4 times his estimate because he hadn't considered the costs of the operating room and staff, after care, etc.

It was more than I could pay at the time, so I paid half, and paid the rest in monthly installments over the next four months.

They were happy to make arrangements for payments, and got half up front, much faster than they would have received payment from an insurance company.

I've been a "senior citizen" for quite a while now, so my health care costs are higher than when I was 50 years younger. But I've worked hard all my life, lived frugally, started a number of companies, etc. And I doubt very much that I'd be bankrupted by any medical condition that I'd have any chance of surviving.

Georgia girl
Answer one question for me. I have insurance that pays most of my health care costs and I am happy with it. Why should I have to pay for health care for you? I don't understand that concept. I mean I can't take you as a dependant on my income tax.(Believe me, I wish I could!!)You don't clean my house, mow my lawn, sit my kids, or anything else. So why???

Georgia Gal
Sorry about the butcher job on your name, I seem to be doing that alot. Sorry

And to continue eastlake joe's question,
why should you pay for my healthcare?

Stan
gotta go guy hope you have a good weekend. I might be back on the 'morrow. take care.

Stan
You've seen enough of life to know that most people with families simply don't have 10, 20 or 30 thousand to pay for each and every operation they or their dependents may need.

I'd be interested to know how you define "frugal".

2 Guns
Communists and Marxists couldn't care less that "most of us are happy with what we have". Their goal is total control over our lives.

I've frequently read comments which referred to Hillary as a Marxist.

In a 2004 speech, Hillary told her audience they (meaning Hillary and the Dems if they win in '08) were going to take things from them for the common good.

My understanding of what she said is that their goal is to take some money from those who have worked and earned it and give it to those more needy.

It's a well-known fact that many of the "needy" don't see education and a job as a big priority. They appear to be quite content with government handouts and profits from crime.

Note: I said "many", certainly not all.

The latest of Hillary's "brilliant" solutions that I've read should also convince us skeptics that she is a truly generous, compassionate American.

She wants to give $5,000 to every baby born in our country. (I assume she extends this largesse to Mexican babies born here of illegal aliens.)

For sure, Hillary won't be writing $5,000 checks from her own personal account! She plans to make each of us cough up the bucks to pay for another one of her Marxist, and vote-getting schemes.

Those who are "intelligence-challenged", ahem, will lap it up with glee.




Harmony:
Thats exactly why everyone should be able to make their own decisions about what is best for them. A government run program will be "one-size-fits-all". Whats best for you might not be best for me. I doubt that "HillaryCare" will be best for either one of us. A free market is the best way to provide the best set of choices for everyone.

I have no problem with providing charity or even government assistance for those who really need it (although the constitution leaves that as an option for state and local governments, not the federal government). But I have a huge problem with taking money from those who earn it and giving it to those who don't as an entitlement. And I have a huge problem with trying to control what should be private decisions.

Define "frugal"...well at different times in my life I've been very poor and I've also been very, very well off. For most of my life I never spent money on anything that wasn't really essential. I guess thats what I mean by frugal. I'm less frugal than in the past, but my family still has one car (ten years old) and my wife and I live in a 900 sq.ft. house (in a nuce area, I admit). But this is getting a bit off topic, lol.

Thanks, eastlake joe!
You have a great weekend too!

Stan
I do not want any parts of Hillary's national health care agenda...not in '93 and not now.

"Frugal" is a word my husband has used to describe himself in past years. He happened to use it again today, when I reminded him of times when he's told me I'm cheap with money. So I'm "cheap" and he's "frugal". What the h*ll's the difference?



Harmony,
LOL! I don't think there is a difference, other than "I'm frugal, other people are cheap!" :)

Reality
Stan

What would happen if you needed a very expensive procedure 6 to 7 figures to live? Do you have the money?

Just a simple question,
has Mrs. Clinton discussed her plan with anyone in the medical field? I'm curious to know what effect nationalized health care has on the quality of health care providers, and also, on the numbers of those willing to go into the field. Just curious.

Good question Chopper John
What if those aspireing to be physicians take a look at the system and decide it isn't worth it? Would the government have to force people to become doctors?

for JD's Handsome Son
JD's Handsome Son writes: "If someone can't afford to maintain their own life, then perhaps they need to simply go away and die. They have no business burdening the rest of us."

Do you REALLY want a Republican candidate to say that to the American people during a nationally televised debate with Hillary???

Instead of giving us a demonstration of your adrenal glands and your gonads, try thinking with the pre-frontal lobes of your brain that the Lord has blessed you with. And ask yourself what you would like a GOP candidate to say to the American people that might actually inspire them to VOTE for him on Election Day 2008.

?Reality?
" John Konop writes: Saturday, October, 06, 2007 5:19 AM
Reality
Stan

What would happen if you needed a very expensive procedure 6 to 7 figures to live? Do you have the money?"

I don't know how Stan would answer, but I know what I would say. I don't have the money, so without CATASTROPHIC health care coverage, I would likely die. Why do we need coverage that takes care of a little cough? When a light switch in my house needs to be replaced, I don't call an electrician, pay a deductible, file a bunch of paperwork... I take care of it myself, with the money for the new switch coming right out of my pocket. My homeowner's insurance covers CATASTROPHIC loss, and that's what we need in healthcare. I should be able to shop for a doctor that charges what I'm willing to pay. It's called the free market, and we're a long way from that today. We need to remove the tax incentives that corporations have for providing full insurance. I would fully support my employer if they would provide catastrophic only coverage (which, unfortunately, they don't).

free market - not free medicine
think for a minute.

how can a system so full of bureaucracies be efficient? it can't!

in the old days, we would go to the Dr and pay cash on the way out. we would sometimes have a payment plan with the Dr. we would go to the Dr only when we were sick. costs were out of pocket and we watched what we spent. the Dr ran an efficient office, there were 4 Drs, several nurses and a receptionist.

today
the health plans cover all visits with a small co-pay. the incentive is to go for everything and anything because it is almost free. the Drs now have to submit claims to receive payment for their services.
the insurance companies want to minimize costs and deny claims as much as possible.
the Drs are overwhelmed with the paperwork and have to hire a staff just to deal with all of it.
many have signed onto to the pressures of the insurance companies (which are heavily influence by the Pharma companies) to push the statins, the diet (because of obesity) and other symptoms common in seniors.
many Drs see the writing on the wall. their education costs are high, their malpractice insurance is expensive, their compensation gets smaller and smaller. they got into medicine to help people, but they are finding that they cannot afford it.
they come to the realization that they have to spent even less time with patients and maximize the numbers that they see.
they breathe a heavy sigh as they get their track shoes on for another lightning round of diagnosis and 'scripts.

bottom line:
Drs are getting squeezed by lawyers and insurnace companies. who in their right mind would want to be a doctor in the US??

Pro-Life
A roundabout answer to the question: why should I have to pay for someone else's healthcare?

Are you pro-life? Because, today, thousands of people are alive only through the use of high tech medicine and/or newly developed medications. A premature infant can easily cost $1 million to keep alive. A pre-schooler with a heart defect can easily cost upwards of a quarter of million dollars to have treatment (including surgery) that enables that pre-schooler to live for decades (instead of dead at age 3). The medications, specialists, and operations that those with Parkinson's disease need to prolong life can similiarly cost hundreds of thousands of dollars over the course of a lifetime. Most people don't have the money to pay this out-of-pocket. Most insurance plans, given a choice, would exclude such individuals from their plans. So, who pays? Government does, directly; and those with insurance do, indirectly, through the cost shifting by health care providers.

Without "other people" contributing to their health care, those people would die.

So, my answer is: Pro-life ethics demands that we, as Americans, find a way to provide expensive treatment to those who need it.

John Konop:
Yes. I do.

charities would have to help
it is not fair for anyone to depend on others for their health care. it is wrong to coercively take from someone and give to someone else.

it should be up to those that are willing to contribute to charities for these services. Drs may be willing to contribute their time as may hospitals.

do you really believe that everyone has a right to the same health care that say Bill Gates has?

government is only good at limiting choices. it will drive all the good Drs from the field and we will be left with those that are willing to work for a lot less and deliver substandard service.

want to lower costs? pass tort reform where the lawyers cannot charge more than $100 per hour with a cap of $200k per year. in addition, loser pays.

we need to take the incentive out of the extortion business. we pay dearly for all of the defensive measures taken by Drs and hospitals.

It Just Makes Sense
Rich Boomker says, "With all the countries with nationalized healthcare out there, you would think that less people would be interested in this model. It such a huge failure in EVERY place it has been tried. It just doesn't work!"

Perhaps you can supply us with some examples of countries where the citizenry is clamoring to return to a system that places them in jeopardy every time they lose a job or have a family member come down with a serious disease. I know of none, and for good reason---national health care protects everyone from those kinds of risks.

Of course one can always point to elements of this country or that country's national health care system that don't work as well as they should---and conservative commentators are tireless in doing so. But we have the opportunity to study the record of 30-plus advanced industrialized countries that have such plans to pick and choose what works best.

johninoregon:
No one in this country is denied healthcare because they can't pay. If you can't pay, what you get now is government healthcare. If might not pay for things like a lung transplant, but that won't change if the government takes over the entire industry.

If you are old and require some very expensive treatment and the tax payers are restless about the cost of the entire program, would you want some politician having control over whether or not to pull the plug on you?

Clinton's hypocrisy
I read somewhere that Clinton said illegal aliens wouldn't be included in her health care system. That's kind of interesting since that is where a major part of the problem comes from. So who will pick up the tab for them? Obviously, we're not going to deny sick people treatment. Although we have had to shut hospitals because they've gone bankrupt serving the indigent, in most of the others it is the INSURANCE companies and the INSURED patients that must ultimately pay for the increase in provider costs. The government pays for nothing. It always comes back to us, the little people.

The people who can't afford insurance, still won't be able to buy it. We'll have to pay for it for them. The illegals won't be allowed to buy it. We'll pay for that. Companies will still have to provide insurance. We'll still have to buy it. Only thing that's changed is the gov't has their hands in it so new bureaucracies are created, new opportunities for graft, corruption, and campaign donations are presented. We'll end up getting less for more. Just like we always do.

What Clinton proposes to do can only cut health care costs if she adopts price controls and rationing. That is what the socialist countries do. Once that happens the pharma business will lose any attraction at all to business. Kiss R&D good-bye.

Clinton knows that and that's why she sold off her medical stock investments before she introduced her '93 plan. If her new plan is so good, she must be heavily into those stocks now.

Johninoregon
"We have 30 plus industrialized nations to study". And the systems don't work in any of them! Canada's sucks so bad they are comming here for treatments. Even when they have one of the best hospitals in the world for hernia repair they come here for the procedure because they don't have to wait six months to see a specialist. And don't say its not an emergency surgery as the intestine can drop into the hernia and choke off and kill the person.

Hillary-scare
Share a Common Purse Held by the Left = Communism

“If they say, ‘Come along with us; ...let’s waylay some harmless soul; ...throw in your lot with us, and we will share a common purse’ ---my son, don’t go along with them, do not set foot on their paths.” (Prov. 1:11-15)

hillbilly care
Does anyone remember that back in the 70's, Ted Kennedy grabbed the new Dem Senator from North Dakota, Byron Dorgan & said "let's get this socialized medicine going & the best place is in North Dakota" [hicks in fly-over-country, perhaps?]
Needless to say, North Dakotans had enough information about all the Canadians coming to AMERICA for their health care & they said....NO WAY!
It was voted down because they knew just why Canadians had to come to the states to get treated...socialized medicine is a scary idea!

Question
I understand English pretty well and I clearly heard H Clinton say that in the health care plan she proposes if we like the health insurance we have now we would not have to change. That's pretty plain: we keep seeing our present doctor. It's our choice. She did not say everyone would be forced into a government-run plan seeing government-salaried doctors. What changes is not what doctor we go to but how he gets paid. So why are conservatives insisting this is socialized medicine? They seem to be distorting and misrepresenting for political gain.

To stan
If you are basically healthy and maybe go to a doctor once every two or three years you will have no trouble paying medical costs out of pocket if you have a decent job and some savings. However, if you have an accident or major surgery or chronic illness, or your spouse does, or your child does, you may have all kinds of trouble. A significant portion of personal bankruptcy starts with medical bills. Do you have any clue what in-hospital care costs?

First, suppose you go in through the ER and they admit you. You will get a bill of $1000 or so for your ER adventures. Then suppose they decide that what you need is emergency surgery. Your numbers will look something like this: $50,000 for the surgery, $2000 a day for Intensive Care for a few post-surgical days then $1000 a day after that, $800 for the anesthesiologist, $600 for the radiologist, and a 16-page itemized bill for every plastic tube and pill and bedsheet and box of Kleenex, totalling another $23,000. They count EVERYTHING and bill for it.

A diabetic may have thousands of dollars a year cost in medications. His condition often leads to expensive amputations and 3 x week blood dialysis. A heart defibrillator costs around $70,000 plus the cost of surgery to implant it. A couple of weeks ago an extended family member of mine had to have a hip replacement based not on old age but on an athletic injury; he is only 44. A young friend was diagnosed with cancer in her early thirties; she faced two years of repeated surgeries as well as chemotherapy and radiation.

Paying such costs out-of-pocket, especially on a repeated basis, is out of the question for most middle-class people.


Incremental Hellary Care..
Back when Hillary's co-presidency was soundly rejected in 1994.. Apparently, she & her minions vowed to bring her ba----dized HillaryCare brain-child back to life.. Incrementally.
Looks too much like her, to me.. this current illegitimate, sucker-bait Expansion of the Schips bill "for poor children". It is a socialist, tax payer funded health insurance scam for "children" up to 25 year old, and employee innsured families who earn up to $83,000 dollars! This irresponsible, huge entitlement would result in back door nationalized medicine, and Dem/Clinonista control over a much larger sector of the US population. No wonder the Dems refuse to compromise.


Democratically Insane
DEMOCRATICALLY INSANE

BY LISA RICHARDS
October 7, 2007



Voting democrats into the White House would be akin unlocking the doors off padded cells in an insane asylum: you don’t let crazies loose to mingle amongst normal human beings.

September 26, 2007’s Dartmouth, New Hampshire Democrat Debate was absolute proof America can not afford to have lunatics named Clinton, Edwards, or Obama running the country. Each one wants to pull troops killing the murderers of humanity out of Iraq, only leaving a small number to guard the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad.

Oh, that will protect our homeland from Islamic loons plotting to come to the States to kill us all. Yes, let’s fight them on U.S. soil versus Iraqi soil. 9/11 was not explosive enough. Not enough people died to satisfy liberals. We need a really heavy bloodbath, like say, 30 million Americans dead for liberals to say: gee, ya think maybe staying in Iraq and fighting the freaks there is better than New York, Boston, Washington, L.A., San Francisco, Chicago, Phoenix, Miami, Atlanta, Dallas, Fort Worth, Minneapolis, Seattle, Newark, Detroit, and all the places in between?

Liberals are the very definition of insanity. Anyone who wants to stop killing evil where evil dwells and put America in the position of evil returning for another bombing is an insalubrious idiot...

for rest of column visit my blog

copyright 2007 Lisa Richards
http://www.lisa-richards.com
E-mail: lisa-richards@lisa-richards.com



Lilly
"We can keep the health care we have.... Why are conservatives against it?" Just who do you think is going to pay for those who don't have insurance? The tooth fairy? I have good insurance and am mostly satisfied with it. Why should I pay for you? You libers have still not answered that yet other than to say "It's the humanitarian thing to do". To that I say kiss where I can't and I don't mean my elbow. If I want to give to charity, fine I will. Don't make me do it as that isn't humanitarianism it's theft!!!

Lilly:
I know very well what medical care costs. While I am currently healthy (and do my best to stay that way), I have survived one cancer (and paid my own bills). I know what a lung transplant costs because my sister needed one a few years ago. And I know what a few months in intensive care costs.

I never anyone else should do without insurance (although most people would be better off with lower cost high-deductable policies). The point I was making was that everyone should be free to choose the best solution based on their own needs and resources. A one-size-fits-all government ssolution is the best solution for very few.

Also, needs change over time, as do a person's finances. There have been times in my life when I've had very little and needed insurance just in case. That was when I was younger and healthier. But now I am in a position to cover most anything that could concievable come up.

Does Bill Gates need health insurance? (I'm certainly not in that league, but I have started a number of companies and have done well enough to pay my own bills without insurance.) Or could he pay for his own medical bills?

Government run health care will greatly reduce your freedom to choose whats best for you. And it will also gradually diminish quality and availability.

And Lilly,
"I understand English pretty well and I clearly heard H Clinton say that in the health care plan she proposes if we like the health insurance we have now we would not have to change."
That would be true for most people at the start (but not for me, since she also said insurance would be mandatory). But she also said insurance companies would be required to cover anyone who walked in the door, no matter what the risks were. The insurance company's costs would go up, leaving them with three choices: 1. raise their rates, 2. reduce the amount they pay out to bring costs in line with revenues, or 3. go out of business.

Meanwhile, the government plan would be subsidized by the tax payers. It would have to be. Since its required, the voters would demand that it be affordable. Then, more and more people would leave the private plans and go with the lower cost (subsidized) government plan. How long would it take to drive out private insurers?

Next, since there would be a single payer, or close to it, the government would dictate how much would be paid for any particular procedure. Actual costs would not change however, so quality and availability would suffer.

And if there is a single payer, doctors would be government employees in everything but name. And you would have one and only one choice. The old Hillery care implemented gradually through the back door.

And it would be extremely difficult to go back to a market based system.


And consider this, Lilly:
Do you really want the government to require you to pay for my healthcare?
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