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Wednesday, May 07, 2008
John Stossel :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Left Is Wrong
by John Stossel
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She was once the darling of conservatives like Newt Gingrich, but now you can't watch a television news-talk program without seeing her calling for more government and showing scorn for those who want less.

She's Arianna Huffington, website impresario and author of "Right Is Wrong: How the Lunatic Fringe Hijacked America, Shredded the Constitution and Made Us All Less Safe".

I interviewed her for "20/20" last week because I was impressed by the success of the website she created. In just three years she made the Huffington Post a hot liberal opinion site.

What happened to Huffington's beliefs? In 1994, she worked to promote the Gingrich Revolution. She appeared at political events with Bob Dole.

"I definitely called myself a conservative," she told me. "I actually believed that the private sector would be able to address a lot of the issues that I believed were very important, like taking care of those in need. And then I saw firsthand how difficult it was. ... One of the problems with the Right is that they don't believe in facts, and they don't believe in evidence. And I was willing to change my mind, confronted with new evidence. And we would all be better off if we were willing to look at new evidence."

So she turned to big government.

"What we need is serious government policies to address poverty."

But they don't work, I said.

"They don't work as well as they should be working, but there's a lot more we can do."

She believes the old AFDC (Aid to Families with Dependent Children) program helped the poor and therefore welfare reform was not a good thing.

"[Reform was] not a success. A lot of people have been left without job training and therefore without the ability to really lead productive lives."

I pointed out that since welfare reform, eight million people left the welfare rolls, and many found jobs they like, jobs that pay better than welfare. Although her favorite political candidates say life for the poor has gotten worse, incomes of the poorest Americans are actually higher today.

Confronted with a chart showing that, Huffington acknowledged that lower-income people are generally better off.

"In general. In general ... But you know we have over 30 million Americans living below the poverty line."

But the Census Bureau says the percentage of families living below the poverty line fell from 11 percent in 1996 to 9.8 percent in 2006. The percentage of single mothers below the poverty line fell from 32.6 percent in 1996 to 28.3 in 2006. That looks like progress to me.

But Huffington had this retort: "The fact that we used to live in caves is not a justification for the state of affairs right now."

Like most liberals, she believes America needs more regulation. OSHA (Occupational Safety and Health Administration) should be strengthened to protect workers.

I tried to acquaint her with the facts. While it's true that since OSHA started, deadly job accidents have dropped, the truth is, deaths were dropping before OSHA. Between the late 1930s and 1971, job fatalities fell from more than 40 to fewer than 20 per 100,000 workers. After OSHA was passed, fatalities continued to fall, but no faster than before. It's misleading to credit regulation for the improvement. Government gets in front of a parade and pretends to lead it.

Huffington's reply: "If you were the husband of one of the women who died recently because OSHA regulations were not sufficiently implemented, you would not be so cavalier about the speed at which things get better."

As if the government could guarantee zero job deaths.

Huffington has also joined the war on global warming. "We have two Priuses," she says.

I pointed out that she also has a $7-million house that burns more carbon than a hundred people in the Third World. She said:

"There is no question that the fact that I'm living in a big house, I occasionally travel on private planes -- all those things are contradictions. I'm not setting myself up as some paragon who only goes around on a bicycle."

That honesty is a relief. If only she and others would own up to the other contradictions in the Left's call for endlessly intrusive government.

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About The Author
John Stossel blogs at http://blogs.abcnews.com/johnstossel/ is an award-winning news correspondent and author of Myths, Lies, and Downright Stupidity: Get Out the Shovel--Why Everything You Know is Wrong.
 
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Typical Liberal
Huffington was always liberal, I don't care if she once supported Gingrich. Heck, Clinton once supported Goldwater, and now look at her.

The thing that sets a liberal apart is that they look at the evidence, and see that the free market doesn't work THE WAY THEY WANT IT TO WORK. Hence, it must be regulated.

Facts
I thought it was hilarious that Huffington says that Republicans don't like facts, and then she just ignores every fact that goes against her interest.

And it's nice to know that she has 2 Priuses in her 8-car garage.

She's a hack, plain and simple. Marry a rich guy, get a divorce, and spend the rest of your life being a useful idiot. Only in America.

Arianna didn't huff enough
Her husband left her and turned "gay." That surely explains all you need to know about this "woman."

Hillary's facts
This same kind of thing is seen most recently (and shockingly) in Hillary's refusal to accept the fact that the supply of gasoline is inelastic and therefore the reduction of a tax won't lower prices. Despite what over 200 economists tell her, and the evidence of what happened when it was done in individual states earlier, she insists that if SHE is in charge, she'll be smart enough to make it work. Her next task: coming up with a way to reverse gravity. Physicists say it's darn near impossible, but if she's on the job you can bet she'll get it done. Just like John Edwards was going to make Christopher Reeve walk. Talk about audacity...

All you need to know
Huffington paid for her house by being what every liberal most loves: a convert. She is, in a word, an opportunist. The laugh is on them.

Thank You John!
I wonder what kind of questions she thought she was going to hear before the interview? And I can only imagine what kind of language was used to her handlers for getting her on 20-20.

If only liberals like Al Gore could get these kind of questions instead of the hero worshiping questions like - 'Are you sure you don't want to run for president?'.

Keep up the good work John. Keep everyone honest.

The Cyclist -- Expectations
"I wonder what kind of questions she thought she was going to hear before the interview?"

Hey, they told her she was going to be interviewed by this famous reporter from ABC's 20/20, one of Barbara Walter's cohorts. What do you think she thought?

John ...be prepared ...
Great article John ...and great job exposing the 'HuffPo in Chief' as being willfully ignorant as the raving loons that frequent her web site to get their 'facts'.

What a pathetic bunch. Facts ...as well as 'truth' mean nothing to a Marxist worshiping liberal nut-job. The end justifies the means. Their methodology and ludicrous beliefs will never change regardless to how often and how miserably their ideas fail!

Thomas Sowell nails their mind-set in "The Vision of the Anointed". Their arrogant elitist opinion of themselves and self-exaltation to the ranks of High Priests and Priestesses are analogous to a religious cult that seeks to sensor and silence all 'heretics'.

Huffington's reply: "If you were the husband of one of the women who died recently because OSHA regulations were not sufficiently implemented, you would not be so cavalier about the speed at which things get better."

...was nothing more than the usual attempt to vilify anyone that dares to question their 'holy' proclamations.

Our betters speak--again
Overpopulation will destroy us. No, wait. The economy will collapse (worse, I may not have a gardener) unless we allow unrestricted immigration. The next ice age may arrive any minute now. No, wait. Our greenhouse gases will melt the polar caps and wreck the planet. Like most on the left, Huffington can change sides without losing her conviction of rightness. She knows better than ordinary slobs, and those who don't get with the ever-changing program are either stupid or evil. If only we could stop giving these pismires the time of day.

Great job John ...but ...
be prepared for the death wishes by her devoted disciples who post on her web site and the Daily Coz.

Thomas Sowell nailed liberals like her in his "The Vision of the Anointed'. These self-appointed and self-exalted arrogant elitists closely resemble a religious cult. The capitalism hating 'High Priests and Priestesses' of the far left adhere to the same methodology of their Marxist mentors and friends. Their end justifies the means ...no matter how often or how miserably their ideas and 'solutions to an imagined crises' fail ...they will never admit the fallacy of their beliefs.

Any disagreement with them will be considered as 'heresy' and motivated by evil intent.

That's exactly what she was alluding to when she (Huffington) replied: "If you were the husband of one of the women who died recently because OSHA regulations were not sufficiently implemented, you would not be so cavalier about the speed at which things get better."

A perfect example of how the left tries to vilify anyone that dares to contradict their 'supreme edicts'.

My apologies for...
the near identical posting. I thought I had accidentally deleted a post that I had nearly completed ..and tried to re-post my thoughts again.

This woman is the typical
limosine liberal and hasn't got a clue. But everyone can count on one thing, HalD will be on hear today singing her virtues.

The big question is what will be the words to the song since she doesn't have any.

KL, you, like most us, probably ...
wear many hats throughout the day. Your 6:34am post indicates you're wearing your comedy hat this morning. Thanks for the laugh!

photogbill
"Thomas Sowell nails their mind-set in 'The Vision of the Anointed'. Their arrogant elitist opinion of themselves and self-exaltation to the ranks of High Priests and Priestesses are analogous to a religious cult that seeks to sensor and silence all 'heretics'."

Exactly, just as Hayek does in _The Fatal Conceit_.

Sowell's analogy with religion is interesting. The Left always seems to be out to save the world--heard Obama say that at the end of a speech.

But you cannot save the world. Man cannot be perfected. We might progress materially, but not morally.

Forgive me if I have you pegged ...
wrong, lonestarblues, but your last sentence is interesting to me. I agree in one sense that man cannot be perfected, but do you believe we have no hope of moving toward being moral or, since it's not possible, why try?

FROG
"do you believe we have no hope of moving toward being moral or, since it's not possible, why try?"

I believe that liberty, or free will, entails a moral responsibility to do our best to choose good over evil in our interactions with others. But we are by nature flawed, corrupt, and cannot be perfect, or perfected. To think so is what Sowell means by the unconstrained vision, Hayek the fatal flaw.

I like John Stossel
John, You have a great way of pointing out the falacies of all the pseudoscience, political correctness and the liberal left. It is maddening hearing a leftist say the right does not let facts get in the way of our beliefs. Is that the pot calling the kettle black or what? We can all take the same facts or numbers and use them to "prove" our beliefs are true. Thomas Sowell is correct in his "Vision of the Annointed". The left's "feel good" philosophies regarding many issues either create new problems or exaserbate existing ones. More government is NOT the answer. Unless you think the USSR, The People's Republic of China, Vietnam and Cuba are perfect examples of where the left wants to go. Why they want to go there I have no clue. I guess I need an annointed one to tell me.

how did the witch
get her house. she married it, then divorced it. in other words, she didn't earn it herself so she has no problem with others being given stuff by gov they also didn't earn.

Below the poverty line?
Poverty in America is a relative thing. If every one in the country was making over $100 K per year, the poverty line would start there. You will always have a poverty line. And there will always be people living under it.

Some people simply don't have the ambition to be wealthy or even middle class. They don't want the responsibility. I have been a landlord and when my renters didn't pay rent, I went over to their residence to try and collect. The man of the house was a perfectly healthy mid 30's husband and father who was always in front of the t.v. (some way the cable bill always got paid) but he was trying to push thru a disability claim so he could spend the rest of his life getting paid to do nothing. His wife worked, but only nine months of the year because she was employed as a school janitor.

Whenever I went to their house in the evenings or on weekends, they were sitting in the house playing cards with friends while the grass in the yard was knee high, the kids were dirty and the house would surely have been condemned by the board of health had they been notified of the filth. No type of government assistance is going to help people like this short of giving them a check every week so they can continue to live a life of sloth.

This is what the Clintons, Obamas and Huffingtons of the world just can't understand.

DUMB bunny.
DUMB bunny. Her own words speak for her. I watched my mom deal with OSHA. You can't depend on the government because you can't depend on the integrity of it's employees. Yes, Huffington put your faith in government. Government has all the answers and will solve all our problems. By all means throw more of my money at it. Meanwhile, I think you are making out quite well in the real world echoing liberal montras. What a niche you have found for yourself.

M Sederoff
Actually, I beleive your last paragraph may be in error. The Clintons, Obamas and the Huffingtons understand these people very well, that's the kind of people that they can get to vote for them. All you have to do is get that government check to them and they'll vote as many times as you ask.

Facts are Inconvenient
One of the luxuries of being rich and successful is eliminating the inconveniences of life. Don't like cooking? Hire a chef or eat out! Don't like cleaning? Hire a maid! Don't like sharing an airplane with strangers? Take a private jet!

Don't like facing reality? Become a liberal! Like the other solutions above, it may cost you money and let some skills atrophy, but at least you get short-term comfort and a sense of importance when you spout your airy opinions.

That's the trap Arianna Huffington fell into. And the odd thing is, she's advocating the brute force the lummox called government is famous for, instead of the delicate solutions from the private (both for-profit and non-profit) sector.

If Huffington doesn't care for ...
... America's treatment of the poor, she can always go back to Greece where everyone's income is above average.

Damn, I'm tired of foreigners living off the benefits of our country and then criticizing the U.S. If you don't like it here, don't let the door hit you in the a** on the way out!

Feeling Not Thinking
Its nice to be compassionate. But America's poor don't need compassion. They need a moral compass and discipline.

Liberals and especially women don't understand this. Thats why single moms produce much higher rates of bums and sluts.

I'm with Ann Coulter. "If women were denied the vote we would never have another liberal president.

KL, about that comedian hat ...
you may want to check it. I fear is has become too tight!

John Stossel: US vs Norway
The US and Norway's have the same precipitate GDP.... But Norwegians are much better off than Americans.

Why? Not because of bigger government, but because government addresses the issues of the population better.

Under Conservatives the US government has grown just as fast or faster than under Liberal administrations... But the key difference is to what end.

Conservatism administrations have only grown government to increase social, political and economic inequalities....

Liberals on the whole have grown government to decrease inequalities.... And more telling liberals have been more likely to shrink government...

The facts speak for themselves.... Liberals... Tend to be libertarians as we would expect, and as such respect individual liberty and small government more often than conservatives.

Vic
"This woman is the typical
limosine liberal and hasn't got a clue. But everyone can count on one thing, HalD will be on hear today singing her virtues. "

You bet I will LOL. Just because a smart person woke up and stopped being a deadbeat conservative your heads spin around???

Look at this country your failed form of virulant conservatism has removed us from leader of the free world, far from the top in education, sciences, medicine, development... shall I go on? While you happily consumed all the riches left by the greatest generation you paid little or nothing back. Your biggest failing is your inability to look to the future and invest and plan. While you shudder in fear from serious but far from life threatening enemies, you invest in nothing and greedily comsume our seed corn. I think that is what Huffington meant. She woke up perhaps you should too

RA
"..Its nice to be compassionate. But America's poor don't need compassion. They need a moral compass and discipline."

BS they need jobs and a decent income. Funny how when you you have some pride and encouragement you can move mountains. look at what the military does. And almost by definition that is a what you folks wrongly call a socialist organization

"Liberals and especially women don't understand this. Thats why single moms produce much higher rates of bums and sluts."

LMAO which are you? Talking like that it seems pretty clear that you are one or the other or maybe both

"I'm with Ann Coulter. "If women were denied the vote we would never have another liberal president. "

Ahhhhh you must be a guy. I wager you are both too. Am I right?

She is nothing but a capitalist.
She was conservative when she thought it's get her what she wanted. But she joined the new crop of people to capitalize on liberalism. The Moore Gore crowd.
Ironic Eh?

An embarrassment
Arianna Huffington was an embarrassment to conservatives when she was on Buckley's side on "Firing Line." As a "conservative," She didn't even sound like she believed what she was saying in the debates, and the liberal opposition routinely tore her apart.

simpleminded level of analysis
Obviously, if Stossel was less simpleminded in his approach he would separate the change in poverty rates during the first 5 years of welfare reform when the major implementation was an increase in government spending on training and the like, from the period after when the time limits kicked in, and there was more of an emphasis on the getting people off of the roles.

But if he did, he would find that the first half was the successful half, while the second half was not. So effectively he is using the success of the Clinton period to cover up the lack of success of the Bush period. (This is only partionaly fair. It is true that the strong balanced economy under Clinton helped the poor more than the tilt towards the rich Bush policies. But the time limits of welfare reform would have kicked in even under a democratic president.)

Ariana the Pollyanna...
Arianna was somehow irretrievably inoculated with the liberal hypodermic needle...maybe it was Bill's unfailing charm, who knows?
In any event, John's conversation with her reveals what we conservatives face every day, or at least every time we attempt to engage a liberal in dialogue. Inevitably it degenerates (sometimes immediately) into "I believe..." statements and ad hominem attacks on either the source of our facts or ourselves.
In the arena of ideas, today's Demo-gogues are literally unarmed. They appeal not to reason or fact but to feelings and beliefs. Look at Obama's slogan: "Change We Can Believe In" - ignoring the dangling participle, it's empty. Look at Hillary's slogan: "Hillary" - as if that carries enough meaning for any smart person to understand.
McCain at least tries to engage in substantive talk, although he keeps tripping over his own ego as he does so. No matter which way the November Presidential vote comes out we're in for a rough ride I'm afriad, because none of the three hopefuls is really "in touch" with America.

Huffington
talks authoritively about matters about which she knows little. As a social worker I have worked with those on ADC. It ruined them.

How many times I went to their homes to find them all in bed until noon(children not in school). They had no pride no incentive and at best were creating the next generation to carry on in the same manner.

She talks about liberals dealing in facts. Well. it is a fact that liberal assistance to those who wouldn't work failed them.




innovation
If you want innovation and a strong economy you have to provide some basic things.

One: Health security.
Two: Access to information.
Three: Access to the mean of production.

If any of these are missing, then innovation becomes negatively effected.


Huffington
Had she not gotten a large divorce settlement and if she did not speak with a foreign accent, no one would listen to her. She was liberal. She was conservative. She is liberal, again. She gravitates to where she will get the most attention.

uber
"per capita" is the term you are looking for.

The Principal
"...Inevitably it degenerates (sometimes immediately) into "I believe..." statements and ad hominem attacks on either the source of our facts or ourselves."

LMAO You ONLY deal in ""I believe..." statements" witness your god and gay agendas. Fear and greed are all you have to offer. Heck if your type of conservatism ruled during WWII or the Cold War we would be speaking German or have been incenerated. It really is about competency and results - you folks have demonstrated neither

"... No matter which way the November Presidential vote comes out we're in for a rough ride I'm afriad, because none of the three hopefuls is really "in touch" with America. "

Ahh see it is YOU who is out of touch. Come out of your bunker and talk to folks. Get involved maybe take instead of teach a course or two. Your extreme conservative values are completely discredited. Don't "believe me" well just sit back and watch the 08 elections

H. D. Schmidt
"...Yes, all the while America sinks deeper and deeper morally! You asks me for a reason and I have one for you: America is now the mass grave of over 50+ million of unborn babies and the bitcher shops daily murder thousands more.

Can there be a more God insulting thing than to murder the innocent ones for no other reason than materialistic/satanic convenince?"

What about all the abortions that God herself causes? Are you counting those?

But using torture is ok?

Lon
Lon:
smoke and mirrors work with obama's crowd, not here. Somewhere you took a wrong turn and entered the 3-dimensional universe. Exit please, stage way left.

zedsmom
"...Had she not gotten a large divorce settlement and if she did not speak with a foreign accent, no one would listen to her. "

They certainly would they did before the settlement and was one of your darlings?

"She was liberal. She was conservative. She is liberal, again. She gravitates to where she will get the most attention. "

Now why say that? Isn't she entitled to adapt with the times? There was a time long ago when Republicans were actually honorable

Hal arrives
Can Robert be far behind?

What would TH do without them?

The drivel they feel compelled to force upon us. Yep! Pure nonsense. Comments so poorly constructed they do more harm to the "liberal thinking process" than good.

What would we do without our in-house liberals-Robert and Hal? They do one thing well, however. Their special talent?

Comic relief.







uber ...
have you and KL linked up this moring to see who could make the funniest post? Man, you guys are on a roll this morning! Liberals are libertarians and respect personal property rights. Man, how do you come up with this stuff? I'm in stitches!

Obama Will Fix Everything
As soon as we elect Obama gas prices will go down to $2, poverty will disappear and everyone will get Beverly Hills style medical care for FREE! Arianna says so and she must be right. John Stossel and his so-called 'facts' are just a smokescreen to shield the lies of the Bush-Cheney cabal which wants to kill poor people and children to increase capitalist profits. Arianna hasnt fixed the weather YET but as soon as Obama takes office the climate will certainly change for the better.

if the shoe fits
"Are you better off now than 4 (8) years ago?"

RR's famous catch line for the trauma of the 70s. If you really think the country is better off now than 8 years ago, continue to live in lala land.

Stossel refers to the census report and pulls one set of beliefs from it. I look at it and shudder. He thinks 15% of the population living in poverty is acceptable. I do not.

Another famous aphorism was "a rising tide lifts all ships". Unfortunately for Repubs, the inverse is true. In a recession everyone drops.

Now that the economy is in a shambles, deficit spending will cause massive inflation. What will that do to the lowest earners? And the welfare safety net is no longer there.

The priority difference between us is that you will cheerfully spend (waste for me) a trillion dollars in Iraq while I would rather spend (waste for you) a 100 billion dollars on poor at home.

Just like most liberals....
Ms. Huffington attained her wealth the easy way and now feels so guilty that she want eveyone else to pay.
"Do as I say, not as I do" must the liberal mantra.
Actual working experience and observing those who will not take responsibility for themselves are the cure for liberalism, two things she obviously has not seen.

skep41
"Obama Will Fix Everything
As soon as we elect Obama gas prices will go down to $2, poverty will disappear and everyone will get Beverly Hills style medical care for FREE! Arianna says so and she must be right. "

Yet another conservative lie. The country is broke and fixing it will not be easy and it will be expensive. That is the position of all the presidential candidates and Huffington

"John Stossel and his so-called 'facts' are just a smokescreen to shield the lies of the Bush-Cheney cabal which wants to kill poor people and children to increase capitalist profits. Arianna hasnt fixed the weather YET but as soon as Obama takes office the climate will certainly change for the better. "

What the conservatives learned from Rush was how to lie with real, honest facts. Pick one correct "fact" then pack a lot of propaganda around it to pass that off as "fact" too.

HalD...
the man of a thousand angry platitudes. Get lost you man pleazin' fatazz.

badboy
LMAO feel better??? That was helpful wasn't it?

ca
"..Damn, I'm tired of foreigners living off the benefits of our country and then criticizing the U.S. If you don't like it here, don't let the door hit you in the a** on the way out! "

Why can't you compete in the real marketplace?

Huff and Puff
Liberalism is a mental disorder and Huffy the Puffy is just a mouthy brainless idiot. Liberalism and big government has solved NOTHING!

Hal
ca
"..Damn, I'm tired of foreigners living off the benefits of our country and then criticizing the U.S. If you don't like it here, don't let the door hit you in the a** on the way out! "

Why can't you compete in the real marketplace?
-----------------------------

Hal, I don't get what you are asking me. Please explain.

BHL
Typical of your side's tactics. Stossel never said 15% poverty is acceptable to him. He was using numbers to refute the fallacies and idiocy coming out of Huffington's mouth. Not only are the numbers better, but the true story is better than the numbers. Liberals like you keep moving the bar way up so that you can continue to use poverty as way of self loathing your country. A great majority of the poor own a car, have air-conditioning, have a home, television, electricity, running water, etc. Now, go ask someone in Africa or most anyone in another country if this is their definition of "poor."

ca
"ca writes: Wednesday, May, 07, 2008 12:36 PM

"..Damn, I'm tired of foreigners living off the benefits of our country and then criticizing the U.S. If you don't like it here, don't let the door hit you in the a** on the way out! "

Why can't you compete in the real marketplace?
-----------------------------

Hal, I don't get what you are asking me. Please explain. "

Certainly, this country was built in a large part by competition often immigrant competition. You should embrace competition both of ideas and ability. It should keep you on your toes and make you stronger and better if you can't compete perhaps you should embrace them. The mere fact that Arianna is such a success means she offers the marketplace something we did not have or do.

For Uber
Health care: Nobody is denied care in this country. It's called *Medicaid* if you can't pay, the county health clinics dispense necessary vaccines, birth control and even mamograms for free if yoy can't pay, and no emergency room can refuse to treat you.

Information and access to the means of production: You're kidding, right? The so-called "poor" have just as much access to newspaper want ads, Internet job listings and radio as the rest of us. Even grocery store bulletin boards and churches are good sources for something, anything, if you really want to work. Everyone has to start somewhere, and it's just a fact of life that it's usually at the bottom.

In other words, nobody in this country HAS to be poor. But there are those who would rather be poor than work. I owe them nothing, thank you.

Here's an idea: have a point
I’m not really certain what the point of Mr. Stossel’s post is. Is he saying no more can be done to combat poverty or that it is not even a problem? The Census Bureau’s most recent data from 2006 indicates there are 36.5 million Americans living in poverty. Yes, many people are off welfare, but there is still a “working poor” class in this country. They are one group of people living in poverty, which also includes retirees and children. It seems to me Mr. Stossel simply wanted to write a petty and vindictive article about Arianna Huffington and scarcely anything else. Even a cursory glance at her website will tell you her opinion is not the only one being espoused there.

Riteaidbob
"Liberalism is a mental disorder and Huffy the Puffy is just a mouthy brainless idiot. Liberalism and big government has solved NOTHING! "

WWII for one small thing. But remember your version of extreme conservatism has not accomplished anything but stunning incompetence

Cookie/BHL
".... Liberals like you keep moving the bar way up so that you can continue to use poverty as way of self loathing your country."

LMAO you know other than the loathing the country part you may well be correct. Moving the bar was how everyone got roads, telephones, electricity all as a result of us raising that bar. Guess what I hope we never stop. As far as the "loathing" part it isn't us living in fear clutching our guns afraid of living that would be extreme conservatives

" A great majority of the poor own a car, have air-conditioning, have a home, television, electricity, running water, etc. Now, go ask someone in Africa or most anyone in another country if this is their definition of "poor."

LMAO I love it. Well with the way you have damaged the economy more folks here might be living more like people in Africa...but you like that. Wonder if you will be one of them? You are only one major accident or disease away most likely

Liberal Observations
In reading the posts of the liberal visitors to this website; it seems evident to me that they want to judge everyone else's actions, but be judged ONLY on their intentions.

T C
What would TH be without them? .... a breath of fresh air!

People like Hal D, Bleeding Heart and ..
King Liberal throw around some terms as if they really mean something. One of my favorites is the cry of poverty. Ohh, poor, poor Americans living in poverty. You want poverty? Visit some places like Haiti or Guatemala. You'll see what true poverty is.

The most rediculous thing about poverty in America is how it is measured. Namely, by income only. So a family of four who lives on $19k income is in poverty. What they DON"T consider is all the forms of assistance they receive that boosts their real income by thousands of dollars. Secion 8 housing allowance, food stamps, medicaid, free or reduced lunches for school kids, and the list goes on.

Name me one place in the world, other than the US, where poverty stricken people have multiple cars, airconditioned homes, cell phones, cable and satellite TV, AND are obese from overeating? We FINALLY joined the 21st century last summer by getting BASIC cable. While Joe Blow on welfare could afford it, I couldn't because I decided to responsible and pay for the children I sired.

You libs and your lack of asking people to be responsible and accountable make me sick! YOU and YOUR ilk will be the death of this once great country.

Hal Doofus 9:23am
"You bet I will LOL. Just because a smart person woke up and stopped being a deadbeat conservative your heads spin around???"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

You mean just because a smart person found a way to make alot of money fooling deadbeat liberals!

Hal Doofus 9:33am
"Look at this country your failed form of virulant conservatism has removed us from leader of the free world, far from the top in education, sciences, medicine, development... shall I go on? While you happily consumed all the riches left by the greatest generation you paid little or nothing back. Your biggest failing is your inability to look to the future and invest and plan. While you shudder in fear from serious but far from life threatening enemies, you invest in nothing and greedily comsume our seed corn. I think that is what Huffington meant. She woke up perhaps you should too"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Hal Doofus just described the Liberal Movement of the last 50 years.

Umm, Hal, you'd better be ...
careful. All that LMAO will leave you with nothing to sit on your scrawny shoulders!

AliveInHim
"Health care: Nobody is denied care in this country. It's called *Medicaid* if you can't pay, the county health clinics dispense necessary vaccines, birth control and even mamograms for free if yoy can't pay, and no emergency room can refuse to treat you."

The very poor are looked after fairly well if close to a physician who will accept them. The working poor, you know the folks working two or three jobs with no healthcare and owning a house etc gets nothing but overcharged etc.

anyone can be seen at an ER but over crowded ERs mean you may not get seen quickly and die. ER's are required to provide immediate care not to treat the cause.

"Information and access to the means of production: You're kidding, right? The so-called "poor" have just as much access to newspaper want ads, Internet job listings and radio as the rest of us. "

Not true at all I mean you folks are even cutting back on library budgets and hours. Internet??? Huh? and that assumes that they can read and write because of our collapsing education system many cannot read

"Even grocery store bulletin boards and churches are good sources for something, anything, if you really want to work. "

If you have transportation and are near a grocery store many no longer do business in poor areas. churchs????

"Everyone has to start somewhere, and it's just a fact of life that it's usually at the bottom."

LMAO nice

"In other words, nobody in this country HAS to be poor. But there are those who would rather be poor than work. I owe them nothing, thank you. "

Actually I can think of one thing for certain that you owe them: your misfounded sense of superiority

Hal Doofus 9:49am
"BS they need jobs and a decent income. Funny how when you you have some pride and encouragement you can move mountains. look at what the military does. And almost by definition that is a what you folks wrongly call a socialist organization"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Why should the poor work; welfare, SSI, and food stamps give them everything they need.

Please talk to a Marine and ask if any Conservatives ever called the military a socialist organization. I must have laughed for 10 minutes Hal when I read what you wrote.

Hal Doofus 9:49am
"Liberals and especially women don't understand this. Thats why single moms produce much higher rates of bums and sluts."

LMAO which are you? Talking like that it seems pretty clear that you are one or the other or maybe both


How intelligent and courageous of you Hal Doofus! Please feel feel to find out where this person lives, walk right up to their door, and tell this to their face.

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Our citizenship requirements are too lax
And Arianna Huffington is living proof of that.

Hillary delenda est.

Hal Doofus 9:49am
"I'm with Ann Coulter. "If women were denied the vote we would never have another liberal president. "

Ahhhhh you must be a guy. I wager you are both too. Am I right?


Your intelligence and courage never cease to amaze me. Please Hal Doofus, find this person and say it to their face!

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha,
ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, oooohh somebody please, help me, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!

Are you serious Hal when you say this:
"anyone can be seen at an ER but over crowded ERs mean you may not get seen quickly and die."?

You are referring to American hospitals are you? Check this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_Rf42zNl9U

Is THAT the type of system you wnat here? Well, dammit, leave us our imperfect system and you can just move north to get what you want. No one's stopping you.

Hal Doofus 10:33am
"LMAO You ONLY deal in ""I believe..." statements" witness your god and gay agendas. Fear and greed are all you have to offer. Heck if your type of conservatism ruled during WWII or the Cold War we would be speaking German or have been incenerated. It really is about competency and results - you folks have demonstrated neither"


LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Hey Doofus, check out the "Gay" policy the US Army had during WW2.

What an idiot!

Hal Doofus 10:47am
"What about all the abortions that God herself causes? Are you counting those?

But using torture is ok?"


LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Let me get this straight Hal Doofus. You are saying that God causes abortions?

I suggest you read the Book of Job.

(Before you leave this world, I pray that you do some serious thinking about what you just said.)

Hal Doofus 10:50am
"She was liberal. She was conservative. She is liberal, again. She gravitates to where she will get the most attention. "

Now why say that? Isn't she entitled to adapt with the times?

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

So let me get this straight. Liberalism is only a "Fad"?

Nothing is constant. There is no moral compass. Everyone should just do what "feels" good to them at the time?

This keeps getting better and better!

Hal Doofus 11:34am
"What the conservatives learned from Rush was how to lie with real, honest facts. Pick one correct "fact" then pack a lot of propaganda around it to pass that off as "fact" too."

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Talk about "shooting" the messenger! Why don't you just come out and say John Stossel lied in his article? I mean why "beat around the bush" (I thought you would like that use of an old saying!).

Gee, Hal Doofus, why don't you say, "John Stossel, your mother wears army shoes!"

Or you could say: "Your mother was a hamster. And your father smelled of elderberries."

Hal Doofus 12:47pm
"WWII for one small thing. But remember your version of extreme conservatism has not accomplished anything but stunning incompetence"


LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Gee, for some reason I thought that the soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen (like my father; 3 victories in P40's) who won the war.

Thank you Hal Doofus for explaining that it was the GOVERNMENT that won the war.

I will be sure to go to my local schools and tell their history teachers to stop putting out such falsehoods and lies like they have been doing for the last 50 years.

LAUGH MY A*S OFF AGAIN!

Okay, Gray Ghost....
NOW YOU'VE GONE TOO FAR! How dare you waste a perfectly good taunt from Monty Python on the likes of Hal? Heck, even a Sid Ceasar of Don Rickles slap is too good for him. You must go lower. Try a Bill Mahr quip. That's more his level.

Hal Doofus 12:58pm
"LMAO you know other than the loathing the country part you may well be correct. Moving the bar was how everyone got roads, telephones, electricity all as a result of us raising that bar. Guess what I hope we never stop. As far as the "loathing" part it isn't us living in fear clutching our guns afraid of living that would be extreme conservatives"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF, WITH MY FLINTLOCK RIFLE IN MY HAND!

Yep, I gotta hand it to you Hal Doofus! I now know that the long hunters, Lewis & Clark, the mountain men, and the plainsmen were "living in fear, clutching their guns".

The history lesson I am getting today is priceless!

Gee, I am also an electrical engineer (30 years experienced, licensed in 4 states). I now know that "raising the bar" was how we got electricity and telephones.

However, in your case was that a wet bar, a liquor bar, or a sushi bar?

Sorry Frog
But I am on a roll!

Rob
"Heck if your type of conservatism ruled during WWII or the Cold War we would be speaking German or have been incenerated"

Look this is real. What have you folks delivered? I mean a real serious question. Everything you have done has been a failure. By you I mean the folks here who while praising Reagon would be calling him a RINO if he were president now. The extreme conservative's had total control for six years and produced a record of failure seldom seen

"...What about all the abortions that God herself causes? Are you counting those? "

Abortions are frequent in nature. To compare a living breathing human with a weeks old fetus is complete nonsense and trivializes real horrors and murders

"What's happened??"

the complete total callusness of many here

"...you think generally that government has most of the answers to our problems (where we believe they lie with the individual)...."

We believe we ARE the government that is the huge difference. Government works for us all of us. If there is any fear the government should fear the people; not the people fear the government



Hal Doofus 12:58pm
"LMAO I love it. Well with the way you have damaged the economy more folks here might be living more like people in Africa...but you like that. Wonder if you will be one of them? You are only one major accident or disease away most likely"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Yes Hal Doofus, you "old mind-reader" you. You can tell this person wants everybody in poverty. And I love how you gently rebuke him or her with your tasteful analysis of their short-comings:

"One major accident or disease away most likely"

Gee Hal Doofus, why don't you just say: "I hope you die a long and painful death."

I mean, "Don't sugar-coat it Sundance, tell her straight."

Hal Dumb A*s
No, I'm doing great, but thanks for your concern.

However, you are so dense, it is beyond my comprehension. The bar I was talking about (clearly) is the one that is set by the govt. to define poverty. How does a definition bring roads, electricity, etc. You are truly clueless. This is the first and the last time I will engage you. You are beneath my intellectual level-obviously.

Well, I see
the other Destroyer of Threads is here. I'm gone

Hal Doofus 2:10pm
"We believe we ARE the government that is the huge difference. Government works for us all of us. If there is any fear the government should fear the people; not the people fear the government."

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Oh please Hal Doofus. You are killing me. I haven't been able to stop laughing for 15 minutes. I gather the "We" you reference are the Liberals, like yourself?

(And seriously, I don't fear the government. I fear what idiots like you will allow the government to do next.

And for once we agree. President Bush has been a great disappointment. But because he has shown himself to be a RINO and not a Conservative like Reagan.)

Hal Doofus 1:28pm
"Not true at all I mean you folks are even cutting back on library budgets and hours. Internet??? Huh? and that assumes that they can read and write because of our collapsing education system many cannot read"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Oh, Hal Doofus, the hits just keep on coming. I missed this little tidbit in your 1:28pm post. Let me get this straight, President Bush and all of us Conservatives DESTROYED the US Education System in 8 years???????????

I mean, maybe I am not knowledgeable about public education (my wife has only been a public school teacher in a 95% black school system for 28 years; and she has only been picked as the favorite teacher 10 of the last 14 years). But I would have thought it would have taken YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS to destroy the system.

You know, that would have to include the years LBJ, Jimmy Carter, and Bill Clinton were president. You know, like with a Democrat controlled Congress (up to 1993).

Hal Doofus 1:28pm
"Actually I can think of one thing for certain that you owe them: your misfounded sense of superiority"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

What a come back! Hal Doofus never ceases to amaze me!

(HalD, you really should think about some type of counseling. Normally, here at TH, pretty much everyone thinks you have a "misfounded sense of superiority". If you would "tone it down a bit", you probably wouldn't be laughed at so much.)

Cookie et al
If you wish to consider our country's "greatness" by comparing it to a 3rd world never was, be my guest.

Would you compare the worst NY Yankee player to the best little league player and say it was a fair comparison? Oh Wow. BFD!!!

15% poverty is unacceptable and Huffington was not quick enough on the uptake to suggest that is for Stossel and other far right knuckle draggers. Are the poor better off now than 8 years ago. I read the same census report and I say no. Is this country better off now than 8 years ago? Well, it must be if your criteria is a 3rd world never was.








Arianna Huffs
I first saw Arianna during the Monica Mess.She was a 'contributing person' on one of the cable shows,in the afternoon.She was always on the 'anti' side of the debate.

I never knew if she was liberal,or just disliked Bill.I did,so I agreed with her.I think that is when she became somewhat popular,and just look at her now.

I doubt she was ever conservative.If so,she sure has made a change in her thinking.I suppose shallow minds are easily swayed.

King Liberal
If you will go on Prager's article of yesterday and look at the comment thread, you will see my answer to your question to me.

I am sorry, I got called to a job site not 5 minutes after I posted. I didn't see your question until I got back.

Cookie
"No, I'm doing great, but thanks for your concern."

excellent

"However, you are so dense, it is beyond my comprehension. The bar I was talking about (clearly) is the one that is set by the govt. to define poverty. How does a definition bring roads, electricity, etc. You are truly clueless. "

Not at all. What if we said way back then let's not have the government pass laws to help electrify the rural areas. If they want it let them get it. Why invest in roads that go to rural areas if they want them let them build them... on and on. We raise the bar when we say everyone should have access to electricity education, etc...

"This is the first and the last time I will engage you. You are beneath my intellectual level-obviously. "

There is that lovely misfounded air of superiority again

youre kidding right?
Its all due to Global Warming. Where's Al Gore when you need him? :_)

A Dim Bulb
I pretty much wrote Huffington off as a dim bulb long ago. When she ran for Governor in California I came to know a lot more about her than I ever cared to. Her statements frequently lack coherency. Her success proves how well the free market works! In the U.S., even a dim bulb can burn brightly and strike it rich.

Hal Doofus 2:48pm
"There is that lovely misfounded air of superiority again"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Hal Doofus, you are repeating yourself. You can do better than this. Just tell "cookie" to drop dead!

YOU, HAL DOOFUS, KNOWS WHAT IS BEST FOR ALL OF US EONS!

BTW, the use of the word "lovely" was a bit of a tip-off that you were in your "elitist" mode.

Gray Ghost
"...Oh, Hal Doofus, the hits just keep on coming. I missed this little tidbit in your 1:28pm post. Let me get this straight, President Bush and all of us Conservatives DESTROYED the US Education System in 8 years???????????"

Now who said that? The US education system really started to decay back in the mid sixties in California. At that time Reagan became Governor and CA had the best schools. That was the start of "they cost too much" and they were aided and abetted by all the folks R and D who supported it.

Hal Donahue and fixng the country
Hal et al say that fixing the country will not be cheap. Conservatives can you read the codewords? "Fixing the country" means increased entitlements to special interest groups (voter blocs), mandatory, crappy health care for everyone, further suppression of Christians, confiscation of all firearms, increased eugenics, etc. "not be cheap" means all pretense of private ownership, private property, and individual freedom will be finally eliminated, etc. The only people who will prosper under this system will be the anointed government managers. Update your resumes.

Gray Ghost
"Oh please Hal Doofus. You are killing me. I haven't been able to stop laughing for 15 minutes. I gather the "We" you reference are the Liberals, like yourself?"

We moderates and liberals believe the government represents "we" the people all of us even you

"...And for once we agree. President Bush has been a great disappointment. But because he has shown himself to be a RINO and not a Conservative like Reagan.) "

Reagan raised taxes and admitted failures both according to your lights make him a RINO. Bush is the best you extreme conservatives could ever do because he is exactly what your extreme conservativism fosters - fear of anyone different and greed. Bush is you

Hal Doofus 2:10pm
"Abortions are frequent in nature. To compare a living breathing human with a weeks old fetus is complete nonsense and trivializes real horrors and murders"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

OK, let me get this one straight. You are saying, Hal Doofus, that our court system is WRONG for charging a man who killed a pregnant woman WITH THE MURDER OF TWO PEOPLE??????

Wow!

Your legal skill amazes me. I have only been on this thread a little over an hour and I have learned so much!

Please, keep it up, Hal Doofus.

King Liberal
The book has some "dull" points; but it is worth reading. I learned alot from it.

I grew up in the South. I was very lucky, my father and mother were not bigots. They believed that we "were all God's children". But they really got mad at all the un-founded hate that was directed at the South.

A book like this shows the "other side". There were great injustices during this time, both in the South and in the North.

Hal
Again, I'm not sure what your responses to me from 12:02 and 12:45 are about. I agree with you generally. I was merely saying that it is wrong for the first poster to say that foreigners (especially those that are US citizens) should shut up and go back to where they came from. I still don't get your responses to me.

That said, I like the content, if not the construction, of this post from you:

"...you think generally that government has most of the answers to our problems (where we believe they lie with the individual)...."

We believe we ARE the government that is the huge difference. Government works for us all of us. If there is any fear the government should fear the people; not the people fear the government


Hal Doofus 3:09pm
"Reagan raised taxes and admitted failures both according to your lights make him a RINO. Bush is the best you extreme conservatives could ever do because he is exactly what your extreme conservativism fosters - fear of anyone different and greed. Bush is you"

WOW!!!!!!!!!!

HAVE I BEEN PROPERLY SET IN MY PLACE!

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

The rest of the world KNOWS Reagan was a Conservative; but the Hal Doofus knows better! HE IS A RINO!!!!!!!!!

Please keep up the history lesson, Hal Doofus. I am learning so much!

(Seriously, "greed"? I do free engineering work for small towns, the local Carnegie library, two small black churches in the county, and donate time and money to help improve education in my area. I really don't think you know about my greed. But if it helps you "blind" yourself to reality, knock yourself out.)

tedmug
"...Conservatives can you read the codewords? "Fixing the country" means increased entitlements to special interest groups (voter blocs)NOW IT IS INDUSTRY AND RELIGIOUS GROUPS, mandatory, crappy health care for everyone NOPE MUCH OF THE COUNTRY HAS THAT NOW LOOK AT THE STATISTICS AND THE COST, further suppression of Christians CHRISTAIAN HAVE NEVER BEEN SURPRESSED, confiscation of all firearms ANOTHER LIE NO ONE, NO ONE IS FOR THAT, increased eugenics HUH????, etc. "not be cheap" means all pretense of private ownership, private property, and individual freedom will be finally eliminated NO IT DOES NOT BUT I CERTAINLY DO HOPE THAT IT MEANS YOU DEADBEATS WILL START PAYING FOR WHAT YOU DO AND USE LIKE YOUR IRAQ WAR, etc. The only people who will prosper under this system will be the anointed government managers. Update your resumes YOU MEAN SOMEONE OTHER THAN THE VERY RICH WILL PROSPER WELL THAT ALONE IS A WELCOME CHANGE. "

LMAO no it means literally repairing the damage to the national infrastructure. It is clear we will probably have to start with the military

Adm Mullen to Grey Ghost
Since you are so obcessed with gays I thought you should see his comments at West Point LOL

"With a national election looming, a cadet asked about the “don’t ask, don’t tell” law and what would happen if someone took office who wants to change it. “It’s a law, and we follow it,” Mullen said. Should the law change, the military will carry that out too, he said.

“We are a military that is under the control of our civilian elected leaders,” he said. “It has served us well since we’ve been founded. That is a special characteristic of our country and I would never do anything to jeopardize that.”

Hal Doofus 3:03pm
"Now who said that? The US education system really started to decay back in the mid sixties in California. At that time Reagan became Governor and CA had the best schools. That was the start of "they cost too much" and they were aided and abetted by all the folks R and D who supported it."

LAUGH MY A*S OFF! YOU SAID THAT!

Hal Doofus 1:28pm
"Not true at all I mean you folks are even cutting back on library budgets and hours. Internet??? Huh? and that assumes that they can read and write because of our collapsing education system many cannot read"


Hal Doofus, I also noticed the little "D" in your last sentence of your 3:03pm post. Let me get this straight, the Democrats had something to do wuith the problem?

Gray Ghost
"A book like this shows the "other side". There were great injustices during this time, both in the South and in the North."

Horrendous but does that excuse the state sponsored racism of the segragationist Southern police state?

ca
If I think I commented on a reply to you and included you so you noticed if not, I apoligise

I am So Sorry, Hal Doofus...
But I have to go back to work. The Special Project Coordinator at the local community college needs some help on writing a grant application. I have a project under construction there, so I can do an inspection and help him without charging him anything. (It's a "GREED" thing.)

LAUGH MY A*S OFF AT YOU!

Hopefully we can get together again and play real soon.

IMPEACH HOWARD DEAN
Democrat Party in total disarray

Imposed Primary Process disenfranchises voters from BigShot back office AutoCrat PowerCrats that dictate policy in StarChamber secrecy.

DEMOCRATS UNITE - IMPEACH HOWARD DEAN

Hal Doofus 3:41pm
"Horrendous but does that excuse the state sponsored racism of the segragationist Southern police state"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Nor Hal Doofus does it excuse the STATE AND CITY SPONSERED RACISM OF THE "SEGRAGATIONIST (your spelling, not mine)" NORTHERN POLICE STATES AND CITY GOVERNMENTS.

Remove the 2x4 in your eye before you try to remove the mote in my eye.

Gray Ghost
"...The rest of the world KNOWS Reagan was a Conservative; but the Hal Doofus knows better! HE IS A RINO!!!!!!!!!"

No, no there you go again. Reagan was only a Conservative but based on how extreme and alienating conservatism is now he absolutely would be called a RINO.

"Please keep up the history lesson, Hal Doofus. I am learning so much!"

Nah you need an open mind and you lost that long ago

"(Seriously, "greed"? I do free engineering work for small towns, the local Carnegie library, two small black churches in the county, and donate time and money to help improve education in my area. I really don't think you know about my greed. But if it helps you "blind" yourself to reality, knock yourself out.) "

But you oppose paying your dues to society. The infrastructure of the country is crumbling and for the first time in our history we are not attempting to pay for a war. You used and profited from the infrastructure and failed to maintain or replace it. One of my favorite comments is when Reagan became governor CA had the best schools in the country. When reagan became president CA had the worse schools and the country had the best airtraffic control system in the country. The basic premise of conservatism has been to use up and not replace the country's assets


cat trapper
Well said-1:14 p.m. post. Speaking of TH....

TH features conservative writers and was launched by the conservative Heritage Foundation. Guess what? CONSERVATIVES were the key demographic. But Robert, Hal, King Liberal and few other liberals can't keep away from the place.

Just like Rush and Fox News, both No. 1 in Talk Radio and Cable News, TH is a huge hit. Here's where the rub comes in for Hal and friends. Makes their blood boil if you want to know the truth.

Ain't it sweet?


Gray Ghost
"...Hal Doofus, I also noticed the little "D" in your last sentence of your 3:03pm post. Let me get this straight, the Democrats had something to do wuith the problem? "

Sure they did they essentially were co conspirators too bad. Why act surprised? I have said repeatedly that I had hoped Carter was the worse president in our history and sadly now he and Bush the torturer will be competing for that infamy

Honesty=Credibilty
Hal I have some simple questions for you.

1.Why were you vital to the national defense under President Carter? Were you more vital than all of the other Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, Marines, and Coast guardsmen who were on duty at that time?
2. Were you a pilot? What aircraft were you certified to fly?
3. What service medal were you awarded to make you eligible for membership in the VFW?

Thank you

Gray Ghost:
Hal talks about keeping an open mind. Too bad he does not take his own advice. His mind is as closed as the gates of heaven are to Lucifer.

Gray Ghost
"...Remove the 2x4 in your eye before you try to remove the mote in my eye. "

was that a yes or a no?

Oh and I really like making the above comments to an engineer LOL

Willi Beax
I told you once why and I won't again.

Lumberjack7392/Gray Ghost
"...Hal talks about keeping an open mind. Too bad he does not take his own advice. His mind is as closed as the gates of heaven are to Lucifer."

Now how can you say that? LOL

off for a jog maybe later be well all

Two step Hal ...
Always the contortionist with the words. Accusing Gray Ghost, and by implication, all conservatives, of being unwilling to pay our "dues to society." By that, I'm guessing taxes. The problems I have with my "dues" is not so much paying them, but how much of them are demanded and what they are used for.

I agree that an educated populace benefits all of society. I agree that there was/is a need for roads for citizens to travel on. Heck, I even voted for a local increase in taxes to fund Lextran, the county bussing operation, so that those who can't afford vehicles can get around for less than what it actually costs to run the busses.

No, what I have a problem with is the vote buying scheme Democrats. The Dems, through force of law, confiscate my hard earned dollars and then dole it out to "the less fortunate" (read: anyone who buys their crap) for a voting quid pro quo. It's really quite a built in system they have established. The more they can get hooked on their drug (money for nothing), the greater their chances of getting re-elected.

The only thing I still haven't figured out is why seemingly intelligent people still buy their feces. I don't know if it's some moronic guilt you guys carry or whether your just not that bright (even though you can apparently rub two words together to make a coherent sentence).

I'm sure you're going to say that you "care more about the less fortunate" (said with my most syrupy and sarcastic voice). Unfortunately, you're blind to the unintended consequences of your so-called good deeds.

GrayGhost-WilliBeax-LJ7392
What do you think of a DRUNK who kisses the backsides of UGLY WOMEN for a living? I think he has the stones of a RABBIT.

Hal Drunkahue
The Pennsylvania Porkbutt will have to jog from Scranton to Pittsburgh for it to have any affect on his Fat Behind.

King Liberal
Hey your highness,

I read this story in a few ways. First, why not drop out now? Second, maybe she is planning to drop more bombs on Obama, literally and figuratively. Maybe he'll be in a "plane crash" like Ron Brown or "kill himself" like Vince Foster.

A senior campaign official and Clinton confidante has told me that there will be a Democratic nominee by June 15. He could not bring himself to say the words "Hillary will drop out by June 15," but that is clearly what he meant. I kept saying, "So, Hillary will drop out by June 15," and he kept saying, "We will have a nominee by June 15." He stressed what a reasonable person Hillary is.

Everything about our conversation implied that he had already had this reality-based discussion with Hillary. He said the Clinton campaign plan is to collect as many votes and delegates as they can right through June 3, then take no more than a week or so to make their case to the superdelegates. Nothing he said indicated that he actually expected the superdelegates to move to Hillary in the week after the final election. The Clinton campaign has not lost its grip on reality. Yes, Clinton spokespersons publicly seem to be lost on gravity-free planet Clinton, but privately they know the end is near.


Georgetwin writes:
Hal Drunkahue
The Pennsylvania Porkbutt will have to jog from Scranton to Pittsburgh for it to have any affect on his Fat Behind.

I hope he notifies the National Geologic Seismologists before he jogs, otherwise they might announce a 6.5 Richter Scale earthquake has struck Scranton.

You really want to know something scary, Hal is the Lackawanna County Veterans Advisor. I suspect his advice can be summed up in four words: "Vote for the Democrat."

Hal
Your comment, "CHRISTAIAN HAVE NEVER BEEN SURPRESSED," in your reply to tedmug (3:29 pm) has to be one of the most ignorant I've seen from you. Have you not read or heard about any of the court cases that were brought by students, parents, or private organizations that had their rights trampled? Check out the web sites of the Alliance Defense Fund, American Center for Law and Justice, Rutherford Institute, Thomas More Law Center, just to name a few, where you can read about these cases that have been going on for decades.

Grey Ghost, thank you for your exegesis, your patience, and your sense of humor.

For the Foundation (1 Cor. 3:11) of the Founders ><>

Honesty=Credibilty
Hal writes:

"I told you once why and I won't again."

This proves you are a liar and a blow hard!!

Yeah! Yeah! Whatever

Lumber
"Hal is the Lackawanna County Veterans Advisor. I suspect his advice can be summed up in four words: "Vote for the Democrat." "

Or perhaps "Get me a drink".

Arianne, Leonsa, Theresa & Michelle
Arianne, Leonsa, Theresa & Michelle - vanity, alimony & entitlement
The best classical entry which illustrates Arianna's career is Vanity Fair's Becky Sharp - she is a crass, cynical & shrill arrivist. While Stosses describes her during those years as a conservative/ republican, I remember her op-eds in LA Times some years ago, I wasn't ever, never been able to figure out what her position was on one or other issue - and I still am at loss how she got syndication for her crap.
She's a total fraud, fiction - her book about Picasso (my! my! Picasso! I'm so impressed!) can be best described as printed matter, her mighty crappy accent does not betray years of studies at Cambridge but a Pireus sly strumpet, her family is not of shipping magnates. Somehow washed upon this country's shores in the eighties, she married one Michael Huffington, a Colorado zillionaire met at a John-Roger retreat (fully aware that the man is gay to the hilt - hey, but it paid-off alimony-wise), descended together in LA to buy a Calif. US senatorship, lost the bid and the money (40 mils. plus), then the real Huff went to SF to fulfill his real sexuality, she took the money, she tried a tragi-comic shot at the Calif. governorship, failed, and we're stuck here in LA with her crap - she's often on Santa Monica College radio (K-???) and is steadfastly incompetent, unfunny, repetitive and uniformly using un-attributed quotes from that day's LA Times, Huffington Post is an operation which, while of liberal gesticulation, is essentially a backgdrop for her vanity, and her current book is crap, too. (Cont'd)

Leonsa, Arianne, Theresa & Michelle
(Cont'd) And now to reveal Arianna's vulnerable side: are charlatans ridiculous megalomaniacs who crave attention & understanding? Yes - see her "Other Arianna Things" in HuffPost. Tom Hayden, Robert Scheer & Warren Beatty (her side-kicks) cut decent figures when compared with her.
Leonsa is gone and no one regrets her - but our bestiary still has Theresa, Arianne and Michelle to use as visual aids when talking about bad character, vacuousness, haughtiness and hypertrophyed entitlement sense.

The left is NEVER wrong
I give it to Stossell, he's slick. But he does ply one of the oldest conservative sophistries going. Conservatives allege that liberal policies and programs don't work, or have negative unintended consequences. However, even if true, this is no proof that the free market will even work as well as liberal programs, much less work any better.

Stossell also applies the sophistry of statistics. Because B follows A it does not mean that A causes B. The decline is welfare rolls is welcome as is the drop in people below the poverty line, but there may have been other factors at work that are even more causal than forcing people off welfare. It's just possible, or even probable, that we aren't talking about the same populations.

So, for those of you who aren't hip to Stossell's slickness, beware.

Hawk
I saw your self-congratulations at having answered the point I made, but I missed the part of your comment in whihc you answer the point I made.

Were the factual claims I made false, or are you just bragging about your lack of concern with factual claims?

Correlation and Causation
Proud Liberal: "Because B follows A it does not mean that A causes B."

Very true. That's known as "correlation doesn't imply causation."

It's surprising how often I need to teach that concept to a liberal, and here we have a liberal trying to teach it to conservatives! There's some irony for you.

However, when you have enough reasons that explain the causative properties of A to B, enough cases where A and B *do* occur together, enough cases where the absence of A is followed by the absence of B; then it makes sense to presume that either A causes B, or some third property, C, causes both.


"Conservatives allege that liberal policies and programs don't work, or have negative unintended consequences. However, even if true, this is no proof that the free market will even work as well as liberal programs, much less work any better."

Very true.

Nevertheless, whenever we CAN do a direct comparison between a free market and a controlled market, the free market does better in virtually EVERY case.

So, maybe A didn't cause B, but, unless you've got a "C" out there that explains the observed phenomena, I think we should stick with the free market.

FROG, Grey Gjost
Thanks so much for stepping in while I was getting in some necessary gardening and errands! Loved your comments! :)

HalD-You need to get back to Mommy's basement before she gets home from work. What a snob you are, thinking that people are simply incapable of meeting life's challenges and doing what they have to do unless a government nanny is there to hold their hands and wipe their noses! How self-righteous can you be to think people are so stupid? Ever hear the phrase "Necessity is the mother of invention"?

Didn't think so...

You've already been responded to on the other points so thankfully I don't have to bother.

Heavens
I went off and worked a full day, and this discussion is still active.

Frog: You're right. I completely forgot that everything -- screechy co-workers, bad radio reception, flat frittatas, and even global cooling -- can be blamed on Human-Origin Global Warming And Similar Horrors (HOGWASH). I know that there's a growing body of evidence that the sun is putting out more energy these days. But hey, the effects of HOGWASH are so insidious that our greenhouse gases may be heating up the sun, too.

Willi Beax: Thanks for adding the Coast Guard to the honor roll in your 3:59 post. It's often overlooked.


Huffington Hal
I see Huffington Hal has been here leaving his loony left-wing Doofus diahrrea again. One can only laugh at his loonacy. I stopped letting his antics rile me a long time ago. His insane, repetitious posts just get passed over now. Stupid is as stupid does. King Libturd, I see you're challenging Hal the Doofus for the post of Townhall villiage idiot. Keep it up your highness (no respect intended), your inane posts are beginning to rival those of the Doofus. Good luck on your endeavor. Grey Ghost, good job dueling with the Doofus. Save your energy & just laugh at him. You'll feel much better.

Back from Work
Thanks LJ7392(4:03pm)! My grandmother used to say that: "His mind is as closed as the gates of heaven are to Lucifer." Thank you sincerely for reminding me of her. She was a fine Christian woman and a fine rifle shot.

FROG(4:16pm), Georgetwin(4:17pm) and Jeff(4:43pm): Thank you for defending my back while I went out on a job site.

Change course now or face calamity?

Newt to GOP: Change course now or face calamity in November

Is Newt right and John Stossel wrong?


HotAir-Without Change, there’s no Hope.

The Republican loss in the special election for Louisiana’s Sixth Congressional District last Saturday should be a sharp wake up call for Republicans: Either Congressional Republicans are going to chart a bold course of real change or they are going to suffer decisive losses this November…

This defeat follows on the loss of Speaker Hastert’s seat in Illinois. That seat had been held by a Republican for 76 years with the single exception of the 1974 Watergate election when the Democrats held it for one term. That same seat had been carried by President Bush 55-44% in 2004…

A February Washington Post poll shows that Republicans have lost the advantage to the Democrats on which party can handle an issue better — on every single topic…

This is a catastrophic collapse of trust in Republicans built up over three generations on the deficit, two generations on taxes, and two generations on national security.

read more

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/newt-to-gop-change -course-now-or-face-calamity-in-november

her old man was gay
I think because her husband who tried to win the Republic seat was found out to be gay she has soured on the Republic party.

What's In Her Head?
If I recall her marrage history correctly, her politics have more to do with who's in her bead than what's in her head.

Uncle Alby @ 12:50
Look at gingrich now.

Skywalker81: It would be wonderful if all the liberals went to Cuba and stayed there.

M Sederoff @ 8:50: ...as they ask, dead or alive.

King Liberal: liberal democrats are the American Communist Party.

Uber: taxes take away health security. Access to information is prevented by the teachers' unions. Access to production is destroyed by liberal over-taxation.

The way to improve the economy is to repeal the thousands of taxes and replace them with one proper tax for each level of government, reducing the cost of everything by 1/3 and no longer forcing employers out of business.

Proud Liberal
Could you explain the effects on the family when:
-----------------------------------------------1) Government makes a contract with poor women who do not work. They are sustained by the government.

2) Government will continue to pay as long as the woman does not marry a man who works.

3) Women are paid more money when they have more children.

4) Women and kids are placed in housing projects.

5) There is no man to help with discipline.

FROG
"...Accusing Gray Ghost, and by implication, all conservatives, of being unwilling to pay our "dues to society." By that, I'm guessing taxes. The problems I have with my "dues" is not so much paying them, but how much of them are demanded and what they are used for."

Ahh but see how much and where it goes is decided by us through Congress. You think I like watching Bush's Iraq war bill running up or my taxes that go to that effort?

"No, what I have a problem with is the vote buying scheme Democrats. The Dems, through force of law, confiscate my hard earned dollars and then dole it out to "the less fortunate" (read: anyone who buys their crap) for a voting quid pro quo. It's really quite a built in system they have established. The more they can get hooked on their drug (money for nothing), the greater their chances of getting re-elected."

Is this any different from Santorum's K street project our your massive handouts to industry and Agri business? What goes where is up to us - that is my point

"The only thing I still haven't figured out is why seemingly intelligent people still buy their feces. I don't know if it's some moronic guilt you guys carry or whether your just not that bright (even though you can apparently rub two words together to make a coherent sentence)."

The human waste that for lack of investment is ignored or wasted. The people now are healthier etc than the WWII generation but....



Proud Liberal et al
What is the smallest minority group protected by government?

What is the largest minority group protected by the government?

Proud Liberal et al
What is the definition of racism:

1) Those who hold that a particular race is superior to others.

2) Those who hold that a particular race needs helps and affirmative action to compete with other races?


3) Are 1 and 2 both racism?

Liberals et al
It makes no difference whether government controls allegedly favor the interests of labor or business, of the poor or the rich, of a special class or a special race: the results are the same. The notion that a government can benefit any one social group at the expense of others is a worn remnant of the Marxist mythology of class warfare, refuted by half a century of factual evidence. All men are victims and losers under such a government; nobody wins-except the ruling clique.

Liberals and Collectivism
Collectivism doesn't disparage responsibility; but ultimately, collectivism does not hold individuals accountable for the choices they make. Failing to save for retirement, having children one can't afford, making bad investments, becoming addicted to drugs or smoking---these actions are called ``social problems'' that ``society'' has to deal with. Thus, collectivists seek to build a social ``safety-net'' to protect individuals from the choices they make. To collectivism, responsibility is only to be expected of the productive, and consists of doing one's part in keeping the social ``safety-net'' in tact.

Hillary and Common Folk
"You know, I'm going to start thanking the woman who cleans the restroom in the building I work in. I'm going to start thinking of her as a human being"
-Hillary Clinton
(From the book "The Case Against Hillary Clinton" by Peggy Noonan, p. 55)

Liberals and Education
Plato argued "that no one would ever do what is wrong if they know what is right" - so the liberal answer always lies in better education.

The value system that John has detailed for us (and I agree with) cannot be found in our PC educational system. Like teenagers trying to transition to adulthood - Liberal education really is forcefeeding bias and distorting reality to what liberals think it should be.

Liberals teach that deviancy should be accepted as normal behaviour. Empathy should be for the criminal, not for the victim. The death penalty is cruel and inhumane yet, for convenience sake drilling a hole in a babys head and sucking out its brains is a right. Objects used for self preservation are evil and should be banned. Liberals believe pornography and prostitution do not dehumanize women but simply allows one to practice freedom of speech. Liberals believe removing fathers from the family so poor women can receive benefits from their programs is a good thing. Working hard and receiving just compensation should be taxed and distributed to those who won't work - to be fair.

Education and Survival
Modern day schools no longer emphasize survival because the government is trying to gurantee survival of everyone - it is called socialism or worse.

Initiative is not necessary under socialism.

The initiative to be a skilled hunter/gatherer or basket weaver etc. for trade with someone with a different skillset is no longer necessary under socialism.

The initiative to increase knowledge for use in advancing humans is no longer necessary under socialism.

The initiative for defense now has become 'words' instead of weaponry.

The initiative to move where one can find better land to farm and hunt/gather is gone - the replacement is government funded crime centers - called housing projects.

The initiative to raise a family to share work and defense is now an industry - the more babies a woman can produce the more income - the more babies a woman aborts the more income for Planned Parenthood.

The initiative is now on children learning sex so they can become consumers of government and Planned Parenthood services.

Education and Abstraction
The first 'educational system' was homeschool.

There were teachers (parents) students (children) a curriculum and a graduation.

Curriculum consisted of: shelter, fire, hunting gathering, defense, finding ones way etc.

Graduation consisted of either life or death.

Survival was the main reason for education.

One either learned the basics or died.

Education now is political correctness - not exactly a survival skill.

Education now is based in diversity - not exactly a survival skill.

diverse = unite

Definitions by liberals are insane.


Why
are all these filthy rich libs always talking, talking, talking about poverty and the poor. If they are so concerned, why not part with some of their brass for the poor, infact 90% of it if they are that concerned. And maybe trade in the mercedes and the other fancy dancy vehicles, sell the mansions, and fly like regular folk. Then maybe they might have an argument. But it's never them that they demand give up their
perks, pleasures and money, its the flyover biblebleliving, gun totin, churchgoin' clingers, and if white, so much the better.
My church supports a young man who is struggling to educate Haitian children (parents have to pay to educate their kids), these are the poorest of the poor kids. These poor kids would eat meals
like their peers who aren't being helped made up of rice and mud, now with the price of rice, it's more mud than rice. Of course, the eugenicallyminded enviroterrierists think that's just great, less of them means more for me.

Whoops
My train of thought got stalled at the station, I
was going to add, that per Frog's 1:16 post, where in the U.S. do American kids eat rice/mud pies? And Arrianna and her ilk should put their money where her mouth is and maybe send some of her riches to Haiti for these kids educations and
healthy meals. But no, it's up to us, not the elites.

Honesty=credibilty
Halbert's Post Wed. May 7,2008 8:14PM



Yeah! Yeah! Whatever

Retired Geek...

Retired Geek writes: several outstanding comments.
-----------------------------------

Clarity, Insight, and Honesty, et al.

What I cannot imagine is...

1. Coming to Townhall as a Liberal.

2. Actually reading the Articles and comments

3. And then continuing to think/believe in the nonsense I started with.

Stossel's Article
This article just shows how hypocritical Liberals are and how FACTS really doesn't matter. They let emotions dictate their opinions instead of facts.

Cynthia

Tea Party ..

Tea Party writes: "where in the U.S. do American kids eat rice/mud pies?"
----------------------------------

Don't ask my inlaw that question. She claims there are 3 million homeless *families* in America.

And don't dare ask to see them!

This blockhead says, "Sure you can't see them Carlos... they're very proud, and park their cars in dark parking lots so the authorities don't bother them."

Good Grief.

Lumberjack7392
"...You really want to know something scary, Hal is the Lackawanna County Veterans Advisor. I suspect his advice can be summed up in four words: "Vote for the Democrat."

Well not quite LOL. I was "volunteered" for the job but you know what someone should do something. The previous guy didn't. The vets, including me, screamed and got a good guy in but he needed to be home a lot. Oh yes the previous county government was R. Guess what they did so well they lost all 197 precints a feat never before accomplished....

But if you are in Scranton drop bye and I will treat you to a coffee

Retired Geek
"...It makes no difference whether government controls allegedly favor the interests of labor or business, of the poor or the rich, of a special class or a special race: the results are the same. "

Ooops here we go again with the conservative timidity and and greed. The first big government program I heard of was the opening of the west i.e. the Ohio valley under Washington. Perfect? no, but it happened because of government. Look the government is a community tool. The only reason to fear it is if you are a powerless minority. Ehh, well I guess you are almost that now and certainly will be after the 08 elections

Perhaps you can go to a country like the one you want us to be? Nigeria is one...

Carlos/Tea Party
Guys check the 2000 census data for Mississippi and Louisiana. The details for some of the northern parts of those states are worse than Haiti. That is why the old Soviet Union did stories there so often

stilmill
"This article just shows how hypocritical Liberals are and how FACTS really doesn't matter. They let emotions dictate their opinions instead of facts. "

LOL emotion is the very heart of conservatism. Healthcare is a perfect example. By any indicator, we are paying FAR too much for poor results. Yet, you conservatives keep throwing around the "socialism" word either not understanding or plain lying. That is emotion not facts, not results

Hal Doofus 10:23pm
"Guys check the 2000 census data for Mississippi and Louisiana. The details for some of the northern parts of those states are worse than Haiti. That is why the old Soviet Union did stories there so often"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Hal, I really cannot stand anymore laughing. My wife believes I am going to stroke out!

Tunica County (North Mississippi): Casinos at Robinsonville (average salary, $25.00/hour); and possibly one more casino to be built (world class golf course to boot at the Grand)

Desoto County (North Mississippi): Fastest growing county in THE SOUTH

Oxford, MS (N. MS): voted one of the top 25 towns to retire to in the USA; home of the University of MS

Pontotoc, MS (N. MS): Soon to be home of the new BMW Plant (approx. jobs, over 3000)

Clarksdale, MS (N. MS): Home of the Blues and Morgan Freeman's "Ground Zero" and "Madidi's"; at the "Juke Box Festival" last week we had vistors from all over the world (I spoke to Russians, Germans, and Japanese.)

Hal Doofus, your data is over 40 years old. You need to get out of the RUST BELT in Scranton alittle more.

Hal Doofus 10:29pm
" Yet, you conservatives keep throwing around the "socialism" word either not understanding or plain lying. That is emotion not facts, not results"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

With the data you placed on your post of 10:23pm, it sounds like "sour grapes" to me. In other words, you are letting "emotion not facts" and definitely not "results" color your comments.

That is not "understanding" and is just "plain lying".

LAUGH MY A*S OFF AGAIN!

Hal Doofus 10:20pm
"The only reason to fear it is if you are a powerless minority. Ehh, well I guess you are almost that now and certainly will be after the 08 elections"

LAUGH MY A*S OFF!

Let me get this straight, I thought you said there was no reason to fear the government. However, now you say: "if you are a powerless minority" then there is reason to fear the government?

WOW!!!!!!!!

You even give a date (after the 08 elections).

WOW!!!!!!!!

So if the Liberals win, what next? Are you going to throw all Conservatives in prison? Deport them?

Will you deport the Constitution with us?

(Seriously, HalD, you really don't believe this sh*t do you? Are you "stoned"? Have you had too much to drink?)

Hal Donahue
"Perhaps you can go to a country like the one you want us to be? Nigeria is one..."

Nigeria, eh? Hmmmm ...

CIA World Factbook:

"Following nearly 16 years of military rule, a new constitution was adopted in 1999, and a peaceful transition to civilian government was completed. The government continues to face the daunting task of reforming a petroleum-based economy, whose revenues have been squandered through corruption and mismanagement, and institutionalizing democracy. In addition, Nigeria continues to experience longstanding ethnic and religious tensions. Although both the 2003 and 2007 presidential elections were marred by significant irregularities and violence, Nigeria is currently experiencing its longest period of civilian rule since independence. The general elections of April 2007 marked the first civilian-to-civilian transfer of power in the country's history."


WHOA yah, definitely a bastion of free market economies -- NOT --

mamasan & ex-Wyomingite RE Arianne
mamasan writes: I think because her husband who tried to win the Republic seat was found out to be gay she has soured on the Republic party.
ex-Wyomingite writes: Exactamundo. That is the precise depth of Arianna's beliefs one way or the other. About half a dozen inches. He humiliated her in public and now she hates all Republicans. From the most fervent of conservatives to the most rabid of liberals. Hell hath no fury and Arianna hath no scrupples.

Sorry folks, but a crook by any other mame is still a crook and oftentime less ratiocinating provides the right picture of a fact. Don't try to find some mighty psychological explanation for Arianna's political shift:
1) she was't a conservative, she's not a liberal - she's just a natural and opportunistic (and repetitive) turncoat; come smth. in her advantage you'd see her moving from Tom Hayden & Ayres to Gordon Liddy and Oliver North (and I like Liddy & North);
2) when she hooked up with ColoHuffy, she was fully aware that Huffy is not interested in consortium, he needed a cover for running for office and she wanted his money, Wikipedia is quite clear about this (they issued a couple of kids, I think);
3) Huffy went San Francisco, she got a mega settlement and went liberal becuse this is how the wind blows in Pacific Palisades (she's snout to snout with Tom Hayden, Warren Beaty etc,)
4) she can be in a second a fascist, a communist, a whatever - a natural.

GG
Hal is a prime example of a Dem/lib - he means well but his desires, when extrapolated on a larger scale, are misery-inducing. He is ill-read and cannot think long-term; it is a physical and mental limitation that takes years of reading comprehension and common sense life experience to overcome. He doesn't understand that modern liberalism props up and enables human weaknesses such as sloth, coarseness towards others, incivility, lack of self-sufficiency, and self-absorption. Hal, like all liberals, is subconsciously fixated on making himself feel good above all else.

OSHA
I used to be a safety manager for my part of a Naval Air Station. I had to study and enforce OSHA regulations. That is a VERY difficult job. The main reason for the difficulty is that the regulations are done by the gummint, so they are completely disorganized and contradictory. If one tries to look up a regulation on, say....step ladders, one can find stuff in 3 or 4 chapters and paragraphs, and some of the regs will apparently say things that are different from the other paragraph on the same subject. Quite confusing, and typically bureaucratic...probably written by union gummint workers and union industry workers.

Craw
Me, too. And let me tell you...as a lab person, it sucked. Imagine, you have to have a sharpie container for needles. Says OSHA. Then, You must treat the needles, band-aids, etc... as a biohazard, blood, guts and all that. Well, the state of NC doesn't consider blood to be a hazard!! Just more oxymoronic rules to follow, er, um, break??? It is insane.

Gray Ghost
You can't argue with ignorance. Someone who won't be honest with themselves about the core beliefs of their ideology can't be reasoned with. Only defeated and marginalized. The Left may be fooling the dumbed down moderate middle now, because they've been lulled into a sense of security and brainwashed by the Enemedia. But when things get tough again, you'll see them storm the Bastille, and the Socialists will be thrown out again. Man cannot take another's freedom given to them by God, and he does not know better than God how to solve Man's problems. Only Freedom can.

Newt is a poser, Ariana a dimwit chik
Proximity to Newt Gingrich does not deliver conservative credibility, Newt is a political whore, look at Newt now posing with _________________ in global warming ads, what a putz.

Everybody knows global warming is just a political control and tax revenue tool, if "global warming" was a "real" threat the last thing we should do is encourge mass immigration in the tens of millions, industrialize the 3rd world and promote global trade, that's the response to promote global warming.

The only people who ever thought Ariana was conservative were the idiot CA Republican party hacks that chose to run her "beard" husband as a Repu-Senator.

Gray Ghost
Did you happen to see Hal's response to me about his advice to vetreans. SAid if i was ever in Scranton look him, and he get me a coffee. That won't happen for three reasons.

1. I don't drink coffee. Never even drank it in the Navy.
2. I don't have a death wish. There'd be enough arsenic in the coffee to kill an army.
3. I never expect to return to Pennsylvania. Two years in Philly convinced me that Pennsylvania was a great place to be from, as far away from as possible.

HUFFINGTON BABE
This Huffington Babe does not tour around Manhattan in a PRIUS. Her BigRearEnd is carted about town in a Stretch Cadilac Black Limo with driver and bodyguard.

She does not pay multi-thousand dollar interior designers to put CFL's in her light sockets

These people live in a theoretical about the word "Poverty" when in actuality - to them - it starts and stops with their closed number of very rich friends.

Her HVAC usage will never "save the Planet!"

This Huffington Babe - her homosexual ex-husband is dead - will never do floor service anywhere for people less privileged.

Arianna's Ruse
This is claptrap! What really changed Arianna Huffington's views more than anything was the disintegration of her marriage with conservative California state representative and one-time Senatorial candidate, Michael Huffington.

Mike Huffington turned out to be gay and his candidacy for the U.S. Senate in California fell apart about the time Ariana decided to do the "splits". Other explanations are window dressing and mere psychological defense mechanisms on Arianna's part. You were fooled by her charm.

The left and Facts
There are several inconsistencies with the left and facts. Of course, these inconsistencies are never acknowledged by leftists.

One, the left believes in facts, as long as those facts "support" their agenda.

Two, if the facts support the leftist agenda, they are beyond question.

Three, when facts contradict the leftist agenda, they immediately become suspect.

Four, facts that support the leftist agenda must be closely scrutinized to ensure the facts contain all of the relevant data and have not been massaged to ensure the leftist agenda is supported.

Five, when facts are evaluated and found to have been massaged, etc. or do not support the leftist agenda, the MSM will do all in its power to ignore this information. Even life saving information may be ignore if it contradicts the leftist agenda.

the money train
Huffington is just a money whore. She just takes the money train in whatever direction its going. It just happens that now the tracks are bending hard to the left.

Bush with his low approval ratings is an easy target for her. And theres no shortage of liberals who hang on her every word.

One wonders why a true liberal wouldn't ask themselves why her convictions have changed since her support of Gingrich in the "contract with America" days. Then again, convictions have never been a liberal strong point.

I guess sister Huffington has finally found her way. At least until the money train bends to the right again.

IF only
she and the others would own up to the fact that global warming id a big ho ax and the fact that we need to build new petro refineries here at home and drill for oil in Florida and Alaska and anywhere else we may find our own supply.

The Left Is Wrong
The left have lied many times yet the liberal left-wing news media still listens to their mindless crap
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