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Friday, June 01, 2007
John Hawkins :: Townhall.com Columnist
Why The Senate Amnesty Bill Would Be An Unmitigated Disaster For America
by John Hawkins
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The amnesty bill in the Senate is undoubtedly one of the worst, most destructive pieces of legislation to come down the pike in the last half century and not only could it do cataclysmic damage to the Republican Party, it has the potential to send our country into a downward spiral from which it would never truly recover. Not only would this bill fail to secure the border, it would encourage millions of new illegals to pour into the country, demographically flood the conservative movement out of existence, add more than two trillion to the national debt, and it would set up a never ending cascade of amnesties that would permanently change our country for the worse.

First of all, let's start with the border. The problem with securing our border has always been that our politicians haven't wanted it to be secured. That's because the Democrats see every illegal alien who waltzes over the border as a potential voter and the Republicans in Washington don't want to cut off the supply of cheap labor to their allies in the business community.

Once you understand that, you know why George Bush has been dragging his feet on building the wall and why extremely effective programs, like Operation Vanguard in Nebraska, have been killed by the politicians: it's because they desperately want the flow of illegal immigrants into the United States to continue unabated. It's also why the "one time only" amnesty for roughly 2.7 million illegal aliens in 1986 has failed and why its much bigger, uglier stepsister in the Senate will fail again if this bill is passed -- because the politicians in D.C. only care about the amnesty and once they get it, they will methodically work to kill the enforcement and border security measures. So, if you don't get the security first, you won't ever get it.

Next, what will happen if we bring in 12-20 million illegal aliens? Well, first off, we don't know that 20 million would be the ceiling on the number of illegals. Because illegal aliens engage in document forgery the way most of us engage in breathing, it's entirely possible you could see millions of illegals pouring across the border, getting forged documents, and getting in on the deal -- and that's before the chain immigration starts that will bring in tens of millions more illegals to get in on the goodies Congress is ready to hand out with both hands.

But, let's say 20 million of these illegal aliens take advantage of the amnesty and get Z visas (By the way, despite what you may have heard from supporters of this bill, the moment the bill is signed into law, every illegal alien who was here before January 1, 2007 or who can acquire a forged document that says that he was, may be immediately eligible for a "probationary," i.e. permanent and infinitely renewable, Z visa).

First of all, hasn't one of the selling points of the pro-amnesty crowd been that illegals are manual laborers who are willing to do jobs that lazy Americans won't do? I believe it has. Well, there are a number of problems that will be caused by permanently bringing in 20 million foreign strawberry pickers and ditch diggers. The Z visa illegals themselves may not be eligible for government programs, but the moment they have an anchor baby, they can start leeching welfare, food stamps, and other government programs off of the American taxpayers. Also, the very fact that they have a child with American citizenship would make it that much more difficult to deport them if our politicians ever, by some miracle of God, get serious about enforcing our laws.

Moreover, consider this: if there's an economic downturn, and the labor market contracts, who will be the first people to get laid off? The low skilled, minimally educated, Spanish speaking Z visa holders. If you want to see the danger of that situation, look to France, where there is a staggeringly high unemployment rate among Muslim immigrants, legal and illegal, who live off the dole, join rape gangs, burn cars, riot, and have made swaths of France into no-go zones, even for the police in many cases. Think that it "couldn't happen here?" I bet that's what most Frenchmen would have told you 30 years ago.

On the other hand, let's say that these 20 million illegals become U.S. citizens. If anything, that would be an even worse situation for a variety of reasons. To begin with, Robert Rector has estimated that because we're talking about, for the most part, uneducated, manual laborers who will pay very little in taxes, the illegals are going to sponge 2.2 trillion dollars in government largesse from the rest of us over the course of their lifetimes. That means Social Security goes broke faster and we add more than two trillion dollars to our national debt to take care of people who weren't invited to this country, aren't wanted here by most people, and aren't even American citizens at the moment. How much sense does that make?

Like most Americans, I'm a compassionate person and I'm glad that we help feed the world, have helped stand up for freedom across the globe, and guarantee the security of nations like Taiwan and Israel from their hostile neighbors. But, compassion only goes so far. Asking the American people to carry 12-20 million illegal aliens on our backs, in our own country, isn't compassion; it's a shameless attempt to exploit the good nature of the American people.

Beyond that, Latinos went for the Democratic Party 70/30 in 2006. Expand those numbers out over 20 million people and you have 8 million new Democratic Party votes (which is 4 million more than George Bush's margin in 2004) -- and that is probably a very low estimate since we're mostly talking about poor people from socialist countries who don't respect America's laws and will have great difficulty improving their lot in America because of their limited English skills and lack of an education (If ever there was a group of people with "Democratic Party voter" written all over them, it's this batch of illegals).

Moreover, once those 20 million people become citizens and add their voice to the existing open borders lobby, we will never stop another amnesty because the former illegals are sure to demand that their representatives block any deportations or harsh enforcement of immigration laws. So, this isn't just a vote for another "amnesty," it's a vote for what will turn out to be a never ending string of amnesties that will continue until this country is dragged down to the point where it's not any nicer than the countries these people are fleeing.

Look at it this way: immigration is not a right, it's a privilege that is supposed to benefit the people who are already American citizens. That's part of the reason that America has always been a friendly country to immigrants. It's because we know that bringing in a small, but steady supply of ambitious foreigners to supplement our native population helps keep our country healthy, growing, and strong. The other reason Americans tend to like immigrants is because of a largely unspoken social contract: immigrants who come here are supposed to love this country, see it as a land of opportunity, and want to assimilate into our culture.

If you want to know why there has been such an explosive reaction to this wave of illegal immigrants, it's because none of the old rules of immigration are being followed. There are far too many illegal immigrants being allowed in and the illegals are a drain on our country, not a net benefit to the Americans who are already here. Furthermore, many of the illegal immigrants have bent over backwards to let us know that they don't love the U.S. and have no wish to assimilate. They wave foreign flags at illegal alien rallies, send much of their money to their home countries, and don't even bother to learn English.

So, even if this country did need to bring 12-20 million new people all in one fell swoop, which we most certainly don't, it wouldn't be the illegal aliens who are already here. We would want people from all over the globe, instead of a group of people who are resistant to assimilation because their first act here was breaking our laws, because of their sheer numbers, because they speak the same language, and because they are overwhelmingly from similar cultures.

Instead, we would want a much more diverse (and therefore more easy to assimilate) group of people from around the world, who respect our laws, and are willing to wait in line as opposed to what is by definition a criminal class that snuck into this country in the dead of night, forged documents, used fake social security numbers, and mock people who believe that our immigration laws should be taken seriously with their very presence in our country. Let me add to that by saying that, yes, we would want some people who do manual labor, but we'd also want plenty of engineers, rocket scientists, math teachers, doctors, and other professionals.

In short, the Senate immigration bill will do enormous damage to this country because it has it exactly backwards: it has turned immigration in this country into a right designed to primarily benefit people who come here illegally instead of an orderly, well maintained privilege that we grant to people who respect our laws so that they can help make our nation a better place to live for all of us.

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About The Author
John Hawkins is a professional blogger who runs Right Wing News, Linkiest, and Viral Footage.
 
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Right on
I was already upset at Bush for everything else, despite voting for him twice. This makes me want to turn my back on him for good. Shoot, let the democrats impeach him, at least then we'll have Cheney.

If it smells like fertilizer
it probably is.

This bill smells like AMNESTY no matter what the out-of-touch elites want to tell us.

Here in California, we are drowning in a morass of ivory-tower Leftists, illegal aliens, and Central American Marxists. The police have been emasculated, and the Chief of Police, William Bratton is bending over and holding the desk for Mayor Villaraigosa (aka Villa-Reconquista).

After the problems in Mac Arthur Park on May 1st, I wrote to Governator Schwartzenegger's office about the security issues regarding the group called the March 25th Coalition, who plan to take the Southwest "back" for "La Raza" (The Race- guess WHICH race that would be).

So today, I got my reply.

His office advised me to contact the office of the State Attorney General.

It took a little while for me to remember who the California Attorney General is... JERRY BROWN! Yes, the old former Governor Moonbeam, who practically destroyed California when he was in charge.

Think he will do anything about Marxist agitators? Not bloody likely!!! He is a Marxie himself from waaaay back.

If the feds don't do anything to help us, we are $cr&w&d!!!!

Bravo - A Perfect Ten
This is the best opinion piece I have ever read on Townhall concerning the illegal alien invasion. There was absolutely no quivering, PC dialect, or parsing to this man's essay -- he tells it like it is.

And a perfect recitation of the facts and solutions wasn't ruined with ending statements like, "After the borders are secured then we can decide what to do with the 12 - 20 million". Why would we want to do anything but deport the illegals before, during, or after the mythical point when borders are finally secure? Is the 2.4 trillion cost going to be any more palatable after the borders are supposedly secure?

And it wasn't ruined with, "...and then we can institute a "Guest" worker plan". Guest worker plans are never temporary and if by some stroke of magic they were indeed temporary it would essentially be temporary slavery. America is a greater country than that.

Thanks Mr. Hawkins for a great article and for not ruining the ending.

KILL IT NOW!
Any amnesty is surrender, not only to the demands of citizens of other countries illegally in our country, but also to those who have been encouraging them to break our laws. Corporations have been paying off our politicians to subvert enforcement of existing laws since they were passed in 1986. We won't be bamboozled again. The jig is up. We know this is not about immigration, it is about importing cheap labor. KILL THIS BILL NOW. ENFORCE THE LAW NOW. SECURE THE BORDER NOW. Maybe after 20 years of action, to make up for the 20 years of inaction we've had, we can talk about immigration reform.

This is a great article
It is only a short time before some from the small group of Americans who support amnesty show up to blast it, but they cannot fault Hawkins for his honesty about this.

It sickens me that politicians are not courageous enough to tell the Mexican government where they can stick their complaints about this country not wanting Mexican poor to invade our country.

Until every welfare recipient is working, I do not want to hear the words "the illegals are doing jobs the Americans won't do."

Would I be willing to pay more for produce if farmers had to pay better wages? You bet, I would. It would be a lot cheaper in the long run.

Any politician who votes for amnesty should be sent packing by his/her constituents in the next election! When illegals take precedent over American citizens, it is time for change.

Sorry Mountain Rose
I am afraid California may already be lost. The only hope we may have of saving not only CA, but America is to elect a President who WILL secure the border and enforce the law. One man in the race has pledged to do just. He has pledged to build the whole fence in 6 months. The current President has had 6 months and has 2 miles to show for it. Duncan Hunter will secure the border and will enforce the law. I don't have any confidence that any of the others are doing anything other than posturing. We had better make darn sure the next President will actually do something or it will not be our country any more.

Excellent point Dottie.
It's worth repeating:

"Until every welfare recipient is working, I do not want to hear the words 'the illegals are doing jobs the Americans won't do.'"


Excellent article too!

Virginia Patriot- Thanks!!!
You know, there are enough conservative Americans left in Los Angeles to make a difference, but they have all moved to the farthest North part of the county, where the air is clean and the streets are safe, and there are few people from lower classes living there. It is almost like San Fernando Valley from the '50s.

So those people, who dealt with the problem by fleeing, don't feel the problem acutely like those of us left here in the pressure cooker.

I don't know what it would take to get them riled up enough to become politically active. They have escaped (for now) and are busy with the PTA, Soccar, and Church Picnics, while the rest of us rot!

What to do?
As long as these prostitute politicians are aligned against us there's not much we can do. They can legislate whatever bill they want; anyone in the Senate who disagree with them will be silenced by either vicious frontal attack or behind the closed doors. Although I like Virginia Patriot's argumentation and resolve, I don't see a strong block of politicians willing to say it as it is. None of them is willing to become a subject of mad dog attacks from the left and more importantly, from the right (by the president, senators like Graham, even miserable Linda Chavez who recently discovered a call of blood).
We don't even know the statistics of how many citizens emailed to and how many called their senators. The latter will never reveal the true numbers. Besides, many millions of Democrat voters are simply follow their party lines; for example, my neighbor told me years ago that she votes Democrat because her working family has always voted Democrats. For her there's no difference whether it is Clinton, Jackson or Obama -- whoever her party designates. Many vote following endorsements by unions, newspapers, etc. With Americans like that, what do we have in our assets? Without an organization, no victory. That's why people joined major political parties. I chosen Republican party as the closest to my conservative philosophy. Now, we don't even have this party; its so-called leaders sold themselves to the devil.
So I'm saying: What to do? Too many enemies are aligned against us and I have known their Socialist brethren closely and personally: they are immoral, ruthless, spineless, untrustworthy, without God in their hearts. Add nationalism, racism, long hatred of America and you will have a terrifying picture. I know what they will do when they come to power; that subject is not part of the American schools curricula.

Propaganda
Did you hear Tony Snow on O’Reilly last night? The scamnesty propaganda machine rolls on. Now the spin is that if we tried to have any large scale deportations, it would so overload law enforcement and the courts that the system would break down and they would be doing nothing else, that every other function would be stopped cold. Talk about blatant scare tactics and dishonest rhetoric. Is he actually insinuating that every deportation is a vast, expensive, time consuming bureaucratic procedure? Is he trying to make us believe that every illegal alien is entitled to a trial before being deported?
Every time a Scamnesty propagandist opens his mouth, I am
again actually stunned by how stupid they think we are.

Excellent article!!
Now let's put the 'comprehensive bill' on the Orient Express and give each American a little knife with which to really, REALLY kill this obscenity.

With any luck, TubbyTeddy will be holding it! The same TubbyTeddy who is primarily responsible for destroying what once upon a time was a sensible immigration practice and morphing it over the years into this destructive piece of ***.

"All aboard."

Black Dog
Se habla espanol?

Bush Pulls Border and Airport Screeners?

President Bush has once again demonstrated poor judgment on protecting our Country. Does anyone think it is a good idea to pull border agents and airport screeners to guard candidates?

Currant-WASHINGTON — The U.S. Secret Service expects to borrow more than 2,000 immigration officers and federal airport screeners next year to help guard an ever-expanding field of presidential candidates.

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/bush-pulls-border-and-airport-screeners


Black Dog
What a load of crap. Oh Boo-Hoo for those poor mommies.

Who said having kids out of wedlock was a right? For THAT matter, who said having kids was a right at all? If you can't support em, DON'T HAVE EM! It's what RESPONSIBLE PEOPLE DO. I was 30 when my first kid was born. Well established in my career field and able to support them. Gee, what a concept huh?

Put em in the fields picking crops with a nice child care center closeby. They WORK for a living, we get rid of the illegals, and we reduce the welfare rolls.

Sounds like a win-win to me.

ALL
Check my blog today for an article on the human locust and a pic of our new money!

Right ON
Bush, Kennedy, McCain collaborated to sell us out. Tony Snow is now back as the chief propagandaist. After we flood our Senators and our Congressmen with messages that we will never forget who sold us out (if they do) it is time to look for a real conservative with the guts to enforce the law and the border.
http://teamtancredo.com

speaking truth to power, America!

Encouraging news, Middle America-- while it is true that the Conspiracy Of Evil (see definition just below) expected to cram this thru Congress, and some variation may well pass the Senate, we ARE successfully rattling their cages. See power of the other side here:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/05/15/AR2007051502022.html

A pundit yesterday said that ANY RINO Senator will tell you that calls are running against the inchoate Scamnesty bill 100:1. The other side IS powerful (organized and monied), but YOU are answering them with what they sometimes fear in Congress-- the vox populi... popular opinion/votes! Keep up the pressure-- see how just below!
________________________________________________

Have you noticed how many columnists are speaking out against the BS served up by the apologists for ILLEGAL aliens, speaking truth to the power of the Conspiracy Of Evil? [miscreant employers; scandal-ridden Catholic Church leaders seeking replacement contributors; open borders, NAU globalists seeking unrestricted cheap labor; the weird, anti-America, multicultural, PC crowd; leftists seeking a permanent entitlement Big Brother government; self-aggrandizing pols].

They say that Presidente Jorge and many in the Senate are dumbfounded that Middle America is so irate about the pending Scamnesty. [Then again, it does not take much to perplex Dubya!] The truth is that the remote "elites" see the ILLEGAL invasion in theoretical terms. The massive, monied organized lobbies they hear most from make them imagine that it is a sure thing that we should naturalize 15-20 million (who would turn into 60-100 million just like them soon enough!) undereducated, indigent, ethnocentric, "cheap" laborers... that America "must have them to do all of those jobs Americans won't do." THEIR children do not go to schools decimated by the ILLEGAL invaders... the rich LIKE their cheap ILLEGAL help nodding deferentially as they tend their lawns and mow the fairways at their private clubs as the "elites" walk by to climb into their Mercedes SUV's.

But Middle America in its straightforward wisdom sees through the shell game... it realizes that the teeming masses of uneducated, indigent ILLEGAL alien laborers are REALLY only benefiting a few business owners (who do NOT pass on the "savings") at the unbridled expense of ALL... that the downside of letting them all naturalize here will be CATASTROPHIC... that Americans would be MUCH BETTER OFF if employers simply paid a bit more to hire Americans-- like they always have before. Indeed, the jobs at Armour, etc., are quickly filled by Americans after rare "show raids" clear out infestations of ILLEGALS.

Amazingly, even the new LIBERAL-commissioned CBS/N.Y. TIMES poll says that Americans oppose key goals of apologists for ILLEGAL aliens and the architects of the pending Scamnesty:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/25/us/25poll.html?pagewanted=print

TIMES poll excerpts:
"Most of those polled agreed that illegal immigrants should eventually be allowed to APPLY to become American citizens. BUT 59 percent said illegal immigrants should be CONSIDERED for citizenship ONLY AFTER legal immigrants who have played by the rules." [Ergo, no path to amnesty! This question was disingenuous-- other polls show that a substantial majority opposes a path to citizenship for those who came here ILLEGALLY UNLESS they go home first and get in line-- that says: NO SCAMNESTY!]

"In the poll, 75 PERCENT of those who responded favored TOUGHER PENALTIES FOR EMPLOYERS of illegal workers, and 82 PERCENT said the federal government should DO MORE TO REINFORCE THE BORDER."

"Among those polled, a majority of 51 percent favored overhauling the American immigration system to make it more attuned to economic demands, GIVING PRIORITY TO JOB SKILLS AND EDUCATIONAL ACCOMPLISHMENT. Only 34 percent said that immigrants with family ties in the United States should take precedence."

Here are some more objective, detailed poll results which show what happens when the questions become more precise about views on immigration and what we want America to be:

http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back906.html
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=20530

And some about the problems the apologists artfully try to hide from you-- the first is a MUST SEE:

http://www.firesociety.com/article/12134/
http://www.amren.com/Reports/Hispanics/HispanicsReport.htm
http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/wm1076.cfm
http://www.theamericanresistance.com/articles/art2004jan04.html
http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/index.html
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=M2Q5ZWZiOTU2OTY1YWEyZDFiYTliNTRmMzk0ODIwMmE=
http://www.grassfire.org/
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=OTg5YmRmODY4OTAyZTU2NGM2Y2E3NjY2MzdmYTE1NjI=
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/back704.html

_______________________________________________

Middle America reads the dire warnings of Heritage about the TRUE all-in costs and gets righteously indignant against the weird Conspiracy Of Evil which attempts lamely to brand us "racist" and "zenophobic" for common sense reckonings that America CANNOT absorb masses of the undereducated indigent without morphing into what those poor people are trying to flea from. SEE HERITAGE SUMMARY HERE:

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/wm1076.cfm

Comprende espanol, amigos?

Keep booing Miss America, "amigos"-- it speaks volumes!
_______________________________________________

CONTACT YOUR PEOPLE IN CONGRESS ASAP FOLKS.... TELL THEM YOU WANT TO STOP SCAMNESTY... AMERICA IS TOO IMPORTANT AND SPECIAL TO ALLOW IT TO DEVOLVE INTO A THIRD WORLD WELFARE STATE... IT IS EASY TO REACH MEMBERS OF CONGRESS RIGHT HERE:

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm

Bookmark it and contact them often! If you want subject specific messages already prepared that you can fax/e-mail, go here (a GREAT site):

http://www.numbersusa.com/actionbuffet

May God bless America and save her from the self-serving myopia of the few at the expense of ALL.

Ken
Agreed. I want to see a Fred Thompson/Tancredo or a Thompson/Hunter ticket in 08.

"Thompson/Tancredo. FOR Americans NOT against them!"

some wandered off reservation of reason
reply to:
___________________________________________________
Black Dog writes: Friday, June, 01, 2007 7:49 AM
The Fear Mongers March On...
I guess after being dead on about Iraq and the WOT, the Warpublicans have new fear to spread - and we should listen to them because their track record is so solid...
___________________________________________________

I have opposed this wrong war at the wrong time in the wrong place since the beginning. OTOH, I have also opposed unbridled the ILLEGAL alien tsunami invasion. BOTH are threats to the well-being and antithetical to the best interests of America. Dogs might not get it, but Middle America certainly does!

ILLEGAL aliens are actually yet MORE inimical, because they threaten the very survival of the nation. An advanced socio-economy CANNOT absorb the teeming masses of uneducated indigent who would like to come here-- it would morph us into the very third world they seek to escape from. It is neither our fault that governments and economies in Latin America are corrupt and inequitable, nor our obligation to be the welfare lifeboat for same.

_______________________________________________

reply to: rocker
re: (edited w/corrections)
"Guess everything is OK when they are illegal and working on the jobs Americans don't want. But make them legal and it is the end of civilization as we know it. Relax, amigos. America is stronger than a bunch of bigots."
________________________________________________

This mythology is really way too platitudinous and shameful ad hominem calumny. It is NOT "bigotry" to believe in the rule of law and REAL immigration of those who can contribute on balance, as opposed to an unbridled invasion of border-crashers who then become serial lawbreakers --> tax dodgers, identity thieves, and welfare cheats who permeate high levels of crime, drugs, illegitimacy, ethnocentricity, dropouts, and barrio blight... what among these pandemic social pathologies do you find beneficial?!?!

We would gladly send them all to YOUR town, but the cancer has spread everywhere... like a cancer, the ultimate danger is that eventually the entire entity is inexorably destroyed by the alien life form voraciously feeding on its host.
Each ILLEGAL alien household is soaking up a net of $20k a year just in government services not paid for with concomitant taxes.

MOre
It will take a lot more than just a fence. It will take an immigration service that can function and an adminstration that wants to enforce the law.

The focus has been on the Mexican border but an even bigger sieve and security threat are the people who come in on tourist visas and never leave. I see nothing in this bill that stops overall illegal immigration.

Just about every other country in the world controls illegal immigration better than we do.

Why is that?

Amnesty Bill - A Ticking Time Bomb

.....This is a copy of an email I originally sent to the RNC and every talk show host I could think of:

.....America has been sucker punched by our President ...

.....Bush senior ...along with Bill Clinton (ever wonder why those two get along so well?) and John McCain ...are all members of the CFR and they all believe in "open(no)borders" ...the merging of Mexico, Canada and America (the North American Union) ...and the "Amero" as a common currency ...

.....They are "One World Government Globalists" and their ultimate goal is to end America's sovereignity ...the current "Amnesty Bill" is a big step in that direction ...America is being sold down the river by our President and a small group of traitors in Congress ...

.....Pundits like Bill O'Reilly and Mark Davis will poo poo all this as the rantings of conspiracy theory nut jobs or tin foil hat wearers but the evidence is there in plain sight for all to see ...citizens are being boiled like frogs to accept the end of America as a sovereign nation ...

.....to understand the motives behind President Bush ...Ted Kennedy and John McCain's support for Amnesty ...go to http://www.grasstopsusa.com and read ...
...NO AMNESTY
...NO NORTH AMERICAN SUPER HIGHWAY
...NO NORTH AMERICAN UNION

.....COLOSSUS

The Beginning of the End
The fall of the Roman Empire began when, to fill the ranks of the legions, the newly conquered were invited into the empire and made citizens. These new citizens had their own interests and demands, and the Roman Senate did what it could to mollify them. But, as anyone with two brain cells to rub together could have predicted, over time this arrangement faltered and the newly minted Roman citizens joined their old tribes and ransacked Rome.

Does anyone see any parallels here?

What our "leaders" in Washington have to get through their heads is that to sell any deal on immigration they will first have to convince us that it will actually be enforced. The can write in all the hoops and enforcement programs they want, but their history suggests they will never follow through. The end result will be 12 million newly minted legal residents and 20 million more queueing up at the border for the next amnesty.

March for America

..... http://www.lframerica.com/march2.html

.....support it or start learning to speak Spanish .....COLOSSUS

Virginia Patriot
"One man in the race has pledged to do just. He has pledged to build the whole fence in 6 months. The current President has had 6 months and has 2 miles to show for it. Duncan Hunter will secure the border and will enforce the law."

While I agree with you in principle, we need someone who will secure out borders and restore our economic freedom, I don't think Hunter is the only one who will do, as you implied. I feel he is one of the three. Tancredo (who will get my vote in the primary), Hunter, and Paul. They are the ONLY options for President any constitution-loving American has.

A vote for Giuliani, Romney, McCain, Clinton, Obama, Edwards or any of the others who have made it clear they have never read the constitution, or if they have read it they have no reading comprehension, is the same as lighting a match and holding it up to what little is left of this once great nation. The 10th amendment, amoung others, has been ignored for far too long. National univeral healthcare, national welfare, national social secutity, national education, federal laws on abortion, and the federal government defining marriage, are all unconstitutional. If you support them please find a country whose documentation agrees with you and stop trying to steal this one. All those things are STATE issues not federal, if you don't agree read your constitution, in the United States of America the federal governement has stolen (from the states) the power to do things it was never inteded to do.

mountain rose
Have you seen this? I can't believe this is the Speaker of the California Assembly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIW-BZ8oLrk&eurl=

political winds
They say that Sen. Juan McQuisling is fading further lately in large part because he is (rightly) tied to Scamnesty... OTOH, Romney has gained some ground for speaking out against the Scamnesty bill, and similar opposition (even more vocal by Fred) is seen as a key plus among those hoping that Fred Thompson will take the plunge.

I have maintained for some time that if the Republican candidate truly makes an issue of stanching ILLEGAL aliens and Shrillary or whoever whines about their "rights" and "compassion," the 'Crat will suffer greatly. Fully 68% of Americans are opposed to what has been passing as "immigration" of late:

http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back906.html

Actually so far the 'Crats have been smarter on this thing than the RINOS. They have watched with a smirk as RINOS welcome ILLEGALS amid foolish fantasies that they can snag some of the votes given their alleged "conservative social values." [What, pray tell, is "conservative" about rampant illegitimacy, dropout rates, gangs, barrio blight, crimes, and willful disparate, alien ethnocentricity?!]

Holy Mary, mother of God-- the indigent, ignorant ILLEGALS will inexorably vote for leftist big entitlement government! If Middle America fails to radiate the cancer of the ILLEGAL alien tsunami soon, the PC left "elites" (see ilk of Shrillary, Edwards, etc.) will control indefinitely as we morph ineluctably into a third world shell of our former societal greatness and socio-economic strength amid the giant sucking sound of the government black hole devouring everything productive for the madding crowd of indigent, undereducated, former invaders... the killer bees will take over and spoil the big hive.

humorous
Those who throw the word bigot around when it does not apply have cheapened it to where it has no real meaning. I really think those who screamed "racists," "bigots," and other such words thought that would stem the tide of opposition against this travesty.

If people really want to help the illegals, they should appeal to their representatives and senators to put some pressure on Mexico to fix its system. Why should people have to come here to make a "decent" living? Are Mexicans bigots? I see they have stronger immigration laws than we do.

And, as for trying to drag kids into the welfare issue. That is ridiculous. Too many women on welfare simply use those kids for a meal ticket. The kids grow up without a solid example of a work ethic, and too many of them end up on welfare too. Earning your own way is the only path to freedom, and not sitting on your butt expecting the American taxpayer to pay for your own irresponsibility. If people realized the safety net was only for those who CANNOT work due to physical diability with NO loopholes for drug abuse, alcoholism, or other self-inflicted problems, it would solve a lot of problems. The war on poverty is a hopeless quagmire, so how much longer do you expect us to fund this failed war?

Clap, Clap, Clap, Hurray for Hawkins
Except for occasional Rocker-DOGS, personally I don't care what color they are, we have all stood straight up in front of our chairs and saluted Mr Hawkins. He can come to my house for dinner any time.

And Virginia Patriot, it's Thompson-Hunter, right? I trust Tancredo and Hunter more than even Thompson, but lets get them on the ticket and elected.

And if some people are being paid to get on TH blogs and write stupidities, well so be it. I think with another 200 or 300 writers like Hawkins, we can get those pols running down the road so fast they forget to cash their paychecks.

And there are a lot of writers who are just waiting to see which way the wind is blowing. You know, like a lot of politicians. Semper Fi and Guuuung Ho

what would our "leaders" say about this?

Imagine that 20 million Mexican (and others) massed on our southern border. At a predesignated time, armies of poor Hispanics (and others) march across the border and into the United States, ransacking border towns and moving steadily into the interior of the country. There are reports of gang violence and numerous thefts.

Would there be ANY response by our leaders? Would they stop the horde? Or would they hit the airways, seeking to convince Americans that any apprehension is pure bigotry. Would Americans who protest be full of "empty rhetoric"?

Would the government actually tell the American people that AMERICANs should help pay for this invasion??

Lastly, if you think that the government would actually act to stop this invasion, then why haven't they stopped it over the past ten years??

Oh yeah, that boiling frog thing again...

reply to: Black Dog
re:
______________________________________
Black Dog writes: Friday, June, 01, 2007 10:59 AM
United Fruit Company
Lodestar - google it up and then get back to us on American involvement in South and Central American economies...
___________________________________________________

If it were not for the U.S., economies in Latin American would collapse. It is THEIR autocratic and plutocratic forms of government and economic systems which cause their suffering, not our involvement. I teach college level economics and am a sedulous student of history and politics... I know a bit about it.

Our real concerns should be with the NAU, one-world, open borders globalists who would put aside nationalism and identity as a people... a nation with no borders ceases to be a nation. Interestingly, the ILLEGAL alien latino invaders do NOT share the globalist views-- they TRULY believe that much of the U.S. rightfully belongs to Mexico/Latin America, and they are quite serious about the Reconquista-- they are teaching it in the schools in Mexico, though most who come here from there drop out after the 7th grade.

Excellent column, Mr. Hawkins!
"...we're mostly talking about poor people from socialist countries who don't respect America's laws and will have great difficulty improving their lot in America because of their limited English skills and lack of an education (If ever there was a group of people with "Democratic Party voter" written all over them, it's this batch of illegals)."

Funny and sad at the same time.

By the way, anyone interested in Mark Steyn's column on comprehensive immigration reform is welcome to drop by my blog (just click on my name).

Rocker

First of all, even if they are "legalized" (even though the only reason that the government wants to legalize them is because THEY BROKE THE LAW getting here), they will not pay anywhere close to what they spend in government services.

I know that to a liberal like you, that doesn't matter. Liberals love to BUY votes, and that is the only reason that they are supporting this garbage now. As for you, I don't believe that you care about that. Instead, I am sure that you just want to feel good about helping a poor Mexican...you don't care about the cost...in money or blood...as long as you feel good.

By the way, forgetting the money for a second, what would you tell the mothers and fathers and sons and daughters who have been victims of the hardened criminal element of these illegal immigrants? Again, you probably don't care about these Americans as long as poor Mexicans get some jobs and you feel good.

another one for Rocker

Here's another one for you.

What do you say to poor Americans who will have their wages suppressed?

What do you say to parents who have their kids in schools that are inundated and slowed by illegal immigrant children?

In my mind, liberals are trading one group of poor people for another.

Oh, that's right...the poor Americans can just collect welfare. Perfect plan...poor Americans on welfare and poor illegals. And who pays for this.

Oh, that's right. Us.

Bigots
Why does wanting the laws enforced automatically make one a "bigot?"

Marx or Lenin or somebody said it,
...can't remember the exact words but society is a continuing class war between the capitalists and the workers.

Us, being the workers, have been out flanked by them, the captialists, who have enrolled foreign mercenaries to destroy us as a blue collar working class of people.
We, the workers, have protested to them, our elected representatives about this outrage. But our elected leader and our elected representatives have turned their coats and joined them, the capitalists.

No wonder folks like them want to take away our guns.

when justice breaks down, violence will ensue

Could it be true?
I jsut read that this bill calls for an acceleration of the March 2005 agreement between out President, the president of Mexico, and the Prime Minister of Canada, known as the "Security and Prosperity Partnership" (SSP) of North America. Theis is a somewhat secret agreement, that aims to erase the borders between the U.S.,Canada, and Mexico, and threatens our sovernity and security. this bill should be eliminated, not accelerated.
This legislation also makes it easier to target gun dealers for prosicution . Gun clubs could find themselves targetedunder this legislation.

They have also recruted 120 of our best trained Border Patrol, to go to Iraq, to teach the Iraqis how to better guard their borders. They will removing National Guard troops from several border states to deploy them in Iraq, and Afghanistan. This is an outrage!!!

If this is true, It's even worse than I thought. And I already thought it was outrageous!!!

reply to; Rocker
re:
_______________________________________________
rocker writes: Friday, June, 01, 2007 11:40 AM
illegals and taxes
lodestar writes:
Each ILLEGAL alien household is soaking up a net of $20k a year just in government services not paid for with concomitant taxes.

If you repubs are so concerned that illegals dont pay thier fair share of taxes, why not make them legal so you can enforce this.
And how do you come about the 20k/year figure?
This is just a red herring.
___________________________________________________

It is NO red herring... here is the link to the data from Heritage, a highly respected think tank... read it and weep-- or at least learn:

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/wm1076.cfm

Simply click on the recording at the upper right of Dr. Robert Rector speaking in detail specifically about the tax equation for ILLEGAL aliens.

Actually, he does not also address here the myriad social costs associated with the uneducated poor due to concomitant social pathologies, nor does he mention the implicit costs of ethnocentricity such as clinging to spanish. The all-in costs of so-called "cheap" ILLEGAL alien labor will be CATASTROPHIC.

Actually, making them legal does NOTHING to "make them pay their fair share of taxes" as you put it. Two key points: 1) ANY undereducated, indigent resident is a substantial net tax drain on society, so 2) we MUST place an emphasis on educated, skilled immigrants because our society is now an advanced service economy, not the agrarian-based economy of 100 years ago which could absorb the uneducated and unskilled. Ergo, we CANNOT benefit from allowing or inviting the teeming masses of the undereducated, unskilled to come here.

Unlike the apologists for ILLEGAL aliens, I am not simply braying disingenuous drivel because I want to reshape America into a PC plutocracy of the "elites" ruling a massive welfare state, or reclaim it via the "Reconquista," or eliminate its borders, heritage, sense of purpose, and culture simply to enrich the relative few with new slave labor to milk.

Excuse the errors
Think my fingers got tangled a few times.

The Right thing for America..
Is NOT Amnesty!
This bill gives a legal right to be in our country to EVERY illegal immediately upon it's signing by the President. That is amnesty!

***understand they will not pay fines,taxes,or touch-back because THEY DON"T WANT TO BE CITIZENS! THEY JUST WANT TO BE LEGAL RESIDENTS WHICH THIS BILL GIVES THEM IMMEDIATELY!

1.ENFORCE THE LAWS WE HAVE!
2.Retain our right to DEPORT any illegal we choose. Personally I choose all gang members, felons(especially violent), DUI offenders, druggies, child abusers etc.
3. Punish Employers according to LAWS ON THE BOOKS!
4. No social services for Illegals- pass a Constitutional Ammendment if necessary. Stop the "anchor babys" again another ammendment if necessary.
5. Seal the borders- and let the Border Agents actuall PROTECT OUR BORDERS! there's a concept for ya!
6. BUILD THE FENCE CONGRESS ALREADY VOTED FOR!!

****By the way all you social libs who like to feel superior because of your affinity for the little guy--Here's a CAUSE for you--FREE Agents Campeon and Rameriz 2 U.S. Border agents IN PRISON for shooting an illegal DRUG SMUGGLER in the a** as he was ILLEGALLY attempting to cross OUR BORDER!
Since we anti-amnesty folks are all bigots against latinos - MAYBE YOU CAN GET'EM OUT!

For rocker and Black Dog
NO, it was NOT "OK" when they were here "illegally, doing jobs Americans won't do."

There are no such things as jobs Americans won't do. There are only jobs that Americans won't do for substandard wages, under substandard conditions, with no recourse for unfair treatment in the workplace.

The real hypocrisy here comes from the left. The same left that for decades has claimed to represent the rights of the "working man" has simultaneously supported undermining those very rights by tolerating, enabling, and supporting the tactic of giving jobs to illegals.

Meanwhile, the very same left continues to badger Wal-Mart for not paying its LEGAL resident workers more money and for not providing its employees with health insurance.

It's long past time for you hypocrites to start insisting that illegals and their employers comply with the same standards you want to jam down Wal-Mart's throat.

Illegals are, by definition, law-breakers. All we on the right want is justice. That means we want the law enforced. The 'punishment' for committing the crime of entering this country illegally is supposed to be deportation, not a "Z" visa that allows you to bring in four family members as well, and which can be renewed every four years until the recipient dies.

Finally, were are not "scared" of illegals. We simply refuse to continue supporting them.

Two sides of the same coin, eh?!
"Now the spin is that if we tried to have any large scale deportations, it would so overload law enforcement and the courts that the system would break down and they would be doing nothing else, that every other function would be stopped cold."

Yes, but the scamnesty proponents now argue that the same HGUE overbearing load of bureaucratic duties for registering all the illegals and processing the Z-visas, etc., will somehow NOT overload the system and bring everything to a halt?!

Buffoons. I'd much rather overload law enforcement to do the right thing, than overload bureaucrats to do the wrong thing.

Voters and cheap labor
I understand the analysis that says Democrats want the illegals made legal for a new voter bloc, but I'm having trouble seeing how Republicans look at it as a source of cheap labor.

The illegals are cheap labor while they're illegal. When they become legal, who thinks they aren't going to essentially use that legal status to bid up labor costs. Perhaps not to the same level as the legal residents, but that "cheap labor" is going to ring mighty hollow. Then we'll need a whole new cheap labor pool of NEW illegals.

Democrats win if the bill passes, Republicans get a waning "win" that depreciates rapidly if it passes. Why again to the Republicans want this to pass?

Hugo Chavez
is stepping all over everyone and the illegal aliens are stepping all over us. How does this continue to happen? When 96 percent of Americans are against amnesty, how does this continue to happen? How does God keep getting let out of our society when only 14 percent of Americans are atheists? I'm serious. What the heck???

Wisone: More Leftist Hypocrisy
What about the left and their desire to protect the environment? What impact do they think that 12-20 MILLION people have on our environment? Think of all of the wilderness that needs to be paved in order to house them all. Plus the grocery stores, department stores, and cars etc.

Where are we going to get all that extra drinking water? We are already in crisis throughout the country.

Landfills? More of them as well.

Oil: LOTS more, plus coal too and all the other raw materials (plastic, etc) that they are so worried about.

Make no mistake about it, they will use much more here in America than they will in their home country.


Hunting
Bush needs to go on a deer hunt with Cheney.

grids wrote:
"Yes, but the scamnesty proponents now argue that the same HGUE overbearing load of bureaucratic duties for registering all the illegals and processing the Z-visas, etc., will somehow NOT overload the system and bring everything to a halt?!"

It won't bring the Z-visas to a halt because they are AUTOMATICALLY approved UNLESS a background check shows they can't get one. The government has 24 HOURS to deny the visa from application. Then THEY ARE IN, anything after that point is TOO LATE!!!!!

Sung to the immortal words of Monty Python (slightly modified)
SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, oh wonderful SCAM! SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM, SCAM,

(sorry, I got carried away)

another problem

Washington DC, February 2, 2010

Today, President Hillary Rodham addressed the growing DUI problems in a national speech designed to mollify growing anger among ordinary Americans.

"Today, we have a serious DUI problem. We know it. And today, I am urging Congress to pass the current Comprehensive DUI law that is being debated. The bill will treat DUI violators humanely and decently while addressing the DUI problem. Those who are speaking out about this bill are using empty rhetoric, hoping to stop the bill using fear and misinformation."

The President and Congress have been under fire lately, especially from right wing talk show hosts and their follows who claim that the Comprehensive DUI bill is amnesty. The bill, if signed, would prevent local law enforcement from conducting DUI stops. Furthermore, those offenders currently facing jail time would be absolved.

According to the President, "the offenders are good people, family oriented people. They only want to work and make a better life for themselves. It is our burden to help these people fulfill the American Dream."

Opponents argue that it is the government's obligation to enforce current laws. They worry that this amnesty will simply encourage others to drive while drunk with impunity, endangering millions of Americans.

The Heritage Foundation reports that the amnesty bill will cost the American taxpayers hundreds of billions of dollars in hospital care and legal fees over the next couple decades.

The President, despite the growing hostility of the American people, urged Congress to pass the bill for the good of the American people.


Ho-Hum
Fifty years ago conservatives saw Communists behind their sofa. They said that racial integration was a Communist plot and definitely Martin Luther King and everybody in the NAACP were all Communists. They fought putting fluoride in the drinking water (to prevent tooth decay in children). They saw to it that boys with hair longer than a crew cut got expelled from school (this actually happened---kids with long hair were assumed to be dangerous hippies).

A hundred years ago conservatives fought immigration just as hard as they are doing now. When the immigrants were Asian they were called "The Yellow Peril". Italian immigrants were feared as part of a Catholic plot to put the Pope in charge of the United States. Although factory labors worked hideously long hours in unsafe conditions, their attempts to organize were called "anarchist" and (you guessed it) Communist.

A hundred and fifty years ago conservatives defended slavery as Christian. Abolitionists were viewed the same way hippies were in the 1960's.

The words may change but conservatives just keep singing the same old song: hate, social control, fear. Ho-hum.

Hey Lilly

Go to any inner-city school in the country. Walk around. Talk to the kids.

And see the result of your liberal ideas.


Excellent summary
An excellent summary. And a good explanation of how immigration is supposed to work - for the benefit of all Americans. Not as a tool for corrupt politicians of both parties.

This isn't about Democrats versus Republicans or Left versus Right. This about our so-called leadership destroying our country. We will all lose if this bill passes.

STOP ANY REP. DONATIONS NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RNC is "very, very surprised" that the donations to Rep. party went down by 40%.
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Let's knock it down to ZERO!!!!
Stop any donation NOW!
When they've called me, I always said: "close the borders and then we'll talk".
Never called me again....

Again, my "house" analogy
Imagine the US as your house, and someone walks in the front door without knocking, brings his whole family in, sets up their own living arrangements in your den, steals the food from your refrigerator, invites all their friends to join them, and demands that you add them to the deed as part owners.

It think THAT captures the reality of the situation.


Rush Limbaugh
Rush pointed out that there are already "guest worker programs" here in the US. There's no need for yet another program.

The danger to our country
The RINOs who are sidetracking the GOP away from the principles upon which this country is founded are potentially dooming the entire country.

The US has no God-given mandate nor guarantee of its survival, and historically the great empires have failed not due to external forces and invasions, but due to internal rot that weakened them to the point of either vulnerability to an inferior force, or outright implosion. Greece, Rome, USSR, Egypt, Persia, Armenia, Imperial UK, France.... all have failed for the same reason.

We are on the same path. The GOP is seriously considering candidates such as Giuliani and McCain who would destroy its principles. Bush and the GOP are joining with liberalism to push another amnesty that opens the floodgates to
an underskilled and undereducated permanent underclass that will drain our resources while having a huge impact on our cultural heritage and value system.

In a government "of, by, and for the People", the wishes of the People are being totally ignored and berated with slanderous ad homina.

The danger to the fabric of our nation cannot, in my opinion, be overstated.

The myth of the "$5 head of lettuce":
I was watching a "Modern Marvels" episode the other day on the History Channel, and the topic was harvesting automation.

What was very interesting to me is that as labor costs increased, automating the harvesting process became ever-more the viable economic option. Almost any crop can be mechanically harvested, but there's the initial cost to the farmer of buying the harvesters, which they avoid doing until forced by economics.

The conclusion I drew was that we'll never see the apocryphal "$5 head of lettuce". If the illegals aren't available for picking the lettuce, either other cheap labor, i.e. unskilled Americans, will step in at a higher wage, or the farmers will simply switch to harvesting machines.

"We can't simply deport 12 million people":
First of all, just because you can't capture every lawbreaker doesn't mean you simply give them all amnesty. How about murderers and robbers? We don't get all of them, either.

As to rounding up the ones we can: Every time they show up at the emergency room, put 'em on a bus back south. Kids in school? Bus 'em south. They're grouping together for another of their street demonstrations? ICE rounds 'em up and puts 'em on the bus south. Raids like the one in Arkansas. No more "catch and release". Enforce the 1986 law and give their employers jail time. Stopped for a traffic violation, jail and deport 'em. This is the only law on the books that isn't enforced when you're stopped for a ticket; see what happens if you have an outstanding warrant. Check the status of all the day workers hanging around the hardware store.

Pretty soon, you'll have rounded up a LOT of them, and made the environment so hostile they'll start self-deporting.

Sounds pretty effective to me.


Amnesty!!
I would be willing to bet that all the people who back this bill don't have a clue as to what is really going on. As one who works with the Border Patrol daily, I can tell you that it is not the common people that pose a threat, it's the drug cartels. The Sinaloa cartel and the Tijana cartel run the border on the south side. If this bill is passed, I can guarantee that it will be war not only politically but physically. There are numerous occassions where agents have been fired upon that the MSM doesn't even report. But why would they? They as well as the Democrats and, unfortunately, some Republicans don't want you to know the truth. I can personally promise you that if this bill passes, not only will we see a dramatic rise of violence along our Southern border; but we will also see an instant surge in the number of people crossing. BTW 12 million is not even close to the number of illegals that are in this country. It's more like 30 million.

reply to Black Dog
response to:
_________________________________________________
Black Dog writes: Friday, June, 01, 2007 12:38 PM
Lodestar says:
"I teach college level economics and am a sedulous student of history and politics... I know a bit about it."

Then you probably know way more than me, but how can you say we've not meddled in the economies and governments of South and Central America?
____________________________________________________

Oh, we have indeed indubitably "meddled in the economies and governments of South and Central America"-- much to their benefit on balance. THEIR economies depend FAR MORE on us than vice versa. The best jobs they have come from American companies which have "near-sourced" jobs to their otherwise typically wretched economies.

Mexico is rich in resources-- but its ruling plutocracy keeps the wealth among the very few-- like most countries in the world. Hence, while they boo Miss America because of envy of our success and plenty for many, most of them will gladly come here to jump on our gravy train. We need a border wall NOT to keep people in, but to keep the economically desperate out.
____________________________________________

reply to:
wiseone writes: Friday, June, 01, 2007 12:29 PM
pointguard writes: Friday, June, 01, 2007 11:48 AM

Excellent posts, folks! Charity begins at home!
We can neither afford, nor do we have some sort of moral obligation, to serve as the welfare department for failed economies in Latin America-- or anywhere else! If you try to put too many in the lifeboat, it founders for ALL.

Someone noted the environmental impacts... ask anyone living in the desert southwest about the trash everywhere from "these hard-working undocumented workers just trying to feed their families." Ask them on Long Island(!) about former nice communities which have morphed into barrios. Ask them in Hazleton, Pa. about the threats from La Raza, the ACLU, etc. that--> We will bankrupt your city with litigation to stop you from enforcing these regulations against ILLEGALS. Yessir, we sure need more of the same!
Muchas gracias, amigos!

Bush has torn the conservative

President Bush has torn the conservative coalition asunder.

This is great essay by Peggy Noonan explaining my frustration I have with President Bush. Do you think she is right?

From-PEGGY NOONAN

WSJ-What political conservatives and on-the-ground Republicans must understand at this point is that they are not breaking with the White House on immigration. They are not resisting, fighting and thereby setting down a historical marker–”At this point the break became final.” That’s not what’s happening. What conservatives and Republicans must recognize is that the White House has broken with them. What President Bush is doing, and has been doing for some time, is sundering a great political coalition. This is sad, and it holds implications not only for one political party but for the American future.

The White House doesn’t need its traditional supporters anymore, because its problems are way beyond being solved by the base. And the people in the administration don’t even much like the base. Desperate straits have left them liberated, and they are acting out their disdain. Leading Democrats often think their base is slightly mad but at least their heart is in the right place. This White House thinks its base is stupid and that its heart is in the wrong
place.

For almost three years, arguably longer, conservative Bush supporters have felt like sufferers of battered wife syndrome. You don’t like endless gushing spending, the kind that assumes a high and unstoppable affluence will always exist, and the tax receipts will always flow in? Too bad! You don’t like expanding governmental authority and power? Too bad. You think the war was wrong or is wrong? Too bad.

But on immigration it has changed from “Too bad” to “You’re bad.”

The president has taken to suggesting that opponents of his immigration bill are unpatriotic–they “don’t want to do what’s right for America.” His ally Sen. Lindsey Graham has said, “We’re gonna tell the bigots to shut up.” On Fox last weekend he vowed to “push back.” Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff suggested opponents would prefer illegal immigrants be killed; Commerce Secretary Carlos Gutierrez said those who oppose the bill want “mass deportation.” Former Bush speechwriter Michael Gerson said those who oppose the bill are “anti-immigrant” and suggested they suffer from “rage” and “national chauvinism.”

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/president-bush-has-torn-the-conservative-coalition-asunder


Jobs Americans Won't Do
Rocker writes: "Guess everything is OK when they are illegal and working on the jobs americans dont want."

I'd like to know what these jobs are. Could someone please name some?

As I understand it, the largest penetration the illegals have made is in the as farm workers -- where they make up about 30% of the workers. Now maybe I'm missing something, but that means that 70% of the jobs in this sector are held by Americans. Thus these are jobs that Americans want and will do.

I suspect that if the illegal aliens weren't here, the wages might go up. And if that happened, who knows, maybe more Americans would find work more profitable than welfare.

That's the key to this entire problem. Republicans have been bought by business and business wants cheap labor. Democrats want cheap labor too because that means that more people will stay on the welfare rolls.

If we get rid of the illegals, wages will go up & the welfare rolls will shrink. Good for the counrty, but bad for the politicians. Well, we know how the politicians are going to act...

reply to: lilly
cumbaya...
I think you need some new drugs there, girl-- you are getting those same hackneyed flashback images of us bad old Middle Americans!

A pox upon us for imagining that the rule of law out to matter, and that the heritage, culture, socio-economic stability, sense of purpose, indeed the American way itself might be worth preserving... how introverted of us! What selfish swine we are! Funny thing, though-- nobody is trying to get out of HERE! Hmmm...

Maybe they would buy into your platitudinous pablum down in Latin America where they have those socialist governments that solve all of life's problems... almost everybody has nothing, but oh the equality!

Illegal aliens on townhall blog
Sorry Black Dog . You are declared an illegal alien and I "flagged" you. Libs can blog but if you don't meet the IQ & integrity standards to blog with the Gunny G's and Brian R's then you are allowed only one blog before you are rounded up and sent back to Kosland or Huffingtonville where you belong.

STOP ANY REP. DONATIONS NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RNC is "very, very surprised" that the donations to Rep. party went down by 40%.
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Let's knock it down to ZERO!!!!
Stop any donation NOW!
When they've called me, I always said: "close the borders and then we'll talk".
Never called me again....

Bush is a Democrat
George Bush and his Senator allies are nothing but in the closet Democrats. The are RINOs and those people are NOT republicans. They do not stand for the principles of this party and base.

THIS IS A CALL TO ARMS: write every single Senator and express out rage. Then write the House representatives. Next we make a list of all those who supported this amnesty bill. Send money to the compeditors in the primaries. Vote them out of the party. If we can't do it in the primaries, then we hae no choice but to do so in the general election. But use the primaries first! Fred Thompson-Duncan Hunter in 2008!!!

Amnesty --- or betrayal?

TRAITORS!
This is George Bush's plan. George Bush is the Commander-in-chief during wartime. If this is his plan for securing our borders -- we have no right to disagree with him.
Why don't you people support our troops?

Raywood Ashe...Traitors?!
Sir, this plan DOES NOT secure our borders. It is every American's right to voice dissent, no matter how idiotic it may seem. Oh and by the way, I AM THE TROOP!! HOO-AH

Fences, etc.
I supported a border fence until someone said three little words that changed my mind -- President Hillary Clinton. Remember that a fence built to keep people out can also keep people in. If Hillary gets elected, we don't want her to have that option.

Contrary to what some have said above, people are leaving and more will leave if the Lizard Queen gets elected.

Black Dog has a point. Part of the illegal immigrant problem is caused by US government policy that destroys the economies of the countries south of the border.

Lots of people have talked about stopping welfare. I agree. But surely, if we're going to require women and children to get off the dole, we should do the same for multi-millionaires and giant corporations.

Take, for instance, the sugar subsidies. Most of this money goes to large corporartions. It pays them to grow sugar in the US -- where it is less efficient.

The US taxpayer pays several times for this -- once in taxes, again much in higher prices for things that conatin sugar, again in having to eat food sweetened with corn syrup instead of sugar, and again by having to play host to illegal aliens who come to this country because they cannot make a living growing sugar cane in their native lands.

This is only one of the things our government does that makes it difficult for people to earn a living in Central America.

Let us not be so so pro-American that we refuse to see our government's faults.

Our so-called leaders
really do not respect the Constitution or rule of law. They look upon us, the true owners of this great nation with total disdain. This sellout of our birthright will continue if we constantly fall for the myth they perpetuate with the help of their MSM cronies.

The myth is that only a Democrat OR Republican can be President! They have us all so convinced of this idea, that the result has been a concentration of power in the hands of the elites of both parties. Republicans on this site seem to be placing great hope in the new darling of the Republican elites, Fred Thompson!

When will we wake up and see the light? If we elect another Dem/GOP President in 2008, we are only going to guarantee more big government, less personal freedom, and growing influence for the internationalist cabal here, in Europe, and of course, the UN. Is this the future we want for our nation and our children?

I urge you to visit my website JOEOLIVAFORPRESIDENT.ORG. I am the only candidate who has published a Campaign Platform that outlines a concrete method for restoring the Constitution, rule of law, and will of the people as the principles by which we govern ourselves as a free people.

Why do we continue to believe the propaganda of both parties, why do we accept the idea that only they can govern, only they are smart enough or wise enough? Just because they say so? We need to have some faith in our own natural ability and wisdom, trust in our own common sense and reject the lies put out by these elites. Their goal is only more power for themselves. Their clever plan is for us to take the entitlements and pork barrel projects and go home. Send in our tax dollars and leave the country in their most capable hands.

This is the election, now is the time for us to reclaim our inheritance. This is our opportunity to finally do something other than the same old, which never has and never will produce a different result. We do have a choice, we can ignore their partisanship and egos, we can reject their agenda to turn this country towards socialism. Both parties seek to drag this nation into the New World Order that will finally "Bring America into line with the rest of the world".

If you don't think that is their goal, what is it you think they want to accomplish? McCain-Feingold, an assault on the 1st Ammendment. Phony immigration reform, a direct violation of the Constitutional mandate to protect the borders and an affront to the will of the people of all political persuasions. Have we already forgotten Sandra Day-OConor's guide for US laws, to make them more in line with those of other nations?

How much longer do we tolerate this? How many more times will we elect the same individuals? How much more trust are we going to put in the two parties to do what is right and good for America? Let's wake up and sieze this chance. Visit my website and see that we have a choice. We can do it, the only question is, will we? Well, will we? Thanks, Joe


Grids: right ON
What happens afterwards, if there is an AMNESTY, is what no one talks about. I have for years had conversations with plant owners who just loved their Mexicans. I usually get around to telling them that:

1. Their kids are going to be a big pain in the A$$, and

2. if the illegals get papers, they will work but with many more benefits, protections and higher wages.

3. The other thing you can count on in the work place is, they will always try to keep non Mexicans out of their area. This is already being observed.

It's not just wages, they make an active effort to make non Latins uncomfortable or failing that will cause things to happen to make you look bad; get you in trouble with the boss. Really?? Ho Ho HO. Gonna be fun if this thing goes through.

I haven't even addressed the community problems caused by the "then LEGAL" neighbors. They are use to marching in the streets. It's protected by the Mexican constitution. And they have seen or done it since they were born.

black dog, rocker et al
only our Senate is more stupid than you, but they have a higher IQ.
READ WHAT SMARTER THAN YOU HAD WRITTEN AND LEARN.
I DID -AND THEN JOINED MENSA.
WILL YOU LISTEN AND TRY TO LEARN?

Corbett
I don't know the numbers of who works where, but I do know that nowhere near 70% are in the fields doing agriculture work.

Just the other day I guy posted about the jobs in the construction arena. Big numbers. Look they are heavily into meat packing of all kinds, remember the plant in North Dakota, who incidentally replaced all the workers with Americans after the ICE took away the illegals, well that's just the tip of the ice berg.

The welding shops (factories) are full of them, roofing, carpet layers, furniture manufacturers, add nauseum.
They not only lay the carpet, they are in the carpet plant making the stuff. Go to Taco bell in Alabama and he's from Mexico, Really??


To Chavez and Medved
The bigots can't get it done...

This is for all you social libs who like to feel superior because of your affinity for the little guy--

Here's a CAUSE for you--FREE Campeon and Rameriz. 2 Border agents IN PRISON for doing the job they were hired to do and shooting an illegal DRUG SMUGGLER in the a** as he was ILLEGALLY attempting to cross OUR BORDER!
Since we are all bigots against latinos - MAYBE YOU CAN GET'EM OUT!

(p.s. Yeah yeah the drug smuggler is fine now-in fact he got AMNESTY to testify against our own Agents! by Bush's Justice Dept! )I'd say they got Bushwhacked!



reply to: John Konop
Thanx for the link to the Peggy Noonan op-ed piece-- it is an exceptionally cogent and salient indictment of how the Bushes (father and son) and Bushies abandoned conservative principles... if you just tuned in, I urge a read at the direct link here:

http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/pnoonan/?id=110010148&mod=RSS_Opinion_Journal&ojrss=frontpage

Some on the left TOTALLY misread many of us on the other side about Presidente Jorge-- you people can HAVE him! He is as lost as you folks are! He wandered off the reservation of reason some time ago.
p
The whole globalist, NAU, open borders, neoCON proactive foreign policy agenda (let's impose democracy on the ignorant foreigners) is spooky tangential and dangerous. When we SHOULD be truly enforcing ILLEGAL immigration laws, we are instead welcoming them in with a get out of jail free/ally ally in come free card and promise of welfare benefits. Holy Mary, Mother of God!

Mr. Hawkins
Very Well Put!

Good Afternoon, BrianR!

Mr. Hawkins
Very Well Put!

Good Afternoon, BrianR!

Crack the RNC
Friends! The RNC is cracking with lack of money funds. Keep it up, we can retake the party. Bankrupt them unless they change. Give money to conservative canidates. Vote conservative in the primaries against the RINOs. Don't let the Dems have the satisfaction of crippling our party, yes I know what your plan is Ted the red Kennedy! We are the party and we are the people, lets take back control, Fred-Hunter 2008!

Hey, Georgetwin!
How ya doing?

ONCEAMARINE AND CORBETT
latest data - only 2% (TWO) of illegals work in the fields now... the rest had moved to the big cities, where construction jobs pay a lot more (and really push Americans out of work).

NUKES THRU MEXICO (Newsmax)?????????????
In November 2004, another key al-Qaida operative was captured in Pakistan. He told interrogators that the terrorist group had arranged to smuggle nuclear supplies and tactical nuclear weapons into Mexico, then to transport them across the U.S. border with the aid of a Latino street gang. The gang was later identified as Mara Salvatrucha – a group Adnan at met with during his visit to Honduras.

lodestar
I agree!

GoHunter08 - Duncan Hunter for President
The only national leader to successfully deal with the immigration fiasco is California Congressman Duncan Hunter.

The San Diego border fence is a resounding success. And it is simple, do-able, inexpensive, low-tech easy to repeat all across our porous southern border.

http://www.GoHunter08.com

1. He has heavyweight national leadership experience.
He was the highly respected chairman of the House Armed Forces Committee for 4 years - so he is ready for foreign and military policy.

2. He is re-elected by big margins, even in California, so he could bag California's rich electoral vote for the GOP.

3. He is tough, plain-spoken, yet diplomatic.

4. His resume is stellar: enlisted in the Army, qualified as Army Ranger, earned the Bronze Star in Viet Nam.

5. Came home and worked in farming and construction to help support himself through law school.

6. Got married, stayed married, has 2 sons in the Marines, both serving fighting the war on terror, one served in Iraq, I think the other is shipping out to Afghanistan.

So they shoulder their own load. He could have steered his sons to light duty - instead they take on the bad guys face to face.

Duncan Hunter is a decent man for these troubled times.

Vote America first. Remember 1776.

Privilege v. Right -- Well said
"In short, the Senate immigration bill will do enormous damage to this country because it has it exactly backwards: it has turned immigration in this country into a right designed to primarily benefit people who come here illegally instead of an orderly, well maintained privilege that we grant to people who respect our laws so that they can help make our nation a better place to live for all of us."

This is exactly right. Somehow our senators and congressmen have forgotten their duties to this country and replaced those duties with seeking to benefit those who would come here illegally. There is some kind of "globalist, one-world view" point going on here. Borders and sovereignty don't seem to matter. "Compassion" has somehow taken over, without regard to justice, causing the exploitation of the American people.

BrianR
So Far, So Good! Fred Thompson has Foul Donahue, SpaceCadet and their like spewing like crazy today!

A SWIFT UPPERCUT

Is that expression still used in boxing?

Whatever, the traitors who are planning to sign that amnesty bill -- by whatever name they want to give is -- need one. We can give it to them with our continued e-mail, faxes and telephone calls.

I have never seen the country in such an uproar in all my life -- and I've seen a lot of it.

Those people in Washington need to know who really put them in office -- and who can take them out, no matter how much money they get from corporate America needing cheap labor.

From the President on down, all of them think the American people are so stupid they have no idea what's going on. Perhaps our calls and letters will let them know we're not quite as stupid as they would like us to be.

DOWN WITH THIS AMNESTY BILL! AND DOWN WITH EVERY SENATOR WHO VOTES FOR IT.

To OnceAMarine & Thinker
I was getting my 30% figure from an article I read by Thomas Sowell.

The exact numbers are immaterial. The point is that in ANY field of endeavor, American citizens make up the majority of the people involved. Thus there are NO jobs Americans won't do. Since Americans are doing these jobs, they are ipso facto jobs that American WILL do.

Personally, I find it disturbing that the White House considers me to be un-American. As an intelligence officer, I was one of the last of the cold warriors. We fought the commies tooth and nail & finally saw the collapse of the Evil Empire. Yet I must be un-American now because I do these jobs that "Americans won't do."

I have a farm which I work myself. Real Americans evidently won't do farm work. I mow my own yard. Real Americans evidently won't do yard work. I do carpentry work. Real Americans evidently won't do carpentry work. I clean my own house. Real American evidently won't do house cleaning.

And on top of that, I'm told by this jackanapse in the White House that I'm not interested in doing the right thing for my counrty because I'm against amnesty.

Of course by White House standards, George Washington & Thomas Jefferson were not real Americans either. I guess if they can stand it, I can.


MyOpine
That file contains a virus.

LongReach
Thank You.
I will run a scan.

Suprised I did not find it.
I have ran that movie twice and I scan every day.

Off & away to scan.

HUNTER FOR AMERICA

Republican voters still get to decide who their nominee will be. Money only buys elections when people act like sheep. If 80% of Republicans are indeed seeking a conservative, we can nominate one. We can nominate Duncan Hunter. The money players won't like it and are trying to convince us only Rudy, Romney, or McCain can win. Hogwash. 49% of people will never vote for Hillary. Only 60% voted last time and turnout was the difference. My belief is Rudy would push turnout down. There might even be a third party, splitting the vote. Give Americans a chance to vote for a candidate who WILL secure the border and watch what happens to turnout. Americans want their government to fulfill it's most basic responsibility.

The primary responsibility of the U.S. government is to protect the territorial integrity and people of this country. They have completely abdicated this responsibility. Both parties have been complicit in this. We are being told it is not possible to control our borders, enforce our laws, and thereby control our destiny as a nation. Hogwash. We are being sold out by corporations intent on importing workers for jobs that can't be exported with the taxpayers paying the true costs, financial and human. If we act like sheep and don't stop the inundation across our borders, we will lose our country without a bleat.

http://www.gohunter08.com

http://duncanhunter.conservativebase.org/

http://www.theconservativevoice.com/articles/article.html?id=23212

http://www.politico.com/multimedia/?pageref=Photo_Video-520559

LongReach
My computer checks out clean with Avast and MacAfee both.
I tested that link right after I posted it.
My computer should have caught it.

Did you wander off on any other links from that site?

In any event I will not post that link again.

LongReach
This is not a movie but it is something to make you wonder.
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=55925

LOL, Georgetwin
In other words, things are normal around the TH household.

CAUTION: DO NOT USE THE A-WORD!
Since Bush has re-defined the word "amnesty" the same way Clinton re-defined the word"is" -- if you call, fax or e-mail the Repubs demanding "NO AMNESTY" the ba$tard$ put you down as being in favor of the senate's Kyl/Kennedy S.1348 "comprehensive immigration reform" bill.

By using the A-word, you are automatically considered as supporting Bush's nation-destroying "immigration reform" package and they talley your comments a$$-backwards. Now you know how and why the RNC is telling every propagandist out there that the American people support Bush's plan. We've been Bushwacked by the moron brigades!

to Lily
Will you pay my legal fees when I decide I want amnesty when I finally refuse to renew my Drivers License, to give checkpoint Law Enforcement Officers "my papers", or stop paying taxes?

Sam
I don't know how true this is. It is something I heard from a caller on a talk radio show.

I heard the bill is 1,000 pages long!
I heard it contains the United Nations Weapons ban!

Why would any Amnesty Bill need to be that long?

THINKER ::ref: Corbett
As I said earlier(I've been busy until now) his figures of 70% in agriculture are way out of line and I didn't know the numbers, but (SEE 2:27 pm) I was going to say, no more than and probably far less than 30% were in the fields.

Thanks for your update on the numbers, one percent(1%) in the fields.. I am, and am not surprised.

Heard just this afternoon that the U.S. farmers were in congress crying for help in the fields.

What, with 15 to 20 million Mexicans in the U.S., --Nah.

Listen, there into every thing but the fields. And the AG people want more, ILLEGALS ??). Want to bet they still wouldn't have enough. Want to bet that after they would give them a Z Visa you couldn't find even three(3) to go into the fields. WE NEED MORE..

John Hawkins came out and said, what you and I and a bunch us already could GUESS, KNOW, FATHOM, (gee do we really have to THINK before putting our thoughts into actions?), that this whole BILL S 1348, is not only ridiculous (that would be true if it wasn't so DANGEROUS) (read deadly to the U.S. as a country), but MUST have been Kooked up by some real Kooks. Because other wise they can only be considered """TRAITORS""" to this U.S.A.... Now I don't think I am very far out when I suggest they should be on trial. Everyone of them that votes for this BOMB. I stated earlier that they can't claim ignorance or lack of education for their STUPIDITY. Well maybe they could get off on IGNORANCE.. Ignorance is as ignorance does.

NO laws on the books for "Ignorance", stupidity, treason,?? You might have to make some new laws.. It's called survival.. Gung Ho..


MyOpine
"I heard it contains the United Nations Weapons ban!"

You're kidding, I hope. I haven't heard that yet, but I wouldn't doubt it. I have heard that it contains provisions for a biometric National ID for all Americans and that every American would be required to be approved by Homeland Security before any employment.

Yes, there's a darn good reason why they are keeping this thing under wraps as much as they can.

Gee, I am glad I toned..
....that last post down. Someone might have thought this old man is dangerous. Forget that we gave him a high level clearance a few years back..

Utterly Pathetic
For years many of us have screamed on these web-pages about the likes of Chappaquiddick Teddy, the Clintons, Pelosi, etc.
Now we are screaming about a President most of us voted for and a group of RINO Republicans who are stabbing their base and this country in the back for a bunch of illegal invaders, who will not even vote for them.
I think Bush has completely lost his mind. He is not running again and apparently has got it into his head to create some sort of North American economic zone along the likes of the European Union. American Sovereignty? To quote one of the Mexican bandits Bush loves so much: "We don't need no stinkin' American Sovereignty."
The RINO Repubs. think you're stupid. You'll forget about all this and vote for them again in a few years. After all, they're conservatives right? And anythings better than the Dems, right?
Wrong! We must have true conservatives run against the likes of Kyl, Lindsay Graham, Specter, Lott, etc. Can you imagine the gall of McCain. He teams up with Teddy Kennedy to come up with this piece of crap of a bill and then expects us to vote for him in the Presidential Primaries. Well, screw him and screw every other traitor politician plotting to give our country and our children's future to a bunch of illiterate invaders.
This is one battle we must not lose!!!

Again
I meant to post 15 to 20 million Mexican and other poor Latin ILLEGALS in the U.S.

and once more
You know that they have a year after the president would sign this abomiNATION to apply, and then our under staffed over worked IMS people would have all of 24hrs to approve them.

Another words, if the Computers didn't hiss back at the interviewer because it maybe knew by the name supplied (any name will do sir)that he was a bad boy, then by god the interviewer just looks across the counter and says, come back tomorrow for your Zippety doo dah visa, sir.

Gosh, I can hear their sandaled feet, tennis shoe ed feet, coming right now. Shhh.. That sound, do yah here it.. Hey, get out of the way, their gonna run us over. Where's my lariat mom? No, No. I said my shotgun, mama. H-ll, just pick up the kids and make a run for it.

Sam
Does this explain the meeting you speak of?

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=55917

Could I get any madder than I am??
Comments: NONE.. Just can't think I'm so mad..

What a Laugh
I went on the GOP.com website to register my disgust with Bush and the RINOs stabbing this country in the back. The website had a picture of Bush with the new Border Patrol agents and told of Bush's tough plans to enfore the border. Yeah, by giving them all amnesty I guess.
Next to the picture was a little blurb advising you to click on it for GOP.com en espanol.
Perhaps part of the amnesty bill will be to provide the illiterate invaders with computers so they can click on this website in Spanish.
I don't think the Republicans have quite figured out how angry their voters are.
They will!

onceamarine
Think of ways to organize the people.
Start something like a chain letter asking people to unite and bring their ideas to a central location like maybe a blog site.

The people can shut this entire nation down and keep it down for as long as they want to by blocking freeways and all arterial traffic.

If anyone is arrested for participation then the entire nation stays closed down until the protesters are released and compensated for their inconvenience.

Every day of a strike like that would be a swift kick in our Legislator's wallets.
All it would take is uniting the people for a national strike.

O'Reilly
Bill O'Reilly's long-time motto has been "Who is looking out for you." Even wrote a book with that title. Now, he is pitching for Bush and Kennedy every night on Fox and every day on his radio show. He maintains that it is not possible to deport 12 million illegal aliens. Therefore, we must give them amnesty. Here's an idea. How about taking the tens of thousands of IRS agents and turn them into INS agents. They already have the training to harrass, hunt down and jail Americans who don't pay their taxes. Since the illegals don't pay their taxes, the agents can use the same skills. If the IRS agents just pretend that the illegals are Americans, the illegals won't stand a chance.

Sam
I don't trust, and you shouldn't either, anyone except Tancredo and Hunter. We may have to accept a Thompson because he'll at least make us feel comfy while they're running over us.

Get the picture. I am willing to listen to anyone who is not known to be a RINO, but that's it; just listen.

And the HH of it all is they can just put us out of the picture if we won't vote for anybody. I am guessing that the only difference between a RINO and a DEMO is they're both approved by the COMMITTEE.

Re: "Lilly The Looney Lib"
To all those responding to “Lilly”:
My suggestion is don’t. It's a wast of time. Just ignore her. Lilly comments on many of the articles on Town Hall, and is now commonly known as “ Lilly The Looney Lib”. She is a total Whack Job. She operates on what’s known as “Hit & Run”. Her rants are from the lunatic left fringe. She’s never able to defend her position. So she posts her “comments” and then leaves before she sees all the responses which make her look like an idiot. Best to ignore her and hope she’ll eventually get tired of looking like the idiot she is, and disappear.

MyOpine
You are right. They do things like that in Mexico.

Now can I bring my portable TV and Can? What time are we going home?? Did you see any burger kings as we drove in. Hay..It's raining.. Now the sun is too hot.. Why are we here for anyway?? Did you say something?? ZZZ ZZZZ zzz zzz..

Maybe??

Why?
don't we get more voices like this on the talking head shows.

This guy makes a great arguement, and he is right!

THis whole immigration debate is as anti-voter as anything I have ever seen come down the road. Totally bizarre. The GOP/McCain position is undefensible. Good bye GOP if this bill passes.

11h

SAM
I just got through reading on another site that Bilderburg, Guilderburg, or was it Hillary-burg was going to be in Greece. Yep.. they slipped most of the reporters again, and went to TURKEY. Well so much for listening to their conversations. We'll just have to wait for the noose to tighten.

Remember Gadamm Hussein, that must have been what he was waiting for starting about two seconds after they discovered his hideout.

Think he was in Bilderburg, Iraq wasn't he??

Now you know that they invited Rick Perry for his invaluable input on the Iranian problem.. Ehh..

18Wheeler
I’m with you. We need to ignore Lilly the Looney Lib, and maybe she will go away. She usually makes one post a day, ranting about Bush lied, conservative bigots, the US is the terrorist, blah, blah, blah. The topic of the article is irrelevant to her. Then, she disappears. She makes Edith Bunker sound like a genius. You’re right. I don’t think she even bothers to read the responses. Why waste our time.

Sam
I make the same kind of mistake you did just above here..."We need to organize badly"", I guess I'm just knick picking, but believe you meant "WE badly need to organize".. Why don't we organize "well" as in real good.

Sam, you're from Texas. I lived there long enough to have lived and died there. I won't say which direction from Austin, like Dripping Springs or Georgetown. But I hear you loud and clear, and I promise not to short sight on Ron Paul. I didn`t see a man who could get forceful and TAKE a nomination, but if he does they won't need a security force because I'll see to it he's protected.

Speaking of which, you know the BIG BIG problem is he won't be on the short, short list at Bilderburg. These big shots own us they think, and they're not going to give away the farm to make us happy.

Security would be the BIG 'problem for any candidate not on the short list. Entendido..??..

Planes crash with public figures aboard every little while... we are talking some very BIG money and some very powerful figures who want things THEIR WAY or scr-- you..

Robert
So you went to different school in a different neighborhood and a different state than houndog did. Got anything better to do than tell us that??

Sam
You're right, The BIG BIG issue is immigration no matter how much the innocents and not so innocents try to deflect the arguments.

As to FOX news, I have to wonder if they aren't a decoy duck to bring all us ducklings into the shoot'em up pond. You know keep your friends close, and your enemies even closer..

<>keep thinking.. It will come to us all of the sudden.. Then they really will trot out those IRS agents hound dog was talking about, but to use on us not the illegals. They're the good guys in this equation..besides Bushes deal with Fox was something like..
FOX: I got a hell of a job trying to manage these Mexicans..
Bush: Tell you what I am going to do for you.
You send me as many millions as you wish. I'ii take'em and put them to work until they learn to "just get along"
FOX: Are you sure about that brother.
Bush: yea. Don't give it another thought. You just ship 'em here. I'll take care of the rest.

Robert
Got you're attention. Sure it's non of my business if you want to pick on Hound Dog; just that my mama taught me not to pick on my friends when they didn't have the best game plan in town.

Besides it was worth a chuckle to read his IDEARS..

Well Robert
I said tongue in cheek that it is a possibility. Don't ever over look the possibilities..

You don't know what's hunkered down behind the possibilities..do you??

Thanks Sam
I had by now figured out that Roberto is just full of himself. But, thanks.

ATTENTION MEMBERS OF THE MEDIA

TOWNHALL IS CATERING TO THE BIGOTS

TOWNHALL HAS CAVED TO PRESSURE AND IS NOW CATERING TO THE BIGOTS ON THEIR WEBSITE BY TAKING DOWN THE LIST OF RACIST COMMENTS ON THEIR SITE THAT I HAVE POSTED (BUT YET ALLOWING SOME OF THE COMMENTS IN THEIR ORIGINAL FORM TO STAY UP ON THEIR SITE)

HERE IS THE LIST TOWNHALL DOESN'T WANT YOU TO SEE:

“We don't want spanish speaking little retards befouling our great country.”

"The fact is, 95% of latinos are pigs."

"Most latinos are thieves and are corrupt"

"They can be referred to as: Human Locusts"

"your correct i believe only 92 % are pigs."

"most Mexicans, especially men, are lazy good for nothing drunks who only care about sacking as many mujeres that they can."

"one question, do you do windows?"

"I take Ms Chavez is of latino culture, does anyone one know if she is in america legally? The way she words her column would make one think not."

"why is the country of Mexico such a toilet?"

"get over the fact many of us will stop such as you and the racists like Linda Chavez from making America like the hell hole the Mexicans wallow in"

"Quickly, the fact is that we're being invaded by an inferior culture. Every person of low quality we import plants a family-tree that bears low-quality fruit. The rotten fruit of that tree will rot our own fruit."

"The Mexicans getting dumped on us are the worst of a corrupt, dysfunctional nation; they're thieves and criminals the second that they cross our borders."

"Every Mexican who comes here makes America worse, and this article is proof of it."

"How dare you call us racists when ILLEGAL ALIENS move 20 or 30 into a single family home next door to us and lower our property values."

"If Linda thinks Mexicans are so great, then why doesn't she move to Mexico?"

"DO have too many babies (paid for OTHER PEOPLES MONEY). DO bring in disease ( T.B. anyone????). ARE PRONE TO CRIMINAL BEHAVIOR,(look at the outstanding warrants in L.A. and Ca. prison population, MS13 gangs..). DO dumb down our schools, CHECK THE STATS, (2nd and 3rd generation aren't even advancing)."

"The human locusts come here seeking freebies"

"Doesn't matter if they are rich or poor. They spit continually, throw their paper and trash anywhere and everywhere, don't care about other peoples rights.

"Send the law breaking, disease carrying, America hating,goverment assistant stealing, law breaking illegal immagrants back to THEIR HOMELAND."

"Nuke mexico and start over down there."

"here, I'll just say it...I HATE MEXICANS
There, happy now? Yes, I do hate the mexicans around here in Utah. They are liars, dirty, nasty, germ ridden, law breaking, no english speaking, government money stealing, car jacking, 18 people to one PRIVATLY owned home, who cry racists anytime their little rug rats don't get their way."

"They have all but ruined schools, hospitals, day cares, headstart centers, not to mention ruined certain areas all over the USA."

"let's round them allmup, hey, we have done it before, and ship them off to differant countries around the world. Let's see how well these lazy, dirty, no good bastards are welcome there."

TOWNHALL HAS BANNED THIS COLUMN


Below is Linda Chavez's latest column, which can also be read here: http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/daily/opinion/53284.php

Chavez: Color-blind need to disavow those who aren't
LINDA CHAVEZ
Published: 06.01.2007

It seems I've touched a raw nerve among my fellow conservatives.

My column last week argued that "Some people just don't like Mexicans - or anyone else from south of the border," and that this sentiment was playing a destructive role in the current immigration debate.

I estimated the number of such persons in the general population at about 10 percent, a figure I extrapolated from several studies and polls of racial attitudes taken in the past 20 years, which generally show that about 1 in 10 Americans harbor some animus based on race.

Ten percent is not a very alarming number (Americans are among the least intolerant groups in all international studies of the issue), even though I think the group includes a disturbing number of influential voices on the right, who even if they don't personally share these views seem comfortable in the company of those who do.

Those in positions of influence, whether elected leaders or talk-show hosts, have a special responsibility not to inflame racial passions and animosities.

So how is it that some of my fellow conservatives have demonstrated that I am wrong to think a small group of them might not want Mexicans to come to America - even legally?

On Townhall.com, these bon mots appeared:

- "Mexicans are pigs."

- "They can be referred to as Human Locusts."

- "Latino girls are baby factories. They fornicate like animals with no regard for the welfare of the child. Babies having babies while the boy goes out and screws someone else. Most Latinos are liars. True again. Look at the corruption at all levels of the Mexican government, and it carries on to all the people."

- "We don't want Spanish- speaking little retards befouling our great country. REMEMBER SAN JACINTO!"

- "And, yes, illegals are lazy, disease-infested, freeloading moochers. The fact they criminally enter the country qualifies them as lazy freeloaders."

- "Get a clue, Chavez. . . . we don't want wetbacks mooching our system and, no, we don't need them. They are simply slave labor. Nothing more."

I could go on. There are more than 300 posts on Townhall and hundreds more on less mainstream sites. You get the point.

But because I've exposed the underbelly of the anti-immigrant crowd - and let's be clear here, this debate is about more than illegal immigration - I'm called a racist, as in this post:
"Linda Chavez has revealed herself to be a racist who demonizes color-blind conservatives as racist. Special rights for Latino criminal invaders and mindless labeling to intimidate fair-minded Americans - that is what Linda stands for now."

I want more secure borders and an end to illegal immigration, but the only way that will ever happen is to adopt a market-based legal immigration system that allows sufficient numbers of workers to come here to fill jobs Americans shun.

I've spent my entire professional career fighting against racial, ethnic and gender preferences; against bilingual education and multiculturalism; and for making English the official language of the country, for which I have suffered significant abuse, even physical attack.

But I reject the view that our immigration policy should ever be premised on a racial test, or that members of one group are unfit to become Americans.

Most conservatives claim to be color-blind, but remaining silent in the face of such bigotry evokes Edmund Burke's dictum: "It is necessary only for the good man to do nothing for evil to triumph." It's time for those who are color-blind to disavow those who are not.

TOWNHALL CATERS TO BIGOTS
Townhall has banned this column.

Chavez: Color-blind need to disavow those who aren't
LINDA CHAVEZ
Published: 06.01.2007

It seems I've touched a raw nerve among my fellow conservatives.

My column last week argued that "Some people just don't like Mexicans - or anyone else from south of the border," and that this sentiment was playing a destructive role in the current immigration debate.

I estimated the number of such persons in the general population at about 10 percent, a figure I extrapolated from several studies and polls of racial attitudes taken in the past 20 years, which generally show that about 1 in 10 Americans harbor some animus based on race.

Ten percent is not a very alarming number (Americans are among the least intolerant groups in all international studies of the issue), even though I think the group includes a disturbing number of influential voices on the right, who even if they don't personally share these views seem comfortable in the company of those who do.

Those in positions of influence, whether elected leaders or talk-show hosts, have a special responsibility not to inflame racial passions and animosities.

So how is it that some of my fellow conservatives have demonstrated that I am wrong to think a small group of them might not want Mexicans to come to America - even legally?

On Townhall.com, these bon mots appeared:

- "Mexicans are pigs."

- "They can be referred to as Human Locusts."

- "Latino girls are baby factories. They fornicate like animals with no regard for the welfare of the child. Babies having babies while the boy goes out and screws someone else. Most Latinos are liars. True again. Look at the corruption at all levels of the Mexican government, and it carries on to all the people."

- "We don't want Spanish- speaking little retards befouling our great country. REMEMBER SAN JACINTO!"

- "And, yes, illegals are lazy, disease-infested, freeloading moochers. The fact they criminally enter the country qualifies them as lazy freeloaders."

- "Get a clue, Chavez. . . . we don't want wetbacks mooching our system and, no, we don't need them. They are simply slave labor. Nothing more."

I could go on. There are more than 300 posts on Townhall and hundreds more on less mainstream sites. You get the point.

But because I've exposed the underbelly of the anti-immigrant crowd - and let's be clear here, this debate is about more than illegal immigration - I'm called a racist, as in this post:
"Linda Chavez has revealed herself to be a racist who demonizes color-blind conservatives as racist. Special rights for Latino criminal invaders and mindless labeling to intimidate fair-minded Americans - that is what Linda stands for now."

I want more secure borders and an end to illegal immigration, but the only way that will ever happen is to adopt a market-based legal immigration system that allows sufficient numbers of workers to come here to fill jobs Americans shun.

I've spent my entire professional career fighting against racial, ethnic and gender preferences; against bilingual education and multiculturalism; and for making English the official language of the country, for which I have suffered significant abuse, even physical attack.

But I reject the view that our immigration policy should ever be premised on a racial test, or that members of one group are unfit to become Americans.

Most conservatives claim to be color-blind, but remaining silent in the face of such bigotry evokes Edmund Burke's dictum: "It is necessary only for the good man to do nothing for evil to triumph." It's time for those who are color-blind to disavow those who are not.

What a country
I ask myself one question and keep watching FOX NEWS trying to find an answer. My question was and still is: why do we need this "Comprehensive Reform"? Obviously, not for the reasons provided by the government, that illegal aliens have to be registered, scanned and stay and work in this country legally. That deportation of 12 to 15 million people is impossible. So it is possible to spend $2.5 trillion and bring 40 million Spanish speaking people in this country to destroy delicate but at least stable racial composition of the population, but impossible for maybe 1/100 of that sum to send illegals home? Illogical, and lawyers are logical people. So I hoped Fox News will ask this question but to no avail. I have noticed some time ago that Fox became soft on important issues of our time. O'Reilly and Hannity devote very little time for the Immigration issue discussion, like it is of the same importance as some teacher in God forgotten town who said sex is good. O'Reilly should change his motto to "The spin starts here" and "We are not looking out for you." All of the sudden he becomes soft on Sharpton, mildly disagreeing but understanding where Sharpton's coming from. On immigration, he nods his head in a statesmanlike pose when the statesman did everything possible in his power but failed and has to cope with the inevitable. He disagrees with Michelle Malkin who sees very well through the thin veil of Bush/Kennedy propaganda.
And than there's Colms. I understand and support the freedom of speech and free discussion but for whatever reason I have an uncontrollable desire to vomit each time he opens his mouth. Sean is better but also soft and let bad people escape easily.
Both Bill and Sean interviewed Bush recently but those shows were staged like soap operas. Deeds speak for the man, not demagoguery.
Could anyone imagine Bush offering anything like that to Republican Party in 2000 or 2004? That would've been a disaster for him! Now he's teaming with the number one enemy of the people. The conclusion: it all has been planned years ago; that's why nothing has been done on the southern border in six years. It is his fault, his neglect, intentional as we know now. Why should American people pay such a heavy price and very possible by their lives so Bush can secure a place in History? Keeps his promise to Mexican President? He has a nerve to urge Senators to vote for the Deal, despite hundreds of articles and analyses showing a disaster in the making; despite millions of decent people, his supporters, begging him to slow down; abandon amnesty; rethink the whole thing. It can be done much more efficiently, almost painlessly if they only listen. But they don't. And they wont! This is not about doing something right. Bush behaves like a capricious child who wants a candy and refuse to take "No" for an answer. Wants it NOW, this same minute! No wonder this country is falling apart: the war has no end in sight; anti-American propaganda fills major newspapers and magazines and TV screens, decent people feel unneeded. What was shameful is now a norm! Treason is presented as a humanitarian achievement! But the most disgusting of all was the Republican Party's "President Bush's Compassionate Agenda." No, no, not toward good citizens, hard working families or the future of their children. Not at all! Republicans outran Democrats in spending and entitlements. Wonder why Graham calls us racists and bigots? It is all in the name of the COMPASSION, stupid!

Brian232
Brian, I understand what you're doing but I will answer you anyway. Colorblind. Want an experiment? Go to the core of New York City liberal environment, extra liberal. There's not a trace of conservatism. This is the open border crowd, gay marriage crowd, the sophisticates -- you got the picture. Take a look, take your time. Do you see low paid Mexicans there? Not a single one, Brian. Why? This bunch of people supposed to be color blind, isn't it? All of them snobs, that's why. They consider themselves enlightened people, they discuss philosophical issues, theater, recent movie release, gossip, books, etc. These people consider uneducated meat packers and apple pickers below their intellectual level. Plus, Mexicans may smell bad sweating at meat packing factories.
No one is color blind, apparently except Linda Chavez, the exceptional humanitarian public figure. Nor people are race blind or class blind. Thinking otherwise is utopian, to put it mildly. Only some people disguise it with lipstick and others don't. If you, Brian, really want to fight racism, why don't you fight Al Sharpton and NAACP and La Rasa? These guys see everything through the prism of race. Or color. Always. They never failed.

You lead the discussion away from real issues. On this blog, of course, anyone can have a point of view but you keep pressing the same issue again and again. After all, is it written in the American Constitution that American people must love Mexicans? Reverse your line of vision and you will see that Mexicans hate white Americans, at least. Watch the Miss universe competition; or soccer game; or the behavior of Mexican youth on our streets. Play again the video of the May 1 demonstration in LA. That's the future, according to Bush/Kennedy vision! What this blog is buzzing about is that our government wants to make these haters legal residents of our country, in the range between 40 and 60 millions. Our government cannot explain why it's doing this. Our government consider it not worthy their time to talk to the American people. How about this fatal blindness on the government part? Can that make people angry? You bet!

Hospital ‘Dumping’ of Patients?


Hospitals are overwhelmed with Americans who cannot pay what will happen when we flood our country with lower wage workers with no healthcare via the immigration bill? Do you think we will have more hospitals closing down after the immigration bill?

USATODAY-LOS ANGELES — A city prosecutor investigating whether hospitals are discharging homeless patients onto the city’s Skid Row says the latest alleged example “makes my stomach turn.”

A paralyzed man was found last week crawling the streets without a wheelchair and wearing a broken colostomy bag.

Los Angeles City Attorney Rocky Delgadillo accuses the hospital, Hollywood Presbyterian, of refusing to cooperate with his investigation. The hospital denied it.

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/hospital-dumping-of-patients


Black Dog writes: 01, 2007 7:50 AM

I guess - considering the majority of welfare recipients are women and small children. Of course it never fails with Republicans - babies only count when they're unborn. Once they pass through the womb, send them to do hard labor...

DESKJOCKEY RESPONDS.

Yup, if the unmarried husband moves in with her then they loose the benefits, so he supports her and has a separate apartment so they can double dip. Why on earth do you think their marriage rates fell off the cliff when this restriction was put into the benefit package?

Anyway we have a plethora of private charity for legitimate cases, the few that really exist.

We have a saying down in the Democratic Party controlled state of NC regarding folks who bind us into slavery to support them for life. “You breed ‘em, you feed ‘em.” This stops the moral hazard of downloading endless welfare babies.

Black Dog writes: June, 01, 2007 10:59 A
Black Dog writes: June, 01, 2007 10:59 AM
United Fruit Company
Lodestar - google it up and then get back to us on American involvement in South and Central American economies...

DESKJOCKERY RESPONDS.

Let me see if I understand this. Keith comes down to SA to build a railroad for the country. The country’s president is happy with his country’s great social project and this young man who is making it happen. In fact he is so impressed he decides it would be nice to have his families wealth created through this promising you man and suggest Keith marry his daughter so that the number one family of the country can benefit from the countries development. But low and behold the impoverished government defaults on the railroad construction payments and Keith decides to continue the project for his new family’s interest anyway and goes to AmeriKa to find investors in his new homeland’s enterprise. His happy country president and father-in-law rewards his efforts with all kinds of tax free land along the railroad so his grandchildren will enjoy the “fruits” of his son-in-laws labor. Then president daddy decides to put his daughter’s company into other industries providing services to his giver-ment. And low and behold, it is Bush’s fault for meddling in SA politics because one of the big political families of S.A. created a Fruit company. What is the point of being a dictator if you can't manipulate the giver-ment as president.

Golly, I think there may be sex going on in this brothel.

grids writes: Friday, 2007 12:36 PM

When they become legal, who thinks they aren't going to essentially use that legal status to bid up labor costs. ,,,"cheap labor" is going to ring mighty hollow. Then we'll need a whole new cheap labor pool of NEW illegals.

DESKJOCKEY RESPONDS

We are opening the borders on ’10 under the SPP treaty and DC & Mexico having been working day and night with their teams to co-ordinate this NAU, the 12 lane superhighway etc.

So there will be an endless steam of cheap, no longer illegal, labor with or without shamnesty migrating from S.A. for unlimited stays starting in ‘10.

The reason shamnesty is so important for Repubs is that left wing Bushwacker has driven off the somewhat right of center and all the conservatives long ago so they do not have a base for '08. They will probably need to get 8 to 10 points more from independents that have no clue what is going on except a few months before the election. Therefore the Repubs need in excess of $1B for the ’08 presidential marketing campaign. Then you have the local campaigns for yet more money. There will be a lot more purple states this time, mayb just a few red states. Shamnesty was timed for the corporate donors to pay for their purchase in time for the elections.

OnceaMarine
Read one of your earlier posts about when they found gaddam. What they should have done was just fill in the hole. With some lead to hold him down, of course.

euphemistic myths being perpetrated

Have you noticed that when the advocates and apologists for ILLEGALS state their cases that they seem vacuous and facile prima facie/on the surface? Consider:

FALSE PREMISES AND SCARE TACTICS:
The "undocumented" are just doing jobs that Americans won't do that we must have done... they give more than they take... they pay into S.S. funds they will not get back... they have lesser rates of crime than legal Americans... they just want to share in the blessings of America just like the rest of us, which they have ever right to do... resentment against them is racist/xenophobic-- they are really no different from prior waves of immigrants who were also resented, but who assimilated and made America great... the proposed legislation is not amnesty... Americans generally believe in a path to citizenship for those already here... we cannot simply round up and deport 12-20 million... the only crime they have committed is akin to jaywalking

DEMYTHOLOGIZING REALITIES & INCONVENIENT TRUTHS:

1) ILLEGALS ARE INDEED taking many jobs that Americans will gladly do, driving down wages, and permeating myriad concomitant inimical problems (crimes, barrio blight, drugs, gangs, illegitimacies, droputs, balkanization, diseases) like a plague of fire ants or killer bees.

2) ILLEGAL aliens do NOT contribute more than they take, because the government services alone used by the uneducated indigent GREATLY exceed any minimal taxes paid (mostly sales taxes, etc.). Heritage calculates that each household headed by the undereducated indigent (legal OR ILLEGAL) will drain over $1 million in the course of a lifetime:

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/wm1076.cfm

3) Presidente Jorge has already committed to send already unfunded and threatened S.S. funds south to Mexico, and ILLEGALS would become eligible much sooner than American taxpayers... Gaucho Jorge promised THEM while visiting in Mexico recently that he would work for THEM on this Scamnesty legislation! That is TREASON!

4) Latino rates of crime and other social pathologies are, sadly, pandemically troublesome (the reasons are irrelevant to this discussion really-- facts are stubborn things), and worse among the poorer ones like most coming in ILLEGALLY (more than half have only a 7th grade education, assuring the snowballing of the associated social problems):

http://www.amren.com/Reports/Hispanics/HispanicsReport.htm
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=M2Q5ZWZiOTU2OTY1YWEyZDFiYTliNTRmMzk0ODIwMmE=
http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/index.html

5)they are NOT just like prior waves of immgrants in several ways... there are far more at once, there is no ocean separating them from the old cultures, they are clinging to same with no desire to assimilate, and the PC/multicultural ilk is aiding and abetting the ethnocentricity with bilingualism... furthermore, America is a VASTLY different nation socio-economically than it was when many LEGAL immigrants came historically-- we can benefit on balance today ONLY FROM EDUCATED, SKILLED IMMIGRANTS, which is NOT the norm among the great unwashed running across the border.

6) the pending Scamnesty is PRECISELY that, and the all-in implcations are egregious:

http://www.firesociety.com/article/12134/

7) Americans are rightfully indignant about the nonfeasance of the govt. which has allowed the ILLEGAL invasion to become an infestation. It is NOT that we are afraid of diversity as Presidente jorge lamely and disingenuously opined-- we already are the most diverse nation on earth! Ad hominem braying about "racism" is the calumny of artful scoundrels. When polled HONESTLY, Americans rightfully have profound concerns about unbridled immigration, especially ILLEGAL invaders:

http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back906.html
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=20530

8) the artful ploy that "we cannot deport 12 million" is a false argument-- TRUE enforcement of EXISTING LAWS would result in attritive repatriation at THEIR expense-- the same way they got here... we need only the political will to reflect the desires of Middle America.

9) the facile remote "elitist" PC theories of bilingualism and multiculturalism are doomed to failure. Even in countries with essentially the same ethnicity and culture, bilingualism alone creates crises.

10) as to scurrilous Geraldo-ilk suggestions that "these good people" are committing minor crimes akin to jaywalking in crossing the border, this is but the first of what become serial patterns of lawbreaking including tax dodging, identity fraud, welfare cheating, etc. ad nauseam.

Immigration Flood Unleashed by NAFTA

This is why you cannot fix immigration without fixing trade? Do you think Clinton & Gore with bipartisan lawmakers sold out American workers with NAFTA?

CD-The recent ferment on immigration policy has been so narrow that it has excluded the real issue: family-sustaining wages for workers both north and south of the border. The role of the North American Free Trade Agreement and misnamed ‘free trade’ has been scarcely mentioned in the increasingly bitter debate over the fate of America’s 11 to 12 million illegal aliens.

NAFTA was sold to the American public as the magic formula that would improve the American economy at the same time it would raise up the impoverished Mexican economy. The time has come to look at the failures of this type of trade agreement before we engage in more and lower the economic prospects of all workers affected.

While there has been some media coverage of NAFTA’s ruinous impact on US industrial communities, there has been even less media attention paid to its catastrophic effects in Mexico:

NAFTA, by permitting heavily-subsidized US corn and other agri-business products to compete with small Mexican farmers, has driven the Mexican farmer off the land due to low-priced imports of US corn and other agricultural products. Some 2 million Mexicans have been forced out of agriculture, and many of those that remain are living in desperate poverty. These people are among those that cross the border to feed their families. (Meanwhile, corn-based tortilla prices climbed by 50%. No wonder many so Mexican peasants have called NAFTA their ‘death warrant.’

NAFTA’s service-sector rules allowed big firms like Wal-Mart to enter the Mexican market and, selling low-priced goods made by ultra-cheap labor in China, to displace locally-based shoe, toy, and candy firms. An estimated 28,000 small and medium-sized Mexican businesses have been eliminated.

Wages along the Mexican border have actually been driven down by about 25% since NAFTA, reported a Carnegie Endowment study. An over-supply of workers, combined with the crushing of union organizing drives as government policy, has resulted in sweatshop pay running sweatshops along the border where wages typically run 60 cents to $1 an hour.

So rather than improving living standards, Mexican wages have actually fallen since NAFTA. The initial growth in the number of jobs has leveled off, with China’s even more repressive labor system luring US firms to locate there instead.

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/immigration-flood-unleashed-by-nafta



Unmitigated disaster? John Hawkins
The unmitigated disaster here are those who throw temper tantrums EVERY TIME they don't get their way, only their way, and entirely their way on each and every issue.
When you are looking at president Hillary with a Democratic congress and senate passing a Amnesty bill which is complete amnesty without even any fig leafs, then you can feel proud of yourself. When Socialized medicine passes through, you can feel proud of yourself. When the next round of Tax increases comes through, you can feel proud of yourself. When the military funding cuts come, you can feel proud of yourself. When all the international treaties are passed, the International Court is joined. . .you can feel proud of your tantrum that enabled it all.

how to get a free ride.
More americans have been killed or murdered in the past year by illigal immigrants than have died in combat in Iraq.Now the Senate wants to reward the illegal immigrants with amnisty and that same senate and congress can't wait to under mine the efforts of our troops in Iraq. Did I get up on the wrong side of America or do I see a major sell out of our country

LINDA CHAVEZ BRINGS THE STATS!
HER COLUMN YESTERDAY (ANOTHER ONE THAT TOWNHALL HAS IRRESPONSIBLY BANNED)

The Great Assimilation Machine
By LINDA CHAVEZ
June 5, 2007

For more than 200 years the United States has been the great assimilation machine, churning Germans, Swedes, Italians, Poles, Greeks, Russians, Lebanese, Chinese, Indians, Pakistanis and myriad others into Americans. There are many Americans today who believe, or worry, that the largest group of recent immigrants -- the nearly 20 million Hispanics who have come here in the last several decades -- are unwilling or unable to do the same.

In his 2004 book, "Who Are We? The Challenges to National Identity," Harvard political scientist Samuel P. Huntington warned that "Mexican immigration is leading toward the demographic reconquista of areas Americans took from Mexico by force in the 1830s and 1840s," a sentiment I hear echoed frequently in the debate over immigration reform. Others warn that the country is playing host to a burgeoning new underclass of poorly educated, welfare-dependent Hispanics who will overwhelm us with social pathologies. Still others marshal statistics that appear to support their view that Hispanics are indeed failing to assimilate as have previous ethnic groups.

The real story of Hispanic assimilation, however, is a lot less gloomy -- although a bit more complicated -- than the critics charge. Part of the problem is the interpretation of statistics: As we are in the midst of a huge influx of new immigrants, legal and illegal, including seven million Mexicans who have arrived since 1990, any statistical snapshot that includes these newcomers (who make up about half the adult Hispanic population) will distort the overall moving picture.

Take Hispanic dropout rates. A snapshot looks bad: 42% of Hispanics, according to the Current Population Survey, had not finished high school in 2005. But nearly half of the people counted aren't dropouts in the usual sense; they've never dropped in to an American school. They are immigrants who completed their schooling, such as it was, before coming here in their late teens or 20s. Granted, low education levels will make their climb up the economic ladder slower -- 60% of Mexican-born adults have not completed high school. But the earnings of Hispanic immigrants will improve as they gain work skills and experience, and the evidence is strong that they will do so. Mexican-born men, for example, had higher labor force participation rates than native-born male workers, 88% compared with 83%, and lower unemployment rates than native workers, 4.4% compared with 5.1% in 2006. Labor force participation rates of illegal aliens are higher yet, a whopping 94%.

More importantly, the children of Hispanic immigrants are graduating from high school. The high school completion rate for young, U.S.-born Hispanics is 86%, only slightly lower than the 92% of non-Hispanic whites. Hispanic immigrant children who do enroll in school after they come here are as likely as American-born Hispanics to earn a high school diploma (although half of Mexican immigrants 15-17 years-old do not enroll in school).

Hispanics are more likely than either whites or blacks to continue their education at two-year institutions; in 2000 they represented 14% of all students enrolled in two-year institutions. Only 12% of U.S.-born Hispanics earn four-year degrees compared with 26% of non-Hispanic whites. Nonetheless, the economic returns on education are substantial for Hispanics. As a 2006 study on Hispanics by the National Research Council of the National Academy of Sciences reported, "We consistently find that, after adjusting for the levels of human capital (e.g., schooling and English language proficiency), Hispanics do almost as well as whites with respect to both employment and labor market earnings," which the authors note is not the case for blacks, who still lag behind whites even after adjusting for observable measures of human capital.

English proficiency is, of course, essential if Hispanics are to fully assimilate into the mainstream, and one issue many Americans have expressed great concern over. But despite anxiety that Hispanics aren't learning English and will soon insist that the U.S. become bilingual, the evidence suggests otherwise. True enough, most Hispanic immigrants have poor English skills: The 2000 Census reported that 26 million people spoke Spanish at home, and of these, 14 million were unable to speak English well. But there is nothing unusual about this; historically most immigrant groups have taken a generation or more to produce fluent English speakers. In 1900, nearly 50 years after the peak period of German immigration, 600,000 students attended German bilingual schools in the U.S.

But if Hispanic immigrants have been slow to learn English, their American-born progeny have quickly adapted. English is the preferred language of virtually all U.S.-born Hispanics; according to a study by the Pew Hispanic Center, indeed, 78% of third-generation Hispanics cannot speak Spanish at all. Even in Southern California, an area with the largest population of Spanish speakers in the nation, 96% of third-generation Mexican Americans prefer to speak English at home, according to a recent study by sociologists Ruben Rumbaut, Douglas Massey and Frank Bean.

The fear that Hispanics are or will become an isolated, economically alienated group within the larger American society also does not jibe with a variety of other measures. A 2006 Commerce Department study reported that Hispanics are opening businesses at a rate three times faster than the national average. In 2002, the last year for which detailed data are available, there were 1.6 million Hispanic-owned businesses generating $222 billion in revenue. Most of these businesses are family affairs, with few employees, but some 1,500 Hispanic businesses employed 100 or more people, generating $42 billion in gross receipts.

Half of all Hispanics own homes. This is substantially below the 76% of non-Hispanic whites that are homeowners. A Department of Housing and Urban Development analysis of Hispanic home ownership trends suggests that the gap can be explained by a number of factors, including age. Home ownership increases with age, but nearly twice as many Hispanics as non-Hispanic whites are under 35, while only 10% of Hispanics, but nearly one quarter of whites, are over 65.

One genuinely disturbing trend is the increase in out-of-wedlock births among Hispanics, which has risen to 46% in 2004 from 24% in 1980, compared with 24.5% for non-Hispanic whites and 69% for blacks. (Mexican immigrants have a somewhat lower rate of unmarried childbearing, 35%.) This is not good, but it is not clear that these unmarried mothers remain so for long or that their children grow up in fatherless homes. Marriage rates for Hispanics are virtually the same as for non-Hispanic whites, suggesting many unwed mothers make it to the altar eventually, and they are no more likely to divorce than whites. The most comprehensive study of marriage and cohabitation, produced by the Department of Health and Human Services in 2002, shows that 77% of Hispanic women will marry by age 30, compared with 81% of non-Hispanic whites but only 52% of blacks. Moreover, 67% of Mexican origin children live in two parent families, compared with about 77% of whites, but only 37% of blacks.

Finally, consider that ultimate indicator of assimilation, intermarriage. One in four Hispanics marries a non-Hispanic white spouse, but nearly one-third of all U.S.-born Hispanics who are married have non-Hispanic spouses; and the percentage is slightly higher among college-educated Hispanic women (35%). There is a curious, and provocative fact buried in all this. The Population Reference Bureau notes in its 2005 study of intermarriage that, because most children of intermarriages are reported as Hispanic on Census data, "Hispanic intermarriage may have been a factor in the phenomenal growth of the U.S. Hispanic population in recent years, and it has important implications for future growth and characteristics of the Hispanic population." In other words, the widely cited prediction that by mid-century Hispanics will represent fully one third of the U.S. population fails to take into account that increasing numbers of these so-called Hispanics will have only one grandparent or great-grandparent of Hispanic heritage. At which point Hispanic ethnicity will mean little more than German, Italian or Irish ethnicity does today.

Ms. Chavez is chairman of the Center for Equal Opportunity and the author of a number of books, including "Out of the Barrio: Toward a New Politics of Hispanic Assimilation" (Basic Books, 1991).

URL for this article:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118101275193224692.html

Copyright 2007 Dow Jones & Company, Inc.

Immigrants and being an American
The year is 1907, one hundred years ago......
Theodore Roosevelt's ideas on Immigrants and being an AMERICAN in 1907.

"In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the person's becoming in every facet an American, and nothing but an American...There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."

Theodore Roosevelt 1907

Every American citizen needs to read this! We do not have another 100 years to learn this lesson.


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