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Monday, March 23, 2009
Harry R. Jackson, Jr. :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Pope Versus AIDS
by Harry R. Jackson, Jr.
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Last week as I was discussing the difficulty of communicating issues of faith on secular media, a Catholic friend of mine asked why the Pope had spoken out so boldly on the AIDS problem. It seemed to this liberal Catholic that the Pope had once again stuck his nose where it did not belong. Pope Benedict XVI made the following statement in Yaounde, Cameroon, “You can't resolve it with the distribution of condoms…On the contrary, it increases the problem.”

As far as I can tell, contrary to my friend’s opinion, the Pope was right this time. In fact, his statement was not just a doctrinal position on sexuality; it was also a practical observation about a dreaded disease that the Roman Catholic Church has invested billions of dollars to fight around the world. I agree with the Pope that a responsible and moral attitude toward sex would help fight the disease.

It was appropriate that his statement was made in sub-Saharan Africa, where some 22 million people are infected with HIV (accounting for two-thirds of the world's infections in 2007, according to UNAIDS). Adding insult to injury, this region also accounted for three-quarters of all AIDS deaths in 2007. In four southern African countries, national adult HIV prevalence has exceeded 30%: Botswana (38.8%), Lesotho (31%), Swaziland (33.4%) and Zimbabwe (33.7%). Food crises faced in the latter three countries are also linked to the HIV/AIDS epidemic by some experts. In just the past year, the AIDS epidemic in Africa has claimed the lives of an estimated 1.5 million people in this region. Perhaps most concerning of all is the fact that more than eleven million children have been orphaned by AIDS, according to the UNAIDS 2008 report.

The Pope’s observation about the use of condoms also applies to the spread of HIV in the developed world as well. There needs to be a world- wide initiative aimed at two things: 1. stopping the spread of the disease and, 2. finding a medical cure for HIV/AIDS.

Just days before the Pope issued his statement in a far away national capital in the impoverished land of Cameroon, leaders in the world’s most powerful city also threw up their hands in exasperation. Washington, DC health officials discovered that at least 3 percent of residents are living with HIV or AIDS. The report points to increases of incidence in every race and sex; in fact the disease has impacted every population and neighborhood within the District.

This is particularly disturbing compared to the 2006 report. The DC report does not conclusively show that condoms do not work. It suggests to me, that many people are not even trying to use condoms. The increase in the HIV/AIDS infection rate is not the only surprise in this work. Let’s look a little deeper into the study.

Cases of HIV and AIDS in DC jumped 22 percent in the last two years. What has caused such an abrupt increase? The report states that men having sex with men accounts for most of the cases. Heterosexual transmission and injection drug use follow. The raw data states that of those living with AIDS, 37.5 percent were due to homosexual contact, 25.6 percent were due to heterosexual contact and 23.5 percent were due to drug use.

I was personally shocked by how many older people in the nation’s most powerful city assumed that all “the noise” about safe sex was for someone else. Those in the 40-49 year age bracket had a startling 1 in 10 rate of occurrence among residents. Further, the black community in DC seems to need a very intense HIV/AIDS education program since black men reached the highest infection rate. In the 2008 DC update, the black female infection rate is equal to that of white males.

The overarching lesson the DC numbers show me is that the AIDS pandemic has similar dynamics here in the states as it does overseas. Dr. Shannon Hader, Director of the HIV/AIDS Administration at the DC Department of Health, stated (somewhat defensively) that Washington does not have the highest rate of the disease among the world’s capital cities - but it does have the highest rate among US cities.

Thankfully, Dr. Hader stated that the District is still looking to initiate a comprehensive response, including early detection and prevention of ongoing transmission. Even the Washington HIV/AIDS Administration agrees that responsibility toward sexual encounters is a primary factor in preventing the virus from transmitting. In fact, Dr. Hader stated that along with other preventions, “…serious decisions about relationships can make a large prevention difference.”

In conclusion, let me applaud the Pope’s boldness to state the primary way HIV/AIDS can be stopped. I felt sorry for him that his brave statements have been interpreted as petty, bigoted, and out of touch with modern sexuality. I also applaud the Roman Catholic Church for having the wisdom to minister to people around the world suffering with AIDS. Many of us non-Catholics are guilty of criticizing the way problems are being addressed without investing anything in a solution. For this reason, I have made a commitment to stamping out AIDS in our lifetime. I have raised thousands of dollars to fund research for a world famous, DC based organization. My vehicle for raising the money was running several marathons. The fund raising has been my contribution. What’s yours?

We should all do what the hymn writer said, “If everyone lit just one little candle, what a bright world this would be!” Let’s take every opportunity to combat the spread of this dreaded disease.

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About The Author

Bishop Harry Jackson is chairman of the High Impact Leadership Coalition and senior pastor of Hope Christian Church in Beltsville, MD, and co-authored, Personal Faith, Public Policy [FrontLine; March 2008] with Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council.

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Pastor Jackson
I appreciate hearing from church leaders when they find common ground with Rome. This is the true ecumenism Pope John encouraged. Thanks for "schooling" my heretical fellow Catholics.

Truth is always the way to win.
Aids will stop spreading when modern sexuality is replaced with obedience to God's statutes. Perhaps someday there will be a cure for AIDS but the real problem isn't AIDS it's just a consequence.

I wish you would have been clear about how many unmarried heterosexuals and how many homosexuals are responsible for the spread of the disease in Washington DC.

aids
is a pale substitute for the traditional plagues. the black death pruned the excess population of the earth for centuries. lesser plagues, smallpox, gaol fever, etc, to say nothing of starvation, took their toll. today, most of the old plagues have been controlled, leaving only aids, which claims to a great degree those who choose to risk it. regardless of the aids toll, overpopulation with humans is rampant in 6 of the 7 continents, and will get worse, aids or no aids. so tell me. what is the problem? why should obama-impoverished north americans use their reduced resources to prevent the self pruning of some of the population of the southeastern continent, after they have intentionally self-pruned their own population by birth control and abortion, only to be overrun by illegals from south of the border who do not practice birth control, but who do give nominal allegiance to the pope? practice what you preach, pope. here in the united states catholics voted for the partial birth abortion candidate, and did not get excommunicated. so partial birth abortion is ok to get rid of americans, but condoms are not to be recommended for africans? sounds like more papal bull to me.

Pope is Right
When the U.N. went into Africa and passed out birth control it broke down the tribal systems and traditions.

They didn’t stick around and make sure the people used the birth control properly.

The Africans put the rubbers over their fertility idols.

They also put the birth control pills between their legs instead of swallowing them.

Birth control only works when they’re used.

That’s the problem with birth control people don’t use them.

So we end up with a bunch of children with STD or pregnant.

Aids In Africa & D.C. Same Dynamics.
Preach on Mr. Jackson I admire what you're doing but in these modern times the Pope and you are just preaching to the choir.
You're asking young men to put on condoms-Black men at that-Yeah right.
Not happening, the sexual dynamics are the same because of attitudes regarding sexual performance/prowess. In Africa it's tribal and religous, Sub-Saharan Africa is predominantly Muslim, where Sharia Law rules and women are considered subservient, they walk behind men, period-both literally and figuratively.
In D.C., same thing on a much more modern scale, the tribal element is representative of Hip-Hop "culture" with the piimp & hoes attitude, the women shake it and the men jump it, the women are turned out by the sexual prowess of the men and that prowess does not include condoms. They will tell you condoms limit performance, they're restrictive and to be considered "studly" skin on skin is desirable. And with a disproportionate amount of Black men in prison's, where the homosexual element is prevalent, once these young men get out of prison what's the first thing they do to prove that they're not a punk. In their minds, that's best done without a condom.
The ironic twist to this is, if these men were to seek services from a "professional" they would be required to wear a condom, but that's illegal except in Carson County and I think Reno, Nevadas.
Then there's the phenomenon of the happily married Congressmen who "cruise" public bathrooms unlike Mr. Spitzer who was publically condemned for seeking "professional services" at the Emperor's Club where he had to use a condom paid with public funds, of course.
But seriously, kudos to Catholics for continuing to minister to those around the world suffering from the disease, investing time and monies to stamp out this dreaded killer.


AIDS
Mr. Jackson posits that there are two goals about AIDS: 1. Prevent the spread. 2. Find a cure.

If we can accomplish goal 1 with 100% certainty, goal 2 becomes moot.

AIDS is spread only in a few, specific ways. Contact with blood or other cell-carrying bodily fluids is required. Saliva and sweat, to my understanding, does not carry the virus well, if at all. It does not travel in the air or the surface of the skin. Even if you are bled on, if I'm right, you probably won't get it. (I could be wrong about that last one, though.)

How many people, when using condoms ALWAYS use them? I mean EVERY SINGLE TIME. The only way to ensure that you will not spread AIDS is the same as the only way to ensure that you will not get someone pregnant. DON'T HAVE SEX!

If all the people with HIV stopped having sex and sharing drug needles, the disease would pretty much die out in a generation.

But no one listens to that. No one wants to hear "You shouldn't have sex." No one wants to hear "You have to stop doing that which gives you pleasure," whether "that" is sex, drugs, or whatever.

If you're serious about ending AIDS, encourage the people who have it to stop doing what it takes to spread it.

Moronic
How can you champion a statement that is clearly wrong? Just because the pope is a holy man doesn't mean he's immune from being wrong. The truth is condoms DO protect against AIDS. It has been scientifically proven and promoted in areas such as Thailand and Japan. To say condoms aren't part of the solution is to ignore scientific facts and promote ideology instead of real solutions. And in this case, it not only causes more suffereing, it leads to needless deaths.

Don't Grasp the Concept,
Anyone who can think for one moment that there is any aspect of human life or behavior to which the Pope, or any other religious leader, cannot legitimately apply religious principles simply does not grasp the concept of religion at all.

Religion is not a few obscure rituals and a collection of writings to be indulged in for a set period each week then ignored while a person goes about his "real" life. Religion is an all-encompassing philosophy of life that permeates every aspect of human behavior.

Whether you're talking about God's command to "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength," or the Wiccan Rede "An it harm none, do what ye will," the religious believer's first principles must apply to everything he/she does.

Anyone who compartmentalizes religion and sets it aside from his/her everyday acts has little claim to having a religion at all.

Mr. Jackson Jr.
My good man, I'm in agreement with everything you state in your piece. I also laud you on your efforts to combat this disease with your program. However, I must take exception to your very first sentence in the article. You sir, were not talking to a catholic. Unless of course that is qualified with the noun - cafeteria. To be a true Catholic, one must adhere to the practices and principles developed and followed now for more than two thousand years.

Odd
There is no evidence whatsoever to support the Pope's claim in this article, and some that tells against it.

Of course the Pope has a right to speak about whatever issue he wants. But in this case the Pope is advocating a policy that is likely to increase the spread of AIDS>

He does deserve to be criticized for that.

OCAM YOU ARE A JERK

Ocam you are a Jerk, period.

Burdening universal healthcare
This is one more reason to rail against universal healthcare in the US. This disease is preventable but to those who want to engage in homosexual activities unprotected and drug users there will no cost control. I can handle paying for the poor babies born with HIV because of the sins of their parents but no way do I want to pay for the bad behavior...

Americans under surveillance
Hope that no one is Anti-Abortion, a war protester, a Ron Paul supporter, a member of a third party, or a member of the Campaign for Liberty. If you are you may be "on the radar" of the U.S. Government.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/first100days/2009/03/23/fus ion-centers-expand-criteria-identify-militia-members/

Here is a link to the report

http://www.scribd.com/doc/13290698/The-Modern-Militia-Movem entMissouri-MIAC-Strategic-Report-20Feb09-

Some things you didn't mention
Bug chasers
HIV parties
Not informing your partner

BTW Happy Jake - Blood most certainly DOES carry the virus! That is why health care workers wear gloves when dealing with HIV/AIDS

A mother/fatherly kiss will do no harm, but a passionate kiss MAY. (Many times, you cannot be SURE there is no 'bleed' in the mouth.)

I don't care which way this goes, I just want it gone. Either all die off or find a cure. I am tired of hearing about it.

The one sure-fired way to stop AIDS,
STD's and un-wanted pregnancy.

It's called chastity. This means living according to ones calling in life. Remain virgins until a man and woman are married. Result - no HIV or STD's. Babies come in to a home with a mother & father who are in a commited relationship.

Really folks, this is very simple. Thank you to the Pope for reminding us of this. God's laws do not change.


jazzmanJim
God's ways are so simple and direct and lead to life. Man sure knows best though, doesn't he?? Thanks for an excellent post.

If condoms were the answer...
At a time in history where there has never, ever been more condoms around, AIDS infected and spread among us. If condoms were the answer, the disease wouldn't exist. People's rampant homosexual and extra-marital sex and intravenous drug use are the behaviors which spreads the disease. That, when I was educated, is the target behavior that needs changing. Any cheap, easy talk that sidesteps behavior change will be fruitless in defeating the disease, minus some vaccine being made.

Until then, there are two sure-fire ways to stay away from the disease: be in a faithful, monogamous lifelong relationship (both people are committed to) and don't use injectible drugs. People wouldn't have a problem with these measures if they didn't smack of organized religion. That's really what they're rebelling against, and the Pope provides a convenient to lambast, even when he says things that are inarguably accurate. Their hatred is more powerful than their love of AIDS patients.

Ironically
it's people's faith that they won't get HIV/AIDS that often leads them to ignore safety precautions, like using condoms. The pope and his church have always been more concerned about their version of human sexuality, and what's right and wrong in their minds, than in the practical matter that humans have sex, protected or otherwise.

jeffrey
In other words, God's laws are wrong and man's animal instincts are right. No need to control them. So repressive--all those churches and following God's laws and all.....

ocam

is another one of those who because they can construct a sentence think they make sense.

If he knew anything about the subject, he would know that the only african country that has dealt successfully, to any extent, with the AIDS epidemic is the one that stopped pushing condoms and started pushing committed and exclusive relationships.

Research has determined (as publicized by Harvard University) that condoms not only do not decrease the incidence of AIDS infections in a population but most likely increase the incidence.

Do not be fooled by people like ocam who speak out of ignorance.

BRACE YOURSELF!!!
I'm going to give you the sure fire way to prevent any more outbreaks of AIDS, but it is going to require self-control.

BRACE YOURSELF!!!!

CHASTITY

recommended reading
Death on a Friday Afternoon

Meditations on the Last Words of Jesus on the Cross

Richard John Neuhaus

2000 Basic Books, a member of the Perseus books group.

Terry
Now you did it! Don't you understand that "chastity" is considered a 4 letter word in an "enlightened" society???

Lon in Pa

"There is no evidence whatsoever to support the Pope's claim in this article, and some that tells against it.

Of course the Pope has a right to speak about whatever issue he wants. But in this case the Pope is advocating a policy that is likely to increase the spread of AIDS>

He does deserve to be criticized for that."

REPLY:

You're crazy, Lon.

Self-denial and chaste relations in marriage alone, are by definition the ONLY ways sexual contact is licit and pure. ALL other activity is sinful!

You, in slavish adherence to Playboy mentality, believe people can and should have their cake, and also eat it.

The Pope is speaking absolute truth. The reliance by hedonists at large, --relying on a rubber apron while stubbornly fornicating at will,

Is sure to exterminate the human race in just a few centuries. Why shouldn't the Pope warn humanity? Nobody ELSE warns us!

Still Jimbo is unchallenged
Yup, the wise old Jimbo must have been spot on with his earlier post, as no one seems to be able to counter his argument, that the best way to protect yourself from AIDS is to be celebate (like the Pope), in only one life-long monogamous relationship (both parties), refrain from homosexual sex, and say no to illegal syringe-applied drugs. I will go ahead and say I didn't come up with this very complex prescription, but the Church sure espouses it with Her teaching to man.

Will we listen? Just a quick reading of the posts confirms my contention that this is really a war over religion, and people are taking their swings at the Pope for espousing a religious response to AIDS. Why so much hatred, people? He's asking people to do this voluntarily! Methinks you all protest too much. You can keep doing your own thing...but you'll find that you're banging your head against the wall. Just come in the front door and save your frontal cortex and sanity. See you at Mass.

You risk becoming another statistic
If you buy into the condom lobby and the predatory hedonists that preach "safe sex," you're exposing yourself to stupid risks.

Condoms have an "acceptable" defect rate. They also break even without defects. The more "adventurous" your sexual practices, the more likely condoms are to fail you. The more you have sex, the more likely you are to have a condom failure. Though a broken condom can sometimes be detected in time to avoid pregnancy, there is no time to evade exposure to STDs including HIV.

You'd have to be some kind of complete moron to gamble with the fact that if a piece of latex rips you're exposed to HIV.

The only safety you can find in sex comes from trusting your partner. You have to be able to trust your LIFE to that partner - not to have sex with other people, use IV drugs, lie to you about exposure risks and test results. That level of trust is completely incompatible with the kind of lifestyle the hedonists and condom-lobby are marketing.

That level of trust ~is~ found in the relationships the Pope is advocating for: loving, monogamous unions that involve an enduring partnership for better or worse.

Any other choice is a willful choice to gamble with one's own life. Keep gambling with your life and eventually you'll become a statistic, with no one to blame but yourself.

Gamble with the lives of others and surely you've become a monster.

HIV-AIDS
The virus is spread only by blood and sex. The blood supply is relatively safe so a very very small number of people are infected from the injection of blood or blood products. A baby can be infected by its infected mother.
All the rest are infected by high risk behavior.
Unprotected promiscuous sex is a high risk behavior. Injecting drugs with a non-sterile needle is a high risk behavior. Real squares have very little risk of becoming infected with HIV. There has been a reluctance by all parties to face the above facts.
It is desirable to diagnose an HIV infection, it is desirable to have those infected treated, but no one has been cured. The virus is good at mutating and becoming resistant to treatment. Are the contacts of those infected sought? If not, why not? So far as a vaccine is concerned, it is just a hope. In my opinion it is not very likely given the nature of the disease and the ability of the virus to mutate.
A sea change in behavior is the only thing that can control the epidemic. How likely is that given the mentality of our current populations. They think that bad actions should have no bad consequences, but nature trumps all ideology. It doesn't matter what the President thinks, what the Congress thinks or what the Supreme Court thinks.
The pill was not the answer to separating sex from reproduction and the condom has not been shown to be the answer to it either nor to the problem of sexually transmitted diseases, including that equal opportunity killer-HIV.
Donald W. Bales, M.D. retered

joel-de
your diatribe is full or unverifiable assertions and personal attacks. take this one, for instance:"The available farmland in the USA, with our modern farming techniques, is more than capable of feeding over 6 billion people. The problem is, every time we send "aid" to some 3rd or 4th world pit of a nation, the warlord confiscate 90% of it."

support 6 billion people? for how long, moron? using enormous quantities of fossile fuels to produce fertilizer and other agricultural needs, perhaps for a short time. meanwhile, who is going to pay for it? and that excess population? where is it going to live? traditionally, building is done on the best farmland. if the world by your flawed logic, is "capable" of suppporting 6 billion people, why not 12 billion? or 24 billion? what is the desired world population with which to destroy the world? thanks fo the lesson in stupidity, joel. in actually, the west is birth controlling itself out of existance, while the muslim world is breeding itself into world domination, just like the catholic church wishes to do. the problem is that excess muslims are still muslims, excess catholics become everything but catholics. meanwhile, the "catholics" of the deluded states voted for a proponent of partial birth abortion, and were not excommunicated. the price we will pay for the voting stupidity of catholics, who should know better, will be the death of our nation and the ascendency of the most persistent enemy the catholics ever had--islam.

Religion
Religion might be a problem that will solve itself in Cameroon. If the Christians don't use condoms, maybe they will all die of AIDS and other venerial diseases. Then the pope will have no reason to visit the country and spread his nonsense.

Okay
well despite curmudgeon's post, the whole world isn't going to hell in a hand basket because of catholics. Are there a lot of catholics in name only?? Yes. If catholics were really adhering to the faith--we wouldn't have such dummies in power (i.e. Pelosi and Reid)whose puppet is Obama.
Just an aside regarding HIV. One of our daughters has scleroderma and Raynaud's Syndrome and her infectious disease doc in Houston has been treating Magic Johnson for HIV for a very long time. He has some concoction of 18 pills a day that he takes. I guess there is a start to managing this illness but the cost is so astronomical...
it is much cheaper to be a modest and chaste person and follow the Pope's advice.

Bravo, Donald W. Bales, MD


Excellent post;

Pope Benedict XVI has been scorned and laughed at; while the population of western society is slowly going the way of Africa.

The Pope is the only leader who

always tries to teach the truth.

I hope no one thinks the anti-religious, pro-sodomy, pro-fornication posters know what they are talking about.

They have no credentials. The Pope is Jesus Christ's Vicar on Earth.

SSG R in MA


You *are* a fool, hmmm?

"If the Christians don't use condoms, maybe they will all die of AIDS and other venerial diseases. Then the pope will have no reason to visit the country and spread his nonsense."

If they die it'll only be because they copulated to death. The nice thing about rabbits, as they mate and mate and mate ad infinitum,

They do what nature created them for. They screw with total abandon, and never die of venereal diseases.

But men aren't rabbits. Men have innate self-respect and a sense of responsibility supposedly higher in nature than dumb animals. When they cast it to the winds depending on a rubber to save them from disease, they are LOWER than the dumb animal, who at least makes no pretense of awareness. Men are AWARE, yet they sin wantonly, like dogs in heat.



Eddie
Oh, please--the Pope always tried to teach Catholic doctrine. That's his job, and not the truth. When Catholic doctrine and the truth conflict, he's going to preach Catholic doctrine and ignore the truth.

People who whine about "anti-Catholic bias" should remember that those of us who aren't Catholic have no obligation to pretend that those Catholic doctrines that are silly or untrue are really "the truth" or things we should all follow. If we criticize them for being silly or untrue, we're not be anti-Catholic--we're being anti-silly or anti-untrue.

Eddy, Eddy, Eddy
We Catholics have no problem with you non-Catholics disputing or disbelieving our beliefs. What we call anti-Catholic tactics or bias is when our beliefs are taken as disqualifiers for sitting on the Supreme Court, being a police officer, media person, etc. You get it now? Many Catholics have been, or are close to, being disqualified from sitting on the bench simply because they are Catholic and believe marriage, for example, should be between one man and one woman.

Bruce
or anti-knowledge.

Bruce,

how would someone like you, with your attitude know when something is true or silly. You lack of knowledge is obvious if one bases it on what is known of you, your writing.

For Bruce-- bad manners Bruce


You have no obligation, therefore you're correct, and the Pope is necessarily incorrect?

The Pope is ALWAYS correct, no matter what you prefer to think. He is the defender of truth. You attack the truth, if you spread your malice here, thinking "I have no obligation."

The HIV risk
A reference and thoughts on HIV:


The Myth Of Heterosexual AIDS
Author Michael Fumento, in his book The Myth of Heterosexual AIDS, offers substantial evidence that white, middle-class, non IV drug abuser heterosexuals are in less danger of contracting AIDS thru non-anal, sexual intercourse than they are of dying from shark attacks, being hit by lightning, or accidentally drowning in the bathtub. The book is very well referenced and documented. The book was reviewed by the Journal of the American Medical Assn as "the best single source available to enable heterosexual persons to assess their personal risk."

Perhaps those in DC and other places should assess their risk.

The HIV statistical risk numbers
The Statistical Real Risk
The risk of AIDS transmission from an infected person has been estimated to be about: 1 in 4 for anal (very high), 1 in 200 for female getting from vaginal intercourse with an infected male (high enough to take precautions if not sure if your partner is in a risk group). 1 in 16,000 for a male having 500 sexual encounters with females not using a condom and 1 in 110,000 from 500 female encounters if using a condom. With the risk of death in an auto accident 1 in 5000 EVERY YEAR, it is so much more risky for you to drive than to have 500 acts of unprotected sex.. The one in 500 risk would be worse for a women and much less than one in 500 for a man to have sex with an HIV infected women. If your partner is not HIV infected the risk is ZERO.

These relative risks are from Norman Herast, M.D. and Stephen B. Hulley, M.D., researchers at the Center for AIDS Prevention. Dr Herast also in Dept Epidemiology of San Fran General Hospital. The info was originally published in JAMA (Journal of American Medical Assn). Vol 259, No.16, page 2428. While the estimates were made a few years ago, the current continuing low incidence of heterosexual spread, especially almost none female to male,tend to confirm the original estimates.

Another HIV comment
A comment from a medical discussion of HIV among physicians:

"No documented case of AIDS exists anywhere in the Western world of a drug-free heterosexual who contracted AIDS from a primary carrier (like a hemophiliac) and then transmitted the disease to a healthy, drug-free third party. (Dave Comment: So the scare that a man who has sex with an infected woman, such as a prostitute, is likely to then infect his wife is a myth, not a fact.)"

Can anyone point to an example illustrated in this excerpt ti the contrary?

The Courage of Your Convictions
For those who are praising condoms as the answer to the problem, one question: would you have sex with a person with HIV with a condom? If so, you have amazing faith in a scrap of rubber with a high failure rate.

Dread
I'm not correct because I have no obligation to support things that aren't true--I'm correct if I am, and not if I'm not. I'm more likely to be correct because I don't have an ideology to support that would pull me away from the truth.

The Pope isn't necesarily incorrect, but he is necessarily putting truth behind doctrine, so he's less likely to be aligned with truth than he is with doctrine.

The Pope may be always correct on doctrine but he's clearly NOT always correct on truth. He's not the defender of truth, despite any labels that appeal to the gullible. If I point out where the Pope is wrong, I'm supporting the truth, not attacking it.

Jeez, to think these people can find there way home at night...

It's easy...
...but I am not surprised that the leftist morons don't get it. No outside of marriage sex, no illegal drugs-NO AIDS. Say NO to condoms, say YES to abstinence and being faithful...But I am just repeating what sane people already know. Liberalism is a mental disorder...

Just sayin'
I guess we are to conclude that the failure rate of condoms is so high that their use provides ABSOLUTELY NO PROTECTION from the transmission of HIV. I assume further that the Pope knows this. I'm well aware that his reason for opposing condoms ultimately has nothing to do with their efficacy or lack of it. Instead, with the arrogance that seems to belong to religious people who know God's will, he and his Church have decided that it is better to allow some percentage of the exposed population to die rather than yield one inch on doctrine. We liberals call this sort of calculation "immoral;" I don't know what conservatives call it, but I'll bet you've got a nice label for it.

Jack reply 9
Condoms only work 98-99 percent of the time to prevent pregnancy. Says so right on the box. A woman can only get pregnant a few days a month. You can get HIV/AIDS every day of the month. And that's if they are used correctly EVERY time.

Gestell
states: We liberals call this sort of calculation "immoral;" I don't know what conservatives call it, but I'll bet you've got a nice label for it.

Actually, we're just really sad for you. The ONLY "free love" you should be accepting is from God and you turn down the gift. Now that is just sad. God still cries.

Bp.Harry Jackson Jr.'s observation
Evidently the author is not aware of the docu- mentary"Why We Will Never Win The War On Aids" (1994)banned by the U.S.A.Govt.that commisioned the study, forbidding it even to be given away free! "Over 200 respected leading scientists who have been studying AIDS for the past seve- ral years now agree that the virus known as'HIV'may not be the cause of AIDS after all...
You will also learn just how big the'AIDS Scam' is and how the news media and the Fed.Govt. are involved,who's behind it and why." (cf. AMAZON).

dreadnaught
I get that you think that all of the people who have sex outside of marriage are doing something illicit. But does that really justify your not caring whether a certain number of them die a slow painful death because of it?

If the Pope claims that all sex outside of marriage is illicit, that is his business. I would disagree, but have some respect for his position. If he says that programs that advocate making condom's available makes the spread of AIDs worse. Then he is not making a moral claim. He is making a factual claim that happens to be false. People who actually care about other human beings should not make such false factual claims.

That would be another one of those moral claims. And I suppose if the Pope thinks that saying false things which lead to an increase in painful deaths is moral, that would be an odd moral position to take. But at least it would be back in his domain.

Of course in Africa, because of the extent of the disease, there are many women who contract AIDS from sleeping only with their husbands, if their husbands have AIDS. I understand why you are not bothered by the deaths of the husbands, after all they have done something not licit. But why are you not bothered by the painful deaths of the wives? Isn't stopping the spread of the disease something that should be taken as a relevant factor along with what is licit?

Lon
Why do you insist on people not taking responsibility for their actions? There will always be someone who suffers at the hands of sinners. Why not approach the topic where it begins? With the sin.

To Lon
You're intellectually dishonest.

"If the Pope claims that all sex outside of marriage is illicit, that is his business. I would disagree, but have some respect for his position."

Get real; it is God who commands "Thou shalt not commit adultery." Why lay that at the feet of one pope?

"If he says that programs that advocate making condom's available makes the spread of AIDs worse, Then he is not making a moral claim."

Yes he is. The mere fact that you like condoms in some situations is irrelevant; you aren't an authority.

"People who actually care about other human beings should not make such false factual claims."

People in danger of contracting AIDS should not expect a rubber to save them from evil consequences for which THEY have complete responsibility. That isn't a false claim. It's plain as a wart on your nose.

Essentially that is what the Pope has said; "YOU have all the responsibility for
AIDS." Are you somehow too smart to see this?




To All here concerned:
Guess who says pope was right about condoms, AIDS
Harvard scientist: Those mocking pontiff's stand are wrong
Check-out:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId= 92702



The Pope is right
It has been repeatedly proven through scientific research that the HIV/AIDS virus can and does penetrate through the membrane of a condom. Also, as stated in a previous post there is a high rate of failure in condoms, generally from misuse. I hope whether thou art liberal, conservative, or confused you can grasp one idea. It is this: If condoms were the answer to HIV/AIDS or STD's there would be no cases in the USA where condoms are given out by government funded agencies like lollypops are given out at the bank. At last we see that condoms are not the answer to the problem, but to the contrary appear to perpetuate the problem by giving people false confidence that results in increased sexual activity that puts the person at higher risk.

As a side note, I find it comical that the people who are yelling the loudest over the Popes comments. Claiming it is damaging to human life, or that he is killing innocent people with his statements. Are the same people who believe it is ok to kill an unborn baby in it's mothers womb. To my mind that is total idiocy. Values based on convenience not logic or reason.

Stupid old men

Because of Mr Ratzinger's position and influence, his comments will ensure many more people will suffer and die from AIDS. To justify that you need more than a rationale ultimately rooted in the myths of primitive religions and the superstitions of illiterate goatherds living several thousand years ago.

Defense of Benedict XVI
I think ocam is a stupid YOUNG man. The Pope, whose name is Benedict XVI, not Mr. Anybody, is far from stupid. He is widely acknowledged as a brilliant man. He's been a great writer, a university professor, and now a great pontiff as well.

Ocam says,

"Because of [his] position and influence, his comments will ensure many more people will suffer and die from AIDS."

You forget; those who ensure it are fornicators and promiscuous homosexuals, not people of influence. AIDS is passed on mainly by degenerates; irresponsible and dirty ones.

". . . you need more than a rationale ultimately rooted in the myths of primitive religions and the superstitions of illiterate goatherds living several thousand years ago."

The fact is, you defend depravity and filth just because you're an ignorant ant-catholic. The LAST thing you rely on is "rationale." If you hate AIDS so much; don't bugger with other homosexuals. (We can see you're a homosexual and a bigot as well.)

Stanislaus/Harvard "backing" for Pope
If you dig a bit deeper you will find that the underlying key study concerned Uganda, and it noted that education, abstinence and condom use were all essential parts of the package:

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/304/5671/714

"A comparative analysis of 1995 and 1989 Ugandan population-based surveys of HIV behavioral risk indicators offered evidence of important changes since 1989, including an increase in the age of sexual debut, a decrease in indicators of casual or nonregular partners, and an increase in the use of condoms, both overall and in casual partnerships (10, 12, 25, 26). The subsequent report, led by the Joint United Nations Programme on HIV/AIDS (UNAIDS), emphasized the relative importance of sexual debut and condom use (13)."

how man complicates
life on this earth. Just follow God's laws and you can live a worry free life regarding HIV/AIDS. Quit messing with nature--nature will always win. Look at the high incidence of autism and ADHD--many people are beginning to believe it is a direct consequence of women and the "pill." Mother Nature can be quite furious.

HIV/Aids
There already exists a "cure" for HIV/Aids. Practice sex God's way -- monogamous sex between a man and a woman NEVER transmits any form of STD.

It's a travesty that the free-sex movement of the 60s has brought such a plague upon the world. And now we are spending millions on research for a cure for a preventable disease -- instead of using those funds to find cures for victims of cancer, paralysis, etc.

ML
Amen to that.

To all my TH friends:

After this coming Saturday, my posting in Townall will cease for about two weeks. I'll be flying to Madrid, Spain with my good wife who has a workshop assignment there.

Keep up the good work all of you; good Christians like Truetolife and Stanislaus, et al. God bless you.

dreadnaught
Thank you! Have a wonderful trip. I will pray for your safe return!

Even assuming 'sexual responsibility'
is a better way to stop the spread of HIV/AIDS, why does condom use 'increase the problem', as the Pope asserts and Jackson concurs?


condom use
encourages illicit sex. Sex is reserved for one man and one woman within the context of marriage. Open to God's plan for procreation.

God Bless Pope Benedict
In the "Summer of Love" doctors noticed diseases unseen by modern medicine for so long they had not even been given Latin names.

Abomination is a strong word and would not have been used to describe something that was simply socially "yucky". It would have been reserved for activities having grave consequences.

Please visit for a laugh and a peek at the basis for Catholic teaching on sexuality.

http://kenusa.blogtownhall.com/2008/05/10/dogs_and_condoms. thtml
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