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Friday, February 22, 2008
Douglas MacKinnon :: Townhall.com Columnist
GOP to Conservatives: Drop Dead
by Douglas MacKinnon
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As with small children, many of the entrenched, beholden, or power-hungry hierarchy of the Republican party, simply wish conservatives could be seen, but never heard.

In a very telling headline, The Washington Times recently reported, “McCain Refuses to Pander.” In the first paragraph of the article, the paper said, “John McCain's campaign manager yesterday said the candidate will not pander for conservative support…” Yeah, we know. Message received.

For those conservatives or talk radio hosts who still don’t get it, or who are still not prepared to compromise their principles for the party, then some elder statesmen have some names they’d like to call you. Chase Untermeyer, the former high level official for Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, and the current president, said in a recent column, “At both the national and local levels, there are those who declare that certain Republican elected officials are insufficiently conservative and must be purged. Senator John McCain is getting the worst of these blasts right now, with some self-appointed tribunes of Reagan’s legacy saying they might even prefer Senators Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama – scarcely followers of the Gipper – to McCain.”

For those conservatives who admire President Reagan but would dare question the record of McCain, Mr. Untermeyer, labeled each a “SQUIRREL.” As in “Snarky Quibbler who Undermines and Ignores Ronald Reagan’s Enduring Legacy.”

“Snarky.” I guess if you went to Harvard, called yourself “Chase” instead of Charles, and mingled with the elites of the world, then “Snarky” is a name you might assign to conservatives who have an honest disagreement with John McCain. If you’re someone like me, who grew up in poverty, barely got an education, and never met an Ivory Tower elite worth a warm bucket of spit, then you might substitute the word “ethical” for snarky.

When I first came to Washington, I had the honor to work in the White House as a low-level writer for Ronald Reagan. While certainly lacking the pedigree of Mr. Untermeyer, I did share one or two special moments with that President. In a conversation that Peggy Noonan was kind enough to chronicle in her bestselling book entitled “When Character Was King,” President Reagan and I spoke in the Oval Office about the alcoholism of our fathers, poverty, and the cruelty of life. It was actually because of Ronald Reagan’s wisdom, kindness, and suggestion, that I was able to reach out to my estranged father.

Understanding that, I’m more than proud to plead guilty to using Ronald Reagan as the template for true conservatism. As such, I just don’t think there is any way that anyone can accurately equate Reagan’s conservative legacy with McCain’s moderate voting record. Does saying that make me a bad person? Am I now an Untermeyer “Squirrel?”

The thought of voting for Clinton or Obama makes me nauseous. We are a nation at war with Islamists who mean to exterminate us. To vote for Clinton or Obama is to vote for the authority to wave the flag of appeasement or surrender. I have no intention of voting for the next Neville Chamberlain.

John McCain is a good person. I do believe he has the best interests of our nation at heart. That said, as an American, it’s my right to disagree with him on substance. John McCain heroically fought and sacrificed to give me that right, and for that, I am forever grateful. On issues such as immigration, taxes, judges, global warming, drilling in Anwar, and the detention and prosecution of enemy combatants, I take issue with some of his past comments, votes, or current positions.

Unfortunately, the message I’m getting from the Republican establishment is that conservatives should bite their tongues, do their duty, and await the crumbs that may come their way in a McCain administration. Is that what it’s come to? Party loyalty before principle?

In endorsing McCain the other day, former President George H.W. Bush said, “…no one is better prepared to lead our nation at these trying times than Senator John McCain.” Really? No one? Does this incredibly decent former president truly believe that McCain is better prepared to lead this nation than say, his own son, Jeb? Or Mitt Romney?

In his endorsement, the former president also said, “…I believe now is the time for me to help John in his effort to start building the broad-based coalition it will take for our conservative values to carry the White House this fall.”

“Conservative values.” That’s all this election is about for millions of Americans who choose to put country before party. As such, they are entitled to have McCain further define or clarify his “conservative values.” He needs to earn their vote.

Like Untermeyer, former President Bush questioned those on the right who question McCain. He called such criticism “grossly unfair” and an “unfair attack.”

If some in the party succeed in quashing the conservative voice, then they will have silenced the conscience of America. Surely, John McCain will stand shoulder to shoulder with conservatives to prevent such an outcome.

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About The Author

Douglas MacKinnon is a former White House and Pentagon official and author of the forthcoming novel, The Apocalypse Directive.

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Reagan Would have Supported McCain
The beauty of President Ronald Reagan was that he kept his conservative principles during very liberal times, 1960's-1970's, and in a very liberal state, California. Despite the constant despicable attacks, he kept his head, stayed positive and was always a gentleman. He kept his principles, but he also supported the party. I know the arguments both for and against Senator McCain. I know what he would have supported concerning illegal immigrants, and I am also aware of what Reagan supported in the 80's, both plans had fatal flaws. Quite frankly, I heard McKinnon's name before, as well as Untermeyer, and whatever personal issues they have with one another, I choose not to care. I also do not care what a liberal, moderate, conservative think of me when I make a political & pragmatic choice based upon the available candidates. Senator McCain campaigned in 2000 & 2004 for President Bush. This help should have been turned down by the party if it was not going to be reciprocated. President Gore & Kerry would have been a disaster, just as Obama or Queen Hillary & her court jester would be if they get back in.
Senator McCain has 1 son in the military, and 1 son in a military academy. His service, sacrifice and patriotism are unquestionable. I would sleep well at night with him as Commander in Chief. I can't say that for the other 2.
President Reagan would have supported him, just as the elder president Bush has done. he would have done so without worrying about what anyone has said. He was a class act. RIP

Back to your day job, McCain
We know, the only people who John McCain feels comfortable pandering to are illegal aliens. If he doesn't feel the need to "pander" to us conservatives, then he can just lose the general election and go back to this day job (after all, liberal nutcases like Hillary and Barack can open the borders just as effectively as McCain).

Then, after four years of disastrous, amateurish leadership from Hillary or Barack, we can elect a real president -- Mitt Romney. We can only hope that the country will not be in too much disrepair after the Democrats screw it up. I, for one, will not vote for McCain if he does not renounce that horrendous, idiotic amnesty bill he co-sponsored from last summer.

McCain is an embarrassment to the Republican Party. If this were "American Idol" from last season, he would be the party's Sanjaya (hey, maybe votefortheworst.com is even responsible for McCain's frontrunner position as party nominee).

I believe he needs conservatives a lot more than they need him.

Illegal's friend
Hang in there my illegal friends. John McCain is going to make you U.S citizens and make us all speak spanish. YOU M.F.

It's not McCain
it's the House and Senate we should fight for.

But the worst of all...
...are the poor sad fools who are trying to push the "McCain is a conservative". So, is McCain is a conservative and will he stand with conservatives? Maybe McCain can fly by waving his arms? Maybe Clinton is a conservative? Wanna' buy a bridge?

The "McCain is a conservative" folks make me sick to my stomach because they are trying to brainwash themselves into believing outright bulls**t.

If you want to vote for McCain, fine. I will not. But you make me want to vomit with attempts at wild revisions of history.

Conservatives: McCain is your worst enemy. He knows how to destroy you from the inside out, and he will do it. If you get Johnny boy elected, you WILL regret it.

Jeb Bush
"Does this incredibly decent former president truly believe that McCain is better prepared to lead this nation than say, his own son, Jeb?"

If Jeb would have been such a great president, why didn't he run instead of Dubya, who has proved to be rubbish? We can only assume that Jeb would have been even worse.

Go to war with the candidate you've got.
Face it. Huckabee, Thompson, and Romney are political roadkill. Except for Huck the others deserved better. If you keep arranging the deck chairs we better hope the Carpathia is a lot closer this time.

-Ray

What a dumb conclusion!
So you think Juan McCain will stand shoulder to shoulder with conservatives?! Please, give me a break! Juan is just another CFR approved Rino.

Should Juan become president it'll take a high-powered microscope to differentiate him from our current Mexican president, Jorge 'the spendthrift' Bush.

Complete, Utter Nonsense
The article by Mr. MacKinnon is complete, utter nonsense and is badly timed. If anything, the GOP has made it clear that it needs conservatives to win in November. John McCain, however, is the presumptive GOP nominee because he won most of the primaries; and the truth is that he is a pro-life fiscal conservative who is the most qualified of the candidates to be the next Commander in Chief and who is a hawk on the Iraq War and foreign policy in general. At this point there are and need to be efforts to unify the GOP in order to win in November, lest the Democrats elect Obama or Hillary, who are anti-military socialists who will increase government spending and thus taxes, accept defeat in Iraq, pursue appeasement policies in foreign affairs, seek outright amnesty in immigration, promote pro-abortion policies and nominate left wing judges to the federal bench.

DeLay Rips McCain for Opposing Medicare

Is Delay out of his mind? How is this pork filled bill with no money to pay for it conservative?

CNS-Former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay criticized likely Republican presidential nominee John McCain - and by extension some of the more conservative members of Congress - by calling McCain’s 2003 vote against the Medicare prescription drug plan a non-conservative vote.

DeLay made his remarks in an interview with Cybercast News Service at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) in Washington, D.C., on Saturday.

While in Congress, DeLay had helped quashed a rebellion by House conservatives, who tried to defeat the prescription plan then being promoted by President Bush.

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/delay-rips-mccain- for-opposing-medicare-drug-plan

Yes, it has come to this.
"Is that what it’s come to? Party loyalty before principle?"

It is indeed what it has come to. It's the dynamic of winner-take-all electoral politics, from which there is no escape.

In this regard, Republican strategists believe they're merely absorbing useful lessons from the Democrats, who've put partisan advantage above all else for about a century. Unfortunately, the Democrats hold the high cards at this table: they already own the ranking collection of special interests, both boughten and ideological, required to dominate a purely partisan contest. The GOP cannot enter this game; it simply doesn't have the ante.

We used to fantasize about an enduring -- some said "permanent" -- conservative majority. But we who did so were insufficiently vigilant over the men who plot the course of the supposedly conservative major party. There's a real lesson in that. Let's hope the learning of it comes at a cost the nation can bear.

Limited Options
The GOP cannot run credibly on the issues of immigration, spending, global warming or the environment. To claim that there is any difference between the candidates is to ignore the track record of the GOP, and McCain's positions. It can run on the issues of Iraq, abortions, and the possibility of having more moderate to conservative justices appointed to the bench. This, of course, is the short term. The longer term is the issue of what to do about a party that Bush pulled to the left, and which will continue that drift with McCain. McCain can also promise not to raise taxes, but what he cannot do is tell us how he will pay for the costs of government today if he does not do so.

The economy will drift regardless of whose elected. The current $400 B deficit, which in fact will exceed $500 B given both the optimistic revenue projections and the fact that the total cost of the military budget was not included for the coming year. is not being discussed. The rising costs of entitlements, which can only drive that debt higher, trade, a concern to many, the weak dollar and balance of payments deficits are also being ignored. The costs of Iraq, when factoring in the replacement of the armed forces equipment, the costs of health care for the injured vets, and interest on the borrowed money is now projected to exceed $2.7 trillion.

McCain wishes to grow the forces, which will cost money. At the same time, McCain, as Bush did with the Drug Entitlement Act, will have to deal with health care, given that 65% of the American people clearly want something done due to the fact that costs have risen 78% in the last 7 years, and if this continues, health care and insurance will become increasingly unaffordable to many Americans whose income has not remotely kept up with these increases.


McCain Shouldn't Pander
McCain would be wasting his time if he pandered. I can't speak for other conservatives, who also won't vote for him, but if he told me the American flag was red, white and blue, I'd have to check it a couple of times myself to make sure he didn't make a deal with the Democrats to change the colors while I slept or on his own, decided to cement his maverick reputation by having all the flags re-done as purple, yellow and black just because he can. John McCain has no magic words to make me change my mind about him because my opinion is based on his past behavior, not on his words. Soooo, he may as well do whatever the heck he wants and not waste his time pandering. Who'd believe him?

GOP desperate already...
The shrill is getting louder and louder from McCain supporters telling conservatives what idiots we are for not supporting McCain. Now that Obama has skyrocketed in popularity, the GOP is scared that the "chosen one" won't beat Obama in November. You all remember...McCain was the only guy that could beat Hillary.

As fas as I'm concerned, it would go much better for the GOP and McCain if they just called the guy a moderate. Calling him a conservative in light of the legislation that he's passed is an insult to real conservatives.

Don't Sell out
As a voter and past supporter of the GOP(both with my time and my money) I believe that Conservatives should not vote for McCain. As the Conservative wing of the party was fighting to maintain control of the agenda for the party, McCain, Hagel, Graham and other moderate republicans did not support them and instead fought to push the party to the left. They won and have in fact pushed the party to the left. McCain fought those within his own party which weakened the party as a whole in my opinion. What McCain did was fair game for sure but now he wants Conservatives to forget about it. The republican hacks who are in the media want Conservatives to forget about it as well. "Grow up" they say, "get over it" they say. I say if Conservatives vote for McCain we will make sure that the GOP/RNC keeps serving up the lesser of 2 evils for President each election cycle.

Yep
It is becoming increasingly difficult to be optimistic these days. Anyone paying even scant attention can see what's happening, and while that's good for the alchohol industry it's useless for the betterment of the country. McCain's people have been lecturing us conservatives for not falling in lock step with his particular maverick brand of "conservatism". He's not trying to appeal to us by maybe meeting us half-way, instead his people insult us while trying to appeal to moderates and independents and democrats who will never vote for him in a general election. Indeed, we are the people he would need to win this thing, yet we are told we are insignificant. Not only that, we are being told we are blind by the very people who have been so thouroughly cowed by the drive by media .
As I've said before, when the straight talk express drives over the cliff these same people will point the finger of blame at us. I suggest that when that time occurs we show them a finger of our own.

The fact that McCain
created the kind of legislation (McCain–Feingold) that silenced political opponents and then a few years later personally benefited from that legislation as he sought the highest office in the nation, is nothing short of gross injustice.

If this sort of thing had happened in some South American country, we would be screaming "corruption" and "fraud" and talking about regime change.

We seem to be blind to the corruption in our own country.

HankRearden
Priceless!

I enjoy starting out the day with a good laugh. Thanks.

Robert
you folks have torched the word conservative, twisted it into some "we hate brown people", "we love war (but we dont want to fight in it or pay for it)", and all we know how to do is personally attack our opposition...cause

You folks lost the nomination battle. drop dead


I hope you are are right, DM
I hope he will, though I am doubtful.

And the GOP is too power hungry right now to care about anything but winning elections. If conservatives are in their way, they will side step this large and important group.

I do see a split down the road...

Completely Missed the Point
McKinnon completely misses the point of "not pandering to the right". If McCain is seen as groveling on his knees for wingnut support, then he will certainly start losing the independent and moderate support he will also need to win the election. That doesn't mean he can't make concessions to the very conservative crowd, and he's been doing that. He admitted at CPAC with conviction that he cannot win without conservative support, and has been reaching out to various conservative leaders for their input on how he can rally that support. But there are some, which have been pointed out by guys like Untermeyer, who have this absolute purity test that they want their candidates to go through before they'll consider voting for them (even though such a candidate cannot win a general election with better than 1/3 of the country being independents). Those people will be waiting forever for this conservative purist to come along, because he doesn't exist--and he most certainly was not Mitt Romney, who McKinnon apparently still has a man-crush on.

The picture is becoming crystal clear that those who want to keep this country safe, socialism out of the picture, and conservative judges on the bench, will vote for McCain--while those on the outer fringe of the right will put their differences with McCain before their country. And because I think there are many more conservatives who will do what's right for their country, I am confident McCain will still win without the fringe support.

Robert
"you folks have torched the word conservative, twisted it into some "we hate brown people", "we love war (but we dont want to fight in it or pay for it)", and all we know how to do is personally attack our opposition...cause"

Only liberals say that conservatives hate brown people. I've never heard a conservative say that.

"we love war (but we dont want to fight in it or pay for it)",

Are you saying that liberals are fighting in Iraq? Pahleeeeeeeeez!

I know that I can speak for most posters here at TH when I say, "please take a hike yourself. TH is a conservative blog you idiot!

Ah Yes, he strikes yet again
Robert writes: Friday, February, 22, 2008 8:17 AM
The far right can take a hike..

You folks lost the nomination battle. drop dead

Robert


And yet again we have another well thought out and logically reasoned argument for his point of view by the esteemed "Navy Captain."

Way to go Wobbie.
Just keep on setting such fine examples of how "Officers" in the US Armed Forces should conduct themselves in public forums.

OH, and have a GREAT day.

Another thought
While I respect and admire Reagan greatly, is it possible for conservatives to move past him and stop mentioning him every breath?

I am not sure invoking a president who served 20 years ago constantly is a good thing...

Problems
McCain has always had ethics and finance problems. The NYT hit piece is the lesser of the 2 problems.

McCain may be hobbled by his own campaign finance reform and will have to limit spending until the general election. In the mean time Obama is raising 30 million a month which he can spend on his own candidacy and to help the Congressional races.


If this gets much worse McCain should step down and let a brokered convention get a decent nominee.

Reagan Reagan Reagan
Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan Reagan

McCain is tough!
McCain is tough as a box of rocks and almost as smart!

The man can't understand the Constitution (even when it is explained with small words and really slowly) which gave us the 1st Amendment infringing McCain Feingold.

He is a boring speaker. I put on one of his speeches so I can fall asleep.

Is it any surprise that McCain is going to kick the conservatives to the curb?

I for one and many others are going to vote for Obama. If we are going to get a left winged liberal disaster, let it be a democrat. Oops that's right. They are both democrats. Then, let it be the socialist with the "D" next to his name.

There is hope with Obama. He is a bright man. He graduated at the top of his class instead of at the bottom. He may see the light and make good decisions. McCain does not offer any such hope.

Let's see:

A brilliant and inspiring black man vs. a dimm-witted, dull angry white man.

Hmmmm .....

******* WARNING *******
DEMOCRAT LANDSLIDE AHEAD
************************


I hate this but . . .
I think McCain is going to win. He needs to make a good VP choice to at least get some conservatives to vote and hope God and actuarial realities to the rest, but...

He'll win without strong conservative support. He'll win because he's the most qualified Democrat. The Democrats have screwed themselves. Both Hillary and Obama are weak candidates.

Hillary's weakness is exposed by Obama's "Seinfeld like" campaign about NOTHING - and he's beating her like a red headed step child. But Obama can't sustain is cult like emotional sensationalism for 9 months.

If Obama wins, McCain appeals to Dems and moderates in NY, NJ, Ohio, PA, and Michigan - where the population is old, change isn't good, and black people aren't Presidents. Sorry, but that's how Hillary won those states.

If Hillary comes back to win the nomination, she'll carry the normal States that Kerry and Gore won - but she'll lose all the others because Hispanic men won't vote for a woman if St. Juan - the patron saint of illegals is running. So either way, believe it or not, by November it's going to be McCain either in an Electoral landslide against Obama, or a close but comfortable electoral margin over Clinton.

McCain?
Thanks for expressing our true feeling. I am behind your article 100%

McCain
Im 57 years old and worked for Barry Goldwaters and Ronald Reagans Campaign as a teenager. I have contributed money to the republican party for as long as I can remember. Not this year. I have contributed to the republican candidate for president for as long as I can remember - even for the liberal George Bush Senior. Not this year. From now on, I will only contribute directly to true social and fiscal conservative candiates, and those will be the only candidates I vote for. I would encourage all of you to do the same. The republican party needs an enema - of both the leadership and many of the elected folks. Either we as conservatives reclaim the party, or we go our own way in the future. America might be better off if we kill the two party system anyway.

I agree with Laura Cap

There is not a chance in hell that I would believe anything that lying,liberal little twerp would say. And something tells me that he already knows that it would be a waste of his time.

I also feel the need to point out that the fellow is not so bright. He went completely off the reservation pandering to illegals who are going to vote democrat not republican. How smart is that?

I think that he will be floored to see just how few people actually vote for him in Nov. After all, if what you want is a liberal, your going to vote for Obama NOT McCain.

Regardless of party
many people long to vote for the winner of any contest, even though the results are invariably disappointing.
If most people voted their principles over party, we would have more parties to vote for.
The conservatives concerned enough need a different label than Republican. The moderat-conservatives have taken that title. The leaders of each party work to dis-enfranchise their own voters by rules that eliminate choices later in the process and whichever group gets their ox gored cries foul.
In this case it is those of us who beliave in the Constitution and expect that it should be adhered to religiously.
The candidates who espoused this position were summarilly run off, leaving us limited to a conservatively-modetate-liberal or flaming communists. At some point we need to decide whether conservative principles are more important than losing our form of goverment.

Mc Cain's colors
I DO NOT wish to vote for a moderate Republican turncoat such as McCain obviously is and will vote for Mitt Romney rather than Democrat or "turncoat" Repub.

DNC to the Clintons
Drop Dead!

McCain isn't a good man period
That line of thinking is like the two teenage girls who got caugth robbing banks and then the parents tell the media, "My daughter's a good kid." "Hey, good kids don't rob banks!"
Same applies to John McCain, he is not a good man of Conservative character, shoot for that matter he isn't a good man of any character, if one researches his past at a personal level.
"We support the troops but not support the war menatality." This isn't consistant, we cannot pick and choose certain things that we have done in our lives that is good and keep just them and forgot about the crappy things we have done. Your either a good person or your not there is no inbetween.

Hey Robert, how can you 'claim'

to be doing night patrol in Iraq to protect us from evil... ha ha ha, when you claim to be a Navy Capt., PILOT.

Since when does a Navy Capt. PILOT do night patrol in Iraq? Ummm???

And, how a are you going to be a delegate... from Texas, for the RNC when you're in Iraq???



This ought to be good... LOL



Doug Really Means "Christian"
Good article, but if you substitute the word "Christian" in place of the word, "conservative" it would be more accurate.

The Republican elite would like all the Christians to just go quietly away.

After they vote for McCain, of course, but then just shut up for another four years.

Sorry, this one isn't buying.

Liberal vs Ultra Liberal
Sen McCain has been labeled liberal and justifiably so on some issues.

Sen Obama is Ultra-Liberal.

Anyone who doesn't see the difference is in denial.

McShameful
Buck: "We, real conservatives have already moved into open rebellion against this Neo-Con front man,McCain. We will not be blackmailed into selling our souls for this least of the worst."
-------------------------
John "Bilderberger" McCon is probably the worst of the worst. Better to have an Obama and remove the elites from their entrenched positions, and rebuild the Party from the ashes.

I know one thing for sure
I totally despise Communists in whatever color they come in, and I detest that smarmy twit the high priest of Yes We Can, and Change. The fools who faint over his every word and movement didn't have the brains to realize when he blew his nose during his public speech, like all elites he was showing his utter disdain for the
great unwashed peasantry. His mama didn't teach him good manners no matter how polished his external persona is. He's a trojan horse, and a puppet of the ones who trained and mentored and financed him. And wifey hates America but now she's finally proud of Amerika. If you vote for Obama you can't call yourself conservative, you aren't getting even with McCain or the GOP by
lowering yourself and your standards to vote for the piece of work. And I'm not saying vote for
McCain either, I haven't come to that decision myself. What I am doing is having a daily conversation with God because I don't know what to do. I admit, I'm scared silly. I don't think many believers would disagree that God has been warning us for 40 some years and the more
we disobey the deeper into the wilderness He lets us wander. When we decided to kill His little ones, we crossed a line and He's been
increasing the warnings since. YOu'd think 911 would have done it, or the illegal invasion but
nope, still stiffnecked people. So what's it gonna take, aside from one of the three stooges
getting elected..a major nuke attack? 2 Chronicles 7:14 has a message of hope and we
better pay attention

Conservative Principles are Important
Mr Bill,

And we need to cultivate them at the grassroots level.

In another post I explained how to become a precinct delegate.

We can make a difference within the party.
When I first became a delegate, I was one of only two conservatives out of 13 in my community.

In a span of 4 years, we were able to recruit and replace the moderate to liberal delegates with our own. Our community went from two to eleven conservatives out of 13.

Once we had the numbers we had a greater say in the voting on candidates and party platform.

How many of you are delegates?

How many are going to be?

It is the only significant way to make a difference.

You have appx two months to file.
You only need 3 votes in an uncontested precinct.

Trying to start another party will not work.

Trust me on this.

Phil
re your post: Friday, February, 22, 2008 6:24 AM
...If anything, the GOP has made it clear that it needs conservatives to win in November. - True enough at CPAC, but words hardly equate to action (unless you are a lib).

...John McCain, however, is the presumptive GOP nominee because he won most of the primaries - while not winning the majority of conservative support.

...a pro-life fiscal conservative - who wants the fed to pay for fetal stem cell research (how do you protect life that way?)

...who is a hawk on the Iraq War and foreign policy in general - unless you want to stop agressive questioning of terrorists or close a camp for securing terrorists.

...At this point there are and need to be efforts to unify the GOP - again there is plenty of time for a sitting senator to introduce legislation or are we to buy empty rhetoric?

...increase government spending and thus taxes - and wreck the economy with global warming garbage legislation,

...pursue appeasement policies in foreign affairs, seek outright amnesty in immigration - are you still taqlking about Dems or McLame?

...nominate left wing judges - becaues Alito wears his conservatism too proudly.

Robert
I won't argue with you on substance because you repeatedly demonstrate that you have none. however I copied this from your earlier post:

most of them, not all, but most of them are at least smarter then that. They always link it to some "viture" like "respect for the law" but having said that then they go making excuses for Scooter Libby..

Most of them are smarter THEN that? when you meant "than"
You invariably misspell words and often use improper syntax-- hardly to be expected from a naval officer- much less a test pilot--btw- what's happened to the test pilot claim?

Once I was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt-- but you've provided too much evidence that you're a wannabe- maybe a sim "instructor" ?


I'm A Squirrel
I prefer "maverick" but if Chaz wants to call us squirrels, then fine.

I agree with Beastie Boy. We need to rebuild from the ashes. I will NOT pander to McCain.

Anyone notice how drugged up McCain looked during his press conference denying his improprieties? The man is not healthy.

Danny:
No one is saying McCain is an "ultra liberal" like Obama. I just choose NOT to vote for McCain. I just don't like the man. I will strongly support all conservative congressional, state and local candidates but I will not be an enabler for the GOP.

phil
oh-- I'm another Phil- there are two posting -I'd better change ny nick

Bad to Worse
Mr Kapahulu,

I respect your conviction, but don't you think our country will go from bad to worse under Sen Obama?

And why would you want that?

crescen7
have you been noticing the slamming in primary voter numbers the Democrats have been giving the GOP? The Dems even in the primaries are turning out consistently in larger numbers, and even in 2004 "red" states, than the GOP (and this is with the crossovers for McVain that he won't get in the general in the GOP numbers).
The Democrats are focused on one thing...WINNING the Whitehouse; that might be why they are promoting candidates that encourage and excite their base instead of a candidate, like McVain, who alienates, or at least depresses, a great portion of the GOP base. The GOP "leadership" is too stupid to engineer an effective political party. It's really pathetic. 2006 brought us the benefits of the exposure of the last minute "sex scandal" that GOP leadership had known about for a year prior, but never dealt with in order to make moot any election year bonus for the DEMS (this was the "straw" in key races and cost the GOP the House majority). The GOP Senate re-election commmittee blows strategy so badly they loose the majority in 2006 (I mean they wrote off Burns in MT way before election day allowing his opponent to gain momentum and score points when MT, with a small population, was the easiest seat to defend! they were too incompetent to prevent Geo Allen from destroying himself in VA!). The GOP leaders are just not effective leaders, period. The Conservatives should seek their own way, as opposed to staying on a sinking ship which refuses to pay attention to iceberg warninigs, again and again.
The GOP has no money in this election cycle; gee I wonder if they even paid attention to all the party membership cancellations during McVain's summer dance with Teddy on scamnesty? I know they ignored the folks who sent in their party cards during the 2004 scamnesty debates! It's almost laughable. Dems moved leftward to their radical base, and the GOP followed them to the left...so now, "where IS the right?"

At least Obama...
Doesn't have on the forefront of his agenda...'Mexico First.' At least Obama doesn't have 'My Friend, swarmy, smiley Juan Hernadez...ex-cabinet member of V. Fox's, Open Borders, America is really Mexico' as his 'Latino Buddy.' At least Obama doesn't have as a co-sponsor, the owner of 'Univision.' McCain's BIG 'in-his-heart' agenda is to destroy the soverengty of America and blend our beloved country with the 3rd world corrupt gov't of HIS beloved Mexico.

And you really think vindictive, hateful McCain is ever going to nominate strict consitutionalist judges...those that would strike down his ego-invested, beloved McCain-Feingold?

I'll take a clear 'enemy' that the beleagured GOP in Congress can see more easily and perhaps grow some 'balls' and fight, than more of the dyfunctional, 'but he's our leader...we've got to rally' scenarios that we've had with Jorge Bush.

No way will I ever vote McCain.

If you think you're conservative...
yet you'll vote, even begrudgingly, for McCain, I submit there are only three possible explanations for you doing so.

Reason 1) You admire and embrace McCain's liberal leanings. Hel-l-l-o-o-o?? You're no conservative...you're a damn fool.

Reason 2) You're a hopelessly romantic dreamer and pathetically naive and gullible. You so badly want to believe what McCain is now telling you that you will disregard your better judgment and throw caution to the wind. Tragically, your trust is misplaced. You have foolishly ignored McCain's past betrayals and his dangerous liberal predisposition and instincts.

Reason 3) You're gutless and unprincipled, you'll meekly accept - without protest - that which you are told, and you're primarily motivated by fear. You mistakenly believe that your faithful, reliable and consistent selection every four years of those you believe to be the lesser-of-two-evils is a positive contribution and is making a difference. Let's face it, you're an ignorant, worthless and weak coward.

So, which of the three accurately explains your vote?

Conservatives - "Drop Dead"
Given the stated views of the three remaining, viable candidates, we WILL have a major crisis under any one of them. Furthermore, with the loons who run Congress helping, the crisis will be blown into a complete catastrophe.
The only reason the libs want McCainiac in the hot seat is to have someone to blame for the mess. The clear message from the NYT this week was: "McCain you are toast."
I plan to write-in the name of a real conservative like Ann Coulter for president. McCain has been unqualified for every position he has been handed starting with his stellar performance at Annapolis.
Sorry - I've held my nose when voting for the last time.

GOP missed the boat completely
Sounding the alarm is a good thing, not a bad one. You see something wrong you speak up. The critics of talk radio were too quick to jump on the bandwagon, along with the media in attacking talk radio. Now was a good time to silence talk radio, because talk radio questioned McCain's claim that he was the true Conservative. You don't get labeled a Maverick by being a true Conservative, and that is what talk radio pointed out to it's listeners. There are only a few in talk radio who have said, that they weren't going to vote for McCain. There are thousands of Conservatives who are going to vote for McCain. The problem is the critics of talk radio just wanted the Conservatives to roll over and not say a word at all about McCain period. Let's not forget how talk radio has support the GOP against the Democrats, when the GOP didn't even bother to defend themselves to the American people when the Democrats called for resignations. It has been talk radio who has taken on the critics of President Bush, the war, defended our troops, and the economy. What thanks has talk radio gotten from their critics. Shut up and vote for John McCain.

Don't count on Mccain.
Don’t count on McCain to cater to conservatives anymore then Bush has.
They both value praise more from the left then the right.
How did this happen to my party?

Not it
I am a big McCain supporter, but I don't know if the message from the party has bee to shutup.Just not be unfair with criticism at this stage when the party has a candidate.

This is clear when conservatives write that McCain will be no more conservative then George W Bush.

By this standard there has been no conservative presidents. Not even Ronald Reagan who also had heated battles with the right wing of his party including on Dick Cheney who later joined his staff.

But we should be critical of the people running just like they were critical of Reagan. Immigration is a big issue where the right wing made an impact on McCain. McCain wasn't pandering even though the Dems think that when he focused on much greater border and employment enforcement. He was responding because he thought that there was enough of a constituency to make it happen. On the other hand McCain will not do something he thinks is the wrong thing to do to get a vote. If that was what were were looking for we would have people like Romney as the nominee, which would of course been a horror in a general election when he bagan pandering to the middle when it becomes clear there are not enough conservative votes to win.

McCain needs the conservative vote to win, but he also needs at least 35% of the hispanic vote, 55% of the independent vote, and yes about 10% of the democrat vote (Think that is not possible? I think that McCain will get 70% of the jewish vote on Obama's Israel stance and Lieberman's backing.)

McCain is the only Republican candidate where that is even remotely possible. And that is why he is the nominee.

Robert
Never forget that there is nothing sacred about the two party system. Almost all other democracies have more than two. And, consider that almost all other democracies have a far higher turnout of voters than the US does. That should tell you something. In essence, in other countries, people vote for those that resemble their views. Then, those parties either represent them directly in their legislatures, form coaltions to govern or form coaltions to pass necessary legislation. In all cases, people can clearly see that their views are seriously considered and that they are represented.

I happen to believe that what you fear, is what we need in this country. The big tent philosophy no longer works well. If we had such a system, McCain would have to negotiate with the leadership of a conservative party in order to gain it's support. In the process, people would not be dealing with vague references and promises unsupported by guarantees.

Under the circumstances, what is transpiring today, in my view, is an essential evolution of our political process. Granted, it would split the GOP. However, the GOP would then do what McCain is trying to do, which is move to the middle, where it would have an honest message and could attract more of those moderates it so dearly wishes to have. That, in turn, would split the Democratic vote.

Like it or not, we now have three basic voter groups. Conservatives, Independents, and Liberals. However, we have disenfranchised the independents, many of which are simply disgusted with both parties, and, we are now disenfranchinsing the conservatives. And, also never forget that we have a fourth group - those who have stopped voting or only rarely vote. They also feel disenfranchised. If you want a system that discourages voter participation - then you certainly have it.

GOP
be careful what you wish for. You just might get it.

McCain does not have a chance of even getting close to POTUS if the conservative base does not get behind him.

This is a chess game being played by the RNC, with conservatives as the pawns. I refuse to play this game with them.

John McCain scares me…

Yes, John McCain scares me…He does not have the right temperament to be President or even a Senator representing the Republican Party. It could be the “Manchurian Candidate” syndrome that scares me the most or the fact he is a RINO (yes a RINO); probably it’s a combination of all of the above. Just look at his past (public and private). As a Senator, what has he accomplished for the Republican Party or the country?

If John McCain is the only Republican who can beat the Democrats in 2008, as many are now saying; the Republicans and America are in deep trouble. The Democrats and MSM are just thrilled that McCain just might end up with the Republican Nomination. They can’t lose…even if he wins.

Both Dole and McCain are war heroes who are genuine patriots; however, the political system they both find themselves in is surely not patriotic. It has become a corrupted, self-serving, etc., etc. unpatriotic system that must be changed/reformed. Else, America will continue its slow and very painful decline into oblivion.

Hope for the best, prepare for the worst…I urge you to V-O-T-E…else you have no right to complain!

My State’s primary elections are not until April. A lot can happen between now and then. But whatever happens I will not, repeat NOT, vote for John McCain. Come November I will not like it, I hate doing it again; but I maybe forced to vote for McCain, because he will be the lesser of the “evils” to choose from. This seems to be what our political system has come too…voting for the lesser of two evils…does not make it right or good for America! May God Continue to Bless Her! And God Bless the Troops!!!

PS – And yes, I am a Vietnam Vet


None of the Above
If the best the two party system can come with is McCain or Hilary/Obama, if a third party candidate can do no more than "steal" votes, then why vote at all. There is no such thing as free and fail elections in the US. The parties decide who is running, just as the Party decided in the old USSR, just as the party decided in Hussein's Iraq.

The modern American needs a government he can rely on to save him from his mistakes. He needs a government to pay for his health care when he doesn't plan ahead for his own health care. He needs a government to pull his fanny out of the fire when he is in danger of defaulting on a high risk mortgage. He needs a government to take care of his wife and kids when he abandons them to "find himself". America can't use real conservatives in its government any more. We are a dying breed, we conservatives. Dinosaurs headed for the fossil pits of time.

Our only hope is to teach our own children our principles, to save them from the liberal public school system which would claim them for its own.

Beware What You Wish For
"As with small children, many of the entrenched, beholden, or power-hungry hierarchy of the Republican party, simply wish conservatives could be seen, but never heard."

Keep it up guys, and you just might get your wish come November, when McCain loses in a landslide to Obama because conservatives took your advice and left you on your own in the general election. Because you can't ask us to keep our mouths shut and still expect us to support you when it matters.

McCain
I am questioning whether you are even smart enough to be POTUS.

If you were, you would know that the party is comprised of 30% conservatives and that you need them to get elected.

You had better start pandering and quick because you don't have enough to offer the left and there aren't enough moderates or undecideds to save you.

I don't know how much your paying your campaign manager bit I know it is too much.

I'll vote for McCain
I've always voted and this election will be no different. And I'll vote for the least liberal, which is McCain. That's all the support he or the GOP will get from me unlike past elections. If he wins or looses it's not going to make a whole lot of difference since he's been pandering to the left for so long we can't believe what he tells us now...

GOP to conservatives, "Drop Dead"
Conservatives to GOP, "You first!"

Another lesser of two evils, Neal?
Is this what we will continue to do, always hoping for the different result that never has and never will come to pass?

Isn't it time to realize that the two parties, in conjunction with the MSM, have hijacked the election process? Control remains in the hands of elites who are squandering our resources, weakening our military, selling out our sovereignty, and mortgaging our future. Every time we elect another elite, we strengthen the hold that the two parties have on power, and we get more big government, less personal freedom, and watch the internationalists gain even more influence.

If you want to see how the elites have scammed the American people, you need to visit my website, JOEOLIVAFORPRESIDENT.ORG. Exactly when are we going to get enough courage to reclaim the birthright that the elites have stolen from us? If we won't do it now, then we never will. The time has come, either we rise up and reclaim what is rightfully ours, or hand over what is left to the elites! It's time for action! Thanks, Joe

Funny. I am watching MSNBC, and
"Breaking News" just interrupted the show, regarding an indictment of Arizona Congressman Rick Renzi & illegal "land deals".

Why did I instinctively know this guy was a republican? (perhaps it was the "Arizona" congressman reference).

The fact is, cons: 17 republican members of the Senate are resigning this year, leaving many republican seats vulnerable. There are also a handful (including Larry Craig & that Alaska guy - Ted Stevens) that are under indictment & fighting ethics charges. This Renzi guy is a House member & you guys are having similar problems there.

I can unequivically state (as of today anyway) that the dems will pick up seats in the Senate & at the very least, maintain a solid majority in the House were the elections held today. You guys had BETTER win the presidency or we liberals will find ourselves running the entire show. Food for thought.

Conservative Cry Babies
I am getting very tired of all the crying and whining by my fellow conservatives. This is what liberals do when they don't get there way. This argument is getting very long in the tooth. I am a Romney supporter, contributed to his campaign, and still believe he was by far the most qualified candidate for President I have seen in sixteen years. Unfortunately, most conservatives didn't recognize this until it was too late. So hear we are, with what in my mind is a very easy choice to make, Obama or McCain (I leave out Hillary because I think she is done). McCain may not be our first , second, or even third choice, but an Obama presidency would be a disaster for this country. With a democrat controlled congress, Obama would have the ability to push through the most liberal social, fiscal, and foreign policy initiatives the likes of which we have never seen. Don't be fooled into thinking the damage done can be corrected by sitting this election out and hoping for a more "acceptable" Republican candidate four years from now. There is a reason why Reagan never spoke ill of his fellow Republicans, because he recognized that the liberal alternative was unacceptable.

Got this from a blog
************** THE SETUP ***************.

I'm telling you this election has been a setup from the start.
Listen, the Dems.used reverse psychology, they got the word out early in the race that they do not want to go against McCain
the media repeated it over and over until the REP. voters believed it. GOPbigwigs also.
McCain is the very one they wanted to go against all along.
Also seen on a DEM. blog about 2wks ago where they do not want to go up against Huckabee.
After reading these blogs made me realize they where up to something.
Someone posted something similar to this yesterday, he may have read the someone as I did.
here's how it worked .

When McCain was low in the polls DEM. strategists used the media to say McCain would be the toughest for them to go against.
media played it over and over, REP. voters believed this and the McCain polls numbers shot up.
NY Times must have been in on this also, Why else would you endorse someone and then hang them as soon as they looked like a lock on
the REP. side.
Also remember McCain's campaign manager from 2000 is now on the DEM. side.
Sounds like someone is playing Big Brother House tactics with our election process, I wonder if Will & Boogie is working with them.
To all the GOP bigwigs, you have been played, if you do not believe me go look at those DEM. blogs, The writing is on the wall guys. They do not want to go against Mike Huckabee

Please someone warn the GOP befor its to late.


Does the GOP Want To Survive?


It's really up to Little Johnny. If he wants our votes, he has to earn them.

He said he heard us after the last amnesty fight. He heard two things right. We want the border secured and we don't trust them. There apparently was alot he didn't hear.

He hired Juan Hernandez, who represents foreign nationals illegally in our country as his hispanic outreach, instead of reaching out to someone from "You Don't Speak For Me" a group of citizens of hispanic descent who oppose illegal aliens.

He said a couple of weeks ago he would sign McCain/Kennedy if it were put on his desk.


If he wants my vote, there are a couple of things he could do.
1. Publicly dismiss and disavow Juan Hernandez and the Reconquista for which he stands.
2. Apologize for conspiring in secret with La Raza and Ted Kennedy and trying to jam amnesty down our throats.
3. Pledge to veto ANY amnesty bill.
4. Pledge to enforce the laws, including deportation, which is the penalty for illegal aliens.

It's up to Sen. McCain, he can represent the interests of American citizens and uphold the rule of law or he can continue to court the favor of liberals and illegal aliens.

Got this from a blog
It must be a Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy!

Hope
Everyone comes to their senses before November.

party within a party
"Never forget that there is nothing sacred about the two party system. Almost all other democracies have more than two."

That's true, but we used to have a workaround which made the US system work. The solution was for conservatives to be a party within a party. If liberal Republicans started working with Democrats too frequently and ignoring liberal Republicans, conservatives fought back by refusing to vote for liberal Republican candidates, withholding money from the party, etc.

This has the same effect as a party withdrawing from a coalition and bringing down the government in a parliamentary democracy.

That is why I am amazed to see people so shocked about conservatives threatening to not vote for McCain. It is simple political reality, that groups need to use their votes or be ignored.

It seems common sense to me that if conservatives keep giving their votes and money to liberal Republican candidates, then the liberal Republicans will continue using Democratic votes to steal the nominations. That means conservatives will get nothing, but will simply be ignored.

Any party in a parlimentary democracy who wasn't willing to break out of the coalition and bring down the government would simply be ignored, and it would be their own fault.

Hey Will,
When Reps get in trouble, we get rid of them. When Dems get in trouble you libs circle the wagons and give them key committee appointments.

Re: Virginia Patriot 11:01 AM
I'm not a doctor, but, I'm pronouncing the GOP dead. You seem intelligent, so, I'm puzzled why you will allow McCain to "persuade" you with sweet talk.

FOT (Friend of Teddy)
Voting for RINO's is like hitting yourself in the head with a hammer, it feels good when you stop.

http://gopteaparty.com/

Take the pledge.

This says it all
"The thought of voting for Clinton or Obama makes me nauseous. We are a nation at war with Islamists who mean to exterminate us. To vote for Clinton or Obama is to vote for the authority to wave the flag of appeasement or surrender. I have no intention of voting for the next Neville Chamberlain. "

This part sums up the whole thing for me. McCain isn't Obama or Clinton when it comes to the war on terror but his idea that we shouldn't waterboard prisoners for information is something I can't deal with. Why should we have to play fair when our enemies don't play by the rules?

Conservatives are to the GOP
as the NAACP is to the Democrats.

A bloc to which hollow promises are made at election time, and who are ignored the rest of the time and treated like mushrooms.

Keep 'em in the dark and cover them with bulls**t.


will
You knew he was a Republican because he was indicted unlike Land Deal Reid.

Funny thing about libs their moral outrage only kicks in when it involves Republicans.

Robert has no comprhension
ROBERT said: "The right wing which is here a lot is perfectly happy to live in some Jack B world...they are not fighting in it, dying in it or paying for it. But the vast majority of Americans are not.

On Jan 20, 2009 we as a nation want to all take a collective shower, pull back the curtians and 'find another way'".

Richard says: "Robert, go back to your bong pipe and stop trying to force reality into your hallucinations!"


Proud to be a Squirrel
Not a bad mascot. Can run high wires with ease. Spends most of its time foraging for the coming winter and being prepared. Pretty smart for rodents. Occasionally, one gets zapped by a transformer or run over by the bus.

With McCain at the wheel, the republican bus will probably crash and burn due to his insistence on trying to run over all the squirrels on the road to the white house. I bet he doesn't even make it past the McDonalds in St Louis. He probably needs to be tested to see if he can still drive.

You folks go right ahead and get aboard though. It does seem safer than the other bus. Myself, I am walking. The fee to ride is way too high.

acceptreality
Right on !!!Republicans "take out their trash".
The Democrats cover theirs over,sprinkle some talc or perfume on it,even make a shrine of it,but it would take a good layer of lime to hide the stench.

sheepdog
While I agree with you about the waterboarding what incenses me is closing GITMO and bringing them here on American soil, giving them Constitutional rights and civil trials all paid for by our tax dollars. I am sure the trial lawyers love that get rich quick scheme.

Somebody needs to throw some ice water on McCain and wake him up!

Conservatives and party
We Conservatives never had a party. The Republican party only offered a spot under their tent. Regan convinced us the party was conservative. It's is not and never has been. Since it's inception there has been at least two groups under the tent. The strong group has always been big business, money if you will. The smaller weaker group has been the Conservative group "Country, Family, Constitutional Freedoms and Religion. Plus the many other things that used to make up the US culture. Every time we help put a Republican in the white house, we get the shaft. Money wins over morals and/or character any day. We feel betrayed and we should not feel that way. Observation over many years makes it obvious how the party works.

Actually big money controls the top of both parties. The libs who are reveling in the destruction of the US culture are getting what they want, even as we have been turned into a service economy and manufacturing has been offshored.

How many laws can you remember, that have been rolled back once the opposing party gains power?
I you watch congress and the opposing party yelling and fighting tooth and nail to prevent a law from being passed. Well it passes and when that party comes into power, they quietly and slyly use the law they so vehemently opposed.

Never a rollback, which indicated to me it's the same group. George Soros or his ilk.

A third party would be a great way to fight. The only way to start a third party would be tons of money and the ability to brainwash the masses. There are only two emotions one can use. Fear and Greed, and the two major parties have a lock on both.

I'm voting for local, state and national candidates of character, if any can be found. We need enough Republicans in congress to stymie the worst of the excesses. Finding a Republican, the moneyed variety, with a backbone or morals is almost the same odds as getting hit by a meteor.

Voting against rather than for
I'm through doing that. Conservatives are the blacks of the Republican Party.

George 41 crippled the Republican Party and George 43 delivered the head shot.

How did we get here? Regardless of party or nominee, we will be asked to go out and vote a disaster for our country. No other choice. Regardless of winner, we will look back on Jimmy Carter with nostalgia. In fact, I predict that that black-hearted little man will lose his status as worst president in history.

Let it go...
Sometimes you have to crash before picking up the pieces and moving on. Let McCain take the Republican Party over the cliff, with all his neocon buddies on board. Obama is a fruitcake, but at least he doesn't appear to be a warmonger.

Then we can have a realignment, with those of us who support the Constitution and the vision of the Founders (liberty at home, non-interventionism abroad) on one side, and all the rotten big-government freaks from Obama to Clinton to McCain to Dubya on the other. THEY are the panderers.

Once the message is clear and unequivocal, it can succeed. Otherwise, we'd still be part of the British Empire.

There's Nothing In McCain's History
to indicate that he is conservative. If anything, he's been screaming that he is a liberal. Only a liberal would favor amnesty for illegal aliens, etc., ad nauseum.

I believe it is better for conservatives not to enable the RINOs any longer. Conservatives need to focus on congressional, state and local elections.

McCain's plan is to get "moderates" and Democrats to vote for him. Conservatives are not in his plan. He does not want and does not think he needs our votes.

Better McCain or Obama
I hear ya, I really do hear ya, but what damage will a President Obama do? Jimmy Carter was president almost 30 years ago and we have never regained what we lost in those 4 long years.

I'm upset about illegal immigration. Who will give away more to illegals -- McCain or Obama?

McCain is weak on economics. Obama studies economics at the Marx-Lenin Institute. Which one will screw up the economy more?

Boycott McCain at your own peril. We can elect McCain and still work to rebuild the party.

Just A Thought
Maybe if Obama gets elected, we wouldn't have to deal with the poverty pimps any longer. We could finally acknowledge that blacks and other "minorities" do not need affirmative action since one of theirs is President. No more mau-mauing. It would be worth it.

Precious Moments
You have to admit, that for us liberals, the circular firing squad known as the Republican Party is amusing.

But, because I am interested in what is best for the country, I will let you in on a secret. This morning Brent Bozell, another TH dweller, was on C-Span. One of the callers was a middle of the road Republican completely disenchanted with the right wing. The outcome of the Republican primary process shows this woman is in the majority. The conservatives whining here are ignoring the reality: McCain is the overwhelming choice of Republicans: conservatives are NOT.

Conservatives are becoming more and more isolated and ineffectual. But why? If they have such a great program, why is it being rejected by not only all the left, but the majority of the right as well? WHine all you want, but not asking why is just stupid.

Wrongbert
Rob - conservatives don't hate brown people. Dem/libs are the ones who want to leave the rest of the world, which is mostly brown, hanging. You phonies are the ones who embrace dictators who kill brown people. So shut up about that. You are the ones who are patronizing to brown people. You don't take them seriously. Stick to speaking about things you know about whatever that is.

Absolute Bullsh*t!!
"We can elect McCain and still work to rebuild the party." Horsesh*t!!

If the patient is dying, you don't feed him more poison before trying to save his life.

Defeat McCain!!

Here's the thing, Jack
This is a constant cycle of the GOP, as HongKongCharlie pointed out. The GOP has, actually, always functioned better as an out-of-power opposition party, and rarely well as a majority power. Reagan and the first few years of the Gingrich Revolution were the exceptions.

However, what the GOP constantly forgets is that they can't WIN without the support of the conservatives. It's the conservatives who volunteer the time and money that make success at all achievable.

Are any of those "moderates" or "independants" going to contribute money, man phone trees, walk precincts, attend rallies, or do any of the other grunt work neccessary to win?

Hell no.

In an era when the outcome of the presidential election is determined by a few thousand votes in a few pricincts in a couple of states, the GOP nominee loses -- flat out -- without the support of conservatives.

Conservative to GOP: Drop Deader
This purposeful alienation of a MUST HAVE constituency by the GOP is calculated self destruction.

McCain is simply the designated loser, and Obama will be our next POTUS by a landslide. (no matter how conservatives vote)

I will vote for the only non-CFR pony in the race.

In 2000
I could have voted for McCain even though he wasn't my first choice. He was conservative enough to be able to vote for. In the eight years since, he has taken himself out of the picture with his own legislation and the speeches he has given. Being a pro-life "hawk" isn't enough.

I'll not vote for a liberal, whether it's McCain or Obama. My votes will go to conservative local candidates and I'll end up writing in Ben Stein or Fred Thompson or something.

Brian R
I agree with all that. In a weird way, it would be better for America if McCain won, because it would show that conservatives matter a lot less than they think they do. But that isn't my point. Even if what you say is true, it doesn't explain WHY conservatives find themselves increasingly isolated, why all their money, energy, manpower, and votes aren't making a difference in the Republican party right now.

Name for Conservatives
There has been a number of posts that desire a new name for Conservatives. A name that we might consider is "Constitutionalist". The Constitution Party platform supports most of what we support. If you have the time please visit http//constitutionparty.com and read the platform.

Conservatives replaced by Democrats
"McCain's plan is to get "moderates" and Democrats to vote for him. Conservatives are not in his plan. He does not want and does not think he needs our votes. "

Exactly. Many of the neo-cons have made clear that they intend to use McCain to realign the party, "replacing" conservatives with "moderate" Democrats.

There are columns and even books written about the "new Republican Party" and conservatism the neo-cons want to build. The neo-cons are basically Democrats who became Republicans solely because they want to aggressively wage war. So their neo-conservatism means pro-war plus Democratic about everything else. Some of them have said openly that pro-life is a losing issue which we need to change, that we need big government programs fight things like obesity, etc.

McCain
If he becomes president,then amnesty is a sure thing.Most of the pubbies in the house and senate will not buck their pres.However if Obama is pres,they will be under pressure from cons to try and block him.

Jack, we're not "increasingly isolated"
This war over dogma isn't anything new; it's been going on since the Rockefeller ere; "country-club" Republicans v. conservatism has pretty much always been the order of the day.

It's the reason Bush 1 lost his re-election bid: reneging on his "read my lips, no new taxes" pledge, among other problems.

Conservatism is actually the true heart of the American electorate: witness the landslides of Reagan, Bush 1's landslide first election on Reagan's coattails and loss when he ran as himself, and the landslides of the Gingrich Revolution in 1994 and 1996.

The race is only close when the GOP reverts to it's inherent "Rockefellerism".

That's why this constant pandering of the GOP to some mythical and non-existent "uncommitted independant" demographic is such a puzzler; they insist on making the same strategic error time after time after time.

Einstein's definition of insanity: repeating the same action while expecting a different result.

the conscience of america?
Mr. D. MacKinnon writes:

"If some in the party succeed in quashing the conservative voice, then they will have silenced the conscience of America. Surely, John McCain will stand shoulder to shoulder with conservatives to prevent such an outcome."

Oh really?, thats a pretty funny yet revealing line about conservatives. I really do believe that conservatives beleive that about themselves, that they are the "guiding light and consciense of america." It's typical of their
conceit and dissmisal of people that dont think like they do and it's why the more moderates are taking over the Republican Party and telling the cons to "drop dead".

They are tired of being pushed around by right wing zealots when every political move and they make and politicians running for office have to passed the con "litmus test".

They also know that the conservative moment/coalition as conservative hero R. Raygun,
put together of social and fiscal conservatives is practically dead and a new order is needed to appeal to more moderates and independents, which is why a person such as Sen. McCain is about to clinch the Repub nomination for potus.

conservatives the conscience of america? I think not. they are becoming more marignalized every day with outdated dogma in a modern world.
thats why the repub party is telling them as the author says to: DROP DEAD!!

PS, Jack
It's also why the GOP is known as The Stupid Party.

BrianR
Brian

The first part of what you say and the last part don't match, and that disjunciton is my point. If conservatism were the heart, then how could it be the case that Democrats are drawing hoards of new voters and McCain has dominated teh Republican primary. Even you realize it doesn't make any sense! You say as much.

But still, no one bothers to ask why. The insanity of which you speak is shown in the way conseratives refuse to evaluate what they say and how they say it, preferring to repeat the same talking points over and over again, even though the electorate isn't buying it.

For Anyone Who Wants To Know Why
Left Angle has nailed it.

that sinking feeling
BrianR has pointed out what we've feared for a long time. The GOP, when they're half-way conservative, just can't handle success. They have an inferiority complex. That's why we call them "The Stupid Party".

Jack
writes, "Conservatives are becoming more and more isolated and ineffectual. But why? If they have such a great program, why is it being rejected by not only all the left, but the majority of the right as well? WHine all you want, but not asking why is just stupid."

Short answer. The conservatives do not have a program per se. What we offer is the elimination of programs and that is why we are marginalized. Most of the people, like you, want the government to do more and more for them. They are always looking for the guy or gal with the program that is going to end poverty, restore our alleged reputation etc. etc.

In short, the sheep, like you Jack, fall victim to every flim flam con artist that ever ran for office. Politicians buy votes pure and simple and you and your kind are eager sellers. You are the majority. We fear you will spend the country into bankruptcy. Your kind thinks that is ok. The nation can just file a chapter 7 and start over. It may work that way for an individual but, not for the whole. You think you are Robin Hood. You are a common criminal like most of the politicians you vote for. It is not ok to take the fruits of others' labor because you think the cause is just.

Envy is one of the most pernicious of sins. It is responsible for most of the evil in the world and you and most of the american public have bought into it because the media shows you what others have and tells you that you should have it also. Why should the rich drive Lexus while we drive twenty year old Chevrolets? You fool yourself into believing they got their riches unjustly, perhaps some did, and therefore it is just to take from them and spend it on some government program touted to help the needy. It is not right. The needy are still needy no matter how much we spend.

Jack, you've confused
what I wrote. Conservatism is the heart OF THE COUNTRY AND ELECTORATE, which is very different from the Rockefeller elites of the GOP.

What I wrote doesn't conflict at all. I'm very clear on that point, and the distinction.


Moderate Mark
Well, yes, that's exactly my point.

Moderates and independants AREN'T going to "work with" the party.

That's why it will LOSE.


BrainR
Will you EVER react to what I actually write? Seriously, discussing importnat things get hard when you wan't do that. I did not say that conservatism is the heart to of the Republican Party. I was agreeing with you.

But please address the question: it is not rhetorical in nature. If conservatives have it so obviously right, then why are they being rejected by more than 3/4 of the country?

Let history tell the tale
Reagan, two MASSIVE landslide victories

Bush 1, a landslide as "Reagan II", a loser as himself (RINO)

Dole (the "Great Compromiser") - loser

Clinton, 2 victories with pluralities, NOT majorities

1994 Contract With America, sweeping GOP victory in the House

1996 - Gingrich Revolution continues, takes the Senate. GOP has control of Congress for the first time in almost 50 years.

It also continually loses its margins as it becomes ever more liberal, corrupt, and Dem-Lite, until losing BOTH houses in one election in 2006.

Bush 2 squeekes out two narrow wins over incredibly incompetent opponents, both of whom absolutely blow the gun issue. Clinton himself credits Gore's loss to gun owners.

Bush's second term is a disaster, POing conservatives no end and thereby finalizing his legacy as a RINO, and setting the stage for GOP defeat as conservatives have finally suffered the straw that broke the camel's back.


PS, Jack
You: "If conservatives have it so obviously right, then why are they being rejected by more than 3/4 of the country?"

Do you just make statistics up, or what?

Anyway, the history tells the tale.

LOL, Mod Mark
Uh, dude, who took both houses of Congress in 2006? The GOP?


That IS the topic here, in case you missed it.

BrianR
Don't fight it: reality is your friend.

50% of the nation leans to the Democrats. Do you have a problem with that?

That leaves 50%. Right?

If the title of this thread is accurate, then the majority of that 50% are rejecting conservatives. That means at least 76% of America is rejecting you.

I repeat: If conservatives have it so obviously right, then why are they being rejected by more than 3/4 of the country?

@ Doc W:
Yes, we can!

grass roots vote for conservatives
IF McCain is president the only way to keep the conservative ideals is to have a veto proof congress, that is both houses.
We must vote for conservative congressmen and senators.

We must vote for conservatives at the city, county, state level. This is were the federal constituents come from. We must start building the conservative base now. They will be the leaders in 20 to 30 years.
We must put personality aside and vote for principals.
We voted for Reagan because he had principals and did not waver. McCain needs to be reminded of this. If he betrays the conservative standards he will be a one term president, just like Bush senior.

@ Jack
It is the neocons that Americans are rejecting, not conservatism per se. Recall that Reagan was elected in a landslide.

There is a reason why the neocons are being rejected now. The neocons are actually big government leftists who found a niche in the conservative movement by being pro-military hawks. Neoconservatism was born of The Left in the 60s as a reaction to the worldwide failures of Communism and socialism and to the repulsive sight of New Left hippies. The neocons dropped the methods of The New Left, but not their basic big government premises. They get very annoyed when the notion of limited government is brought up.

The big government agenda over the past seven years has resulted in the disasters we see today, and Americans know something is wrong, even if they can't always put their finger on the exact cause. That is why they are "voting for change." But if Americans were offered a strong, principled small government conservative leader, they would vote for him.

Sorry, Jack
The history timeline I wrote proves you, and the theory, completely wrong.

Polls gave us a Dewey Presidency, and even on election night it was a Kerry victory over Bush.


Agnew actually had it right in talking about a "Silent Majority". This country is by and large conservative, but most people aren't political junkies like us. They don't spend months of their time bothering with this stuff. Many don't even bother voting in primaries, even if they are registered with a party.

But come Election Day, they know what they believe in, and if neither candidate supports their beliefs, they simply stay away.

That's particularly true for conservatives. Conervative philosophy encompasses an individualist belief, unlike liberals/Dems who are a groupthink crowd. Dealing with conservatives is always akin to herding cats.


brainR
If what you say is true, then what is the point of this column?




It's a Zoo out there!
Between Rinos and Squirrels and God knows what other fauna or flora lurks out there--we've got a political zoo out there.

Jack, Left Angle is left indeed,
embracing “the modern world,” wanting to be rid of “right wing zealots” (sounds like an ode to relativism to me: whatever - if it feels good, do it). Hitchhiker nailed it (12:22).

Conservative ideas have more to do with individual liberty than with a big-government nanny state, which is one or two steps away from socialism, as we are now. If many people are primarily concerned with bread and circuses (see BrianR’s recent post), aka stuffing their appetites, they will seek satiation more than freedom. A random look at television these days should be enough to show you this.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are rights endowed by our Creator. Governments are instituted to protect them, not take them away. No, I am not talking about a “right” to abortion. It is not in the Constitution. I am not talking about a “right” to spend my tax dollars to teach a kid how to put a condom on a banana. It is not a right. As Walter Williams famously describes it, much of taxation is legalized theft. The rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are to be protected, not diluted by means of corruption and the redistribution of wealth, taking a citizen’s money under threat of prosecution to pay for a bridge to nowhere or someone else’s medical bill. We the people can and do voluntarily give, in great abundance, to numerous charities and needy people.

One other thing should be mentioned. One of the reasons for the perceived “marginalization” of conservatives and conservative ideas is the persistent drumbeat by many on the left in media, academia, and government for the expansion of government power to redistribute tax dollars for bread and circuses, and for the silencing of anyone who objects. You want to talk about moral superiority, but you don’t talk about moral standards. Many on the left get hysterical when someone says something is wrong.

For the Foundation (1 Cor. 3:11) of the Founders ><>

MacKinnon's outrage is justified
The complacent pickpockets in the GOP have not learned the principle that in a contest between pickpockets and murderers, the murderers will win.

Most people will flock to "Yes, we can!" when their alternative is "Yes, kind of, sort of." The GOP will face this reality in November. Perhaps they should have stuck with "No, we shouldn't."

On a related note
Obama is a great example of the pop culture’s being drawn to symbolism over substance. People who for one reason or another appear to enjoy having their ears tickled while big nanny’s hands are reaching into their pockets.

And I would rather be a zealot who seeks to protect innocent human life than a modernist who advocates their destruction (Clinton, Obama). Many on the left seek to redefine the rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. They are not contradictory.

For the Foundation (1 Cor. 3:11) of the Founders ><>

Jack, the point of this
column is to tell the GOP that they keep repeating the same stupid mistake time after time after time, and refuse to learn anything from their idiocy.

Which is how they've earned their nickname as The Stupid Party.

To let them know that they can't count on conservatives to be blind, cheerleading rah-rah drones.

It simply ain't gonna happen.

That they should prepare themselves for defeat, and a long time as a minority party until they come to their senses.

That they were warned long, loud and often that the conservative base was absolutely fed up, especially after Bush's shenanigans, and that the only way they had a chance of success was to skip the RINOs, and nominate a conservative.

This has been going on since RINO Rudy was the presumptive nominee. They didn't listen.

And when they lose in November, they'll have no one to blame but themselves.

clue
You have it all wrong. Republicans aren't telling conservatives to shut up. We are telling the radical right to shut up. These lunatics are the most hated people in this nation, and much of that hatred is spread liberally over all conservatives.

You are not a conservative when you eat your own over ideological purtiy ... you're a radical right wing fool. You are a radical right wing lunatic when you turn Reagan's big tent party into an ideological burka. Republicans couldn't elect a dogcatcher before the Reagan democrats joined the party. Now Rush and his radio whores are telling the majority of the party that they don't belong. It's insanity pure and simple

The Rushites and the Coulterquist have done for the word conservative what a bunch of socialist fools have done for the word liberal. Today both are considered dirty words by the majority of Americans. We need to reclaim the term conservative and admit that the liberals had Rush and clowns perfectly pegged as the radical right.

How does it feel?
Really, Doug--how does it feel to have such bowel-loosening fear of "the terrorists" every single day? It certainly is a shame that two of the people you'd refuse to vote for want to cut away from the worst distraction since the Sicilian Expedition in the 5th century BC to actually resume targeting them.

Congratulations on buying the rhetoric.

Hahahaha, Thomas
Spoken like a true RINO.

Well done.

Thomas' ideological menu conundrum
Thomas, aren't you doing what you ascribe to "lunatics," "eat[ing] your own over ideological purity"? Or is it impurity?

For the Foundation (1 Cor. 3:11) of the Founders ><>

Rino
Hahahaha, Thomas
Spoken like a true RINO.

>>>>

Yeah, republicans are Rinos and the Rushites and the Coulterquist are conservatives. You ideological purist aren't conservatives! Your the lunatics that turned conservative into a dirty word, and the republican party into a permantent minority party, and all in the name of purity. You freakin' lunatic!

Even funnier, Thomas
I happen to call them "principles", which is something you neo-cons seem to be totally unfamiliar with.

I live in California, which means I get to see on a daily basis where YOUR path leads:

A Governator who calls himself a Republican but governs like the leftist Kennedy-clanner he really is.

A state GOP that kowtows to the Dems, and conspires with them on issues like reapportionment to simply secure their own seats, in a permanent minority status.

Thanks, but no thanks; not interested in seeing that happen to the nation as a whole. Not with MY vote, anyway.


Why not try Reagan conservatism?
ModMark: "For myself, I fail to see any realistic solutions coming from the conservatives in the modern world."

Actually, as a conservative, I can agree with that. The reason is that real conservatives are not in control, so conservative solutions can't be tried or even offered.

What we have instead is the neo-con's economic pacifism & do-nothingism instead of real Reagan economic conservatism.

President Reagan was action-oriented and got things done. He believed that when there was a problem it was because someone, usually the government, was interfering with the market.

So unlike today's pseudo-conservatives, Reagan took action. A good example was when President Reagan removed government control of oil prices. Everyone said the world would end, and that prices would go sky high & make inflation worse.

Prices did spike during the first weeks, but came under control through the free market and the oil crisis was solved.

We face the same basic situation today with the governments of China and India creating high oil prices and an artificial shortage of oil by subsidizing oil prices. Yet the Bush administration (and liberals) would never dream of actually DOING anything about it.

Brian R
Thanks.

Personally I espouse some radical ideas:

- innocent, unborn and partially born human life is sacrosanct.

- our national borders are sacrosanct and should be inviolate.

- that if as commander in chief, you are going to ask and expect your troops to hazard all they hold dear, the very least you can do is to put the welfare of our citizenry and the the sovereignty of our nation at the top of your list of priorities.

- that government governs best which governs least.

- that from each according to his abilities to each according to his means should not be the impetus behind the graduated income tax, which thing funds the self-perpetuating wasteland of our social welfare system.

I looked at your blog and you are precisely correct. If Edward Gibbon were alive, the Decline and Fall of the Imperial United States would be an addendum to his immortal classic.

As for our current conservative dilemma, lay the blame to the money behind McCain - Feingold and the RINO who attached his name to it, as has been pointed out, but needs to be drummed home.

Sarkozy made a prescient statement regarding immigration, paraphrased, immigrants should be selected not endured.

The greatest and most generous nation on earth will be neither if we continue on our present course. The world will lament the day.

Why bother with details
when ranting "lunatic" is easier?

You could say what kind of "ideological purity" you have a problem with, and why, Thomas. You poked at Rush and Ann Coulter, but didn't say anything specific. You accused the "radical right," which apparently equates to "insane" to you, of turning Reagan's party "into an ideological burka" but did not say anything about the 'what' or the 'how.'

For the Foundation (1 Cor. 3:11) of the Founders ><>

John McCain=do-nothing neo-conservatism
McCain is an example of a do-nothing neo-con, and the proof was how clueless he was in Michigan when voters asked him to save their jobs. Since McCain is a liberal / neo-con, he had no clue how to keep jobs in the US. A real Reagan conservative would respond with his plan.

Thanks, marine
for actually taking the time to read that blog essay. I'm actually rather proud of it.

I agree with every single word you just wrote. That Sarkozy comment is precisely right.


South Park Conservatives >= Wing Nuts?
Thomas, I agree with you. Don't listen to these judgmental types who can't debate any issue without resorting to ad hominem attacks such as calling people they don't know the evil N word (Neocon).

Based on the primary voters and the number of delegates John McCain has currently racked up, I'd say there are a lot more South Park Conservatives out there than any other kind. I personally find Ann Coulter the most disturbed human being in today's media with the possible exception of Keith Olberman.

If these guys want to become as irrelevant as Ron Paul, then fine - let them not vote. Nobody cares. If they'd all gotten behind their boy Romney from the get-go instead of standing around with their thumbs up, they'd have the nominee they wanted today. Guess what - they have no one to blame but themselves. And this whole Poor Us victim mentality is really unattractive. Whatever happened to the sexy Republican Alphas? That's the core value I miss the most. This whiny Beta "those nasty Establishment types told me to drop dead" tactic makes Right Wing Conservatives sound like a bunch of losers. Maybe the Right Wing will find a way to man up again. In the meantime there's just no joy in GOP-land.

I ask again, Thomas
If we're not conservatives, why does the Press and the RNC think McCain has to court "conservatives"?

Or, why are many Republicans like yourself urging him not to "pander" to "conservatives"? I'm confused.

Whatever I am it is not a RINO.

Something Wicked This Way Comes
Jeff, you write "Obama is a great example of the pop culture’s being drawn to symbolism over substance." I think it's far more serious than that. I already have a really, really bad-juju feeling about this based on the following:

1) The Trinity United Church of Christ's anti-Semitic Reverend Jeremiah White and his eery Black Value System.

2) Michelle Obama's UCLA Speech claiming that her husband will heal our souls (which are broken, don't you know), bring heaven on earth, and change forever the way we live. Forget whether she's never been proud of her country prior to now, the UCLA speech is the real kicker. Look into it.

3) The impassioned fainting, crying, and sheer size of the crowds at his rallies. The only thing missing is the mosh pit. This is not a political campaign, it's a social movement reminiscent of Moscow in 1917, Berlin in 1939, Cuba in 1956, and so on.

4) Obama's application of 4 covert black ops mass hypnosis techniques in each victory speech: Neuro-Linguistic Programming, Social Engineering, Seduction and Persuasion. Look into that, too.

5) Mainstream media's outright admission that they hold a bias toward Obama's candidacy and open distribution of Obama propaganda.

Before we split the GOP into an impotent non-entity sucked dry of its bodily fluids? (h/t to Dr. Strangelove!), maybe we should start paying a little more attention to Obama's success than McCain failures, because something wicked this way comes while we're all distracted and looking the other way.

BrianR
If The McAmnesty McMidget thinks The NYT dissed him, Election Day will give him a Cerebral Hemorrhage.

Maverick on McCain
Isn't it funny that it is acceptable for McCain to be a maverick (i.e., oppose the party) but when McCain is the party's nominee then it is not permissible for party members to be mavericks. I'd much rather oppose an inconsistent party member than plug my nose and vote for opposition to a marriage amendment, amnesty for illegals, campaign finance reform that ensures incumbents retain power, and all of McCain's other maverick positions. I'll vote for Republicans for Congress, but not for McCain!

Sending mucho BUSH PESOS to McCain!
I should support a party that never supported me.....???? NO THANKS!

@ Buck
Buck, you suck. Here's why. While you're so busy skinning the bark off the evil Neo-Con notables, Barack Obama and his lovely and patriotic wife Michelle will be laughing all the way to the bank with your tax dollars which will enable them to completely reengineer your entire world into one that you will not even be able to recognize compared to the one you would have lived in under John M