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Saturday, November 15, 2008
Doug Giles :: Townhall.com Columnist
Radical Homosexuals Trample a Cross, Harass a Granny, Crash a Church, and Threaten Joe the Plumber’s Life
by Doug Giles
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Can you imagine what would happen if a gang of angry male Christian activists started shouting down and shoving around some nice old lesbian during a religious rally right after ripping her rainbow pride flag from her hands and waffle stomping it?

How much television coverage do you think that spat of stupidity would spawn? What kind of outrage do you think the gays would gin up over such an inexcusable and pathetic act?

I’ll tell you what would happen: We would see an irate Elton John hold a special Candle in the Wind concert on the old lesbian’s behalf, Lance Bass would host a telethon, Ellen would weep, Brad and Angelina would adopt another baby and Rosie would shave the right side of her head again and again until justice was served and those chunks of corn were convicted and sent to prison.

You and I both know we’d never hear the end of it, and you know what? We shouldn’t because that kind stupid, out-of-whack bullying is bull.

What about this scenario?

Say some dyed-in-the-wool, belligerent backwoods snake handlers sporting crosses, vicious anti-gay fliers and blarin’ Dueling Banjos on a boom box infiltrated a gay soiree, disrupted the event, disbursed their literature into the crowd, performed some hetero sex acts and then threatened those in attendance? Do you think the gay bloggers would blog it and the MSM report on it and both sectors call for the rednecks’ necks?

Fo’ shizzle my nizzle they would.

Indulge me one more scenario: Would it be cool if a conservative Christian talk show host called for the death of some gay dude named Joe who simply campaigned for a month for president elect Barack Obama? Would that be cool? You and I both know the answer to that question would be “H” to the no—it would not be cool. That guy would be Imus’ed so fast his head would spin. His days of talk radio would be over.

The above three supposed scenes would be publically condemned, the perps would be captured, convicted and imprisoned, their names would become proverbs for our populace, and the nation would be put on notice that if Christians take their disagreements with homosexuality to belligerent, disruptive and life-threatening levels that their butts will be imprisoned.

It seems as of late, however, that gays can do the above junk to Christians and get a pass from certain cops and the mainstream media.

Yep, just this past week a 69-year-old woman carried a Styrofoam cross in support of traditional marriage into a pro-gay marriage march in Palm Springs and within seconds had the cross ripped from her hands and stomped on, and then the homosexuals began to shove her around and curse her out. You can watch it on YouTube here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_ZvPR09N4Q. If Christians would have done that to an old gay lady they would be currently in the Palm Springs pokey waiting to make bail. No arrests were made. Can you say, double standard? I knew you could.

From that crap we move to Lansing, Michigan and last Sunday’s protest inside the Mount Hope Church by the rabid gay group Bash Back. These winners entered the church along with worshippers and surprised the congregation when they stood up during the service, threw fliers and condoms at the congregants, pulled the fire alarm, made out in front of the church by the pulpit and shouted slogans such as “Jesus was a homo.” No arrests were made.

In light of this Mount Hope Church event I’ve spoken to several pastors across the nation who have wisely beefed up their security in case the protests/threats turn violent. Matter of fact, if I was a radical gay activist I would really think twice about barnstorming churches and threatening their members.

Then we come to one Charles Bouley, queer activist and talk show host on San Francisco’s (where else) station KGO who on November 1st angrily said on the air that Joe the Plumber was a “G** D*** M-F’er” that he wanted dead! At least he got fired this past week. However, I’m sure he’s inking a contract right now for a gig on a new station to keep hate alive.

Again, if homosexuals got the above from Christians the media and the cops would be on them like a duck on a June bug.

My advice to the MSM is this: If I were you, I’d cover it and condemn what the gays are doing to Christians and their Churches or it’s going to get worse—way worse.

And lastly to the radical gay guys, do you really believe that this kind of belligerent behavior is going to make Americans capitulate to your cause? Who came up with this strategy? Was it the same guys who thought that Clear Pepsi would be a real winner?

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About The Author
Doug Giles’ new book “If You're Going Through Hell, Keep Going!" is now available. Ann Coulter says "Doug Giles is a substantive and funny tour de force for traditional values.” Doug’s talk show and video blog can be seen and heard at www.ClashRadio.com.
 
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Great article Doug
All your examples of how the militant gay activists treat those people in the Christian and/or straight communities that sare to disagree with them are right on the money.

Equally bad, if not worse, is how they treat any gay person who dares to disagree with them, or show even the slightest sign of being an "EVIL" Republican, or Conservative.

I know. I've been called every vile name in the book, spat on, hit, and threatened with death, just for saying that I'm a Republican or that I was voting against the Democrats "Messiah."

But don't hold your breath waiting for the media to report on these things. We can't afford to lose people like you who tell the truth about how vicious and hypocritical the "All Accepting," "Tolerant" and "Open-minded" Gay activists, and other liberals are.

Enough
As a Christian I am obliged to turn the other cheek, but as anyone who truly knows the Scriptures, there are understood limits, even though they are oftentimes difficult to determine. Had I been a member of that congregation, right or wrong, I would have responded physically with exceptional force.

I recall a time in Houston when I took a taxi from the airport to a client's office, the driver started an uninvited conversation and started telling me that he was gay. Personally, I think that the term "gay" is in itself repulsive and I keep with the term homosexual for such deviant behavior. But anyway, after telling me that he was a...homosexual...and I essentially ignored the unwanted discussion of sexuality with a cab driver whom I did not know, he asked, "You don't have a problem with that, do you?"

I kick myself to this day for not responding that it was he who had the problem and not me. I am on guard now and prepared. I will take it farther than a discussion if someone chooses to get in my face and cross the line. I have had enough.

Thanks for your article,
Doug.

I wish more writers here on Townhall and elsewhere would have the courage to defend in writing Traditional Marriage and expose the intolerance of certain members of the gay community who seek to FORCE their will on America.

Frankly, I'm disgusted at Republican leaders who haven't the spine to stand up for traditional morality. If they can't tell the difference between right and wrong on such an OBVIOUS issue, I seriously doubt their ability to distinguish right from wrong in other areas of policy debate.




becoming to no one
the behavior doug points out here

now this is scary

And another thing
The philosopher Roger Scruton states:

"In place of the old beliefs of a civilization based on godliness, judgment, and historical loyalty, young people are given the new beliefs of a society based on equality and inclusion, and are told that the judgment of other lifestyles is a crime." From the West and the Rest, p.81.

Our schools, universities, and media churn out and propogate such assaults on Western Civilization and it's no wonder we find ourselves in the muck we're in.

We must hold back the tide and reverse course, or our descendants face a bleak future.

And for what it's worth: Arnold Schwartzenegger can go back to Austria and stay there!

stop demonizing.
What is disingenuous is pretending that these kind of abuses don't happen on both sides of the debate.

They do.

What is disingenuous is pretending that these acts are representative of the vast majority of gay people.

They're not.

I am a man married to another man. I used to be a part-time prosecutor. If event no. 1 had happened in my jurisdiction, I would have charged the older woman with disturbing the peace, and the people who shoved her with assault. If the Mount Hope event had happened in my jurisdiction I would have charged all of the protesters with disturbing the peace and criminal trespass.

I would like to think that as law-abinding citizens, if you all were the prosecutor in a jusrisdiction where someone did these things, you would apply the law equally regardless of whether you believed in the position of the protesters.

There are a few bad actors on each side. Stop trying to use these few bad apples on my side to promote hatred against gay people. We are normal people and we are in your community. I don't ask for special press or special praise every time I represent an abused or neglected child pro bono or every time I mow the lawn of my elderly neighbor. I am probably more mad than you are at those people who let their angry at being oppressed lead them to do stupid or criminal things. But regardless of your religious beliefs, don't lose your common sense or objectivity. I am not blaming each and every one of you for the guy who bashed that gay couple with his yes on 8 sign. Stop blaming the majority of respectful, normal good people like me who happen to be gay and want to be treated like everyone else for the sins of a few.

And let's work together to put a stop to the violence on both sides.

allen
how do you feel about the culture of life movement?

I agree totally Allen
Those gay activists DO NOT represent the majority of us. The sad thing is that the media knowingly presents them falsely, as if they do.

The people in the examples Doug present SHOULD be prosecuted, and also made an example of AS THE CRIMINALS THEY ARE.

They should NOT be presented as P/O'd "victims of dicrimination" trying to express their first amendment rights.
But that's how the media presents them, if they report on the outrages they committ at all.

Don't Forget about the Mormons
Please don't forget about the Mormon churches that have been vandalized, the Mormon scriptural text that was burned on a church doorstep, the fake anthrax mailed to Mormon temples in Salt Lake City and Los Angeles (forcing them to close their doors), the Mormon theater director forced to resign his position in Sacramento, the Mormon restaurant manager publicly intimidated in Los Angeles, the massive demonstrations in front of the Mormon temples in Manhattan, Los Angeles, Salt Lake City, and Oakland, and so on and so forth.

I realize that evangelicals tend to have a problem with us, but surely, on this issue, we should stand together against (ironically) bigotry and hate.

Gays Promoting Hatred Against Gays
No one has to promote hatred against gay people...they're doing a fine job of that themselves. I'm turned off by their behavior. You don't see people in favor of traditional marriage rallying outside Levis Strauss, the Apple store, Dreamworks Studios, George Lucas' or Brad's house do you?
Give it a rest.

MSM bias hasn't stopped
An interesting development is the rift that California's Prop 8 vote has created between two stalwart Democratic contingencies - African-Americans and gays.

Allen @ #6, I am tired of excusing bad behavior by saying the other side does it too. The point of this article is that there is a bias in what gets reported, your "moral equivalence" argument notwithstanding

It really does look bad
I don't know any gay people who would behave in that manner - but I am from the south and it really isn't socially acceptable behavior.

And I identify with the gays who are posting here, because this is what is often displayed as typical Christian behavior - but, believe me, in my neck of the woods, family members would stop speaking to people who behaved in such a manner.

It's tacky, to say the least.

Blame
First the people of California spoke in a fair vote and the measure passed. Period! Second the religious, whoever or what kind are not all to blame. I know a lot of people who are not religious, and do not believe that Gay Marriage should not be legal and I am sure there were alot of those who voted in California also. Both groups of people should stop the protesting, it makes them all look bad. The voting process should be respected.

Here is another example of thuggery:
The owner of a famous Mexican restaurant in L.A. was forced to give money to gay organizations in order to stop a boycott of her business because she gave $100 to Yes On 8. Link:
http://www.dianawest.net/Default.aspx?tabid=36&EntryID=578

I think this is what is known as "protection money". Isn't that illegal?

Why Does Approval Matter To Them?
Occasionally I had been watching The View but have had to turn it off completely lately. Whoopie was railing about how the proposition in California was so unfair to gays and blah blah blah. Joy was bitter and doing some major nervous fidgeting, Sherry was speaking in circles, Barbara acted like a crash test dummy and Elizabeth was trying to get a word in edgewise sticking up for straight people There's four of those five women sitting on the fence and they've got major splinter burn on their behinds. It was a very telling scene. Sad to say.....Sigh.
I don't know why we should have to change the definition of marriage to suit the gay and lesbian agenda. Nobody seems to be keeping them from having relationships and living together, etc. What"s next? Bisexuals demanding redefining marriage so as to marry both male and female partners?
Are they taking too many steroids? Is it some kind of group hysteria? Why do they need and demand societies approval?

We know the MSM shamefully turned their journalistic heads away from many issues recently that they had a duty to report on! Why are we so surprised at the lack of reporting and justice here? Water seeks its own level.

We had all better have very thick skins when we stand up for what we believe, if we don't want to lose our Constitution and the principles this country was founded upon. Sometimes that means calling a spade a spade. Or turning the TV off, avoiding propaganda, reading up on the issues and voting your conscience! And how about not being bullied by intimidators? Circling the wagons seems to be a good idea, too!

Allen;
I can appreciate your attempt at reason and balance. But unless there are a substantial number of unreported cases on the other side, it really does appear that the Christian community does not resort to violence (Prop 8 was a vote, not a violent protest) the way the gay community does when it responds as a group. Certainly there may be exceptions. And I would think that the vast majority of gay men and women do not take to the streets in violence, trespass in conservative churches, etc. The old lady carrying a styrofoam cross into a gay ralley lacks common sense, and I suspect that she should have anticipated that kind of violent reaction. But I would like to see the reaction to a gay activist carrying a plackard at the entrance or in the stadium at a Promise Keepers event. He would be heaped with love not violence, but his point of view would not be agreed with. He may even be asked to leave. May not. I have often heard preachers saying come in and listen. Perhaps some will turn. The gospel is for everyone. We are all sinners in need of grace. Note - the protesters in the church were NOT attacked, beaten, assaulted. Only asked to leave. And that typifies the contrasting approaches.

Gay lefties
The gay left are having a temper tantrum, unwilling or unable to accept the will of the people. They ought to grow up and at least act like 12 year olds. But for them, childishness is a birthright.

I guess you guys
would have disapproved of the Boston Tea Party, eh? I think groups get rather angry when they gets rights taken away from them as a group, by another group that has nothing to lose but is trying to promote its religious agenda. We're talking about a fundamental right to marry someone of our choosing. With all the other problems facing Christians, why on earth is this one worth all the fuss?

Jeffrey
Don't you have any common sense, Gay military and Allen made some good points, but all I read from you is whining. Boo Hoo you did it first, it's not my fault..etc. ENOUGH! I'm the adoptive mother of a 40 yr. old man who did his best to have us condone his behavior. It wasn't that we hated him, we hated his sin as we Christians are commanded to do. He's struggling to leave his life. I'm not here to argue about whether or not he can or will, I
here because what we are trying to get through to you is A. The Constitution, the LAW is for the people; the majority of the people of California voted for Prop 8, they came from all political sectors..and races.
B. Tantrums don't work with adults.
C. Yes, the woman wasn't very wise but that doesn't excuse the abuse she took. That's not the way for your side to win friends and influence people.
D. Invading a church, that's really smart, as if that will change their minds or more importantly their Christian faith and Biblical
truths. I hope that rather than remain stunned,
the congregation began praying and singing
hymns/gospel songs and calling on Jesus. It was for the bullying and shock effect that these genius's invaded the church.
C. It's a testimony about the MSM; it's no longer the watchdog that the Constitution mandates but a propaganda machine and is beneath contempt.
It reflects the overall contempt for the law
that's become so rampant in society, there's some that believe others are worthier than the rest of us and need to have their abuse of the law, and contempt for the law excused. That goes all the way to the top of government otherwise we wouldn't have ACORN stealing votes with the approval of the benefited politicians.

No, Jeffrey, We Are Talking About....
...fundamental rights to worship as we please--and teach our children as we choose.

Gays have equal rights with the civil unions. But that, of course, it not enough because the gay activist agenda is 100% equal acceptance in all areas of society, especially schools and churches.

With gay marriage legal, first grade primers can teach reading with Dick, Jane, Spot, Daddy and Daddy.

Gavin Newsome is the person who lost Prop 8. His marrying the lesbian teacher in front of her first grade class and calling it a teaching moment--and then gleefully screaming: Like it not, the door is wide open now!!!! is what brought people to their senses.

A bunch of people who don't care diddle-do-dah if gays are issued a marriage license woke up to the fact that gay activists intended to push and push and push--intruding their agenda into schools and churches.

Gays overplayed their hand and are now unleashing their satanic anger on everybody in sight. Of course, the MSM is protecting them just as it has and will protect Barack Obama.

Tea Party
You seem desperate to express rage and anger at somebody. I'm just saying, this was a few people. Smart gay people will probably work through the courts to overturn this injustice. I didn't smear the anti-abortion crowd when they started killing abortion doctors or bombing abortion clinics.

To dismiss this as "the majority has spoken" never seems to dissuade the anti-abortion crowd, who keep putting abortion restrictions on ballots, and they keep getting voted down. Evidently, for abortion, using the courts is ok.

I'm sorry that "religious" bigots want to impose their faith on others, all while disobeying their faith themselves. The double standard is partly what gets gay people so angered.

Jeffrey
Jeffrey writes:

Demonizing article
What is the point of this article? That a few angry protesters can do stupid things? The slant that this is typical of gay people is just an attempt to smear.

========================================================================
Isn’t that what you say about Christians?

Just because some Christians speak out regarding there beliefs, you throw all of us together as gay haters, accusing us of hanging, drawing and beating gays.

Strange that you would find fault with the article being that you engage in the same thing.

Out of the closet--
and into the light. If it's attitude they have on, it doesn't match. (the gays we're talking about) Some people just can't take criticism. What is it about some of the gender disrupted that have personalities and attitudes that are frankly lovable and others just can't take a hint to go back in and get dressed properly.

Mountain Girl
I think the Mormon church and other religionists overplayed their hands. Clearly this was a religion-inspired attempt to squelch the rights of a minority. The courts will deal with this issue in that light. But it is cause for wondering out loud, why are “Christians” so concerned about making same sex marriage illegal, while maintaining legal access to adultery and divorce? It must be ok for schools to teach kids about the opportunity for adultery and divorce if a marriage is unsatisfying. You’re ok with that, right?

Schools can teach kids about homosexual behavior and marriage whether it’s legal or not, is the thing. The right wing religion nuts have made it such a big deal that it’s splashed all over the newspapers, on TV and on YouTube, how exactly do you think kids won’t find out about it? Homosexuality isn’t illegal. There are homosexual characters on TV, in books, in history, etc.

Wanna protect the sanctity of marriage? Make divorce and adultery (one the of Ten Commandment prohibitions, by the way) illegal. Your argument for protecting marriage from same sex couples would be a lot more convincing if you outlaw divorce and adultery. Otherwise, you’re just showing your hate, instead of love, for your homosexual neighbor.

Jeffrey
None so blind as those who refuse to see- There is no debating with you. ALL christians who oppose gay marriage must be homophobe hating gay bashers who want to oppose their religion. In the last Doug article, I gave you several SECULAR reasons why gay marriage shouldn't be legislated through the court. You are not being discriminated against. NOBODY has the right to marry anyone they want to, because marriage is not a right. It is licensed and regulated by the state legislature who is elected by the will of the people.. NO COURT involvement. I can not marry who ever I want. You have the same right as me-you can marry someone of the opposite sex- period. California granted civil partnerships. That is not good enough for homosexuals, because they want to eradicate all things Christians. It is the homosexual lobby who has admitted that this fight is about power (not marriage) I am quoting John D'Emilio who was a board member of the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force in 93. It is not about equal rights it is about making it acceptable. Tolerance and accepting is two different things. I have to tolerate, but I do not have to accept. Either way I will pray that some day you will see the light.

Allen
Allen, you lie. You just lie. The defenders of marriage between a man and a woman do not, have not, and most likely will never behave in the way that the homosexuals do. How convenient it would be for you if they did. I know it is tempting to make the claim that they do because the behavior, the temper tantrums, of the homosexuals is embarrassing and indefensible.

Foxfire
Foxfire, when someone objects to same sex marriage, it is a prejudicial view. It is either based on disgust, hate or some religious belief. There are no sound reasons to object to same sex marriage. Personal distaste is not enough: obese people disgust me but I don’t have the right to have them barred from all-you-can-eat restaurants. Even sincere religious beliefs are enough because we don’t legislate based on religious beliefs; in fact, we try to avoid it, hence divorce and adultery, clearly displeasing to God, remain legal. Concerns about children and what they learn are a red herring: get involved in crafting school curriculums if that’s your concern, don’t outlaw marriage for a minority group. When a minority fights for its rights, they have a right to get angry at the group that wants to keep those rights from them. You don’t get to act indignant and angry: you have the rights that you want to deny to others.

Your Christian beliefs are in no way compromised by same sex marriage. I know it, you know it, but it lets you portray yourself as the victim. No one will force you to marry a same sex person. Period. I promise. Supposedly Christians are offended at those who don’t honor the Sabbath but they don’t seem too energetic about getting Commandment #4 enacted into law. Why is that? If Christian churches don’t want to marry Christian same sex couples, I’m totally supportive. No church should have to do something against its religion. On the other hand, why should an atheist same sex couple be bound by Christian orthodoxy?

All About False Self-Esteem

We live in a society in 2008 that has an educational system that is more interested in 'Self-Esteem' than survival.

Our educational system is NO longer focused on the survivability of the student in a world of Information and High Tech, but rather how the student 'Feels' about themselves.

Homosexuals want the educational system to change the curricula to teach they are 'Normal' so they can have 'Self Esteem'.

Homosexuals want to feel 'Good' about their deviant lifestyle and think ANY criticism is intolerance.

Homosexuals have 'Pride' parades and wear badges about 'Gay Pride' and yet seemingly hate their lifestyle or they wouldn't constantly try to show the world 'How Proud They Are'.

Homosexuals are intolerant of anyone who disagrees and attack them personally and viciously, all in the name of 'Tolerance' and 'Diversity'.

Homosexuals declare all they want are the same rights of every other American Citizen - yet Homosexuals have the same rights as any other American Citizen.

Homosexuals have the right to marry someone of the opposite sex just like every other American Citizen. Homosexuals have the right to have sex with another consenting adult just like any other American Citizen.

There is a 'Cure' for hunger 'Eat', there is a 'Cure' for sleepiness go to 'Sleep', there is a 'Cure' for loneliness 'Make Friends' etc.

There is a 'Cure' for sexual deviancy choose non-deviant sex.

Homosexuals who want to feel 'Normal' and have self-esteem, change your lifestyle or accept yourself and leave the rest of us out of the equation.

Homosexuals 'Life is a Hill' get over it.




Jeffrey
>Even sincere religious beliefs are enough because we don’t legislate based on religious beliefs;

Just because it is based on a religious "belief" does not make it wrong. Should we do away with murder laws, because they were initially based on religion? Should we do away with perjury laws- because they were originally based on religion. Our governmental laws were based on English Common Law which was originally based on Religious law. Just because something has origins in religion does not make it an untruth. You can point south all you want and call it north, but it is still north. There are some real truths in life. I know you can't appreciate the irony of your bigoted view of Christianity Jeffrey, but you have problems. Again be thankful that our Constition was based on Judeo- Christian ethics and that all rights are endowed by their CREATOR, because if we went by Darwinisms- Gays wouldn't exist.

ArmyWife
I wish I could make my argument easier for you to understand. Marriage is a right. A fundamental right. The US Supreme Court said so in Loving v. Virginia in 1967. But it isn’t even a relevant issue: a state should not discriminate against a minority in order to please a tyrannical religious view. We do not legislate based on Christian views of what is right or wrong is this country. Please. Don’t play dumb. Is divorce illegal? Christ said divorce isn’t even possible, yet here we are, USA 2008, and divorce is totally legal. Adultery? Dishonoring the Sabbath? Dishonoring Mom and Dad? Worshiping other Gods besides the Christians God? Making graven images? All perfectly legal. Shall I go on? Do you get it yet??????

So far, only Massachusetts and Connecticut seem to understand how discrimination hurts gay couples and their kids. Many, though not quite most, Californians did. I think many Californians may start to regret their decision to support Prop 8 now that they realize how involved the Mormon cult/church was, and how that same cult/church is quickly backpedaling, and supporting homosexual rights.

The unbelievable dishonesty of acting like Christians are under siege or something, it’s disgusting. You can’t even follow your own rules, and yet you’ll inflict them on everybody else! When I learned that Christians actually have a higher divorce rate than non-Christians, despite Christ’s clear condemnation of the act, that was the last straw for me. I’m officially a heterosexual gay activist, in honor of my homosexual brother and his partner. I can’t stand the hypocrisy of Christians, it’s despicable.

Vandalism in $1000's,...
...human excrement on door steps, using the Prop 8 signs to gouge cars, breaking car windows in church parking lots, picketing and boycotting businesses, forcing people to resign from their employment, issuing death threats, threatening to destroy businesses, running over a Prop 8 sign--waver with a truck, causing the need for SWAT teams...

...these acts and more are documented intimidation directed toward Mormons. Mormons are few in number and cannot elect anything in CA. However, they provided $$ and organized manpower.

The point of the gay nazi "terrorism" is to intimidate traditional marriage supporters into submission and silence when a same-sex proposition comes up in two years.

The Mormons I know, while bearing the persecution meekly, are more determined than ever to give double and work double the second time around.

The gay maffia are doing themselves no favors with their tactics of terror in order to silence law-abiding citizens exercising their God-given right to have their voices heard.

Jeffrey
Talk about hate. Re-read your posts and pretend that someone else had written them. If you don't see hate then I do not know what to tell you.

Really Jeffrey? Is that so?
Jeffrey says:
"Foxfire, when someone objects to same sex marriage, it is a prejudicial view. It is either based on disgust, hate or some religious belief."


Well Jeffrey, if that's so then would you tell me what my prejudic against gays is? I'm not disgusted with all gays, just the activists trying to overturn the will of the people in my state through childish temper tantrums.

I DON'T HATE GAYS, because I am one. That should be obvious because of my login name.

And my religion doesn't preach to hate gays, doesn't preach to abuse gays, and doesn't preach to discriminate against gays.

So tell me Jeffrey, what is my objection to gay marriage based on, or in? What is my "prejudice" against gay marriage?

It's certainly none of the three things you stereotype it as being.

Jeffrey
Follow our own rules-LOL

The fundamental of Christianity is that EVERYONE is equal in sin and every one is EQUAL in Christ's eyes. They are Christ's rules. Again I have NEVER committed adultery or divorced. BTW, it was the ACLU who fought for no-fault divorce.. Go on the GLBT websites and you will see that CHRISTIANS fought against these laws and that is another argument as to why we are trying to impose our morals on the public. We fought against adultery and no-fault divorce. We told the public that it would contribute to the breakdown of the family much the way we are warning of the redefinition of marriage. We were called hysterical bigots. Religios zealots... One of the reasons you lost prop 8 is that you equate gay marriage with civil rights. Not being able to sit in the front of the bus and go to school. Getting hung from trees, not being able to eat in certain establishment is SO MUCH more than what gays say they go through. One man Matthew Shepherd got killed, and there were hate laws passed and public outcry even though the killers said later that it had less to do with him being gay then drugs. Oh and in my next post I will show you how religious liberty is being taken away.

ArmyWife
Who told you that US Law is based on Judeo-Christian biblical law? Do you honestly think killing people was A-OK before Christ came along? Seriously, 6 or more of the Ten Commandments are NOT enshrined in law, in a country where up to 85% of the population claims to be “Christian.” I’m sick of ignorant, self-certifying “Christians” gumming up the workings of a basically honest society trying to do the right thing. That’s one of the things I love about New England, the region really has stayed true to the intentions of the founding fathers.

I’m bigoted? I guess the “I hate homosexuals and their lusts!” extravaganza among “Christians” is ok? Opposing same sex marriage certainly isn’t based on Biblical imperative, since Christ nixed divorce and no Christians I know of appear poised to put a proposition on any ballots changing the constitution to say, “Divorce is illegal.”

Amazingly, blinded by their hatred of homosexuals, Christians who supported and financed “Yes on Prop 8” were willing to lie about treatment of sexuality in public schools, and other related issues, in order to trick voters into voting for Prop 8. It’s always a good PR move for Christians when they’re caught lying in order to force their views on the rest of us!

Jeffrey
You have what you want in being able to leave your estate to whomever you wish. You may own property and bank accounts jointly with whomever you wish. So far as we know you may visit whomever you wish in the hospital. Don't tell me this isn't possible; my own mother in the '90's had all these things with her 'companion'. You may in some states adopt children-though this is insane, it can be done.

You're not wanting to let well enough alone, however. You're like the fisherman's wife in the famous Grimm's tale who, after having wishes granted beginning with wanting a larger home and progressing up to being Emperor, then Pope, also wanted to be Ruler of the Universe. Nothing less was sufficient to make her feel that she finally had all she wanted. The fish who heretofore had granted her wishes finally said "Enough! Go back to your hovel". Even he knew there were limits to what could be attained by mere humans.

So say we. Go back to your hovel, mind your own business, and be content.

irrelevant
Most of the gay and straight protesters have been peaceful. There have been 10s of thousands of demonstrators.

This article merely uses isolated cases and anecdotal accounts to scare gullible people and to demonize the gay community.

Radical social conservatives are confining themselves to irrelevancy with these scare tactics.

They are on the losing side of history and they know it.

Intellectual and moderate Republicans know that they will eventually have to throw the social conservatives under the bus if their party is going to survive.

Jeffrey: The Gay Agenda...
...is to not only normalize but glorify homosexuality--beginning with the schools: Harvey Milk Day, Coming Out Day.

When schools begin glorifying adultery and divorce, they will have a problem with parents.

Homosexuality has been considered sin for millennia by Jews, Muslims and Christians. Activists are striving to irradicate these long-held beliefs.

I would not expect a public school for force Jewish children to pray in the name of Jesus Christ or be force-fed a ham sandwich in the lunch room.

I have been working with Prop 8 supporters from all quarters. There is absolutely no hate toward gays: none, only sympathy and respect.

But the street runs both ways: show some respect for people have chosen to respectfully disagree.

Jeffrey
Jeffrey, what would you like Christians to do about adultery and divorce? The church already teaches and preaches against it.

Many preachers won’t marry those who are the responsible party in a divorce.

What exactly do you want Christians to do about sin?

You still have failed to acknowledge that this issue is a cultural issue, not a religious issue. There are many people who are not Christians who are against gay marriage.

AliveinHim
I am totally on board with the civil union thing. I, too, thought, “what’s wrong with that?” But I also think that same sex couples should have no more and no fewer rights and benefits of marriage that different sex couples have. Well, it seems the law says you can’t offer one group XYZ and a different group XYZ and call them something different. It’s called “separate but equal” discrimination. So if civil unions offer the same benies that marriage does, under the law they have to be called the same thing. So when I support same sex marriage, I’m just fast-forwarding through the inevitable legal challenges between having both civil unions and marriage by the state, and jumping right to marriage for all.

But there is a solution. Get rid of marriage and just have secular authorities grant only civil unions. People of faith can go to their church and get married but in law they are really just joined in a civil union. It’s the civil union that describes their legal rights and protections. Their marriage ceremony defines their religious feelings about marriage.

So how about it, you in? Ready to dissolve your legal marriage and create an identical civil union instead? It will make everybody happy. The “Christians” won’t have to suffer the evidently horrible pain of same sex marriage because NOBODY will be married. Except if churches start marrying same sex couples. Oh, I give up!

Jeffrey.
>Who told you that US Law is based on Judeo-Christian law

I said Judeo-Christian ethics- and I learned that in law class and 8th grade history.

>Do you honestly think killing people was A-OK before Christ came along?

Yes religious tenets & morals which formed law(again brush up on history) are help form civilizations.

>I’m sick of ignorant, self-certifying “Christians” gumming up the workings of a basically honest society trying to do the right thing.

I am not outlawing homosexuality. I am not for jailing homosexuals. If you claim to be a Christian I must consel you on your sins and would expect nothing less from a fellow Christian in love (something you are seriously lacking an understanding of. Honest society does not seek to teach children things that their parents object to- Remember that.

> I’m bigoted? I guess the “I hate homosexuals and their lusts!” extravaganza among “Christians” is ok?

Ok, Please tell me where I have ever said this?

Jeffrey
> Opposing same sex marriage certainly isn’t based on Biblical imperative, since Christ nixed divorce and no Christians I know of appear poised to put a proposition on any ballots changing the constitution to say, “Divorce is illegal

Again Go look at your own agenda's website. Christians fought making no-fault divorce legal. We wer called the same things.

Marriage is not a right
It's a license granted by a state, just like a driver's license, cosmetician's license, therapist's license, for which wannabes are tested, and they don't all pass.

If the Founders had seen marriage as a fundamental right under natural law, they would've put it in the Constitution. Instead, the Const. says if it isn't stated here, it belongs to the states (10th Amend.).

The Boston Tea Party was a Sunday picnic compared to the gay attacks. The people participating in Boston considered themselves gentlemen, and they were protesting being taxed without being consulted.

Gays can form partnerships, grant powers of attorney, bequeath their posssessions, buy and sell property, start and end businesses, and pursue happiness as the Dec. of Ind. mentions, but NO ONE GUARANTEES HAPPINESS OR THAT YOU CAN ALWAYS GET WHAT YOU WANT.

That's what the song says: You can't always get what you want.

The more these events attack churches and straight society the more resistance the great mass will exert back. No state has voted for gay marriage, because it is an oxymoron.

The lib. thugs who've become ascendant with the Big Bro O are dividing the nation in cultural and social ways never imagined. Whether the MSM covers the issue is in some ways immaterial, because the web will.

Believers and plain citizens should keep up their good works, support 1000s of years of tradition and custom, and let the M**F**ers rant and rave till the cows come home.


but
The last time the CA Supreme Court overruled the gay marriage ban, they established that marriage was a civil right and that gays were a valid minority group just like ethnic minorities and religious minorities.


Most Homosexuals Want Vulgarization

Homosexuals want respect of both themselves and their lifestyle - yet most homosexuals and certainly their leaders, show NO respect for anyone else and their lifestyle.

The goal of most Homosexuals is a complete and utter vulgarization of society.

Ever watch a Homosexual parade? The only goal is to shock and degrade any semblance of normality.

This is NOT about 'Civil Rights', but about 'Vulgar Rights'.

There are no orderly quests for Civil Unions which most Americans would agree to - rather it is a vicious attack on anything 'Sacred' - anything 'Traditional'.

Most Homosexuals hate themselves and anyone who does not agree with their vulgar lifestyle.

Regardless of what Homosexuals gain, it will never be enough to satisfy or sate their unnatural lusts.

Homosexuals want to deny others freedom of religion, freedom of speech and even freedom of thought - unless all others praise them and their deviance from normality.

The concept of live and let live is 'Anathema' to militant Homosexuals.


to
To protect Marriage, there should be Constitutional Amendments to outlaw adultery and divorce.


Equal Rights/Eradication of Rel. Freedom
Consider what happened in Massachusetts in 2004: Justices of the peace who refused to preside over same-sex unions due to moral or religious objections were summarily fired. Since same-sex unions were entitled to be treated the same as traditional marriages, this refusal was discrimination and a firing offense. What about a priest or minister who similarly refuses to preside at such ceremonies? Obviously the state can’t fire such people, but it is easy to foresee other sanctions — such as loss of tax benefits — being imposed on churches.
Just last year, two women filed a complaint in New Jersey because they were denied use of a pavilion for their civil union ceremony. The pavilion was owned by a Methodist ministry. It had been rented out for marriages, but the ministry refused to rent it for civil unions because it is a religious structure, and civil unions are not recognized in the United Methodist Church Book of Discipline. Due to the ministry’s refusal to rent it for the lesbian ceremony, New Jersey revoked its tax-free status.

The Des Moines Human Rights Commission found the local Young Men’s Christian association in violation of public accommodation laws because it refused to extend “family membership” privileges to a lesbian couple that had entered a civil union in Vermont. Accordingly, the city forced the YMCA to recognize gay and lesbian unions as “families” for membership purposes, or lose over $100,000 in government support.

Perhaps the most notorious example of a state forcing its view on a church agency comes from Massachusetts, where Boston Catholic Charities ran an adoption agency that had been placing children with families for over 100 years. In 2006, Archbishop Sean P. O’Malley announced that the agency would abandon its founding mission rather than submit to a state law requiring it to place children with homosexual couples. (A Vatican document from 2003 described gay adoptions as ”gravely immoral.”

Funny isn't it Michael
Michael says;
"Intellectual and moderate Republicans know that they will eventually have to throw the social conservatives under the bus if their party is going to survive."


Michael, isn't it funny how people like you and Ranger29 are always proven wrong when you say things like that.

The RINO Republicans, and the Democrats, with the help of their MSM lapdogs, through the use of "Open primaries" foisted well known(and at that time media loved) MODERATE(read RINO) Republican John McCain on our party as the presidential candidate, and immediately he started going down the tubes because the Conservative base rejected him and threatened to stay home on election day.

Enter Sarah Palin, a REAL CONSERVATIVE, as his VP Choice, and the party base once again becomes energized, and McCain's poll numbers start soaring.

If you look, you'll see that this election went to Obamination only by a slender majority of votes. That WOULD NOT have been the case if McCain had picked a RINO like Rudy or Hagel as his running mate and you know it.

Had he picked either of those two, or any other weak Republican as his running mate, it would have been an Obamination landslide because the majority of Conservatives would indeed have stayed home.

If anything, to get our party back on the right track, we conservatives need to throw the RINO's not just under the bus, but run them over a few times then throw their stinking corpses off a high cliff.

Marriage is a civil right.
Marriage was an issue in the Civil Rights Movement.

Black slaves were not allowed to marry other black slaves.

Once Blacks were allowed to marry each other, they still weren't allowed to marry anyone of another race.

Eventually the court's struck down the ban on inter-racial marriage against the will of the majority of Americans.


Any American Citizen

An American citizen (singular) can adopt a child.

An American citizen (singular) can name any other Citizen as the beneficiary to their life insurance policy.

An American citizen (singular) can name any other Citizen as the sole recepient of their estate.

An American citizen (singular) can name any other Citizen with the power of attorney when incapacitated.

An American citizen (singular) can name any other Citizen in their living will and medical power of attorney to make medical decisions which would include visiting in the hospital.

An American citizen (singular) can own property jointly with one or any number of other citizens.

An American citizen (singular) can live in the same dwelling with any other consenting citizen(s).

A married couple pays more income tax than two individual citizens.

What exactly does homosexual marriage give other than a false sense of 'Normalcy' and self-esteem and a vulgarization of society?