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Wednesday, April 08, 2009
Donald Lambro :: Townhall.com Columnist
Too Much Humility in the Age of Obama
by Donald Lambro
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WASHINGTON -- President Obama set great expectations for himself on his first European diplomatic trip to test his new get-along-by-going-along foreign policy. And it was a complete success, according to the gushing reports from the news media.

Not everyone agreed with that assessment. Obama certainly proved "that he can work smoothly and productively with a wide range of foreign leaders -- provided that he allows them to set the agenda," remarked the Washington Post's foreign-policy analyst Jackson Diehl.

Obama went to Europe to persuade the major European powers and other countries who make up the world's richest G-20 to pump more money into their financial markets to help pull the global economy out of its recession. They agreed to come up with more than $1 trillion, most of which went into the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank. But they said no to plunging their countries further into debt as he was doing here at home.

German Chancellor Angela Merkel flatly dismissed his bigger spending request, saying, "That is not a bargaining chip." French President Nicolas Sarkozy said his own demands for imposing more regulations over the financial markets were "nonnegotiable."

Then it was on to the NATO summit where Obama hoped to talk the military powers into sending thousands of combat troops to help the United States fight the Taliban terrorists in Afghanistan. He got weak commitments from the NATO alliance and other countries of a mere 5,000, mostly for noncombat roles.

He said he came to Europe to listen and not to lecture. The days when great world leaders like Roosevelt and Churchill sat "in a room with a brandy" and led the Free World against tyranny were over, Obama said. Did he miss his U.S. history classes where FDR, Truman, Churchill, Stalin and a host of other allies joined together to defeat Germany and Japan in World War II?

But this is the Age of Obama, a time when we had to "show some element of humility and recognize that we may not always have the best answer."

Well, humility can take you only so far in a still-very-dangerous world where Iran, North Korea and other rogue nations consider humility a sign of weakness and indecision.

While Obama was practicing international humility in Europe, Defense Secretary Robert Gates was unveiling the overhaul (some are calling it a dismantlement) of America's military arsenal, including worrisome cuts in U.S. missile-defense programs.

It was an unfortunate coincidence that Gates was laying out the plan to cut back on U.S. missile testing at a time when North Korea was firing an intercontinental ballistic missile over Japan's airspace and across much of the Pacific Ocean in what their military said was an attempt to put a satellite into orbit. It apparently did not achieve orbit, but the test firing showed that North Korea was inching ever closer to having the capability of hitting our allies and, eventually, the United States.

Congressional lawmakers reacted with alarm this week at the combined news of North Korea's latest provocative action and Obama's planned defense cuts, especially on long-range missile-defense technology.

A bipartisan group of senators, including Joe Lieberman and Jon Kyl, wrote to Obama on Monday to voice their opposition to what they called "deep cuts" in missile and missile-defense programs.

"I cannot believe what I heard today. President Obama is disarming America. Never before has a president so ravaged the military in a time of war," said Oklahoma Sen. James M. Inhofe, a senior member of the Senate Armed Services Committee.

Rep. Trent Franks of Arizona, a member of the House Armed Services Committee, said, "North Korea's launch of a long-range ballistic missile should be a clarion wake-up call to the whole world that this is not the time to diminish our missile-defense budget as proposed by the Obama administration."

There were reports, too, that Iranian missile experts were present at the North Korean missile launch, which Franks said "compounds the threat. As dangerous as North Korea's missile capability is becoming, it should be noted that Iran's missile technology is far advanced than that of North Korea; and if Iran should also gain the nuclear capability now possessed by North Korea, the entire paradigm of world peace would be jeopardized."

More than half-a-dozen members of the House missile-defense caucus hurled similar statements at the White House Monday. Indeed, this was no time to be cutting back on any missile-defense systems that have shown we can destroy incoming enemy missiles with deadly accuracy. We need to continue testing proven and even as yet unproven systems.

Obama made headlines by showing that he could work closely with the Russians on what he hopes will be a new treaty to reduce nuclear weapons between the two superpowers.

But not long after Obama and Russian President Dmitry Medvedev shook hands on the deal, Russia was defending North Korea's right to shoot missiles into orbit for "peaceful" purposes. Sure.

"Is the new president shrewd and pragmatic about using his power at home and abroad -- or too passive, even weak?" the Post's Jackson Diehl asked Sunday. It is a critical question that demands further scrutiny in the weeks and months to come.

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About The Author

Donald Lambro is chief political correspondent for The Washington Times.

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Reading between the lines,
it's very hard to interpret Der Obama's words in any way other than...

"I have absolutely NO IDEA what world leaders are supposed to do, will someone please show me?"

What a loser!

Humble? Surely You Jest!

Do you suppose it would have humbled Obama to have visited at least one American war dead cemetery while in France, especially since this was his first trip there as President? Or, perhaps, such humility doesn't fit in well with his agenda of apologizing for American "arrogance."

In fact, we know that Barack Hussein Obama was urged by French President Nicholas Sarkozy to visit the Normandy American Cemetery and Memorial, where nearly 9000 American soldiers, who gave their lives in WWII's invasion at Normandy, are buried. But, he declined so as not to offend Germany and Britain. WTF???

Yes, he's now so worried what the walking-dead Europeans think that an American President won't visit the graves of those who gave their lives for America (and, I might add, for Germany and Britain, who without us, might not be here).

French officials and senior American military officers walked with White House staff through the cemetery discussing how the two presidents might follow the same route. But even before their trip, the White House had decided that Mr Obama would not travel there this week.

"It wasn't going to happen," said an American official in Washington. "We went through the motions to placate President Sarkozy but giving special treatment to France was not on our agenda."

http://www.aipnews.com/talk/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=3592 &posts=2

Oh, but Mr Obama did find the time to visit a historic mosque.

An entire stadium full of ACORN agitators is not worth one drop of blood from a fallen American soldier.

Sir Barack Obama, may you rot in Hell.

JUST GREAT!
Our alleged president can't figure out for himself what gifts to give to visiting dignitaries; how on earth can we expect him to understand the machinations that have gone on behind the scenes here. Hillary Clinton would have made a MUCH better president. As the master of triangulation, she would understand the Russia-NK-US situation very deeply indeed.

It's a shame she merely won the popular vote in the primaries, but then, she could hardly have done better. Also, notice that she is infinitely less whiney about having the election stolen from her than was Al Gore.

Denise
It all makes sense when you realize that President Hussein is, as far as we know, not an American. We will see his birth certificate over his dead body.

BO was so humble this week
that he apologized to the Austrians for his inability to speak "the Austrian language."

I bet Dan Quayle knows that Austria speaks German. And that the US has 50 states.

Donald
This article reminds me of High School sports. In high school,any "lost" is followed with "We Could Haves". I never thought that adults could "Whine" as much as "High Schoolers". Whine,Whine. If the Republican Party has a better agenda,someone may need to start explaining same. Tick,Tick is beginning to drown out the "Whining"!

A visit to our war dead
The President should have visited our vets and shown Americans some respect. Notice how that was just not on his agenda while he was so busy apologizing for America every where he went. Disgusting. And killer, I don't why you chose that sobriquet, but you are an insult to our real warriors.

Move over Jimmy Carter.
You have just lost your title as the weakest president ever.

An Exerpt From A Ralph Peters Column
Last updated: 1:36 am
April 8, 2009
Posted: 1:23 am
April 8, 2009

THE real climax of President Obama's Spring Apologies Tour wasn't his photo op with our troops in Baghdad or even his "American Guilt" concerts in Western Europe.

While fans in the press cheered wildly at every venue, the real performance came in Turkey. And it was a turkey.

Obama means well. Just as Jimmy Carter, his policy godfather, meant well. But the road to embassy takeovers and strategic humiliation is paved with good intentions -- coupled with distressing naivete.

On every stage, Obama draped Lady Liberty in sackcloth and ashes, drawing plentiful applause but no serious economic or security cooperation in return. Then, in Turkey, he surrendered our national pride, undercut our interests and interfered in matters that aren't his business.



Obama on a Roll Internationally
Anyone who would deny that our standing and image in the world had plummeted during the Bush years, or that it is on a comeback since the last election, is simply denying the obvious. Moreover, adopting a “we will listen to you with mutual respect” will garner allot more in the way of cooperation with our international counterparts than the heretofore “you’re with us or against us” approach ever could. All one has to do is examine the differences in the coalition that was assembled for Desert Storm vs. that cobbled together for Iraqi Freedom and the fact that we shouldered 10% of the cost in the former vs. 90% for the later.

Regarding Obama being rebuffed by European leaders, consider the following quote:
“The Europeans say they have no need for further stimulus right now because their social safety nets, derided in good times by free market disciples as sclerotic impediments to growth, are automatically providing the spending programs that the United States Congress has to legislate." (NYT 3/27/09) B.T.W., the Czech premier that said Obama’s Economic Program was “a highway to hell” has seen his party turned out of office since he made this statement.

Regarding the acquisition of No. Korea or Iran in obtaining nukes, one need only to read David Sanger’s new book “The Inheritance” to see the catalogue of international trends the have emerged to the detriment of the U.S.A. that are borne of the failed Bush foreign polices and have been exacerbated by our being tied down in Iraq. Thus far, ironically, Iran may be the big winner in the region.

With regard to weapons programs, we have more than ample capability to deal with conventional threats given the threat environment we currently face. What Gates is wisely doing is cutting out wasteful spending, something every Conservative should applaud, and shifting money to counterinsurgency where the present threat exists.

SJGulitti
Obama on a Roll Internationally
************************************************
Right on ! Right on! He is on a roll,all right. He got rolled at every stop. So did we.


Wait! A new crisis?
While the Big O was bopping around Europe blaming the U.S.(now a non-Christian nation, in his words) for our bad behaviors as far back as the dawn of the Republic, a made for t.v. crisis has now fallen into Big O's lap.

A day or so ago, a U.S.-flagged container ship was attacked and hijacked by Somali pirates. Up until this point, it's always been someone else's ox being gored. Now it's one of our own.

In the spirit of not letting a good crisis go to waste, get ready for the Big O to declare war against the Somali pirates.

His press office will be aided by the fact that all the slogans and jingoism for this new war are already on file under the heading "Tripoli Pirates".

Remember the stirring call to arms from that long ago war, "Millions for defense, but not one cent for tribute"? (Wait a second, we're cutting the defense budget, so let's not use this one!) Anyway, I'm sure they can dig up something useful.

Every politician is taught from birth that if thing are getting hot at home, find (or create) an crisis abroad. Anyone want to bet that the Big O isn't going to milk this cow til it cries? Meanwhile, Iran gets the bomb and North Korea gets the means to deliver it.

God save the United States of America.

Rowly @ 10:26 AM 4/8/09
"He is on a roll,all right. He got rolled at every stop. So did we."

What facts do you have to uphold the aforementioned claim?

Who is the “we” that got rolled?

I don’t feel that my country has come out the worse for wear in the exchanges between Obama and European leaders. In fact, former Bush Administration economist Dr. Bill Rodgers, appearing on Meet the Press this past Sunday said of the President’s trip overseas: “Obama’s first task is to rebuild relations with Europe.”

B.T.W. the last NYT/CBS Poll that came out yesterday showed that 67% of the American people polled feel that Obama has the respect of world leaders.

The one place where he may considered to have been "rolled", if you can call it that is on getting any further, meaningful troop commitments for Afghanistan. Then again, European reluctance for overseas military action has been on the decline since Desert Storm. Just look at all the no shows on their part in Operation Iraqi Freedom.

Touchy feely metrosexual President
Obama is a prime example of a Fatherless boy. Surrounded by and coddled by Liberals his entire life, he is the product of a dysfunctional Family. And now this Man child is apologizing to the world for what? Supposed wrongs committed by the Country that has done nothing but allow him advantages (Affrimative action programs) throughout his life. How Pathetic...

WEAKNESS OR CRIMINALITY?
Which is it?

Is Obama purposely demeaning America so he can persuade the world that he is the ONE?

Does he really think he is the Messiah?

Is he willing to sacrifice America on the Cross?

Is Obama willfully inviting his own and America's demise in order to fulfill some fantasy he bought from the PERVERT AMERICAN MEDIA?

WHAT IS HE DOING?

SOMEONE PLEASE FIND OUT NOW BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE...

HOW DARE HE CALL ME AND MY ASSOCIATES ARROGANT? DEVISIVE?

WHAT A CREEPY LEADER...I HOPE ALL THE OBAMA VOTERS HAVE THIER HANGOVER FOR A LONG TIME...

OR...ARE THEY STILL SLEEPING?

ROWDY BOOTS

He got a cool...
...reception from NATO because they listened to him campaign on not just drawing troop levels down but pulling the plug on Iraq. Why would these European countries be expected to commit anything to help Mr. Obama in this when they may well find themselves holding the bag when he dee dees out.

As to humility. What we saw on display was not humility but rather arrogance taken to the nth power. It was arrogance that lead him to prostrate himself, and by implication all The United States, to these people. Arrogance lead him to assume that the groveling and apologies would be seen as saying "The previous administration caused these regretful things" and would then earn him a clean slate.

Humility indeed. This is a word not to be found in the vocabulary of our Glorious Leader.

SJ: Polls, Polls, Polls
So, the NYT's poll showed that 67% of the American people polled feel that Obama has the respect of world leaders, but 57% of Americans want to take out North Koreas "Chihuahua" missiles.

Do you think that Americans would say that Obama has Kim Il-sung's respect?

But, vous êtes très correct with regard to the cheese-eating surrender monkeys not assisting Obama in by sending troops to Afghanistan. As a French-descendant with a sister living in Nantes, I have long said that "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, and the French are from France" and that is that. Even in the days leading up to Hitler's invasion of France, both the French and German generals believed the French to be better armed and trained; yet, it only took the Germans 6 weeks to roll into Paris.

Humility
I have no problem with a president who behaves with humility; the US does not have the answer to all questions and problems. Mr. Obama's tour, however, seemed to be an exercise in self-abasement, appearing to sit at the feet of Europeans pleading for enlightenment. He needs to keep in mind that he is our Chief of State and not acting as the "innocent abroad".

I would rather have Mr. Obama show a little of that humility at home. Here, he strides about like Zeus coming down from Mt. Olympus to reconfigure our lives to his warped image of a perfect society.

Denise, RE #2:
"Sir Barack Obama, may you rot in Hell."

SIR? Where did he get the "Sir"? Did the Queen knight him during his recent trip there? Was that before or after Michelle Obama groped the Queen?

How an Ole Country Boy Sees It
Out in West Texas when two dogs got into a fight, the loser used to roll over on his back and show that he knew he was whipped. We said that loser dog was "cowed". Obama went to Europe and like he did earlier with the Moslems, rolled over on his back and signalled, PLEASE DON'T HURT ME! What a triumph.
Now, we have the news that pirates have boarded a ship flying a US flag and have taken a crewman, possibly the captain as a captive. We could send a detachment of Marines like we did against the Barbary pirates and clean these thieves and cut-throats out but my expectation is we will try to negotiate. I hope o sends Hillary and she decides to stay and be a part of the pirates' cabinet. At least she would be around some people with sand in their craw.

Tick Tock
One year, seven months and 23 days until the elections in 2010. If there is not a significant shift in the balance of power in congress by then, we are screwed, so screwed.

Barack Obama is the best thing that Russia, North Korea, China, Venezuela, Iran and the whole of militan Islam could have "HOPED" for. Surely this "CHANGE" they can delight in.

O is a punk
The Big O is a Chicago punk, no class, no dignity, not presidential, no sense of history or tradition, nothing came before him, and after him le deluge.

Without a teleprompter he's a Bozo, no aspersion against legitimate clowns.

Think of O in O Land as the ultimate punk, the creep who gives the queen of England an ipod, the nitwit who kneels to a Muslim prince.

Send him tea bags. Go to a tea party on April 15. Show the political machine creeps in DC we still own the streets.

the vision of the messiah
seems flap ears believes america is far too powerful and his idea to surrender to every potentate and tinpot dictator will make him beloved around the world.

I would think he is severely troubled when he has to stand at attention during ceremonies where the american flag is raised in prominence.

But his bowing to the saudi's brings to the forefront where his true allegiance lies.

The vision of the messiah is reducing america to it's knees and the msm and the lefties will cheer every surrender action of their messiah

Jefferson said --
The American people will get the kind of government they deserve. Americans who voted for the Messiah will get that kind of government. Unfortunately, so will the rest of us who saw through the teleprompter king. He is an arrogant buffoon who demeans his own country to make nice with those who hate us. It might have been nice if he had pointed out to Europeans that if it were not for America, all of Europe would be speaking German --if not in 1914, then certainly in 1939.How many of our finest laid down their lives for the ungrateful of the world. His administration appointments show what he thinks of us. Chicago is about to replace Washington as the Capitol.

Teddy Roosevelt said --
We should walk softly but carry a big stick. Guess Obama could not find the stick.


Does he have it just backwars?
BO believes in audacity for BO but humility for US.

Or backwards?
(Sorry about the typo)

This Is The Problem
Just 53% Say Capitalism Better Than Socialism
Thursday, April 09, 2009 Email to a FriendAdvertisementOnly 53% of American adults believe capitalism is better than socialism.

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey found that 20% disagree and say socialism is better. Twenty-seven percent (27%) are not sure which is better.

Adults under 30 are essentially evenly divided: 37% prefer capitalism, 33% socialism, and 30% are undecided. Thirty-somethings are a bit more supportive of the free-enterprise approach with 49% for capitalism and 26% for socialism. Adults over 40 strongly favor capitalism, and just 13% of those older Americans believe socialism is better.

Investors by a 5-to-1 margin choose capitalism. As for those who do not invest, 40% say capitalism is better while 25% prefer socialism.

There is a partisan gap as well. Republicans - by an 11-to-1 margin - favor capitalism. Democrats are much more closely divided: Just 39% say capitalism is better while 30% prefer socialism. As for those not affiliated with either major political party, 48% say capitalism is best, and 21% opt for socialism.

Week Willie.
I really don't care if other countries like us. I want them to fear us. You only deal in strength when you talk to these people.

You need to be like Lyndon Johnson and Kruschev. Here is my sh*t, I want all of you to eat it or get the f out of here.

Esto Vir.

Arrogant + Humble = Happy Medium
Townhall today has an article saying that Obama was too humble overseas and another one saying he was too arrogant overseas. Add these two together and you get a happy medium. As the Goldilocks told The Three Bears, "just right".

Weird thinking
We need to get rid of all bullet proof vests for police officers to instill confidence for the rest of society and world that no one is above the law concerning gun ownership. Also, all fences, window bars, and home security systems should henceforth be eliminated under penalty of imprisonment, since having these things needlessly presupposes that other citizens and neighbors can't be trusted.

Delusional
President Obama told the Europeans what they wanted to hear, and they gave him nothing. This is a liberal's idea of success.

North Korea's weapons, the problems in the Middle East, Iran's soon to be a nuclear power are just a few of the important issues we need to deal with. Europe has no desire to deal with anything, and President Obama being a good European will follow their lead.

He wants and craves their approval. In order to get it, he has to trash his own country, countrymen, and our country's former leaders. Afterall, it's about his needs and desires - the rest of us don't matter.

And if we need more money, just print it!

So Force Them?
We have already experienced consequences of arrogant leadership. No only does arrogant prevent a leader from recognizing facts that are contrary to their beliefs, it also alienates our allies and potential allies. A little humility in foreign policy might go a long way toward rebuilding our failed foreign policy.

Re: Hysterical Historians
"A little humility in foreign policy might go a long way toward rebuilding our failed foreign policy."

Right! Just ask Neville Chamberlain!

Choice - Johnny Action
Right! Just ask Neville Chamberlain!

Even Hitler needed allies. Had he not been so arrogant an invaded Russia he might have won.

Obama barking at the Moon again
All this self abuse that Obama is heaping on this country is sickening. This man is no Patriot. The sooner Obama is gone the better.

Re: Lord how its hard to be humble
"I have no problem with a president who behaves with humility;"

Personal humility is a good thing, too bad Barrack Hussein Obama has no idea what that is. His entire thrust on his 2009 European Tour, was humiliating the country he is suppose to represent, the country with the World's largest economy, the mightiest military, and by far the highest moral standard.

His entire foreign policy is "Noble Laureate" Jimmy Carter, Part Deux.

"He Treated Me Like A Little Boy" - I

Let's not forget that JFK's first foray to Europe, the excursion where he accompanied Jacqueline to Paris, included the disastrous meeting without preconditions with Khrushchev, our Soviet enemy.

Kennedy's meeting to defend his own stated willingness to meet without preconditions in the first year of his presidency with the leaders of nations adversarial to the U.S. As Thrall and Wilkins note, Kennedy's meeting was an unmitigated disaster. Kennedy viewed it that way himself.

Kennedy's aides convinced the press at the time that behind closed doors the president was performing well, but American diplomats in attendance, including the ambassador to the Soviet Union, later said they were shocked that Kennedy had taken so much abuse. Paul Nitze, the assistant secretary of defense, said the meeting was "just a disaster." Khrushchev's aide, after the first day, said the American president seemed "very inexperienced, even immature." Khrushchev agreed, noting that the youthful Kennedy was "too intelligent and too weak." The Soviet leader left Vienna elated -- and with a very low opinion of the leader of the free world.

A "dazed" JFK said, "He treated me like a little boy".

"He Treated Me Like A Little Boy" - II

Kennedy's assessment of his own performance was no less severe. Only a few minutes after parting with Khrushchev, Kennedy, a World War II veteran, told James Reston of The New York Times that the summit meeting had been the "roughest thing in my life." Kennedy went on: "He just beat the hell out of me. I've got a terrible problem if he thinks I'm inexperienced and have no guts. Until we remove those ideas we won't get anywhere with him."

A little more than two months later, Khrushchev gave the go-ahead to begin erecting what would become the Berlin Wall. Kennedy had resigned himself to it, telling his aides in private that "a wall is a hell of a lot better than a war." The following spring, Khrushchev made plans to "throw a hedgehog at Uncle Sam's pants": nuclear missiles in Cuba. And while there were many factors that led to the missile crisis, it is no exaggeration to say that the impression Khrushchev formed at Vienna -- of Kennedy as ineffective -- was among them.

The Bay of Pigs was an unmitigated disaster. And, lest we forget, it was JFK that began our "go it along" catastrophe, Vietnam.

When the man, who accompanied the Francophone, Michelle, to Paris, received a resounding "Non!" when he requested French combat troops in Afghanistan. When he asked Chancellor Merkel for combat troops, as well, Obama received a stiff, "Nein!" And, worst of all, when Kim Jong-il launched a missile, the leaders of Russia ("Nyet"!) and China ("Bu dui"!) and said that they will veto any additional UN resolutions.

They treated Obama like a little boy, too!

Re: Hysterical Historians
"Even Hitler needed allies. Had he not been so arrogant an invaded Russia he might have won."

Really? And if the humble Chamberlain hadn't appeased the arrogant Hitler in Munich and instead enforced the terms of the Treaty of Versailles, Hitler would have been kicked out of office by the German military, if not the German people, when re-militarized the Rhineland.

But that is what makes the humble internationalists so charming - Treaties (Arms Proliferation; Versailles, etc.) and UN Resolutions so charming. Making these grandious treaties makes these humble diplomats "feel good" (like "Peace in our time.") - but enforcing them requires a modicum arrogance. That is why it usually left up to the US to do the right thing.

Genuine cactus
He refused to appear until AFTER the Christian
Chaplain prayed the opening prayer and the National Anthem was over when he went for his
Camp Le Jeune photo op. Then he obsequiously
pays obeisance (meaning homage, defernce, reverence, also says respect..but one can respect another without groveling) before a foreign king who just happens to be the caretaker of the holiest sites in the religion, not only that also the head of the most fundamental sect, Whabism. You remember that
sect, most of the 9-ll murderers were members.
That groveling before this foreing king was an
act of subservience and by virtue of O's title,
an act showing this foreign king Americans were subservient to him and his religion. He and his harpy wife didn't show the Queen that kind of "respect" nor to the President of France and his First Lady, nor to the heroic dead in the
American cemetary.
No he goes on his mea culpa tour, speaking for
the American people apologizing for our "many
sins" and telling the Europeans we are too arrogant. In other words, the American Republic and it's historic form of government is
too arrogant and he, the new messiah will take U.S. down a peg. He tells the world and the Turks that the U.S. isn't a Judeo/Christian country..then he tootles off to a Mosque..THAT he can do, but he can treat better men than he could ever hope to be even in death like dirt.
He DOESNT mean well, he is an evil, corrupt thug..a worldwide baby killer, and accepter of
reverence and worship by his cultist..his day will come. He will learn God doesn't take
kindly to usurpers accepting what is rightfully
Gods.

Re: JFK's Legacy
"And, lest we forget, it was JFK that began our 'go it along' catastrophe, Vietnam."

No, JFK made Vietnam an "American War", and insured our loss, by permitting the overthrow of the only strong leader South Vietnam had. BTW, as I recall we had most of SEATO allies with us in Vietnam and even help from South Korea. The Brits were "going it alone" in Burma and French already had gotten spanked by the Viet Minh.

BTW, the Bay of Pigs is an example what happens when you are not arrogant enough. Had JFK delivered the promised "air power" the Castro brothers would have been history and there wouldn't have been no "Cuban Missile Crisis".

The End Of The Iraq War, But Spending?

President Barack Obama plans to request new funding from Congress for the conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan, but he risks a backlash from antiwar lawmakers.

Mr. Obama is expected to seek congressional approval of $75.5 billion for the wars, perhaps as soon as Thursday. The issue is already raising tensions on Capitol Hill, especially among liberals who are sympathetic to the president's broader agenda but voice concerns about his timeline for withdrawal of troops from Iraq and his plans to beef up forces in Afghanistan.

"I can't imagine any way I'd vote for it," said Rep. Lynn Woolsey, a California Democrat and leader in the 77-member congressional Progressive Caucus. It would be her first major break with this White House.

Ms. Woolsey fears the president's plan for Iraq would leave behind a big occupation force of, at least, 50,000 troops. She is also concerned about the planned escalation in Afghanistan. "I don't think we should be going there," she said.

Similar sentiments echo across the House. Rep. Jim McGovern (D., Mass.) said he fears Afghanistan could become a quagmire. "I just have this sinking feeling that we're getting deeper and deeper into a war that has no end," he said.

Rep. John Conyers (D., Mich.) dismissed Mr. Obama's plans as "embarrassingly naive," and suggested that the president is being led astray by those around him. "He's the smartest man in American politics today," Rep. Conyers said. "But he occasionally gets bad advice and makes mistakes. This is one of those instances."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123923540395603311.html

So, not only is the "wrong war in the wrong place at the wrong time" going to continue, but we will be, basically, be "going it alone" in Afghanistan, too, and spending "all that money when we have poor people here".

Where's Code Pink?

Re: Hysterical Historians
"All one has to do is examine the differences in the coalition that was assembled for Desert Storm vs. that cobbled together for Iraqi Freedom and the fact that we shouldered 10% of the cost in the former vs. 90% for the later."

Really? Did you know that the 90% came from the Saudis? I believe Obama repaid that debt with his cute curtsy to the Saudi King. Al Qaeda plan to include it in their next recruiting video.

The UN, who ran the "Oil for Arms" program as part the sanctions(?) for violating a couple of dozen of their Resolutions, where too humble to insist that Saddam "toe the line", so the only real soveriegn Nation in that humble organization did what was necessary. BTW, that Gulf War I coalition was so fragile that Bush I thought it would come apart if Israel defended itself from Iraqi Scuds.

John Action, So, We, Basically, Agree
"And, lest we forget, it was JFK that began our 'go it along' catastrophe, Vietnam."

"No, JFK made Vietnam an "American War", and insured our loss, by permitting the overthrow of the only strong leader South Vietnam had."

As I said, JFK began OUR go it along "American War" in Vietnam.

"BTW, as I recall we had most of SEATO allies with us in Vietnam and even help from South Korea."

And, what happened to them since it became the American War?

"The Brits were "going it alone" in Burma and French already had gotten spanked by the Viet Minh."

The Indochina War lasted from 1946 to 1954 before JFK sent in the military beginning in the earky 1960s. And, the Brit's hand their hands full without getting involved in Vietnam.

"BTW, the Bay of Pigs is an example what happens when you are not arrogant enough. Had JFK delivered the promised "air power" the Castro brothers would have been history and there wouldn't have been no "Cuban Missile Crisis"."

My point exactly. And, Kennedy learned from his mistakes. He did not insist on some namby-pamby foreign policy. Obama, on the other hand, believes that our arrogance has been the source of all evil and that, somehow, humbling ourselves before the world will change their intentions if we do so first.

Russia will not. China will not. Iran will not. North Korea will not. Syria will not. France will not. Germany will not. Spain will not. OPEC will not change its oil prices. Pakistan will not change.

As a French-descendant, I could have told Obama that les baisers, brie et vin make for an enjoyable repast, but an agreement? Non. For years, I have said, Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, and the French are from France, and that is that.

John Action - New Recruits
"I believe Obama repaid that debt with his cute curtsy to the Saudi King."

So you are saying that it is better to hold hands with King Abdullah the way GW did? I am no diplomat, just asking.

Neville Chamberlain was also a conservative that gave whole countries away so today's diplomacy is some improvement.

At Least He has GATES
I have to admire the Perseverance/Knowledge displayed by Sec. Gates.. That's about the only bright side I see so far in Mr Obama's "Smoke and Mirrors Show"..If Ms Clinton can demonstrate even a semblance of Ability in Affairs of State we MAY have a CHANCE..I've never been a CEO, etc, but I have *been the B@stard in Charge* and I learned early on, and without doubt, POPULARITY wasn't very high on the list of CREDENTIALS..U Reckon Mr. Ob's learning??

At Least He has GATES
I have to admire the Perseverance/Knowledge displayed by Sec. Gates.. That's about the only bright side I see so far in Mr Obama's "Smoke and Mirrors Show"..If Ms Clinton can demonstrate even a semblance of Ability in Affairs of State we MAY have a CHANCE..I've never been a CEO, etc, but I have *been the B@stard in Charge* and I learned early on, and without doubt, POPULARITY wasn't very high on the list of CREDENTIALS..U Reckon Mr. Ob's learning??

Re: Teddy on Terrorism
"Teddy Roosevelt said --
We should walk softly but carry a big stick. Guess Obama could not find the stick."

"Long before there were suicide bombers, Osama bin Laden or chants of 'Death to the Great Satan,' a Trenton, NJ man named Ion Perdicaris became the 20th century's first American victim of Middle Eastern terrorism.

"It all happened in 1904, when the 64-year-old Perdicaris and his stepson found themselves taken hostage from their villa in Tangier, Morocco by a scruffy band of rifle-toting Berber tribesmen on horseback.

"The bandits' chieftain was flamboyant, black-bearded Mulai Ahmed er Raisuli, and he wanted to extort a heavy ransom from the Sultan of Morocco -- not to mention embarrass the sovereign by showing his powerlessness to protect foreign citizens.

"This was more than a simple kidnapping in a distant land. For President Theodore Roosevelt, it was an opportunity to start waving his 'big stick,' sending battleships steaming toward the African coast to ensure Perdicaris' safe release.

"It also gave Roosevelt the chance to issue one of his most blood-curdling proclamations, a statement that helped ensure his re-election while sending Americans wild with joy:

"'Perdicaris alive or Raisuli dead'!"

I guess this Noble Laureate US President was from the arrogant school of diplomacy rather than the humble.

Re: Diplomacy 101
"So you are saying that it is better to hold hands with King Abdullah the way GW did? I am no diplomat, just asking."

Holding hands shows equality of position, it is a reciprocal jesture; bowing indicates subservience.

"Neville Chamberlain was also a conservative that gave whole countries away so today's diplomacy is some improvement."

No, Neville Chamberlain practiced the diplomacy of humility, just like Obama. His excuse was trying not offend Hitler, thinking his nice gestures would be reciprocated. Having lived through WWI Chamberlain believed that "making nice" could avoid another European "bloodbath".

Unfortunately he was humble at a time arrogance was needed.

I do know how todays diplomacy is an improvement when Syria for all intents and purposes runs Lenbanon; Warlord control Somali; the Pakistanis can't or wont control the Hindu Kush area of the country; Russia can invade suvereign Georgia at will and occupy portions of that country with impunity, and Communist China can invade and occupied the Kingdom of Tibet for over 50 years without the World do anything about it.

Re: Hysterical Historians
"And, what happened to them since it became the American War?"

It became an American War only to the extent that weak South Vietnam leadership after the US/JFK approved coup and murder of President Ngo Dinh Diem in 1963 forced the US to take on more of the responsibility for the war.

As for our allies, they remained in country wih us until Nixon began the process of withdrawing US troops and Vietnamization of the war starting in 1969

The allies of the US during the Vietnam War were: South Korea with the second largest contingent of troops in South Vietnam, Thailand, Australia, New Zealand and the Philippines. Members of SEATO.

Canada made military hardware that was used in Vietnam including large amounts of Agent Orange. The Canadian soldiers that fought in the war were part of the US troops.
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