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Friday, July 27, 2007
Diana West :: Townhall.com Columnist
My 125-minute President Cheney fantasy
by Diana West
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For precisely two hours and five minutes on the morning of July 21, 2007, there was something different about our world.

The center of gravity shifted: President George W. Bush temporarily transferred the powers of his office to Vice President Dick Cheney.

The occasion was less than earth-shaking -- a routine colonoscopy that required the president to be placed under general anesthesia. Bush underwent the same procedure back in the summer of 2002, transferring presidential powers to Cheney for the first, uneventful time.

But what a difference a second colonoscopy makes -- or so Cheney might have thought as he prepared to assume presidential powers from his vacation perch on Maryland's Eastern Shore. During the first procedure, the country was still in the patriotic throes of the early post-9/11 age. The Taliban were on the run, our mistakes in Iraq were unimagined, the president was committed to opposing -- better, destroying -- terror networks and the nations that support them. Even the president's cozy, border-lite relationship with then-president of Mexico Vicente Fox was in temporary abeyance.

Five years later, Iraq is a mess. The administration's lodestar policy of fighting terrorists has given way to free-falling "security" talks with Iran -- currently, the most malignant jihadist threat. The president's diplomatic freeze on the late, unlamented Yasser Arafat has melted into a warm embrace for Fatah, the party Arafat founded, now headed by Mahmoud Abbas, a Holocaust-denier, among other things. And who could forget the president's recent amnesty debacle? And still the borders are undefended.

Well, what could he do? Cheney must have thought. He was only a vice president. And then, suddenly, a distant ruffle of drums rose up, as if from the bay, preceding the faintest strains of "Hail to the Chief," and we dissolve to ... An aide tentatively approached Cheney. Now, according to the constitutional powers vested in someone or other ...

"Well, Mr. 'President,' said the aide, breaking his bitter reverie. "What should we do now? Settle in to watch the British Open until Mr. Bush comes to?" Mr. Cheney's eyes followed the rising arc of a bird over the water.

"I want an Executive Order form, and I want it now."

"Sir?"

"You heard me."

Mr. Cheney checked his watch. It was already 35 minutes into his "presidential" term, but he had plenty of time left to issue presidential pardons for border agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Alonso Compean (now serving excessively harsh terms for reportedly wounding a fleeing drug smuggler following a struggle). And while he was at it, what about presidential recognition for the service of some of our great soldiers who have been overzealously prosecuted after fighting in Iraq and left out to dry by their commander in chief? "Let's gets these pardons going. I'd also like to issue some presidential proclamations, starting with Col. Allen West and Lt. Ilario Pantano, thanking these men for their military service and apologizing for not recognizing their gallantry sooner," Cheney said.

He chuckled as he signed the orders pardoning the agents and thanking the soldiers.

Cheney sat down on a sofa, still holding his pen, still thinking. Broken borders. Broken Iraq. Genocidal Iran. The Saudis -- how could Bush hold hands with them? Yuck. But what could he, Cheney, do about it, and quick? "Something that goes unnoticed," his aide offered helpfully, getting into the presidential swing of things.

"Unnoticed," Cheney said. "Too bad asking Condi for her resignation would be noticed. So would an executive order to drill in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, or my idea for defunding those treasonous so-called sanctuary cities. What can we do about Iraq, irrevocable or unnoticed, in the next hour?"

"Well, sir, remember that Diana West column you liked so much that pointed out that whatever we do in Iraq, we won't be addressing the real national security threats posed by jihadist Iran, Syria -- not to mention Saudi Arabia. The real question is, what can you as president do in the next hour about Iran?"

Cheney's jaw set. "Right. I need a general, a good general. Who are those generals I like on Fox News? Call somebody like that."

He drummed his fingers on the table while his aide dialed and passed him the phone.

"Hello, general? Yes, Dick Cheney here. Listen, I'm president this morning -- right, George is having that procedure again -- no, nothing serious. I just wanted to fix a few problems while he's, you know, recuperating...yes. I want to hit Iran and I want to hit it now -- really knock out its offensive capability so it can't make nuclear bombs, kill our troops in Iraq, support Hezbollah, the Taliban, Hamas -- you know, everything. It's always stuck in my craw that we never responded to any of their assaults on us. I mean, think about the embassy seizure in 1979. Think about Khobar Towers in 1996. Think about Hezbollah, Iran's proxy army, and those 243 Marines killed in their barracks in 1983, and what they did to CIA station chief William Buckley, and on and on. You got anything in mind?"

He paused. "Uh-huh, uh-huh...uh-huh. Really? OK. Great, general. I'll call the Joint Chiefs and give them your recommendations."

"President" Cheney hung up and smiled. "One more call, and we make the world safe for democracies."

Suddenly, as abruptly as the music had begun, it stopped. All that was audible was the sound of hushed, televised commentary of the British Open.

The phone rang. Cheney answered.

"Mr. President! How are you, sir? Good. No, nothing out of the ordinary. In fact, I must have fallen asleep." He checked his watch. Precisely two hours and five minutes had passed since he sat down in front of the TV set.

"Yes, I'll be happy to tell the press. Just a routine Saturday morning."

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About The Author
Diana West is a contributing columnist for Townhall.com and author of the new book, The Death of the Grown-up: How America's Arrested Development Is Bringing Down Western Civilization.
 
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Darth Vader as Prez
Jon Stewart does a great bit on Cheney's brief tenure as official president. Check it out at crooksandliars.com

Thank god there were only five polyps found. The sixth may have meant destruction of the world.

Scary does not even begin to describe it. Cheney as President is the horror of any normal person.


a "West Wing" plot
Ah, this was a "West Wing" plot device (the show is a great learning tool about the American political system and gives a fairly balanced view of both major sides of the issues, even if he president himself is supposed a "liberal").

President Bartlett's daughter Zoe has been kidnapped by terrorists and he knows that he might not make decisions in the country's best interests because it is his daughter, so he employs the same amendment the made Cheney acting president to hand over power to the Speaker of the House, a Republican, played by John Goodman (the vice presidential position is temporarily vacant*). A choice line by Goodman's President Walken: "Find her and find her fast. But if Zoey Bartlet turns up dead, I'm going to blow the hell out of something, and God only knows what happens next."

Well, John Goodman's character's team, while he is acting president, takes some advantage of his newfound position of power to get some things rolling in their party's favor. Some links to the episodes below. Seriously, for those conservatives who have watched the show, I'd like to know if you think the characters representing conservative viewpoints have done a fair job of doing so.

Anyway, back to Ms. West's article. y one problem with this is that Diana West seems to think that VP Cheney had nothing to do with all the problems the White House is in now. He's been in bed with the Saudis, too.

* In the "West Wing" series, the vice presidential position is vacant due to the resignation of the VP over a sex scandal. The VP character's situation is an obvious reference to the situation of former Clinton advisor Dick Morris, who is now a beloved contributor to Townhall. Go figure.

Links:
http://westwing.bewarne.com/fifth/501premier.html
http://westwing.bewarne.com/fifth/502dogs.html
http://www.westwingepguide.com/S5/Episodes/100_TSP.html

One wonders...
...how many times Iran has to commit acts of war against the US (directly or thru Hezbollah) before we return the favor.

Alan K. Henderson:
One wonders if you're of military age...

Fantasy
I wonder how many people chucled to themselves and had the same fantasy about tactical nuclears hitting Iran? I did.

Watching cons
fantasize while their grip on power slowly fades is sad and funny.

Funny because of the absurdity, and sad for the same reason. It is so apparent they care nothing for America.

Which Americans are realizing in the ever growing numbers reflected in ever shrinking approval ratings for Republicans. Which is also refelected in the amount of money given to candidates. Republicans are trailing even in that department, and in the south to boot!

My guess is that after the cons are routed again in '08, and even some "moderate" Dems have their fannies handed to them, they will finally begin the slow process of reformation. It will take them several election cycles to regain respectability. Unless of course they hang onto the religious reich and continue to wallow in their sexual hypocrisy(Vitterosis or Haggardism) and corruption(Cunningham/Ney Syndrome. Also referred to as Abramofitis). Then it will be several decades.

In that same time the Dems will be turned out from the inside and maybe even a legitimate third party will rise from the ashes. The Constitution Party likes to think they are it, but they are laughable with their principles that are hardly different than the current Republicans.

All in all folk, it boils down to realizing that political parties are not we the people. Some are worse than others at remembering that.

To Army Vet
then you must be proud of "5 Deferrment" Cheney.

wow
I’ve been known to fantasize from time to time, but never about suspending democracy or the deaths of thousands of people. Folks, you don’t think that maybe I am a liberal inside, do you?

The importance of service
If, as the leftists imply, only those who served can comment on the proper use of the miltiary, doesn't it logically follow that only those who served can COMMAND the military?

This is important, because if memory serves, the COMBINED total military service of the three DOnkey Party front-runners for COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF is...

...[drum roll]...

ZERO years, ZERO months, ZERO weeks, ZERO days, ZERO hours, ZERO minutes, and ZERO SECONDS.

Is anyone else
sick of all the libstain bull around here? Seems the brainless dweebs are taking over.

Anti-Jihad Crusader
No, if I were to be sick of something, it would be the brainless name calling around here and the gratuitous insulting in place of good commentary.

An Army Vet
My dad (Ret AF CMSGT) was in Vietnam same time frame. (I'm Ret AF Tsgt) Thanks for your service.

Here's MY fantasy:
This week: A bipartisan delegation of Congresspersons, Senators, William F. Buckley, and George Will, go to the White House to meet with Bush and Cheney. They tell them that Bush and Cheney have lost their political base permanently, over immigration and Big Government. And unless Bush and Cheney both resign, they will both be impeached and removed from office not just by congressional Democrats, but also with the help of the congressional Republicans. And they're not bluffing--they will show Bush the Draft Bill of Impeachment.

Karl Rove, as pragmatic as ever, proposes the following graceful way out:

Cheney resigns for "health reasons."
Bush appoints Condi Rice as VP to replace Cheney, on the condition that Condi promises not to run for election for President herself, ever. The Senate ratifies it quickly.

Then Bush resigns, making Condi Rice the Acting President.

As President, Condi Rice's poll numbers aren't great, but they are way higher than Bush's or Cheney's had been. Going into the 2008 election, she's not a drag on the GOP candidates like they were, and may even be an assist here and there. The Dems find it much harder to demonize Condi than to demonize Bush in the 2008 campaign.

And that makes the 2008 election winnable for the Republicans. ON Election Night, it's Giuliani-Palin*** beating Hillary-Obama, not a landslide but decisive enough to avoid any uncertainties or recounts.

*** Palin, for those who don't know:
http://www.gov.state.ak.us/
http://www.palinforgovernor.com/aboutSarah.html

DocNoleCat
Thanks for the belly laugh. Reminds me of the
time, a woman who couldn't even drive a tractor,
tried to tell this old man how to bale hay.

A Little Help for Cheney
Poor Cheney would have a lot to take care of in just an hour or so of presidential tenure, so he might want to consider turning over domestic operations to Peppermint, who writes a serialized online novella as well as posting to townhall. You can google chapter of this opus by going to "The Diary of Juliet Smith". The plot tends to be a bit repetitive, as in segment after segment the government of the United States has been taken over by liberals and the country is being liberated by conservatives (whom Peppermint calls "Patriots"). One by one they ambush and capture liberals then kill them, usually shooting them in the head and then feeding their bodies to dogs, although sometimes more graphic and gory ends are destined for the liberals. All of this sounds right up Cheney's alley and he would be well-advised to take seriously a collaboration with Peppermint, who in her/his writings reveals bodacious knowledge of munitions---that would be most helpful.

Or, to save even more time, Cheney could just order the military to storm the United States Archives, capture the Constitution, and set it afire. After all, as Cheney's boss GW Bush once said, it's just a piece of paper.

Bombing Iran = Bad
Not that I dont believe in Military force when need but we would turn a HUGE population of Iraq even more so against us right now. It would be the biggest mistake since staying in Iraq after we won the war.

I agree on the pardons and all of that but bombing Iran right now does not work in our interest. There is not much more he really could have done in that small time frame in all honesty. Now if we could give him the rest of Bush's term (Which I would LOVE to see happen), then he might be able to get things done and turn around Bush's train wreck of a presidency.

SteveL
And just think how much money this country would save if we didn't have to ship Condi's exercise treadmill all over the world with her (it, and her Marine trainer, go where she goes). According to an article in my morning paper she has now visited 60 countries doing her so-called diplomacy. If she just stayed at home, think what a savings in fuel, expense, and effort.

Gregdn
The US Navy turned me down.

A second chance not likely
The hammertoe can be fixed, but stiff ankles are another matter, and being 46 years old yet another. At the time I tried to enlist (age 32) I was still young enough for Intel and Cryptography; I doubt that since then they've raised the age that significantly.

Yes! Pardon Ramos and Compean now!
What a wonderful dream that is, to pardon the border agents who shot at a drug smuggler. There probably wouldn't be sufficient time to give them a medal, but they would probably regard the pardon as sufficient!

Lilly
"And just think how much money this country would save if we didn't have to ship Condi's exercise treadmill all over the world with her (it, and her Marine trainer, go where she goes). According to an article in my morning paper she has now visited 60 countries doing her so-called diplomacy. If she just stayed at home, think what a savings in fuel, expense, and effort."

Ditto for Owlgore's private plane.

Lilly
"Or, to save even more time, Cheney could just order the military to storm the United States Archives, capture the Constitution, and set it afire. After all, as Cheney's boss GW Bush once said, it's just a piece of paper."

I thought the Warren Court already did that.

Palin
Palin should be the next Vice-President, alright. But not with Giuliani. With Duncan Hunter, the best candidate for the Presidency since Ronald Reagan. This ticket can win.
This ticket includes two public servants of proven integrity and ability. Hunter/Palin 2008

TALK ABOUT:
Is there anything more important than closing our borders, to prevent criminals, terrorists, nuclear bombs getting through?

IF SO, WHY DON'T THE MEDIA SHOUT ABOUT THAT EVERY DAY, 24/7....?????

IRAQ IS NOT A MESS!
I am fed up with people buying the oft repeated lies of the left.

Shame on you, Diana West, for swallowing the Bull Pucky that the Leftie Losers are shovelling down everyone's throat!!!

These slimey weasel have been repeating the mantra of "quagmire" since the war started. Why? Because if America loses the war, they gain power.

Stop allowing your brain to be washed!

Where the mess really is
It is located here at home, because the borders are not being protected, and the laws are not being enforced.

We are doing business with an Evil Empire, Communist China, who compete unfairly, use slave labor, are not held to the pollution and human rights standards that we are, sell us poisoned and defective "goods," spy on us and steal our technology, bootleg our intellectual property, sell the organs of their political prisoners to medical companies, mow down protestors in the streets, and execute their trade minister like Darth Vadar eliminating an underling who "disappointed" him once too often.

This is more out of control than Iraq.

Btw
The economy sucks more than Iraq. The Stock Market is plummeting, the housing market is in a slump, and the much touted "low" unemployment rate, which does not count people who have not been an employee for over 2 years, is a fabrication.

I have written about this once again in my latest post entitled "What Goes Up Must Come Down."

I have some opinions about how to fix it, but we must acknowledge it first.

How I long for Alan Greenspan!!!

Cheney's been in charge all along
Good lord. Does any reasonable person think Cheney hasn't been pulling the strings throughout Bush's tenure?

Proud Fibber
Only fools believe the lies of the Left.

What does that say about you?

Stop repeating the lies and come toward the light on the Right!

talk about oft-repeated lies
Yup, Dems are cowards and you guys possess only the Right Stuff. Ooowee, what's that smell? The smell is all around us.

Sniveling Democrats

* Richard Gephardt: Air National Guard, 1965-71.
* David Bonior: Staff Sgt., Air Force 1968-72.
* Tom Daschle: 1st Lt., Air Force SAC 1969-72.
* Al Gore: enlisted Aug. 1969; sent to Vietnam Jan.
1971 as an army journalist in 20th Engineer Brigade.
* Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.
* Daniel Inouye: Army 1943-'47; Medal of Honor, WWII.
* John Kerry: Lt., Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze
Star with Combat V Purple Hearts.
* John Edwards: did not serve.
* Charles Rangel: Staff Sgt., Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea.
* Max Cleland: Captain, Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam.
* Ted Kennedy: Army, 1951-1953.
* Tom Harkin: Lt., Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve,1968-74.
* Jack Reed: Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army
Reserve 1979-91.
* Fritz Hollings: Army officer in WWII, receiving the Bronze Star and seven campaign ribbons.
* Leonard Boswell: Lt. Col., Army 1956-76; Vietnam, DFCs, Bronze Stars, and Soldier's Medal.
* Pete Peterson: Air Force Captain, POW. Purple Heart, Silver Star and Legion of Merit.
* Mike Thompson: Staff sergeant, 173rd Airborne, Purple Heart.
* Bill McBride: Candidate for Fla. Governor. Marine in Vietnam; Bronze Star with Combat V.
* Gray Davis: Army Captain in Vietnam, Bronze Star.
* Pete Stark: Air Force 1955-57
* Chuck Robb: Vietnam
* Howell Heflin: Silver Star
* George McGovern: Bomber pilot, many missions. Silver Star & DFC during WWII.
* Bill Clinton: Avoided service. with student deferments. Entered draft but received 311.
* Jimmy Carter: Annapolis grad. Seven years in the Navy.
* Walter Mondale: Army 1951-1953
* John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs and Air Medal with 18 Clusters.
* Tom Lantos: Said to have served in Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul
Wallenberg.
* Wesley Clark: U.S. Army, 1966-2000, West Point,
Vietnam, Purple Heart, Silver Star. Retired 4-star general.
* John Dingell: WWII vet
* John Conyers: Army 1950-57, Korea


Heroic Republicans

* Dennis Hastert: did not serve.
* Tom Delay: did not serve.
* House Whiip Roy Blunt: did not serve.
* Bill Frist: did not serve.
* Rudy Giuliani: did not serve.
* George Pataki: did not serve.
* Mitch McConnell: did not serve.
* Rick Santorum: did not serve.
* Trent Lott: did not serve.
* Dick Cheney: did not serve. Had "other priorities."
Several deferments, the last for wife's pregnancy.
* John Ashcroft: did not serve. Seven deferments to teach business.
* Jeb Bush: did not serve.
* Karl Rove: did not serve.
* Saxby Chambliss: did not serve. "Bad knee." The man who attacked Max Cleland's patriotism.
* Paul Wolfowitz: did not serve.
* Vin Weber: did not serve.
* Richard Perle: did not serve.
* Douglas Feith: did not serve.
* Eliot Abrams: did not serve.
* Richard Shelby: did not serve.
* Jon Kyl: did not serve.
* Tim Hutchison: did not serve.
* Christopher Cox: did not serve.
* Newt Gingrich: did not serve.
* Donald Rumsfeld: served in Navy (1954-57) as aviator and flight instructor.
* George W. Bush: six-year Nat'l Guard commitment (infour).
Issues of desertion and unfitness.
* Ronald Reagan: made war propaganda movies.
* Gerald Ford: Navy, WWII
* Phil Gramm: did not serve.
* John McCain: Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of
Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross.
* Bob Dole: Army officer WWII.
* Chuck Hagel: two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star, Vietnam.
* Duke Cunningham: nominated for Medal of Honor, Navy
Cross, Silver Stars, Air Medals, Purple Hearts.
* Jeff Sessions: Army Reserves, 1973-1986
* JC Watts: did not serve.
* Lindsey Graham: National Guard lawyer.
* G.H.W. Bush: Pilot in WWII. Shot down by the Japanese.
* Tom Ridge: Bronze Star for Valor in Vietnam.
* Antonin Scalia: did not serve.
* Clarence Thomas: did not serve


Pundits & Preachers

* Sean Hannity: did not serve.
* Rush Limbaugh: did not serve (4-F with a 'pilonidal
cyst.')
* Bill O'Reilly: did not serve.
* Michael Savage: did not serve.
* George Will: did not serve.
* Chris Matthews: did not serve.
* Paul Gigot: did not serve.
* Bill Bennett: did not serve.
* Pat Buchanan: did not serve.
* Bill Kristol: did not serve.
* Kenneth Starr: did not serve.
* Michael Medved: did not serve.

Lola, just goes to show you...
That not everyone that's served in the military got any smarter and that not all intelligent people served in the military!

Navy Submarine Service '84 - '92

Lola
With you line of thinking you can disqualify Hillary Clinton (she had ample oppurtunity to serve since 1972 when the military went All Volunteer). She has absolutely no right to offer any opinions concerning national defence or diplomacy.

Also, here some swell people that did serve -again by your logic, they are more than qualified to be national leaders.

Lee Harvey Oswald -USMC

Adolph Hitler -decorated combat veteran for the Kaiser's Army awarded both the Iron Cross 1st and 2nd Class

US Grant- Commander of the Army of the Potomac. His Administration was one of the most corrupt in history.

Here are a few leaders that saw no service:

Golda Mier -Prime Minister of Isreal.

Ambraham Lincoln -did serve if you could call it that for a few weeks with a milita from Kentucky (during the so-called Blackhawk rebellion).

Cardinal Riechlieu -Prince of the Church, France's Foreign Secretary during the bloody 30 Years War.

These three leaders didn't allow thier lack of "service" get in the way from executing successfull campaigns or war srategies.

The Left's infatuation with military service is a strawman. The Left detests the military.


I have a WW II injury!!!!!!
This whole business on who served in the military and who didn’t is sometimes a joke. I served in the Ohio Sate Guard, the Merchant Marines, and the US Army twice, and had my 18th birthday on a troopship in the harbor at Singapore.

When I was called back into the Army for the Korean War, I mentioned to my sister’s friend, “I have no one to kiss good-bye.” Pat said, “I should have thought of you.” That very day at lunch, her coworker said, “You girls need to get me a date.” It was not Love at First Sight, it was LOVE AT FIRST GLIMPSE, for me as soon as my Sweetie opened the door when I arrived for our blind date. The Wedding took 5 minutes, the Marriage lasted 55 years.

I have a WW II injury. One brother won a Bronze Star Award for his heroic efforts in the Battle of the Bulge on Dec. 20, 1944, and another brother’s US Navy Destroyer sunk two Jap ships at Iwo Jima four days later, and neither of them got a scratch. Fertilizer came in 167 pound bags, and that bag, a ten gallon can of milk, and a bale of hay were rather heavy for the back of this 14 or 15 year old kid. And it still hurts.

dannyboy
Good one. At least you have wit.

To others, 'Just the facts, Mam'.

The list constitutes people who have fought and know war. It contains the architects of our present horror and their illegitimate claim to a superior love of country.

JPK

You forgot Vlad the Impaler. Probably an Independent, though.

Duncan Hunter
Duncan Hunter is a great candidate. He is not on board with the glbalist/CFR/North American Union agenda. He would close our borders.

Hunter introduced an amendment to the Transportaion Appropriations Act that prevents money to be spent on the Security and Prosperity Partnership (SPP), or the Nafta super corridor. SPP is what the summits Bush has been having with Mexico and Canada on integration are called. Apparently some people in the gov don't think the North American Union is a conspiracy theory.

Section 413 of Bush's amnesty bill called on Congress to "accelerate the implementation" of SPP so that the US can "improve the standard of living in Mexico". This is straight out of the CFR playbook. Part of their new world order includes bleeding Americans to raise the standard of living in Mexico.

http://www.augustreview.com/news_commentary/north_american_union/global_backlash_against_globalization?_2007072672/

BTW all the top tier candidates Dem and Rep are globalists.

Cheney
It is wishful thinking that Cheney would free the border agents. He is a past CFR director and like Bush would never close our borders. He is on board with the whole agenda.

Seriously, he is around to make sure Bush stays on track.

He is Darth Vader.

Lola's list
Interesting that she includes Supreme Court justices (two conservatives and no liberals) - the branch of the government that has nothing to do with making military policy.

No liberal pundits on the list - and, despite the title, no preachers.

Wesley Clark proves that being in the military doesn't mean you belong there:

'While commanding NATO troops in defense of Muslim Kosovo and against Serbian Christians, for example, the hot-headed Clark commanded a subordinate British General to attack Russian troops that had landed without NATO permission at the airport in Kosovo’s capital. (Clark speaks fluent Russian but chose not even to talk with the Russian troops before attacking them.)

'The British General Sir Mike Jackson reportedly refused Clark’s risky orders, saying: “I’m not going to start the Third World War for you!”'

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=9889


Stop arguing with liberals
Liberalism is a mental illness. It's cruel to argue "facts" or "logic" with someone lefty, they barely have a grip on reality. Save your spleen and your sanity and ignore them.

The real story
War opponents (with some exceptions, like Jane Fonda) don't have any love for the enemy. They suffer the delusion that the enemy can be reasoned with or contained. This applies to the Cold War as well, especially the unilateral disarmament types.

War hawks don't love war any more than police officers love shootouts. They support war in instances where they judge non-war to be costlier in lives, property and liberty than war.

For instance, during the past three decades 7.5 million people died at the hands of the Hanoi government.

http://www.matus1976.com/nucleus/index.php?itemid=14&catid=1

Nobody on the antiwar left thought this would happen. If they'd paid attention to the history of Communism they wouldn't have been surprised.

The antiwar left is similarly naive about the consequences of an American pullout from Iraq. And this time such a pullout threatens American civilian lives. Islamic terrorists were at war with us before we went to Iraq, and even before there was an al-Qaeda. An abandoned Iraq will fall to one (or more) of them - possibly Iran will take the Shia portion - and they'll have the resources of an actual country to draw upon to plot their next attacks by against the West.

Surprise - war kills
Bad comparison, for two reasons. First, the 10-15 million doesn't distinguish between combatant deaths and noncombatant deaths. Second, the North Vietnamese invasion was a war of imperialism, and it inflicted a lot of state-sponsored murder DURING PEACETIME after the conquest was consolidated; America's wars in Asia were do-gooderism intended to defend fragile nations and to prevent the spread of Communist totalitarianism. Korea was a draw, which is better than what happened in Vietnam.

Laos and Cambodia were boneheaded strategy. If we'd fought Vietnam like a real war, we would have invaded the enemy nation instead of bombing its invasion routes in Laos and Cambodia. The war-of-containment strategy was part of the reason the war dragged on as long as it did.

I'm unaware of any significant noncombatant casualties from the Bush 41 round of the Iraq War. Bush 43 has gone to tremendous lengths to avoid collateral damage in the current phase of the war, and in Afghanistan. Even the already dead are spared:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14823099/

Our forces need to be a little less Ned Flanders, without going to William T. Sherman extremes.
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