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Tuesday, July 18, 2006
Dennis Prager :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Middle East conflict is hard to solve but easy to explain
by Dennis Prager
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The Middle East conflict is difficult to solve, but it is among the simplest conflicts in history to understand.

The Arab and other Muslim enemies of Israel (for the easily confused, this does not mean every Arab or every Muslim) want Israel destroyed. That is why there is a Middle East conflict. Everything else is commentary.

Those who deny this and ascribe the conflict to other reasons, such as "Israeli occupation," "Jewish settlements," a "cycle of violence," "the Zionist lobby" and the like, do so despite the fact that Israel's enemies regularly announce the reason for the conflict. The Iranian regime, Hizbollah, Hamas and the Palestinians -- in their public opinion polls, in their anti-Semitic school curricula and media, in their election of Hamas, in their support for terror against Israeli civilians in pre-1967 borders -- as well as their Muslim supporters around the world, all want the Jewish state annihilated.

In 1947-48, the Arab states tried to destroy the tiny Jewish state formed by the United Nations partition plan. In 1967, Egypt, Syria and Jordan tried to destroy Israel in what became known as the Six-Day War. All of this took place before Israel occupied one millimeter of Palestinian land and before there was a single Jewish settler in the West Bank.

Two months after the Six-Day War of June 5-10, 1967, the Arab countries convened in Khartoum, Sudan, and announced on Sept. 1, 1967, their famous "Three NOs" to Israel: "No peace, No recognition, No negotiations."

Six years later, in 1973, Egypt invaded the Israeli-held Sinai Peninsula, a war that ended in a boost in Egyptian morale from its initially successful surprise attack. Though nearly all of the Sinai remained in Israel's hands, the boost in Egyptian self-confidence enabled Egypt's visionary president, Anwar Sadat, four years later (November 1977), to do the unimaginable for an Arab leader: He visited Israel and addressed its parliament in Jerusalem. As a result, in 1978, Israel and Egypt signed a peace treaty in return for which Israel gave all of the oil-rich Sinai Peninsula back to Egypt.

Three years later, in 1981, Sadat was assassinated by Egyptian Muslims, a killing welcomed by most Arabs, including the PLO (Palestine Liberation Organization). Why welcomed? Because Sadat had done the unforgivable -- recognized Israel and made peace with it.

The lesson that Palestinians should have learned from the Israeli-Egyptian peace agreement was that if you make peace with Israel, you will not only get peace in return, you will also get all or nearly all of your land back. That is how much Israelis ache for peace.

Think about Israel for one moment: Israel is one of the most advanced countries on earth in terms of culture (most books published, translated from other languages and read per capita; most orchestras per capita, etc.); major advances in medicine; technological breakthroughs; and decency as a society, as exemplified by its treatment of its women, gays and even its large Arab minority (particularly remarkable in light of the widespread Arab and Muslim anti-Semitism and desire to annihilate Israel). This is hardly a picture of some bloodthirsty, land-grabbing society. And Jews, whatever their flaws, have never been known to be a violent people. If anything, the stereotypical Jew has been depicted as particularly docile.

As a lifelong liberal critic of Israeli policies, the New York Times foreign affairs columnist Thomas Friedman wrote just two weeks ago: "The Palestinians could have a state on the West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem tomorrow, if they and the Arab League clearly recognized Israel, normalized relations and renounced violence. Anyone who says otherwise doesn't know Israel today."

Give Israel peace, and Israel will give you land.

Which is exactly what Israel agreed to do in the last year of the Clinton administration. It offered PLO Chairman Yasser Arafat about 97 percent of the West Bank and three percent of Israel's land in exchange for peace. Instead, Israel got its men, women and children routinely blown up and maimed by Palestinian terrorists after the Palestinians rejected the Israeli offer at Camp David. Even President Clinton, desirous of being the honest broker and yearning to be history's Middle East peacemaker, blamed the ensuing violence entirely on the Palestinians.

Israel's Camp David offer of a Palestinian state for Palestinian peace was rejected because most Palestinians and their Arab and Muslim supporters don't want a second state. They want Israel destroyed. They admit it. Only those who wish Israel's demise and the willfully naive do not.

If you don't believe this, ask almost anyone living in the Middle East why there is a Middle East War, preferably in Arabic. If you ask in English, they will assume you are either an academic, a Western news reporter, a diplomat or a "peace activist." And then, they will assume you are gullible and will tell you that it's because of "Israeli occupation" or "the Zionist lobby."

But they know it isn't. And it never was.

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About The Author
Dennis Prager is a radio show host, contributing columnist for Townhall.com, and author of 4 books including Happiness Is a Serious Problem: A Human Nature Repair Manual.
 
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Logic not Emotion is called for now
I know that it is sick but I can't stop laughing at some of your posts here... especially you kraken... The inaccuracies in your 'facts', logic, spelling and grammar are histerical, lol.
I really don't care about the Israelites any more than I care about the French, Mexicans, or Japanese (well, ok, I care a lot about the Japanese, I do live here). I am a realist and believe in TRUE equality. Ergo (kraken, in case you dont understand, 'that lot like therefore'), I look at the 'middle eastern conflict' differently than Dennis and some others here, but I still come to the same conclusion.
People of Hebrew origin started moving to the area now known as Israel in the early 1900's. They did so legally and their land purchases were completely legit as well.
The UN made a split state of Israel after WWII and this pissed off the Arabs/muslims (honestly, what percentage of Arabs aren't muslim?). Many times they tried to take out the Jewish half of that country. They are still trying today.
If anyone here actually thinks that Israel or 'the Jews' are plotting to take over the world, they need to lay off the pipe. Israel has tried for a long time to have peace but the Arabs and muslims do not want peace at any cost or gain, they want blood. The Jewish population around the world has been highly successful, but that is probably due to the strict way of life that they adhere to. This can also be said of other people in the world. My current home, Japan, is much the same way. Have you ever met a poor Japanese person? Probably not since they follow a more disciplined lifestyle.
If you think that the the Arabs have a right to the land, then you should also think that the UN is the enemy, not the Israelites. Furthermore, those of you living in the good ol' US should look at it parallel to the Native American's position (though there is no true parallel here since we truly took the land from the Natives.): How would we feel about Navajo and Cherokee people blowing up cars in Dallas or LA? Would it be excusable at all? -of course not! Then again, they never would since they are not driven by a fanatical text that considers all non-Natives to be second class lives.
The bottom line here is that Israel has tried for peace for many years and the world has done its best to see that it doesn't get it, though not on purpose. The Arabs/muslims are devoted to the destruction of Israel and the conversion/death of the rest of the world.

Poor America turned into a Jewish puppet
My posts have been deleted over and over and over and here I go again! It’s just fun to un-mask what’s really been going on the American media.
Be aware that ultimately this is just fun. Just yesterday I read an article about people who protested vs USA involvement in WWII, they claimed exactly the same as I do today, even influential people like the pilot Lindbergh. I’ve come to realize that the Jewish power and dominion over the western world is meant to stay until they want…which may come some day. As great founders of the Liberalism (the same thing they pretend to fight today) they don’t like having babies and this could be their end. Fact is the birth rate is very low. They just want the high life.

This was my first deleted post:

Aha! I wrote 2 commentaries, and the last one was deleted. This is an example of the crookedness of this web site and/or its fanatic viewers who hypocritically say the Liberals are repressive. We’ll see how longs this one lasts! I’m even setting new account and nickname since this site won’t let me in! I was JohnDoe. Well, not for nothing one member (Colorado) once told me being Conservative is not about Foxnews, townhall.com or the Republicans. No, this is not a really conservative web site, this is another Jewish hoax.

What I said in my last blog is that this site and several more people and organizations are fighting the Liberal causes that the same Jews created over time. The top two examples are Karl Marx who promoted socialism and communism in the XIX century, and Sigmund Freud who started the sexual revolution (in soft ways by then) shortly after him. Later on, many Jews immigrated to America (everybody in here knows why, I can clearly see) and took over one new business: The Media; they had realized about its importance.

Yes, I remember several movies or TV programs with Jewish actors or characters; despite the fact that they don’t even make 1% of the American population, let alone the world population. Yet, does anybody remember a movie with either a Jewish character or actor playing bad guy? I do remember one, about machismo from orthodox Jewish, however it never become famous (I don’t remember its name) and one movie in the literally thousands that have been made is nothing. This is extremely weird and discriminatory, since the media has shown bad guys from all other races, nationalities, genders, ages and so forth, with the exception of this single untouchable group: the Jew. We all have heard about what the Nazis did to them, but nobody knows the German version. Nobody wonders how’s come one of the most civilized nations did what it did to them.

Today, you can see that the mainstream media is declining in sales (the editor from here gave specific figures in a recent article) and blasting it has become fashionable. However, the Jews are still on charge, just look how often columnist talk abot them and stand by them. For example Thomas Cal (such a proud conservative jerk writer) rejecting the idea that the Jews control de media (on the movie Oscar awards), Kathleen Parker even poking fun at Jesus Christ by saying “the guy is OK to me” when defending the Jew. Her commentary would have outrages everybody in other times; today she writes for this “Conservative” web site. What a joke. Even the bee (or wasp?) queen, Ann Coulter is another puppet at the Jewish service. For all her blast on the liberals, she is just a pawn.

The simple fact is that the Jews have realized that people have had enough of their products from the conventional media, and instead of insisting on stuffing folks with it, they have realized it’s more profitable to smash it with a new product, the “conservative” media. –The call it “creative destruction”- For example Foxnews was/is owned by the Jew Robert Murdoch, and in here everybody can see how much space has been given to Dennis Prager.

These Jewish business are simple great, not only they reach huge population bites they hadn’t swallowed, they get more support for Israel and raise their sales at the same time even faster. Nothing attracts so much like violence, not only Rambo-type but also verbal violence, the continuous blasting that is done here day after day against the “liberals”.

This whole thing of conservative vs liberal is worse than mumbo-jumbo, it’s a scam to turn USA into a puppet of Israel.

The Jewish wanted to settle down in the Palestine land and now they have to assume the full responsibility. Dr. Mike said they legally bought the land. Maybe, but now they have to deal alone with the mess they got into. Their torahs well said the way life was back when they were there. But no, the Jews want USA to pay for their broken dishes or throw a fit, just look at people like Dan blowing up in rage, LOL! So you want the world to remain barbarian as always. That’s what Dan said, that just because that’s the way it was in the apst it should be today: people being in wars for stealing each other.

And by the way, stop claiming you’re “Semite” because you’re NOT. The typical Jew from today is white Caucasian (or “Arian” as Mr. Hitler used to say). The real Semites are the Palestinians.

And finally, stop telling about all the bad thing preached by the Muslim religion because the bible has plenty of evilness as well. You can waste your time objecting about the bible, but the fact is that the Christianity has a history full of wars, greed, corruption and blood for more than a thousand years up until today. People who criticize the Muslims for being violent seem to be born yesterday, and must practice one of their so boasted values: honesty, honesty to admit that the Christian world hasn’t proved to be better than any other.


This was my second deleted post:

My humble apology

Sorry for my flawed spelling Dan, it’s just that I noticed everybody here so concerned for Israel that I never thought you’d cared about English. I promise next time I’ll try to post my message in Hebrew, do you mind I borrow from you a few thousand dollars for the English-Hebrew translation?

Dan is also right about my lack of reality appreciation, how the heck can I really know anything for real when the whole American media is Jew-dominated? Many people may know big names like Steven Spielberg are Jewish, but the list goes far larger to include All-American type people like Harrison Ford, Sarah Michelle Gellar, Dustin Hoffman, Alicia Silverstone, Natalie Portman,...I could go on forever! Not only this, I well remember lots of movies with Jewish characters. Nevertheless, they only make about 2% of the USA population as raidencraig well said. By the way, they erased his post as well! The fact is that the non-Jewish white American people have been discriminated in the media industry. There’s been a huge preference for the Jews. Either an actor or a character, the Jews almost always play good guy roles, which is discriminatory to all other types of humans as well.. Jews are the only ones who are always good. The bad guy roles have been the top Jew enemy way too many times, the Nazis. Sometimes, when watching American movies, it seems the single bad people in the world are the Nazis! Even Ann Coulter has poked fun at this fact.

Now, being serious, blasting and yelling doesn’t prove anything/body right. The American have had too much of the same bullying propaganda on fighting the Muslim world when USA does NOT need to deal with them in first place! The Muslims want foreigners out of their lands not conquering the world. Their attitude is not nice for sure, but there’s no need to insist. USA has the world’s biggest oil reserves in the Rocky Mountains. Bigger than Iraq’s or Saudi Arabia! It’s oil mixed with sand and rocks but there’s already technology to profitably extract it. The Canadians have the same type of oil in their rocky mountains and they have made great profits out of it. BUT NO, THE JEWS MANIPULATE USA and therefore we have to continue in the mid-east mess.

The REAL ENEMIES OF USA are the people who get us into wars we really don’t need! People like all the bloggers in here supporting neo-con Prager and the rest of monsters in here. Thousands of American soldiers are both murdering and being murdered for another nation! Nobody should ever get in the middle of a war where both sides (Muslims and Jews) are EVIL! USA must be gotten out of this mess! But no, the Jews control the media and they have spread the word that USA cannot dig oil fields because of the environmentalist! They even had best-selling writer Michael Crichton join this anti-enviro campaign! (his novel “State of Fear”) The media is telling that the tiny and poor enviro groups are more powerful that the whole nation and nobody objects them. Thus, blame the enviros for our war in the other side of the world where we can never get out!

You, Jews, are making understand why nobody liked you in Europe for the two thousand years you lived there. Just look at you brother Dan yelling and repeating same old stories. If you happen to be Christians watch the movie "Saved" just a sample on what Jews think about your religion. It’s not a secret movie, but a commercial one. Jews hate and despise your religion, don’t be blind.

IF you keep using and wiping USA for your own profit someday you history will repeat even when you are so powerful, bully and violent, At least you’ll have you precious right to claim victim again. That’s what Jews always do, hit first, next claim being victims when people defend against them. Never mind this site pretends to stand against the victim mentality that Liberals have preached for so long.

Dido Israel
I can hardly believe the pandering we do when some far left liberal cries about the outright lies our enemies spout about how horrible the United States is as fact. Our enemies torture and kill our soldiers and civilians, commit unspeakable barbaric acts against us and when we exercise our GOD given right of self defense, the traitorous liberal residents of this country speak of our defensive actions as if we really are the Great Satan the Islamic Jihad calls us and the Judaists are nothing more than persecuted innocents.

It is simply amazing how anyone can trash their own country the way some of our citizens, elected officials and liberal media do with no retribution from the conservative majority in this country. It is becoming more apparent that we all just sit around and talk about these issues like a bunch of paralytic slugs allowing this crap to continue with no response like it has no affect or serious consequences to the safety or freedom of the people of this country.

We are involved in a war that is for the survival of our nation and way of life, with an enemy that has no feelings of mercy in the prosecution of their ultimate goal; of the destruction of western civilization. In fighting this war, the practice should be, “no holds barred” make our enemies suffer to the point that war with us is so terrible that anything is more preferable. There should be no non-combatants in a war zone, there is just the living, the dead and the dying. Rules of engagement are: if you are not an ally, you are the enemy and have two choices, surrender unconditionally or die. If you do not want to participate in the combat get the hell out of the way or become collateral damage. In the war zone the living are fighting, the dead are casualties of war, and the dying are sticking their heads out where they do not belong. This is the way our Islamic jihads conduct themselves in prosecution of war against us they deserve no less in return.

We should accept the statements of not developing nuclear weapons as the lies they are and not treat those that make those statements with appeasement, do not give them the benefit of doubt. Make them prove without a shadow of doubt that they are in fact not planning WMD for use against us. Preemptive action is in fact what we should do. Let all know that to mess with the US of A is not the smart course of action as we will protect ourselves and our interests with all means at our disposal without prejudice and without restraint.

P.S. Kraken,
Use spell check. Your total lack of understanding and your lack of a firm grasp on reality is obvious.

Mr J - The Conflict
Again I am forced to write regarding the after facts of this enlightened forum.

People who say * Go read this !! is to me a text based learning that has the same ability to plagiarize the various equanimical controversies that creates a non thinking race. Also finding the townhall proved difficult considering I am in Australia* - Townhall change your forum from the states to worldwide so we all can log in and have a descent say rather than me choosing wiscousin with a postcode of 90210 to comment [.


Middle East Conflict
I have read a lot of back and forth arguments about who is the right full resident of the area known as Israel. If we all left land we now occupy, where some other group of people lived before our ancestors lived there, the entire population of the Earth would have to move to outer space. Throughout history we have conquered and been conquered. What is the difference today?
We all have a God given right to self defense. If we are attacked with deadly force we have a right and obligation to respond. Once force is used to enforce your position don’t cry if you get a black eye or worse. If I am attacked, live or die, you can bet you sweet ass I will fight for my families safety. I will use what ever force I deem necessary., including killing my attacker if it is within my power and necessary.
Israel has an ancient history in the land they now occupy. The land was and is now theirs. No matter who you are, if you chose to live with or near another, do it peacefully or suffer the consequences and shut up if you are punished or killed for trying to kill those you must live near or with.
If you want change do it peacefully and accept that the process is a marathon not a hundred yard dash. If you decide to use force, to the victor go the spoils and let everyone who doesn’t want to be injured get the hell out of the way.
This situation does not need a bunch of piss in their pants cry babies siding with a terrorist organization who’s stated goal is to destroy Israel, which is to kill a majority of the residents of the area.
At this point Israel has a right to the land they occupy and the surrounding countries do not have a right to do anything but live peacefully with Israel. Doing anything else should bring the wrath of Israel to the terrorist aggressors. We should stand back and let Israel do what they have proven over and over they can do when attacked, Kick the sh-t out of those who would do them harm, Bomb them all back to the stone age.

Israel / Islamic war
I have read a lot of back and forth arguments about who is the right full resident of the area known as Israel. If we all left land we now occupy, where some other group of people lived before our ancestors lived there, the entire population of the Earth would have to move to outer space. Throughout history we have conquered and been conquered. What is the difference today?
We all have a God given right to self defense. If we are attacked with deadly force we have a right and obligation to respond. Once force is used to enforce your position don’t cry if you get a black eye or worse. If I am attacked, live or die, you can bet you sweet ass I will fight for my families safety. I will use what ever force I deem necessary., including killing my attacker if it is within my power and necessary.
Israel has an ancient history in the land they now occupy. The land was and is now theirs. No matter who you are, if you chose to live with or near another, do it peacefully or suffer the consequences and shut up if you are punished or killed for trying to kill those you must live near or with.
If you want change do it peacefully and accept that the process is a marathon not a hundred yard dash. If you decide to use force, to the victor go the spoils and let everyone who doesn’t want to be injured get the hell out of the way.
This situation does not need a bunch of piss in their pants cry babies siding with a terrorist organization who’s stated goal is to destroy Israel, which is to kill a majority of the residents of the area.
At this point Israel has a right to the land they occupy and the surrounding countries do not have a right to do anything but live peacefully with Israel. Doing anything else should bring the wrath of Israel to the terrorist aggressors. We should stand back and let Israel do what they have proven over and over they can do when attacked, Kick the sh-t out of those who would do them harm, Bomb them all back to the stone age.

Arab Israeli conflict
Lots of smoke and mirrors about the root of this conflict.
I believe we must look at Germany in the 1920's and 30's, then read the Balfore Agreement.

Israel is a better place to live
I have only visited the Middle East two times. The first a mentor, who had ties with both sides, he was a World War II hero in Africa through Italy, was our tour guide. Our historian was the Chaplain of the British Army during WWII and his wife.

Our group stayed in East Jerusalem, and had a lecture from a PLO talking head giving us her ideas of struggle. My mentor was concerned we have a balanced and full view of the situation.

The second time was during the early 90's, without such a tour.

Both times it was clear to me, that the non-Jewish people were happy to be in Israel, and were treated much better than most Arabs or Palestinians in the entire Middle East.

Israeli’s are mostly non-religious. And they are socialistic and atheistic in their paradigm. With the exception of their country. But they understand the need for treating others with respect and dignity, and except for the ‘normal’ human political maneuvering which can be vicious, there is a practicality and common sense with most Israelis.

The Palestinian issue, especially the ‘camps’ seemed more to do with major Arab influence and power believes that solving the problem, or bringing these unfortunate people into their own countries, or dividing part of their countries to provide cities, infrastructure etc., is not politically expedient. Money, land, resources are not a big issue, except for Israel.

The point is Palestinians are not, nor ever wanted by any other Arab country. The economic issues were more evident of a culture of highly structured hierarchy, with fear and tradition keeping movement upward, or rewarding of initiative. Education and knowledge give people choices which it seems most leaders do not want their people to have, for the truth shows the leaders themselves to be men wanting power, and willing to use their own to keep it.

Palestinian camps have an average age of around 15 years. This is when young men, need to have purpose and higher ideals and hope of becoming significant to themselves, even if only to themselves, but to having a family and moving on. In these camps they are taught lies about the evil of the Jews, of the blessedness of martyring of themselves to find life and eradicate the Jews. With Clinton’s Onslow attempt at peace, Israel was willing to give almost their entire security advantage for peace. Arafat said no. Because without the hatred of the Jews, the anger all funneled to Israel as the reason for all their problems, and discontent, the impotency of the PLO, Hezbollah, leadership and authority to do anything required for peace and security would be exposed. Things like infrastructure, schools, health, a moving economy, competitive and growing without a death grip on their constituents is impossible. So the truth would expose these leaders.

easy to explain
Dennis is 100% right. You just need to read the Qur'an, in which "Allah" commands muslims to kill Jews. If you don't believe me, just read the Qur'an online, you'll find many versions with a Yahoo! search. I don't believe how naive so many people are, people who assume that muslims are peaceful like us, without ever have read their most basic book. Muslims prefer war, that's a religious obligation. Moreover, the goal of the believer is to subdue **all** nations by the saber until all the world is islamic. See also www.americancongressfortruth.org for a heart-wrenching account of life as a christian in a muslim country. Muslims are also supposed to **lie** to non-believers about their imperialistic ideals - there's even a name for that: Taqqiya.

Wake up and smell the coffee, America. The conflict is coming to our shores. Do you think that they will stop after having killed the Jews? The only solution - besides supporting Israel 100% - is to ban muslim immigration to this country, on the grounds that their culture is antagonistic to ours.

Basic Education
Some of the commenters need to go back to read "O Jerusalem" by Larry Collins and Dominique Lapierre. I recomend this book because it was a best seller and should be easy to obtain from a library. The authors make the point that by the time of the 1947 war the Jews had already purchased land legitimately through various Zionist organizations in both what would be Israel today and the West Bank. There had also been a Jewish presence in Israel and Jerusalem since Biblical times. It was also clear that the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem was allied with Hitler. The desire to kill Jews predates the establishment of Israel.

Modern politics is based on rational actors. When two rational parties sit down to negotiate there is a chance for success because it might be in the interests of both parties to compromise. So, the question before us could be framed as which of the parties is irrational? When one side builds greenhouses and the other side destroys them the answer is pretty clear. Clinton could not get a Peace Prize because of the irrationality of Arafat.

I also want to agree with the sentiment that there is not a distinct Palestinian people group. There are no linguistic or genetic differences between the people living on either side of the Jordan. If we went back to 1946 we would lable all of these people as Jordanian. I don't think Dennis was falling into a trap here. He was trying to make one point; the question of Palestinian nationality would be a good subject for another column.

THE PALESTINIANS ARE RIGHT!
I am not a Palestinian, Arab, Muslim, ex-Muslim or whatever the like. I’ve never even had a chat with those folks either. This is totally irrelevant because what is right has nothing to do with race, nationality or whatever else.

The Palestinian lands have always belonged to the Palestinians. Buckhuntr wrote:
“the entire region was nothing more than a rocky arid desert. The only people occupying this region was a handful of bedouin, camel riding, goat and sheep herders. There were few cities or settlements, other than Jerusalem, the City founded by the Jewish King David. The entire region was barren, unproductive and sparsely habitated.”

Thus, there were people living there! The BEDOUINS! And since this comes from a Israel-supporter, it figures that there must’ve been more Palestinians living there. After all, from reading the bible we see the Israelites never stopped fighting with their neighbors to whom they robbed their lands. The Israelites eventually left those lands after the Roman ruling, and the lands retuned to their very original owners until now.

They were poor people and from what I see, everybody in here is saying that just because they were poor they had no right to posses the lands they lived from who knows how long ago. USA, Canada and Australia, (maybe Great Britain and Norway) have huge lands very much like buckhuntr described wastelands. And nobody in here is going to tell me that Israel has a right to take over them and invade if necessary!

Hey! Why don’t we think about powerful aliens invading this world and taking over ¾ of USA and almost the whole Canada and Australia? They would rightfully (according to the current logics from here) that those are waste lands, populated by ignorant creatures.

What Dennis actually said is that if your house is being robbed, you should be thankful that the robbers are highly educated people, wearing fine tuxedos. Then, you should not do other thing than reaching a deal where they will give you back some of your OWN stuff and thank them. This is what Dennis said and everybody agreeing. Everybody ripped what they saw, this is the way the universe is -don’t ask me why- and someday you all be in this position as well with lots of people siding with your filthy robbers. You will deserve it!

Re-visit, "tough talk".
Russia lurks and smirks and loves the evil puppets works, China wines and dines as the puppets lie as others die, these lines of silken asian words are ever so easy to hear, "the rockets in their pockets are not ours", there,,
don't you see America its the loon who flys down North Korea way, now ? why can we not dance this evil puppet dance, well we are real boys not those made of wood.

AMERICAN LEADERSHIP

TEAR DONW THIS EVIL PUPPET AND ROCKET FACTORY THAT IS IRAN

Australia aligns with Dennis
Dutch law, was a descendant of the Napoleonic code and is a word called edification. As being with the codes of vista anomalies we have another problem here today and always tommorrow.

This new tension in the middle east amounts to various fortifications across the Israel and Gaza west banks... to have more borders to protect. Both sides have demonised themselves for taking lives and not creating peace, all though the steps taken have been met with fury and dispair. However the structured minds on those who have believed can be curtailed to a depth that is discombobulated and strengthened beyond any call to arms or religion. A jew is a jew...a "Palestinian is a terrorist" right or wrong...* The mind of either has been washed and cleansed to destroy what is unknown to them from neolithic pasts bar scriptures. I am not from either race. Moreover i can only subdue myself to sit back and watch the world virtually implode itself on beliefs from afar.

The USA is our alliance, as with the UN... the Commenwealth and all countries that have peace.

True in guidance to instruct those and improve especially in moral and religious knowledge; also : ENLIGHTEN, or INFORM"
.

May we all have a non-muslim nation to guide us and may we all live in peace. It's simple and can only agree so highly with Dennis.

Mr J from Australia


Israel No Choice But to Fight
When I look at these situations I do not want to go too far back in history. We need to deal with what we have now. Israel is recognized as a country and therefore they are entitled to live in peace. The problem with many in the world is that they expect the Jews to take a lacing and show restraint while their enemies attack and kill them with abandon.

the article DID write
Geez! I've read the comments and had to re-read the article because I was not sure I had read the same thing most of the commenters claim to have read.

Dennis makes one point and only one. The Arabs, in general, as a matter of policy and action want Israel destroyed. That's it. They want nothing else.

When the Israelis left Gaza this last time, Israel left fully functioning greenhouses and detailed instructions on the operation and care. Israel wanted the Palestinians to be able to grow their own food. Did the Palis do that? No! The greemhouses were destroyed, the generators stolen, the crops in production weren't eaten, but pulled out by the roots. The Palestinians didn't want Israeli technology or food; they just want Israel destroyed.

The history presented is not complete and detailed because of finite space and "The Official Complete History of the Middle East Conflict" was not the topic. But, the detailed history would be irrelevant because it will always boil down to that one inescapable salient point - the Arabs want Israel destroyed.

SharpsRifle
While I agree with much of what you say, I've spoken with Egyptians who had been involved in Islam but left it. They both stated that Ishmaelites started what evolved into Islam; the hate Islamists have for Jews is based on Ishmael's mother Hager being a slave of Isaac's mother (Abraham's wife) Sarah and was driven into the desert by Sarah; as the first born (by custom) Ishmael would have inherited Abraham's wealth but was denied (due to Sarah's actions). If you wish to disagree with ex-Muslims, so be it.

July 18/06 Middle East conflict
Dear Dennis
I appreciated your article very much. It was right on. Yes, the answer is so simple that most of the "genius' posters above completely missed it. God says in the Bible, "Professing themselves to be wise, they become fools." Peter

Greg
The problem is one of moral relativism which so many people ascribe to these days out of fear of being labeled “judgmental”.

It astounds me to find many of my liberal friends supporting tyrannical and corrupt autocracies over a tolerant democracy. They prefer the murderous regimes of state-mandated religion, women treated as property, freedom of speech and expression curtailed, and of civilian targeting homicide bombers.

Moral Relativism teaches that no one culture is better than the other. I respectfully beg to differ in that regard.

Phylo
Firstly, it is silly to complain about an opinion columnist being partisan. They are paid to express an opinion. They are generally hired by a publishing company that caters to a demographic. In the opinion business, that demographic is partisan one way or the other.

Secondly, it is foolish to claim his article doesn't give credence to the Palestinian claim. He does not address legitimacy of EITHER side's claim. He is merely pointing out a few facts.

a.) The Arab nations/PLO are not be fully honest with their claims. The complete destruction of Israel is now and has always been their ultimate goal. Most of their claims are just window dressing for the international community to weep and moan about the plight of the poor Palestinians.

and

b.) The Palestinians have systematically rejected any serious bids for peace because they those bids do not include the complete annihilation of Israel.

This is not narcissicm as much as it is being a realist. It is foolish to expect the Israelis to abandon a land they feel is rightfully theirs, a land they have bled for and brought up from nothing. They will never accept a deal that eliminates the state of Israel, but they are willing to make concessions.

The Palestinians, on the other hand, take the concessions as simply as baby-steps towards the ultimate goal. The violence continues simply because the fanatics in the area refuse to accept anything less.

Mr. Prager is simply pointing out that one side has constantly made bids for peace, while the other side has systematically rejected every one.

If you do not believe this is racially and religiously motivated hatred against the Jews, then why are there not any calls from the international community for Jordan to return the land it seized from the Palestinian mandate? It is a significantly much larger portion.

revisionist history
thanks for adding some clarity, Bondmanp, to disperse Warrior's dark Clouds of Confusion. DocJ's sensible comments were also appreciated. I'm a bit surprised to see how many readers here have bought into the Arab revisionism. The area in question was home to the Jews at least 3000 years (that's 3 millennia)before Islam was even conceived, shortly after which it began it's violent conquest of territory stretching from Spain to Indonesia. Of course, once lands have been thus conquered, claimed and subjugated by Islam, it is an unspoken tenet of that "religion" (of "peace" no less!) that those lands must ever be held, never ceded back to the infidels. (They're still smarting over the loss of Spain 500 years ago, which they feel a right - make that a duty - to reclaim.)

Meanwhile, there are over 1 million Arabs living freely in Israel, while Arab countries insist on being and remaining Jew-free. How any fair minded person can find this acceptable and/or defensible is beyond me. (But I have a strong feeling that those who support the Arabs on this score are the same multiculti hypocrites demanding open borders here at home....and the "right of return" for all "palestinian" Arabs.) Throughout the Arab world, Jews were forcibly evicted from their homes. Returning to their ancient homeland, they created a successful society in very short order. The displaced Arabs, by contrast, have done nothing but stew in their own bile since the state of Israel was RE-created, milking their self-perpetuated victim status for all it is worth to con the West's many useful idiots. I'm just surprised to find so many of them on this forum/website!

Review History
In 1947 when Israel was reinstated (having been "evicted" by the Romans in 70 AD) the entire region was nothing more than a rocky arid desert. The only people occupying this region was a handful of bedouin, camel riding, goat and sheep herders. There were few cities or settlements, other than Jerusalem, the City founded by the Jewish King David. The entire region was barren, unproductive and sparsely habitated. The UN recognizing Israels ancient history in the region decided it was in the entire worlds best interest to let the Jewish People settle in their historic homeland, about the size of the State of Rhode Island, a postage stamp sized piece of Real Estate. Within days war was decended upon this infant nation but the Religion of Peace, Islam.

As to the claims of the Palestinians, who by the way, got their name from the Roman Empire and are not a genetically distinct peoples. They are a potpouri of the surrounding Arab countries, who refuse to assimilate their own flesh and blood.

For all of you "blinded fools" who refuse to believe what is written in The Bible, all of this history and todays happenings were forecast is vivid details nearly 2500 years ago. The only events to be questioned are the ones that have not happened yet. Modern archeology is everyday proving the Bible to historically accurate. Even excuvations of other ancient cities are uncovering proof of the Bibles accuracy. Whether or not you choose to read, study or believe the Bible, doesn't make it any less true. It is still the Truth.

Israel has turned this wasteland into one of the most productive and prolific areas in the entire world, again prophysied in the Old Testament, they are a Rose blooming in the desert!! Israel will survive and prosper and its enemies will not! They are the Apple if God's Eye.

donsingleton:
You are completeley correct!

My point to Prager is not that Israel should try try to retain the disputed territories (although personally I feel that doing so is the only way to safeguard Israel), but rather that he has bought into the lies of the Arabs who whine about how Israel stole "their" land, and how the Jews don't belong in Palestine. Once you accept the lie that Palestinian Arabs are the rightful owners of Gaza and the West Bank, you also de facto accept that Palestinian Arabs have a legitimate claim to all of Palestine, including pre-1967 Israel, and that the Jews have no claim to their ancestral homeland.

My question to you then is, why do the Arabs have a legitimate claim to Gaza and the West Bank, but not to Haifa and Tel Aviv? When answering, keep in mind the points I made in my (regretfully duplicated) original comment.

Thanks.


Doc J
You miss my point entirely Doc J. My point is that Prager wants to say that the problem is so simple––it's all the Palestinians fault for being angry that their land was taken away. In other words, he's ONLY seeing the conflict from the point of view of a person who is on the side of Israel. He is totally ignoring the fact that the Palestinians have legitimate gripes that aren't being addressed. So naturally the situation seems simple to Prager––"it's all the fault of the Arabs and the Palestinians."

A narcissist is a person who can only see reality from their own point of view, and is unable to consider the point of view of others. So I think my narcissist comment was spot on. Besides, I've listened to this guy a lot. He's pathologically partisan. He is totally incabable of seeing the faults of his own party. All he seems to be able to see are the faults of the left. Just like a narcissist.







I tried to post a trackback (http://donsingleton.blogspot.com/2006/07/hard-to-solve-but-easy-to-explain.html) with my comments, but it would not take it. In it is a response to bondmanp: your description of history would justify Israel's claim on the rest of the West Bank (Judea and Samaria), and those might well be more defensible borders, but that is not what Israel is asking for. They would be happy allowing a Palestenian country to be formed in the West Bank, if it would be a country at peace with Israel.

Present conflict
The wonderful people who like talking with the enemy. Rminds of the tale of try to wi a contest urenating with a pole cat. Old indians new that one. bgbl@my mailstation .com

How could you, Dennis?
I feel very betrayed. How could Dennis Prager, who heretofore has spoken the truth, spread such terrible lies about the Arab-Israeli conflict? Does Prager have any knowledge of British Mandatory-era history? If he did, he would have made sure to include these facts that place the conflict into perspective:

1. There never was a "Palestinian" people prior to the 1964 formation of the PLO, an Egyptian proxy army created to weaken Israel and contribute to its destruction. Prior to 1947, "Palestinans" referred to residents of British Mandatory Palestine, and that included Palestinian Jews. Most of the Palestinian Arabs in Palestine in 1947 came from adjacent Arab countries. They were attracted by the economic opportunities that the Zionists were creating as they built up the land. (For a description of Palestine before massive immigration of European Jews, read Mark Twain's travelogue from the 19th Century.)

2. ALL of British Mandatory Palestine was to be open to Jewish settlement. This included what is now Jordan, Judea, Samaria and Gaza. The British government handed Trans-Jordan to the Hashemite dynasty in 1922 as a reward for their assistance in WWI. This, despite the fact that the Hashemites were and are a tiny minority in the region. Most Palestinian Arabs have made what is now Jordan their home.

3. Even under the UN Partition Plan, Gaza (an area with a Jewish history that long predates Islam) was "unallocated" territory given neither to Arabs or Jews. It was seized by Egypt in the 1948 war of aggression, which is why no nation except Egypt ever accepted Egyptian soveriegnty over Gaza. Similarly, Jordan illegally seized Judea and Samaria ("The West Bank") in the same war. Gaza and the West Bank were never intended to be part of any Jew-free Arab country. Conversely, Israel liberated these territories in a defensive war, giving Israel, according to UN rules, the right to retain these lands. That is why a UN resolution was necessary to force Israel to make territorial concessions in the disputed territories for peace treaties (although the UN resolutions intentionally refrained from calling for "all territories" to be traded for peace; only for "territories" captured in the 1967 war).

What you have done, Mr. Prager, is to play fully into the evil hands of the Islamic aggressors by ignoring history and accepting illegitimate Arab claims over Gaza, Judea and Samaria. By holding out the promise of getting their "rightful" land back when it was never theirs to begin with, you have lent support to those who seek to dismantle Israel piece by piece until it can no longer defend itself from the Arab-Muslim onslaught. Shame on you, Dennis.

Prager: HOW COULD YOU?
I feel betrayed. How could Dennis Prager, who heretofore has spoken the truth, spread such terrible lies about the Arab-Israeli conflict? Does Prager have any knowledge of British Mandatory-era history? If he did, he would have made sure to include these facts that place the conflict into perspective:

1. There never was a "Palestinian" people prior to the 1964 (three years before Israel liberated the disputed territories) formation of the PLO, an Egyptian proxy army created to weaken Israel and contribute to its destruction. Prior to 1947, "Palestinans" referred to residents of British Mandatory Palestine, and that included Palestinian Jews. Most of the Palestinian Arabs in Palestine in 1947 came from adjacent Arab countries. They were attracted by the economic opportunities that the Zionists were creating as they built up the land. (For a description of Palestine before massive immigration of European Jews, read Mark Twain's travelogue from the 19th Century - there was no "there" there.)

2. ALL of British Mandatory Palestine was to be open to Jewish settlement. This included what is now Jordan, Judea, Samaria and Gaza. The British government handed Trans-Jordan to the Hashemite dynasty in 1922 as a reward for their assistance in WWI. This, despite the fact that the Hashemites were and are a tiny minority in the region. Most Palestinian Arabs have made what is now Jordan their home.

3. Even under the UN Partition Plan, Gaza (an area with a Jewish history that long predates Islam) was "unallocated" territory ceded neither to Arabs or Jews. It was seized by Egypt in the 1948 war of aggression, which is why no nation except Egypt ever accepted Egyptian soveriegnty over Gaza. Similarly, Jordan illegally seized Judea and Samaria ("The West Bank") in the same war. Gaza and the West Bank were never intended to be part of any Jew-free Arab country. Conversely, Israel came to control these territories as a result of defending itself against foreign attackers, circumstances which, according to the UN, means that Israel has a right to retain these territories.

What you have done, Mr. Prager, is to play fully into the evil hands of the Islamic aggressors by ignoring history and accepting illegitimate Arab claims over Gaza, Judea and Samaria. By holding out the promise of "getting their own land back," you have lent support to those who seek to dismantle Israel piece by piece until it can no longer defend itself from the Arab-Muslim onslaught. This "phased destruction" plan was adopted by the PLO after the 1973 Yom Kippur War failed to destroy Israel in one blow.

Shame on Dennis Prager for supporting those who would "push the Jews into the Sea."

No narcissism
Phylo Se Fizer labels our host. How narcissistic of him/her! I am amazed at the wild manner people throw such labels around. Ad hominium attacks are always the mark of a desperate argument.

No, the issue is whether the Jews will survive. I am in favor of them surviving. People have taken land from each other since day one, Phylo. Get over it. The modern western native americans took land from the Anasazi culture. Then we took their land. It is nonsense to pretend otherwise. So the Jews have land that some palestinians had before. So? I live on land that nominally belonged to Mexico, and before that, Spain, before that Shoshone / Utes / et al., , before that ??? It is a stupid argument.

Warrior - partially right (mostly left)
What made it "worthless" was the mis-keying of Ishmael. Various ex-Islamists I've spoken with have validated the accuracty of the comment. As far as turning off those who attempt to discredit the book of history you refer to as the bible - "who cares"?, as its record of history is far more accurate than what is taught as history by the NEA in today's classrooms by Marxists such as Ward Churchill or Jay Bennish.

C'mon Prager
I see, so there would be peace in the Middle East if only the Arabs and Palestinians would give up their desire to get their land back.

It's easy for Israelis (and their supporters) to say this because they are the ones sitting on the land. If someone acquired your home, by what you felt were illegitimate means, the new occupants would be quite happy with the status quo, but you would not. And knowing you, I suspect that you would fight to get it back. You might even resort to what you would call "moral violence". Then the new occupants might complain about the terrorist Dennis Prager. And everyone would say, well, if Dennis would only give up his desire to get his land back there would be peace.

Not so simple now, is it Prager? The only reason you think it's so simple is because you are a narcissist––you can only see reality from your own point of view. And like all true narcissists, you don't know that you are a narcissist.

OK, just for argument's sake, I agree that Israel was founded on the ethnic cleansing of the rightful occupants of the land, that Israel's very existence is a crime, that if we were in the Palistinians' shoes, you and I would hate Israel and the USA too. Fine. Granted. Agreed.

My question is, so what? What does it have to do with the questions facing us: Is it a fight to the death between Israel and the Palistinians, Syria, Iran? If it is, who do we want to die? What should be done to make that happen?
Questions #1 is unfortunately a no-brainer. #2 is obvious. #3 is unspeakable, at least today.

Theological problem
Anyone who believes that blowing yourself up in a crowd of innocent women and children will achieve you everlasting paradise is dangerously deceived. It is not rational or logical to believe that evil deeds will be rewarded with good. Evil is punished. Sadly these people are deceived by their hate into acting in ways which reward them with eternal punishment.

anti-socialist
Me too! Your comment is worthless for 2 reasons. Everyone does not believe in or read the Bible. To quote the Bible to these people means nothing and turns them off. Additionally, quoting the Bible is an irrefutable, superfluous source for an argument because the Bible cannot answer back and the Bible is incapable of being questioned by a non-believer.
Inanimate objects cannot be cross examined. Moreover, Bibical arguments are boring.

Clouds of Confusion
Prager has written an article which only a fool would believe. This paragraph is key:
"In 1947-48, the Arab states tried to destroy the tiny Jewish state formed by the United Nations partition plan. In 1967, Egypt, Syria and Jordan tried to destroy Israel in what became known as the Six-Day War. All of this took place before Israel occupied one millimeter of Palestinian land and before there was a single Jewish settler in the West Bank".
Key thoughts:1."The United Nations partition plan"--Who are the UN? How many Palestinians had a say in this partition? What was partitioned?
2."All of this took place before Israel occupied one millimeter of Palestinian land"--Really, where did the land Israel was formed on come from? Once Israel was formed , was the land not occupied? Were towns, villages, and communes not created/occupied by Jews displaced from Europe? Where was David Ben-Gurian from? Was he not a Communist(did he not publicly state he was a Bolshevik), a terrorist, and anti-religion?
Prager wants us to believe the world was formed in 1946 with Israel already in existence as a nation and the Arabs (all of them) already imbued with a hatred for this state God created.
This whole piece smells and I take it as an affront to any man endowed with the capacity for rational thought.

The other hand
Israel was promised peace for Gaza and the West Bank. They did not get what they negotiated. Perhaps the Palestinians should also now forfiet their land until the next "peace" negotiation. Israel (and the USA) need to impress upon the Islamofacists that it stands with the olive branch in one hand and the sword in the other. To not have offered the olive branch would have been immoral. But to have that branch taken, and then used as a whip in their face, justifies that it is now time for the other hand. May they strike hard and deep.

no peace till surrender
To have a negotiated peace you must have 2 sides that will negotiate in good faith. The Arabs will never negotiate in good faith and have a history of being untrustworthy. The solution in the middle east is to keep Condi Rice as far away as possible and to let the UN talk forever. During this time the Israelis can keep kicking the crap out of the enemy killing them till they surrender or until they are all dead. This is how you get peace in the middle east. (And if the Syrians want to play turn Damascus into East Berlin 1946.)

Islam was founded on the hate the Ishmaelites had for the Jews - hate which has existed since Hagar & Ishael were sent into the desert by Sarah, the mother of Isaac.
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