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Thursday, July 17, 2008
Debra J. Saunders :: Townhall.com Columnist
Obama's Pander on Immigration
by Debra J. Saunders
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When Barack Obama addressed the National Council of La Raza on Sunday, he pandered when he said America's immigration system "isn't working ... when companies hire undocumented immigrants instead of legal citizens to avoid paying overtime or to avoid a union; when communities are terrorized by (U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency) raids -- when nursing mothers are torn from their babies, when children come home from school to find their parents missing, when people are detained without access to legal counsel."

When Obama accuses the men and woman who administer federal laws of viciously tearing nursing babies from their mothers' breasts and abandoning young children, his words eerily echoed a 1995 NRA fundraising letter that claimed that a federal ban on some semi-automatic weapons "gives jack-booted government thugs more power to take away our constitutional rights, break in our doors, seize our guns, destroy our property, and even injure or kill us."

NRA exec Wayne LaPierre took a lot of heat for demonizing federal agents. Will Obama have to answer for calling ICE agents child-abusing thugs?

As happens, Obama was trying to have it both ways. The Change Candidate started off criticizing a system that failed to stop employers from hiring illegal workers. Then in the next breath, he slapped ICE officials for making arrests at workplaces believed to flout the law.

And to get there, he trashed the very people who risk their safety enforcing laws enacted by the people's representatives.

Or as U.S. Attorney Joe Russoniello noted, "Criticizing law enforcement officers for carrying out their sworn duty is unfair." After all, "they didn't create the crisis."

ICE spokesman Tim Counts sent me this response to Obama's remarks: "Our procedures for addressing humanitarian issues, including child-care situations, go far beyond what any other law enforcement agency has in place. We routinely conditionally release parents so that they can care for their children. We have great compassion for the children involved. Quite simply, however, parenthood does not make you immune from having to comply with the nation's laws, and the responsibility for any family disruption lies squarely with the violator."

I read the Obama quote to John Trasvina, president of the Mexican American Legal Defense and Educational Fund, and asked: Is the situation that bad?

"Sometimes the fear is worse than the reality," he answered. People panic when being caught means deportation, and losing whatever lives people have built here.

I hear that if children are left alone after ICE arrests, it is often because parents lie to agents. Sometimes parents lie, Trasvina answered, because "they are so afraid that if they disclose where they live, their children are going to get deported, too."

Trasvina does not support ICE's targeting of scofflaw employers because the workers, more than the employers, pay the price. Instead, ICE should concentrate on illegal immigrants with serious criminal records: "That would keep them very, very busy."

But when ICE targeted "immigration fugitives" -- illegal immigrants who had violated deportation orders -- in northern California last year, critics like San Francisco Mayor Gavin Newsom railed against ICE "raids."

No matter who the target is, they'll cry foul. You see, even if agents are looking for the worst offenders, they have no choice but to arrest every illegal immigrant they encounter.

And for that they get called every name in the book -- even by men who help write the laws.

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Hardly
"The ONLY solution is a resolve to enforce EXISTING laws everywhere. When they realize that there are no ILLEGAL jobs or freebies, they will repatriate at THEIR expense-- the same way they came. So much for the straw man challenge: we cannot deport 12 million!"

First, the thesis that so-called tough sanctions against illegals caused their exodus from Arizona is a point of debate as a professor once said to me, univariate analysis is the hallmark of a neophyte scholar. The downturn in the housing market in Arizona where many illegals worked--landscaping, construction, etc is just as likely a cause of the exodus. Second, just say you are right. Okay, let's use Taiwan as an example, if there is a huge crackdown on illegals in say Nantou, but not in Taichung, they would just go across the county line (no states in Taiwan) to Taichung or Miaoli. In the US, if you have a crackdown in say Georgia, they'll go to Alabama. So you say have a crackdown everywhere--well, then they'll just bear it, because being a illegal in the US even under a tough immigration regime is better than living as a peasant in Mexico.

Also, the US is unwilling to accept what it would take to really get tough--e.g. biometric national ID cards which I support nor spend the resources to make sanctions on employers really bite. Until you do that you are just spiting at heaven.

Oh and many of the 12 million have put down roots in America--American spouses, American chilren, owning American businesses and property--sorry but sooner or later you are going to have to normalize these people because they aren't going anywhere, get used to it.


comprehensive
we don't need COMPREHENSIVE (read amnesty) immigration reform.
we just need the government to enforce the existing laws which are adequate.
put bill gates in jail if he has an illegal nanny.
diane feinstein had an illegal working in her home.
mccain's God's children. is mccain moses?
and they are here to do the jobs americans won't.
if so:

can we elect illegal aliens that will do the job that our elected government won't do?

adios,
a.b. normal
lancaster, mexifornia, greater aztlan
vamanos gringo
dial 1 for english

la raza
the ford foundation has donated 600,000 + to la raza.
miller breweries have donated to la raza. to support drinko de mayo i guess.

adios,
a.b. normal
dial 1 for english

viva la raza viva juan mccain
and when john climbed the la raza pyramid and they cut out his heart and showed u.s. citizens how he could also pander to the marxist, chevista, fidelista, stalinist loving group.
and help the chicken factories cut costs.
both candidates failed the american people by talking amnestia.

i get spanish lessons from the walmart aisles.
i just need some grammar to please Herr Obama.

barry obama should visit yugoslavia, quebec, soviet disunion, cz, and see how multilingual countries cannot survive.

mccain wanted to keep north vietnamese out of south vietnam, but wants southern foreigners to freely come to greater aztlanifornia.
when they legalize 20 million-85% from mexico, a survey south of the border's result showed that 70,000,000 more illiterate peons from the south would crash the border within a 60 day period. and what of central america, china, india, and other overrepresented illegal alien origin countries will rush in?
adios,
a.b. normal
lancaster, mexifornia
dial 1 for english

Mexico's #1 export ? -- CRIME !


There are MANY things wrong with tolerating the ILLEGAL alien invasion and pervasion of America, but the most basic must surely be the crime, drugs, and gangs which go with ILLEGAL aliens like flies go to manure. The PC ilk tries to obfuscate the realities, but people all over America simply KNOW better.

States which initially granted them drivers' licenses like N.C. had to pull back on that because of the crime waves/gangs which followed. States like Az. and Ok. are now seeing an exodus after passing tough anti-ILLEGAL enforcement laws, but the ILLEGALS simply move on to where it is easier to get along.

The ONLY solution is a resolve to enforce EXISTING laws everywhere. When they realize that there are no ILLEGAL jobs or freebies, they will repatriate at THEIR expense-- the same way they came. So much for the straw man challenge: we cannot deport 12 million!

This is certainly not to say that many ILLEGALS are not basically decent, law-abiding people, but EVERY ILLEGAL who works here is not just border crashing or violating a visa-- s/he is, by definition, committing multiple felonies (typically identity fraud and tax dodging at a minimum) just to work.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=research_ill egalsandcrime
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=51259
http://newswithviews.com/Wooldridge/frosty2.htm
http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=54132
http://www.newsmax.com/headlines/mexico_immigration/2007/09 /28/36496.html?s=al&promo_code=3A98-1
http://www.usillegalaliens.com/impacts_of_illegal_immigrati on_crime_summary.htm

the Conspiracy Of Evil
I agree that marxism is not in the offing, BUT

The biggest challenge about stopping ILLEGAL aliens is that the money and organization (hence power) is on the other side. The pro-ILLEGAL forces include an unlikely, strange bedfellow alliance between groups which want to use them in different ways-- the Conspiracy Of Evil.

Miscreant employers simply want to exploit their labor-- screw the myriad egregious socio-economic problems they foist on America. The PC left wants to get them voting and seize permanent control for big entitlement government. The scandal-plagued Catholic Church needs replacement bodies for the pews; and
ILLEGALS can put more in the collection plates in America than in Mexico. Ethnocentric Hispanic groups really do want an effective Reconquista, so they hide behind claims of racism and pleas for PC multiculturalism.

Finally, the remote elites including the liberal MSM do not see what all the fuss is about. Besides, they LIKE their cheap ILLEGAL maids and yard-workers, and THEIR kids
will not go to schools enervated by "those people."

Easily 70% of America is righteously indignant about ILLEGAL aliens, but they are not also buying the pols like the employer lobby. See how YOU can get involved to save your country at my posts below

Oh please!
"Our political elites are pushing us relentlessly toward totalitarian marxism."

Yes. I just read Obama's secret plan for America--he is going to abolish private property, outlaw all parties but the newly named American People's Party for Liberty and Enlightenment (APPLE), state control of all mass medida...no he's not.

The US is not going toward Marxism and to say so makes you look like a complete idiot.

Hopeless........
It's hopeless, the erasing of the border, the "Mexicanization" of the USA is almost complete.

Bilingual, bicultural nation is almost complete. The US government has created a social engineering project to change the US population from majority caucasian to one where there is no majority race/ethnicity. It's almost complete.

The chronically corrupt Mexico couldn't exist without it's parasitic relationship with the US. We've been brought down to the level of the Mestizo peasant, thanks to Bush, Clinton, Kennedy, McCain, Osama/Obama, etc.

I Give Up
America's elite political class simply doesn't care what I think. Neither political party represents me, both parties betray me. I have no stake in the continuation of this farce. Our political elites are pushing us relentlessly toward totalitarian marxism. There is only one way to stop it, and politics is not the way. Americans are willing to be slaves if they can be comfortable. Most of them aren't worth worrying about. They are stupid sheep who will follow anyone who promises to make them comfortable. Voting is a waste of time. Where are the revolutionary leaders who will start the process of renewal? Our political parties serve up nothing but warmed over puke.

at least Obama's pander makes sense
Hussein knows that he can garner some Hispanic votes by pandering to their racist lobbying groups-- La Raza, LULAC, etc.

Consider instead poor, foolish Amnesty Juan McQuisling-- he is losing more than 2:1 among Hispanics to Obamanation... but worse still, he is alienating Middle Americans righteously indignant about McAmnesty pandering for the Hispanic vote via Kennedy-McQuisling ilk efforts and groveling to La Raza. Ergo, he is getting whipsawed both ways!

RINOS who imagine that they can appeal to the supposed "conservative social values" among Hispanics are sniffing glue. The PC left correctly KNOWS that current ILLEGALS will vote 95:5 for big entitlement government... the other 5 will simply not be able to read their Spanish voting instructions. What, pray tell, is "conservative" about penchants for crime, drugs, gangs, illegitimacies, identity fraud, etc.?!

How much do ILLEGALS cost us? (Part. 2)


(stunning inconvenient truths)

8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for welfare & social services by American taxpayers.
http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html

9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused by illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

10. Illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children, are going to create a huge additional crime problem in the US.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html

11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10MILLION illegal aliens that crossed our southern border; also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from terrorist countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroin and marijuana, crossed into the U.S. from the Southern border. Homeland Security Report...
http://tinyurl.com/t9sht

12. The National Policy Institute estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period.
http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf

13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back to their countries of origin.
http://www.rense.co m/general75/niht.htm

14. “The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants In The United States.”
http://www.drdsk.com/articles.html

Still sound like "cheap" labor to you?!

How much do ILLEGAL aliens cost us?


Just a few of the myriad and snowballing direct costs of ILLEGAL aliens to contemplate... does it still sound like "cheap" labor now?!?!

1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens each year by state governments.
http://tinyurl.com/zob77

2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens.
http://www.cis..org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens.
http://www.cis..org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html

5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.htmlG ALS

the worst hypocrites about ILLEGALS

... are the wealthy remote "elites" (see Geraldo, Smilin' Juan Hernandez, and Linda Chavez). Linda Chavez is a case in point. She writes routinely about the alleged benefits of ILLEGAL aliens, BUT she never fesses up that she sits on the board of a huge janitorial company which willfully and ILLEGALLY employs them! Consider uber lib Nancy Pelosi... she brays about compassion for ILLEGALS and supports scamnesty even as her crooked wealthy husband employs them and crime stats to be work ILLEGALLY in her vineyards.

ILLEGALS are simply "the new slaves" in a very real socio-economic sense-- the relative few in America benefit ILLEGALLY from their labors (YOUR hotel room and vegetables are no cheaper to YOU), but the legacy will be DEVASTATING for the many (citizens and taxpayers) who will inherit the pandemic social pathologies and pay for the re-stoked welfare state, which the prolific ILLEGALS will soon insist upon with numbers.

Those who do not learn from the mistakes of history are condemned to repeat them. Much of Europe now faces the inevitable hegemony of Shariah Law in a generation because they myopically imported Islamic Arabs to do their mean tasks... the native populations never fathomed making them equal citizens, but they are inexorably being outbred.

Guest worker programs nearly always backfire UNLESS rigidly enforced. Worse still, "amnestia" only begets a bigger invasion... RR admitted that the worst mistake of his political life was getting snookered into amnesty for just over 1 million (which proved to be 3 million!) in exchange for a promise of tough enforcement that was never funded by the snickering PC Kennedy con-artist ilk.

must we actually deport 12 million?


Artful apologia for ILLEGAL aliens by the MSM, the PC ilk, racist/ethnocentric Hispanic lobbyists, and miscreant employer interests suggests that "we cannot deport 12 million," but this is an egregiously disingenuous false choice. First, if the govt. admits to 12 million, they surely know that there are MANY more. We have over 37 million now here who are foreign born-- WAY TOO MANY of them ILLEGAL.

The red herring false dilemma subterfuge of the deportation dilemma has been proffered WAY TOO OFTEN. Tough new anti-ILLEGAL enforcement laws (approved with about half of the LEGAL Hispanic vote, I might add) took effect in Az. on Jan. 1. Guess what is happening there? Already, Arizona residents report trucks packed high with belongings heading back home to Mexico. In other states when new laws reverse sanctuary-ilk policies, typically due to citizen outrage over crime rates and social service decimation, ILLEGALS pick up and move like locusts to ravage elsewhere.

We need only reverse the PC, RINO, open border, globalist message with this reality--> America needs/wants ONLY LEGAL, EDUCATED immigrants who can contribute on balance and want to become AMERICANS, NOT the madding crowd of ILLEGAL, ignorant, indigent, culturally disparate who will ineluctably become HUGE net users of government services. Each such family will suck out $1.4 MILLION more in services than taxes paid in a lifetime (Heritage)-- ASSUMING they actually begin paying taxes!

The equation is actually surprisingly straightforward-- no jobs, no freebies, no amnestia-- NO STAY! Vamanos al Mexico, muchachos! Hasta la vista, baby!

Join the sacred fight to save America!


Presidente Jorge has put out a, "Bienvenido, amigos" sign down on the border. It will not be easy to force the political will against the powerful Conspiracy Of Evil, even though > 70%+ of Americans want the result. We MUST enforce existing laws, or lose America to the ILLEGAL alien invasion of the ignorant indigent.

Many pols have been bought and paid for by the Reconquista lobby ilk, and mainly by the miscreant employer/Chamber lobbies who bray the disingenuous drivel about "America must have that cheap labor to do those jobs Americans won't do."

HOGWASH! Americans simply expect a living wage to do those jobs. When the govt. makes token show raids on meat plants, etc., Americans return to those jobs immediately. ILLEGAL alien employers are NOT saving YOU money-- your hotel room or head of lettuce is NO cheaper to YOU.

The above forces of evil are aided and abetted by the PC multicultural cabal, including the remote "elite" MSM, and the scandal-ridden Catholic Church trying to fill those vacant pews with better paying ILLEGALS.

Keep rattling the cages in Congress so the money flowing from the special interests will seem less "special" to them. It is easy to reach them at numbersUSA.com with prepared, targeted e-mails, or you can send direct e-mails or call them at their official contact sites and offices just below... BOOKMARK
these sites and contact legislators OFTEN and with vigor... tell them you support the SAVE Act:

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm

http://www.numbersusa.com/content/content/6/3105
http://www.numbersusa.com/content/congress/phone-numbers-an
d-mailing-addresses-memb.html
http://www.numbers.usa

other solid groups/sources:
http://www.teamamericapac.org/
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=about_aboutm ain
http://www.cis.org/
http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/bg1936.cfm

Akagi
Thanks for illustrating my point. When people openly defy the law, particularly in areas in which weapons are known to be kept, the government is faced with a difficult situation. There is a big difference between recognizing the difficulty of the situation, and trying to understand it in jack boot terms.

Again, I will note that if what Obama was trying to do was similar to what Akagi was doing here he would have been explicit. This just brings out the degree to which trying to lump Obama in with this way of thinking misses the point.

I'm not a conservative
But Lon, if you don't think murdering a woman holding a baby in her arms by a cowardly FBI sniper isn't acting like a jack booted thug, I am not sure what to say.

Oh I guess you'll say he was following orders. Yeah, that's what the Nazis at Nuremberg said too. Hey, Lon, you have the same name as Lon Horiuchi our proud West Point grad and hitman for the FBI--you wouldn't happen to be him now would you? What you doing these days? Killing people for the CIA or the mob?




Carol
Why do you find it so obvious that he was accusing ICE of terrorizing communities. I notice that neither LaPierre nor the various comments in this thread supporting him have any problem actually attacking the officers involved. Obama points to a problem that he thinks needs fixing. And the ICE agent acknowledges that the problem exists.

This may be a difference between liberals and conservatives. Liberals are more consequence minded, and so the fact that families being torn apart is the central problem here that Obama sees as needing to be addressed.

But conservatives when they talk about problems seem to need to identify someone as evil for the problem to exist. So for them the problem is jackbooted government thugs. And when Obama says that it is a problem that families are being torn apart. Conservatives seem to think he must be identifying someone as jackbooted thugs.

But notice, if the problem was that law enforcement is too fascist in its applications, than our immigration policy wouldn't be broken, just our officer training. The point of noting that it is the system that is broken is precisely because it is not something as simple as blaming enforcement agents.

Conservatives talk about jack booted thugs, presumably, because they think the problem is jack booted thugs. Obama does not talk about jack booted thugs, but rather talks about families being broken apart because the thinks the problem is not jack-booted thugs, but families being torn apart.

Akagi
You're a funny guy.

Weijiniya Aiguoren (Va. Patriot)
Yes, they can ignore the laws of the US and at their peril. But I can ignore laws of the US too and so can you--at our peril.

Millions are in the US illegally, but since resources are limited the government has made a wise decision to go after true criminals--like MS13--not pine straw spreaders in Atlanta.

They can try to enter the US anytime they feel like it but not as easy as you make it sound--often you need help from coyotes which is expensive and run the risk of dangers from bandits and drug smugglers--rapes and murders are common as is death due to natural barriers as well.

Illegals are actually banned from most Federal assistance programs and states have been cracking down as well. Most benefits are restricted to "urgent medical care" and public schools.

They can try to have a voice on what US immigration law should be, but the US Congress didn't follow through with the reforms in 2007 and in 2005 the protests were over the inclusion in an immigration bill in the GOP controlled house to make it a felony to cross the border illegally--that bill died. Their influence over US immigration policy is pretty slim--the US Chamber of Commerce has much more than they. Congress doesn't listen to people who can't vote, but do listen to people who bankroll their campaigns.

Most lawsuits that are filed are filed by US citizens--ACLU, Mexican-American Legal Defense Fund, etc. Should Americans be banned from filing lawsuits in their own country?

Voting in elections? Total farce. Few do and no election has ever been shown to have been decided by the non-citizen vote--even the Doran-Sanchez election in 1996.

Take your country. Sure--they are sent by my employers you know, the DPRK. We are all part of the same DPRK plot. Me and a bunch of illegal Mexicans had tea with Kim Jong-Il at Zhongnanhai in Beijing (they are bankrolling the plot) and came up with the whole plan. Its called Operation Xinshibei.

But don't tell anyone, its a secret.

SteveL
"The moment Osama bin Laden sets foot on U.S. soil, he gets Constitutional rights."

Depends really. German POWs at places like Camp McCain Mississippi or Japanese internees at Tule Lake didn't have them--granted both before Johnson v. Eisentrager or for that mater Ex Parte Endo. The German Saboteurs were tried at the US State Department by a military tribunal--again they weren't granted access to the US courts and 6 if I recall were soon executed after being found guilty by the tribunal. Also it is possible that due to Boumediene v. Bush (2008) Obama could seek redress from the courts to challenge his detention in US custody. But illegal aliens do in fact as you and I pointed out have rights under the constitution.


Si se puede

Si se puede (Yes We Can)
Yes we can:
Ignore your laws.
Enter your country any time we feel like it.
Collect benefits to which we are not entitled.
Tell you what your immigration policies should be.
File thousands of lawsuits to prevent you from enforcing your laws.
Vote in your elections fradulently.
Take your country.

Allen
"Did he mention that if everyone spoke whatever language they wanted the costs of printing alone puts burdens every person with extra costs to run the government and businesses, costs past on to them. We can help each other by learning ENGLISH."

No business is required to print documents other than English (or whatever language it wishes) and few government organizations are either. The exception is ballots and voting information as per to Voting Rights Act and documents used in the prosecution of someone who is not fluent in English.

"When Mr. Obama and Mr. McCain meet with a Philipino, or Chinese organization they can explain why it is the well educate and English speaking legal immagrants must wait ten years for their applications to be processed."

It depends. If you are a parent or spouse of a US citizen the wait is months--2-3 months from application to visa interview. For a sibling of a US citizen the wait is years. Current visa bulletin is around 11 years.

for American Sweetheart
American Sweetheart claims: "How are we breaking Constitutional Rights of people whom HAVE no rights?"

Not true.
Any PERSONS, including illegal immigrants, who set foot on U.S. soil have Constitutional Rights, according to our own Constitution. That's because the Constitution assures those rights are given to "PERSONS," not just to "CITIZENS." Go read it.

A foreigner does NOT have to be a citizen to have rights. The moment he sets foot on U.S. territory, he gets American rights.

In fact, that was the entire Bush rationale for housing captured terrorists at Gitmo: By keeping the terrorists there, off of U.S. territory, Bush was trying to deny them Constitutional rights. His argument was that Gitmo isn't U.S. territory because the base is only leased from Cuba, not owned outright by the U.S.

The moment Osama bin Laden sets foot on U.S. soil, he gets Constitutional rights.

They have rights
"How are we breaking Constitutional Rights of people whom HAVE no rights?"

100% wrong. The courts have ruled over and over again that illegals do in fact have rights guranteed by the constitution.

See Johnson v. Eisentrager (1950); Wong Wing v. US (1896); Plyler v. Doe (1982) and a host of others.

At the appellate level see: INS v. Lopez-Mendoza and US v. Verdugo-Urquidez (1990).

While illegals don't have all rights guranteed by the Constitution such as the right to vote (which not all Americans have either--e.g. felons, those under 18)illegal aliens enjoy the same rights while they are within the boundaries of the United States as a US citizen.

"There are PLENTY of people over the course of the history of our country who came here LEGALLY."

Until 1882 everyone came to the US legally as the US had unrestricted immigration. It wasn't until 1882 that the US banned Chinese and later banned most of the world in 1924. Pretty easy to say "We came legally" when there were no restrictions or no restrictions at least where your family came from. Even in 1924, Germany, the United Kingdom and Ireland had quotas so high as to make immigration to the US from these countries basically unrestricted and this remained the case until 1965 when the mindless and yes racist US immigration law was replaced from a national quota system to a preference system.

Thugs
In the 1980s and 1990s the ATF and to a lesser extent the FBI were just that Jack-Booted Thugs. The terms used by the NRA were accurate and it was too bad that George H.W. Bush didn't have the guts to stand up for the NRA and resigned his membership.

Does Ruby Ridge ring a bell? Waco? Sure Randy Weaver was a racist and a neo-Nazi and not the type you'd want living next door, but the force used against him and his family was in short murder. Sadly Lon Horiuchi was never fully prosecuted for the unlawful killing of Weaver's wife.

Is ICE jack-booted thugs? Well they were no doubt in the Elian Gonzalez case (then called INS).

Is ICE now jack-booted thugs. I would say no, but Obama didn't use that term. It is fair to say that the current system of basically allowing millions of aliens to enter and work in the US and do almost nothing to those who employ them--they are the major source of the problem, not the illegals--is a broken system. Of course there is little support for a real guest workers program which despite myths by CIS and people here has worked in other countries. So, you are left with illegal workers hired by corrupt companies, with the workers then from time to time arrested and deported and the companies later hiring a new batch to replace those now deported and the cycle begins again.

Allen
You took the words right out of my mouth.

Oh no...we are raiding homes of illegals! Are they or are they not ALL (every last one of them) criminals?

Just because you aren't on Sunset Blvd. shooting people doesn't mean that you aren't a criminal for being here undocumented.

How are we breaking Constitutional Rights of people whom HAVE no rights? You sneak in, you should be kicked out. Plain and simple. There are PLENTY of people over the course of the history of our country who came here LEGALLY. My grandparents for example. My SO's mother for example. My family came from Italy in the 1920s. His family from Vietnam in the 1980s. But ALL documented!

This country is going to be in complete chaos if this continues. And this isn't just about Hispanics. This is about everyone whom comes here from ANY country and didn't do it in an orderly and LAWFUL way.


What he say about medical &schools
Did Mr. Obama mention that the people trying to escape Mexico and South America are putting a burden on the costs of services? Schools and hospitals are being over burdened.

Did he mention that if everyone spoke whatever language they wanted the costs of printing alone puts burdens every person with extra costs to run the government and businesses, costs past on to them. We can help each other by learning ENGLISH.

Did Mr. Obama mention the women who are forced into prostitution or the drugs which have accompanied some of the upright citizens who are trying to make money on the misery of others.

When Mr. Obama and Mr. McCain meet with a Philipino, or Chinese organization they can explain why it is the well educate and English speaking legal immagrants must wait ten years for their applications to be processed.

Tom is correct.
That babies are pulled from the breast of their mothers is happening. What if a mother has just shop lifted a new pair of jeans. If she has a baby they do not arrest the baby. The baby is TORN, RIPPED, DRAGGED and otherwise removed from it's mother's arms. She then goes to jail, hopefully.


No Enforcement/No Votes

The Stupid Party

The RNC wants an amnesty candidate.

Don't vote for one.

Another amnesty will result in Democrat majorities for decades, or until they are supplanted by the La Raza Party, why doesn't the RNC know that? How stupid do you have to be to import voters for the opposition at the same time you alienate your own voters? Nominating any of the amnesty supporters is a losing proposition, we will not support them. If the GOP intends to surrender our sovereignty and abandon the rule of law, they will find in November 2008, that they still have their big money/cheap labor donors, but they do not have voters. GOP-RIP

A Vote For McCain Is A Vote For Amnesty

John McCain has not changed his mind about "Comprehensive Immigration Reform", amnesty, at all.

http://townhall.com/columnists/AmandaCarpenter/2008/03/28/b loggers_press_mccain_adviser_on_immigration
“John McCain’s position on immigration is very clear and this a question that gets asked at townhall appearances everyday in media appearances and has answered the question at least a thousand times before the New Hampshire primary,” Schmidt said.

He explained, “Any person who supports John McCain’s campaigns is a subscriber to John McCain’s views"

A vote for McCain is a vote for surrender of your country.

Your vote for McCain will be used as proof that you want amnesty.



Many of us see another amnesty as the end of the Republic, the stampede it will set off will be overwhelming. If we don't stop the inundation none of the rest matters. We'll be a banana republic before the jihadis can get us. There will never be another GOP president or Congressional majority. Importing voters for the socialists is as stupid as it gets.


McCain keeps saying "Secure the border first". We know that he means amnesty next. The plan is to get the border state Gov's to declare the border secure. Conveniently, they are all on board the cheap labor express. Then his good friend Ted Kennedy will bring back McCain/Kennedy and McCain can provide his good friends across the aisle with their new permanent majority.

I will not vote for amnesty.

Lon
I think it's fairly obvious that Sen. Obama was accusing ICE of "terrorizing" communities - I'd say that's "mentioning" them.


odd column
The quote from Obama claims that the system is broken because a laundry list of bad consequences result. Saunders claims that he is attacking the officers who carry out the policy, although they are not mentioned in the quote.

She then produces a variety of people who note that in fact the consequences that Obama cites are occurring just as he says, but that it is not the fault of officers who were not mentioned by Obama.

So, gasp, Obama is pandering by saying true things. How dare he.

It is true that if you substitute what LaPierre said for what Obama said then you have someone villainizing officers. But that presumably is why LaPierre was criticized widely, and Obama will only be criticized by people who distort what he says.

Thank you Ms. Saunders,
Great column which highlights the bias of the media, as well as Senators Obama and McCain.

I would prefer some sympathy for the children of Americans "who are torn from their mothers" when the mothers are taken to jail for dealing drugs, theft, or any other crime. Why do we only hear about the children of illegals "who are torn from their mothers"?

Kudos TeamNRA!
If only the federal troops that stormed Elian's house had been as inept as the Waco team. They might have raided a house a few blocks away and captured Mohammed Atta and the rest of the 9/11 crew! Oh well, I guess Janet perceived the flood of illegal 10 year cuban boys as a bigger threat.

Where the Continuum Meets
Not since the 80s have the left and right agreed on the same subject so wholeheartedly.

In the 80s the libs thought it was the homeless' constitutional right to be crazy and live on steam vents. The cons thought it was not their job to pay for the sanitariums to house the crazy homeless.

Today, the libs think it is the right of illegal aliens to come here and raid our Treasury. The cons just want the cheap lawn work.

Neither candidate
Say what you want but neither candidate will do what is required on illegal immigration. McCain wants it and so does Obama. Obamas ego is getting in the way and will make him lose. To go to Germany and campain for the presidency you have to have a large ego. Germans do not like Americans.

Hey Debra
Ask Randy Weaver's wife, Sara, if she has any opinion on Government Jack-Booted Thugs... Oh, what's that you say ? Sara isn't available for comment ? Maybe you could get Elian Gonsalves on the line for a response... Forget about the 21 kids who were in Waco Texas, April 19th 1993... You won't get much of a response out of them either...

Words, Just Words
Not so long ago Hillary was accused of being willing to say anything to get elected; anything if it helped her win. When Obama does it, it's called retuning and refining; Obama is moving to the center now, and suddenly Obama and McCain aren't so very different after all. Or so Obama's campaign would like us to think. He didn't earn the title of The Most Liberal in the Senate for nothing.

Obama says words, just words, lot of words. His prewritten speeches are great, but spontaneous questions prove how ignorant of how our government and economy actually work. Obama puts his foot in his mouth often, and they immediately send someone more articulate to explain what Obama "really meant," and try to convince us Obama isn't totally stupid.

Obama is way, way over his head, yet his enormous ego continues to feed itself and he dances on his puppet strings for Soros and the elite, like him.


Yep, Debra, you're right!


McCain really told it the way it should be to La Raza: No amnesty!


Oh!..... wait!....... he didn't say that!......

Actually, what he said was "Si, amnestia!"

But somehow, I guess, in DebraWorld that's not a "pander".



Pfffffffffttttttttttttt, Debra! You're just another McCain apologista. One dinky check mark on this hypocritical column, only because I can't give minus check marks.

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