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Friday, July 20, 2007
David Limbaugh :: Townhall.com Columnist
Chris Matthews and "Misinformation"
by David Limbaugh
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MSNBC's Chris Matthews appeared on "The Tonight Show" Wednesday night pontificating, mostly, about the Iraq war. Those who deny the overwhelming liberal bias of the mainstream media and who are pushing the Fairness Doctrine to muzzle conservative talk radio should be required to watch a tape of Matthews' performance.

To a fawning Jay Leno, Matthews engaged in a nearly uninterrupted soliloquy trashing all things Bush, from his governing according to perceived signals from God to his alleged lies about WMD.

Notably ironic, was Matthews' repeated spewing of misinformation in the process of characterizing the administration of disseminating misinformation. They talk about men and women occupying different planets. Perhaps, but at least their planets seem to be in closer proximity than the ones inhabited, respectively, by liberals and conservatives.

Leno jump-started Matthews by asking him about New York Times columnist David Brooks' supposed assertion that President Bush has pursued the war in Iraq because God wills it. "God told him that we should fight this war."

We've heard this bogus charge before. Matthews dutifully responded, "Well, if he was going to play Joan of Arc, we wouldn't have elected him. Getting whispers from heaven is scary business. The guys we're fighting say that, too." Matthews said Bush needed "a little humility." Even Abraham Lincoln, Matthews said, didn't claim to have God on his side in the Civil War.

While I can't prove a negative, I am confident Bush never said that God is on our side in this war -- though it wouldn't bother me if he had -- or that God directed him to attack Iraq. He has said he continually prays for divine guidance and reads the Bible every day. That is wise, commendable and utterly no different from what Abraham Lincoln and many, probably most presidents in our history did.

This is not a distinction without a difference. Matthews is unequivocally implying that Bush has claimed to get his marching orders directly from God and that that is scary -- as if he's in some kind of spiritual trance. It simply isn't true, and Matthews is distorting the truth in suggesting it is.

Contrary to Matthews' depiction, Bush is exhibiting the ultimate humility in prostrating himself before God to ask for His guidance and blessing. Perhaps Chris has his wires crossed. It's the secular humanist types who are more likely to have too much pride: to believe in God, much less ask for His guidance.

Matthews then began a rant, saying "almost half the American people believe that Iraq attacked us on 9/11. The misinformation, the indoctrination that's going on. And the rest of the American people have gotten so skeptical now do you think the American people believe that the brass didn't have something to do with Abu Ghraib? Do you think the American people don't think that we were given a bill of goods to get us in over there? ... I think we gotta be damn skeptical of this crowd, because on WMD, on the connection to 9/11, on the surge on the torture, on every step of the way we've been given misinformation to the point now, we just did a poll, a fifth of the American people believe we found weapons of mass destruction when we got there. They're still indoctrinated. How do we get all this misinformation? From the top, unfortunately. It's a sad thing "

There is no question in my mind that Matthews believes this nonsense he is spewing. I think he's a decent enough guy -- but he just doesn't think straight. The administration never said Iraq attacked us on 9/11. It never said there was an operational relationship between Iraq and Al Qaeda, just that there was a relationship, which there was.

Only grassy-knoll nutcakes and anti-military types believe the "brass" authorized systematic abuse of enemy combatant detainees. I don't deny that many Americans now mistakenly believe, after being bludgeoned over the head with liberal propaganda for years, that Bush lied us into war -- as I've said three billion times, but apparently not often enough.

On all of these points and more it is the Democrats and mainstream media who are responsible for the "misinformation."

If two-fifths of the American people believe Iraq attacked us on 9/11, it isn't Bush's fault because he never said that. And if one-fifth of the people believe we found new WMD stockpiles (we clearly did find old WMD), it isn't because Bush said so. Yet Matthews says this "misinformation" came from "the top," meaning Bush. But he knows that Bush has never said we've found WMD there. Never. He's said quite the opposite. This one isn't even arguable.

Unchallenged, even frequently applauded, Matthews "disseminated" his "misinformation" to the audience. It's no wonder people so many people are so woefully misinformed.

Chris, you're not helping.

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About The Author
David Limbaugh, brother of radio talk-show host Rush Limbaugh, is an expert in law and politics and author of Bankrupt: The Intellectual and Moral Bankruptcy of Today's Democratic Party.
 
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Standard equipment at Abu Graib
Irrespective of one's political bent, it is hard for anyone who wants to clear the military brass for the abuse of prisoners at Abu Graib. Leather masks, electrical prods, attack dogs, were photographed and cannot be denied. It appears unlikely that low echelon soldiers would have packed their duffle bags with such equipment. The inference is inescapable; this equipment was provided by the military brass or CIA. The problems in winning in Iraq was undermined by the conduct at Abu Graib. It hurt America's standings in the world and rationalizing it as a school prank was inappropriate, as Limbauugh's Dad did.

I'm REALLY tired of the ignorance
We have got to start realizing that we are engaged in perhaps history's most horrible war. Muslims are killing Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus and others all around the globe simply because they are Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, and others.
There were WMD in Iraq. We found some and found proof that there had been more. Iraq was intertwined with the 9/11 attacks. And I don't give a DAMN if we humiliated, embarrassed, or scared prisoners at Abu Graib.

To all the conservatives who think...
...that the re-introducing of the "fairness doctrine" to talk radio,why must conservatives always be on the defensive?We should immediately make public plans to apply it to television and not just "talk" television like Matthews show,,but the regular tv news shows also.Then watch the MSM come out against that "fairness doctrine".You have to use their laws against them.It throws the fear of censhorship into the debate.I've yet to hear any Washington politician make this threat,including the president who controls the FCC.

If this is done,then watch ALL the media oppose it.

Marvin.....
....I'll take your word for the leather mask, etc., business, but I saw none of that, nor read of it anywhere. Still, assuming you're correct, isn't it possible that it's the kind of stuff found in Abu Ghraib's closets, left over by the Saddamites?
To me it is pretty unbelievable that the U.S. Brass would be sure to bring such equipment along in THEIR ditty bags.
I think you need to cite sources. And you need to sharpen logical thinking skills.

To Buzz
Good writing...my sentiments exactly!

Buzz
You are a poster child for Chris and completely repudiate what David is saying. Thank you so much.

Torture
Marvin... The dogs and electical prods are likely normal security eqipment to maintain order at Abu Graib. I worked with dog handlers in the Army...very normal "euipment" for perimeter security.The masks Etc..?? Easily obtained by the "bad apples" in the pictures who pulled these "pranks". Any lowering of America's standing over this nonsense was done by useful idiots like the traitor ted kennedy.Anyone who thinks high ranking military officials approved these "torture" tactics...must also believe the moon is made of cheese...

Mathews is a screeching, boring hack
But he caters to a small group of people like Marvin, who have a willful disregard for truth and facts, especially if they get in the way of their preconceived notions about Bush and Islamonazis. They can't be reasoned with, nor swayed with logic because they begin their side of the debate with falsehoods, which completely nulifies their argument for even semi-serious thinkers.

They cannot distinguish propaganda from reality or disseminate the mountains of information which run counter to their mindset, which is so similar to mentally disturbed persons they could be classified as such. With a micro fine filter blocking ingress to the brain, their thought process is constipated, and any debate with them is an exercise in futility, going around in circles that they are unable to break out of. A discussion on string theory with a recalcitrant 4 year old would be more satisfying.

Thanks David, for continuing to marginalize these morons. What is really scary is they vote for like minded dweebs who endanger our country and culture with their idiocy.

Marvin?
Limbaugh's Dad? Are you referring to his older brother, Rush ?

The perpetrators at Abu Grahib from the general in charge down though the 2 primary actors have be punished as prescribed in the UCMJ.




Marvin
You totally destroyed your brilliant analysis when you commented that "Limbauugh's [sic] Dad" compared the guards' actions to a college prank. It was Rush Limbaugh who said these actions were like college pranks (and if you'd ever experienced a fraternity initiation, you'd know he was right--except that, unlike the Abu Ghraib incident, those fraternity initiations sometimes actually result in the death of an initiate). Rush Limbaugh is David's BROTHER, not his father.

Chris Matthews
Sometimes, when channel-surfing, I come across the ranting and raving of this semi-hysterical nut case. He shouts, spews forth the gospel according to Matthews, and gives his so-called opinions to the uninformed. This guy is a journalist??????

Poor Chris
Immediately after 9/11, Chris Matthews lamented that the attack didn't come while Clinton was in office so that Clinton would have had an opportunity for a great legacy. Obviously poor Chris has never gotten over his disappointment.

Now his mission is to see to it that Bush doesn't leave a great legacy. If the MSM can bring about defeat in Iraq as it did in Vietnam, Chris can again raise his head proudly.

what to think of a President
Who engages us in a foreign war with
1. An enemy who didn't directly threaten us
2. We had no WMDS
3. Gave no bid contracts to Haliburton
4. Our troops are still there.
5. Went in without UN approval

OF COURSE I AM TALKING ABOUT CLINTON IN KOSOVO.

Funny I didn't hear these moral high ground blow hards back then....

Journalist?
I thought Chris Matthews was an entertainer. He gets people going. The sad part is sooo many people don't realize that most of what he does and says is for ratings, entertainment. That's why he is where he is, does what he does and says what he says. He even said so in an interview one time - at least he was being honest (I think most people mssed that interview). Too bad so many take it as "the way it is". That is sad.

the perfect democrat
Matthews is nothing but an ignorant, self-important, little fraternity punk. Anyone who takes him seriously is disconnected from reality.

Kennedy and Nixon
Chris Matthews may still be trying to atone for writing in his book "Kennedy and Nixon" that Richard Nixon did indeed get cheated out of the 1960 election by the burning of 800,000 votes by Democrats in Chicago immediately after the election. This is also backed up by Seymour Hersch in his book "The Dark Side of Camelot".


Chris Matthews
I used to enjoy "Hardball" with matthews, but that was before he lost his mind. I no longer waste time on losers like matthews and his cohorts, which includes the clown leno.

Lies
I am constantly amazed at the people that say GW "lied" to us to get us into Iraq. Every other nation's intel said the exact same thing that ours did but our intel folks were the ONLY ones that lied?? What am I missing here?

The Chris Mathews - Jay Leno Gig
Unchallenged by Jay Leno, Chris Mathews was allowed to spew lies about our President on national T.V. Ironically, Mathews' lies were in stating that Bush lied to us about the Iraq War. Did I hear someone say "hypocritical"?

Thank you Mr. Limbaugh for exposing the hypocrisy and refuting Mathews' lies with the truth. Liberals have repeated the rarely challenged lies so much, I fear the American people are accepting them as facts.

David, I have to disagree about
Mathews being a basically decent fellow. He is a lunatic and a raving anti-American leftist that can't disparage the US fast enough or loud enough for his BDS deranged mind.

rocker
Why are you surpised that Bush and Cheney lied,they saw Clinton and Gore get away with it for 8 years.Sad part they are still at it,but it doesn't seem to bother you.

Hardball Matthews
I watch this guy a few times. I came away with one word "idiot". What a big mouth blowhard that gets a free pass just spewing lies. I no longer listen to him at all and anyone that does should do so for entertainment purposes - that is what he is - entertainment - he is NOT a journalist. And don't forget "ONLY Matthews plays hardball" - what a joke.

Doesn't Matter
Whether Bush gets his marching orders from God, Cheney, Laura or his twin daughters doesn't matter.

What does matter is his complete lack of an intelligenst understanding of the Middle East region.
How else to explain his ignorance about there being Sunni and Shiite sects of Islam until days before the Iraq i9nvasion?

marching orders?
Doesn't Hillary get her marching orders from Eleanor Roosevelt? Or was it Ghandi?

union dude
I had a go round with rocks in his head yesterday. He conveniently overlooks the greatest liar in history and his incompetant sidekick, alldull and hails them as role models. Yesterday he defended the right of illegals to break our laws by not following immigration procedures and claimed that once here they should be allowed to continue to steal our social services because it is our moral duty. This is lib buffoonery at its most insidious.

Marching Orders
If and when Hillary becomes commander in chief, the origin of her marching orders will be relevant.

velvety1
she also claims her religion guides her to want to provide cradle to grave programs. Her minister taught her socialism is the best remedy for all that ails mankind

Bush lied?
Challenge to the kooky commie lefties who claim Bush lied:

Come up with ONE lie about the intelligence on Iraq.

Please keep in mind that the independent intelligence agencies from the UK, Israel, France, Germany, Russia, and China ALL claimed EXACTLY what ours did -- that Iraq had stockpiles of WMDs.

Heck, in fact Saddam himself had, at times, ADMITTED as much, and there have been several different writings from different sources who say that it is Saddam's own people who were lying to Saddam about their WMD capability. Saddam HIMSELF wrongly believed he had massive stockpiles of WMDs.

So where are the lies?

P.s. If you claim anything about Joe Wilson's claims about Niger, please note that 1) the senate commission investigation on pre-war intelligence indicated that Wilson flat out lied about his findings, and 2) even to this very day, Brittish intelligence stands behind the assertion that Iraq had tried to buy uranium from Niger, so don't bother embarrassing yourself by screaming "WILSON! YELLOW CAKE!! NIGER!!"

rocker - again - go where you belong
They may be shaping up, but they'll never ever be outdone by Clinton/Clinton who lied their way through so well that you can't wait to give them another 8 years to pick your pocket and lie to you some more. I ain't crazy 'bout the Repubs, but I can't help but think the road to hell for this country will be led by a Dem.

As a trained observer
of people, my opinion is that anyone who drools and spits (Mathews) when they report has so much pent up anger and frustration that they can't possibly think straight!!!!

Entertainment?
Who would find the kind of hateful, deceiptful, divisive, distasteful garbage that Matthews spews to be entertaining? The tragedy is that he is given a platform for his venom by a company (GE) who should know better. If such partisan ideology is to be dispensed on a network like MSNBC, they should at least have the decency to have a counterweight like Fox does with Colmes against the diatribes of Hannity.

Matthews has contributed more than any other outlet to feeding the lie that Bush lied about WMD. He repeated nearly every program for months after the Plame affair that Bush lied in the 2003 State of the Union when Bush said Saddam had SOUGHT African uranium. Matthews continually stated that Bush lied because there was proof (eg Joe Wilson!) that Saddam had not BOUGHT yellow cake from Niger. It escapes me how Matthews could possibly not know the difference between the two. I do not find it plausible that he was just honestly deluded. If not, he was intentionally lying to stir up resentment and opposition to Bush.

The Libby affair was triggered as a result of attempts by the administration to address the Matthews delusion or lying. By her own account, Mary Matalin (Cheney advisor) recommended that it would do no good to try to reason with Matthews because he was too biased and partisan. She suggested talking with Russert, who was thought more objective. We now know how successfully that strategy turned out. The media fried Cheney and Fitzgerald fried Libby.

Until the numbers of voters who buy the partisan garbage are reduced to manageable levels (on both sides), it will be nearly impossible to build any consensus to address our national problems constructively. The tide looks to be running against this prospect for the foreseeable future.

Carter's Boy Matthews
Poor thing reminds me of a mad dog chasing his tail while foaming at the mouth. There is a short curcit somewhere between his ears. He is just unable to engage in a normal conversation with another person. He converses with himself therefore, the shotgun spewing of words make following his diatribe, convoluted and tiring. Wasn't Jimmy Carter his idle? Carter carries on much the same...just slower. Both are completely oblivious to the fact that most reasonable and sensiable folk don't care what either has to say.

Actually Matthews was ...
...pretty decent for about a week after former Senator Zell Miller (I think) challenged him (Matthews) to a duel over Matthews verbal (almost physical) abuse of Michelle Malkin during the '04 presidential convention coverage. Zell said if he was present with Matthews right then he would kick the shiite out of him. Unfortunately for everyone Matthews recovered his obnoxiousness.

I remind of this incident because it shows that if people in the right (not right wing people) call out these liberal liars they will shut up -- at least for a while. That means that there must be a constant and continuing (if that's not redundant) barrage (not necessarily physical threat) against these bustards like Matthews and his ilk.
TBC :>)

Time for Michelle Malkin vs fatboy Chris
I enjoyed Chrissy vs Ann Coulter...and would relish a rematch for Michelle Malkin against this serial abuser of the truth. matthews is such a coward he won't go face to face with Michelle again, she will make him cry and spit!

No liberal bias
Hardball host Chris Matthews lurched even further off the deep end on Wednesday's Imus in the Morning. After praising the "great job" Rudy Giuliani did in cleaning up New York City, the MSNBC star, who appeared by phone, went on a rant declaring how he's "sick of southern guys with ranches running this country." Losing control, Matthews dropped the F-bomb on national television: "I want a guy to run for President who doesn't have a f**ing -- I'm sorry, a ranch." As host Don Imus began to snicker, Matthews plowed ahead with his Democratic talking points: "Wouldn't that be good, Don, a guy who wasn't on the ranch during Katrina, he was on the street corner answering questions?"

Nope, no bias
Luckily, the five-letter networks like MSNBC tend to have viewership in the tens of thousands.

"I got an idea, I got a solution. Pardon him but send him to Iraq in uniform and put him on the front. Send him to the front. He supported the war, send him to fight it!...In the old days the judges would take a working class kid who got into a scrape with the law and say, ‘Junior, want to go jail or do you want to go join the Army?’ They should say the same thing to Scooter Libby. ‘Want to join the Army?’"
— MSNBC’s Chris Matthews on Hardball, June 21.

Rocker lies
Just name the lie, Rocker. Otherwise, just accept your position as an ignorant, blathering idiot just like the rest of the "Bush lied" koolaid drinkers.

Did he Kiss his Ring, too?
Senator Barack Obama: "Let’s roll back the Bush tax cuts on the wealthiest Americans, let’s make certain that those resources go to the people who need it....We’re not going to solve it by pretending that issues of poverty and struggle among working families are just going to go away magically because the stock market is going up."

Moderator Chris Matthews: "So much of what you say just grabs people like me, because it sounds like Bobby Kennedy. It sounds like the ’60s at its absolute best."

— Exchange at AFSCME Democratic candidates forum shown live on MSNBC, June 19.

Matthews Misrepresentations
You can't be serious that "he believes this nonsense....he's a decent guy".

Bull. He's not stupid. He's dishonest. It's been patently obvious for a long time. He's a DNC shill.

Mike-Chicago

Fairness Doctrine
Conservative talk radio must be controlled, but straight down the middle independents like Chris Matthews are just impartial reporters.

Interesting idea.

RE: AZPhil
"They should say the same thing to Scooter Libby. ‘Want to join the Army?’"

Conversely, a judge should order Matthews to take Zell up on his challenge to a duel. I'd LOVE to see that sissified left wing had quivering in his boots!

Puncho
Bush didn't know about Sunni and Shiite until just before the invasion? You know this for a fact or is this information you got from watching Chris Matthews. Maybe Dan Ratherornot had a copy of a memo?

Mmmmm! Grassy Knoll Nutcake!
The thing that I find hilarious is that most people would never even have heard of Matthews if not for Darrell Hammond's impersonations of him on SNL and his appearances on other shows like Leno's. Nobody finds him interesing enough to tune in to Hardball, yet he still holds himself up to be the arbiter of wisdom and common sense. A self-styled Joe Biden (minus the hair plugs) if you will. Though the two men are both first rate buffoons, there is some evidence that the people of Delaware like Biden. Hardball's total Neilsen ratings are within the margin of error - meaning there is no evidence ANYONE is watching his show.

Matthews perfectly unbiased
Anchor Contessa Brewer: "Let’s talk about Mike Huckabee, because last night he sort of had the humorous line of the night. I know a lot of people are talking about it."

Chris Matthews: "That was set piece though. He brought that in with him....They waste our time with these set pieces....It’s embarrassing to everybody when they do these jokes....It’s hokie panokie. It’s Mickey Mouse. So what? And what a stupid thing. What did it have to do — John Edwards paid the price for his haircut weeks ago, to bring that up in front of that audience was pandering. Let’s face it."

— Exchange on MSNBC Live, May 16, discussing Huckabee’s quip that "We’ve had a Congress that spent money like John Edwards at a beauty shop."

Beowulfe/Wingo
I only know about this a&&hole and his butt buddy Olbermann from reading Media Research Center (http://www.mediaresearch.org/).

I NEVER hear of any need for the Fairness Doctrine on TV. I guess it's because MSNBC is so centrist.

Wingo - I saw Olbermenn gets 800K viewers. Now, of course out of 300 million people that's infinitesimal. But to compare apples to apples, O'Reilly gets about 2.5 milion, or triple what Kardiac Keith gets.

Beowulf - as for Matthews, I think most Americans' opinion of him is "Chris who?"

brooks said it
One of the more unnerving reports out of the president's seminar with the pundits came from Brooks, who quoted Bush as saying: "It's more of a theological perspective. I do believe there is an Almighty, and I believe a gift of that Almighty to all is freedom. And I will tell you that is a principle that no one can convince me that doesn't exist."

It's bad enough that Osama bin Laden is still out there plotting bloody new acts of terrorism, convinced that God wants him to slay the infidels. Now we know that the president of the United States believes God has chosen him to bring freedom to the world, that he refuses to acknowledge setbacks in his crusade and that he flat-out doesn't care what "the polls" -- meaning the American people -- might think. I'm having trouble seeing the bright side. I think I need cognitive therapy.


azphil
actually matthews has 500000 viewers and is up 50% from last year.

here are the numbers

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/original/q207vs06.pdf

leroy
None of the above. The claim is made by Peter Galbraith, one of the most respected and knowledgeable Iraq analysts.

>In his new book, The End of Iraq: How American Incompetence Created A War Without End, Galbraith, the son of the late economist John Kenneth Galbraith, claims that American leadership knew very little about the nature of Iraqi society and the problems it would face after the overthrow of Saddam Hussein.

A year after his “Axis of Evil” speech before the U.S. Congress, President Bush met with three Iraqi Americans, one of whom became postwar Iraq’s first representative to the United States. The three described what they thought would be the political situation after the fall of Saddam Hussein. During their conversation with the President, Galbraith claims, it became apparent to them that Bush was unfamiliar with the distinction between Sunnis and Shiites.

Galbraith reports that the three of them spent some time explaining to Bush that there are two different sects in Islam--to which the President allegedly responded, “I thought the Iraqis were Muslims!”


religious lib
Nonsense! You spun what Bush said and I don't give a fig about Brooks. As a religious person you should know that the concept of freedom first came from God. Freedom IS a GOD given right and quite frankly I think that although you may go to church you are quite selfish.

Question to rocker and the left:
You repeatedly state that Bush and Cheney deceived the whole nation in their evil plot to go to war.

Then you say Bush is too stupid to be president.

Which is it? Clever enough to fool the whole world? Or too stupid to pour water out of a boot with instructions on the heel?

C'mon, be consistent, but wait, you're liberals, you don't have to be consistent, or intelligent, or erudite. You just have to "feel" good about things. And things that make you feel bad are evil.

ROFLMAO!!!!

Matthew's Meter
RIGHT ON BROTHER LIMBAUGH!

It will surely be odd to watch those of Matthew's stripe lament, mourn, and become stricken when our troops come marching home VICTORIOUS!!

But, just as with the economy, the poor in Spirit must be led in wartime to greener pastures.

And we are all blessed to have your insight.

Regards,
Tom

(Ya know, you sound alot like that radio guy.....what's his name???)

Religious One
I said Olbermann has 800K viewers, or a third of O'Reilly. Now you're admitting Matthews has 500K vieweres, or a fifth of O'Reilly? Impressive indeed.

Exciting his loyal followers.
__As Matthews voiced his,barely uninterrupted blather,I can picture Leno's,majority liberal audience,fawning in unrestrained joy.Embracing his lies,has gold nuggets spewed to legitimize,and fill their passions.The passions of the self righteous,unwilling to accept any argument that does not support self need. The people who voice concerns of humanities needs,the worlds needs,as long as their needs are not interupted.This is,as Leno put it,"God told him that we should fight this war.".God is directing all to fight this war,and "remove the plank" from the eyes of the many,unable to see,and"remove the splinter" factions of society. Factions who's only passion is driven by self love,at the expense of the many. If the shoe fits,either wear it,or trash it. Get with the truth of this world wide war against the evil used to terrorize.

Liberal Coward - But I Repeat Myself!
Chris Matthews stands up to all 5’ nothing of Michelle Malkin, but tucks tail to Zell Miller. Matthews is a Gutless, Lying, Coward of a Liberal, Girly Man just like his mentor, Jimmy Carter.

Victory
> when our troops come marching home VICTORIOUS!!

That statement is deluded. The victory, militarily speaking, was defeating the Iraqi Army and regime change. What you're asking the military to do now is referee centuries old disputes along religious, ethnic, cultural and tribal lines. Unless your idea of victory is a minimal amount of chaos and bloodshed, terms almost impossible to define as victory.
Maybe you think the current Iraqi government, led by SCIRI and DAWA, political parties with Iranian backing, Sharia law intentions, and a policy of not recognizing Israel's right to exist is worth throwing a victory party over.


Leno
I will admit Leno gives it to both sides. Sure, he let this tool go on and on, but he makes more Clinton jokes than anyone.

Pancho
Words like claim and allegedly, coupled with an author of a book which has a title that in itself shows a lack of objectivity. You will pardon me for being very skceptical of your sources, I will have to rank this one up with the two I offered initially.

georgetwin
LOL!

Matthews and Carter...a match made in H*LL.

religiouslib
Nothing in the quote you provided from Bush says anything close to your assertion that he claims to be lead by Gods voice.

Are you religious, do you believe in the Almighty?

If so, do you believe that freedom is something the Almighty intends for every man?

If you believe in mens freedom are you willing to back down on that and allow some to be oppressed or enslaved?

Suit yourself
I suggest you do a bit of research on Peter Galbraith before dismissing his claims. Better yet, read his books, something you will likely find illuminating and fact-filled. That is, if you can put down that objective Ann Coulter novel for a minute.

Marvin
Surely you are kidding. Abu Ghraib was MILD compared to what the Islamofascists do. Panties on their heads? OH THE HORROR. Electrical prods? I've never seen proof of that.

And the absolute HORROR of insulting their manhood! OMG! What's NEXT? Forcing them to get a manicure? Quick. Call the NY Slimes!

leroy
You misunderstand the liberals my friend. They are ALL about "I've got MINE, the H*LL with the rest of you"...except for taxing the crap out of us.

You see, it's okay for US to have freedom but trying to help other people, well, that's simply too war mongery for the libsquirts. You see, in their minds, if God had wanted the Iraqis and Afghanistanis to be free, He'd have made them Americans.

Abu Ghraib
What liberals never seem to notice about Abu Ghraib is that it was an isolated incident, AND the perpetrators were punished with prison time.

The second thing is that, as wartime atrocities go, this is a joke. Frat hazings are rougher than this.

Also, liberal "logic" goes like this: Abu Ghraib happened (so far, so good); therefore, all American soldiers are war criminals.

This is like saying "I'm never rooting for USC again because O.J. Simpson killed those people" (except the Abu Ghraib people were punished for far less), or "I'm never checking into a hospital, because people die in them all the time".

leroy
i am relilgious but i don't believe God commands us to kill people to spread democracy and freedom.

if you do than you are not reading the same bible i am.

az phil
you orginally said matthews had 10's of thousnads whch was not true.

also did you notice matthews and olbermann are growing from 30-50% while fox and oreilly are at 8% growth.

LOST FACE
I remember thru the whole LIBBY scandal that CHRIS (THE WATERMELON HEAD)MATHEWS was swearing up and down that the ADMINISTRATION (all of them) were going to be lead out of the WHITE HOUSE in orange jump suits and shackles. I also remember when they unplugged his MELON when the verdict was read. I thought that he would have a heartattack. All he did was cry like a big baby with all them excuses as to why his rederect didnt come true. Thats why his ratings are worst than the DEM CONTROLLED CONGRESS.

RE: religiouslib
"It's more of a theological perspective. I do believe there is an Almighty, and I believe a gift of that Almighty to all is freedom. And I will tell you that is a principle that no one can convince me that doesn't exist."

Let's imagine that is an accurate quote.

Open your eyeballs and READ it. In fact, doen't just read it, UNDERSTAND what he's trying to say.

He states that God has gifted mankind with freedom (and a close reading of the Bible leads even the casual reader to understand this).

What is wrong with that?

You make half-hearted comparisons to what OBL believes, and that is just flat out lunacy. According to OBL, Allah is NOT granting freedom whatsoever. According to OBL, Allah OBLIGATES one to strive to forcefully convert the non-believers, and having failed that, kill the non-believers.

The ideas espoused by the claimed Bush quote and OBL's thinking are diametrically opposed to one another.

As far as what "the polls" say, contrary to the kooky commie thinking, a leader is not someone who takes daily polls and does whatever the polls say he ought to do (like Bill Clinton). A leader is one who is willing to do "the right thing" without regard of how popular that "right thing" is, and is able to convince the masses that "the right thing" is really "the right thing".

Bush certainly espouses the first part of leadership -- that is he is willing to do what he thinks is right regardless of what the prevailing wind is, even if that could lead to his own destruction. Unfortunately, though he started out espousing the second part -- the ability to persuade others that it really is the right thing -- he has lost that ability now. Whatever the reason, though he still persues those things he thinks is right, he no longer is persuading anyone that is the right thing to do.

FoxNEWS ratings
"actually matthews has 500000 viewers and is up 50% from last year.

"here are the numbers

" http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/original/q207vs06.pdf "

The funniest thing about those numbers are that the 11:00PM RERUN of the O'Reilly Factor has 3 times the viewers of Hardball (which has 400,000 viewers, not 500,000).

RE: religiouslib, again
"also did you notice matthews and olbermann are growing from 30-50% while fox and oreilly are at 8% growth."

Similarly, the Cambodian economy is growing at almost 8% a year, but our own is growing at 3% a year.

When you are at ROCK BOTTOM, you have a lot more room to grow than those who are at the very top.

Religios
Stats can be massaged a lot. If you have 100 viewers on Tuesday, and 1000 the next Tuesday, that is 900% growth as well.

Regarding this comment: "
i am relilgious but i don't believe God commands us to kill people to spread democracy and freedom. if you do than you are not reading the same bible i am."

I don't believe it does, either, but i doubt the Bible wanted us to let 3000 people die on 9/11, either.

religiouslib
Sorry, this comment by me "you orginally said matthews had 10's of thousnads whch was not true." was exaggeration for effect. I didn't mean it literally.

ReligiousLib
"I'm having trouble seeing the bright side. I think I need cognitive therapy.

Me thinks that why people like live you on the DARK SIDE.

Sorry
Meant to say thats why people like you live on the DARK SIDE and can't see anything.

Rocker
You wrote: "Both of them have manipulated the american public and the saddest thing is that the extreme right wing lunatics still believe these clowns did not lie to us."

Please document the lie(s). By that I refer to those "lies" that can be backed up with quotations and facts disproving anything Bush or Cheney said.

Also I don't think anyone could ever be worse than Karter and whomever his VP was.

Thigh
The Fairness doctrine only applies when conservatives dominate, as in talk radio. Didn't you know that?

Religious - the actual number of people watching Chris "Blowhard" Matthews is a good point. It proves that in any population, some people will watch and believe anything (probably including test patterns). There are some who believe Bush et al destroyed the WTC and the Pentagon. There's even a flat-earth society. So I congratulate Chris on finding a few nuts to watch his rantings.

If you don't know it by now, Chrissy
Matthews doesn't have a grenis, ha has a gragina.

bobbit
Carter's VP was Walter Mondale.

religiouslib
Nowhere in the quote you provided from Bush did he say God commanded him to kill anyone for any reason. As a matter of fact I don't believe I've seen any quotes attributed to Bush where he can be said to have Gods blessing on killing people. Have heard the islums make such claims though.

religious lib
Typical libdrool spin on what Bush said. All you morons have done for four years is spin anything that has to do with Iraq. God has always spoken for freedom and I believe He backs justified wars. Certainly when the Crusades were undertaken to drive back the Moors (Muslims) and to deliver the Holy Places from Mohammedan tyranny that was a justified war no? Do you think God was opposed to that war? I am sure you can debate all day (and you will) as to whether this war was justified or not, but Bush thought it was and so did the Congress (at the time when it was not politically expedient to oppose it like it is now). Why don't you all pull your heads out and stop with this disingenuous nonsense and contribute something meaningful and/or helpful to the problem in the ME or just STFU.

sheepdog
Interesting thig about Mondale,I always thought he was a better choice than Jimmy. Would have much rather seen Gerald Ford win but we all knew that wasn't going to happen, but you just couldn't help getting the impression that Mondale was the better man of the two.

I have often wondered how Walter Mondale managed to keep from crying everytime Carter pulled some lame brained scheme like giving away the Panama Canal or making all Viet Nam vets feel the nations gratitude by granting amnisty to the deserters, I for one just felt loved all over.

bobbit
please keep in mind that you are in a very small minority of americans who believe that this war was justified.

even republicans are expressing the same things i am so rather than blame liberals for the incompetence of this war you may want to examine why you are so out of touch with most americans.

leroy
isn't that implicit in his argument, that God is telling him we must kill people to spread democracy.

Chris is on his last legs
Its over big guy. Your greatest days were with Carter's stumbling sell outs of this nation. We are paying the price and you can't get over how badly you missed the opportunity to be a great journalist. I turn you off when you come on.

religiouslib
Given that you say you are religious, which I have no reason not to believe, then that simply leaves us with the second and third points:

Do you believe the Almighty intends for men to live in freedom?

If you do believe He wants us to live in freedom are their some people in this world who you feel can be denied the chance to live their lives freely?

Religious lib
You wrote: "please keep in mind that you are in a very small minority of americans who believe that this war was justified."

More spin RL. I defy you to prove that to me. Polls do say overwhelmingly that Americans are against the war as it is currently configured. They want us to fight to win or get out - as do I (the emphasis being on fight to win). And the majority do not want us to simply cut and run. At the time of our going to Iraq the polls said quite the opposite and everyone, including your libdrool leaders, thought it was justified.

"even republicans are expressing the same things i am so rather than blame liberals for the incompetence of this war you may want to examine why you are so out of touch with most americans."

Again you are spinning. There are some Repubs that are turning against the war that is true. They are unhappy with the prosecution of it as am I. I never blamed libs for any of that in any of my posts.

I do not believ I am so out of touch as libs would like everyone to believe. You still did not answer my questions.

religiouslib
No it is not a part of his arguement at all, to say you have a belief in God, that you believe that God wills freedom for each man and to further state that you do not believe this will can be extended to some people and not others is not a debate. It is a statement of belief.

The man made three points:

He stated a belief in God.

He stated a belief that God wishes men to live free lives.

He stated that this principle of God given freedom is something that he believes in.

I ask you, are you in disagreement? Do you find these three beliefs wrong, and if so why?

bobbit
just because you don't like the facts does not mean it is spinning.

look up any poll you want and 70% of americans want a timetable to get out.

you are the one who is spinning.

leroy
and i ask you a question you did not answer

do you think God wants us to kill people to spread freedom?

that is the implication in bush's statement.


Chris Matthews
The problem with Chris Matthews is that he is in love with his voice and his thoughts. He doesn't stop his monologue one second to hear what anyone else is saying. It's a mindless stream of consciousness that does not allow for anyone else's opinion to have an impact. Talk about arrogance! The few times I happen to stop a minute to watch what he's saying he's spewing lie after lie and it makes me cringe. He knows PERFECTLY well that he's just fudging things enough to perpetrate the lies that allow him to keep his job.

ThighMaster
I believe Matthews was on the staff of House Speaker Tip O'Neill before becoming a TV buffoon. It was probably pretty good training.

RE: religiouslib
"please keep in mind that you are in a very small minority of americans who believe that this war was justified."

This can't have anything to do with the Chris Matthews, et al, who have been doing everything they can in the media to bring this about, could it?

Imagine had we the very same media of today during World War II.

The media would be screaming "BUT GERMANY DIDN'T BOMB PEARL HARBOR!!" every single day.

On the D-Day invasion, your television would be splashed with the thousands of dead American soldiers.

There would be story after story about the "horrible" treatment the "poor German freedom fighters" were receiving in our POW camps.

Public perception of that war would be COMPLETELY different. The vast, vast, VAST majority of Americans would have been COMPLETELY against the war.

Starting toward the end of the Korean War, the media went from reporting the news, and maybe even reporting the news in a way to spin things more positively for the United States, to doing everything they could possibly do to cripple our ability to wage any war. The New York Times has actively gone out of their way to help our enemies by printing classified information on their front page ("Pinch" and his editors are LUCKY that someone with the testicular fortitude that a president ought to have isn't our president. Had Lincoln been our president when they pulled that one, they would have been hanged from the neck until dead.).

Perhaps it is because in the aftermath of "the last great war", after seeing the HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of dead Americans come home in caskets, the already sissified lefties in the media decided it was better not to fight any war ever, or maybe the media has since been taken over by traiters who hate the US (or maybe both), but it is an IRREFUTABLE FACT that if we had today's media during WWII, we would all be goose-stepping and speaking German.

RE: religiouslib
"do you think God wants us to kill people to spread freedom?"

Do you think that God would approve of us sitting idly by and watching other people get killed and tortured when we had the power to stop that killing and torture?

matthews
he serves two functions, he throws red meat to the libtards by his continued ravings against all things repub, but in an enraged act that only stirs the dark and primitive areas of their "brains". His second function is to give his imitation of monica on all things dim. But he has never been anything but a dimlackey from his days with good old tip, That his home is on msnbc also shouldn't as any surprise, another example of fair and unbiased reporting

religiouslib
No where does he say God told him to wage war, he doesn't even imply it. You read only what you look for if that is what you see.

And your question to me is the old "Do you still beat your wife" routine. In a short answer, I do not believe God "wants" us to kill one another at all.

Religious Lib
you wrote: " just because you don't like the facts does not mean it is spinning. look up any poll you want and 70% of americans want a timetable to get out. you are the one who is spinning."

And how does this desire for a timetable equate to being "against the war"? You constantly spin things that say something entirely different to suit your agenda. I say this simply confirms my opinion that we want measurable and positive progress or we want out - not just that we want out.

beowulfe
as long as killing and torture takes place in countries other than america or europe libs don't care. Their poster boy who cheers every killing dictator on the planet, the peanutman Jimmy Carter, always tell us how america is the enemy but castro, arafat, kim jong mentally ill, mugabe, chavez, and others of their ilk are actually heroes to their people because they stand up[ to the evil america.

religiouslib 2:21pm
__You reply to bobbit's post that he should keep in mind that he is in a very small minority who believe this is a just war. I find comfort in that remark,has this war against the evil we fight,is of the worlds majority.Those of the world,and what is afforded by the world.A day will present itself when,that minority will stand alone.A people examining the depths this evil goes in subverting truth,to achieve its goals.An evil that liberally moves with freedom with the worlds love,but has no freedom of movement with the Love of its inhabitants.That freedom first needs to be given up to the world.

To AZPhil
You were quoting Matthews, who said:

"Losing control, Matthews dropped the F-bomb on national television: 'I want a guy to run for President who doesn't have a f**ing -- I'm sorry, a ranch.'"

To which I reply, that's a bit disengenuous, isn't it? I guess Matthews' memory isn't very good. Has he forgotten already that Great Society rancher by the name of Lyndon Johnson?

This is what happens when one becomes myopic. You become so rabid in your efforts to undo someone, Bush in this instance, that you become blind to knowledge of things you have known as well as you know the back of your hand.

EVERYBODY knows LBJ had a ranch, a huge one at that; at least, everyone in Matthews' generation knows it.

This is just another example, slight as it is, of the indsidious nature of Newspeak, a la Orwell.

All ranchers are bad, bad for the country: BEWARE . . .ooooooooooh, be very afraid.

Darcy
Matthews is in the advanced stages of BDS, so what can you do? He thinks Jimmy "I make Neville Chamberlain look like a Warmonger" Carter is the answer to all our problems.

And he is, if you want a crappy economy, a gutted military, and the same respect worldwide now enjoyed by Rwanda.

Thigh
I couldn't agree more. have yuo noticed most (not all, so liberals stop typing now) incidents you hear about donkeysih behavior is with liberals? Remember Alec Baldwin told some cop in NYC "Do you know who I am?" Elton John had a hissy fit about having to walk 50 yards because of some security set up for the royal family. Sean Penn used to get in a public fight every time he went outside. And Babs, Mikey Moore, and Madonna are known for being condescending arrogant a%%holes.

I was against the Iraq war
and not because of any liberal media spin. The Denver Post and The Rocky Mountain News published letters from people who were in Iraq, literally begging us not to invade--that the Iraqui civilians and their infrastructure had already suffered too much under Hussein and the embargo. Walter Pincus wrote good articles against the invasion of Iraq.

I don't believe or buy into "Bush lied, people died" mantra. I wish that were so--then we as a people wouldn't bear so much of the blame due to our own apathy. Cheney and Rice did say a few things that were actually lies, purposefully or not, I don't know. What the administration did that I think is worse than lying was the constant drumbeat for the invasion. In the one state of the union speech, President Bush mentioned 9/11 and Hussein, I believe 17 times. The implication was obvious and they all did it. To people who don't read and get their information from radio or TV, the consensus was and what I can't get over is still that Saddam Hussein was connected to 9/ll, that Iraq is an enemy to us. So now we have turned that country upside down and we want to leave. By the way, choosing to fight them in Iraq rather than here? Boy, I can't understand why the Iraquis aren't thanking us for that! Whyever, we did invade Iraq and now we can't abandon those people and I don't need God to tell me that.

Bush Lies Explained
I am going to attempt to explain the Bush Lies as I see it. Tehre are two primary arguments

Argument # 1) The intellegence from other countries believed that Iraq had WMD's, so how did Bush Lie if our intellegence agencies believed the same?

Answer:

The word is belief. There was abscence of real intellegence on Iraq for many reasons. So the world and the US assumed and believed Iraq had WMD's. We really didn't know. Clinton himself says he believed, but he didn't really know. We went to war on a belief, not knowledge. So the Administration looked for evidence to support the belief to sell the war.

If you recall, there was virtually no intellegnce made public. The adminstration claimed they knew where the WMD's were (Rumsfeld famous quote on "Where know exactly wher ethey are hidded, North of Baghdad, East West and South somewhere"), but refused to give it Hans Blix (Weapons Inspectors) citing National security. The intellegnce made public was selctively picked but was questionable at the time made public. For example, In the Presidents State of the Union in 2003 when he first mentioned Yellow cake he quoted British Intelligence. He didn't quote AMerican Intelligence becasue no one would back it. It could not be verified by US intel. But he used it anyway.

The Aluminum Tubes was discredit from the begining by the UNIAEA and The US dept Energy. But went with it becasue the CIA believed they were part of a nuclear program.

The intel made public did not come from varied intellegence agencies, but rather filtered by the Counterterrorism Evaluation Group (CTEG) and the Office of Special Plans (OSP), Run by Doug Feith reporting to Rumsfeld. They looked for links to AL-Qaeadea and WMD's.


Argument #2) The Bush Administration never said Iraq casued 9/11 and never said Iraq was working with Al-Qaead.

Answer:

This is true. They never said it. They also never said "immenent danger". This is what is called plausible deniability. They never said it, but had no problem if you believed it. After all, they never corrected our understanding.

Dick Cheney is the master. If you go back carefully listen to the tapes of DIck Cheney on the Sunday morning talk shows and other admin officals, they carefully invoke Iraq with 9/11. Here is how:

Cheney; "It is hard to believe that a roque group like Al-Qaeda could carry this out alone. We looking into the possibility that other nations were involved. So we are looking at Iraq, Iran and others"

See how they do it...Pretty Slick. The connection is inferred. This is how 50% of the AMerican believe Iraq was involved in 9/11.

Dick Cheney carefully leaked information through the NY Times so he can quote it on Sunday Talk shows.

Please keep in mind, history tells us that to sell war in a democracy or any society is not possile without propaganda. It amazes me that after 6 years and looking back that so many people in this post are in denial and continue not to see that propaganda was used. I just cited some examples, but there is a lot more that has been documented.

You should be outraged, not defending him.

Stedes
Why title your post "Bush Lies Explained" and then admit he did not lie. Looks like you may be using some deception yourself.

To the "Bush lied" crowd...
For once and for all, you "Bush lied" parrots:

If Bush lied, then so did every single congressman that originally voted for the war and/or made public statements in support of it. (Yes, that includes Kerry, H. Clinton, et al.) Do you really believe that Pres. Bush had access to some top-top-top secret intelligence that members of the Intelligence Committee and other high-ranking congressman could not get their hands on? That's just absurd. They had access to the very same intel, and you know it.

So, please, stop it already with the "Bush lied, people died" mantra. Not everyone believes something just because it's repeated over and over -- some do, but not everyone.

Robert
You must have stopped reading where I said "most (not all, so liberals stop typing now) incidents you hear about donkeyish behavior is with liberals? "

I'm sure there are arrogant asses on both sides, and i said that before. But the two or three conservative actors in Hollywood aren't telling us "little people" how to live while doing the exact opposite themselves.

Thigh
One small correction to your point: "These folks are so completely unhinged, but remember, other than telling you how to live your lives or what you should think, they want nothing more to do with you. Just try approaching one of them in a restaurant...."

They do want one more thing to do with us. They want us to buy tickets to their movies, concerts, etc. Otherwise, you are 100% correct.

To Buzz from earlier
Exactly!!!

Belief means...
...you think a store has the item you want to purchase, knowledge comes when you enter that store and find the item. Had the weapons inspectors been granted access to all the sites they requested we may well have had "knowledge" one way or the other regarding the weapons, without that access we were left with "belief". And that intel was filtered through one or two offices is not an indicator that it did not originate from various sources.

Only an elitist would think they are smarter than 50% of the population, when no where near 50% of the US believes Iraq was responsible for the events of 11 Sept 01. More people believe the US government was responsible for 9/11 than believe Iraq was.

As to the use of propaganda, yes there is a lot being spread but not from the places the Left claims it to be from.

Stedes
Given that all of these people were president, and/or are running/did run for president, anything to add? Even the smartest woman who has ever lived said Saddam had WMD AND a relationship with al-qaeda.

Don't try the "Congressmen don't get the same NIE brief as the president". Co-President Rodham got the NIE for eight years.

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002 |

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."

- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."

- President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998


"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002




Thigh
Yes, Gary Sinise is one conservative actor in a sea of liberalism. And he doesn't badmouth everyone. Remember first that Sean penn is a cretin; that goes a long way.

I don't know how you forgot, but yes, they do have their fossil-fuel-buring homes, pools, yachts, planes, limos, etc to pay for.

The funny part is, owing to their arrogance, they can't see that they actually HURT Dems by standing by them on stage. If they continue to "help" like michael moore, I say let them.

Re "Bogus Charge"
"God told me to strike at Al Quaeda and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you can help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them." ---George W Bush, speaking to Palestinian Prime Minister Mahmoud Abbas. Quoted in the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette, July 9, 2003. Cited in "Take Them at Their Words" by Bruce J Miller and Diana Maio, page 56. The book is a compilation of documented actual quotations by Republicans.

For confirmation, I googled the words "God told me to strike Al Quaeda" and got numerous hits, some offering more detail and one giving an Arabic translation of Bush's words, which were witnessed by many at the meeting where they were spoken.

Limbaugh dismisses this quotation as "bogus". In fact, it is well documented.

AZPhil
Get your story straight. How can we liberals have yachts, mansions, private planes, second homes, and expensive cars when we are all tax-sponge government-sucking do-nothing leeches? Don't you know, we are all on welfare.

bush and god
i cannot stand mathews. he is an obvious liar and shrill for his impotant favorites.

However, that does not make bush good. we have had 1 too many christian moronic tongue speakers. first carter, now bush, both terrible presidents. it is the insane christian right that put this fool bush in office, christians deserve the blame for side tracking the republicans as much as unions had done to dems.

your religion has no place in political life. if it does, you are not religious, you are an uneducated zealot. you need to be shunned as such. if you speak to god about politics, and god replies you need to be committed to a home of the insane.

lilly
your hatred of this president is well documented. That you supoport every liberal cause and despise everything conserv is also frequesntly posted. You have told us you are a sr citizen who has trouble getting infor about all you critisize. Kindly go and gum you strained carrots and stop pestering us with you idiocy

Lilly
My story is straight. The democrats are the party of the rich now. Babs and all your hollywood heroes don't care about high taxes for two reasons. One, they have the extra cash. Two, and this is a guess, but I imagine they pay accountants to minimize their tax burden. And they can always donate some dress to charity when they need a write-off, too.

I saw part of Michael Moore's 1040 last year, and he paid some ridiculously low amount. With liberals, it's always "do as I say, not as I do".
Sort of like Owlgore's mansion with the enormous CO2 production.

Robert
"Silly me, I think it is worse when people "lie" about things when they are representing the government aka the people then just "lies"."

Like a sitting president suborning perjury, for example?

Robert
You may be right "absolutly...I am quite sure the POTUS has access to intel that the Senate does not", but no senator in his right mind would have taken Bush's word for it.

Besides, Hillary WAS president for eight years, so she would have known...

Robert
"It was about a consensual sexual relationship that showed poor judgment but is sadly not unique in DC."

But not true for Sen Vitter and Mark Foley, right? they have to resign in disgrace.

religiouslib says:
please keep in mind that you are in a very small minority of americans who believe that this war was justified.
=====================
Can you cite your stats for this claim? Besides which, who the heck cares at this point? We're there, it was legally begun, we need to finish the job. No one...not one single liberal on this site, will bother to say what would be gained by leaving a huge vacuum in Iraq after our "re-deployment." Look at a map, sometime. If Iraq is not a strategically important part of the ME, then I'm not sure what would be. Think outside the box, why don't you? BTW: Proud to be one of the "very small minority of Americans who believe that this war was justified."

Lilly
As ususal only part of the story

from one of the googles
"Two calls to the White House for clarification went unreturned, but colleague Glenn Kessler did some digging. The Haaretz reporter, Arnon Regular, read what the paper said were minutes of the Palestinians' meeting to Kessler and another colleague, who is an Arabic speaker.

The Arabic-speaking colleague's translation, was this: "God inspired me to hit al Qaeda, and so I hit it. And I had the inspiration to hit Saddam, and so I hit him. Now I am determined to solve the Middle East problem if you help. Otherwise the elections will come and I will be wrapped up with them."

Even then, there's uncertainty. After all, this is Abu Mazen's account in Arabic of what Bush said in English, written down by a note-taker in Arabic, then back into English. "

Lots of chances for errors,
Did you ever play the game gossip?

Packrat
Every time she speaks.

replies to a few posters
One of the differences between the Iraq war and the Kosovo action: No U.S. battle deaths in Kosovo.

Why no one would complain about the lack of a Germany-Pearl Harbor link: After Japan bombed Pearl Harbor, U.S. declared war on Japan. THEN Germany declared war on the U.S. So we HAD to fight Germany--DUH!

Bush's statement that God told him to invade Iraq was reported by reputable media sources, such as the BBC.

Chris Matthews is neither a liberal nor a secularist. He's pretty much a centrist; he criticizes the left as well as the right, and he makes liberals mad a lot of the time. He was very critical of Bill Clinton. And he's a practicing Roman Catholic.

And really, attacks on his weight are out of line, as are sexually oriented comments such as that he has a "gragina," as if comparing him to a woman is the worst possible insult!

It's not cultural war, it's spiritual.
Like an army of frogs making noise, the corrupt media is spewing venom all over the earth. The Bible does have this to say, before Armageddon:
(“Then I saw three evil spirits that looked like frogs; they came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.”)
Abortion, homosexual marriage, “political correctness” above religion (Christian only), monopoly of Darwinism, anti-America, appeasement to the Regime and terrorism, and etc. are not real cultural wars but spiritual wars waged against Christianity by the “frogs” and the agents of the antichrist.
Above is a quote from my article “Behold, 666 is here”. For more details, please click
http://www.canadafreepress.com/2007/chow051007.htm
“It is a very insightful and well written article”, said Judi McLeod.

Chris Matthews, Democrat
As many of you know, Mr. Matthews once worked for Speaker Foley, Democrat, Massachusetts. While he is free to express his opinion, I believe it is important that he be introduced on his television appearances as "Chris Matthews, Democrat, New York."

mr boss
I believe foley was from washington, matthews worked for tip o'neil. He used to write a column that was carried by one of the paper's from san francisco, that of course was no surprise

Matthew is medicated...

That drool we see pooling under his tongue, is a sign of psychotropic medications. Really, look at this guys mouth full of drool. I used to get the same drool-pool halfway through my LSD trips.

It's painfully apparent to me that this guy is not well. I'm not being sarcastic either, just watch his show.

We're losing the war
because of Abu-Gharib? Liberals will pick out one speck and then try to apply it to a universal concept. Perhaps the next excuse against the war will be that their dog got sick.

Robert,
The reason Kosovo worked out well was because Republicans did not interfere in Mr. Clinton's war (even though we were against it). Liberal interference is the main reason the current war hasn't progressed farther along. Secondly, we could bomb Iraq and the entire Middle East into submission, but Democrats would never allow that to happen would they?

Going to War
Seems to me the person in Congress that was in the best position to know what intelligence the Clinton administration had on Saddam was --HILLARY-- and she voted to invade. Was her vote because she was lied to by Bush? Wouldn't she know he was lying? Maybe she knew he was lying but voted for the war because it was popular (everyone is doing it).

There is also the possibilty she knew the threat was real.

james earl carter
I thought the peanut man legally changed his name to jimmy carter.

I did.
.

matthews and missus clinton
c-span and the wash post are reporting about missus clinton showing some cleavage. Is this the latestg attempt at changing her image to show she is actually a female. I am sure matthews will enlighten the country with the salacious details. At least they are not telling us about her ample rear end

to the conserv ladies
I apologisize for my reference to the physical appearance of missus clinton if you found the reference offensive. I cioyldn' resist after all these libs have been informing us about the size of her supposed male accoutrements. I just find it very weird that the ice queen is suddenly showing something unseen since the departure of vince foster

Someone fails to understand..
"the power of stratigic bombing". Four Carrier Groups could close the coast of the Indina Ocean from the Persian Gulf to the Straits of Malacca.

The United States could choke off all economic activity with in B-52 range of Diego Garcia.

If you do not plan to invade a country and force it into submission, then control of the sea lanes and halting all economic activity with end design of starving a people into submission is a militarily acheivable end.

Robert said CT does not understand, I say America will take the hard road, because starving a people into submission is just to inhumane.

To CT
Listen to what you said: "We could bomb the whole Middle East into submission but Democrats would never allow that to happen, would they?". Could you just for a minute consider the consequences of an action? The Middle East is mostly Muslim. Muslims have a strong sense of brotherhood with one another. There are Muslims all over the world, not just in the Middle East. What do you think would happen next if we "bombed the Middle East into submission"? With Islam's traditional ethos of "you killed my brother so now I'm going to kill you" we could expect x amount of revenge from Muslims everywhere, and it would not be of short duration.

True, somebody did post on townhall that we should "nuke every country that has Muslims living there". Maybe that was you? That would be roughly every country on earth. Possibly we could exclude Antarctica, but we would have flattened pretty much everything else. Then what?

Meanwhile, with what manpower and money would you conduct Armageddon? War is very expensive. Throughout history it has been paid by raising taxes. You don't want to pay taxes. And war needs manpower, but already our forces are stretched thin and our recruitment numbers are down. You don't want a draft. Where is the manpower coming from?

Another townhall poster said, "I have no problem with nuclear war as long as it's somewhere else." With nuclear war, there is no "somewhere else". Forget "they'll follow us home"---if we start dropping the kind of stuff that subjugates the world, they won't wait to follow us home, but will find our address and come here on broomsticks. And frankly, if the situation were reversed, wouldn't you do the same thing?

So: tell us how you would operationalize your plan.

Proud Lib
The best laugh of the day, at one time before there were other options i might have believed he wasn't a far left hack but during the Bush years he has been nothing but a major hack.

Mathews worked for Tip Oneal
For those of you wearing but cleavage pants--Tip Oneal was the Democrat Speaker of the House. Chris Mathews was an operative for the Democrat machine.

He still is. But he pretends to be Objective.

While I'm at it Bill Moyers used to work for Jimmy Carter.

Hmmm... The Republicans take questions from Chris Mathews but the Democrats say Brit Hume is too conservative...

Pansies.
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