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Tuesday, May 22, 2007
David Limbaugh :: Townhall.com Columnist
The Immigration Debacle
by David Limbaugh
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Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


The almost-stealth immigration bill light-speeding its way through Congress represents all that is wrong with politics and an elitist political class that is too far removed from its constituencies.

There is so much wrong with this bill procedurally, and substantively, that one can barely scratch the surface in a short column, but I'll recapitulate some of the most egregious concerns and share a few pet peeves.

First, we are bogged down in a semantic debate over whether the bill constitutes "amnesty." Open-borders apologists take umbrage at the term, saying the bill does not constitute amnesty because illegal immigrants will be punished, never mind how inconsequentially.

But I would argue that those insisting it is amnesty are, in a sense, understating their case. In certain respects it's worse than amnesty. Not only will criminal violators of the immigration laws receive a mere wrist-slap for their infractions; they will be rewarded for them.

Consider the treatment of those convicted of other crimes -- take stealing, for example. The convict not only faces criminal penalties; the law seeks to restore him and his victims to their status prior to the crime, to the extent that's practicable or possible. The bank robber is not allowed to retain the fruits of his crime. He must pay restitution, if applicable, in addition to whatever fines or jail time to which he is sentenced.

By contrast, millions of illegal immigrants under the bill would not be sent back home but would become legal permanent residents of this country. By being allowed to stay, they would be, in effect, keeping the fruits of their crime. More importantly, many of them would become recipients of federal government largesse via a smorgasbord of entitlements.

As reported in the Washington Times, the Heritage Foundation's Robert Rector calculates that during their lifetimes, they will likely receive "$2.5 trillion more in government services than they will pay in taxes." Among those benefits are Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, SSI, public housing, subsidized college education and Social Security Disability Insurance. So those persisting in challenging the amnesty characterization should be reminded that many illegals will be receiving an enormous economic windfall to accompany their anemic wrist-slapping.

Second, many of the bill's proponents have long resorted to ad-hominem assaults on the opponents, falsely portraying their valid, prudent, noble and patriotic opposition as racist, nativist and ultra-restrictionist.

But again, those who should have the burden of proof in this matter (the proponents) have turned the table on the opponents. How dare those who are promoting legislation that would flout the rule of law, reward criminal behavior, undermine our unique American culture, balkanize our society, dilute our sense of nationalism, make us more vulnerable to attack from our global terrorist enemies and coerce a massive redistribution of resources from lawful, taxpaying American citizens, call those who favor reasonable measures to preserve what is worth preserving about America -- which has nothing to do with race or ethnicity, by the way -- "racists"?

The misguided arrogance of those playing the race card to demonize open-borders opponents is staggering. Then again, inflaming the passions against your adversaries obviates addressing the issues factually.

I dare say that opponents of the bill would be opposed no matter the ethnicity or nationality of the windfall transferees. It's not about their ethnicity; it's not even primarily about them. It's about the rule of law, our national security, the American culture, the English language, national unity during time of war, the constitutional rights of American citizens and the fiscal concerns of American taxpayers and their descendants.

It's especially shameful that many of the bill's greatest supporters are motivated by crass political concerns rather than the best interests of the United States. If it were otherwise, would they be so adamant about fast-tracking this bill and drafting it in duplicitous terms? On that note, be aware that some experts who have briefly studied the bill's fine print have noted that the bill's so-called "triggers" -- the events that must occur as a sop to enforcement types before the wrist-brushings and windfalls kick in -- are virtually defined out of existence in many cases by exceptions that swallow the rule.

One silver lining in this unfortunate series of events is that such cavalier displays of power by the elite governing class serve to catalyze patriots in this nation and crystallize their thinking about what is still right with America and worth preserving despite the highhandedness and callousness of those who masquerade as representing their interests.

Just say "no" to this legislation.

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About The Author
David Limbaugh, brother of radio talk-show host Rush Limbaugh, is an expert in law and politics and author of Bankrupt: The Intellectual and Moral Bankruptcy of Today's Democratic Party.
 
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Anything
with Kennedy's gruby hands on it will screw America.

Cloture Choked, Debate Dangles,
Amnesty Cloture Choked, Debate Dangles, and Power Brokers Tap-Dance

Much to the chagrin of Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, (D) NV, the Senate Power Brokers, and the White House, the push for Cloture by tonight and compromise by Friday is now no closer than June, if at all.

Carefully finding his words and trying not to show defeat of the arrogant power play; "It would be to the best interests of the Senate ... that we not try to finish this bill this week," said Reid, (D) NV, as the chamber began debate on the volatile issue. "I think we could, but I'm afraid the conclusion wouldn't be anything that anyone wanted."

The offices of US Senators including Sen. Reid’s offices were clogged with phone calls, faxes, emails in a groundswell of opposition to this most recent attempt to hoodwink the US public with a fast push and shuffle of the so-called Immigration Reform program. The Senate deal crafted by Liberal Senator Kennedy (D) MA and the once embraced as a Conservative Senator Jon Kyl, (R) AZ; now said by vast portions of the US public as easily seen through as an Amnesty program, custom made for illegal aliens being allowed to stay in the US or return to the US to work cheaply on a Z Visa.

Though there appears many different reasons by Republican and Democrats, Conservative and Liberals alike to not want this latest boondoggle, it is obvious that the absence of real cost projections on this legislative effort that could easily top the cost of the Great Society programs of President Lyndon B. Johnson (D) TX that swelled the public welfare roles to millions and expenses to taxpayers in the Billions of Dollars.

There is growing evidence of organized labor siding with taxpayers on this effort to block unwanted entry of illegal aliens coming by the millions to take the jobs of America’s workforce. Although with unions at a historical low-point in membership, the very thought of swelling membership with newly arriving unskilled laborers by forsaking multi-generation union worker families is not as attractive as once thought by the liberal DEM & GOP politicians who are pushing the Amnesty deal.

The basic principles of enforcing US laws to prevent unwanted illegal aliens, protecting lawful citizens, securing borders and preserving language and culture are among the topics of frustration and anger by millions of Americans who have earned their place in America’s structure, history and future. Even first generation immigrants are speaking of the unfairness of all these lawbreakers coming in and now instead of deportation are facing full pardons and jobs and welfare and the promises of citizenship, never having earned it lawfully like the immigrants before them.

With the Amnesty Cloture Choked and Debate Dangling for a time in June, watch and listen over the next few weeks as the old song and dance routine takes place.

Richard G. Shuster (from Rick’s Random Ramblings, Amnesty Cloture Choked, Debate Dangles, and Power Brokers Tap-Dance)


Th only hope
of stopping this bill is getting through to any Republican legislator, and any blue dog DEM, who votes for it, that they haven't a chance at re-election ever again. I can hardly wait to vote against my senator Martinez for his role in this debacle. I hear even Senator Nelson is having serious thoughts. What do the Miami Cubans really think about moving a crowd of illegal aliens ahead of their law-abiding relatives trying to get in?

"One silver lining in this unfortunate
series of events is that such cavalier displays of power by the elite governing class serve to catalyze patriots in this nation and crystallize their thinking about what is still right with America and worth preserving despite the highhandedness and callousness of those who masquerade as representing their interests."

I love this quote. Here's to David being right about this.

For those interested in this topic, I have a couple of related Mark Steyn columns linked on my blog (just click on my name).

Fool us once...
I hope everyone remembers what Kyl, McCain and any others that supported this bill did. INCLUDING Bill O'Reilly. Fool us once....

A Note to David Limbaugh....
Hi David,

Just wanted to take a moment to ask a favor. Please thank your brother Rush for his unchecked support for all thngs Republican. By offering his unquestioning loyaly to anyone who is a member of the Republican Party, he has allowed them to feel as if they have the support of all members of the party, regardless of how ridiculous the proposals they put forth may be.

Now we Democrats hold all the cards, and with GW Bush's help, we soon will have an ever growing hispanic voter base. No longer will we lose out in close elections, and we have Bush, Rush's number one guy, to thank.

So the next time you see him, give your bro a pat on the back from his pals at the DNC.

PS: Jorge wants his limo simonized, tell Rush to drop by this afternoon and take care of it.

XOXO
LD

I'm disgusted and alarmed.

This latest Amnesty is a real abomination. The third in my lifetime and each one comes with promises that it will be the LAST one, but they never solve the problem. They make the problem WORSE. But I guess our Congress isn't very imaginative or resourceful, because here we go again! The definition of insanity is when you do the same thing over and over and expect a different result.

First of all....who do these pompous Congressmen think they are? They are not kings, they are slobs we elected to represent Americans, not to represent illegal foreigners! But they come out like kings making their pronouncement (without the permission of the people and with no debate), that they are going to DESTROY 250 YEARS OF AMERICAN HISTORY by turning our country into the United Socialst Republic of North Ameximerica!

Secondly, why would any Republican go along with a plan that will ultimately reduce their party to irrelevance? I smell something VERY FISHY. Follow the money.

This plan is dangerous to national security, will be unbelievably expensive (illegal immigration is already killing our resources and they want to triple it??), will hurt cities already overwhelmed by this cancer, will increase crime in our cities (we can't deport gang members? I'd like to know the rationale behind that genius decision) and most of all...the plan is UNENFORCEABLE!

Who is going to enforce the NEW rules? The same people who couldn't enforce the old ones?

This Amnesty is a joke but Americans are not laughing. I have never seen such unbridled anger as I have been seeing from my fellow Americans since these Congressional kings announced their malignant vision for America's future. Many of us are changing our party affiliation over this abortion of sanity.

If these genii in Congress had any real idea (or care) about what people are saying, they would hire some illegals to build them a deep bunker because people want to tar & feather them. Starting with John McCain. He's about as Conservative as Elvis' Vegas costumes.

We need wisdom and common sense in government, but God knows there is none to be found on the hill today.

Disgusted.

INDEPENDENT...ANYONE?
This is going to be a great opportunity for an independent candidate to become President of the United States of America...while it's still America.

There are over 30,000 gang members (criminals all) in Los Angeles alone. These are the folks who live and kill for the drug and any other illegal industry in our country. How many do you think are in our country? They will receive amnesty? YES!

Has any Senator or Congress person ever mentioned to McCain/Kennedy that these illegal aliens are criminals also? The DOJ could pursue everyone of them and have them out of the country before any of the so called triggers are met.

The border cannot be erected without funds being allocated...did NOT notice anything about money except fining the illegal aliens $5,000. They paid more than that to get here! The Border Patrol of 14,000 to 18,000 has not been funded either. That's why the fence has not been built after the President's promise to build it (no funds) and send thousands of National Guardsmen and women down there.

I took the Boston Tea Party to get England's attention about taxation without representation.

What course of action can opponents of this garbage legislation take other than our pens, phone calls, faxes, forums and blogs? ANY IDEAS OUT THERE?

Sometimes I think America needs something very frightening to happen to give us a wake-up call. But that only works for about a year...then it's back to the mall, theatres, stadiums, beaches etc.


Thank you, David
The left is pretending they don't like this either saying it doesn't go far enough to open the borders. Yeah, right. Seeing a picture of Ted Kennedy enjoying a good laugh says quite enough. They're not upset.

The left does nothing but tear this country down in all areas, whether it's morals or their high taxes or pandering to terrorists.

As a person of great faith and hope, David, I do also want to note agreement with your silver lining paragraph here. Many more will wake up. Of course, it may be a tad late. Someone recently noted that the left doesn't particularly agree with Al Qaeda in all respects, just that they are for tearing down the establishment. Funny, we were better off when they just linked up with commies.

Duplicate Post on same topic
Did anyone see Fox News yesterday evening when the "panel" answered questions about this mess. They had 1 Neocon and two liberals to answer the questions. Guess what, they were all "surprised" by the opposition to this bill. Fred Barnes said that the people who were screaming that it wasn't amnesty would never be satisfied. I also note that the "Weekly Standard" has no columns about this issue all the way back to the end on their site. That tells you where they are at. Barns supports Bush on every policy he has.

As to the current bill, Hugh Hewitt has the best analysis I have seen yet. The bill in it's current form is unenforceable so it will be just like the last bill and we will have the 40 to 50 million that Dr. Sowell is talking about, that is if we don't already have them.

Perhaps a few more clauses should be added to the bill to assure enforcement. Instead of the so called "benchmarks" they should add a caveat in which all the available data shall be turned over to a pro-group and an anti-group who will then conduct a hearing. A panel of ordinary citizens chosen by random selection (with no lame excuses for absence) will decide if an honest effort has been made to enforce the rules. If not, then whoever is at fault will be charged with a crime and prosecuted.

If it is determined that the law is unenforceable as written, every one who voted for the bill will be ejected from congress and forbidden from ever seeking office again. If it is determined that the executive dept has not made a good faith effort to enforce, then the head of the immigration dept will be fired and the president impeached; neither to be allowed to hold any office again.

The Weekly Standard is
edited by Bill Kristol who to my great surprise stated the other day that he was a "liberal when it came to this issue".

So much for THAT subscription.

I hope the Rolling Thunder bikers get behind this issue...I used to make that ride every year in support of the POW's and the troops. A better group of patriots doesn't exist in this country, they could become the next Sons of Liberty and have another Boston Tea Party on the mall.

Bill BS
David, I couldn't agree more.......Grandmaster Ro

Not as long as Bush is President
We should not undertake any immigration reform until after another Presidential election. This President has shown his loyalties are not to American citizens on this issue. Personally, I believe we need Comprehensive Immigration Enforcement, not reform. We have the laws, what we don't have is any enforcement. Without enforcement, laws are meaningless.

This new package will be no different than 1986. The borders could have and should have been secured September 12, 2001. But that would have disrupted the cheap labor express and the RNC could not disappoint its contributors. So the problem has doubled as enforcement went from inadequate under Clinton to nonexistent under Bush. Now they will try to jam another amnesty down our throats. The question remains, will we let them?


Who actually believes the President has any intention of building a fence? How will we enforce new laws when we won't enforce current laws? Will the people breaking current law comply with any new law? What will we do if they don't?
Who actually believes, that when George W. Bush delivers on his promises to citizens of other countries illegally in our country, that they will vote Republican? Another amnesty will result in Democrat majorities for decades. How stupid do you have to be to import voters for the opposition at the same time you alienate your own voters? If the GOP surrenders our sovereignty and abandons the rule of law, they may find in November 2008, that they still have their big money/cheap labor donors, but they do not have voters. GOP-RIP

Tangled Web
Oh what a tangled web we weave, When first we practise to deceive! Sir Walter Scott Listen up Congress....
Citizens of the world-come 1 and all.Our govenment will give away our American dream.Take anything you want -lie-cheat-steal-rob-kill-drive drunk-rape to obtain your desires.Nothing will withheld from you.You will be rewarded handsomely for you criminal activies.Our government and big business is so money hungry ,cheap labor is their way..Sacrifice Americans for money.
Illegals have no respect for America. They want what we have and will do anything to get it.
Illegal Invaders have built nothing but a Cesspool of Crime, Corruption, Poverty & Misery. Congress BEWARE!!!!
"Mexicans do the work that Americans Citizens don't want to do", Translated, "Mexicans will do the work more cheaply than American Citizens puting more money into our corporate coffers and the pockets of the rich who control us.Now mexicans march carrying signs saying We demand fair wages.Now who can we import to do the work the mexicans refuse to do.

The Bill Is DOA
Now that the Heritage Foundation publicized the details of the draft bill, Senators are scrambling for cover. If McCain did have a chance at the GOP nomination, well, he doesn't anymore.

And Liberal Democrat, since the Dems took over Congress in Jan of this year, Congress's approval ratings have been in a free-fall; they are now below even the President's. I wouldn't get out the bubbly just yet.

Amnesty
Amnesty
Let me get this straight. A person who has illegaly entered my country and not paid income taxes and social security taxes will be "legalized" by this bill and gets to stay here if:
1. They pay a $5000.00 fine.
2. Don't pay their back taxes.
3. Come out of the shadows and be recognized.
4. Get a path to citizenship by hoop jumping for the gov'ment.

Here is what I believe will happen.
1. They probably won't pay a fine.
(If I stayed here for years without paying a fine and they never took the time to find me, why pay the fine)
2. If I didn't pay taxes before, why should I pay them now?
3. They will come out of the shadows because they will be enabled to continue to break the law.
4. Massive fraud will ensue on the path the citizenship and those people won't bother to demonstate their capacity or ability to be citizens, in the real sense as opposed to defacto.

What would happen if I didn't pay my taxes.
1. The IRS would put a lien on my wages and my real property.
2. If I owed back taxes they would apply fines and penalties and attach a lien on my wages and property.
3. If I used someone else's identity to work and earn money here; I would have committed fraud and I would go to jail.

Why should I be held to a higher standard of behavior than an illegal alien? I would never receive amnesty from my government for anything. Why should illegal aliens? The government is just too lazy to do this job. And I believe they are more concerned about their jobs and well-being than they are concerned about their constituents. I don't hate illegal aliens. I want them held accountable, like the government wants to hold me accountable when I make mistakes in my 401K or Roth IRA and pay their penalties. They sure can jump on me quick when I do that.

Just think what I could get away with if I was a Kennedy or an illegal alien. But maybe I am the real chump for following all of the rules and laws.

Dr. K

LD
I get your usually good attempt at satire and humor. However, you are wrong about Rush supporting anything Republican. On yesterday's show he called the Repbulicans that support this debacle of a bill "just plain stupid". Maybe you should try listening to him once in awhile instead of getting talking points from mediamatters.

What is not menioned is
Why? I believe everyone with sense wants immigration. we can use an infusion of fresh blood and ideas. The problem is politicians know Beaurocracies work too slowly and ineffectively to bring in the kind of numbers they want. But why do they want this many people? Surely they realize the chaos this will cause. I dont like either of the likely answers to this question.

Vote Buying
This bill is nothing more than a way for politicians to buy the votes of millions of "new" potential voters, and stinks from the from the word "go!" I take exception to it on all levels including using my money, our money, for all kinds of entitlements. As the father of a high school senior, I will be the one who pays for his college out of my own pocket with no government help. Looks like as a result of this amnesty bill, I'll also get to subsidize a college education for any illegal alien who wants one. Maybe my family and I should renounce our U.S. citizenship, go to Mexico, then sneak back into this country and demand that the government take care of us too. I swear I will not vote for, or work to reelect any politician in my state who has had a hand in this train wreck!

The Legacy of George W. Bush

If he gets his amnesty, he will be remembered as the last Republican President. The GOP will go the way of the Whigs and whatever party arises to replace it will never dislodge the Democrat majority, thanks to his stupidity of importing voters for the Democrats. He may go down in history as the man who simultaneously destroyed his party and his country. Of course that would be in the underground English language history books. The official Spanish language history books will laud him as the man who delivered El Norte to La Raza. (the Race in English)

Brownbeck
voted Yea on the bill yesterday...Tlhink he can also kiss the oval office goodbye!!!!!!!!!

compelling images?

[e-mail to the major media]

To: Selected National Media

re: ILLEGAL "immigration"-- compelling images?

Larry King had a guest panel discussing ILLEGAL immigration tonight. At the end of the program, a latino offered a bowl of fruit allegedly picked by ILLEGAL aliens as an example of their contribution to America-- "doing those
jobs Americans won't do."

In closing, Larry King turned to Congressman Duncan Hunter and asked if he would like to comment on that image. Congressman Hunter said, "Yeah Larry-- we recently visited a Swift Meat plant where a raid had caught 800 ILLEGAL aliens-- Swift replaced them immediately with Americans who GOT THEIR JOBS BACK."

Analysis:
Among the myriad myths perpetrated by the self-aggrandizing apologists for ILLEGAL aliens, this myth of doing jobs otherwise undone is especially egregious and unctuous. Miscreant employers do milk the "cheaper" labor, BUT the EMPLOYERS pocket the savings-- the end product/service is very little cheaper in price, if any... then American TAXPAYERS and society bear the substantial concomitant costs pandemically associated with undereducated, indigent, ILLEGAL aliens-- e.g., crimes, drugs, gangs, dropouts, illegitimacies, decimated schools and enervated social service delivery systems, balkanization, and barrio blight.

Furthermore, ILLEGALS ARE displacing Americans in quite a lot of jobs as they and their miscreant employers break our laws, including dodging taxes. Some might call the burglar who breaks into a home an "uninvited guest," but putting lipstick on the pig does not lessen the crime. We would be FAR BETTER SERVED as a society and economy if employers hired LEGAL workers at fair wages.


College Professor
Business and Economics
Atlanta, Ga.

Man the phones to Washington!

If I had any doubt that it is just one big
cluster xxxx up there in Washington, they have removed all doubt! Funny thing, though-- this thing is SO EGREGIOUS that it might be just what it takes to get Middle America properly aroused to rattle their cages in Washington. Fred Thompson is already saying that we should build the damm wall before even considering a bill. Mitt has dubbed it scamnesty-- these are good signs!

For those who want to join the fight to save America, please see my transfer post just below with a link that will take you right to your Senators' and Congresspersons' official phone numbers, web sites, e-mail addresses, etc.
_________________________________________________

Scamnesty: The Ultimate Largesse

Be afraid-- be VERY AFRAID! Congress, pushed relentlessly by the Conpiracy Of Evil, is poised to create a path to Scamnesty for 12-20 million ILLEGAL aliens. With "chain migration," that will mean MANY MORE millions of indigent poor-- and the permanent morphing of America into an entitlement government welfare state. The public trough will become a voracious, inexorable black hole devouring all that has made America great.

If you listen to the pro-ILLEGAL alien arguments by members of the Conspiracy Of Evil, they are like low-hangin' fruit to refute:

1) Disingenuous premises:
The "undocumented workers" are generally hard working, good people who simply want to feed their families and do those jobs that Americans won't do that America must have done.

Reality Check:
ILLEGALS are too often both poor and undereducated-- a formula for DISASTER if they are allowed to naturalize. We are simply allowing corrupt Mexico to dump its welfare problems on America. ILLEGALS drive down wages, and they ARE taking good jobs-- America does not save at all! A relative few hoteliers, contractors, meat processors, and other law-breaking employers milk them for lesser wages, then the TAXPAYERS GET STUCK with the crimes, barrio blight, drugs, gangs, sullied schools, ethnocentricity, and welfare costs. Bilingual education is a scam and an abysmal failure. ILLEGALS are at least 3x as likely as legal residents to be incarcerated for serious crimes:

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/3/27/114208.shtml
http://www.theamericanresistance.com/articles/art2004jan04.html
http://www.amren.com/Reports/Hispanics/HispanicsReport.htm

2) We should respect their "rights" and put those who have a job on a path to citizenship and require the payment of back taxes, learning English, and paying a $2,000 fine.

Truth Check--
HOGWASH! We owe them NOTHING! NO THING! We need to require a tamper-proof I.D. card ASAP for ANY non-citizen to function here period-- to work, get a license, attend school, rent an apt., pass go, etc. They will not really build the wall or otherwise crack down on employers-- the card radiates the cancer at its starting point. Make ILLEGALS repatriate to apply for it, then vet them thoroughly to see who might come back on an INTERIM basis to work. There should be NO CONNECTION WHATSOEVER between having been here ILLEGALLY and later gaining citizenship. Token fines and back taxes are a farce! Some would charge them a $2,000 fee when their ANNUAL cost to taxpayers (per Heritage) will be $22k just in net govt. services used alone for a family headed by an uneducated, poor ILLEGAL?!?!

Why is this such a vexing problem? Because different powerful users with ulterior agendas salivate over ILLEGALS --> the PC "elite" left sees poor, malleable voters (40 acres and a mule redux) who will assure big entitlement government for the Big Brother elites to control; miscreant employers see cheap labor that the taxpayers are forced to subsidize; the scandal-plagued Catholic Church sees replacement contributors; self-serving national pols see hispanic votes in key states; the well-heeled like their cheap domestic help-- and THEIR children will not have their private schools ruined by them; finally the latino groups quite simply indubitably seek the Reconquista-- the morphing of America into Mexicomerica.

Middle America MUST unite and stop Scamnesty which is again pending in Congress. You can learn more and/or get involved to save America at the sites below. First, an easy way to reach the OFFICIAL contact info for your Senators and Representatives to oppose the pending Scamnesty Bills:

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm

BOOKMARK IT AND BARK AT THEM OFTEN! It IS EASY-- just a few clicks!!!

Some say that it does no good to contact Congress... don't believe it! Middle Americans like you derailed Kennedy-McQuisling Scamnesty in the House last year! Congressman Peter King said he had NEVER seen such a revolt in the heartland in his many years in congress. BUT the Conspiracy Of Evil is determined to cram ILLEGALS down America's throats, so we MUST BE RELENTLESS in expressing our righteous indignation to stop Scamnesty. We won the first battle, but we MUST NOT LOSE THE WAR! Congressional staffers track the feedback... I get letters and e-mails back from Congresspersons who do not even represent me addressing my specific concerns. YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE!

Other good sites are below... the first one is GREAT -- a well-organized group trying to save America from myopia... it has prepared e-mails addressing proposed legislation you can customize and/or just send to your elected representatives!:

http://www.numbersusa.com/index

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=20530
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=opposeamnesty&s_src=K0613&s_subsrc=olk0604&printer_friendly=1
http://www.immigrationcontrol.com/
http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back906.html
http://www.heritage.org/research/immigration/
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/back704.html
http://pewhispanic.org/reports/middecade/
http://www.immigrationwatchdog.com/
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?Page=/Nation/archive/200701/NAT20070110a.html

FOLKS, THE VERY SURVIVAL OF THE AMERICAN HERITAGE, RULE OF LAW, CULTURE, COMMON LANGUAGE, SOCIO-ECONOMIC STABILITY-- INDEED THE AMERICAN WAY IF LIFE ITSELF-- ARE IN DIRE JEOPARDY!

That "cheap" labor is nothing of the sort! Per Heritage, EACH household headed by an undereducated, ILLEGAL alien will cost taxpayers $22k a year in deficit taxes versus services used alone! And that is just the tip of the iceberg of their total costs (crime control, enervated schools, balkanized barrios)! GET INVOLVED TO STOP THE INVASION NOW FOLKS-- BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE! AMERICA WOULD BE A TERRIBLE THING TO WASTE!
______________________________________________

other perspectives:
http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/
http://www.libertygunrights.com/NAUFactSheet.pdf
http://www.eagleforum.org/topics/NAU/
http://www.eagleforum.org/topics/amnesty/index.shtml
http://www.eagleforum.org/topics/immigration/index.shtml

Cram The Immigration Bill
Congree better get their heads out their rectums.
Or a lot of them will be unemployed ex-Congressmen come next election cycle.

We don't need no stinking illegals!!

I wrote an article on common sense Immigration reform. Click on my name and read it if you like.
(not a shameless plug)

Virginia Patriot
Your post at 0908 was right on the money. Let's not forget that Jorge Bush has Hispanic relatives. Ol Jeb is married to one so like Arnold and Maria, the wife holds his n*ts in her hand.

As the Roman Empire fell from poor leadership, an apathetic populace more concerned with their handouts, and rampant immigration/citizenship without substance, so it's happening now to Pax Americana.

lodestar
Here is some more info on the Invasion of the Benefit Snatchers!

http://noliberalspin.townhall.com/g/65d59c26-bd1d-42f0-96df-21aa8620f845

Better be sitting DOWN when you read it.

feedback to Congress

You can all reach your people in Congress right here at their official sites:

http://www.congressmerge.com/onlinedb/index.htm

Heck, contact LOTS of them in Congress!
NOW is the time for all good Americans to speak out-- while there is still an America to save!
As information, here is my letter I have just sent...

[note: credit is owed to Congressman Ron Paul for the basis of the outline below.]
_____________________________________________

Dear Committee on the Judiciary:

We would like to share our letter to Senator McCain with the Judiciary Committee since the relevant issues are under your auspices. We believe that this is BY FAR the MOST IMPORTANT CHALLENGE FACING AMERICA.

Thank you for considering our views. We hope that your Committee will put the best interests of America ahead of the self-aggrandizing desires of limited interest groups. We will be watching your decisions with GREAT interest.
_______________________________________________

Dear Senator McCain:

While we agree with you on some key subjects philosophically, there is one issue
where we DISAGREE PROFOUNDLY: your support of ILLEGAL aliens. If you are to have ANY HOPE of winning the Oval Office, you need to change course on this according to 68% of the voting public:

http://www.cis.org/articles/2006/back906.html

As a border state senator, you must be acutely aware of the problems these lawbreaking interlopers cause-- see the recent referenda issues passed in Az. which antithetically oppose the concepts of Kennedy--McCain Amnesty.

We know that the Senate is poised to debate Immigration reform and would like to share our summary thoughts. We understand the pressures you face and hope that you will not again cave to the pressures of the special interests when the very
future of America is at stake. We agree with the following overview goals:

Border Security and Immigration Reform

We must secure our borders NOW. A nation without secure borders is no nation at all. It makes no sense to fight terrorists abroad when our own front door is left unlocked. Potential terrorists can dance across our soft underbelly border
or overstay visas.

1. We should FIRST physically secure our borders and coastlines. We must do whatever it takes to control entry into our country BEFORE we undertake complicated immigration reform proposals... no more Simpson-Mazzoli Scamnesty shell game reforms. Only willful neglect by our government could have allowed this crisis to devolve.

2. Enforce visa rules. Immigration officials must track visa holders and deport anyone who overstays his/her visa or otherwise violates U.S. law. This is especially important when we recall that a number of 9/11 terrorists had expired
visas. A tamper-proof I.D. may be necessary for all NON-citizens to function while VISITING America TEMPORARILY-- to work, get a license, rent an apartment, go to college, seek emergency assistance, pass go, etc.

3. NO AMNESTY-- PERIOD. Estimates suggest that 10 to 20 million people are already in our country ILLEGALLY. Border crashing is only the first of what become lives of serial lawbreaking. There should be NO PATH TO CITIZENSHIP for those who have been here ILLEGALLY. It is a farce to speak of paying a token fine and back taxes when each ILLEGAL alien household is costing taxpayers $22k annually in deficit taxes versus social services used alone (Heritage).

4. No welfare for ILLEGAL aliens. Americans have welcomed LEGAL immigrants who seek opportunity, work hard, and play by the rules. BUT taxpayers should not pay for ILLEGAL immigrants who decimate hospitals, enervate schools, roads, and social services, and permeate illegitimacy, crime, drugs, gangs, and ethnocentric barrio balkanization. Public financial assistance for higher education for non-citizens should be prohibited.

5. End birthright citizenship. As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be citizens, the incentive to enter the U.S. illegally will remain strong. We need to reinterpret the 14th Amendment as it was intended.

6. Pass TRUE immigration reform. The current system is incoherent and unfair. But current reform proposals would allow up to 60 million more immigrants into our country, according to the Heritage Foundation. This is insanity. Legal
immigrants from all countries should face the SAME rules and waiting periods.

We should emphasize EDUCATED, SKILLED immigrants who can make positive contributions, NOT chain migration of those who become net users of government services-- like most ILLEGAL aliens. America cannot be the lifeboat to all of the world's less fortunate, lest the boat founder for all.

Thank you for considering our views, and thank you for your service to America.

Traitor in the White House
This man fully intends to destroy this country and his deeds are the evidence, his words are hogwash.

All the while he spends American lives and trillions of dollars all over the globe and protecting (attempting to) Iraq's borders, he prosecutes those Americans here protecting ours.

Argue on, debate all you want to, but he does not give a flip about America cause he himself is owned by the globalists.


As is most all in positions of power in DC.
Unless we citizens get rid of both political parties of democrats and republicans, we are headed for third world disorder and warfare.

Exactly what GW Bush has planned for this nation.

Order out of Chaos

Without this Chaos being created, there can never be a "New World Order".

The Bush administration is nothing more than a trojan horse for a big government agenda of social engineers

Chaos builders are arming tyrants worldwide as a pretext for endless war and empire building.

Check out the latest, the American Government is arming Hamas and the terrorist organizations in Palestine.




No, I won't
I will no longer contact the congress, they dont care. The culture will soon be gone. The military wants a political solution because it no longer has the guts to kill the enemy in great numbers. We have lost the country to cowards and appeasers. The end of the great american experiment will be brought down from within.

The Immigration Debacle
I'm a product of the New Orleans Catholic School System (1949-1961), and have advanced degrees, so I can read, write, and think a bit. Just what the hell do the words illegal and alien mean?

From Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary, 1983:

illegal\adj: not according to or authorized by law: UNLAWFUL: also: not sanctioned by official rules.

alien\n: 2: a foreign-born resident who has not been naturalized and is still a subject or citizen of a foreign country.

When are we going to wake up? God help us if we do not, and soon.

It is worse than it looks.
Congress is giving away our Birthrights.

Given Amnesty the illegals will no longer be content with substandard wages, they will enter the Labor Market to compete with American workers.
American workers who loose their job will find a much longer unemployment line.
Employers will be more likely to fire American workers and find a Mexican to do the job for $1 less.

Many American workers are butt over head in debt, have home & auto loans and have young families to support. A flood of defaulted loans could destroy our American Banking System.

A glut of forclosures will destroy the value of that home you worked so long to pay for.

This could trigger a domino affect in other Nations who's economy is linked to ours and cause another Great Depression.

Perhaps the chaos our DSA wants?

This Stunt is Backfiring
Every so often members of Congress do something so outrageous that it unintentionally sparks a response from the electorate that in turn ignites a political firestorm. This amnesty debacle is just such an instance.

With each passing day, more and more people are finding out what Senators like Ted Kennedy and McCain were up to. This bill doesn't bode well for the President either. Several White House Staffers were part of the effort to secretly get this bill to the President's desk for signature. While the details of the bill are bad enough, it was the undemocratic process itself which is fanning the flames. Secret, behind the scenes agreements, prevention of public floor debates, and scheduled midnight voting gives this bill the odor of anti-democratic elitism. Plenty of GOP Senators backed this bill (Sens Kyle, Lindsay Gramm, McCain, even Brownback to name a few). The implications are obvious. What the liberals cannot attain through democratic means they will get via undemocratic means.

At a time when niether the House nor the Senate can pass a war appropiations bill, they certainly found the time to give this bill time and effort. I think it is obvious where our Elected Overseers stand. They (Congress and the White House)want amnesty, and they will get it -the electorate be damned.

Even if this bill dies a quick death during the next few days, the die has been cast. The anger of this, especially the betrayal of conservatives by thier own party and President will linger through 2008. McCain is finished as a serious contender - I think even he knows it. Support from conservatives to the President is also gone. Whatever good will he had from his base is finished.

I don't think the Dems should take any satisfaction in this. Thier 22 House Freshmen are very vulnerable. This could be the start of an anti-incumbency firestorm that we haven't seen since 1952. The Beltway mentality has cemented itself into a mood of anti-democratic elitism that leads to boondogles such as the Amnesty Bill. Incumbents beware - from both parties.

JPK
Remember when the Democratic controlled Congress voted themselves a 50% pay raise in 1987 and the poopy hit the fan?

They said we're so sorry, we'll nix that one. And then went into a close door session and did a 25% pay raise over the next two years!

Newt
Did anyone see Newt on O'Reilly last night? It would be great to hear, just once, a sitting politician talk like that.

Newt said that the bill is a disaster and the worst proposed legislation in his lifetime amongst other things. I pray for either Newt or Fred as the next President.

I agree with JPK. This bill is DOA

I also agree with gently99. I can't wait to vote against Martinez. As a matter of fact, I will actively campaign against him.



Round 'em up, move 'em out!
First of all, just because you can't capture every lawbreaker doesn't mean you simply give them all amnesty. How about murderers and robbers? We don't get all of them, either.


As to rounding up the ones we can: Every time they show up at the emergency room, put 'em on a bus back south. Kids in school? Bus 'em south. They're grouping together for another of their street demonstrations? ICE rounds 'em up and puts 'em on the bus south. Raids like the one in Arkansas. No more "catch and release". Enforce the 1986 law and give their employers jail time. Stopped for a traffic violation, jail and deport 'em. This is the only law on the books that isn't enforced when you're stopped for a ticket; see what happens if you have an outstanding warrant. Check the status of all the day workers hanging around the hardware store.

Pretty soon, you'll have rounded up a LOT of them, and made the environment so hostile they'll start self-deporting.

Sounds pretty effective to me.



Also, click my name to see my essay "The Bush Legacy", absolutely on-topic this issue.

Shamless plug of my blog, because I'm here legally!


Time to take over!
I'm 66 years old; I wish you could know what patriotism really means. We loved Ike! We debated but didn't fear JFK. We were able to meet our congressmen in person. You could say want you wanted. Back in the days before racism, my sweetest, best friend was a little black girl.

Now we have a bunch of swindlers in Congress. Isn't it time we used our guns for what the Constitution provided? To protect ourselves from a despotic government and to round up all these political hacks. If they want to give the country over to Mexicans, we should take away these self-serving politicians' citizenship and let them see if they can immigrate (legally) to Mexico.

gently99
Drop a vote for me against martinez in the ballot box. WTH, it works for the libsquirts!

Judy
Check my blog (click on my handle) to read two essays on Civil Disobedience. Believe me, it's coming to a head and that rigth soon. Time to work up plan A and B!

BrianR
I say slap the death penalty on em until the situation rectifies. Drastic situations require drastic solutions.

Here illegally? We'll deport you back Mexico all right. At 37,000 ft sans chute.

Employing illegals knowingly or unknowingly? Lose your business, assets, and YOU get to follow the illegals out somewhere over the Sonoran Desert!

They'll quickly vote with their feet...

SAY WATTT????
SECURE THE BORDER????
HOW CAN WE SECURE 2,000 miles border with 370 mile fence????????????????
Illegals will walk around it like we walk around a pile of sh*t on the road.....
Elected gods still think we are total idiots!
Just remember:
crossing the border illegally - a federal crime
falsifying documents - a felony
I would like to pay $5,000 fine and not to pay taxes for several years.
WHO REPRESENTS US?
USA -RIP - 1776-2010.
(signed/buried in Waco, TX, March 23, 2005)

Gunny: LOL
A variant on my "one 12 cent bullet" solution?


Letter to the RNC
.....Report from the Field
>
>
> .....The mood is dark and rebellious ...
>
> .....Have your staff read the articles on
> Townhall.com
> ...they are almost exclusively about Illegal
> immigration and amnesty ...
>
> .....The comments range from Bush is a traitor and
> is
> selling us out to Mexico ...Bush is Ted Kennedy's
> sock
> puppet and Kennedy is the de facto President
> ...passage of the Bill will be the straw that breaks
> the back of the American Republic and destroys the
> Republican Party as a political force forever ...the
> RNC has betrayed the principles of the Conservative
> base ...the illegals will all vote for the Democrats
> and the Democrats will destroy free enterprise and
> give us Socialism ...
>
> .....It's all doom, gloom, misery and despair and
> talk
> of betrayal and revolt in the ranks ...
>
.....COLOSSUS

GunnyG
You do not fully apreciate our guests.
You have it all bassakwards!
See?
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=49482

Good blog
BrianR writes:

Tuesday, May, 22, 2007 12:21 PM
Round 'em up, move 'em out!
First of all, just because you can't capture every lawbreaker doesn't mean you simply give them all amnesty. How about murderers and robbers? We don't get all of them, either.
-------------------------------------------------

All the while the President supports the Mexican Citizens coming into this country, by passing the immigration laws, he is into show business with his calling for "The Rule of Law".


Every single illegal Mexican Citizen in America is using a fraudulent ID to obtain work.

The President himself just says they are here doing work Americans "Will not do".

Knowing full well they are working here Illegally and he supports them doing that.

Then has the gall to think we all are so stupid we cannot see how he himself is promoting crime.

He is guilty of criminal abetting if one single Mafia Boss ever was, cause Bush does the exact same thing as they do.

Then we have the hypocrites among us who will complain about illegals working at Wal-Mart but never mention its the same CRIME if they mow a lawn for pay.


GunnyG
Hey, Guns, I have to agree with you on your post at 1236. Let's hit the business owner with a $100k fine per illegal and see how fast it stops. When law enforcement catches the illegals, use the giant slingshot to send them back.

Criminal Aliens
Criminal is better than illegal right? Since being illegal means you are by definition a criminal.

Some of you guys sound mad enough to take over our political mess of a government. The right to bear arms is in there to protect citizens from a despotic government. Maybe, instead of criminal aliens, we should march on Wash DC and round up the criminals in the government (most of them, I'm sure) and dump them in Mexico stripped of their US citizenship. Wonder if Mexico would welcome them with open arms.

What a mess. I'm glad I'm old. Future doesn't look good for my kids or the grandbabies.

Thanks, Talent, 'preciate it!
.

"the elite governing class"
I find it kind of comical when right-wing pundits blame any efforts to prevent their masters from installing a total police state on "the elite governing class," as David Limbaugh has just done. I guess it bears reminding that the "elite governing class" is (almost necessarily) conservative. The elite governing class has, in the past six years, started wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, engaged in illegal spying on its own citizens, held the national media hostage to its agenda, detained foreign prisoners without charging them with any crime for years on end at Guantanamo, performed extraordinary renditions so that prisoners could be tortured and/or killed with impunity, and created, through its repressive policies, more radical Islamists than have ever existed before. And that is just scratching the surface. The elite governing class does not want amnesty for illegal immigrants. For the most part, it doesn't want to deal with the issue of immigration. However, certain factions of it talk a clean, reasonable game for the cameras, meanwhile sending money to angry rednecks so they can continue their favorite hobby of babysitting the border, armed with shotguns and Coors Light.

BrianR
HAHA! Yeah. Better still, superglue each illegal to a registered Dhimmicrat and nab two losers with one flight! haha.

MyOpine
YEOW! We need to gather these fools up and send em packing...FAST!

FrmrSSGT
Oh yeah. Nice tidy sum! Only it should go BACK into the community where the business and the illegal(s) was/were caught since the Feds have only exacerbated the problem! This would encourage people to act! In fact, how about a 10,000 reward PER BONA FIDE ILLEGAL! We could SERIOUSLY make some big bucks rounding them up FOR the Feds. Load them into Army surplus "cattle trucks" (good enough for us good enough for them) and take em home baby!

Brian
See this?

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8P9HAKO0&show_article=1

You really gotta love those kooky libs!

Gunny: Murtha
A walking poster boy for the upside of abortion.


Such criticism of an accurate post!
Come on you conservatives, you know that the talk show hosts all take their orders from the White House, and display allegiance to the the Republican Party regardless of what they say or do.

Unlike conservatives, those of us on the Left don't align ourselves with every point that our leaders make. Instead, we display an elemnt of critical thinking to what our Democrat leaders tell us. It just so happens that they are correct 100% of the time on the issues they promote. Otherwise, we wouldn't support them 100% of the time.

So deny it all you want, but it is common knowledge that all conservative talk show hosts and columnists toe the Republican Party line, whereas members of the MSM and NPR at least know how to remain unbiased.

IMMIGRANTS - PLEASE WALK IN!

WE ARE A COUNTRY OF IMMIGRANTS. LEGAL IMMIGRANTS.
WE do not WANT TO BE A COUNTRY OF:

LAW BREAKERS,
LEACHES ON OUR "SOCIAL HELP" SYSTEMS,
CHEATERS, RAPERS, KILLERS,
ETC.
YOU GET MY DRIFT........

Loyal Democrat
Are your brains fried or what? Have you really listened to the talk show hosts? What you are spouting is nonsense!! Rush, Hanniity, and Glen Beck have told Republican and Democrat alike when they are wrong..And if you can read at all you will see how many Republicans are angry with our leadership.

Your comments are stupid, and show you are just totally ignorant of what is going on around you.
Typical moonbat lefty. Probabably get your information from Rosie O'Donnell!!!

LD
Looks like ya bagged another one.

Nanna, Loyal Democrat is a satirical right-winger writing like a moonbat would on issues and he does it well!

BrianR
I think Murtha's momma threw out the baby and kept the afterbirth.

Gunny: LOL
I was going to use the old one about something running down Daddy's leg....

I should probably start stocking up on Long Johns right about now.

Got the latest weather for Siberia?

Dumb err...Loyal Democrat
Your hypocricy takes my breath away. When's the last time you saw Ann Coulter or Newt Gingrich on the MSM or NPR. On the other hand you'll see a left winger on O'Reilly, Hannity, Hume, and Gibson every single day.

Critical thinking? Is that what Ted Kennedy and Nancy Pelosi are doing?

My guess is that your handle should really be "Loyal Hispanic".

Legalized Slavery
Jim Crow would be proud. The immigration bill is nothing more than legalized slavery.
As a black man I am ashamed of this flagrant raping of my constitution [13th Amendment] and hope that true Americans stand up for our rights and the poor abused Mexicans we are using! We are taking two steps back for the sake of raw capitalism. Funny, wasn't it raw capitalism that drove America into the slave trade in our early years as a nation? Now instead of crossing the ocean we turn a blind eye as slave traders traipse across the border with the "new slaves." This is history repeating itself and we are so caught up in politics that we can't see the gross injustice being nutured by our own government. I wonder if africans swam here willing during the 17th and 18th century would we grant them amnesty? Probably not. However this point illuminates how fine tuned the concept of slavery has become over the centuries. The evolution goes like this...
1. We steal you from your home to grow our fruit.
2. We beat you to grow our crops.
3. We financially (jim crow style) strong arm you to manage our crops.
4. We offer better benfits than your native home to entice you to come to grow our crops.
God have mercy on our country.
Uncle Tom
Reference
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

Rep. Mike "I wear a little girls dress"
Rogers. Boy what a wimp, went crying to his parents, I mean house minority leadership, cause Murtha threatned him with a b!tchslappin, Murtha only has 30 years on the guy, typical repukelican.

Check this out
Get this: ICE would have ONE DAY to process clearance requests, and the default would be to grant applications unless ICE issued a hold. ONE DAY! They take coffee breaks longer than that!

Brian
Freaking cold.

Nah, brother, ya ain't even close to going! Rock on.

Malou: I take it you're pro-amnesty?
LOL


Malou
Yeah, we're bad boys and girls for expecting people to follow the laws.

BTW, did you catch that armed robbery in the bank in Chicago? Gun ban in Chicago except for criminals. Gee, go figure. You libs sure do have the knack for critical thinking...NOT!


ALL
Swing by my blog for a tear-jerking Memorial Day poem.

Libs, just forget it, you wouldn't understand it anyway.

Malou
"You give the lie to the Republican Party's carefully-concocted, squeaky clean "moral" image. Unwittingly, you rip the shell off their "secure America" cant and expose their violent, sadistic, social-Darwinist philosophy of life for what it is."

Is that today's talking point at George Soreazz's Open Society Institute?

Check my post (1032 am) out for a link that shows you exactly what The Invasion of the Benefit Snatchers is costing us.

Now, assuming YOU are a bona-fide US citizen, you should really care since it hits YOU in the pocketbook.

Gunny: Starting to look like
Malou's posting was just a swoop-by guano drop.


WITH THAT BIG, LIB HEART...
MAJORITY OD MURDERERS, CHILD MOLESTERS, RAPERS, and other scum, mostly "legals", are on the run....why not give them an amnesty?
If we are going to give it to some criminals, why not to all of them? Let's not discriminate!
BTW - let's change the name from: "USA" to Wild West and everything will be OK, baby... ;)
P.S. - and let's hug a tree, bow to goddess Gaya, see the shrink, kiss Gorby's butt - you know, the usual rituals of the left...

BrianR
The simple answer: yeah, I guess I'm reluctanty pro-amnesty. It's sad, though, because there is no legitimate reason the rest of the world couldn't be as desireable as the US. It's a pity people can't understand that nation-states are a made-up and outdated concept. Government is not the source of culture, nor are national governments the best guarantors of people's best interest. A diversity of cultures (including yours/ours)could survive and thrive much better than at present under a global democracy. I wish I understood better why people (and it's not just conservatives) are so repulsed by that idea.

Thinker
"Kiss Gorby's butt"? Have you just come out of a 20-year coma?

Gunny G
I don't understand how asking me if my post is a plagiarism of some supposedly widely-circulated document (which I've never heard of) consistitutes a reply to it.

sorry for the spelling error
constitutes

Malou: I'll treat your post respectfully
because I think it was written sincerely.

I'll leave the amnesty issue per se aside, as that's actually ancillary to you, an offshoot of your deeper concerns.

It's impossible for countries to surrender their sovereignty by eliminating their borders and remain a country. If we in the US did that, we'd be inundated in no time, there'd be no way to sustain ourselves, and we'd be Somalia in very short order. I've read that worldwide there are a *billion* people who would willingly sneak illegally into the US if they could.

That having been said, it becomes incumbent upon the other nations to improve themselves, and it absolutely is possible. But for that to happen, they must heal themselves first. Get rid of corrupt or tyrannical governments. Educate the people. Institute western-style freedoms. Reward individual initiative. Remove government obstacles and punitive confiscatory tax schemes. It can be done. Look at India, Hong Kong, modern China moving in that direction, Japan, Indonesia, Switzerland, Israel, many others.

THAT is the permanent and effective solution. Not a US amnesty for border-jumpers.


Brian-Prosperity in the US
comes at the price of exploiting others. If we weren't prosperous, we wouldn't have as many rights, nor as many opportunities. I'm happy to live here because of that, but I also recognize that people in other countries suffer so that I can have my Subaru Outback, my $5 flip-flops and daily mocha. This kind of inequality benefits us, but permanently disadvantages others. In a country like India, there is huge inequality because the ruling class and its bourgeois servants have been able to benefit from Western domination (colonization first, now business interests) while the rest of the population remains poor, with little to no opportunity to escape from poverty. What if we could still live lives that were healthy, productive, meaningful and fun without having to rely on the desperation of a permanent global underclass? You say that poor countries should get rid of their inept leadership and introduce Western-style freedoms, and I agree in principle. So do many revolutionary paramilitary groups throughout the developing world. They never succeed when they get into power, however, because without the infrastructure and resources to properly develop their institutions and economies, they all degenerate into the same mess of corruption and ineptitude. The reason they limit civil rights is so that they can instill enough fear to be perceived as legitimate, but without being able to deliver on their promises to the people, they quickly realize that they have to rule by terror or not at all. I guess what I'm saying is that third-world corruption and abuse of power is so widespread that it can't be considered a localized problem. It's a systemic problem. The only solution I see is a globalized world where boundaries, though present, would be permeable, and rights would be extended not only to citizens of a given place, but to everyone.

How to deport 20 million illegals

.....I presented this problem to my computer and here is the answer ...

......PRINTOUT ...
...Step one ...deport one illegal family ...
...Step two ...repeat step one ...
...Step three ...Loop steps one and two ...
.....END OF PRINT OUT .....COLOSSUS

Malou
Why don't we just bring in the Chinese, Indians, Africans, Russians, the entire middle east, South America and North Korea? They're all suffering oppression.

That way, you could feel like you've helped the world's suffering. Then, of course you have to give up everything that America has afforded you and you family.

We can't save the world and neither can you.

Deal with it!


MALOU

.....You remind me of an old song ..."What kind of fool am I"? ...

.....So the rest of the world is poor because we are wealthy? ...what rot! ...I guesss that you are one of those zero sum dolts who thinks that there are just so many pieces in a static pie and we are hogging the biggest piece ...

.....We are wealthy because of two reasons ...Capitalism and Freedom ...Capitalism is the source of wealth and freedom allows the accumulation of wealth ...

.....other countries can duplicate our success by following our example ...400 years ago we were a wilderness inhabited by aboriginal tribes while the Sun never set on the British Empire ...

.....But don't fret Malou ...with Socialism on the march and unbridled invasion from Mexico soon we will lose our freedom and our wealth and become one of those Third World countries you have such sympathy for .....COLOSSUS

Cajun & Baseball
Cajun, I'm not talking about the US becoming a haven for refugees around the world. I'm suggesting an alternative to that.
Baseball, who made the clothes you're wearing right now? Where does the gasoline you put in your car come from? Where were the vegetables you'll eat tonight grown? Inevitably, our consumer goods were produced by poor people in developing countries where US companies have set up shop, either in order to take advantage of their natural resources or to avoid stricter North American labor laws.

Sorry, Malou, no sale
The pie is not finite, to begin with; your presumptions require that it be so.

Further, you have things backwards: "If we weren't prosperous, we wouldn't have as many rights, nor as many opportunities". We are prosperous precisely BECAUSE we have so many rights and freedoms. The freedom to be a capitalist, to earn and keep the fruits of your own labor and inventiveness -- though liberalism is certainly doing its best to destroy that, daily.

I hate to say it, because it sounds like a cheap shot and it's not, but basically your post is simply a summarization of Marx's Das Kapital, and that, my young friend, is a totally failed philosophy.


Malou
You say "Inevitably, our consumer goods were produced by poor people in developing countries where US companies have set up shop, either in order to take advantage of their natural resources or to avoid stricter North American labor laws."

Thus providing jobs for those poor people that they wouldn't otherwise have. Jobs that pay more than working their own land. And using those natural resources that would otherwise either go to waste or go unused thus benefiting no one. So yes we are transferring wealth to those poor people in exchange for goods. A win-win deal.

BTW those "stricter North American labor laws" increase the cost of doing business, many times without a payoff to the employee or employer.

The problem isn't "stricter North American labor laws", it is unreasonable tax laws and rates.

Leftist would rather punish the productive and thereby make everyone miserably poor.

There's only one immigration plan
And that is a bill which sends one hundred ten buses south across the border full of illegal aliens and into Mexico and then build a wall so they can't come back and one that puts 40,000 National Guard Troops on the border whose instructions are to shoot first and ask questions later.

what is this?
At some point, it *is* a zero sum game. The Earth is only so big, with only so many natural resources to sustain us all. That doesn't mean that there isn't enough for everyone, though. There is. For now. But that issue is not really related to my argument. I'm not talking about the problem of the US taking more than its fair share. I'm talking specifically about the problem of US companies perpetuating systems of dependency around the globe and using that dependency to its own advantage through global capitalism. Why does the US have the right to do this?

Gunlock Bill
You say that by employing third-world workers, "we" are transferring wealth to "these poor people" and creating a win/win situation for everyone. If you go to the countries where this is happening, however, you will see that this point of view is not nearly as prevalent as it would be if the policy were so uncontestably win/win.

No, Malou, that's wrong
The earth has vast resources we haven't begun to tap, and is constantly creating more by geothermic and other mechanisms. Further, people aren't limited by the availability of physical resoureces, especially not in the IT era. Vast segments are servise-oriented, and simply need people.

Many countries have far-reaching branch operations, not just the US, in an increasingly global economy, and all benefit, including those in the host countries. That's simply economic reality.


All Immigration is Unpopular
I just received an e-zine from The Eagle Forum that sites a recent poll that states the following:

************************************
"75% of Republicans said immigration is too high, 5% said too low.
69% of Democrats said immigration is too high, 6% said too low.
71% of self described moderates said immigration is too high, 4% said too low."
*************************************

If this is true, exactly WHO are the Washington elites trying to please? Certainly not their constituants!!!

But wait, there's more:

*************************************
"58 percent of voters said they wanted illegals to go home, compared to 30 percent who favored legalization."
*************************************

And here's the topper:
*************************************
"When presented by itself, 79 percent of the public said they supported reducing the illegal immigrant population by increasing border enforcement, penalizing employers, and increasing cooperation with local law enforcement, while 15 percent were opposed."
*************************************

If you want to research this yourself, here are the links:

http://www.eagleforum.org/alert/2007/poll-summary.pdf
http://www.eagleforum.org/alert/2007/poll-results.pdf

There are alot of elites who have a stake in destroying the middle class of America and create a near-slave class so that the global jet-setters can compete with their buds in the multinationals.

But the American people have not taken leave of their senses. I am confident that they will eventually stand up against the destructive forces that seek to destroy the United States of America.


Malou
WHEW! Your post at 7:13 pm was over the top. You are extremely naive. Surely you don't believe that pablum you're shoveling. You related to Loyal Democrat BTW? You're doing a satirical thing right?

gunlock bill
BINGO! That's Communism for ya, everyone has a whole lotta nothing, equally miserable, except for the party elite.

Who wrote this bill?
Does anyone know the names of the people who actually wrote this abomination of a bill? I don't mean the names of the people they work for, but the staffers themselves.

Most senators and congressmen don't have a clue how to write, read or interpret the legislation they sponsor or vote for. They largely depend on the anonymous career staffers who actually write, not only the bills, but also the talking points about the bills. They are the ones who prep "their" "member" (as they are condescendingly refered to) before hearings and news conferences.

These are the people who slip in the goodies that their members have no clue about, assuming they even cared to read the handiwork their name is attached to in the first place. In short, it is the staffers, and perhaps their ghost-writing lobbyist cohorts, who "know" what the bills actually mean and their intended but unpublicized implications.

I want to know who these specific people are, because it is high time the public knows who is writing this stuff, because God only knows, it is not the people who were elected.

Malou's 7:15 blather
Stop it. You're slaying me with your asinine idiocy. Please tell me your post is a lame attempt at satire.

Answer me a couple of questions, if you will. Have you ever taken a college level economics course? If so, did you pass? If you did, was the class taken at Patrice Lumumba University in Moscow?

Thanks for the Cold War revolutionary flashback. I needed the comic relief.

Ditto for karennkc
You can tell me - I won't tell anyone else. Who is the third member of your cell?

karennkc
What is the point in your 8:51 post. You neglected to include one minor point in the introductory instalment of your little manifesto - that being a point.

You introduce a proposition in your first paragraph, i.e. that the so-called conservative intelligentsia live in a delusional world of their own creation that is at odds with reality. But then you offer as evidence in support of your thesis - nada. Nothing but a couple of (presumed) quotes from Krauthammer and West, that you didn't even bother to refute with a rebuttal or counterargument.

I can't wait for your second instalment!

loyal democrat?
Your post's are surely satire or the most surly post's on this blog. If they are not satire then you must be the mold of these archaic donkey dems.

Mountain Rose
SUPER GOOD STUFF! I think they are the old "bluebloods" left over from our American Revolution who own ALL the GOLD in the world and control ALL the MONEY in the world.

Their desire is ARISTOCRACY!!! THEY WANT THEIR TITLES BESTOWED UPON THEMSELVES THAT WERE STRIPPED AWAY AFTER WE SENT THE BRITISH PACKING!

This Latest Outrage
I heard yesterday that illegal alien gang members will also be eligible for the amnesty.Why am I not surprised at this insanity?
Many of the Dems are also whining that the $5,000.00 fine is too much. They shouldn't worry. I have no doubt that the Federal government will give them the money for the fines paid to the Federal government. Don't worry when the politicians tell you that the money you paid into social security isn't there, I'm sure it could be used to pay the illegal alien fines.
Every RINO Republican who supports this bill: McCain, Graham, Specter, Martinez, Kyl, etc. etc. must be kicked out once and for all. I don't bother mentioning the Dems, they are utterly useless and are watering at the mouth at the pospect of 12 - 20 million new ignorant, illiterate Democrat voters.

BrianR
How can you claim that the Earth's resources are virtually unlimited? They *are* limited. Water, wood, minerals, and oil--all of it is self-replacing to a certain extent, but not at the rate we consume it. I'll admit I'm not a scientist (are you?) but I'm pretty certain this is true. You make this remark about service sector and tech jobs like I'm so naive I don't know that these exist. I do know they exist. I also know that if natural resource markets collapsed or threatened to collapse, tech and service industries would quickly follow. Someone asked if I had ever taken a college-level economics course. I took four, and got As in three of them. I got a B- in price theory because the math was above my head at the time. I'd ace it now.
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